Episode 868 - Sam Beam / Bob Saget

Episode 868 • Released November 29, 2017 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Marc:Lock the gates!

00:00:09Marc:all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fucking ears what the fuck nicks oh my god i'm harried i'm literally in between scenes right now i'm shooting glow we're shooting down the street down through i can't give too much away i'll tell you we're shooting at a movie theater that's all you're getting that's all you're getting not far from here i'm back at the i'm back at the cat ranch

00:00:33Marc:the i'm in the garage of the house at the cat ranch but i i came up we're going to another location i got to shoot a thing there can't tell you what it is can't tell i did i can tell you that i spent the day primarily with alice and brie shooting some stuff all day long and now i'm gonna go go do another scene i can't i can't divulge but i can tell you this

00:00:54Marc:I'm sitting here in my Sam Sylvia outfit with makeup on, and I'm still miked.

00:01:00Marc:I'm still miked.

00:01:01Marc:And I ran over here in between.

00:01:03Marc:They're doing a company move up into Eagle Rock, and I'm like, I got to get this stuff out before it gets too late on the East Coast so Brendan can get on it and not stay up until the middle of the night.

00:01:17Marc:So that's what's happening.

00:01:18Marc:And fortunately, we've got a pretty packed show today.

00:01:21Marc:We've got a little shorty with Bob Saget, the comedian, you know him.

00:01:25Marc:And I'm very excited to say that we've got Sam Beam on the show.

00:01:29Marc:Sam Beam is essentially iron and wine.

00:01:32Marc:He does some music that I really like, and I was happy that he came by.

00:01:35Marc:So I could get you up to speed pretty quickly, but I...

00:01:38Marc:do not have a lot of time i'm starting to sweat and the makeup is irritating my face oh but i will say this if you're looking to get a unique gift for a wtf fan go get them a cat mug just like the ones i give to my guests brian r jones has a new batch of these handmade mugs with artwork by our old buddy dima who did our cat shirts and stickers and you can go to brianrjones.com to get yours they go on sale today at 12 noon eastern nine pacific and they always go fast they do they're like gone in a second

00:02:07Marc:You can also still get your favorite person in your life, a copy of Waiting for the Punch, Words to Live By from the WTF podcast.

00:02:14Marc:It's available wherever you get books.

00:02:16Marc:And if you want a signed copy, you can get one at podswag.com slash punch.

00:02:21Marc:That's P-O-D-S-W-A-G dot com slash punch.

00:02:25Marc:Great for birthday gifts, for...

00:02:28Marc:Hey, I hope you feel better gifts for the Xmas and the other holidays, the Hanukkah and the other gifting things.

00:02:36Marc:Yeah, just generally good to give people and buy your and have one for yourself.

00:02:40Marc:Why don't you get yourself one, too?

00:02:43Marc:There you go.

00:02:44Marc:Is that how's that for pitching?

00:02:45Marc:Am I a pitch man?

00:02:47Marc:All right.

00:02:47Marc:So the new house is coming along.

00:02:48Marc:It has been baptized by I don't know which cat, but one of them decided to pee on the floor.

00:02:53Marc:It wasn't like a territorial peeing.

00:02:56Marc:It was just someone missed the box, and there's a puddle of fresh pee on the fresh floor in the new old house.

00:03:04Marc:It's an old house, but it's a new floor, and now a little pee has seeped into the cracks.

00:03:10Marc:And I know that the people who lived there before, the woman who...

00:03:13Marc:owned the house was a cat uh had horrendous cat allergies so i think this is in at least the last decade the first time the cat will have scented the house so now part of the house will uh already uh i've i've slept there maybe three or four nights and now it smells like my old house like cat pee and cat poop uh it's only in one room but give them time and

00:03:37Marc:I just have these weird cats.

00:03:39Marc:They can't just get in the box and piss and shit like regular cats.

00:03:42Marc:Two of them need to perch.

00:03:43Marc:Like Buster will actually get all fours, all four of his paws on the edge of the goddamn box and perch there like a fucking bird and shit and pee.

00:03:53Marc:Monkey, he'll sometimes, you know, just two out of the box.

00:03:58Marc:And sometimes he'll just miss the box altogether and pee right up against the wall.

00:04:01Marc:Fonda, pretty good.

00:04:02Marc:Pretty good with the box.

00:04:04Marc:Not great at burying.

00:04:05Marc:Monkey and Fonda never really got a handle on burying shit or piss.

00:04:10Marc:I don't know why.

00:04:10Marc:Monkey tends to try to bury it with his paw outside the box or on the edge of the box.

00:04:16Marc:Fonda does it occasionally, but usually bails midway.

00:04:19Marc:Buster, on the other hand, looks like he's digging for fucking gold.

00:04:23Marc:Like he's digging to get out.

00:04:26Marc:Like he's digging, he's burrowing a tunnel, whether he's burying or getting started.

00:04:31Marc:There's a 90% chance that fucking litter will be all over the goddamn floor.

00:04:37Marc:And I know you people are going to tell me, hey, dude, get a covered litter box.

00:04:41Marc:They don't they don't do it.

00:04:42Marc:I, my cats are always fucking weird.

00:04:45Marc:They're peculiar.

00:04:45Marc:They have odd piccadillos.

00:04:47Marc:Oh, speaking of that, I should probably bring my squatty potty back from this house to the new house.

00:04:51Marc:Cause that's a nice thing to have, right?

00:04:53Marc:Not an ad.

00:04:54Marc:I just have one.

00:04:55Marc:And I just realized I had it because I went into the bathroom and I'm like, wow, that hasn't moved.

00:05:00Marc:I think there's some secret shame tied into that piece of equipment.

00:05:03Marc:You know, it's weird.

00:05:05Marc:It implies something.

00:05:05Marc:It does something.

00:05:06Marc:It means something.

00:05:07Marc:And it's not a sociable thing.

00:05:10Marc:But I have nothing to be ashamed of.

00:05:11Marc:I'm moving it.

00:05:12Marc:I'm going to move it.

00:05:13Marc:So, Bob.

00:05:15Marc:Bob Saget.

00:05:16Marc:You know Bob Saget.

00:05:17Marc:He's got a new stand-up special, Zero to 60.

00:05:19Marc:It's now available on Amazon, iTunes, and other digital platforms.

00:05:24Marc:And he dropped by to chat a couple weeks ago.

00:05:27Marc:So, this is me and the Saget.

00:05:29Marc:I don't think anyone calls him that.

00:05:31Marc:This is me and Bob talking.

00:05:33Marc:Bob's a sweet man.

00:05:39Marc:What's going on with you, man?

00:05:41Guest:Well, things are good.

00:05:43Guest:You seem good.

00:05:44Guest:Are you high?

00:05:45Guest:No, no.

00:05:46Guest:I'm a little tired.

00:05:47Guest:I've been working hard.

00:05:48Guest:I've been doing post on a movie that I finished.

00:05:50Guest:The one that I turned down?

00:05:52Guest:Yeah, actually.

00:05:53Guest:I'm sorry.

00:05:53Guest:Because you were overly busy.

00:05:55Guest:Yeah.

00:05:55Guest:And it worked out really well because at first Kevin Pollack wasn't available and then he became available, so you were the spot.

00:06:02Guest:You were the first choice, weren't the first choice, were the first choice.

00:06:05Guest:However, it makes you feel better with your ego right now.

00:06:07Guest:It doesn't matter.

00:06:08Guest:You got Pollock to do it?

00:06:09Guest:Yeah, and he was great.

00:06:10Guest:Yeah, he's a good actor.

00:06:10Guest:He's a really good actor, and Mary Lynn Rice Cub.

00:06:13Guest:Oh, yeah, she's good.

00:06:14Guest:She's great, and Rob Corddry.

00:06:16Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:06:16Guest:He was funny as shit.

00:06:18Guest:Yeah.

00:06:18Guest:And it's called Benjamin, and it'll be out in 2018.

00:06:22Guest:What's it about?

00:06:22Guest:It's about this kid, my son.

00:06:25Guest:I directed it and acted in it.

00:06:26Guest:You did?

00:06:27Guest:I did, and I played a troubled, messed up suburbanite, kind of like if the guy on the Full House show had like four dimensions, not two, and kind of just loses it.

00:06:36Guest:But it's about your son?

00:06:38Guest:It's about my son.

00:06:39Guest:We think he's on crystal meth.

00:06:40Guest:Oh, not your real son.

00:06:41Guest:You don't have a real son.

00:06:42Guest:No, I got three daughters.

00:06:43Guest:Oh.

00:06:43Guest:And they're all girls.

00:06:44Guest:I'm positive.

00:06:45Guest:You're sure?

00:06:46Guest:Yeah, because we took them to the right doctors.

00:06:48Guest:And they said, yes, we did DNA checks.

00:06:50Guest:Unfortunately, they're mine.

00:06:51Guest:Their Adam's apple hangs down to the knees.

00:06:53Guest:But not their balls.

00:06:53Guest:No, their balls are very tiny and hidden.

00:06:57Guest:You can't find them.

00:06:57Guest:It's like Carmen Santiago looking for their balls.

00:07:00Guest:Do people know Carmen Santiago?

00:07:01Marc:No, I don't even know who Carmen Santiago is.

00:07:03Guest:Well, that's where in the world is Carmen Santiago.

00:07:05Guest:Oh.

00:07:05Guest:I hosted SNL once.

00:07:07Marc:You did?

00:07:07Guest:Yeah, and they did a thing.

00:07:09Guest:It was a really funny sketch.

00:07:11Guest:It's called Where in the World is San Diego, California?

00:07:14Guest:And people would buzz in, three contestants, and they were trying to guess nobody could find it.

00:07:17Guest:That's how stupid we were then, but we have doubled down.

00:07:20Guest:Sure, we have.

00:07:21Guest:Oh, boy, have we tripled down.

00:07:23Guest:Oh, you're so fucking dumb.

00:07:24Guest:so benjamin so it is a movie that was written by seven years i've been attached to this movie and it we only had 15 days to shoot it and crazy low budge and you know that world yeah it's hard yeah uh and running gun uh-huh everything and uh joshua turek who wrote it did a great job he held on for seven years with us

00:07:42Guest:Nicholas Tabarek is the producer and he's made a bunch of movies and this was one of his faves.

00:07:48Guest:And I was passionate about it because it's a statement about how the parents are, why our young people are where they're at in a lot of cases and how families are.

00:07:58Marc:Even if it's just because of negligence.

00:08:00Marc:And it is that.

00:08:00Guest:Detachment.

00:08:01Guest:You're right on what the movie's about.

00:08:02Guest:I didn't even have to make it.

00:08:03Guest:You already know what it's about.

00:08:04Marc:What's the kid up to?

00:08:05Marc:I don't know.

00:08:06Guest:The kid is, right.

00:08:07Guest:Is he in his room?

00:08:08Guest:I don't know.

00:08:09Guest:But when he comes home, we're going to have an intervention.

00:08:10Guest:Yeah, we're going to talk to him.

00:08:11Guest:So what happens is, and it's a good rap out on it.

00:08:14Guest:It's a real short little byline.

00:08:17Guest:My girlfriend, played by Mary Lynn, posts a thing on Facebook to call an intervention.

00:08:22Guest:And that's not where you call.

00:08:23Marc:No, the cat's out of the bag.

00:08:25Guest:Yeah, it's not good.

00:08:25Guest:So you ruined the surprise party.

00:08:27Guest:Not good.

00:08:27Guest:And the kid's mom's not around, so we're trying to get her to come.

00:08:31Guest:So who winds up coming is Sherry O'Terry and Dave Foley, and Rob Corddry is the family's- So it's a hilarious intervention.

00:08:38Guest:It's a dark comedy, though, because it is not hilarious.

00:08:41Guest:It's not wacky.

00:08:42Guest:It's weird, is what it is.

00:08:44Guest:Because we go between, I go between, and it was written that way, to go between really funny-

00:08:48Guest:and then really serious yeah and rob cordry is a family gynecologist who's forced into leading the intervention because he's a medical person so when's the movie's coming out in 2018 yeah so i would say any time you know we're thinking around may but it might be a little before but you'll be seeing benjamin posters and i'll be out doing my whore-like uh you know yeah preaching i really i'm very very proud of it my character is a bit of a conundrum he's he's he's nuts you really do you really do some acting

00:09:13Guest:I did.

00:09:14Guest:And we'll see if people like it or not.

00:09:17Guest:And I've been loving acting.

00:09:18Guest:I did a Broadway play that I got to do, Hand to God, not long ago, a couple years ago.

00:09:23Guest:And that was this Tony-nominated great play that you would have loved.

00:09:26Guest:It's dark as shit.

00:09:27Guest:I didn't see it.

00:09:28Guest:Really smart.

00:09:28Guest:I played a Lutheran pastor trying to help a young boy who had a puppet of Satan on his hand.

00:09:32Guest:So he was Stephen Boyer, this brilliant actor, was fighting his own hand.

00:09:37Guest:Yeah.

00:09:37Guest:And it was a devil trying to kill him.

00:09:38Guest:And I was trying to exercise the devil out of him.

00:09:40Guest:But it was a comedy written by Robert Askin.

00:09:42Guest:So this is real special.

00:09:44Guest:How do you exercise it?

00:09:45Guest:Do you can't just take the puppet off his hand?

00:09:47Guest:Well, I don't want to buzzkill, spoiler alert, because they are doing it around the country.

00:09:52Guest:But it's a violent play.

00:09:54Guest:Okay.

00:09:54Guest:It's a dark, violent play.

00:09:58Guest:Catch his hand off.

00:09:59Guest:No, I don't want to say it.

00:10:01Guest:And I wouldn't say a whole hand is gone.

00:10:04Guest:Okay, okay.

00:10:04Guest:Could just be a fragment.

00:10:05Guest:Could be none.

00:10:06Guest:Could be a nail, a cuticle.

00:10:08Guest:Could not at all.

00:10:09Guest:He could have a full-on hand.

00:10:10Guest:That's right.

00:10:11Guest:Could never have any problem.

00:10:12Marc:Do you have a special on or something?

00:10:14Guest:I do.

00:10:15Guest:I do.

00:10:16Guest:You are so nice because you slide into this shit, and it is one of the things you loathe the most.

00:10:21Guest:What?

00:10:21Guest:Well, you like to promote people that you like.

