Episode 854 - Marilyn Manson
Guest:Lock the gates!
Lock the gates!
Marc:Alright, let's do this.
Marc:How are you, what the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck, buddies?
Marc:What the fuckineers?
Marc:What the fucknicks?
Marc:What the fuckocrats?
Marc:What is happening?
Marc:I'm Mark Maron.
Marc:This is my podcast, WTF.
Marc:Welcome to it.
Marc:If you're new here, because of the juice I got in that Parade Magazine piece, who knew?
Marc:Who knew that I would be on the cover of Parade Magazine?
Marc:And I thought it was a tremendous...
Marc:I think when I got on the cover of my college alumni magazine, Boston University alumni magazine, I thought that was something.
Marc:Because there was a bit of fuck you in that.
Marc:There was a bit of yeah, fuck you.
Marc:Because I had one time, there was a time when I did a stand-up show at the college, made fun of the then president of the college, John Silber, and was erased from the event in the alumni magazine.
Marc:And...
Marc:So being on the cover of it years later was definitely satisfying.
Marc:But Parade, Parade Magazine, I didn't even know, I honestly didn't know it still existed.
Marc:And I'm happy it exists because to be honest with you, and I think they talked about this a bit,
Marc:in that on the sidebar of the parade piece, along with a fairly thorough definition of what a podcast is, which I thought was good.
Marc:It shows you who the audience is.
Marc:And to be honest, it's important that people of that generation do get hip to the podcast.
Marc:It would be nice.
Marc:You know, we don't want the numbers to plateau completely.
Marc:But nonetheless, Parade Magazine was something that I looked forward to a great deal with.
Marc:when I was younger.
Marc:The My Favorite Joke section of Parade Magazine, which was, in my recollection, around the last page, when I was 10, 11, 12 years old, was the best thing that existed in the world.
Marc:I would go just rummage through the paper until I found Parade, until I get to that back page with some sweaty comedian, a picture of Rodney Dangerfield, Buddy Hackett, all the comics of that era in the 70s.
Marc:were on the back and then some of the older guys.
Marc:And it would just be a picture of them, their name, and a bunch of their jokes written out.
Marc:And I loved it.
Marc:I loved it.
Marc:I remember looking forward to it and reading them over and over again.
Marc:And it really planted a seed in my head that comedy was important and something amazing and something that I eventually wanted to be part of.
Marc:So thank you to Parade.
Marc:for putting me on the cover, and thank you for inspiring me as a very young person to respect and enjoy jokes written down on the page.
Marc:By the way, Marilyn Manson is the guest today on the show.
Marc:He was here a few weeks ago before the stuff fell on him at the beginning of his tour, sadly.
Marc:He was, I think, partially crushed a bit by some props.
Marc:I believe he's okay, but this was recorded before all that.
Marc:And it was an interesting conversation because, look, I know who Marilyn Manson was.
Marc:I didn't grow up with his music per se, but he was certainly a theatrical force and certainly a musical force to a certain generation of youngsters.
Marc:But the spectacle of Marilyn Manson is pretty insanely compelling.
Marc:And when I got the opportunity to talk to him, I took it.
Marc:He came over.
Marc:And I'll be honest with you, and I don't think Marilyn would mind me saying, I think he was a little loopy.
Marc:Maybe I'll say more about that before I intro him in a few minutes.
Marc:But he's a witty guy and a bright guy.
Marc:And I think it went pretty.
Marc:I think the conversation went pretty well for a while.
Marc:It was good.
Marc:It was good.
Marc:It was good to see him and good to meet him.
Marc:But speaking of writing, Brendan McDonald and myself went.
Marc:We were at Barnes and Noble in Union Square, New York City on Tuesday night doing our presentation for Waiting for the Punch.
Marc:Words to live by from the WTF podcast by myself and Brendan.
Marc:And it was great.
Marc:Over 300 people showed up standing room only.
Marc:and brendan and i get up there we got the book and brendan sort of takes the lead and you know throw some stuff at me i react to it sometimes like he'll throw something at me he'll get me worked up and that's always fun for the audience we talk a little bit about how how it all came about and just uh people get to know brendan a little bit if they don't know him already and it was a great event a lot of people uh but like i said a lot of people came honestly came this is not a uh i'm not manufacturing numbers
Marc:OK, I don't have any problem admitting success or failure.
Marc:I will admit both.
Marc:I'm fairly candid like that.
Marc:But this was definitely a success.
Marc:And we signed hundreds of books.
Marc:We stayed for two hours, met all the fans, signed the books.
Marc:I even met some cousins I didn't know I had.
Marc:But it was a great event.
Marc:People seem to be enjoying the book.
Marc:I also did the New York Times book review podcast.
Marc:I don't know when that's on, but that was a nice conversation.
Marc:And we did the gist.
Marc:Brendan and I both did that.
Marc:And that's coming up.
Marc:Yeah, so it was fun to be in New York for two days.
Marc:It was a quick two days.
Marc:I hung out with my pal Sam Lipsight, the genius writer Sam Lipsight.
Marc:I would take a look at his books.
Marc:I'm here to sell books for not only me but for my buddy Sam Lipsight.
Marc:It's so nice to hang out with a pal that you see not as often as you'd like and you just sit there and you eat some fish and you laugh for a few hours.
Marc:Quality time.
Marc:Hung out with my buddy Jim Loftus.
Marc:He used to be in politics, used to be at the statehouse.
Marc:Now he's up in New Hampshire, kind of holed up, not in a frightening way, but in a sort of like thinking about stuff way.
Marc:And we talked for a little bit about the state of the world and
Marc:I get, you know, I've got advisors.
Marc:I've got, I've got advisors that were, you know, once within the government, there's people I reach out to and, you know, try to get the pulse on, you know, when do we flee?
Marc:I think is, is the big question.
Marc:When, when, when do we, when do we take off?
Marc:When does that happen?
