Episode 986 - Linda Cardellini
Marc:all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fuck nicks what's happening i'm mark maron this is my podcast wtf how's it going what's happening everything okay you all right i'm all right i guess i don't think my cap buster likes me
Marc:I think he puts up with me and I think, you know, we have a strange relationship, but I don't know if you've had that experience where you have a pet and then a friend of yours comes over and they seem to want to go home with them.
Marc:And I can't resent the cat.
Marc:I cannot resent Buster Kitten.
Marc:He's an odd cat.
Marc:He fetches things.
Marc:He thinks.
Marc:Sometimes he looks like a human in the face.
Marc:But, you know, I do everything I can for the guy, but he's sort of...
Marc:Like, he'll hang out with me when I'm doing things, but when I'm not, it just, you know, I think he likes other people better than me.
Marc:And what do I do about that?
Marc:Right?
Marc:Do I keep trying?
Marc:I mean, how much, like, I feed this cat, like, better than some humans eat.
Marc:Maybe that's it.
Marc:Maybe you've got to toughen up a little bit.
Marc:Or maybe it's just, I don't know, he's used to me.
Marc:We have a certain thing we do, and then when other people come over, he loves them, and they go away.
Marc:You know what I just realized?
Marc:He's exactly like me.
Marc:The cat is exactly like me.
Marc:Today on the show, I talked to Linda Cardellini, who is in the new film Green Book.
Marc:You might have known her.
Marc:You remember her from Freaks and Geeks.
Marc:She had a part in Mad Men.
Marc:She's done a lot of ER.
Marc:She's done a lot of things.
Marc:She's a very, very fine actress.
Marc:And I had an opportunity to talk to her, so I took it and I dug it.
Marc:And you'll hear that in a few minutes.
Marc:I promise you.
Marc:That's going to happen for you.
Marc:You're going to hear me and Linda Cardellini talking.
Marc:Let's read a couple emails.
Marc:I got a good one.
Marc:I thought it was a good one because this guy is very attentive.
Marc:There was something about... I like this email.
Marc:Subject line, hands down the funniest moment.
Marc:Hey, Mark, been listening since God knows when at 220, I think.
Marc:A few thoughts.
Marc:That's episode 220.
Marc:One, some of us are fans of the superhero movies because we grew up on comics and never thought we'd see them on screen as dynamic as they are and are meant to be.
Marc:An old crusty bartender I know saw the very first Spider-Man when it came out and he muttered, I've been waiting for that movie since I was five.
Marc:Anyway, I fucking love him.
Marc:Okay, pal, noted.
Marc:I get it.
Marc:That makes sense to me.
Marc:I respect that.
Marc:Two, Michael Clayton is one of the finest films ever to grace a screen.
Marc:I love when you talk about it.
Marc:Die Hard is on at the theater every Christmas, but I'd go see Michael Clayton on the big screen for multiple viewings.
Marc:Quote, I'm not the enemy.
Marc:Then who are you?
Marc:Unquote.
Marc:It's a couplet from Michael Clayton, by the way.
Marc:Three, this is the meat of it.
Marc:Your talk with Howie was fantastic.
Marc:You run the gamut with guests and the interviews always shine.
Marc:That snappy patois that surfaces when you have a comic on is golden.
Marc:I've got a pretty good job and I work in construction with contractors.
Marc:Sometimes I'm at the job site out in the rain and they joke, must be nice to cruise around and chill in an office.
Marc:I usually respond, this is the job I chose.
Marc:You have the job you chose.
Marc:And here we are.
Marc:My shit ain't without its hang-ups.
Marc:Bullshit last-minute changes and putting out fires.
Marc:Sometimes the whole company seems like a rudderless ship with no one at the helm.
Marc:When you guys were talking about bombing and how he's all, quote, nobody knows, unquote, and you said, because you can't leave.
Marc:It brought tears of laughter to my eyes.
Marc:I rewound it at least 15 times.
Marc:Hands down the funniest thing I've heard on your wonderful show.
Marc:The pain in that moment about those moments coupled with the knowledge that this is what you signed on for.
Marc:The love you have for your craft, even what might be the worst part about it, is just something you deal with.
Marc:I imagine it's not even a clause or a fine print for a comic.
Marc:It's ironclad guaranteed that at some point this is going to happen.
Marc:Soldier on.
Marc:Thanks for the show, man.
Marc:You are a constant source of laughter, inspiration, and wisdom.
Marc:Keep up the phenomenal work.
Marc:Boomer lives.
Marc:Sincerely, Anthony.
Marc:That to me, because he picked up on that moment, you know, we're talking about bombing and how he's talking about no one really understands it.
Marc:But then he brought up his own life.
Marc:It's just and I never really thought about it either.
Marc:It made me reflect.
Marc:on you know when you're younger in comedy or whatever you do i mean the worst fucking thing that can happen is the shit doesn't go over and when you're starting you're only doing it for five minutes three minutes and it's it's it's an eternity and then all of a sudden as life goes on and you stack up these experiences where it it gets as bad as it's gonna get
Marc:In terms of occupational problems in this particular field or whatever fields you're working in.
Marc:You know, if you've been doing something for a decade or more, you know, you're you're going to have a pretty good resume of things getting fucked up, of things going really wrong, of things like teetering on the edge.
Marc:of complete chaos and failure or quitting or losing your job.
Marc:And after you get a bunch of them and they get a little behind you, you're like, yeah, it wasn't great when that happened, but it's a long time ago.
Marc:Fuck it.
Marc:I don't give a fuck.
Marc:Nothing fucking matters.
Marc:Nothing is true.
Marc:Everything is permitted.
Marc:Where did that come from?
Marc:Hassan Isaba.
Marc:Let's do a little business.
Marc:I should have done this at the beginning, but I'm doing it now.
Marc:I'm going to do sort of a residency at the Dynasty Typewriter.
Marc:That's a space down, sort of downtown, Koreatown here in Los Angeles.
Marc:There's going to be a series of dates through February and the beginning of March, Sundays.
Marc:I'll be doing workshopping an hour or two, trying to work some stuff out.
Marc:They're usually fun shows.
Marc:I'll bring feature acts with me of all different sorts.
Marc:Hopefully, I got to ask some people, but you can go to wtfpod.com slash tour and
Marc:to get the links for the tickets to all those shows.
Marc:I believe there's five of them coming up.
Marc:The first one is this Sunday, January 20th.
Marc:So that's happening.
Marc:If you live in Los Angeles, you're gonna be in town.
Marc:Come see me one of those Sundays at Dynasty Typewriter.
Marc:It's a nice little space.
Marc:So this is me talking to a Linda Cardellini.
Marc:She can be seen in Green Book, which is in theaters now.
Marc:And she's in the upcoming Netflix comedy series, Dead to Me.
Guest:And I'm sure a lot of you fell in love with her on Freaks and Geeks.
Marc:You told me you've never talked for an hour.
Guest:I talked for an hour once before.
Marc:In public?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And why?
Marc:What happened?
Marc:Was it a bad hour?
Guest:No, it was great.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah, it was great.
Marc:So it worked out?
Guest:Yeah, it worked out.
Marc:But you grew up in California?
Guest:Yes, Northern California.
Marc:That's the best.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Where'd you grow up?
Guest:Around San Francisco, like 30 minutes south.
Marc:What was your family doing up there?
Guest:My family's been in San Francisco for generations.
Marc:The Cardellinis of San Francisco?
Guest:Yeah, I mean, well, there were different names.
Guest:Yeah, but seriously.
Guest:My father's grandmother was born there.
Guest:And so my great-grandmother, my grandmother, my father, my sister, her son have all been born in San Francisco.
Guest:And then on my mom's side, it's one generation less.
Marc:So they've been there forever?
Marc:They've been there for a long time.
Marc:But where did they come from originally?
Marc:Like New York?
Marc:No.
Marc:No.
Guest:They all checked in at Ellis Island.
Guest:I mean, according to family war.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:They all checked in at Ellis Island and kept going.
Marc:From Italy.
Guest:My dad's side from Italy.
Guest:My mom's side from Ireland.
Guest:Some other pieces of the puzzle I think came from Germany.
Guest:That's the best.
Marc:But Irish, Italian.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Full on Catholic, genetically Catholic.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:For hundreds of years.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Lots of children, big families.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Have you visited those places?
Guest:I've been to Italy.
Guest:I've never been to Ireland.
Marc:Ireland's beautiful.
Marc:I know.
Guest:I'm dying to go.
Guest:I really would love to go.
Marc:I was just there.
Marc:I've only been to like Dublin though and Kilkenny, but like, it's beautiful.
Guest:That's more than I've got.
Marc:Yeah, I know.
Marc:But where'd you go in Italy?
Guest:I've been, well, the first time I went there, I played soccer there.
Guest:I played a lot of soccer when I was a kid.
Marc:Really?
Marc:You were a little jockey.
Guest:Yeah, I went to different countries playing soccer.
Marc:Was it because you were great at it or because it was just a high school thing?
Guest:I was good enough and there was a team that was going and I could go and we were young.
Marc:So you played against the Italians?
Guest:So the first time I went, I went to Denmark and Holland, and we stayed with families when I was 13.
Guest:And the second time I went, I went to Italy, Austria, France, and Germany.
Marc:Oh, man.
Guest:And so I went to Verona.
Guest:And we got our asses handed to us, but we had a great time.
Guest:So that was the first time I went.
Guest:I've done a play there in Italy.
Marc:As a grown-up?
Guest:As a college student, yeah.
Marc:Weird.
Marc:Weird.
Guest:And, which I was leaving to do right after Freaks and Geeks.
Guest:And I was like, why would you go do some ancient play?
Marc:What was the ancient play?
Guest:It was a version of Lancelot.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:But it was like.
Guest:You're saying it like a question.
Guest:You know, because now, I mean, I have an interesting memory.
Guest:It's sort of like I can hold on to things for a short period of time, but my long term is a little bit.
Marc:And it doesn't matter how important it is to me.