00:10:25Guest:I like you.

00:10:25Marc:I like you.

00:10:26Marc:I'm sorry I don't have the special.

00:10:28Marc:I didn't get to watch it.

00:10:29Marc:I wish you had.

00:10:30Guest:I thought you wanted me in because you saw it.

00:10:32Guest:You liked it.

00:10:32Guest:Really?

00:10:33Guest:No, I thought you liked me.

00:10:34Guest:I didn't think you saw it.

00:10:36Guest:I crammed yours.

00:10:37Guest:I crammed yours.

00:10:38Marc:But is it on?

00:10:39Guest:No, I'm saying I crammed it.

00:10:40Guest:I said I shoved it up my ass.

00:10:41Guest:Oh, that's interesting.

00:10:42Guest:How do you do that with a special?

00:10:43Guest:You just shove it up your fucking ass.

00:10:45Guest:See, that's what I do to comedy that you won't.

00:10:48Marc:You just open your ass in front of the TV?

00:10:50Guest:Fuck yeah.

00:10:51Marc:Okay.

00:10:52Guest:And you can get it in CD or DVD or LP.

00:10:55Marc:Oh, so you actually got it on a hard copy and you shoved it in your eyes.

00:10:59Marc:You even watch it on Netflix like everybody else?

00:11:00Marc:I didn't want to stream it into my ass.

00:11:01Marc:I like to stream out of my ass.

00:11:02Guest:I got it.

00:11:04Guest:My woman, who is amazing.

00:11:07Guest:She's not my woman.

00:11:08Guest:She's my equal.

00:11:10Guest:She's my finest.

00:11:12Guest:I guess it's the first place I'm announcing this that I am...

00:11:16Guest:I am engaged.

00:11:17Marc:Congratulations.

00:11:19Guest:Yes.

00:11:19Marc:I wish I could push a button and a glass would break.

00:11:23Guest:Or just... Do you see yourself ever doing that?

00:11:28Guest:What, pushing buttons?

00:11:29Guest:No.

00:11:30Guest:Getting married again?

00:11:32Guest:Yeah.

00:11:33Guest:Why?

00:11:34Guest:Why?

00:11:35Guest:Why you lady?

00:11:36Guest:But she's amazing, and it just felt right, and I don't know.

00:11:41Guest:It just felt right.

00:11:42Guest:I don't know.

00:11:43Guest:And it's been a long time.

00:11:44Guest:I haven't been married since 1941.

00:11:47Marc:Before you were born.

00:11:48Marc:Yeah.

00:11:49Marc:Just tremendous.

00:11:50Guest:Yeah.

00:11:50Guest:My DNA- Have you been married twice?

00:11:52Guest:I've been married once.

00:11:53Marc:Oh, really?

00:11:54Guest:I'm divorced 22 years with three daughters.

00:11:57Marc:Oh, so it took you a long time to get over it, and-

00:12:00Marc:You had to go out there.

00:12:00Guest:I went through many.

00:12:01Guest:You actually had me on here to plug my book, Dirty Daddy, and it talks about all the relationships I had that didn't stick.

00:12:07Guest:Right.

00:12:08Guest:And then you've gone through similar stuff.

00:12:11Marc:I've been through a few, but I don't have kids.

00:12:12Guest:The kids must make everything okay.

00:12:15Guest:They're amazing.

00:12:16Guest:They're actually... I'm real fortunate.

00:12:18Yeah.

00:12:18Marc:Yeah, the mother is a nice lady and not some unstable- Nice lady!

00:12:23Guest:And she wants to take care of the kids as much as I do.

00:12:27Marc:Right.

00:12:28Marc:And she knew that you were- She probably overcompensated for the fact that you're you.

00:12:36Guest:We met when we were 17.

00:12:38Marc:Oh, you locked in.

00:12:39Guest:yeah i locked in actually i couldn't get out it was like a toggle bolt because because the head of my unit is that big it's literally like a toggle bolt i know you do a lot of home repair because i looked around before we came back here and it you know how you put the hole you go in the hole and then bam it just opens up but yeah you can't pull it out no so that happened and so we were together for 14 years because of that situation three kids right my fiance is gonna love that bit

00:13:04Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:13:04Guest:It's not a bitch.

00:13:05Marc:She's going to want you to open the toggle in hers.

00:13:07Guest:Oh, my God.

00:13:08Guest:Well, they have new ones now.

00:13:09Guest:They have the ones that you just screw in and you just put the screw in.

00:13:12Marc:You don't do anything.

00:13:13Guest:Nobody gets hurt.

00:13:13Guest:Oh, that's great.

00:13:14Guest:They make them out of soft rubber like my future neck will be when I have that done.

00:13:18Guest:But, okay, so what's the age difference?

00:13:21Guest:It's supposed to be half my age plus seven.

00:13:24Guest:That's what I did.

00:13:25Guest:So she's 38.

00:13:28Guest:I'm 61.

00:13:29Marc:Are you 61?

00:13:30Guest:I am.

00:13:30Guest:My special is zero to 60, which is about me being zero and then turning and going to 60.

00:13:35Guest:And how long have you been with this girlfriend?

00:13:37Guest:Three years and change.

00:13:39Guest:That's really good.

00:13:39Guest:The change is good.

00:13:40Guest:Always Jews bringing up change.

00:13:42Guest:Yeah.

00:13:42Guest:Yeah, because there could always be more, right?

00:13:44Guest:Well, because you don't need to use a credit card if you have change at the meter.

00:13:47Guest:So how long were you with this one that you engaged to?

00:13:50Guest:This one.

00:13:51Guest:That just sounds like grabbing the pussy kind of talk.

00:13:55Guest:Does it?

00:13:56Guest:It didn't used to.

00:13:58Guest:That's what's fucked.

00:13:59Guest:What do you mean?

00:14:00Guest:I'm not accusing you.

00:14:01Marc:My mother would say that.

00:14:03Marc:My mother would say that.

00:14:04Marc:How long have you been with that one?

00:14:06Guest:Yeah, but your mother would also say, my parents said racial stuff because I lived in Norfolk, Virginia.

00:14:11Guest:So they would say stuff that I would go like...

00:14:13Guest:Who the fuck are you people?

00:14:15Guest:And they didn't mean anything.

00:14:16Guest:What do you mean racial stuff about women you were dating?

00:14:18Guest:No, no, no.

00:14:19Guest:Like in 1960.

00:14:21Guest:The blacks?

00:14:22Guest:Yes.

00:14:22Guest:In 1960, they never said that.

00:14:25Guest:And they looked at people as equal.

00:14:27Guest:But they would slip up with words that disturbed me a great deal.

00:14:31Guest:And so in 1960, that sometimes came up.

00:14:35Guest:Or the girl is coming in on Thursday.

00:14:37Guest:And that's like, hey mom.

00:14:43Guest:You could say it's a different time, but the truth is the time shouldn't have been.

00:14:46Guest:I was on a ferry boat from Norfolk, Virginia to Richmond, Virginia, and now the Chesapeake Bay Bridge Tunnel is there, and there were bathrooms for coloreds and whites.

00:14:57Guest:And I went into the colored bathroom because I wanted to go to the bathroom.

00:15:01Guest:And I was four.

00:15:03Guest:And my dad said, no, that's for people that aren't white.

00:15:06Guest:And I remember, I'll never forget.

00:15:09Guest:It's one of the earliest memories that I have that enraged me.

00:15:11Guest:I said, why does this exist?

00:15:13Guest:Why?

00:15:13Guest:I didn't say that.

00:15:14Guest:I didn't know the word exist.

00:15:16Guest:Why is it this way?

00:15:17Guest:And he kind of started to cry a little bit.

00:15:21Guest:It was really interesting.

00:15:23Guest:And then he held me and made out with me.

00:15:24Guest:Weird.

00:15:25Guest:It was so weird that he kissed me over something racial.

00:15:28Guest:Yeah.

00:15:28Guest:But we were on a ferry.

00:15:29Marc:But it changes the story.

00:15:32Marc:It changes the story.

00:15:33Marc:He didn't want you to have to deal with the heaviness of how society works.

00:15:38Marc:And what is mankind?

00:15:39Marc:That's right.

00:15:39Marc:And where are they going?

00:15:40Guest:And he just figured, I'm going to kiss this kid right on the mouth.

00:15:42Guest:And he'll forget.

00:15:43Guest:He'll forget everything but the kiss.

00:15:45Guest:Right.

00:15:46Guest:And he didn't do anything else.

00:15:47Guest:He didn't hold me like a puppet.

00:15:48Guest:So I got this special.

00:15:50Guest:Yeah.

00:15:51Guest:I talk about... What I was going to say to you that I wanted to say about it, not promo whole way, but you were talking about your dad, and you thought he was so smart, and then you found out... He's a fucking moron.

00:16:01Marc:Yeah, right.

00:16:02Guest:He's all right.

00:16:03Guest:Well, my mom... It's an exaggeration.

00:16:04Marc:My mom died.

00:16:05Marc:My dad's taken a lot of hits.

00:16:06Marc:Your mom died?

00:16:07Guest:Two years ago.

00:16:08Guest:Oh, sorry.

00:16:08Guest:Thanks.

00:16:10Guest:And I really...

00:16:12Guest:started to like her uh i hadn't really because she was so uh so much of a disciplinarian and the reason i would get out on stage and go cock shit fuck wasn't because i was on full house it was because i was told no right those are bad words right and i was like you know the seven words you can't say why can't i just say them but i didn't say them as a rim shot i said them

00:16:33Marc:At your mother.

00:16:35Marc:You said that at your mother.

00:16:36Marc:I did.

00:16:37Marc:You were cock shit fucking before Full House.

00:16:39Guest:I was, but Dice recently spoke to me on the phone.

00:16:42Guest:He goes, Sagan, we got a tour together.

00:16:43Guest:And by the way, you stole my act.

00:16:45Guest:I said, what the fuck are you talking about?

00:16:47Guest:He goes, you didn't curse as much.

00:16:50Guest:And you did it to change your image on Full House.

00:16:52Guest:I said, Andy, I didn't.

00:16:55Guest:It happened naturally.

00:16:57Guest:He was my comedy store friend, Andy.

00:17:00Guest:Yeah.

00:17:01Guest:Yeah.

00:17:01Guest:He would bring girls to his apartment and play his act on cassette tape and then try to- Fuck him.

00:17:07Marc:Yeah.

00:17:07Marc:I lived in his room in Cresthill, the room that he had.

00:17:09Guest:Very lucky man you are.

00:17:11Guest:That little room with its own bathroom.

00:17:13Guest:You know that room?

00:17:14Guest:Yes.

00:17:15Guest:I don't know it.

00:17:16Guest:I've been by it.

00:17:17Guest:I never stayed there.

00:17:18Guest:But it's almost Midnight Express.

00:17:19Guest:Another reference.

00:17:21Guest:So you guys should tour together.

00:17:22Guest:That's a great idea.

00:17:23Guest:I don't know.

00:17:24Guest:I'd have to go on before him.

00:17:25Guest:I'd have to listen to him.

00:17:27Marc:I mean, you also have his audience.

00:17:29Guest:Yeah, I don't do a lot of stuff.

00:17:33Guest:You'd have to listen to him.

00:17:34Guest:He's funnier now than he's ever been.

00:17:37Guest:I love him.

00:17:38Guest:I just love him because he owns who he is.

00:17:40Marc:I do too.

00:17:41Marc:I didn't think about it much one way or the other, but when I get to know him, when I talk to him in here and now I see him around, he's a thoughtful guy.

00:17:49Marc:He's real thoughtful.

00:17:51Marc:Yeah, and he's an original thinker.

00:17:53Marc:And he's creative.

00:17:55Marc:Responsible guy, good father.

00:17:57Marc:I don't know.

00:17:58Marc:I agree.

00:17:59Marc:To hear him talk now without what he used to do, which is now he's in old dice.

00:18:07Marc:He's talking about going to Staples.

00:18:10Marc:I could watch him talk about things.

00:18:13Guest:Well, that's the endearing part.

00:18:14Guest:And he was also raised by Rodney in a lot of ways.

00:18:17Guest:Rodney liked him a lot.

00:18:19Guest:And Rodney's favorite was Jim Carrey.

00:18:20Guest:That was Rodney's favorite one to bring up.

00:18:22Marc:I'm trying to get him in here.

00:18:23Guest:I've actually been able to spend some time with him, and I just love the hell out of him.

00:18:27Marc:Jim?

00:18:27Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:18:29Guest:It's interesting to see people that look at things from outside this stupid box that we're in.

00:18:36Guest:And he's on a journey, and he's trying to figure stuff out.

00:18:41Marc:Yeah?

00:18:41Guest:Yeah, but not like when you talk about meditating and everything.

00:18:44Guest:I mean, it would be interesting for you to have him in here.

00:18:47Guest:Yeah.

00:18:47Guest:Really interesting.

00:18:48Guest:Yeah.

00:18:48Guest:It would be.

00:18:49Guest:Yeah.

00:18:49Guest:You got to get him in here.

00:18:51Marc:So you were shit fuck cocking at your mother and what about your dad?

00:18:55Guest:My dad was really funny and just told me perverted shit my entire childhood.

00:18:58Guest:So the reason I am the comedian that I was, when I say this joke came from my dad, it's either exactly verbatim or something that would have come from him.

00:19:07Marc:Yeah.

00:19:07Guest:And it was in a restaurant and this was on my last special, but it was my dad and it's just a joke.

00:19:13Guest:He opened the menu and said, tonight's specials are cake and cock and we're out of cake.

00:19:17Guest:and that's just a joke and that's just telling you all they got is cock and i'm a kid i'm a i'm really young i hadn't even uh hit puberty so if that's your dad you know you're gonna be something's gonna happen you're gonna be a comedian or and my mother would just say stop it bobby stop it so near the end uh that's what she should have called you special stop it bobby

00:19:41Guest:She actually said to me that she was going to come back as a dove.

00:19:45Guest:Yeah.

00:19:46Guest:And I said, please don't.

00:19:48Guest:And so that was like seven minutes of material of what would that be like if your mother comes back as a dove?

00:19:54Guest:Well, it sounds great.

00:19:55Guest:And I do four songs at the end.

00:19:57Guest:Now you probably, oh, wait, that's what I want to do.

00:19:59Guest:Watch this.