Marc:What else can I report to you?
Marc:Other than the, we're very excited about the book.
Marc:We're doing another event.
Marc:This, um,
Marc:Friday, that's tomorrow, in San Francisco at the Alamo Drafthouse through the Litquake Fest.
Marc:I think you can go to litquake.org maybe to see if there's any tickets left for that.
Marc:And if you want to get your copy of the book, if you haven't gotten your copy of the book yet, you can go to wherever you buy books or you can go to markmarinbook.com.
Marc:And for those of you who got the...
Marc:The nameplates, the book plates, the signed nameplates for the book, those are being delivered separately from the book.
Marc:So ease up on the emails.
Marc:It's coming.
Marc:I wouldn't steer you wrong.
Marc:It's coming.
Marc:I've gotten some emails lately about me getting off caffeine, me getting off nicotine, people wanting to get sober and whatnot.
Marc:I'll tell you what's interesting about where I'm at right now, and I don't like to admit this, I don't think, is that I have gotten off the caffeine
Marc:In the coffee form, you know, I think that caffeine and tea is different.
Marc:I've been drinking green tea, no nicotine.
Marc:And I got to tell you, I'm a lot calmer.
Marc:I'm a lot less prone to spinning out.
Marc:I'm a lot less exhausted.
Marc:I'm less queasy.
Marc:I'm less in need of a nap in the middle of the day.
Marc:I'm a little thick.
Marc:I feel like things are staying with me in the forms.
Marc:I don't think food is moving through me as quickly as it wants to.
Marc:I think everything is slowed down a bit.
Marc:But if I'm slowly adjusting to the ground zero of who I am energetically.
Marc:And biologically, well, great.
Marc:Then maybe I can sort of work from there.
Marc:But nothing is exacerbated right now.
Marc:The anxiety is there.
Marc:The tension is there.
Marc:The fear is there.
Marc:But I'm also like, it's not consuming me because it's not, the volume isn't turned up to 90 with caffeine, with coffee specifically, and nicotine taking the edge off on the bottom end, but then ultimately going both ways when you don't expect it.
Marc:I got to tell you, coffee makes you more aggravated.
Marc:Genius, right?
Marc:I'm glad I did the homework on that one.
Marc:Coffee makes you more aggravated.
Marc:Now, Marilyn Manson.
Marc:And why would he have a problem?
Marc:In fact, he came into the house.
Marc:He got his buddy with him.
Marc:It's like 6, 630 at night.
Marc:I say hi.
Marc:I walk up to him.
Marc:I shake his hand.
Marc:He's a very large man, tall.
Marc:And I smelled a familiar smell of just sort of a being saturated with alcohol.
Marc:I know the smell.
Marc:And then it took me a while to realize, because I don't think this is a negative preface.
Marc:People know that Marilyn Manson likes to live the life.
Marc:And it took me a while to realize that I think maybe the way he coveted his water bottle in here, and then when he took it with him when he left, it was a Fiji water bottle that he was drinking slowly.
Marc:Uh, that, you know, when, when we left the garage, it was, it probably had about a quarter left in it and he hung onto it.
Marc:And I think that if, if you listen, you know, as the conversation goes on, you can, you can feel it a little bit.
Marc:You, you can feel the, he's getting a little, little loopy as a, as I like to call it.
Marc:And, uh, but you know, it's cool.
Marc:You know, this garage is safe.
Marc:It's a safe space.
Marc:If you want to have a cocktail, I've had people come over here with cases of beer, with weed, with cigarettes, with a little booze in a water bottle.
Marc:Whatever you need to get through, man.
Marc:Who am I to judge?
Marc:Right?
Marc:So Marilyn Manson...
Marc:His new album is Heaven Upside Down.
Marc:It's available now.
Marc:And although he had to cancel some of the early dates on his tour, we were told by his reps this week that he's recuperating at home in L.A.
Marc:and he's on the mend.
Marc:So there you go.
Marc:So this is me and Marilyn Manson in parentheses, Brian Warner.
Marc:Okay?
Marc:It was fun.
Marc:It was fun.
Guest:My guitar is called Excalibur.
Guest:I bought my guitar in New Orleans at a pawn shop right next door to where I recorded Antichrist Superstar 1995-ish.
Guest:And it's an old Ibanez.
Guest:It's sort of, I think it used to be white, but it's yellowed with age, but it weighs heavier than most girls that I've had fornication with.
Guest:No, it's really heavy.
Guest:I mean, it's like 90 pounds heavy.
Marc:Which I mean, is it like a Les Paul copy or is it a double cutaway?
Guest:No, it's like a Les Paul copy, but it's a 70s one.
Guest:Yeah, sure, sure.
Guest:But it wrote a lot of great songs, but it wrote Beautiful People, Dope Show.
Marc:Those are great songs.
Marc:Big hits, man.
Guest:Big hits.
Guest:I'm not saying that the guitar wrote them.
Guest:I'm saying that the guitar might have been used while writing them.
Marc:Well, so it was part of it.
Guest:Yes, the guitar is part of it.
Marc:So, and you bought it in New Orleans.
Guest:For 400 bucks.
Guest:It was a lot of money then.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:But everything has a ritualistic kind of status, you know, because it's just the way you set it up.
Marc:Well, no, it has a... Yeah, you bought it in New Orleans, 400 bucks.
Guest:It's like a totem.
Marc:It's like a totem.
Marc:But like some guys have it.
Marc:Like someone told me the other night, who was I talking to Randy Newman's son.
Marc:He said that Bob Dylan gave Neil Young Hank Williams guitar.
Marc:That's important.
Marc:That's got to be a magic guitar, right?
Guest:And I'm friends with Shooter Jennings, which is not related to Hank Williams.
Marc:No, but it's the legacy.
Guest:But no, it's the legacy.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And I think that what we were talking about earlier about Keith, who I've never formally met.