Marc:I'm sort of the opposite.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:No matter what.
Guest:Everyone's like, well, that's because it's not so important to you and it's absolutely not true.
Marc:It's just gone.
Guest:Yeah, it goes somewhere else.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But my short term works well.
Marc:Well, that's important.
Marc:So I can always cram.
Marc:Get through the day.
Guest:I can memorize my lines.
Marc:Breathe.
Guest:Read a book and then read it again a year later.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Yeah.
Marc:Lancelot.
Guest:Lancelot, yes.
Guest:But there was a, it was like one of the first non-secular plays and it was being performed with this medieval play festival.
Guest:And so this teacher of ours took us and we went and did that.
Guest:So I remember that's after the pilot of Freaks and Geeks.
Guest:That's what I went to and did that.
Marc:Well, you didn't have a huge career in show business yet, so you could just go.
Guest:No, I mean, I've been trying.
Guest:Freaks and Geeks wasn't my first show.
Guest:People always think it was, but...
Marc:Well, let me ask you a couple of questions about growing up in San Francisco.
Marc:Did any of your family actually live in the city of SF, San Francisco itself?
Guest:When I was growing up?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But they sort of they started there and then kind of spread.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, my brother moved there and, you know, people always lived, you know.
Marc:Did you like go when you were growing up?
Marc:Is that where you used to hang out?
Marc:Like go to San Francisco sometimes?
Guest:Oh, we would go there all the time.
Guest:Yeah, my birthday party there.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:It was more of like an adventure.
Guest:We sort of had a more suburban life.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah, because it's like such a freak show, San Francisco.
Marc:I lived there for a couple years, and I was like, what is going on here?
Guest:Where did you live?
Marc:I lived in the Mission for a year on South Van Ness.
Guest:That's where my grandmother grew up.
Marc:Really?
Guest:On the Mission, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, see, I never got a... And then I moved to the Panhandle, like Clayton, and fell.
Marc:But when I got there, I could never... I've lived in New York, I've lived here.
Marc:I could never quite get a handle on how that city was sort of put together.
Marc:Like...
Marc:Who's in charge?
Marc:What's the history of it?
Marc:It just seemed like this, like a circus, like it was just embraced freaks of all kinds for generations.
Guest:Yeah, it's great.
Guest:Yes, it is.
Guest:It's rich.
Marc:Yeah, I guess.
Guest:When you get into it, it's very creative, too, like over time in history and even back in the 60s to now with Silicon Valley.
Guest:There's a lot of creative energy that happens there.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:The creative energy now is very much more profit-oriented.
Guest:But it didn't maybe perhaps start that way.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:It was innovation, right?
Guest:Subversion, some kind of like-
Marc:Yeah, maybe.
Marc:Yeah, maybe the original computer nerds.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:But, you know, it's different, though.
Marc:Have you been there lately?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:It's like, I mean, it's completely, the mission is, it's like, there's no grit to it.
Marc:Maybe one corner, like on, where's that mission and 16th at that BART station is still nuts.
Guest:Well, I feel like in some ways, you know, change is always going to come.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:But I think that that it's a difficult change because in one hand, there's progress and there's like, you know, things that get changed for the better.
Guest:And on the other hand, the thing that I've seen the most is it drives the generations out.
Guest:Like where I grew up, it was like grandmothers and aunts and uncles and parents.
Guest:And it was a place where families went to raise their children.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know, they may be moved.
Guest:From San Francisco because it was warmer.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And you were able to like, you know, wear a bathing suit in the summer.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And swim.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It wasn't foggy.
Marc:And you were able to grow up with your grandmother around the corner.
Guest:You were able to grow up with your grandmother around the corner.
Guest:And your grandmother had their friends.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then I think what I've seen because it's happened to areas that I've lived in.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Sort of this new tech money comes in.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Industry comes in.
Guest:Yeah.
Yeah.
Guest:And I think what happens is the generations get moved out because suddenly this house that you bought for $30,000 20 years ago is now worth a million or above.
Guest:Why not sell it?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you can have a different sort of lifestyle.
Marc:Sure.
Guest:But you're moved out of the neighborhood.
Marc:Right.
Guest:So then in the neighborhood is younger, more sort of-
Marc:Yeah, no history.
Guest:Moneyed.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Like a different feel to the neighborhood.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Or in the event of like some of my friends, their parents have houses, but when they have grown up and have a normal job, they can no longer afford to live near their parents.
Marc:Right.
Guest:So then they have to move sort of two hours away.
Guest:And so it's, that's what it does.
Marc:Where are your folks?
Guest:In Northern California, but not in the same neighborhood.
Guest:They moved a couple hours away.
Marc:But that's not too far.
Marc:And you got a kid now, right?
Marc:I do, yeah.
Marc:So they have a good relationship with the grandparents?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And then my daughter's father and I have known each other since we were kids.
Marc:So his folks are up there too?
Guest:So his folks.
Guest:But everybody's moved sort of hours away.
Marc:Oh, right.
Guest:So they're a couple hours from each other.
Marc:Oh.
Guest:But everybody's still up there.
Guest:Our friends are still up there.
Marc:It's so pretty up there.
Guest:It is.
Guest:It's beautiful.
Marc:So how Catholic were you brought up?
Guest:Very.
Very.
Guest:really i mean we didn't go to church every weekend but my parents were brought up catholic yeah and uh like they were told you had to go to confession every week did you go i went well i have i went when i was little because my mom was like you should go to confession every school and i was very young yeah and and i was the youngest of four yeah but my parents were protective right right and uh and i went to confession it was a really old irish priest
Guest:And I didn't, you know, I was scared.
Guest:I was like, bless me, Father, if I have sin.
Guest:And I was going to say like one sin.
Guest:They said you could save up one and then go sell it.
Guest:So I said, you know, I missed mass.
Guest:And he yelled at me.
Guest:No.
Guest:Because he was, you know, kind of an old cranky Irish priest, you know.
Guest:And he yelled at me.
Guest:And I was hysterically crying.
Guest:And I came out of there.
Guest:And he said, why didn't you go to church?
Guest:Do you have a bike?
Guest:And I said, yeah, I have a bike.
Guest:You know, I got one last Christmas or whatever it was.
Guest:He was like, you should ride your bike to the.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:I came out of there and I was hysterically crying.
Guest:My mom felt terrible, terrible about it.
Marc:The old man scared you.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I was like, I'm never going again.
Guest:You know, I was very sensitive.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Of course.
Marc:Right.
Guest:I mean, obviously, I'm a very sensitive adult, too.
Guest:And.
Guest:And I didn't really even have any sins.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But did that, that scared you away forever?
Marc:Scared me away.
Guest:And so here's the, this is a funny story actually.
Guest:So then my mom, one of my good friends, her mom was always like the most wonderful person.
Guest:She always had everybody to her house.
Guest:And if there was a new priest, she would invite them in and feed them because priests like to be fed or nuns, you know.
Marc:That's part of the racket.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And they had a swimming pool.
Guest:So everybody always went to their house.
Marc:Your parents?
Guest:My friend Jeannie.
Marc:Oh, Jeannie.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:And so her mom had the new priest over, which was like this young Irish priest who everybody liked.
Guest:He was funny and he was fun.
Guest:And everybody was swimming.
Yeah.
Guest:And unbeknownst to me, my mom had told that I had been scared away from confession.
Marc:She told the young new priest.
Marc:Yes.
Guest:But I didn't know that.
Guest:So I was swimming.
Guest:Everybody was swimming in the pool.
Guest:It was a pool party.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he swam up to me.
Guest:And I remember thinking like...
Guest:Oh, my God, here's like I saw a priest in shorts with no shirt on, which was, you know, normally you saw them in their whole garb.
Guest:And I was like, this is odd.
Guest:And I remember just clocking that he had.
Guest:And I was, you know, I was like 11 and there was nothing lascivious about it at all.
Guest:He was a very wonderful, kind human.
Guest:There was nothing like it was not that dirty.
Guest:No, nothing at all.
Guest:When you say that and then you say the priest, people get scared.
Guest:But and he came up to me and he had a very earnest talk with me.
Guest:He's like, your mother said that you are scared of going to confession.
Guest:Somebody yelled at you.
Guest:And, you know, and he gave this whole explanation of how, like, that's not really how it is.
Guest:I ever wanted to talk.
Guest:And the whole time, all I could think of was that he had hair on his nipples.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Because I'd never seen a priest with his shirt off, which as a kid, you're thinking, like, they're different than you somehow.
Guest:And like, I don't know.
Guest:I was prepubescent.
Guest:And he was very kind when I came home.
Guest:I was like, mom, how could you do that?
Guest:But she was trying to help me.
Marc:That was the first time you saw hair on nipples?
Guest:I mean, probably not, like my dad or something.
Marc:Sure, but you registered it because it's a priest.
Guest:But I'm a priest, sure.
Marc:It's weird to see people who aren't supposed to be half-dressed, half-dressed.
Guest:Right, which is the funny thing about swimming.
Guest:It's like suddenly it's totally okay.
Marc:Yeah, I mean, it should be okay, but it is odd, especially if it's a priest.
Guest:It should be okay, absolutely.
Marc:Of course.
Marc:All right, so it didn't stick, though, the Catholicism.
Guest:No, not in that way, no.
Marc:And how big is your family?
Guest:My mom is one of seven.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:And they all have a lot of children.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so I had at one point, I mean, people have passed away now and whatever, but I had at one point like over 20, around 21st cousin, 21, yeah.
Marc:And they were all in the area?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's wild.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:So that's nice.
Guest:And my Irish side is much bigger than my Italian side.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:That's your dad's side?
Guest:Yeah, my dad's side's Italian.
Marc:Italian.
Marc:So your mom's side's the Irish.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Uh huh.
Marc:Like what?
Marc:Like where?
Marc:Like that's bigger.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And they stayed together.
Marc:They still.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Very, very close.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, now people have moved away, but up and until I was a full grown adult, nobody had really necessary.