00:20:00Guest:What?

00:20:00Guest:But these, like I was influenced by Martin Mull.

00:20:03Guest:So I would go see Martin Mull at the main point in Philly.

00:20:06Guest:Now, there were comedy songs, and nobody did comedy songs better than him.

00:20:10Guest:There were a couple of other people that were pretty amazing.

00:20:12Guest:He's still around, right?

00:20:13Guest:He is.

00:20:14Guest:You talk to him?

00:20:15Guest:No, and I want to.

00:20:16Guest:I mean, I'm stupid.

00:20:17Marc:I should.

00:20:18Guest:Let's see if Mitchell Walters emails back.

00:20:22Guest:He's a painter, and he's an actor.

00:20:25Guest:I mean, he's always acting and stuff.

00:20:27Guest:He's just wonderful.

00:20:28Guest:But the last song that I wrote for the special is called, or I wrote for performing, is We've Got to Be Kind to Each Other.

00:20:35Guest:And it's kind of give peace a chance, but it's got laced with my R-rated whatever the fuck it is.

00:20:42Guest:Your filthy mouth.

00:20:43Guest:I call it that.

00:20:44Guest:It's not even.

00:20:44Guest:It says explicit.

00:20:45Guest:Fucking dirty fucking mouth.

00:20:46Guest:I don't use fuck as a verb.

00:20:49Guest:I guess it's an adverb, or what would it be?

00:20:52Guest:If you go, that's fucking crazy.

00:20:53Guest:What would that be in the English language?

00:20:55Guest:I think an adjective, no.

00:20:56Guest:That's an adjective.

00:20:57Guest:Wouldn't it?

00:20:58Guest:I don't know.

00:20:59Guest:Is it a conjunctivitis term?

00:21:01Guest:That's fucking crazy.

00:21:02Guest:It feels like an adjective.

00:21:03Guest:i fucked her fucking crazy that's a verb and you're double you're double purposing it well i don't even know if that's a real sentence it's also not acceptable anymore what so well we're fucking crazy well i was talking what does that mean i was talking to my lady just last night literally that's what you said no i'm gonna fuck you fucking crazy no no first she said don't call me crazy but uh don't call me shirley but i i you can't call him crazy anymore

00:21:27Guest:well i can't do i can't well i wouldn't want to anyway now that i'm 61 i just wanted to be more specific on what the pathology is like you can't say she was crazy you could say she had borderline personality disorder i felt bad but i couldn't take it anymore and that used to be like she's crazy barely got out it's gonna get more like this or she had issues but they were probably my issues and i own my part in it yeah you know it's it's in other words she was fucking crazy and you barely got out

00:21:53Guest:I had seven relationships in the past 20 years.

00:21:58Guest:Most of them were a couple years each.

00:21:59Guest:Every time I've walked in this door, you've said, what's up?

00:22:02Guest:And I would say, well, I got somebody.

00:22:04Guest:But this is the real thing.

00:22:06Guest:This is the real thing because I'm locking it down.

00:22:08Guest:Put a ring on it.

00:22:10Guest:That's right.

00:22:11Guest:I'm Beyonce-ing her.

00:22:13Guest:But she's great.

00:22:15Guest:She's just fucking great.

00:22:17Guest:And I've never had her.

00:22:17Guest:Well, I hope you don't get hurt.

00:22:19Guest:Thank you.

00:22:25Guest:Always look on the bright side of life.

00:22:27Guest:Eric Idle should be singing right now.

00:22:30Guest:I did a line in the special that- Hello?

00:22:36Guest:Not a line.

00:22:36Guest:No, not that kind.

00:22:37Guest:But I did a line which is, people are going to be annoyed at some of the things I say.

00:22:43Guest:You can only hope.

00:22:45Guest:In Hollywood, it's supposed to be half your age plus seven.

00:22:48Guest:But I was-

00:22:50Guest:I forgot the half your age, so I was just doing seven.

00:22:54Guest:So that's too young.

00:22:55Guest:See, that's a pedophile joke.

00:22:58Guest:Can you do that anymore?

00:22:59Guest:I don't think so, but I did it in this special.

00:23:01Guest:This new one?

00:23:02Guest:Yeah.

00:23:02Guest:And I also did a thing about Bill Cosby, and it is saying a character of myself.

00:23:10Guest:Because years ago, I took lewds in Cleveland.

00:23:13Guest:You ever taken lewds?

00:23:14Marc:Yeah.

00:23:14Marc:They were already gone by the time I was old enough to appreciate them.

00:23:17Marc:You kids today.

00:23:18Marc:Yeah, I miss the lewds.

00:23:19Marc:They had mandrakes were around.

00:23:22Marc:I don't know what they were.

00:23:23Marc:They were post lewds.

00:23:25Guest:I was doing Full House on the video show, so I G-rated what was left of my brain for a while.

00:23:29Guest:Yeah.

00:23:30Guest:But then roofies, I guess, took over.

00:23:33Marc:Yeah, no, usually those are administered.

00:23:35Marc:You don't take those on purpose.

00:23:36Guest:Right.

00:23:37Guest:The point of the thing is I took lewds myself so that I would not violate someone so that I would be unconscious.

00:23:46Guest:I literally will knock myself out before.

00:23:48Guest:So you don't know what happened.

00:23:50Guest:No.

00:23:50Guest:My butthole had a Tinker Toy in it though, so it had to be a young person or a Lego.

00:23:55Guest:I'm not sure.

00:23:56Guest:Tinker Toy is the reference.

00:23:58Marc:Ticker toy with like one of those pieces at the end of it?

00:24:00Guest:Yeah, the square and you could put a whole bunch of spokes.

00:24:03Guest:Yeah.

00:24:03Guest:Hell yeah.

00:24:04Guest:Oh, you remember a few things.

00:24:06Guest:Oh my God, I had a ticker toy at my house.

00:24:08Guest:But it was a Christmas tree one.

00:24:10Guest:So I know the time of year from that.

00:24:12Marc:It wasn't a car?

00:24:13Guest:No, and you could make the car and the wheels turn.

00:24:16Guest:And it always got crooked.

00:24:17Guest:Once it got crooked, you were fucked.

00:24:18Guest:And it was wood.

00:24:18Guest:They were wood.

00:24:19Guest:yeah i had wood always had wood yeah so you and i will never say wood with the same meaning no or head no but i don't always go there that's what's different about this special well yeah i'm not i can do one lines but it's more stories and it's more i'm just because i'm a grown-up is what's happening and i didn't know unlike you with your netflix special you made your deal you knew you were doing it you knew the theater where did you shoot that by minneapolis gorgeous i loved it i love that theater

00:24:46Marc:I think what we're talking about here is that, you know, Bobby, you're now able to go a little longer.

00:24:52Marc:Like when you listen to yourself, when I listen to you tell an emotional story, I'm like, all right, listen to Bobby's telling an emotional story.

00:24:59Marc:It's touching.

00:25:00Marc:How long will it take for him to throw a dick in it?

00:25:03Guest:Or something up your ass.

00:25:04Marc:Yeah.

00:25:04Marc:Like how long?

00:25:05Marc:And I think it's gotten a little longer.

00:25:07Marc:It's a little longer.

00:25:08Guest:And that is what happens.

00:25:09Guest:It's growing up.

00:25:10Guest:With age, it takes longer to throw a dick in it.

00:25:13Guest:If you love it, you put a ring in it and then you throw a dick on it.

00:25:17Guest:Now, if you throw a dick across a room at a guy and it goes all the way across the room and it sticks to the middle of his head, he's a unicock.

00:25:27Guest:Now, the reason I said that was right when I thought of throwing a dick, I thought of the word unicock.

00:25:34Guest:So, I needed to fill time till I said the word unicock.

00:25:37Guest:You got to get there.

00:25:38Guest:I had to scat to it.

00:25:40Guest:But I didn't know the difference between my special and your special is yours is good.

00:25:45Guest:And the other difference is I didn't know I was doing it.

00:25:51Guest:When you were doing it?

00:25:52Guest:I did not know I was doing it at all.

00:25:54Guest:What are you talking about?

00:25:55Guest:You're not going to believe this.

00:25:56Guest:And you maybe would have said no.

00:25:58Guest:But I got on an email on a plane on a Thursday.

00:26:01Guest:I was going to New York to do some television and do a couple of gigs.

00:26:04Guest:This is a very specific memory.

00:26:05Guest:Well, this is one of the most important moments of my whole life.

00:26:09Guest:More important than my family.

00:26:11Guest:And I got an email, do you want to shoot your special Tuesday?

00:26:14Marc:What?

00:26:14Guest:And I went, where?

00:26:16Guest:And he said, Williamsburg Hall of Music in Brooklyn.

00:26:18Guest:And I went, I love that place.

00:26:20Guest:And that would make it kind of a medium, small to medium sized place.

00:26:24Guest:My last one was at the Moore in Seattle.

00:26:26Guest:So this would be like, this would be intimate.

00:26:28Guest:Four days?

00:26:29Guest:I could talk to the audience.

00:26:30Guest:Four days.

00:26:31Guest:I said, okay, so somebody fell out.

00:26:33Guest:Are you shooting other ones?

00:26:34Guest:And he said, yeah, a couple other ones.

00:26:36Guest:I said, it can't look anything like the same place.

00:26:38Guest:And he went, it won't.

00:26:39Guest:It won't.

00:26:40Guest:And they honored that.

00:26:41Guest:And the set deck people came in and did everything to specifications.

00:26:45Guest:I'm on the plane literally designing the set on a six-hour flight.

00:26:49Guest:And the set I've been rolling for three years.

00:26:51Guest:And I've been doing 90 minutes everywhere.

00:26:53Guest:So it was like I put two shows together.

00:26:55Guest:I never have a person in my life, a girlfriend, my daughters, never have them at a show.

00:27:00Guest:But once I did the first one, my daughters live near there.

00:27:03Guest:I said, come to the second show.

00:27:05Guest:So you gave him like an hour notice?

00:27:07Guest:I just, yeah.

00:27:07Guest:Yeah.

00:27:07Marc:but they knew i had told them ahead that that might happen because do you have uh family members i don't have anybody it's me and the it's all about i don't have my girlfriend come i don't do i go myself it's us and them yeah i go myself i sit it backstage but maybe i have one comic friend or one friend around well this is when you just took a piss it was you and your dick that's right but like who was backstage with no no one was really there did anybody warm up the thing yeah yeah

00:27:31Marc:uh amber amber preston she's from the midwest oh cool um but yeah lynn shelton directed but like as far as like the dressing room like the last special i did my friend tom sharpling was there my friend sam lipsite right when i did carnegie hall nate bargetsy he opened for me he hanging around but not a big scene no loved ones no no because it fucks with you because your relationship that with them is uh is exactly a relationship

00:27:55Marc:That's right, and you don't want that in you.

00:27:57Marc:No.

00:27:58Marc:You don't want to have the moment where you're like, can I do this?

00:28:03Guest:This is crazy, and I don't know if you get asked this, but I do.

00:28:08Guest:I'm going somewhere.

00:28:09Guest:I'm on a plane, or they see me somewhere.

00:28:12Guest:I'm coming around the backstage entrance of some theater, and somebody says, are you going to be funny tonight?

00:28:17Guest:Have you ever gotten that one?

00:28:18Guest:Yeah.

00:28:18Guest:My answer is, do you ask your pilot if he's going to get you to Cleveland?

00:28:22Marc:I see you're already talking to that person too much.

00:28:24Guest:See, that's why I need to talk to you.

00:28:27Guest:We need to see each other outside of this environment because you can actually help what's left of me.

00:28:32Guest:Wanted to go out on a high note.

00:28:33Guest:Thanks for talking, buddy.

00:28:35Guest:I love you.

00:28:39Marc:Okay, there you go.

00:28:40Marc:Me and Bob.

00:28:41Marc:Me and the Bob Saget guy.

00:28:43Marc:The Bob Saget.

00:28:44Marc:As I said, his new stand-up special, Zero to 60, is available on Amazon, iTunes, and other digital things.

00:28:51Marc:You can get that, and he's always a pleasure to see.

00:28:53Marc:He's a lovely man.

00:28:55Marc:He's a heavy-hearted man in some ways, I believe, old Bob.

00:28:59Marc:As we get older, we get a little heavy.

00:29:01Marc:We'll get some spilkis.

00:29:02Marc:You know what I mean?

00:29:03Marc:I think that's the correct word.

00:29:04Marc:Get spilkis.

00:29:05Marc:A little spilkis.

00:29:07Marc:Huh?

00:29:07Marc:Look it up.

00:29:08Marc:I rarely do the Jew.

00:29:10Marc:But there you go.

00:29:11Marc:Some spilkis.

00:29:12Marc:You got spilkis?

00:29:13Marc:So iron and wine.

00:29:16Marc:That first record, man, that first record sold me.

00:29:19Marc:I was mystified.

00:29:21Marc:I was mystified by that first record.

00:29:24Marc:The Creek Drank the Cradle, that record.

00:29:26Marc:2002, wow, that was a while ago, but that record killed me.

00:29:30Marc:I was like, who is this?

00:29:32Marc:What's up with this dude?

00:29:34Marc:Where does this sound come from?

00:29:36Marc:And as some of you know,

00:29:38Marc:Upward Over the Mountain from that album, The Creek Drank the Cradle, was the closing song of my series.

00:29:46Marc:And that was a big concession.

00:29:48Marc:We were on a tight budget.

00:29:50Marc:We got songs by some people that didn't have...

00:29:55Marc:big money publishing and we weren't really allowed to buy songs that people can necessarily identify because they're too expensive but they threw me a bone and they let me buy an iron and wine song for the closing credits because it was the only thing the only song there was nothing that was going to sound like that song

00:30:13Marc:nothing upward over the mountain just it just kills me that song i don't even know why but i'll talk to sam about it i will talk to sam about it so if you don't know iron and wine check them out they've got a lot of great records in there the last record actually uh beast epic uh is out now as is all the other ones and it was just nominated for a grammy so this is me and iron and wine uh aka sam beam or this is me and sam and sam beam aka iron and wine

00:30:43Guest:You don't live around here.

00:30:50Guest:No, I live in North Carolina, outside of Chapel Hill.

00:30:55Marc:Oh, that's nice.