Guest:Are you a fan?
Guest:Of course.
Guest:Especially of him.
Guest:You have to be, right?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I've met Mick many times.
Marc:But Keith is like one of the original dark guys.
Marc:Keith is dark.
Guest:Yeah, he's darkness.
Guest:He's one of the prince of darkness.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:i just remember uh i remember he has a weird tuning that he removes one string from his guitar five string guitar yeah it's amazing open d or g or something yeah yeah so i think that that i called it excalibur yeah because it you know i'm not traditionally a guitar player in fact if you want to know my exact tuning yeah it's e b e b b e
Guest:so it's almost open tuning but I like to play with an open E yeah Billy Corgan taught me that tuning he did so I learned how to play that tuning sort of I believe at some point I had a guild guitar which was not Excalibur but it was a guild but I cracked it yeah I cracked the neck on it so it happens
Marc:So you do kind of an open E-ish tuning.
Marc:So Billy gave you that tuning so you could just play with your one finger?
Guest:Mostly, yeah, because you need all the other fingers for doing the middle fingers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I actually sing with my left hand.
Guest:I'm right-handed.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You want to know why?
Guest:Why?
Guest:Because I just have to catch bottles being thrown at me.
Guest:That's true.
Marc:You had to have your right hand active.
Guest:I still have the dexterity to keep track of not being hit by bottles.
Guest:Are they still being thrown at you?
Guest:Every now and then.
Guest:Someone bit me on the dick at my last show.
Guest:What was your dick doing at him?
Guest:I went into the... Oh, I guess I don't know what you were wearing.
Guest:No, it was not out.
Guest:Okay, all right.
Guest:No, it was in like a freestyle dick body.
Marc:It was a dick in pant.
Guest:Dick in leotard.
Guest:Dick in pant.
Guest:Or whatever.
Guest:No leotard.
Marc:I don't know.
Guest:Okay, fair enough.
Guest:These pants, these exact same pants.
Guest:I haven't changed them since then.
Marc:You've gone through a lot of things.
Guest:I can change a lot of things, but not my pants.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:All right.
Guest:No, I jumped into the barricade.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was singing to the crowd.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I remember what city it was.
Guest:I think it might have been somewhere in upper Eastern Europe, maybe the Kievs or the Russians.
Guest:The Balkans.
Guest:Somewhere far up.
Guest:This is recently?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:This is a month ago.
Guest:And someone bit hard onto where my dick is.
Guest:They didn't get the dick, but they got the part of the pant where the dick belongs.
Guest:They were intending.
Guest:But my dick ducked.
Guest:It swerved like a matrix dick.
Guest:But they wouldn't let go.
Guest:And I had to point my microphone at them because my microphone actually is a knuckle duster.
Guest:oh yeah a real one like uh brass knuckles yeah kind of situation we're not allowed to tell anyone that it's really brass knuckles but it is really brass knuckles so i just had to point it at the girl biting my dick pant it was a girl yeah but i but she had glasses on my mother god rest her soul always said don't hit a girl with glasses i'm glad you saw a line saved her that was what saved her
Guest:You could have handled a diplomatic.
Guest:You weren't going to hit her either way.
Guest:No, but if she would have got foreskin, I would have really got upset.
Marc:Maybe you would have reacted.
Guest:It would have hurt one of us.
Guest:Someone would have walked out of there in pain.
Guest:What are you wearing up there now?
Guest:What's your current getup?
Guest:Well, I coincidentally had to leave a fitting for my clothing just to come all the way down here to your garage to do this.
Marc:Oh, thank you.
Marc:I appreciate that.
Guest:You're welcome.
Marc:What is the fitting for the new adventure?
Guest:Well, I consider it somewhere between Cramps and Alice Cooper and Ziggy Stardust.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it's Marilyn Manson attire.
Guest:But then, but the apocalypse and apocalypse now joining it.
Guest:Oh, some Vietnam.
Guest:So Martin Sheen.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:And then you get a little bit of, remember Lawrence Fishburne when he was 17 in that movie?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's great.
Guest:He gets shot with an arrow.
Yeah.
Guest:No, that was the other guy.
Guest:He got a spear.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Vince Furren got shot.
Guest:He just got regular shot.
Guest:Yeah, regular shot.
Guest:I really liked, it's strange, the last time I saw my father in Los Angeles because he died recently in Ohio, Canton, Ohio.
Guest:Is that where you're from?
Guest:Yeah, he died in the hospital I was born in, and he was born in Canton, Ohio recently.
Guest:So I dedicated this record to him, but I won't want to be morose about it because my father would not like that.
Guest:What kind of dude was he?
Guest:He was the guy who used to say, since I was in fifth grade, I can't look back until now and think that I went in a time machine and said, Dad, I'm only 12, and you're saying to my friends in Christian school, have you ever sucked a sweeter dick than mine?
Guest:And his whole joke about that was, well, you still sucked a dick either way.
Guest:That was his whole joke that he thought was funny.
Guest:And at the time, I just was like, dad, stop saying that.
Guest:But now it's really hilarious because he was saying that to middle school kids.
Guest:What was his job?
Guest:My dad was, well, he was in Vietnam.
Guest:I think he was part of some sort of CIA black ops doing napalm and Agent Orange.
Guest:He definitely sprayed Agent Orange, but I don't know.
Guest:Was he a pilot?
Guest:He was a helicopter mechanic.
Guest:No kidding.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So he came back all right?
Guest:Well, I'm not really sure how he was before that because I was a boy.
Guest:He came back and then made me with his own personal semen.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Good.
Guest:Out of his own.
Guest:Old style.
Guest:Old school.
Guest:Family style.
Marc:But you didn't get a sense that it haunted him somehow or anything like that?
Guest:He never talked to me about it until about two years ago.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he said, as I was actually watching Apocalypse Now, and I had it freeze-framed on my wall, because I have a projector on my wall that I like to watch movies on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he drove cross-country from Ohio in a... To see the movie?