Guest:I had one cousin who moved away.
Marc:Right, but your folks are still together?
Guest:Yeah, they met when they were seven.
Guest:They lived around the corner from each other.
Guest:They started dating when they were in high school, and they've been together ever since.
Marc:Wow.
Guest:My sister, the same thing.
Guest:She buried her neighbor.
Marc:And then you did it.
Guest:Yeah, he was the neighbor of two of my very close friends.
Marc:But he was around.
Guest:He was around.
Marc:Yeah, and you ended up together after.
Marc:But how did that happen after so many years?
Marc:Because you were not always together.
Guest:No, no, no, no.
Guest:We were always friends.
Marc:Oh, that was it.
Guest:Never not friends, but not like best friends.
Marc:Sure.
Guest:Never not friends.
Guest:And then he was working.
Guest:He lived in L.A.
Guest:and worked in L.A.
Marc:Show business?
Guest:kind of peripherally he does makeup but it wasn't necessarily on set right you know and uh where else do you make hey you know he was always like fun yeah he always had fun so i was like hey you're here we ran into each other and i was like do my makeup sometimes and you know so we would do it and we would hang out we would go home for holidays drive in the same car and and then it just you just realized oh we love each other
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like sort of like once you cross a line with a person in that way, there's so much history there that you're like, oh.
Guest:And there's something really interesting about it because it's somebody who knows you, especially when you come to Los Angeles where everybody sort of comes for industry.
Marc:Knows you from before.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And somebody who knows me from before knows my family.
Guest:I know his family.
Guest:My aunt was friends with his mom when they were kids.
Marc:Oh, and you have that.
Marc:You have all that.
Guest:And, yeah, my aunt used to tell this story about this boy she knew who got killed in Vietnam.
Guest:It was her first friend that got killed in Vietnam.
Guest:And when I went to the memorial when I was a kid in eighth grade, she said, could you scratch this name off for me?
Guest:And it turns out that that's Steve's uncle.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it was her friend.
Guest:And we didn't even put it together until much later.
Marc:You went to the wall?
Guest:When I was a kid in eighth grade, we went to the Washington, D.C.
Guest:memorial.
Marc:This is heavy, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I've been there a couple times.
Marc:Beautiful.
Marc:It's really something.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because it just sort of sneaks up on you.
Marc:You're like, where is it?
Marc:And then it's like, oh.
Marc:there yes and you kind of quiet down yeah over there and you inevitably see somebody who you know is there yeah feeling it and oh always oh it's like it's I just yeah it's devastating I just read some story about Springsteen or like he's been like some story I just read about Springsteen has been talking about a guy who was in a band when he was a kid in Asbury Park who was the first guy who really impressed him as a singer and he ended up he's a local kid went to Vietnam and was you know killed and
Marc:And it was just a story about him bringing it up on stage.
Marc:And one of that guy's kids heard about it.
Marc:And him and Bruce connected.
Marc:And he was able to get stories about his dad because his dad got killed when he was just a baby.
Marc:But he was able to get Bruce to tell him about his old man and stuff.
Marc:It was kind of sweet.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's heavy, man.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So, where'd you- They're so young, too.
Guest:Like, it takes you to be sort of beyond that age to realize how young 18 is to be sent there and- To that fucking war?
Guest:And everywhere.
Guest:I mean, nowadays and back then and throughout history.
Marc:But then you didn't have a choice.
Marc:No.
Marc:You know, and like, did you watch that Ken Burns doc?
Marc:You got about 20 hours?
Marc:No.
Marc:You should watch it.
Guest:Well, it sounds like maybe I should.
Yeah.
Marc:the vietnam war well no there's just so much i didn't know about it you know like you kind of know about it but like really the the whole history of that we don't have to talk about vietnam yeah i don't know i don't know enough about it to really talk well i i didn't either and then i watched ken burnstock and i know i know a little yeah i think i know everything but my short-term memory is not great my long term is better so i didn't retain a lot pair so oh you didn't tell me how many brothers and sisters yet i'm the youngest of four
Marc:Oh, okay.
Guest:What'd they all end up doing?
Guest:My sisters, I'm the youngest by far.
Guest:My sister's 13 years older than me.
Marc:Oh, wow.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I'm closer in age to her son than she is, but we were always in the house together.
Marc:Were you an accident?
Guest:That, you know, somebody once said that to me, and my parents were like, that's not true.
Guest:Because my brother and sister, my oldest brother and my sister, they were like Irish twins, and I think my parents were like, whoa, we're going to just take it easy now and space these kids out.
Guest:But yeah, but...
Marc:No, they said you're not an accident.
Marc:Why would they tell you you were?
Guest:I know.
Marc:But you know, it's like... 13 years.
Guest:It's pretty.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They started young, though.
Marc:But you're a happy accident.
Marc:That's good.
Marc:Maybe you're not.
Guest:I'm pretty... I don't know.
Marc:You're doing good.
Guest:I think they like me.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But I started acting when I was a kid.
Guest:I liked it.
Guest:I wanted to do it.
Guest:I always was performing in the front room.
Guest:Elementary school kind of stuff?
Guest:No, they didn't let me, though.
Guest:You had to be picked to do a part.
Marc:Were you a Catholic school person?
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Then I went to Catholic high school.
Guest:Then I went to Catholic college.
Marc:Which Catholic college?
Guest:Loyola Marymount in Los Angeles.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
Marc:But you got good education, right?
Marc:I did.
Guest:I did.
Guest:The Jesuits are pretty good thinkers and educators.
Marc:Did you ever sort of have to wrestle with telling them?
Marc:I mean, if you didn't stay Catholic other than in sort of tradition, did you have belief?
Guest:I did for a long time.
Guest:I had ultra-belief, I think, when I was young.
Guest:I think I was very...
Guest:I was, I believed wholeheartedly.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then when I realized that some of those things were allegory or, you know what I mean?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Or parable or what, then I was like, sort of exploded my mind.
Marc:Maybe none of it's true.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So I had that moment.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then I studied world, you know, the good thing about going to Jesuit schools.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:you study other religions, and then I started to see the commonality in other religions, and appreciate the commonality in other religions and belief, and I think that if I were to go back to school, I would love to study that further.
Guest:I think it's really beautiful what motivates people.
Marc:The threads of belief, yeah.
Guest:And so yeah, it sort of broke apart like that for me.
Marc:Did you ever have to sit down with a Jesuit and go like, I'm having a spiritual crisis?
Guest:Yes, funny enough, it was a long time that I was having sort of a spiritual crisis.
Marc:You felt bad about it.
Guest:Yeah, sure, sure.
Guest:You know, I think when I wholeheartedly was into it, I think it was easier.
Marc:Right, when did it start to crumble?
Guest:Oh, no, no, way before.
Guest:Way before.
Guest:But, you know, I was used to sort of like the, I think in early high school.
Marc:Yeah, right, right.
Guest:But I wasn't mad at it.
Guest:You know, I was like, oh, okay, there are other things.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Not everybody is wrong.
Marc:Right, right.
Guest:And if you really believe like in the idea of...
Guest:of who the person is at the center of the religion.
Guest:It was about, you know, not judging people and, you know, loving your neighbor and all of that.
Guest:So I sort of, sort of, and then I went to, I believe in everything.
Guest:I believe in nothing.
Guest:I believe in, I don't know what I believe in.
Marc:You know?
Guest:So, and I still don't, I don't know.
Marc:But when, when you talked to a Jesuit, did they like, how did they frame?
Guest:So I went to the, the first time I ever went to the Vatican,
Marc:Oh, you went to the Vatican.
Marc:I went to the Vatican.
Marc:You went to Rome.
Guest:This was long after I'd had the crisis, but I thought, well, if I'm going to go to the Vatican, I'm going to go to confession, because I have confession there, and I'm going to say, I'm having a crisis of faith.
Guest:I used to really believe, and I don't really believe in it.
Marc:How old were you when this happened?
Guest:I was older.
Guest:I think I was in college at this point, but I still felt like, eh, okay.
Guest:That's pretty impressive.
Guest:Maybe somebody will say something.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:You know, like maybe somebody will get me into something.
Guest:So I went there and I said, you know, they have these confessions that you can go to.
Guest:And I went in and I said, and they have different languages because some of the priests speak multiple languages.
Marc:It's a big business, the Catholic Church.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:International.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it went in.
Guest:It's beautiful.
Marc:Beautiful.
Marc:The Vatican's incredible.
Marc:Like, you know, I went to a lot of those cathedrals and I'm a Jew, but I was just fascinated with it.
Marc:But once if you go to a lot of the other ones around the country and then go to the Vatican, you're like, this is clearly the main one.
Guest:Well, and religious artwork throughout time.
Guest:Crazy.
Guest:Or religious theater throughout time or all of that stuff.
Guest:It really, it blends in with art.
Marc:Yeah, but the Vatican one is so, it's so, it's not, it's a little more stripped down than the other ones and a lot more kind of gold as I remember.
Marc:And like, cause some of the other ones look old and dusty and weird and there's dead popes everywhere.
Guest:There's probably a couple of dead popes around there.
Marc:There's hundreds of dead popes everywhere in Italy.
Marc:There are dead wizards everywhere.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:pieces of people, relics of kinds.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But I just, I remember when I went to the Vatican, I'm like, this is clearly the headquarters, you know?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It's quite a building.
Marc:It's amazing.
Marc:And did you go to the Sistine Chapel?
Guest:I did.
Marc:Beautiful.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:So, okay, so you go to confession at the Vatican.
Marc:That's exciting.
Guest:So I go to the confession at the Vatican and I say, you know, I'm really having a problem.
Guest:I used to really believe and I'm having an issue.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And, uh,
Guest:The guy who, you know, he didn't really speak a lot of English.
Guest:I think he had English was probably like third or fourth on the list of things that he spoke.
Guest:It was a shorter line.
Guest:Italian guy?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:It's in Portuguese, some other language, and English.
Guest:I can't remember exactly now.