00:30:56Marc:When I was there, it was shortly after the election, so there was a sense of, like, they're closing in on us.

00:31:01Marc:Coming deep.

00:31:02Marc:You know, like those red, those blue cities and red states.

00:31:07Marc:There was some real terror there.

00:31:08Marc:I was scared when I went.

00:31:10Marc:Should try living there.

00:31:11Marc:I think it's beautiful.

00:31:15Marc:Sure is pretty.

00:31:16Marc:Right.

00:31:18Marc:But you just never know when the hills are going to engulf you.

00:31:21Marc:You never know.

00:31:22Marc:Well, you look like you could, you know, like I don't know what you would do if push came to show.

00:31:26Marc:It's all to fit in.

00:31:27Marc:No, you got the beard, you got everything.

00:31:29Marc:It's like, no, you got the wrong house.

00:31:30Guest:You have to infiltrate.

00:31:32Guest:Be safe.

00:31:33Guest:I also have some overalls that I put on.

00:31:35Marc:Got some overalls.

00:31:36Marc:Hold on.

00:31:37Marc:Let me show you the flag.

00:31:38Guest:Yeah.

00:31:39Guest:Also a piece of straw that I just shoved in my mouth.

00:31:41Guest:It's in my back pocket at all times.

00:31:44Marc:I think the hippie you're looking for lives down the street at peace.

00:31:51Marc:So you're an art guy, I noticed, by walking through my house with you.

00:31:57Marc:You're an art guy, I noticed, from walking through your house.

00:32:00Marc:Well, I mean, that's pretty low-level, you know, most of it's poster art.

00:32:04Marc:But the photograph, I mean, not a lot of people know Joel Peter Witkin, and you knew it.

00:32:08Marc:How do you know it?

00:32:08Guest:Because he's a totally disturbing artist, if you've ever experienced it.

00:32:13Guest:No, I used to, I studied photography, and so that's what I thought I was going to be in another life, a photographer.

00:32:21Marc:Is that true?

00:32:22Guest:Yeah.

00:32:22Marc:I don't know why you would lie about something like that.

00:32:24Marc:I don't know why I said, is that true?

00:32:27Marc:Like, come on, you're pulling my leg, you study photography?

00:32:30Marc:Did you study... Yeah, people did that.

00:32:33Marc:So you were doing... How old are you?

00:32:34Marc:Do you say that?

00:32:36Marc:43.

00:32:36Marc:Okay.

00:32:38Marc:Today?

00:32:38Marc:Today.

00:32:39Marc:Seriously?

00:32:39Guest:No.

00:32:40Guest:I still am.

00:32:41Guest:I was yesterday, too.

00:32:42Marc:Oh, okay.

00:32:42Marc:It's not your birthday.

00:32:43Marc:No.

00:32:44Guest:I mean...

00:32:45Guest:Not many people that you walk into their house have a Witkin.

00:32:49Guest:That's for sure.

00:32:52Guest:Yeah, but it's an easy one to take out of the Witkin oeuvre.

00:32:59Guest:There's not a lot that you would want to put up around your house.

00:33:02Marc:No, that was one that my folks got when he was in graduate school, and I don't know, somehow I got hold of it.

00:33:10Guest:So you studied photography, like you were going to shoot?

00:33:13Guest:Well, I was just into art.

00:33:15Guest:I went to an art school not really knowing where I was going.

00:33:19Guest:I mean, it was a nice place to be.

00:33:20Guest:Where did you grow up?

00:33:22Guest:In South Carolina.

00:33:23Guest:You did?

00:33:24Guest:Yeah, not far from where I live now.

00:33:26Guest:I moved around quite a bit and just sort of landed back there recently.

00:33:32Guest:You kind of want to go home sometimes, right, if home's nice?

00:33:35Guest:You know, sometimes you do, and sometimes you don't have a choice.

00:33:39Guest:Oh, really?

00:33:40Guest:Family drew you back?

00:33:41Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:33:42Guest:Which has been great.

00:33:43Guest:Because you got kids?

00:33:45Guest:Yeah, I have a bunch of kids, and so it's great to have access to family and stuff.

00:33:50Guest:To watch the kids.

00:33:51Guest:You need somewhere to dump the kids.

00:33:53Guest:You would think so, man, but they're...

00:33:55Guest:Are your folks both alive?

00:33:57Guest:Yeah, they are.

00:33:58Guest:And they love seeing the kids.

00:34:01Guest:But, yeah, it's kind of hard.

00:34:03Guest:You know, that's a mixed blessing.

00:34:04Guest:Is it?

00:34:05Guest:Being close.

00:34:06Guest:Sure.

00:34:06Guest:Sure, because they like your kids, but how are they with you?

00:34:10Guest:Exactly.

00:34:12Guest:Exactly.

00:34:13Guest:Exactly.

00:34:15Guest:So that's been nice.

00:34:17Marc:Did you grow up in a big family over there?

00:34:19Guest:No, it was actually a really small family.

00:34:21Guest:I think that's why I wanted to have a big family of my own.

00:34:25Guest:How many you got?

00:34:27Guest:I have five daughters.

00:34:29Guest:Wow, five daughters.

00:34:30Guest:I grew up with just one sister, my sister Sarah.

00:34:33Guest:Are you just keep trying for a son?

00:34:34Guest:Is that what's happening?

00:34:36Guest:I think the second one I was hoping, and then after that I just sort of gave up.

00:34:41Guest:No, I just- Are you done?

00:34:43Guest:Is this it?

00:34:44Guest:I am way done.

00:34:46Guest:Your wife, I imagine, is done.

00:34:47Guest:I love them all very much.

00:34:48Guest:Yeah?

00:34:49Guest:But I've enjoyed my time with my male cat.

00:34:54Guest:Oh, yeah?

00:34:54Guest:We throw down.

00:34:56Guest:The only one in the house?

00:34:57Guest:Yeah, we talk about beers.

00:34:59Guest:Uh-huh.

00:35:00Guest:So you grew up there, like in Chapel Hill or around there?

00:35:04Guest:I grew up in Columbia, South Carolina, which is right in the dead center of the state.

00:35:09Guest:It's like the capital, and also there's a university with their mascot is the Gamecocks.

00:35:17Guest:And I remember, even as a child, they had baseball caps that said, Go Cocks.

00:35:24Guest:They did?

00:35:24Guest:Totally.

00:35:25Guest:Unironically.

00:35:26Marc:Yeah.

00:35:26Marc:I think I have a glass that says that.

00:35:28Marc:Is that what they are?

00:35:29Marc:Is that white mug up there?

00:35:31Marc:The one under glass?

00:35:34Marc:No, no, the white mug, that's from the president.

00:35:36Marc:On top of the shelf, there's a mug in the center.

00:35:39Marc:Does it say, is that the cocks?

00:35:41Marc:Is that them?

00:35:43Guest:Oh, that says...

00:35:47Guest:Oh, you got the Five Chinese Brothers book, too.

00:35:49Marc:Oh, no, this is the, yeah, this is the North Shore smoking cock.

00:35:53Marc:I don't know what, I don't know what, sorry.

00:35:56Guest:Not to be confused.

00:35:57Guest:You're going to explain something to me.

00:35:57Guest:Not to be confused with the other cock.

00:35:59Marc:Did you like the Five Chinese Brothers?

00:36:01Marc:Was that an important book to you?

00:36:03Guest:Yeah.

00:36:03Guest:It's a great book.

00:36:04Guest:It's a great book.

00:36:05Guest:I bought a new copy.

00:36:06Guest:Yeah, why wouldn't you?

00:36:07Guest:Because I was haunted by it.

00:36:09Guest:Yeah, that image of the guy with the huge face absorbing the whole ocean.

00:36:13Guest:That's the exact one.

00:36:14Guest:That stayed with me forever.

00:36:15Marc:That's why I remembered it.

00:36:18Marc:The guy holding the ocean in his mouth.

00:36:20Marc:That's why I had to go out and buy that book again.

00:36:24Marc:I don't even know if that book is on the level racially.

00:36:31Guest:On the racial level.

00:36:32Marc:Yeah, I don't know.

00:36:34Marc:But it made a profound impact.

00:36:36Guest:me too because of that same thing i had one another one that was along similar lines was there was you remember the superhero the super friends cartoons yeah when we were kids yeah uh there was one with a with a uh a growing woman like a woman who would turn into a giant that freaked me out too oh yeah on the same line something about people changing sides to be bigger

00:37:00Marc:About bigger or doing.

00:37:01Guest:Smaller seemed okay.

00:37:02Marc:Mutating themselves.

00:37:04Marc:Yeah.

00:37:04Marc:Yeah, I had a fairly weird fascination with human anomalies, freaks, circus people.

00:37:13Marc:Joel Peter Witt and stuff.

00:37:14Marc:Yeah, that was where it all culminated, or fulminated.

00:37:18Marc:That's where it found its portal in art.

00:37:23Marc:Right.

00:37:24Marc:Yeah, I was like, this guy gets it.

00:37:27Marc:He understands me.

00:37:29Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:37:30Marc:So you grew up by the college?

00:37:32Guest:Close, yeah.

00:37:33Guest:I mean, nowhere in Columbia is that far from the college.

00:37:36Guest:Was your old man work for the school?

00:37:38Guest:He worked for the state government.

00:37:41Guest:Oh, yeah?

00:37:41Guest:Yeah, in land management, coastal management.

00:37:44Guest:Coastal management?

00:37:45Guest:Beachfront management, yeah.

00:37:46Guest:For the government?

00:37:48Guest:For the state.

00:37:49Guest:South Kakalaki.

00:37:51Guest:Which was nice because we got to go to the beach a bunch.

00:37:53Guest:I love the beach.

00:37:54Marc:Yeah, the beach is pretty, but what does that job entail?

00:37:58Marc:He just goes out and checks on, makes sure people aren't building things on government property?

00:38:03Guest:Kind of, yeah.

00:38:04Guest:You know, just telling people what to do with the dirt or the sand, rather.

00:38:09Guest:Clean that up.

00:38:10Guest:Sand and water.

00:38:10Guest:Yeah.

00:38:11Guest:Move that shit over.

00:38:12Guest:That's okay.

00:38:12Guest:That's not okay.

00:38:16Marc:And that's what he did that for his whole life?

00:38:19Marc:Worked for the government?

00:38:20Yeah.

00:38:20Guest:Yeah.

00:38:21Guest:I mean, you know.

00:38:23Guest:People do lots of things they don't tell you.

00:38:26Guest:But that's what I understood he was doing.

00:38:30Guest:We called him a beach doctor.

00:38:31Guest:The beach doctor.

00:38:33Guest:And your mom, what did she do?

00:38:35Guest:She was a mom for a long time.

00:38:36Guest:Then she was a teacher.

00:38:37Guest:She would teach him biology, like high school biology.

00:38:41Guest:Luckily, I never had to go through navigating having her as a teacher.

00:38:45Guest:Yeah, I've talked to people that have had that issue.

00:38:52Marc:You think that would have been difficult?

00:38:54Guest:Was she a tough lady?

00:38:56Guest:No, she was sweet.

00:38:58Guest:And you have one sister?

00:38:59Guest:One sister named Sarah.

00:39:00Guest:And she used to sing with me.

00:39:03Guest:Early on?

00:39:03Guest:On the stage, yeah, for a long time.

00:39:05Guest:Really?

00:39:06Guest:Yeah.

00:39:07Guest:On records?

00:39:08Guest:On records, too, yeah.

00:39:10Guest:Which records?

00:39:11Marc:It's documented.

00:39:13Marc:It's on the record?

00:39:15Marc:It's on the record.

00:39:17Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:39:18Guest:She stopped about, well, I mean, I think it was not quite ten years ago now.

00:39:23Guest:Did she play anything?

00:39:24Guest:She played the fiddle, the violin, whatever you want to call it.

00:39:28Guest:Oh, yeah?

00:39:29Guest:Is she still in the music game?

00:39:31Guest:no she uh she wanted to be a mom yeah it's hard to be a mom and travel all the time she also has a lot of uh food allergies and you wouldn't believe like how how hard it is to find well just traveling you never know depends on what you're kind of the mercy of the kitchen you know you have something that you're allergic to you never know i mean and her um allergy was to pine nuts which at the time

00:39:56Guest:was you know now you see pine nuts and everything but now not allergies are kind of yeah they're scary crazy so that was really stressful and so pine nuts like pesto is no good yeah but it was so bad that like if someone was making some pesto in the kitchen somewhere and she ordered french fries yeah you like use the same you know whatever yeah she was in trouble really yeah like her throat was well totally yeah there's a lot of interesting international emergency rooms out there oh yeah

00:40:25Guest:you took a tour of european emergency rooms yeah yeah super fun where's the best one sweden germany yeah the list that don't really have it's not like one of those lists with like these bright shining beacons they all just sort of like have their own dull glow the best emergency room right if needed

00:40:50Marc:So you played music when you were a kid?

00:40:56Guest:Sort of, not really.

00:40:57Guest:I liked music as a kid.

00:40:59Guest:I always loved the radio and stuff.

00:41:01Guest:I didn't really play music until I was a late teenager.

00:41:05Marc:You never picked up a guitar?

00:41:06Guest:No, it just wasn't really one around until I figured out where it was in the closet.

00:41:12Guest:Your dad's old guitar?

00:41:13Guest:Yeah, I think he got one, you know, when country music.

00:41:16Guest:They all do.

00:41:17Guest:Yeah.

00:41:18Marc:I can do that.

00:41:19Marc:It's a nice hobby.

00:41:20Marc:It's always an old guitar that's cheap and like three music books.

00:41:24Marc:Yeah.

00:41:25Marc:Yeah, exactly.

00:41:27Guest:Don Schlitz.

00:41:28Guest:Yeah.

00:41:29Guest:It's a songbook.

00:41:30Guest:I could learn it.

00:41:31Guest:Yeah.

00:41:31Guest:Totally.

00:41:32Guest:What kind of guitar was it?

00:41:33Guest:Was it like one of those?

00:41:34Guest:It was a K?

00:41:35Guest:It was yellow.

00:41:35Guest:Yeah.

00:41:35Guest:A yellow guitar, the popular.

00:41:37Guest:I don't even know what it was.

00:41:38Guest:An acoustic?

00:41:39Guest:It sat beside the dusty golf clubs.