Guest:...disgusting yellow Corvette.
Guest:And I said, Dad, stop flaunting my wealth with such an ugly car, like a chiclet.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was kind of pissed at just the color of the car.
Guest:But he said he was coming to visit me.
Guest:You bought it for him?
Guest:You just gave him?
Guest:He bought it on his own without telling me, essentially.
Guest:So yes, I bought it for him.
Guest:But I don't regret that.
Guest:I just regret the color of it.
Guest:Was it an old one?
Guest:no it was brand new yellow horribly new it would be something that you would want to fight the person that drove it yeah so i made him put a car cover over it in front of my house because i didn't want anyone trying to fight me because of his car but so you're watching apocalypse now
Guest:yeah i had it freeze-framed and he said it was the most accurate portrayal of vietnam and my entire life he had always said he had never drank or done drugs ever yeah and that day and this is about three years ago yeah and he's he just started telling me things he had never said and he wasn't saying the sarcastic apple and tree falling far from each other type of way because i always divert to sarcasm when i'm
Guest:in a situation where it's too emotional right i'll say something funny right or what i think is funny yeah or inappropriate but he started saying to me uh that it was his job to basically kill women and children and he got good at it and he was supposed to because it was his job and it was really tough and
Guest:to come home from that, and not in a PTSD way, in a way that, how do you replace that part of you?
Guest:And I was trying to relate to it in some way, and I really couldn't.
Guest:And then he said to me, it's probably just the same as you when you come off stage, son.
Yeah.
Guest:And that was really a weird comparison, but I guess that was the way he looked at it, and that was a strange thing to say to me.
Marc:Well, maybe he was talking about that zone you enter with all that cortisol and dopamine.
Guest:Well, it's your job, and you're supposed to do what you do.
Guest:Of course, the difference between me onstage and off is onstage I'm speaking to people I've never met.
Guest:Offstage I'm talking to people that...
Guest:I just met just now with you or people that I know.
Marc:And you're performing for hundreds of thousands of people.
Guest:And you're seducing people as a rock star.
Guest:But there's no way I don't think that that compares to what he did.
Guest:But in some way, he related the two.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was unusual.
Guest:It's unusual.
Guest:Words of advice.
Marc:Do you find that, like, you know, that his... So you weren't brought up with religion?
Marc:No.
Guest:I grew up in Christian school, but my parents were not actually religious.
Guest:What did your mom do?
Guest:Well, let me start with my father, before he went to Vietnam, was studying to be a Jesuit priest.
Guest:So they were Catholics.
Guest:yeah my mother was episcopalian and she was a hillbilly from the appalachian mountains yeah so that's a sioux indian part of me so i got half you know rain dance of me you think so oh yeah yeah i make it rain make it stop rain i've made it rain before yeah and i don't mean like in a strip art way you mean like no i believe in you know indian magic okay but um
Guest:My father was always really secretive about his past.
Guest:But, I mean, his side of the family was Polish.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, came from immigrants.
Guest:You don't have to hide that.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:Not that part.
Guest:No, no, he didn't hide it.
Guest:But he was Catholic part.
Guest:So they sent me to Christian school so I would get a good education.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:not catholic school christian school right because my dad got the you had the ruler that's like yeah nuns with the rule but my grandmother his mother yeah used to make me kneel on a broomstick if i ever cursed in her house have you ever knelt on a broomstick oh with your knees on it yeah oh that fucking hurts that's worse than the rice under the knees where do you even learn that catholic school i guess huh but no it's really painful yeah it gives you bad knees yeah because i cursed a lot yeah
Marc:So it really fucked you up.
Guest:So I was not Catholic growing up.
Guest:I went to a Christian school.
Guest:Which is... It was non-denominational and it was weird.
Marc:So was it based on just that vague kind of starry-eyed Jesus?
Marc:Like Catholic, you get a lot of other things going on.
Marc:You got outfits.
Marc:Yeah, you got costumes.
Guest:Thousands of years of history.
Guest:Which relates to my new video, which I was going to try to show you.
Guest:I was showing you.
Guest:You showed me stills of it.
Guest:Nuns with guns.
Guest:But I think that I didn't even come up with the idea as much as a guy that Bill, who traveled with me, he traveled with me during the era of Antichrist Superstar.
Guest:He was on tour with me and he had to be in the thick of it.
Guest:So it was almost like being in warfare because we had so many death threats.
Guest:And I can't not anticipate trouble from this, but I just thought it was a time, rather than talk about politics, just to divert the attention to talking about things that are more interesting or pointing things in a different direction.
Marc:But don't you like doing that?
Marc:I mean, aren't you hoping that'll...
Guest:I love when there's a shitty president because it makes me seem like the smartest person in America when I go to Europe.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's very easy.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But don't you like provoking?
Marc:I mean, especially now, like this weird, now this attempt to meld the Christian right with the nationalistic right.
Marc:There's plenty of crossover, but now there's more of a concerted effort to make it really happen.
Marc:That's a good block to piss off for you, right?
Guest:Well, it seems.
Guest:It seems not unlike when I put out Antichrist Superstar because I was making fun of the Christian right and the fascist element of America.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Who was so busy when I was growing up in school condemning, you know.
Guest:I really feel, and this is not condoning any sort of ism, I just feel like they always focused on one of the others.
Guest:You've got communism, you've got Nazism, but what about Americanism?
Guest:What happened to that?
Guest:If anyone's National Socialist, it would be America for the most part.
Guest:so i tried to make that into a statement that was partly religious pointed yeah partly political and partly rock star and that's where i started and i knew i was called a shock rocker so i put a lightning bolt like bowie did but i actually trademarked the lightning bolt that you get on the back of your toaster or whatever it might be yeah no one ever thought to do that and i trademarked it yes sir i did
Marc:So, let me ask you this, because I was poking around doing research, an Antichrist superstar and Revelation 12.