Guest:It was a long time ago.
Guest:And I went in and I said, you know, bless me, Father...
Guest:And I get so nervous because I don't really know the lines.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:I was like, oh, God, is it for I have sinned?
Guest:And then that first experience with the father and the ride your bike to church.
Guest:And so I go in there and I say, I don't really know how to do this, but I just want to say...
Guest:I am having a, you know, I've had a crisis of faith for a long time and I'm just hoping you can help me out.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:And he says, you gotta have a faith.
Guest:You say like, I think it was like eight Hail Marys and a three Our Fathers.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:And I was like...
Guest:Oh, no.
Guest:That guy, that poor guy, he has no idea.
Guest:He just, like, blew it for me.
Guest:Like, that was it.
Marc:It was my final straw.
Guest:Yeah, he could have, like, really wrote me back in somehow.
Marc:And that was it.
Marc:You gotta have a faith.
Marc:You gotta have a faith.
Marc:And that's it.
Guest:Yeah, so.
Marc:So it didn't do it.
Guest:It's a funny experience, though.
Marc:Oh, yeah, of course.
Guest:I mean, it all comes from within, anyways.
Marc:I think so, yeah.
Marc:It would have been amazing, though, if someone just kind of blew your mind somehow.
Marc:Yeah, it would have.
Marc:Presented some philosophical quandary.
Guest:And I think it's there somehow.
Guest:Somebody probably has one of those things in every religion that can turn somebody, like, turn you on on the inside.
Marc:You got to have the right moment, though.
Marc:You got to see it in their eyes.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, to do the missionary thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But, you know, now it's just sort of like a... Yeah.
Guest:Just try to be as good of a person as I can and hope that it...
Marc:Be a good mom.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Hope that it all works out.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:When did you start getting on stage, not in the non-professional way?
Guest:I was, well, you know, like in kindergarten, we did Noah's Ark.
Marc:Of course, yeah.
Guest:That was the big...
Guest:My parent and my best friend's mom, my mom and her mom, the best friends, were like, wouldn't it be cute if our kids were skunks?
Guest:Which is an adorable concept.
Guest:But we got called stinky for the next 10 years of our life.
Guest:And so we were skunks.
Guest:That was my first performance.
Guest:And I knocked over the waves.
Guest:And that was a problem.
Guest:So I didn't know that I would have a stage career necessarily.
Guest:But then I always liked it.
Guest:I just always sort of... To be honest, I think I had a lot of emotions that I didn't know what to do with.
Guest:And I would often find myself like I had a cat.
Guest:I would go outside and like sing to my cat, cry to my cat, like as a kid, you know?
Guest:Like tell these stories or do this dress-up thing.
Guest:And like they always had this emotional commitment to them that I think was...
Marc:Well, you're kind of an only child in a way.
Marc:Kind of, yes.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, they were all in the house.
Marc:Nobody moved far away.
Guest:And we had a house that was always filled with people.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And food.
Guest:And, yeah, food, for sure.
Guest:But, I mean, like, mostly, like...
Marc:to people hanging around.
Guest:So if somebody didn't have a place to go, they came to our house and we'd always joke around like who's gonna be on the couch and we'd look and see like one of our cousins or some stranger, we don't know.
Guest:But my parents were always very open with people.
Guest:And my dad can play like all kinds of instruments and my dad's like really like a secret artist in a way.
Marc:What kind of, he played guitar and stuff?
Guest:My dad can play the guitar, the accordion, the banjo.
Marc:Did he bring it out at family gatherings?
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Not anymore.
Guest:He won't do it anymore.
Guest:My parents are actually shy in that way.
Guest:They can never believe that this is what I do for a living.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But my parents are a little shy that way, but yeah.
Guest:There was always music at my house.
Guest:My brothers played.
Guest:My sister played.
Marc:Bands?
Guest:I would play music all the time.
Marc:Like what kind?
Marc:Was anyone into crazy music?
Guest:A lot of Creedence Clearwater.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Loved a lot of Creedence Clearwater, which is, you know, there's only a few chords there, so it's not too complicated.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It was fun.
Guest:We always had instruments and drums and neighbors complaining about it.
Marc:So it was Creative House.
Guest:Yeah, of sorts.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But no one was in a band?
Guest:No, and nobody thought that, you know, no.
Guest:I mean, maybe my brothers.
Guest:Yeah, my brothers were in bands, I think, probably.
Guest:Yeah, rock bands.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But no one thought, I'm going to make a living at this.
No.
No.
Marc:No, just you.
Guest:Well, my brother, my oldest brother went to like a modeling contest with his girlfriend one time when he was young and then he ended up winning.
Guest:And so he traveled around modeling for a while and then did a little bit of like acting and stuff.
Guest:And yeah.
Guest:And I remember he helped me get one of my first jobs, which was I worked at a casting agency in San Francisco.
Marc:Who's?
Guest:God, it was called like Fortier Bonneau.
Marc:How many could there be in San Francisco?
Guest:Yeah, and they cast commercials, and I would be the person at the desk.
Guest:I mean, I was so excited.
Marc:I wanted to be an actress.
Guest:You're in show business.
Guest:I did my first play at 11, and I wanted to be an actress ever since then.
Guest:I was like, oh my God.
Marc:Which play?
Guest:The music man.
Guest:I played an old lady.
Marc:At 11?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Is there any videotape of that?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, I'm sure.
Guest:Absolutely.
Guest:Absolutely.
Guest:My father videoed everything.
Guest:It would be like somebody else's wedding and there'd be a picture of like, it'd just be a video of us doing something.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He had always had like, he was a photographer at one point too.
Guest:Like, so he has always had all this equipment.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you're working at a casting agency.
Marc:So how do you did you study acting at Loyola?
Marc:I did.
Marc:You did for undergrad.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And for all four years you were doing it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then I didn't totally finish.
Guest:And so I had to go back.
Guest:I went back.
Guest:I didn't know if I would have my goal was sort of never to finish.
Guest:I was like, I'm just going to go.
Guest:My parents, please go to college.
Guest:And I was the first of all of us to go away to a four year college.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:And so I went away to Loyola Marymount, which wasn't that far.
Guest:I wanted to go to either New York or L.A., and L.A.
Guest:seemed like not so far from my family.
Guest:And I had actually a little scholarship to another school, theater scholarship, closer to home.
Marc:So you got a scholarship at Loyola?
Marc:No, no, I had another place.
Guest:I don't know if I got one there or not.
Marc:So you auditioned for it?
Guest:No, you didn't have to audition, which I didn't want to have to audition.
Guest:And I went to Loyola.
Guest:And it was, you know, coming from my high school, it was like people that I liked at my high school who I thought were good went there.
Guest:So I thought, well, it was small.
Guest:It didn't feel so foreign to go to a giant school.
Marc:But you had built-in friends.
Guest:No.
Guest:Well, I had one girl who came with me, Jeannie, who had the pool party.
Guest:But then she left.
Guest:And then I made friends.
Guest:But that was the great thing, I think.
Guest:For me, going to school in Los Angeles and trying to become an actress was great for me because it actually gave me...
Guest:like a good group of friends who we had gone through moving away from home together you know and I have this wonderful group of people that I met through school I didn't have to meet them you know going out at bars because I just moved to LA to be an actress so I have I had a nice support system avoided the pratfalls of getting lost in the city right away
Guest:As much as possible.
Guest:Yeah, but I think that's hard.
Guest:I think it's really hard when people move out here to become an actor because you have to make friends.
Guest:There's a lot of pressure to begin with and then not to have a support system is tough.
Marc:And also figure out how to get in.
Marc:Because it seems like most of show business is built on those kind of relationships where you meet people and you kind of maintain friendships with casting agents and this and that.
Guest:I was never the best at that.
Marc:I was terrible at it.
Guest:Well, you did all right.
Marc:Yeah, it took 40 years.
Guest:But see, I think that's what you learn.
Guest:It wasn't about like... 35.
Guest:But I think that's the real relationship.
Guest:I think people can smell it if it's not real, right?
Marc:I guess.
Marc:I think there are people that have sort of an undeniable talent that if they get seen in the right situation, they'll probably be okay if they don't destroy themselves.
Marc:And then there are people that work very hard.
Marc:And kind of find their way as well.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Like, I don't know.
Marc:I've never I never was great at maintaining relationships or even being that pleasant when I was younger.
Guest:You seem pleasant now.
Marc:It took a long time because I'm sitting in Obama's chair.
Marc:Oh, yes.
Marc:No, I mean, it just did take it.
Marc:You know, I had to get beat up and, you know, handed my ass a few times.
Guest:I think it's hard when you come to be an actor or actress.
Marc:Yeah, I came to do comedy.
Marc:Acting, I never understood.
Guest:That's extraordinarily hard.
Marc:But at the very least, though, I just had no choice in it.
Marc:It was just what I was meant to do.
Marc:But the one thing about comedy is you really call your own shots.
Marc:You're your guy.
Marc:Once you figure it out, you're not auditioning.
Marc:You're doing your own shit from the beginning.
Marc:You're not kind of going in pretending.
Marc:I don't know how actors...
Marc:Handle auditioning.
Marc:It seems so horrendous.
Guest:It's still horrendous.
Guest:I mean, you know, I still have, I don't know that I necessarily have a handle.
Marc:It's heartbreaking, really.
Marc:I mean, you gotta really be pretty tough.
Guest:Which is interesting because you have to be tough and at the same time be vulnerable enough to be able to do all of the things that you need to do.
Marc:Well, I guess what you do is you frame it in your head as part of the job and eventually that just, you know, it has to, right?
Marc:I mean, you just have to be like, well, you might not get it.
Marc:Maybe you won't.
Marc:It's just part of it, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, and I think for me sometimes when I figure it out, like, oh, well, I'm going to get through this because I have this mechanism of coping with it, then it doesn't work the next time.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And you get depressed about it.
Marc:Right, right, right.
Marc:If you really want something.
Guest:But it's, you know, it's part of it.