00:41:41Guest:We finally brushed it off, dusted it off, and punk rock and everything was cool at the time, and I love music, and so it wasn't hard to find people that, you know.

00:41:51Guest:Was it an electric guitar?

00:41:53Guest:No, the acoustic guitar.

00:41:54Marc:Playing punk rock on the acoustic?

00:41:56Guest:Hell yeah.

00:42:00Guest:Yeah.

00:42:00Guest:you were that guy with my overalls and yeah um no you know you just make do with what you got there's acoustic songs on that record that's about as punk rock as i guess the stooges record i guess that's true it's documented

00:42:17Marc:Your pretty face is going to hell.

00:42:20Marc:Right?

00:42:20Marc:That one's got some acoustic guitar.

00:42:23Marc:Even Gimme Danger's got acoustic guitar all over it.

00:42:25Marc:Yeah, that's right.

00:42:26Guest:Yeah.

00:42:27Marc:It's just... You proved your point, Sam.

00:42:31Marc:Check, please.

00:42:33Marc:So you were...

00:42:34Marc:Okay, fine.

00:42:36Marc:So you listen in the Stooges.

00:42:38Marc:Sometimes.

00:42:39Marc:You're defending the acoustic guitar for punk rock.

00:42:41Guest:That's right.

00:42:42Guest:Did you see that documentary?

00:42:44Guest:I did.

00:42:45Guest:That was fun.

00:42:45Guest:It was all right.

00:42:46Guest:It wasn't one of those, like the big star documentary I saw not long ago.

00:42:50Guest:Yeah.

00:42:51Guest:Changed my whole perception of that band.

00:42:53Guest:Oh, I didn't see that one.

00:42:55Guest:Check it out.

00:42:55Guest:Yeah?

00:42:56Yeah.

00:42:56Marc:this one was just fun it was like yeah it was like you know you kind of romp through it you know nothing was revealed you know and uh if you like iggy it's good super fun so you are like big star is its own rabbit hole that certain people are involved with right are you one of them i'd love that i'd love them

00:43:16Guest:I remember I wasn't really aware of them.

00:43:19Guest:And then they did those reissues in the 90s.

00:43:22Guest:Right.

00:43:23Marc:Of number one, the star with the one in the middle.

00:43:29Guest:Mostly, for me, mostly number three was the one that they reissued.

00:43:33Guest:What's that one called?

00:43:34Guest:Sister Lovers.

00:43:35Marc:Yeah, that's the one?

00:43:37Guest:Well, I didn't realize how many of my favorite bands had sort of co-opted, or not co-opted, but absorbed what they continued the conversation that they had started.

00:43:47Guest:That's a nice way of putting it.

00:43:49Guest:It's better than appropriate or stole.

00:43:51Marc:Yeah.

00:43:52Marc:Continued the conversation.

00:43:54Marc:As it moves through time and space, a conversation was started by Chilton and the fellas.

00:43:59Marc:Carried the baton as long as they... Sisters and what?

00:44:02Marc:Sisters and Lovers?

00:44:03Guest:Yeah.

00:44:03Guest:Sister Lovers.

00:44:04Guest:Sister Lovers.

00:44:05Guest:Or Big Star Third.

00:44:07Guest:Big Star Third.

00:44:08Guest:What does it look like?

00:44:09Guest:How come I don't have it?

00:44:10Guest:It's round, black.

00:44:11Guest:It's got some grooves on it.

00:44:13Marc:I have the first one.

00:44:15Guest:Yeah, the first one.

00:44:16Marc:I like that record.

00:44:17Marc:As you should.

00:44:18Marc:And the second record, I don't know if I have, but I got an Alex Chilton record of some other stuff that he did.

00:44:25Marc:One of the weirder ones?

00:44:27Marc:Yeah, I have a lot of those.

00:44:29Marc:See, I don't have Big City, Radio City Big Star either.

00:44:32Marc:that was good too man i know they're good man you're gonna have to just i know i only have that one and i have the chilton record there's a lot of records out there though you can't really be a lot of them are in my house i have a lot of records in a room in my house and big star should be among them because people like you with your affectation and your folk music

00:44:55Marc:Start talking about Big Star, and I feel like an idiot for liking Aerosmith.

00:45:00Marc:You see what I'm saying?

00:45:01Guest:What's wrong with Aerosmith?

00:45:02Guest:I'm kidding.

00:45:03Guest:Oh, man.

00:45:03Guest:I love Aerosmith.

00:45:04Guest:That's another conversation I have, too.

00:45:07Marc:Well, yeah.

00:45:07Marc:Well, you grew up with Townie Rock.

00:45:09Marc:You grew up with Townie Rock.

00:45:11Marc:That's where it's at.

00:45:12Marc:I don't know if...

00:45:13Guest:I don't know if, yeah, that Big Star thing at the time, it was pretty bent.

00:45:19Guest:I don't know if I was way into Aerosmith that I would have been ready for that record.

00:45:24Marc:Right.

00:45:25Marc:Yeah, I mean, I try to mix it up.

00:45:28Marc:And I have nothing against Big Star or those that it spawned.

00:45:33Marc:But I know that it's a big world.

00:45:35Marc:And I've grown to like Alex Chilton more.

00:45:37Marc:I just don't know why I never completely locked in for the full ride.

00:45:41Guest:well that's what i mean there's so many records to get lost in yeah at this point i mean well in all saturated i i don't i actually don't listen to a whole lot of music anymore just because silence has become such a commodity is it real is it quiet where you live can be when everyone's at school yeah but you live in the country

00:46:00Guest:Yeah.

00:46:01Guest:I mean, it's a rural, just kind of right outside of town.

00:46:04Guest:But I hang around with music people all day who are just dedicated crate diggers.

00:46:11Guest:Oh, yeah?

00:46:12Guest:And that shit is fun.

00:46:13Guest:The guys you work with in the band?

00:46:15Guest:People I work with.

00:46:16Guest:Yeah.

00:46:16Guest:I mean, but that's sort of one of the handshakes you do as these sort of merchant marines that you see people along the way.

00:46:23Guest:You don't only see them.

00:46:25Guest:you know, every few years and you say, hey man, it's great to see you.

00:46:28Guest:You heard anything?

00:46:29Guest:And then people... Yeah, heard anything.

00:46:32Guest:And is it generally older stuff that they find?

00:46:35Marc:It's everything.

00:46:36Marc:Everything.

00:46:37Marc:Omnivorous.

00:46:38Marc:Yeah.

00:46:38Marc:Because there's like so much older stuff that like because of mainstream music,

00:46:43Marc:And I was kind of off the grid as a teenager because I knew some guys.

00:46:47Marc:All he takes is a couple guys.

00:46:49Guest:Man, I had a serious enabler.

00:46:51Guest:One of my best friends growing up, his name was Alex Smith, and his stepdad was a grad student at USC.

00:47:00Guest:And just, you know, for my little kid brain in Columbia that only had access to whatever was on the radio...

00:47:08Guest:all English beat, like all this stuff, New Order, like all this stuff, Rolling Stones, like everything that, you know, just, but deep stuff that like Velvet Underground for the first time in my, you know, little teenager brain.

00:47:22Guest:Oh, shit.

00:47:24Guest:I don't know who I would be without having met that person.

00:47:27Guest:That guy.

00:47:28Guest:Maybe I would have.

00:47:29Guest:Photographer.

00:47:30Guest:Yeah, maybe.

00:47:32Guest:One of Joel Peter Wittgen's assistants, maybe.

00:47:36Guest:Holding the head.

00:47:37Guest:Could you set that head over there, Sam?

00:47:40Guest:Move the head a little bit.

00:47:43Guest:Formaldehyde replenisher.

00:47:45Guest:Yeah, exactly.

00:47:48Guest:I know.

00:47:48Guest:Isn't it weird how much that matters?

00:47:50Guest:It is.

00:47:51Guest:It's funny, like, looking back and saying, like, who really gave your life direction more so than other people?

00:47:58Guest:It's usually a surprise as you look back.

00:48:01Guest:It's not the people that you think they are in the moment.

00:48:04Marc:No, it's not necessarily the good teacher or whatever.

00:48:07Marc:It's that one guy that said that one thing.

00:48:09Marc:Right.

00:48:10Marc:Or gave you this, you know, something to hold on to.

00:48:13Marc:Right.

00:48:13Marc:Yeah.

00:48:14Marc:Yeah, thank God for those guys.

00:48:16Marc:The weird thing about records, though, is that that can still happen.

00:48:19Marc:Right.

00:48:19Marc:You know, it's not going to be the same as hearing the Velvet Underground for the first time and realizing that they're not even together anymore.

00:48:26Guest:I wonder if it's the same now because you have everything, you have access to everything in a few clicks.

00:48:36Marc:I still feel like people need curators in a way.

00:48:39Marc:Oh, no, absolutely.

00:48:41Marc:But I'm back in the record hole like any other relatively... With it, dude?

00:48:50Marc:I was going to say nostalgic old man, but I'll take with it, dude.

00:48:54Marc:You're only 54, Mark.

00:48:56Marc:I know, but I remember records.

00:48:59Marc:There's a lot of people that don't have any nostalgic recollection of records.

00:49:04Marc:They don't fucking care.

00:49:05Marc:They had 12 records, and then CDs happened.

00:49:08Marc:But I had records, and they were important, and they were part of my early childhood.

00:49:12Marc:So I'm back in that hole.

00:49:14Marc:What was your first record?

00:49:16Marc:oddly i think like when i was really young like when i was like five or six i think it might have been a bobby sherman record like and i got it yeah i found that record i have that has a song on there called hey little woman it's a bobby sherman record it was like he was a teen idol i guess he's just saying hey yeah and then uh i had two bobby sherman records but then somehow like there was a box box of cassettes yeah

00:49:42Marc:Like when I was like eight or nine, had Johnny Cash live at San Quentin.

00:49:48Marc:Oh, wow.

00:49:48Marc:It had Cosmos Factory.

00:49:51Marc:Really?

00:49:51Marc:Yeah.

00:49:52Marc:They were my parents.

00:49:53Marc:Had Bobby Gentry's Greatest Hits.

00:49:55Marc:Oh, wow.

00:49:56Marc:This is cassettes.

00:49:57Marc:And then it had like a Perry Como record.

00:50:00Marc:I don't know.

00:50:02Marc:And I think God didn't make Little Green Apples.

00:50:04Marc:It was a cover that he did.

00:50:05Yeah.

00:50:05Marc:But I had Ode to Billy Joe, Boy Named Sue, and Up Around the Bend.

00:50:10Marc:All in the same box.

00:50:12Marc:Those three songs on those cassettes, because I had them recorded, but those three songs were fairly important to me.

00:50:20Guest:That music, if it hits you at the right time, will burn a hole that will not heal.

00:50:26Marc:i still exactly thank god i love that opening riff on that korean song and i had the beatles second album and then i had a mountain mountain a mountain album oh which one it was like uh sitting on the rainbow no no it's it was it might have been a greatest hits whatever that meant for their three records

00:50:44Marc:I was obsessed with the band.

00:50:46Marc:They were great, man.

00:50:47Marc:I don't know why Mountain, but I had it.

00:50:48Marc:I loved the song Roll Over Beethoven, and they covered it.

00:50:51Marc:That's a good one.

00:50:52Marc:Yeah.

00:50:52Guest:It's funny how I hear that music, and it sounds so much more heavy than some of this heavy metal these days or something, where it's gotten sort of operatic.

00:51:03Guest:Or noodley.

00:51:06Guest:Not that it sounds like opera, but it's gotten grandiose in this way.

00:51:10Sure.

00:51:10Marc:Yeah, and they're more complicated, not necessarily blues-based orchestrations.

00:51:14Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:51:15Marc:Not just a few guys.

00:51:16Marc:Right.

00:51:16Marc:You know, doing the heavy riffs.

00:51:18Marc:Right.

00:51:20Marc:Simple.

00:51:21Marc:Yeah, there's some power noodling and some strange chord structures going on that don't lock in to the town-y rock brain.

00:51:31Yeah.

00:51:31Marc:For me, anyways.

00:51:33Marc:I try.

00:51:35Marc:I didn't get hip to Sabbath until like three years ago.

00:51:39Marc:Come on, get out of here.

00:51:41Marc:I didn't listen to him when I was a kid, really.

00:51:43Marc:Why, because you were scared?

00:51:44Marc:No, I just was like, I don't know, I gotta listen to Zeppelin.

00:51:47Marc:But I didn't have friends that were Sabbath guys.

00:51:50Marc:Really?

00:51:51Marc:Yeah, I mean, the guys...

00:51:53Marc:i was in acdc there was some rush involved which i didn't love ted nugent was around but sabbath but sabbath sat outside the the class i don't know why i had one guy who was in the zappa and the cars i was at a weird uh in high school the weird time where new wave was happening yeah so the old guard held strong but then all of a sudden you know here come the cars right you know hey there's tom petty what's happening you know what i mean like a little

00:52:20Marc:Throw some herbs on that old salad, man.

00:52:22Marc:Yeah, exactly.

00:52:24Marc:And somehow Sabbath got left out.

00:52:26Marc:I don't know why.

00:52:26Guest:That seems strange because, yeah, they definitely had friends in the room.

00:52:29Marc:Oh, definitely.

00:52:31Marc:I don't know how I missed it.

00:52:33Marc:Well, I'm glad that you solved that problem that you had.

00:52:36Marc:Yeah, I had to go out and do it as a man in his late 40s.

00:52:40Marc:What?

00:52:41Marc:What is this Sabbath volume for?

00:52:43Guest:why isn't three good enough yeah do other people know about this just keeps going this is amazing well you know what that's pretty cool though i i wish that i had like come upon that a little bit later and just had this beautiful broad continent to like discover oh yeah as a grown-up it's a big that's an adventure to go on

00:53:07Marc:And it's good because it's so intimate and it's kind of heavy, but it's intimate.

00:53:12Marc:It's not overwhelming.

00:53:13Marc:You know what I mean?

00:53:14Marc:There's some good music there.

00:53:16Marc:And Sabbath is not quite an angst-driven.

00:53:18Marc:I was angry.

00:53:19Marc:I think I was more driven to define myself than angry.

00:53:25Marc:I was probably angry.

00:53:26Marc:I got angry later.

00:53:27Marc:But when I was in high school, I was more lost.