Marc:Do you know that's supposed to happen this month?
Guest:Well, yes, I do.
Guest:You do?
Guest:But that would be Revelations 12.
Guest:Revelations 12, yeah.
Guest:But I did a small nod to the Beatles with Revolution number 9.
Guest:On the new record?
Guest:Revelation.
Guest:Number 12.
Guest:12.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah, so I didn't put the S on it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And also I wanted to reclaim the pound sign on the phone.
Guest:It's not being a hashtag.
Guest:Because I was sick of people calling it a hashtag.
Guest:It will always be a pound sign on your phone.
Guest:You'll never have a phone or it's not a pound sign.
Guest:Except some strange future.
Guest:But yes, I did know that.
Guest:But...
Guest:And people say, oh, the world's coming to an end.
Guest:But they said that in 1984, that's when I started to be disenfranchised entirely with religion in Christian school.
Guest:How old were you?
Guest:I don't want to do the math there, but I'm going to guess it's like... I was born in 1969, the best year to be born in.
Guest:Yeah, so right, 15, 15.
Guest:Okay, so I was 15.
Guest:I had that number tattoo behind my ear because that seems to be like... 84 or 15?
Guest:No, 15.
Guest:You do?
Guest:That's the year I lost my virginity.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I got crabs.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:From the first time?
Guest:Yeah, because you would think, who has crabs at age 15?
Guest:And of course, it's the girl I lose my virginity to because my father scared me into it, said, if you don't lose your virginity by the time you're 18, I'm going to buy you a prostitute.
Guest:So therefore, I have a fear of prostitutes and of girls with pubic hair now.
Guest:But you didn't have to go to a prostitute.
Guest:No, I unfortunately found a cheerleader from Louisville.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Louisville?
Guest:It's Canton, Ohio adjacent.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Louisville.
Guest:Is it Louisville or Louisville?
Guest:Louisville.
Guest:In Canton, it's Louisville.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Because I have three different brands of redneck.
Guest:I grew up in Ohio.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Then I moved to Florida, which is like the bottom dick end of insect world history.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Redneck.
Marc:I can see where it all comes, how that informed you.
Guest:The Florida experience.
Guest:Then I did thrive up the dick of Florida.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And somehow ended up in New Orleans.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Which is a place that's, I wouldn't even say, I can't use the barometer of good and evil.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's a sinister place.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's got its own vibe, that's for sure.
Guest:It's sinister.
Guest:I'll tell you that.
Guest:I don't know about good and evil, but it's a place I wouldn't, you know.
Guest:I often say this is a joke about myself.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's a great place to visit.
Guest:I'm a great place to visit, but you don't want to live here.
Guest:Yeah, I've heard that about myself as well.
Guest:But New Orleans, I live there, and it has darkness that has stuck with me.
Guest:Deep and old darkness.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:something something that goes back to Robert Johnson days you know it's old school blues days uh-huh I felt that there the last time I was there you definitely feel like first you feel like well this is a unique place there's no place like New Orleans and then you feel like something's up here
Guest:When it comes to evil shit, I think that people can accept my opinion saying that there's something very unexplainably sinister in New Orleans.
Marc:Sinister, dark, mysterious, but... Unexplainable.
Marc:Unexplainable.
Marc:That's a better word.
Marc:Evil, I mean, evil, that word used in a non-romantic way, like, I don't think you're evil, right?
Guest:You.
Guest:I like that you said romantic.
Guest:That's true, because I consider myself a romantic person.
Marc:Yeah, but you know what evil is.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I know what good is.
Guest:I mean, in the natural moral barometer.
Marc:When you drop bombs, when you kill.
Guest:Ethics and morals.
Marc:Yeah, sure.
Guest:Got you.
Marc:Continue.
Marc:But I'm just saying that when I think about darkness or I think about mystery or I think about some witchy shit, it's not necessarily evil.
Marc:It's just sort of like, what's going on?
Guest:Right?
Guest:Fair enough, yeah.
Guest:But I mean, this was... No, I tend to swerve on the witchy side.
Guest:Yeah, I feel that.
Guest:On the Altamont side versus the Woodstock side of 69.
Guest:On the Manson side versus the...
Guest:the other side.
Marc:I know.
Guest:I spent some time there.
Guest:But I don't, I consider myself to have someone with, I consider myself to be someone with a moral compass where if I love somebody, I love something, I have a very limited family now that my parents are both gone.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it's not something I'm going to, you know, complain about.
Guest:That's part of life.
Guest:It's a circle of life.
Guest:It's a snake eating some tail type of thing.
Guest:Correct, sir.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And I feel like my father would want me to put good energy into moving forward.
Guest:Now, what I do might not be considered good by everyone else, but as far as good and evil, I do believe that you should care about the people you love and protect them with everything you can.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And not try to hurt other people unless you have to do it for a reason.
Guest:That is to protect what you love.
Guest:Your dick.
Guest:Unless they're biting your dick.
Guest:But I didn't hurt that person.
Marc:She didn't get through the dick.
Marc:She didn't get through the dick.
Marc:So like when you started doing this schtick.
Guest:You said to me schtick.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I heard you say it to Alice Cooper too.
Guest:You listen to that one?
Guest:Yeah, I love Alice, man.
Guest:He's so cool to me because at first I thought he hated me because of being Christian and sober and things, and me representing a lot of things that weren't that.
Guest:In real life?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:What other life is there?
Marc:No, I mean, like, it would be hard for him to, you don't separate, which is, I think.
Marc:I don't separate.
Marc:Which is probably why he had a problem, or you thought he had a problem.
Guest:Well, I thought he had a problem.
Guest:And, you know, so when I got to meet him, he was such a, we had so much fun on tour together.
Guest:We did a song together that's going to be on the next Hollywood Vampires record.
Guest:It's called Alice Versus the Bottle, and I play the bottle.