Guest:But I think there are people who are good auditioners who, you know, I mean, some people are really good at auditioning.
Guest:Some people are not as good at auditioning.
Guest:Doesn't mean, can mean different things on set.
Marc:But at this point, people know you.
Guest:I still audition.
Guest:I auditioned for Green Book.
Marc:Yeah?
Marc:Twice.
Marc:Twice?
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Marc:You're very good in it.
Guest:Thank you.
Marc:Did you like working with those guys?
Guest:I did.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I did.
Guest:And you know, the audition part was actually really nice because it was me and Vigo and Peter.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:And they waited for me like I was working.
Guest:What were you doing?
Guest:I was doing a movie, a horror movie, which is like the first one I've really ever done.
Marc:Which one?
Guest:It's called La Llorona.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And so I didn't even have any clothes to wear.
Guest:I borrowed something and I ran.
Guest:And that's like one of three things that I've really was so excited to get that I was like, no, this is probably never going to happen.
Guest:So I'm just going to show up and try whatever I can do, which then that actually helps me in terms of entertainment.
Guest:auditioning I was like well I just can show up and do my best right this is what I got so right maybe they'll like yeah um and so I went in there and we did it and I thought it was just gonna be sort of like a casual they're like I'll be casual kind of reading and I got there and there was like props oh yeah and a camera and Vigo and I was like oh oh shit yeah
Guest:okay, you got two choices here, Linda.
Guest:You step up or step back.
Guest:So I was like, all right, here we go.
Guest:And when I read it, I felt like she was somebody that I would have known in my school or something.
Guest:She seemed very much like some friends of mine's mom, feeding everybody and loving everybody and welcoming everybody and taking care of everybody and supporting everybody.
Guest:She really supported everybody.
Guest:So...
Guest:We went in there and we just sort of did it and it was fun.
Guest:And I was like, I feel like I could.
Guest:I have this problem though.
Guest:I have this like curse where I'm like, I feel like I could do a different.
Guest:So I walked out and then I was like, you know, it was like 10 o'clock at night.
Guest:I went back another day and we sat in there and we talked and read and sort of improv.
Guest:And then it happened.
Guest:And then I was on the drive home and you know, you have this whole audition thing where you're like, oh God, did I just, did I do it?
Guest:I can never tell if I did a good job or a bad job.
Guest:You can't?
Guest:No.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:I mean, sometimes you know when you're not feeling it, but just because you're feeling it doesn't mean other people are feeling it.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So I don't know.
Guest:And then also, you just never know.
Guest:I actually feel like you don't really ever know.
Marc:It's hard to know because I've been acting for the first time really in the last few years.
Marc:Is that true?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That seems so crazy.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, I mean, I did my own show on IFC for a few years, but the glow thing was the first time I've ever really done it regularly as a job.
Marc:And there's definitely times where you're like, am I in it?
Marc:Am I doing it?
Marc:Like when you do a scene and then the director will move on.
Marc:You're like, I guess I was there.
Marc:You can't just sit there and go like, I don't know if I was quite...
Marc:I mean, you can.
Guest:You can, but then that's him.
Marc:You can ask for another take.
Marc:Right, but I've done that before.
Marc:But sometimes, like, I don't... Like, I think there's some... I don't know what the hell I'm judging myself against.
Marc:You've been doing it your whole life.
Guest:Like, I... But that doesn't mean I've gotten... You know, it doesn't mean you've gotten a handle.
Guest:It changes, you know?
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:You change, it changes.
Marc:But I think about submersion.
Marc:Like, you know, how far...
Marc:in are you supposed to be you know like i can be present and stuff but like then you watch people and you read about people and you're like god they transform their whole being how do you do that i think you just i don't know i mean i try to do that yeah you know if i'm lucky i'm doing that but i you know i think you just i like to be in the story and just try to think with the thoughts of people right not to say i don't want to sound so self-serious sure um
Guest:i see what you're saying like you know actually put memories in there yeah yeah yeah that even it doesn't matter right and then in the and then just listen to the other person right yeah and i've been really lucky i mean sitting there working with vigo's amazing did he put on weight for that thing oh yeah i mean he ate like a champ the whole time and my job was to bring out these like plates and plates of food like giant plates of sausage yeah yeah he would actually like
Guest:eat it eat it every take like a whole sausage in his mouth and i was like how is he how is he doing that number one and number two how is he gonna lose that yeah because it was 40 50 pounds oh but he lost it he did yeah i guess that's another thing i don't understand yeah me either eating on camera is terrifying the continuity i don't love watching people eat on camera i don't love it either watching a movie i don't really love watching other people eat
Marc:In general.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But they don't realize, like, you know, what's really going on most of the time is they're spitting it out after each take.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:And they're trying to figure out, you know, when they ate.
Marc:You know, you're asking scripty, like, when did I take the bite?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Or smoke the cigarette.
Guest:Oh, the cigarettes.
Marc:And he's doing both of those things at the same time.
Guest:There was one day where it was, like, multiple meats and a fish and, you know, it was, like, this Christmas feast and those fake cigarettes.
Guest:And it was...
Marc:A nightmare?
Guest:Yeah, it was a small room and it was a disastrous amount of smells.
Marc:Oh, that fucking, those fake cigarettes really stink.
Guest:They're terrible.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I don't know how that could be better for you than, I mean, I guess, you know.
Marc:Well, I don't smoke anymore, you know, so I smoke them.
Marc:You know, I know how to smoke because I did smoke when you smoke the fake ones.
Marc:You don't get, you don't feel like having another one.
Guest:No, but it feels like paper is burning and you're inhaling.
Marc:It's like something.
Marc:It's like some sort of herb or I don't know what's in there.
Marc:Yeah, no, you're definitely inhaling shit.
Guest:Yeah, it can't be good for you, right?
Marc:No, no.
Marc:But you smoked.
Marc:Did you smoke in Mad Men?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Big cigarettes though, yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Did you ever smoke for real?
Guest:You know, dabbled.
Marc:No, I don't.
Marc:Dabbled.
Marc:Dabbled?
Marc:That's where you're going to clam up?
Marc:No, I didn't.
Marc:That's the line?
Marc:That's the line.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Okay, you dabbled.
Marc:Fine.
Marc:So when you went to college, so that's where you got your primary training?
Guest:Primary training in dabbling?
Marc:Yeah, in dabbling with cigarettes and acting.
Yeah.
Guest:No, I, uh, let's see.
Guest:Yeah, I guess.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I studied a little bit.
Guest:You know, I did class at ACT.
Guest:I studied at the National Theater in London for a summer.
Guest:I studied around.
Marc:When you were younger?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:National Theater in London.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Did a summer program over there.
Guest:It was really great.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:And, uh, I mean, maybe I was in, was I, I was over 18 at that time.
Guest:But I studied around.
Guest:I liked to study.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I like it.
Guest:Um,
Marc:Doing scene work and that kind of stuff.
Guest:Scene work or body work, Alexander Gretowski.
Guest:Like, you know, all that kind of stuff.
Marc:You did all that.
Marc:I liked it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I did.
Marc:And it made a difference.
Guest:Which is funny.
Guest:I don't think, you know, I don't think it's obvious in me necessarily, but I liked it.
Marc:I did a lot.
Marc:Like, I just, the more I talk to actors and as somebody who's doing it now, because I'm always poking around trying to figure things out.
Marc:You know, whatever you put together for yourself is what it is.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Do you know what I mean?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:There are some real nerds about it and some real arrogant people about process, but like ultimately you're going to take it from wherever you, whatever works for you.
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, and I also, I never really liked to exhibit my process so much.
Guest:But I did used to do a lot of stuff.
Guest:I do some of it now.
Guest:Some of it is stuck.
Guest:Some of it hasn't.
Guest:Some of it would come in weird ways.
Guest:Like I remember somebody once gave me, as a joke, the Tony Robbins series, right?
Guest:And there's a workbook in there.
Guest:And I remember being like, you know what, I'm going to use this workbook.
Guest:I wish I could recall which characters I did it on.
Guest:But there's this whole workbook about like, where do you see yourself in five years?
Guest:Where do you see yourself?
Guest:Like, what is your biggest fear?
Guest:What would happen if you got over that biggest fear?
Guest:And it actually worked really great as like a character workbook.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:For when I was, I wanted to do that kind of work.
Guest:I would keep journals.
Guest:I would do, you know, I mean, all that kind of stuff.
Marc:Oh, it's sort of like your version of backstory.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, so you used a template of Tony Robbins.
Guest:There's a Tony Robbins workbook that I got, and I was like, this is kind of perfect.
Marc:It's good for character building.
Guest:And, of course, I didn't do it for my real life and get any.
Marc:No, of course not.
Marc:Well, no, I should have.
Marc:I should have.
Marc:No, maybe not.
Guest:The quote-unquote joke gift that I got.
Marc:You might have quit acting and just started going to Tony Robbins concerts.
Guest:They look like they might be fun.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Well, people hyped up.
Marc:Sure, yeah.
Marc:Feel good for a few days.
Marc:Why not?
Marc:Spend a couple grand.
Marc:I'll take any of them.
Marc:Leave thinking you can win.
Guest:That would be great.
Guest:If I could get convinced of that, that would be amazing.
Guest:My life would be different.
Marc:You are winning.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Knock on wood.
Marc:So Freaks and Geeks wasn't the first one.
Guest:No.
Guest:I had done a couple years at least.
Guest:I had my 21st birthday on my first set.
Guest:And I was playing a freshman in high school.
Marc:In TV?
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:On a Saturday morning kids show.
Guest:And I remember having that birthday and I thought to myself, if I could have every single birthday on a set, I would be the luckiest person in the world.
Guest:How'd that work out?
Marc:How many did you get?
Guest:Actually on set?
Marc:Yeah, probably a lot.
Guest:Not that many.
Guest:No?
Guest:I mean, you know.
Marc:ER, like three, must have three birthdays or four birthdays on set.