00:53:29Guest:Yeah.

00:53:31Guest:I recognize that in myself too.

00:53:33Guest:I wasn't particularly mad.

00:53:35Marc:Yeah.

00:53:36Guest:I was just sort of like, where do I fit in?

00:53:37Guest:Yeah.

00:53:38Guest:What is this all about?

00:53:40Guest:When are they going to figure out that I don't know what is going on?

00:53:43Guest:What am I supposed to do?

00:53:46Guest:When did you sort of drift towards art?

00:53:49Guest:I was always into art.

00:53:50Guest:I just, you know, the Southeast is not a burgeoning, you know, cradle for the arts.

00:53:59Guest:Really?

00:53:59Guest:It wasn't a super nurturing place.

00:54:02Guest:I mean, you know, I never felt like I was, and my folks were really supportive too.

00:54:08Guest:I mean, they didn't understand, but they were really supportive.

00:54:10Guest:They were, you know, well, that's what you want to do.

00:54:12Guest:Give it a shot.

00:54:12Guest:Luckily, we got your sister who's good at math.

00:54:15Guest:Might do something stable.

00:54:17Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:54:18Guest:So, I never felt like it's something I shouldn't be doing.

00:54:22Guest:I just didn't... You just felt like sort of an oddball.

00:54:27Marc:Right.

00:54:27Marc:I mean, there was an art department kids where I went.

00:54:32Marc:But I was hanging around the university.

00:54:33Marc:My mom was a painter.

00:54:35Marc:So, it was around.

00:54:36Marc:But in high school, it was still sort of like...

00:54:40Marc:I don't know.

00:54:41Marc:I graduated in 81.

00:54:42Marc:There weren't that many punks around.

00:54:45Marc:There were always those stoners that drew things.

00:54:49Marc:Yeah.

00:54:52Marc:They were holding up the art end of things.

00:54:57Guest:They got really good at pentagrams.

00:54:58Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:54:59Guest:Whatever it was.

00:55:00Guest:A lot of detail.

00:55:01Guest:And the detail and the joint and the smoke.

00:55:03Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:55:05Marc:I grew up in Albuquerque, New Mexico.

00:55:07Marc:Oh, right.

00:55:08Marc:But I was into photography.

00:55:09Marc:They built this amazing dark room, this amazing facility at my high school out of nowhere.

00:55:16Marc:Like a full-on professional dark room.

00:55:18Marc:So my junior and senior year, I kind of laid into it.

00:55:21Guest:That's super cool.

00:55:21Marc:Taking pictures, developing the film, doing that business.

00:55:24Guest:Yeah, that's all lost.

00:55:26Guest:That's considered like a really strange, vintage-y, eccentric thing to do.

00:55:31Marc:It's hard to wrap your brain around too.

00:55:33Marc:I think it was a built-in barrier to just anybody doing that particular art form.

00:55:39Marc:It was sort of necessary because it was like chemistry.

00:55:42Marc:Definitely weeded them out.

00:55:43Marc:Yeah, because he could fuck up at so many levels.

00:55:47Marc:Yeah.

00:55:47Marc:Because you got to wrap your negatives around that reel.

00:55:50Marc:Yeah.

00:55:50Marc:You know, before you put it in the tank to develop it, everything could go wrong at the wrapping.

00:55:54Marc:You're giving me like the worst flashbacks now.

00:55:57Marc:The bag.

00:55:58Marc:Reliving all these things.

00:55:58Marc:The bag with the wheel.

00:56:00Marc:And you got to pop the canister of film open and thread it right so they don't like touch each other.

00:56:05Guest:Yeah.

00:56:05Guest:I'm reliving all these things that I had put in a very safe, dark place.

00:56:10Yeah.

00:56:10Guest:The ruined rolls of film with just blotches on them.

00:56:14Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:56:15Marc:So you caught the tail end of that?

00:56:17Guest:Oh, totally, yeah.

00:56:19Guest:Yeah, I mean, I was into it early 90s.

00:56:22Guest:I was in art school, so it was still big and proud and strong.

00:56:26Guest:Not until, you know, 10 years after that.

00:56:28Guest:Just, man, a puff of smoke, gone.

00:56:31Marc:Like, I saw a movie the other day where it had a woman developing film in a darkroom in a modern movie.

00:56:37Marc:She's a photographer, she's working in a darkroom, and I'm like,

00:56:40Marc:She wouldn't be doing that.

00:56:41Marc:Who would do that now?

00:56:45Guest:All the younger people are looking at each other confused.

00:56:47Marc:What's happening?

00:56:48Marc:She pulls out a roll of film out of her bag, and I'm like, no one has that anymore.

00:56:54Guest:It's crazy.

00:56:55Guest:It's one of those old scripts that's been banging around Hollywood.

00:56:59Guest:They just forgot to update it.

00:57:00Marc:Well, that director wanted that shot of the image coming to in the liquid.

00:57:07Marc:Like, oh, here it comes.

00:57:09Marc:Look at that.

00:57:11Guest:The reveal.

00:57:12Guest:I love those.

00:57:14Guest:Some movies have these little bits that are just so specific to some technology that happened at the time.

00:57:21Guest:These cell phone movies are just going to be like.

00:57:23Guest:oh yeah the big cell phones yeah the big cell phones or even like one what was that scorsese movie the remake that he did not long ago the departed one it's like the big deal was like the cell phone oh yeah it's like this whole movie around like how they use their cell phone yeah yeah at that time those are going to be period pieces like you know what i mean

00:57:45Guest:They're going to be looking at that and dinosaur bones.

00:57:47Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:57:48Marc:Yeah.

00:57:49Marc:Yeah.

00:57:49Marc:And just like almost everything.

00:57:50Guest:Look at these strange objects we can only understand.

00:57:53Marc:Back before we were paralyzed by, you know, convenience.

00:57:56Marc:Now we don't need to do anything.

00:58:01Guest:but uh all right so but in high school were you doing what were you doing were you drawing things yeah i was way you know that's how i spent my time uh listening to records and drawing i was way into comic books yeah um oh really comic book guy comic books and art um yeah just kind of yeah i was game for all which comic books like classic ones or off the grid ones

00:58:24Guest:all of the stuff oh really comic book guy huh i didn't i wouldn't i wouldn't have pegged you for that it's all right thanks comics are great i think that's how i ended up in film school actually we're just sort of learning how to tell a story like yeah i i like them yeah but i never went all in like there was a period there for about a year

00:58:46Guest:I was way into it.

00:58:50Guest:I think it was mostly because I like to draw and I like stories.

00:58:53Guest:I mean, superheroes, who cares?

00:58:55Guest:He's got laser beams.

00:58:56Guest:Sure.

00:58:57Guest:Any kid likes that stuff.

00:58:58Guest:They work for me.

00:59:00Guest:There was definitely some later on that I thought were cool as far as just graphic novels and things I stayed into.

00:59:09Guest:But yeah, that kind of played itself out too once I got into...

00:59:12Guest:I think I kind of lost it on the photography and movie bug.

00:59:18Marc:You lost the comic thing.

00:59:19Marc:But some people can't really engage with comics.

00:59:22Marc:I can totally do it.

00:59:23Marc:It's a weird sort of thing to follow comics.

00:59:27Marc:It's also an expensive fucking hobby undertaking.

00:59:32Marc:Yeah, there's a lot of stuff to keep up with.

00:59:34Marc:Are you one of those guys with the weekly dude?

00:59:36Marc:Every month you go get your bag at the store?

00:59:40Yeah.

00:59:40Marc:the guy would be like here you go here's your 30 titles for the month first one's free exactly he'll be back yeah subscriber at the comic book store so you're doing your comic books and you're drawing shit and then you go to college art school you decide yeah yeah it seemed like the thing to do uh i didn't know what else i was gonna do

01:00:03Marc:But you were going to make films?

01:00:06Marc:That's what you decided?

01:00:07Guest:No, I didn't even know about that.

01:00:08Guest:I mean, I knew I liked movies.

01:00:10Guest:I was just game.

01:00:11Guest:What school did you go to?

01:00:13Guest:A school called Virginia Commonwealth University in Richmond, VCU.

01:00:17Guest:Richmond, yeah.

01:00:19Guest:Yeah, that was a big deal at the time.

01:00:20Guest:It's still a really great art school.

01:00:22Guest:It's a huge art school.

01:00:24Marc:So you get there and are you like, what the fuck did I do?

01:00:27Marc:I was kind of scared.

01:00:31Guest:You know, just first time away from home and you're surrounded by, you know, you finally feel like you're around your people.

01:00:37Guest:You know, you've met

01:00:38Guest:You know, because artsy kids.

01:00:40Guest:Sure.

01:00:41Guest:Look at all these weirdos who have a hard time talking to people.

01:00:44Guest:Yeah, exactly.

01:00:45Guest:We're all together now.

01:00:46Guest:Which was super fun.

01:00:48Guest:But, yeah, I had no idea what I was going to do.

01:00:50Guest:I mean, I still don't know.

01:00:52Guest:I'm just still going day to day.

01:00:53Guest:I think you should go with the musician thing.

01:00:57Guest:Sure is fun.

01:00:59Guest:Why not do that for a while?

01:01:00Guest:It's funny, though.

01:01:03Guest:It feels that way, though.

01:01:04Guest:I don't know.

01:01:06Guest:I just kind of fell into it.

01:01:08Guest:I didn't have... It's that failing forward thing.

01:01:12Guest:I just got lucky.

01:01:14Marc:Were you making movies and stuff?

01:01:17Guest:Well, I went to art school and thought I was going to be a painter, got into photography.

01:01:20Marc:You were painting?

01:01:21Guest:Yeah.

01:01:22Mm-hmm.

01:01:22Guest:still do you do the covers of some of the records right some of them you do the dog one do the dog one yeah yeah did the dog one you didn't do the embroidery on this one no but i i i told her what to do

01:01:37Guest:I can't sew.

01:01:39Guest:No, I found this great embroidery artist named Sarah Barnes.

01:01:43Guest:She runs a blog about all these different artists that do embroidery art.

01:01:49Guest:And she did the new one.

01:01:52Guest:Yeah, I just gave her a picture of myself holding the guitar.

01:01:55Marc:Yeah, it's great.

01:01:55Guest:It's a great cover.

01:01:56Marc:It'd be nice if each album was actually embroidered.

01:01:59Marc:Yeah.

01:02:00Marc:That would have been good.

01:02:00Marc:Yeah.

01:02:01Marc:Did you do any special editions of the embroidered cover?

01:02:04Yeah.

01:02:05Marc:There's one that has the back.

01:02:08Guest:Oh, one.

01:02:08Guest:There's one record?

01:02:10Guest:One record.

01:02:10Guest:No, it's like the special edition, the expanded thing.

01:02:15Guest:Oh, yeah?

01:02:15Guest:For the people who like that kind of stuff.

01:02:17Guest:There's one that has the back and it's all fucked up and looks...

01:02:21Guest:It's pretty bizarre.

01:02:23Marc:So, all right, so you're painting.

01:02:25Marc:Are you a good painter?

01:02:28Guest:You mean as if when I walk away, the thing is painted?

01:02:31Marc:Yeah, like it looks like finished.

01:02:34Marc:Like when you say I'm done, can you look at it and go like, that is done.

01:02:37Guest:Well, I've gotten really good at drawing pentagrams and drawing doobies.

01:02:40Guest:Doobies.

01:02:42Guest:Yeah.

01:02:43Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:02:43Guest:It's like so detailed.

01:02:45Guest:Yeah.

01:02:45Guest:no you know it's a good i just that's how i like to spend my time ever since i was a kid yeah i did one this morning you did yeah and what in la you bring your easel with you no i have a little a little pad of paper and like i've i found these little um you know you can bring watercolors or whatever just little quick little uh-huh fun ways to spend the morning did you do the cover of our endless numbered days

01:03:09Guest:Yeah.

01:03:10Marc:You did that one?

01:03:11Marc:Yeah.

01:03:12Marc:That's nice painting.

01:03:13Marc:Thanks.

01:03:13Marc:Is this supposed to be you?

01:03:16Guest:There's a doobie hidden in there somewhere.

01:03:17Guest:Heck, there's a bunch of doobies.

01:03:20Marc:Surrounded by green doobies.

01:03:24Guest:I love how you're saying doobie.

01:03:28Marc:but wait so where do you start making the music like because you can paint it's nice to have that skill a sense of color and a sense of um you know being able to organize on on art like that i i it's it's great that you can express yourself that way and you now you can play guitar but you're you're a pretty good guitar player so you must have put some time into it i just i have a problem i can only do things that i enjoy so i end up doing them a lot a lot oh so you really like obsessively do them

01:03:58Guest:A little bit, yeah.

01:03:59Guest:But, you know...

01:04:02Guest:Yeah, I kind of get lost in rabbit holes.

01:04:05Guest:Sometimes guitar, sometimes it's painting.

01:04:07Marc:Well, with the guitar, how'd you learn yourself guitar?

01:04:12Marc:Patience.

01:04:14Marc:But did you look at a book?

01:04:16Marc:Did someone show you?

01:04:17Guest:No, I had some friends show me a few chords.

01:04:19Guest:I kind of just played by ear.

01:04:21Guest:Yeah.

01:04:22Guest:My grandma used to, she played the piano in church, but she didn't know music.

01:04:27Guest:She always played by ear.

01:04:28Guest:Uh-huh.

01:04:29Guest:And she would sing the harmony in church, too.

01:04:32Guest:I love that.

01:04:32Guest:She would sing and play.

01:04:34Guest:Yeah.

01:04:35Guest:That takes some doing.

01:04:36Guest:You know, just some people got the knack.

01:04:40Guest:I mean, I wish I had taken lessons.

01:04:43Guest:I wish I had friends who were more generous in their cord tutelage.

01:04:51Guest:But at the same time, I feel like doing it myself sort of made it my own thing.

01:04:58Marc:I think that's true.

01:04:59Marc:I think that you don't do any excessive noodling, and you don't really pick up the pace too often.

01:05:06Marc:You're not like, this one's gonna, hold on, here we go.

01:05:15Guest:That is true.

01:05:16Guest:That is true.

01:05:17Guest:I definitely have a, it's more about the long game.

01:05:20Guest:It's an endurance.

01:05:23Guest:It's an endurance thing, not a sprint.