Marc:See, that's proactive.
Guest:Yeah, it's almost like yogurt.
Guest:How so?
Guest:It's proactive.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:My culture.
Guest:Probiotic.
Guest:My culture.
Guest:Proactive would actually be acne medicine.
Guest:Sure.
Marc:But no, but I mean, it's nice.
Marc:You guys are playing the yin and the yang of who you are.
Marc:She was saying shtick.
Marc:Oh, shtick.
Marc:So, well, yeah.
Marc:Well, I think that Alice, if we're talking about Alice, who obviously had some...
Guest:inspired you somehow at some point great influence huge influence of course but he differentiates i mean he you know he like there's there's the guy on stage and then there's a guy playing golf really well when i was a kid it wasn't that way and it was never that way with bowie or anyone that i grew up listening to even kiss which i think without saying something uh bad about anything with kiss i
Guest:I was really disappointed one day because my father took me to my first concert, which was Dynasty Tour of Kiss, which a lot of people frown upon.
Marc:Was it a later one?
Guest:It was I Was Made for Loving You.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:It was good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My father was dressed like Gene Simmons, and people were asking him for his autograph.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:So it was exciting.
Guest:So your dad was a character.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, he was a total character.
Guest:I mean, he was... You guys, you got along.
Marc:You looked up to the guy.
Guest:Wasn't a problem.
Guest:He looked a lot like me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's how you used to talk.
Marc:But he sounds like he knew how to have a good time, bust balls, get dressed up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And when I met Gene Simmons later, he was...
Guest:It was not, I wouldn't say a letdown.
Guest:It was just a little different than when I got to meet Bowie or I got to meet Alice Cooper.
Guest:Those are great events in my life.
Guest:And I'm not going to say Gene Simmons was a letdown, but I'm just going to say that Bowie.
Guest:You were surprised that he was an obnoxious, loud Jewish man?
Guest:No, I just meant that he was wearing a denim Looney Tunes shirt.
Guest:That's all.
Guest:I'm just saying that was really supporting.
Guest:That's what did it.
Guest:And he had black cotton candy for her.
Guest:It was just weird.
Guest:and he didn't have his makeup on no the makeup didn't matter yeah that didn't matter you know with me like i'm not wearing lipstick right now people have always asked me what do you look like without your makeup i'm looking at you right now yeah it's like what do you look like without your mustache yeah i hear you you know i got eyeliner on because i slept in it last night and you don't and you don't have eyebrows no i shave my eyebrows right for fun because i know it just it looks it looks more interesting no definitely it has an impact
Guest:No, I just mean I just don't like eyebrows.
Marc:I mean, I have really beautiful eyebrows when they're... No, but for me, like looking at you, I'm like, well, look, he's pretty... He doesn't have... I can't... He's got a little eyeliner on, no lipstick, and his eyebrows are gone.
Marc:I can't be lowbrow or highbrow.
Marc:It's no brow.
Marc:It's no brow.
Marc:You transcend beyond good and evil.
Marc:I'm not Nietzsche.
Marc:You're not?
Marc:No.
Marc:I think he's just a thinker.
Marc:That's all.
Marc:He's a thinker.
Guest:Some guy that wrote things down.
Guest:A little man.
Marc:He's just a little man who wrote things down in a fury at times.
Marc:But so did you find Gene dismissive?
Marc:What was it like meeting Bowie?
Marc:No, no.
Marc:That was... I can't even imagine it.
Guest:what year when was that it was on the last tour that he did um before he well it was the last tour that i saw him they did before he died i didn't really get to meet him before that and it was backstage in santa barbara and he was uh somehow laura flynn boyle who's now become a really scary person if you ever look her up because yeah as you could see i love twin peaks yeah
Guest:But Laura Flynn Boyle was somehow trying to squeeze her way into the shot.
Guest:And it was the first time meeting Bowie.
Guest:It's very weird backstage at these big rock shows in this area.
Guest:But for me, I just remember he grabbed my tie and he said, Hedy Slimane.
Guest:What did he say, what?
Guest:No, he grabbed my tie and said, oh, Hedy Slimane.
Guest:Because he knew the design of the tie.
Guest:And I was all excited and I felt like I was going to pee in my pants like that little girl.
Guest:And then Laura Flynn Boyle came in and ruined it.
Guest:Started yelling about cocaine and toilets and I don't know what else.
Guest:What do you mean?
Guest:Was she in just a weird fit of some kind?
Guest:I have no idea.
Guest:Just Google her face.
Guest:Was she acting crazy?
Guest:Just Google her face.
Guest:I'll do it later.
Guest:When you Google it, it'll answer your questions.
Guest:Google it right now.
Guest:Have you ever met that woman that's got the tiger surgery turned tiger face?
Marc:I feel like I know where you're going.
Marc:I'm going to need it.
Guest:It's scary.
Guest:But I felt like she was on the brink of becoming scary.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And when I met her, she was really overwhelming.
Guest:And it was fucking with my Bowie moment.
Guest:I was like having my Bowie moment.
Guest:She fucked with it.
Guest:Okay, I see.
Guest:And I wanted her to be a Boyle, and I wanted to pop it, lance it.
Guest:And that was all you got?
Guest:Just a tie moment?
Guest:Yeah, just that moment.
Guest:And I said, Bowie, I said, I didn't say Bowie.
Guest:I just said, hey, can I ask you one question?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:What's she doing here?
Guest:No, no, that would have been a good question.
Guest:And I said, so when you decided to stop doing drugs and things like that, how did that work for you?
Guest:How did you work that out?
Guest:He said, I just got bored of it.
Guest:I thought that was interesting because I had just broken out of rehab at Promises.
Guest:I think Sherilyn Finn was, no, not Sherilyn Finn, Laura Flynn Boyle.
Guest:It's so many Lins.
Guest:Three-name people are dangerous.
Guest:It's tricky.