Guest:A hundred dollars.
Guest:But I'm in June, so sometimes you're not filling in.
Marc:Oh yeah, not shooting.
Marc:Maybe you could just go over there.
Marc:You mind if I just go into the studio?
Guest:Well, then that changes after like 20 years.
Guest:You're like, I just would like to have my birthday off.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:No, I should still be so lucky.
Marc:So you did like just TV stuff first?
Guest:I did, I did.
Guest:I got my first job.
Guest:Well, when I worked at that commercial agency.
Marc:In San Francisco?
Guest:In San Francisco for like the summer.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I got to be an extra in a commercial.
Guest:Oh, exciting.
Guest:Which is not a glamorous job for me at the time.
Guest:But you were on camera.
Guest:I mean, it was glamorous for me at the time, but you know.
Guest:And then I came to L.A.
Guest:and I tore down a thing on a post and I was an extra in a movie.
Guest:It was a not great experience.
Guest:And then I was in a play and I kept sending out invitations for like actors and managers.
Guest:I got that book.
Guest:I can't remember the name of the book now, but it was like all the actors, managers and agents and addresses.
Marc:Did anyone come?
Guest:A friend of a friend had a manager and he was coming to see it.
Guest:And he was like, I'll send one to them and I'll bring him.
Guest:And he came and he saw me.
Guest:And of course, I was playing hunchback because I got a choice to audition for like the ingenue or the hunchback.
Guest:And I was like, the hunchback.
Guest:And and so he came and saw the play.
Guest:And afterwards, like, I'd love to represent you.
Guest:Come meet with me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so I met with him.
Guest:And the first audition he sent me on was a kid's Saturday morning show called Bone Chillers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I went in and I auditioned.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I got the part.
Marc:You're off and running.
Guest:And I was like, oh, my God, this is incredible.
Guest:I had been working scooping ice cream at my college.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Four dollars and twenty five cents an hour.
Guest:And the idea of like making scale was the like it was just unbelievable to me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was unbelievable to me that I could make a living as an actor.
Guest:Just didn't really seem like a real possibility.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I didn't know anybody who had actually.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Done it.
Marc:Right.
Guest:And as a job.
Guest:But by the time I'd go into college, I was like, that's what I want to do.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it happened.
Marc:You were 21.
Guest:I'm not going to do that.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know, I don't know how I'm going to do it.
Guest:And then I played very, very young.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:For a long time.
Guest:I looked very young.
Guest:That's I was a late bloomer.
Guest:I hit puberty really late.
Marc:That's good, though.
Marc:Well, it's good for you.
Marc:High school.
Marc:OK.
Marc:But I mean, for the job for Hollywood, it was great.
Marc:It's good because if you can find somebody that can act and also play 15, it's like you can get a lot of mileage out of that.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And I knew people who were sort of in my similar situation who were like, oh, I hate it.
Guest:I can only play a kid.
Guest:And I was like, please, this is going to run out.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:The sands are going through the hourglass, so you might as well enjoy it.
Guest:You're not going to be able to play young forever.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So you played a kid for the first few years?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Long.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, all the way.
Marc:A long time.
Marc:Freaks and geeks.
Marc:You were 18, right?
Guest:Past freaks and geeks.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So you could really do it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And then you're also getting all that experience.
Right.
Guest:Yeah, and I loved it.
Guest:I was excited.
Guest:I mean, I wanted to play characters, so not playing something that was me was fun.
Guest:I always wanted—that was sort of what I thought you were supposed to do.
Marc:But you were doing like—it seemed like we did a few one-offs, but then you had arcs and things, it looks like.
Yeah.
Guest:It was after my first, I booked the series.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I got like 13 episodes, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Which was a big deal.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:To book a series was a big deal.
Guest:Everybody was excited.
Marc:Your new manager must have been thrilled.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:How long did you stay with that guy?
Guest:For as long as I could.
Guest:And then he said to me, he actually said to me, I don't know how much more I can do for you.
Guest:It might be time for you to move on.
Guest:Like he was very kind about it.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Because I had outgrown it, yeah.
Guest:That's a nice story.
Guest:Yeah, it is.
Guest:Yeah, so you got a series and then you did like... I did guest spots, but there was a year where I feel like I didn't work for a whole year.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then I think I got a part on Third Rock from the Sun.
Marc:John Lithgow, right?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Who was the nicest person.
Guest:I remember him being the nicest person back then.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That was a really nice cast.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then we worked again on Daddy's Home, too.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:He was like, all this time.
Marc:Did he play your father-in-law?
Guest:Yes.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:So how does, well, you might as well tell the story.
Marc:Oh, no.
Marc:What story?
No.
Marc:Well, just about like how because I've talked to Judd, I've talked to Paul, but that seemed to be a very cathartic thing for everybody involved.
Marc:And, you know, what was the process of Freaks and Geeks?
Marc:Because it was it's such a special and, you know, kind of isolated show.
Guest:Yeah, and I think everybody has a, you know, nobody really knew who any of us were at all.
Guest:And some of us had not worked at all.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And even if we had worked, people maybe didn't notice.
Marc:Of course.
Marc:You know?
Guest:Like, I had been working, but nobody took notice.
Marc:Yeah, you're in a lot of TV stuff.
Guest:I mean, my story is, I remember I kept auditioning for
Guest:pilot season you know this whole pilot season you get like a bunch of scripts you read the first episode and everybody goes in on auditions and back then it was only network television so you would if you got to the point where it was you and a few other people you would test you would have to sign the agreement like I will be in this show for the next six or seven years and this is my pay and you know you know how it works um
Guest:And then you would go in and if two of you didn't get cast and one did, they'd rip up two contracts and the one person would go on to become the person in the show.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So the year before it had happened to me and I tested for a bunch of stuff where it's like sign the contract, negotiate the contract and then get there and then heartbreak.
Marc:Well, yeah, and you go in for all those executives.
Guest:Yeah, you have to go in like a hundred times too.
Guest:I mean, a hundred, but like literally one time I went in like eight times for something, you know, because you go into the casting director and you go into the other person, the other person.
Marc:It just keeps getting scarier and scarier.
Guest:Yeah, as the group gets bigger and the people who are judging you is more and then it needs to go through more people and then, you know.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And so the year before I had like almost gotten a bunch of things.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So the next year came and I think people were casting directors were aware that I was maybe somebody who could potentially be hired.
Guest:And I was up for three things on NBC at that time.
Guest:And I read Freaks and Geeks and I was like, this isn't like anything else.
Guest:It really wasn't.
Guest:You know, it was like that was sort of what killed it in its own way.
Guest:It wasn't like anything else.
Marc:What was it exactly that made you know that?
Marc:Because it seemed more vulnerable or more real?
Marc:That.
Guest:It was funny in a way that wasn't a one-liner funny.
Marc:Right, right, yeah.
Guest:It was in between a sitcom and a drama, which wasn't happening a lot at all at that point.
Guest:That just really wasn't.
Guest:It didn't seem heightened.
Guest:It seemed bittersweet.
Marc:Organic.
Guest:Heartbreaking.
Guest:And it also seemed to me that the girl was smart.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And not sexualized.
Marc:Right.
Guest:You know, I mean, it was just like an interesting character to me.
Guest:It was a person who seemed to be going through what I felt like I sort of went through as a kid.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was like, you really love your parents, but you need to separate.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You like your friends, but you kind of out... You know, just the idea of outgrowing who you once were.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And it just felt... There was a heart to it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That didn't seem to be... The other thing I was reading was like...
Guest:Girl battling with how to be rebellious and sexual.
Guest:And the other one was like, I can't even remember what the other one was.
Guest:And I remember getting a phone call because there were three things on the table.
Guest:And I said, I want to wait for this one.
Guest:And so I had to negate the other two.
Guest:So it was like, if I didn't get that one, then I wasn't going to probably have a job that year.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because those were my three things that I had gone all the way to the end with.
Guest:I took a chance.
Guest:It was like a gamble.
Guest:And they said, and I got a phone call from someone from the network because the other two things were on the same network on NBC.
Guest:And they said, you know, these other two are probably more of a sure thing.
Guest:This other one especially, it's so-and-so and such-and-such, and it's in-house, and I just want you to know.
Guest:And I said, you know, I really appreciate the phone call, which I don't know where I got the guts for this.
Guest:But I was like, I really appreciate the phone call, but I really believe in this, and I'm going to try to do, I'm going to go for this one, and hopefully this will be the one.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Which was a big deal.
Marc:Yeah, it was a big deal.
Guest:Because I didn't know that those phone calls weren't always made, and I don't think I realized what that meant at the time.
Marc:But you loved the material.
Marc:I loved it.
Guest:I absolutely loved it.
Guest:I was committed to how much I loved it.
Marc:That's great.
Guest:And then I heard that they didn't want to see me.
Guest:Somebody wasn't a fan.
Guest:I don't know what was true and what isn't, because you get filtered these things through representation at the time.
Guest:You never found out later.
Marc:They could have been trying to dupe you into doing the other thing.
Guest:Who knows, right?
Guest:But they were pretty supportive, I have to say.
Guest:They were supportive.
Guest:I think everybody who read it knew it was good material.
Guest:Special.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So, yeah, I auditioned, and then I auditioned again, and then I auditioned with the real people.
Guest:I auditioned with Jason, who I had been in a movie with before.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:So he was the only person I'd ever really known.
Guest:And then I remember Franco being there.
Guest:I remember a couple of people being there that ended up being in the show.
Guest:John Daly wasn't there yet because I think he got cast out of New York.
Guest:But there was a thing where they brought us all together and we did mixes and matches.
Guest:And then we read for like several parts.
Guest:And then I got the part.
Marc:And was always pretty fun.
Marc:That process.
Guest:I mean, that process was I mean, if you look at the group of people themselves, I mean, like I'm sure, you know, like working with when you work with a group of people who are really funny.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It makes every day really fun.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then, you know, those were really funny kids.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then there was this special thing to it, too, where a lot of them were very young, so you had people's parents on set all the time.