01:05:26Marc:Well, there's a tone to it all, you know, to the way you write songs and the way that the music is layered, you know, and even when things get different from record to record when they do, you know, you're still anchored in your sensibility.

01:05:43Marc:Like when your first record came out.

01:05:45Marc:And I'm a huge fan of that record.

01:05:48Marc:Thanks, man.

01:05:48Marc:I think I gave you a lot of money for a song, actually.

01:05:51Marc:Did you?

01:05:52Marc:Yeah.

01:05:53Marc:You should call some people.

01:05:56Marc:Because, no, man.

01:05:58Marc:Was that a Bitcoin thing?

01:06:00Marc:No.

01:06:01Marc:I don't even know how to work those.

01:06:03Marc:But at the end of my series on IFC of Marin, the last shot.

01:06:07Marc:Oh, that's right.

01:06:08Marc:The song I had in mind was Upward Over the Mountain.

01:06:12Marc:You mentioned that one when we met.

01:06:13Marc:I did?

01:06:14Marc:Yeah.

01:06:15Marc:And I kept trying to find songs that kind of sounded like that from people that no one knew so we could afford it.

01:06:21Marc:Mine's not that expensive, is it?

01:06:24Marc:No, but we had no money.

01:06:27Marc:But it was one of those things.

01:06:28Guest:It's more expensive than that.

01:06:29Marc:It's the last show of the entire season.

01:06:32Marc:And I was like, oh, fuck, I can't even get one song by a mid-level guy.

01:06:41Marc:Not even a fucking huge rock star.

01:06:43Marc:It's not a Beatles song.

01:06:45Marc:It's a fucking Iron and Wine song.

01:06:48Marc:Let's scope around the lower mids.

01:06:53Marc:I consider myself a mid-level guy.

01:06:56Marc:But I love that record.

01:06:57Guest:I love the album.

01:06:57Guest:I love being in the mids.

01:06:58Guest:You've got room to go up.

01:07:01Guest:You've got room to go down.

01:07:02Guest:If you fall, you're not falling that far.

01:07:04Marc:And you've ruined to be anonymous.

01:07:06Marc:Yeah.

01:07:06Marc:It's like, I've been talking about it on stage, like, I'm at a mid-level celebrity where, like, three guys will walk up to me, one guy will be really excited.

01:07:14Marc:And then two guys, like, one guy will be like, Marc Maron!

01:07:17Marc:And the other two guys will be like, nope, nothing.

01:07:20Marc:And then I gotta...

01:07:21Marc:I've got to watch the one guy that knows me explain to the other two who I am.

01:07:26Marc:That's always fun.

01:07:27Marc:By badly reading my credits.

01:07:29Marc:Oh, they whip out their phones.

01:07:31Marc:Or they're just sort of like, you never saw it.

01:07:33Marc:And both of the other guys are like, no, I never saw any of it.

01:07:35Marc:I'm like, okay, I've got to go.

01:07:37Guest:This says you're super famous, man.

01:07:38Guest:You've got a TV show?

01:07:39Marc:Yeah, exactly.

01:07:41Marc:But they let me buy it.

01:07:42Marc:They let us get it.

01:07:44Marc:It was good.

01:07:45Marc:You should make a little money on that.

01:07:47Marc:You must make a little money on that.

01:07:49Marc:I do all right.

01:07:50Guest:On the publishing?

01:07:50Marc:For a mid-level guy.

01:07:51Marc:Right.

01:07:53Guest:I swear to God, that wasn't an insult.

01:07:56Guest:You know, I never had any clue what I was...

01:08:01Guest:I had no idea what I was getting into.

01:08:04Guest:I liked music.

01:08:05Guest:And so, all of this stuff, people, you sitting here across from you and talking about my music is all gravy to me.

01:08:13Guest:Yeah.

01:08:13Guest:Because, you know, I'm doing it.

01:08:16Guest:As far as, you know, we do okay.

01:08:19Guest:I'm not like super loaded.

01:08:21Guest:Right.

01:08:21Guest:Yeah, me too.

01:08:22Guest:You're in a living, right?

01:08:23Guest:Yeah, we get to do the art life and not have to worry about...

01:08:30Guest:I don't know.

01:08:31Guest:It's nice not to have to... Compromising too much.

01:08:34Guest:Not compromise and not sweat about when it's going to dry up anymore.

01:08:39Guest:Because I remember that feeling for a long time.

01:08:41Marc:Yeah, I still get that one.

01:08:42Marc:You don't get that anymore?

01:08:43Marc:Good for you.

01:08:44Marc:I guess when you have a beard, you can sort of...

01:08:46Marc:I can be in it a while.

01:08:49Marc:I'm going to age out.

01:08:50Marc:You can get in my beard for a while?

01:08:52Marc:No, no.

01:08:52Marc:If you have a beard and you're committed to it, which you are, you're like, I look good at 42, and if I'm 50, this beard's only going to look more wise and interesting.

01:09:01Marc:Ha, ha, ha.

01:09:03Marc:And the songs will probably be more reflective and deeper.

01:09:07Guest:Perhaps, yeah.

01:09:08Guest:Perhaps.

01:09:09Guest:You would hope.

01:09:09Guest:Perhaps.

01:09:10Guest:Someone would hope.

01:09:11Guest:Well, you're right, though.

01:09:12Guest:Someone just wants me to stop.

01:09:14Guest:Huh?

01:09:14Guest:Someone.

01:09:15Guest:Someone probably just wants me to stop.

01:09:16Guest:There's always those people.

01:09:18Guest:Fuck that guy.

01:09:19Guest:Enough already.

01:09:19Marc:Pick up the piece.

01:09:20Marc:Yeah.

01:09:22Marc:I love your pace, buddy.

01:09:25Marc:I didn't mean to.

01:09:26Marc:I'm just busting on you a little bit.

01:09:27Marc:You can take it, right?

01:09:29Marc:I can take it.

01:09:30Guest:No, it's fun.

01:09:31Guest:I'm a fan.

01:09:32Guest:It's fun.

01:09:33Guest:I like... Yeah, it's... I don't know.

01:09:36Guest:Yeah, I've just recently gotten around to not...

01:09:41Guest:always about to be having a panic panic attack about it disappearing i don't know what what yeah what that is i think it's just sort of accepting ruling relenting to yeah people liking it right right or to know that yeah yeah i mean it's a weird thing you do have to go out and do the troubadour business

01:10:00Guest:Yeah, but I like it.

01:10:01Guest:Yeah.

01:10:02Guest:I like playing.

01:10:03Guest:Yeah.

01:10:03Guest:Out, you know, I like playing shows, but I just recently, I think it's just because it hasn't gone away and I haven't really been making big splashes anywhere, you know, just sort of keep doing my thing and.

01:10:14Guest:Right.

01:10:15Guest:Enough people come to listen, enough people chime in and say, that's cool.

01:10:18Guest:Yeah.

01:10:19Marc:But you're kind of dug in.

01:10:20Marc:I mean, like I said, there's no one really like you.

01:10:24Marc:But that was what I was going to say, though.

01:10:26Marc:The first album comes out, and it's Iron and Wine.

01:10:29Marc:And I'm like, who's Iron and Wine?

01:10:31Marc:And then someone said, it's just this guy.

01:10:33Marc:It's like a guy?

01:10:35Marc:Why is it called Iron and Wine if it's just a guy?

01:10:38Marc:Is there more of them?

01:10:40Marc:No, it's mostly just the one guy.

01:10:42Marc:Why is he calling himself Iron and Wine?

01:10:43Marc:It's a real guy.

01:10:44Marc:It's a real problem for me.

01:10:45Marc:It's so confusing.

01:10:47Marc:For the first record, I was like, there's got to be more to it than this.

01:10:50Marc:There doesn't.

01:10:55Marc:But how did you get from painting to this record?

01:10:57Marc:Where did this record happen, the first record?

01:10:59Guest:I just was doing it in my spare time, you know.

01:11:03Guest:You end up... In Virginia?

01:11:05Guest:No, this was a while later.

01:11:07Guest:I went to a film school in Florida.

01:11:11Guest:Ah, so you locked into the film thing.

01:11:13Guest:I locked into the film thing.

01:11:14Guest:I was like way into it.

01:11:16Guest:Did you make any films?

01:11:17Guest:i made a bunch of student films and some music videos and stuff i mean i worked on a bunch but never really big films or just yeah the biggest one was this um i was a scab electrician on the um the patriot remember that mel gibson yeah yeah yeah that was that was interesting where'd you should was that shot down in the south somewhere huh yeah south carolina yeah

01:11:40Guest:Other than that, I was in Miami doing lots of commercials and movies.

01:11:46Guest:Oh, really?

01:11:46Guest:Yeah.

01:11:47Guest:But, you know, production stuff.

01:11:49Guest:Yeah.

01:11:50Guest:And doing music in my spare time.

01:11:52Guest:That's where you were headed.

01:11:53Guest:I was doing it, man.

01:11:54Guest:I was all in.

01:11:55Marc:You wanted to be a director?

01:11:56Guest:And then I wasn't.

01:11:57Guest:Yeah.

01:11:57Guest:uh yeah i thought i wanted to be a director everybody who gets into movies thinks they want to be a director were you writing movies i started working i started writing a bunch yeah never finished any uh and then you start them it's hard to finish them yeah songs are shorter very and very much shorter and they can have a longer impact sometimes sometimes yeah you know sometimes

01:12:24Marc:Oh, man.

01:12:24Marc:You think of some dudes that have 90 records out, but you only know two of their songs, and then you realize it was worth it for those two.

01:12:33Marc:Do you know what I mean?

01:12:33Guest:Definitely.

01:12:34Marc:It's kind of fascinating.

01:12:35Marc:It took me a long time to come around to that.

01:12:38Marc:That one song, that's the magic one, and that magic's not going away.

01:12:42Marc:It's never going to go away.

01:12:44Guest:yeah no even i think you're always working on that song you're always working towards yeah like you never it's not like a thing where like that's the only song i have right and i just laid it on the table and now i'm done right no you always got a bunch of songs but there's some people and i think you're one of those people where the songs are sort of kind of like they're gems they're kind of precious things like i i've talked to john prine i just saw him the other day

01:13:08Guest:Oh, yeah?

01:13:09Guest:I'd never seen him play.

01:13:10Guest:It was so good.

01:13:11Guest:So good, right?

01:13:12Guest:Yeah.

01:13:12Guest:Loved it, right?

01:13:13Guest:It's funny.

01:13:13Guest:It's so funny.

01:13:14Guest:Yeah.

01:13:15Guest:But also, just beautiful.

01:13:20Guest:Yeah.

01:13:20Marc:Like, in just a wonderful conversational way.

01:13:22Marc:Yeah.

01:13:23Marc:His show, you mean?

01:13:24Marc:How he talks to the audience and stuff?

01:13:26Guest:Yeah.

01:13:26Guest:But even his songs, they're just... Yeah.

01:13:29Guest:They're like the opposite of Jimmy Buffett's songs.

01:13:34Guest:Yeah.

01:13:34Marc:Yeah, I only know of one or two Jimmy Buffet songs.

01:13:40Guest:You know, I mean, just sort of giving a nod or winking and saying, like, it's supposed to be funny.

01:13:46Guest:But at the same time, it's really clever.

01:13:49Guest:Yeah, clever.

01:13:50Guest:Some of them heavy.

01:13:51Marc:You know, like real brokenhearted shit, man.

01:13:54Marc:Angel from Montgomery.

01:13:56Marc:That one's pretty good.

01:13:57Marc:Like, if all he did was that, we'd be all set.

01:14:00Yeah.

01:14:00Marc:And Sam Stone.

01:14:02Marc:Sam Stone, Angel from Montgomery.

01:14:04Guest:Did pretty good.

01:14:07Marc:Right?

01:14:08Marc:But I remember that the first record, it was the lo-fi.

01:14:12Marc:You kind of timed it right about the sound.

01:14:17Guest:I guess so, yeah.

01:14:18Marc:Because I like a lot of your records.

01:14:20Marc:I mean, I'm not being a dick.

01:14:22Marc:That's me.

01:14:22Marc:I want to talk to you.

01:14:26Marc:I just think you're a good audience so I can get some laughs.

01:14:30Marc:I like people that can take a hit with a laugh.

01:14:32Marc:I can't take it too seriously.

01:14:36Marc:It's only life.

01:14:38Marc:I'm not being that hard on you.

01:14:40Marc:No, you're not.

01:14:41Marc:But yeah, that record, that's one of those songs, Upward Over the Mountain.

01:14:45Marc:I listen to that pretty regularly.

01:14:46Marc:You mentioned that when we met the first time.

01:14:48Guest:I did.

01:14:49Guest:I'm obsessed with that song.

01:14:50Guest:Yeah.

01:14:51Guest:No, but I love that.

01:14:52Guest:I mean, what else does an artist want but for someone to say, you know, you did this thing, and I appreciate it.

01:14:58Guest:Thank you.

01:14:58Marc:Yeah, and I listen to it.

01:15:00Marc:It moves me every time.

01:15:01Marc:I don't even know what it means.

01:15:03Marc:I don't know what you guys mean, but I know.

01:15:06Marc:I have feelings about that thing, that vague.

01:15:10Guest:story in that in that thing that one's about mom it is about mamas yeah everybody's got mamas but do you when you write songs do you're aware what it's about or do you just get lines uh you know they're all different some of them are more specific than others uh some of them they require less than others you know some of them want to be explained and some of them enjoy being a mystery right sort of try to be open to what whatever happens but letting it happen

01:15:39Guest:Yeah, that one was pretty much specifically about like a mom or about the narrator's talking to his own mother.

01:15:49Guest:Right.

01:15:49Guest:Saying... Yeah, I got that.

01:15:51Guest:We're about, you know, life is about us always losing and let's just hope that...

01:15:59Guest:sometimes we'll have hope that it'll win or will win.

01:16:05Guest:And so because, you know, that's the relationship with the mom and their children.

01:16:09Guest:You know, it's always releasing, always losing.

01:16:12Guest:And so that's what that one's about.

01:16:14Guest:And that's pretty specific.

01:16:16Guest:Some of them are less so.

01:16:18Guest:I mean, I think I try to treat them like poems.

01:16:20Guest:And some poems...