Guest:Lee Harvey Oswald.
Guest:John Wayne Gacy.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Mark David Chapman.
Guest:Henry Lucas.
Guest:Lou Diamond Phillips.
Marc:Terrifying.
Guest:Edward James Almost.
Guest:You want to go four-namers?
Guest:J.R.R.
Guest:Tolkien.
Guest:I don't even know why he's got four.
Guest:I don't know what the R's are.
Guest:I don't know what the J's for.
Guest:J.J.
Guest:Abrams.
Guest:Who knows?
Guest:We could go on forever with this.
Guest:You want to play this game?
Marc:No, I don't think so.
Guest:It's a terrible game.
Marc:So have you gotten bored with drugs and booze?
Guest:I found a different balance with it.
Guest:I didn't get bored with it.
Guest:I just found out very simply, don't drink and do drugs when you're by yourself or you're unhappy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I never knew the difference between a party and a problem.
Marc:Oh, that sounds like a slogan.
Guest:Sounds like a song, but it's too obvious, I think.
Marc:Did you just come up with that?
Marc:Or did you see that on a car coming over here?
Guest:No, I didn't see that on a car coming over here.
Guest:It's the advice I give to youngsters when I go do youth care.
Guest:Give it to me again.
Guest:I go youth care.
Guest:I don't know the difference between a party and a problem.
Guest:Because when people say, let's party, I'm like, I don't know what that means.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because it doesn't seem fun.
Guest:It seems like we're all getting shit hammered, and then there's going to be a bunch of gay dudes naked in my pool.
Guest:And then suddenly... TMZ is here.
Guest:No, no, it's pre-TMZ.
Yeah.
Marc:This is a specific event that's recurring.
Guest:This is in 1998.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:Now there's going to be naked dudes in my pool.
Guest:And then what's the girl that was in bong water?
Guest:Ann Magnusson.
Guest:Ann Magnusson's suddenly taken off her bikini in my bedroom naked.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Ann mad at me because I don't have sex to her.
Guest:And then writes a song about it for bong water.
Guest:Look it up.
Guest:Google it.
Guest:What song?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:Marilyn Manson didn't fuck me.
Guest:I think it's called.
Guest:No, I honestly think it's called Marilyn Manson Did Not Fuck Me.
Guest:I'm not sure, but she did write a song about me not fucking me.
Guest:I like Bung Water.
Guest:I like Dan Magnuson because I interviewed her when I was 19 years old in New York City.
Guest:For what?
Guest:When I was a journalist.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:For the fucking fun of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because she was around and had a pen.
Guest:I would just lie because I thought she was hot.
Guest:She was hot when she took her clothes off in my bedroom.
Guest:So what went wrong?
Guest:I was scared because there was naked guys doing weird chicken fights in my pool.
Guest:So you're concerned about your property?
Guest:No.
Guest:Well, I didn't think that I would come into contact.
Guest:I'm still, in a sense, the same kid that I was when I meet people.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I'm still in awe of them.
Guest:I don't get jaded.
Guest:I don't think I'm better than someone else.
Guest:I like that second Bong Water record.
Guest:I don't remember listening to the record, second one, because I don't have a record player or a CD player.
Guest:It's way back in the day.
Guest:So you're the same kid.
Marc:You got shy.
Guest:You got scared.
Guest:No, I'm still shy.
Guest:No, I still am.
Marc:And you didn't fuck her.
Marc:And she stood there naked.
Guest:She didn't stand there naked so much.
Guest:I'm just saying that she was... I think that she was putting...
Guest:provocative moves towards me, let's say.
Guest:And she wrote a song about it, which I didn't listen to yet, but she told me later when she saw me, and I think that she was kind of mad at me, but it was not because of anything other than fear of being in front of someone that you met when you were 19 and being scared that, well, I don't know what I'm supposed to do with this.
Guest:How did I manage to work my way into this situation where I can...
Marc:Have sex with Ann Magnuson, who I thought was hot when I was 19.
Marc:I was just a nerdy journalist kid.
Marc:And why are those guys outside?
Marc:Naked playing chicken fights.
Guest:I have pictures of the naked chicken fights, too.
Guest:On your phone or just at home?
Guest:No, no, this is old school.
Guest:Cameras, the clicking kind, they go...
Marc:So walk me through the life then.
Marc:So you grew up in Ohio and Florida.
Marc:What was the thing that ruined you?
Marc:Was it Florida?
Marc:You were heading towards journalism and then something went horribly different.
Marc:No, I was in Ohio.
Guest:I just... Great.
Guest:That sounds terrible.
Guest:That's great.
Guest:I haven't eaten because you starved me to death.
Marc:I did not starve anybody.
Guest:I know, I'm just kidding.
Marc:I have some potatoes.
Guest:There's people starving in my stomach right now.
Marc:What about the fitting?
Marc:They didn't give you a nice layout of shit?
Guest:No, they made me shit to do the fitting.
Guest:The shitting.
Guest:It's called the shitting.
Guest:Okay, so in Ohio... Yeah.
Guest:I was just getting ready to, you know, I was really upset.
Guest:I've only gotten one real fight in my life.
Guest:I've gotten my ass kicked a couple times.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:It's not a fight when you just get your ass kicked.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I got my ass kicked by Nazi skinheads and straight-head skinheads because the Nazi skinheads thought that I was Jewish, and the straight-head skinheads thought that I was on drugs, and I neither, neither, neither, at the time.
Guest:Now you are Jewish and on drugs.
Guest:Later, I became Jewish on drugs out of our mitzvah just recently.
Guest:no but they beat the shammy yeah however the only fight i ever got in was in creative writing class uh-huh in heritage christian school yeah in canton ohio yeah in eighth grade yeah and some kid criticized my poem and i brained him right in the nose yeah and gave him a bloody nose he didn't get back up but i stood up for my poetry there you go that sounds a bit
Guest:You've done it before.