Guest:Oh, right.
Guest:So, like, Seth has wonderful parents, and they were on set all the time.
Guest:And you grow to love people's family.
Guest:It's like going to school or, like, community center with people because you end up knowing just more than the actor next to you.
Marc:Sure, sure.
Marc:You get to know them as people, see where they come from.
Guest:Yeah, you see people's parents.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And it was, you know, relative to your life.
Marc:You mean Canadians?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, sure.
Marc:Several.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But, you know, so you, it was, um, and I think everybody was green enough at the time to be completely optimistic.
Guest:And so that there was, nobody was really jaded yet.
Guest:Oh, right.
Guest:And so there was that going into it with the group of people that they had chosen.
Guest:They chose people that weren't the usual suspects.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Which is nice.
Guest:Cause you know, I think the more you get, there's like always a list of usual suspects that come in.
Marc:I've talked to Martin too.
Marc:Like Martin.
Guest:Love Martin.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He's something.
Guest:He's so talented.
Guest:And what you didn't realize too when he was a kid was you would sit there and you would talk to him and his posture would be one way and then he would go to play Bill and it was almost like he had Estelle Getty's posture from the Golden Girls.
Guest:Like it was like a total... There was a metamorphosis there that people just assumed, oh, that's just him.
Guest:Yeah, it wasn't.
Guest:It wasn't.
Guest:No, everybody was really... You know, and I was older.
Guest:I was kind of pitching up my voice.
Guest:I was kind of like pushing things down.
Guest:You know, I was like, you know, we were all doing...
Guest:character work, which was really fun.
Guest:And we were all watching each other and encouraging each other to do it.
Guest:And then Busy and I had, we both went to Loyola.
Marc:I just talked to her.
Marc:She's great.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You guys friends?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, good.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, I don't see, it's hard to see everybody anymore.
Marc:Sure, of course.
Guest:Especially when you have family and then you're working.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:And you guys got along right away?
Guest:yes we knew we went to the same college we'd kind of like known each other peripherally and she tells this story about like how i saw her and there i was like you should do the show and then we end up doing the show together you know it's just yeah we end up being on er together later and it's you know it's a it's a a lot somebody once told me it's a long life in this business if you're lucky and i feel like i hope that that's true because there's a lot of a lot of good things that come back around
Marc:Yeah, and you just did that last Paul Feig movie, too.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And that was fun, huh?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I didn't get to see it.
Guest:He's like, I have this thing.
Guest:You want to come for two days?
Guest:I'm like, yes.
Guest:Whatever you say, yes, I'll go.
Marc:Those relationships stayed strong?
Guest:Yeah, Paul's a sweet person.
Guest:He is a great guy.
Guest:And a lot of that Freaks and Geeks, like a lot of that bittersweet heartbreak stuff.
Marc:It's all him?
Guest:Well, not all him.
Guest:I mean, it's a collaboration.
Guest:The writer's room there was amazing, too.
Guest:There was so many people...
Guest:on that show who brought their whole selves to it because they sort of asked them to like, hey, what's the worst thing that happened to you?
Guest:Put it in the show.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah, and people really delved into like that crappy time of being a kid where you feel terrible about everything but hopeful about everything too.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So that was the life changer.
Guest:that series no i mean i don't i'm still waiting for the life changers oh yeah maybe it'll happen uh keep trying i mean it seems like i'm still trying i just worked at four in the morning last night um no i think uh that changed things in some ways yeah but then the show died yeah yeah
Guest:And at that point, when a show died, it meant things to people.
Guest:It wasn't like, oh, well, somebody else will pick it up and it'll just run forever.
Guest:When a show died back then, you were considered a failure.
Guest:Not me personally, I don't think necessarily.
Marc:But there was a little bit of a stink on you.
Guest:There just was like a, what do you do next?
Marc:Right.
Guest:You know?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And what do you do next that kind of compares to that.
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Guest:And why didn't people like that?
Marc:Right.
Guest:And why didn't that work?
Guest:And, you know, because I had this thing where I like I was in these magazines as like, you know, we were in all these different things like critics choices and, you know, won an Emmy for casting or all these different things happened.
Guest:But then the success didn't match up.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It got canceled.
Guest:And then all of us were out of a job.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:For real.
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Guest:And the guys didn't feel great.
Guest:They wanted it to go.
Guest:Sure, of course.
Guest:Everybody wanted it to succeed.
Guest:So there was a feeling of, back to the drawing board.
Marc:Kind of devastating.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And how long were you out of work?
Marc:You were doing movies too a bit, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Looks like you did some weird movies.
Guest:I did.
Guest:Well, you know, what am I gonna, I don't, I don't have my choice.
Marc:No, I'm not judging you.
Guest:That was a little judgy.
Marc:Well, no, just like I was looking at things and I think your first movie was like, or maybe not your first one was a Dee Snider project.
Guest:Okay, Strangeland, yes.
Guest:Which that was coming off the heels of Sling Blade.
Guest:It was the same studio.
Guest:So like they're doing this horror movie, which is the only other horror movie.
Guest:They're doing this horror movie and it's like the same studio as Sling Blade.
Guest:You know, it's all that stuff.
Guest:But that was, we had fun.
Guest:It was the first time I ever went away on location and we had fun.
Guest:Colorado.
Marc:But it seems like, what was it about?
Guest:It was about a guy who was in like into body modification and sort of like body torturing and like stalking this girl and her father and yeah.
Guest:Terrifying idea.
Marc:So it was a good experience.
Guest:Oh, making that movie was so much fun.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I have very rarely had bad experiences.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Very, very rarely.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You work with some very funny people.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Amazing people.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Martin Short.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Well, that was fun, too.
Marc:I bet.
Guest:That was a whole improv movie.
Guest:We had fun.
Marc:And Reese.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Which I love.
Guest:I remember at the time, I was like, I don't know if you want it.
Guest:Because I think it was after Feast.
Guest:She's like, I don't know if you want to do this part.
Guest:I was like, I think that part is hilarious.
Guest:I want to do that part.
Guest:You know, I didn't know that the movie would become, you know, Legally Blonde became this like thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I had no idea it would become that, but.
Marc:She's kind of a thing.
Marc:Reese is kind of an amazing person.
Guest:She can do both.
Guest:She can do comedy.
Guest:She's really, she's producing now.
Marc:Powerhouse.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:But so you never had any really bad experiences.
Guest:Well, I mean, I wouldn't say I've never had a bad experience, but I think the majority of my career, I mean, I...
Guest:I've had good experiences.
Guest:I like people.
Guest:I like being on set.
Marc:Well, it seems like you were also aware at a young age of the possibilities of bad things that can happen to actresses and making bad choices.
Guest:My grandfather used to always tell me, don't be an actress.
Guest:It's a dirty business.
Guest:And I was like, what are you talking about?
Guest:I think I was...
Guest:I was oblivious enough not to understand when things like that were happening to me in some ways and to deflect them.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I think there are definitely times when things could have gone other ways.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But I was just lucky enough for that not to happen.
Marc:But also, it seemed like the choices you make, you don't seem to exude the kind of strange insecurity or desperation.
Marc:You seem pretty earnest and together for the most part.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:I appreciate that.
Guest:I have a lot of inner anxiety about stuff, I have to say.
Guest:And I question things because there are, I feel, infinite possibilities when I try to do a character or a piece.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then at the same time, on the other side of that, I feel like there's some perfect way of doing it.
Guest:So I'm never quite satisfied.
Marc:Yeah, I know that one.
Guest:But I know what I like for the most part.
Marc:But it seems like you were able to not get used up.
Guest:I tried not to, yeah.
Guest:And I tried to stay out of any of the tabloidy things.
Guest:I tried not to get drawn into that kind of stuff early on.
Marc:And I think also... That was a conscious choice?
Guest:Yeah, I think there were opportunities where I could have made...
Guest:different choices right to invite certain things right um but uh i'm not that i'm contrary to what i do i'm not sure i like to be totally looked at you know in a way in a way yeah um i'm very open with my my friends and i'm very open with people that i meet and i love meeting people yeah the reason why i like being on sets like it's just an incredible pop-up community
Marc:Well, it seems like even with something like ER, which you were on for a long time, I mean, out of all the shows that people love, that seemed to be a real family somehow that evolved.
Guest:Absolutely.
Marc:You know, like as the cast changed and, you know, there was a history to it and, like, it seemed pretty dug in.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Like, it must have been a pretty good life for a few years.
Guest:It was.
Guest:I actually was only intending on staying a year, a year and a half.
Guest:I'd had a bunch of stuff personally happen that I just wanted to be close to home, and I just wanted to work and dive into work and be close to home.
Guest:And they said, you know, they want to meet with you.
Guest:And I was like, oh, I don't know if I'm interested in doing a television show at the moment.
Guest:I just went...
Guest:And I went and I met with them, and I remember seeing Jonathan Kaplan, who had directed The Accused, talking about the show and, like, all these people.
Guest:And then I remember watching an episode where a lot of the characters went over in Africa, and I watched the act, and I was like, this is different than anything I've seen on television.
Guest:They said, you know, you can come on for a year and a half.
Guest:I thought, well, that's good.
Guest:I could stay close to my family.
Guest:I could sort of, like, dig in here.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then after a year and a half, I'll just...
Guest:get out other stuff you know because i never like to stay in one place long enough like i really i like to change it up yeah for in terms of work yes yeah as much as i can i don't always have those opportunities to choose everything right get like the first crop of choices yeah but whenever i can i try to choose things that are sort of different from the last
Guest:And so after the first year and a half, it was such a wonderfully supportive, hilarious group of people.
Guest:We laughed so much on that show, which is surprising because it's so serious.
Guest:But that's what keeps it sort of alive for you that I couldn't imagine choosing to leave the community of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the work was always really fun.
Guest:We always had people for me when other actors come in who you admire or who are great or who challenged you like we always had incredible guest stars.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it was in and the actual cast was all they were fantastic actors.