01:16:23Guest:end up being about you never know when you're getting into it no you don't like i'm gonna sit down and compose this thing about the complex relationship between mothers and sons i mean you just sort of get into it and the lines start coming and then you start to realize oh that's what it's about right hopefully walk away then

01:16:40Guest:instead of developing it too much.

01:16:42Marc:Stop cutting and pasting.

01:16:43Marc:Keep it on the pad.

01:16:45Marc:Because I've written some poetry, and I used to be into it, and it just comes.

01:16:49Marc:But it seems like when a story happens, it takes a lot to be confident in a story, a poetry story.

01:16:56Guest:you know you know what i mean like totally so if it's vague and weird and it rhymes and like you got some good images like that's good enough it takes a lot of confidence regardless i mean just to put your stuff on a piece of paper and put it out there you know what i mean it's really because you're just reaching around in the fog

01:17:13Guest:There's no like, you just sort of get used to it.

01:17:16Guest:Right.

01:17:16Guest:It's true, man.

01:17:18Guest:Yeah.

01:17:19Guest:And every now and then you reach into the fog and you pull back something that you wouldn't have recognized, but you think it's kind of fun.

01:17:26Guest:And you get accustomed and enjoying reaching into the fog and seeing what comes back.

01:17:31Guest:Well, that's the whole thing.

01:17:32Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:17:33Marc:Like, you don't know where it comes from.

01:17:36Marc:No.

01:17:36Marc:You know?

01:17:37Marc:It's kind of fascinating.

01:17:38Marc:I mean, I do it with jokes.

01:17:40Marc:And I do it, you know, not so much in writing, but in performing them.

01:17:43Marc:In letting things happen on stage.

01:17:46Marc:You know, where you're just sort of like, this has got to get funnier.

01:17:49Marc:Nothing I'm going to do.

01:17:50Marc:I can only wait.

01:17:53Marc:It'll be delivered one day.

01:17:55Marc:I can't force it.

01:17:58Marc:I can have some ideas.

01:18:00Marc:But it's the same when you write something where when a song resolves itself, I imagine it's pretty exciting.

01:18:07Guest:It is fun.

01:18:09Guest:I just like making things.

01:18:11Guest:And I think I'm getting less and less...

01:18:13Guest:I think I'm liking it more and more.

01:18:16Guest:I'm getting less and less worried about what it should be or what it might be.

01:18:22Guest:I just let it happen.

01:18:23Marc:Yeah, and you're putting it down, and the songs sound great, and there's some hints of...

01:18:31Marc:You know, the type of singing and playing that you do and the harmonies and stuff, it's a very earthy thing, you know?

01:18:38Marc:It's got a lot of foundation.

01:18:40Marc:Even like Crosby, Stills, and Nash and stuff like that, right?

01:18:45Guest:Yeah, yeah, for sure.

01:18:46Marc:You know, like that kind of, that zone, which is kind of a magic place because you can get heavy, you can get light.

01:18:53Yeah.

01:18:53Marc:and you know and you know you got the delivery system yeah slow i mean not too fast though i think like you got kind of fast on wasn't ghost on ghost the one where it's like let's get some horns in here was there horns horns don't like to go slow huh horns don't like to go slow but you had some horns on there am i wrong oh hell yeah yeah there's a whole orchestra right a whole bunch of them yeah that was a big deal right it was fun yeah whose idea was that

01:19:20Guest:i think it was mine yeah i just love that music i love r&b music yeah and i love jazz you know it's fun to try to but that was a big departure that record for you no i don't know i mean i mean i think if you looked at the first one and then you listened to that one yeah yeah they're like significantly different but if you like just sort of followed the footsteps it's there yeah it was all headed towards that

01:19:44Guest:Yeah, I always... Yeah, I've definitely heard people say that, but I've always felt like each one answered the one before it.

01:19:51Guest:Sure, yeah, yeah.

01:19:52Guest:Pushed you a little further into the fog.

01:19:54Guest:Yeah.

01:19:55Guest:I mean, it might not have been... Maybe just on a production level.

01:19:59Guest:For sure, yeah.

01:20:00Guest:It was a different kind of thing.

01:20:01Guest:Yeah.

01:20:01Guest:It was a bigger... Yeah, just lots of musicians and this complicated thing happening.

01:20:08Guest:But...

01:20:08Guest:I always felt like each one kind of just took a few more steps past where the last one went.

01:20:14Guest:Yeah.

01:20:15Guest:They might not have always been the steps that other people wanted me to take.

01:20:19Guest:Sure.

01:20:19Guest:Well, some people just wanted to stay the same.

01:20:22Guest:Yeah, that's hard.

01:20:23Marc:Yeah, not for some people.

01:20:25Marc:especially people make a lot of money on that first one they're like can you do four of those sure sure no problem then i'll just only four yeah you know just keep making them as long as until it gets sad keep making them until it gets sad but like and also i listened to they sent me that stuff you did with ben uh oh right uh bridwell yeah me and ben that was he's a friend of yours we grew up in the same town yeah we were roommates

01:20:52Marc:Because that band, they did a record where I thought it was amazing.

01:21:02Marc:And I'm trying to remember what ceased to begin.

01:21:05Marc:Yeah, that's a good one.

01:21:07Marc:I listened to the shit out of that record.

01:21:11Marc:You should have.

01:21:12Marc:Right.

01:21:12Marc:That's a good one.

01:21:13Marc:And then I didn't get any more.

01:21:15Guest:there's a lot of music out there man i mean i gotta be honest i'm blown away when people are along for the ride i mean i've been doing it for like 15 years and i can't i can't think of a band that i listen to that i've stayed with for 15 years besides like the beatles or something right where you just sort of like yeah a lot of times they put out records you're like i didn't know they had a record out totally

01:21:35Guest:I'm worried it's going to happen to me.

01:21:36Guest:I'm just going to put up one out and I didn't even know it.

01:21:40Guest:Did that come out?

01:21:41Guest:But that's a lot.

01:21:42Guest:There's so much music.

01:21:43Marc:And who's this Jessica Hoop?

01:21:45Marc:Jess.

01:21:47Marc:Jess.

01:21:48Marc:No, I know.

01:21:48Marc:It's great.

01:21:48Guest:I listened to that record too and I didn't know about her.

01:21:51Guest:I didn't know about her either until I did.

01:21:54Guest:Right.

01:21:55Guest:What's her story?

01:21:56Guest:She was actually from here.

01:21:57Guest:She played at the Hotel Cafe a bunch.

01:22:00Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:22:01Guest:You know, a minute ago.

01:22:03Marc:Interesting.

01:22:04Marc:She's a singer and guitar player and songwriter.

01:22:07Marc:Mm-hmm.

01:22:07Marc:Super talented.

01:22:08Guest:Yeah, yeah.

01:22:09Marc:Interesting person.

01:22:11Guest:You could say that.

01:22:12Guest:You could say that.

01:22:14Guest:Always looks different.

01:22:15Guest:Yeah, she's into the theatrics of it, which I think is really fun.

01:22:19Guest:Yeah.

01:22:20Guest:no i was looking for someone to do a duets record for a long time and i because i always liked that format yeah um it's pretty i talked to um annie from st vincent a couple times we talked about it you know and just but never nothing ever stuck and the one with jess was the one that stuck it's funny with annie because she's like does this very specific sort of thing sometimes musically but she comes

01:22:45Marc:from hippie shit yeah totally totally she's just got nicer shoes yeah you can try to drag her back into the hippie you know for anybody yeah her uh was it her uncle was a wizard right a guitar player yeah yeah yeah

01:23:03Marc:But yeah, I never heard of Jessica.

01:23:06Marc:Is that Jessica?

01:23:07Guest:Yeah, I think you meet so many people like that.

01:23:10Guest:They're so talented.

01:23:11Guest:And for some reason, the stars just didn't align.

01:23:13Guest:They didn't make connections with the people that they should have.

01:23:18Guest:But I think her writing was great.

01:23:21Guest:Did you tour with her too, right?

01:23:22Guest:We did, yeah.

01:23:23Guest:We're all done with that now.

01:23:24Guest:Was it fun?

01:23:25Guest:Super fun.

01:23:27Marc:Were you doing your own shit and the shit with her?

01:23:29Guest:Or were you just touring the duet thing?

01:23:31Guest:Well, we did the duet thing, but we would also play our own songs.

01:23:35Guest:Oh, that's good.

01:23:36Guest:People enjoy it?

01:23:36Guest:Mix it up.

01:23:37Guest:Yeah.

01:23:38Guest:Well, we did a thing where she picked my songs to play and I picked her songs to play.

01:23:42Guest:So, you know, just try to make a team effort of it.

01:23:45Marc:And when you go out, what do you think, what size venues you do usually?

01:23:52Guest:You know, it depends on the band.

01:23:53Guest:It depends on what... Well, it depends on how many people you think will come.

01:23:58Guest:Yeah, well, that's what I mean.

01:24:00Guest:I'm curious.

01:24:01Marc:Where's your biggest draw, usually?

01:24:03Marc:Where's our draw?

01:24:04Marc:Yeah, where's your big... What are your good cities?

01:24:07Guest:Well, Albuquerque is pretty.

01:24:09Guest:Is it?

01:24:10Guest:I do love playing there.

01:24:13Guest:Yeah.

01:24:15Guest:L.A.

01:24:15Guest:would do fun.

01:24:15Guest:You know, the big cities.

01:24:16Guest:Yeah.

01:24:17Guest:College towns.

01:24:18Guest:Sure.

01:24:20Guest:Certain pockets have always been, the Pacific Northwest has always been kind to us.

01:24:25Guest:Oh, that's good.

01:24:28Guest:Minneapolis.

01:24:29Guest:Yeah.

01:24:29Marc:Minneapolis is great.

01:24:30Marc:Yeah.

01:24:31Marc:I just shot a special in Minneapolis.

01:24:32Marc:It's a great place.

01:24:33Marc:It's a great city.

01:24:34Marc:I love it there.

01:24:35Marc:So Beast Epic is the new record, and I enjoyed that record.

01:24:38Marc:I've only given it one or two listens.

01:24:41Marc:I need to listen some more.

01:24:42Marc:Yeah, you do.

01:24:44Marc:Let's listen to it now.

01:24:46Marc:You want to go listen to it now?

01:24:47Marc:What's different about this record?

01:24:49Marc:Is it the first record that you had pedal steel on?

01:24:51Marc:No.

01:24:54Marc:It's not.

01:24:55Marc:There's a lot of textures on the record.

01:25:01Marc:Yeah.

01:25:02Marc:What do you think?

01:25:03Marc:After the other one, the R&B record, this is not an R&B record.

01:25:09Guest:No, it's not.

01:25:10Guest:Although, you know, they're all R&B records in a way.

01:25:14Guest:Come on.

01:25:15Guest:I know what you're saying.

01:25:16Guest:But what do you make of this record?

01:25:18Guest:How is it different for you?

01:25:19Guest:It's a bit more introspective.

01:25:20Guest:It's a bit more...

01:25:22Guest:I don't know.

01:25:23Guest:The other ones, the last few, I mean, I spent a lot, I always spend a lot of time on the lyrics, but I feel like the sonic handshake that was made was more of a music.

01:25:35Guest:I was more interested in the music than actually communicating a certain type of song.

01:25:40Guest:So these songs seemed like they were more introspective songs.

01:25:45Guest:They're more singer-songwriter kind of songs.

01:25:47Guest:And so finger-songwriter songs.

01:25:50Guest:Finger-songwriter.

01:25:51Guest:So the lyrics are more like higher in the mix.

01:25:58Guest:They're songs to be sort of absorbed in a different way.

01:26:01Marc:And when you were writing, how long did they take you to put the writing together?

01:26:05Marc:When did you have it?

01:26:07Marc:Was this like yours work?

01:26:08Marc:Things sitting around for like...

01:26:10Guest:Some of them.

01:26:11Guest:I think these are mostly, I usually have a bunch of like older ones laying around.

01:26:15Guest:They end up on there, but I think these are mostly newer.

01:26:18Guest:These are more.

01:26:19Guest:Reflective, huh?

01:26:20Guest:Recent ones, yeah.

01:26:21Guest:Getting older.

01:26:22Guest:Kids.

01:26:23Guest:Kids.

01:26:24Guest:How old's your oldest kid?

01:26:25Guest:19.

01:26:26Marc:What?

01:26:27Guest:Yeah.

01:26:28Guest:She just went to college this year.

01:26:29Guest:oh i know was that weird it wasn't not weird painful uh it's painful in a way but she's really happy so it makes it easy yeah and then the other ones just tear down from there what's the youngest one she's seven

01:26:47Marc:Oh, my God.

01:26:49Guest:Yeah.

01:26:49Guest:It's never going to stop, dude.

01:26:51Guest:Yeah, that's what this record's about.

01:26:56Guest:In fact, I think I just renamed it.

01:26:58Guest:It's never going to stop, dude.

01:26:59Guest:The new reflective record by Iron and Wine.

01:27:05Guest:All right, buddy.

01:27:06Guest:Well, thanks for talking, man.

01:27:07Guest:It's been a lot of fun, man.

01:27:14Marc:Oh, man.

01:27:15Marc:I love that guy.

01:27:16Marc:Sweet guy.

01:27:18Marc:I felt like I was just trying to get him going.

01:27:20Marc:I felt like he's a good audience.

01:27:22Marc:I felt like I wanted to entertain Sam Beam and his beard.

01:27:25Marc:I love that guy.

01:27:28Marc:I like people from the South.

01:27:30Marc:Is that being racist to say that I like people from the South?

01:27:33Marc:I think it's being unusual.

01:27:35Marc:That's mean.

01:27:36Marc:No, he's a real southern gentleman, that guy.

01:27:39Marc:Seems like it to me.

01:27:40Marc:All right, I can't play guitar today.

01:27:42Marc:I have to go.

01:27:42Marc:I got to be on set in 10 minutes.

01:27:44Marc:And my car has a flat tire, and I don't have it.

01:27:46Marc:So now I got to wait for Transpo to pick me up.

01:27:49Marc:And this is probably... Oh, the van is outside.

01:27:53Marc:Come on over.

01:27:54Marc:Okay.

01:27:55Marc:So let me say... Okay.

01:27:58Marc:Two minutes.

01:28:01Marc:I don't need two minutes to say this.

01:28:04Guest:Boomer lives!