Guest:So we had fun working together and we had fun off screen together.
Guest:And there's some of my close friends still.
Marc:So, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so the community of it was really a beautiful thing.
Guest:And I stayed.
Yeah.
Guest:And it got you through whatever you were going through?
Guest:Yeah, it got me through a lot of things.
Guest:And it got a lot of, you know, and if you spend, it was longer than I'd spent in high school, longer than I spent in college.
Guest:So that community of people is like a support system.
Marc:It's so weird because, like, when I, I mean, I came to Freaks and Geeks later.
Marc:And because I don't keep up with things, I don't watch enough things.
Marc:When I saw you on Mad Men, I'm like, oh, look, she's back.
Marc:But you never went anywhere.
Guest:But the funny thing about ER is that industry-wise, people didn't really watch it so much anymore.
Guest:Like if I go travel somewhere outside of America, people are like, emergency room.
Guest:But within the industry, people just thought I disappeared.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But you were working a lot?
Guest:I was working and enjoying myself.
Guest:And also honing certain skills.
Guest:But then after that, my skills had been honed in such a way that I felt like I needed to take a break.
Marc:You left on your own will?
Guest:I waited until the show ended.
Marc:I ended with the show.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:And then when I left, I just sort of took a break and I was like, okay, I'm going to wait and I'm going to find something that I, because I love to work.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that can be a wonderful thing and that can also be like, hey, you got to chill out for a second and just like wait for something.
Marc:We had some money saved.
Marc:You could think about things.
Guest:Yeah, and also I just, I like the process.
Guest:But anyways, and so I waited and then I got the script called Return, which is one of my favorite things that I had done.
Guest:And it was a small film with Liza Johnson, who at the time was a first-time director.
Marc:Oh, you played a soldier, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Soldier returning.
Guest:And I was in, it was the first movie I was in nearly every frame.
Guest:And so that was really, that was really Michael Shannon and John Slattery and Paul Sparks.
Guest:It was really a great experience.
Marc:So the whole, the ER thing really gave you like a whole sort of toolbox of chops and confidence.
Guest:Yes, but you worked in one way.
Guest:Like there's a way of working in television when it's procedural that is like, you know, you learn how to like...
Marc:get it done every single day.
Guest:And you, for me that's, but it also helped me to learn to like really listen to other people in a different way because that's what keeps it interesting for you is what the people bringing in have to offer you.
Guest:So when we'd get like Stanley Tucci or Forrest Whitaker or any of these people who came in
Guest:to play their roles, it added a different dynamic.
Guest:And you were able to, I don't know, it helped me.
Guest:It honed a listening skill for me in a way.
Marc:That's great.
Guest:It's changing the performance.
Guest:That's important.
Guest:But everything's different.
Guest:Doing that show is 100 times different than doing Bloodline.
Guest:It's a totally different experience, even though it's a series.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:But for you personally, as a person who...
Guest:can do what you do every experience adds to you know the confidence and to the ability like you don't show up places anymore where you're like what the fuck's happening here no i do absolutely absolutely 100 i definitely show up and i can also feel like i know what i do and then the next day i'll be like what am i doing um but that's good you know i feel like once you get too convinced of what you're doing you're maybe not discovering enough
Marc:Did you like doing Mad Men?
Guest:Yes.
Marc:That's kind of an interesting universe, huh?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:Yes.
Guest:And there's a very, you know, it's like, you know, I didn't join the show not knowing what the show was.
Guest:I knew what the show was, but I liked the show, so being part of it was fun.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then you have the ability to trust what's happening there.
Guest:You know, when you do a new show, you're sort of like trying to feel out like how it's going to work and what it's going to be.
Marc:Does this person know what they're doing?
Marc:Well, sometimes, sure.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:but uh and you've and you can do it seems like you can do anything you can do comedy you can you know you're you're a good foil you can do drama you can do everything thank you and they still everybody still uh puts you in the funny movies you're in big funny movies yeah and they're also in kids movies yeah you do you do everything what is this thing you're that is at the end of the uh resume here what's this al capone movie
Guest:Oh, that.
Guest:I'm doing a show right now called Dead to Me.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That's a dramedy.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:With Christina Applegate.
Marc:Oh, okay.
Marc:How's she doing?
Guest:She's great.
Marc:Great.
Guest:She's so good.
Guest:Good.
Marc:Is that on?
Guest:Not yet.
Guest:No, we just, we finished shooting on next week.
Guest:We have three more days.
Marc:How many did you do?
Guest:10.
Marc:I just finished last night at 4 a.m.
Guest:My mind's a little crazy.
Guest:But that's been really fun.
Guest:And then the Al Capone movie at Alfonso is Tom Hardy plays Al Capone.
Marc:It's crazy.
Marc:You're working with Tom Hardy.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What the fuck?
Marc:That's like a well of what the hell's going on there.
Marc:With him or with me?
Marc:Yeah, with him.
Marc:Just not with him.
Marc:He's such an odd actor.
Marc:He's so good.
Marc:Oh, he's so good.
Marc:Yeah, I can't.
Guest:He's so good.
Guest:And you play his wife?
Guest:Yes, I play Make-A-Bone.
Guest:And it's about...
Guest:And the director is Josh Trank and he wrote it and directed it and he'll cut it all together.
Guest:It'll be totally his vision.
Guest:And he's got like a really specific, really cool vision.
Guest:It's about Al Capone and his last years and his syphilitic dementia.
Marc:Wild.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:When you do movies like and you've done so many of them.
Guest:I mean, I don't know if it's about that, but... But that's the period.
Guest:That's what it is.
Marc:That's the time in Al's life.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But when you do movies like that, when you read a script, isn't it sort of like mind-blowing to like, who would commit to this story?
Marc:Why this story?
Marc:It's just amazing to me that people choose what they choose.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:But that's the whole thing.
Marc:I know, I know.
Marc:That's what creates you, is your choices.
Marc:Do you ever think about writing or doing that stuff?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Do you do it?
Guest:I do write.
Guest:I write with a partner and he and I have sold two things that never got made.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:But we went down the road.
Marc:Yeah, sure.
Guest:And I always hesitate to say that because I hesitate to say you're a writer because everybody's like, oh, I'm a writer.
Marc:Well, was it projects that you wanted to be in?
Guest:One was not and one was.
Guest:And then we're working on a few other things.
Marc:Oh, that's cool.
Guest:I like it.
Guest:I really like writing.
Marc:And you've done so much TV and stuff.
Marc:Did you ever direct?
Guest:No, not yet.
Marc:You want to do that too?
Guest:Eventually.
Marc:Am I saying things you're like, why does he bring this up?
Marc:He knows I want to do it.
Marc:I just haven't fucking done it yet.
Marc:And I don't know why.
Guest:Oh, no, not at all.
Guest:No, I actually had an opportunity to do it.
Guest:But at this point, it's I feel like I need to sort of take a little breather moment.
Guest:Sort of have my real.
Guest:I guess I'm just coming off the series.
Guest:It's been a long haul.
Guest:And I was on a movie right before that.
Guest:So I'm just going to take a little break.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And recollect myself.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:All right.
Guest:But no, I do want to do those things.
Guest:I know that sounds way too serious for- What?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I sounded very serious about collecting myself.
Marc:Right then?
Marc:About recollecting yourself?
Guest:Yeah, that is not even a word, but I'm so serious about it.
Marc:You just want to reground.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Re- Regroup.
Marc:Relive my life.
Marc:Regroup.
Marc:Relive your life?
Marc:No.
Guest:Sometimes.
Marc:You're awfully hard on yourself.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:What is that about?
Guest:Annoying.
Guest:It's annoying.
Marc:To you?
Guest:To me.
Guest:I'm hard on myself about being hard on myself.
Marc:You ever tried to figure out why?
Guest:I think it's rooted in...
Guest:Well, do we really want to go?
Guest:I think it's anxiety, to be honest.
Guest:I think if you have anxiety, it'll go in any way.
Guest:It's like water.
Guest:It'll find a chance.
Marc:No, I have it.
Marc:I have it, but mine manifests in dread.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:I start thinking, but over nothing.
Marc:Today, I've got to eat lunch.
Marc:Just ridiculous shit is how my anxiety works.
Guest:That's why I'm saying it'll find something.
Marc:I know, but I don't beat the shit out of myself as much as I used to.
Guest:How did you stop?
Marc:By I didn't know what purpose it was serving on some level.
Marc:And that doesn't always stop it.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Guest:It's not serving any purpose.
Marc:No, it's the worst.
Guest:But I also feel like I'm going to I think I can flip it sometimes.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Sometimes it goes negative.
Guest:And I think of that same.
Guest:I think it also goes positive sometimes, too.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Flip it.
Guest:So I'm going to practice that.
Guest:flipping it flipping it from i suck to i'm good you can also flip it to being yeah imagining the worst so you can yeah i can't i i and i do feel like that is part of why i do it i mean i also feel like i might win the lottery yeah and i also feel like there might be an earthquake you know what i mean it's the same do you play the lottery i do but then i don't check my ticket so i don't know what that means
Marc:More anxiety.
Guest:Yeah, maybe.
Marc:Like what happens if I win or don't win?
Marc:Did I throw away a ticket?
Marc:Did I throw away a winning ticket?
Guest:Yeah, that's true too.
Marc:I didn't, right?
Marc:I don't know.
Guest:We're kidding.
Marc:It's good talking to you.
Marc:I do have some in my wallet if you want.
Marc:You do?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Thanks for coming in.
Guest:Thank you for having me.
Marc:That was nice.
Marc:She's intense, but very charming, but very, you know, there's a lot going on there.
Marc:I enjoyed that.
Marc:That was Linda Cardellini in me, and she can be seen currently in the movie Green Book, which she's great in.
Marc:It's in theaters now, and she's in the upcoming Netflix comedy series Dead to Me.
Marc:Now I'm going to play some haunting, echo-ridden guitar.
guitar solo
Guest:Boomer lives!