Guest:It's a little bit light in the loafers, so to speak.
Guest:No, you're an artist.
Guest:But I put my hand into a broken nose.
Guest:So you can, you know, what I'm saying is don't meddle with poets.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:People that are florists.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Or, you know, guys that wear shorts or they're cut off so small that you can see the pockets hanging out.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because you will get punched.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:You come with that.
Guest:If you have the bravery to do those things.
Guest:To do any of those things.
Guest:Then you pack a wallop.
Guest:so that was the first that was in florida then i got i mean in ohio in ohio and i get kicked out of christian school for what i'll make a brief i put a dildo in the bible teacher's desk that i found in my father's father's uh basement my grandfather yeah was apparently a cross-dressing dildo handler yeah i mean i wrote about it so you kind of you come from it
Marc:It's great.
Guest:There's an explanation for my behavior.
Guest:But I just thought this bitch, Mrs. Price, to name her by name, Mrs. Price, if you're listening, you're a bitch.
Guest:So she was really bitchy because she would say this.
Guest:It was almost like telling a racist joke.
Guest:She would say, is there anyone Catholic or Jewish in the room during Bible class, which was every day, where I had to memorize Galatians, Ecclesiastes.
Guest:I know them all.
Guest:Don't worry.
Guest:Revelations.
Guest:That's why you asked.
Guest:I know it.
Guest:She started to stay by saying that.
Guest:And then if no one said no, then she would start shit-talking all the other religions.
Guest:So I just found I didn't want to be at Christian school anymore.
Guest:I did not realize that when I got kicked out of Christian school by putting a dildo that I found at my grandfather's house covered in greasy, unknown circumstances that I don't even want to think about, but now I can think about it and it's kind of good that I wore gloves.
Guest:you wore gloves to carry not to keep fingerprints off your grandpa's dildo because it was swimy it was somewhere inappropriate sure i put it in her desk i got kicked out and i went to christian school i mean i left christian school and i went to public school yeah same bus stop yeah ass whooping oh yeah so cyberbullying can take suck a dick because i got my ass kicked the old-fashioned way at the bus stop yeah
Guest:If you don't want to get cyber-bullied, just close your computer off.
Guest:I got my ass beat old-fashioned style at the bus stop.
Guest:By Christian?
Guest:No, by people that were like, oh, he thinks he's cool, better than us.
Guest:But my parents were not religious.
Guest:So then I went to public school, got my ass beat a lot.
Guest:I learned to play it.
Guest:I was in the band.
Guest:Playing what?
Guest:Well, this is where it goes south, I mean.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:The Triangle.
Guest:No.
Guest:No, I took drum lessons.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I found my W. Haskell Hart.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So drums, by nature, rhythm is something that's a big part of me.
Marc:Most of your music's got good swing, got good pop to it.
Marc:It's not like crazy metal drumming.
Marc:It's rock.
Marc:It's good.
Guest:It doesn't confuse strippers.
Guest:It doesn't confuse strippers.
Crack, crack, crack.
Guest:yeah i told dave lombardo yeah i told josh homie yeah don't make beats of confused strippers it's not fair it's not nice and i don't like it i was gonna keep tapping that foot working that pole tapping that foot working that pole yeah so i went to no but that's really what i got stuck with i i knew how to play snare drum but i didn't want to be in marching band so i got stuck playing the triangle and
Guest:Now, if you want to pick an instrument to get your ass beat with, it's a triangle.
Guest:So you're telling me you got your ass beat again?
Guest:Yeah, double ass beat.
Marc:By the band guys or just by other guys?
Guest:The band girl guys frowned upon me.
Guest:For the triangle playing?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:That's where I became involved with some weird burnouts.
Guest:I started selling my mother's diet pills, as they call them.
Guest:good kind as speed yeah to uh the burnouts so you're trying to get in like yeah i was wearing a denim jacket yeah going to juice priest concerts iron maiden concerts you were going i went yeah screaming for vengeance peace of mind i was in the beginning yeah old school
Guest:and that was your shit that was my shit oh good and then so I had to sell speed to become cool but it was my mother's diet pills wasn't even real speed it was my mom's piss pills whatever but they bought it anyways so I became cool guy enough to get survive through high school yeah and as soon as I became cool we had to move to Florida we moved to Florida tough break and then I started reading Stephen King yeah the it yeah I'm calling it the it cause it's the shit
Guest:yeah i love the book yeah i wanted to be a fiction writer oh got it so then somehow i decide i'm gonna go to community college in florida in florida broward community college bcc yeah there you go yeah
Guest:represent still not have done drugs still not being a drunkard still not having a band nothing nothing just like i don't know what i don't want to do yet so i went to i took two classes that was excelled in yeah that i was excited about yeah journalism and theater because i had a great fear of speaking in public yeah
Guest:And I'm not afraid of this.
Guest:I started Open Mic Poetry Night.
Guest:Did you?
Guest:Yeah, I'm going to say it again.
Guest:Open Mic Poetry Night.
Guest:In Florida.
Marc:You have three names, I just realized.
Marc:Everyone has three names, but you don't use them all.
Marc:You don't use any of them.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Do people call you Brian?
Guest:Some people do.
Guest:I don't really care what people call me.
Guest:It's just really a word.
Guest:I mean, usually, I haven't called you.
Guest:I have not called you by your name, but we do have the same initials.
Guest:Oh, right, Marilyn Manson.
Marc:Well, yeah, technically.
Marc:So the Poetry Night, that was being run by Brian Warner.
Guest:I started that as Brian Warner, and someone said, oh, you should start a band.
Guest:And I was just doing what became the songs on my first record.
Marc:So you were doing sort of slam style, loud poetry?
Marc:You weren't reading passively?
Guest:I made Poetry Night Up, and it seems sort of an odd thing to say.
Guest:It seems kind of a bit sissy thing to say.
Guest:But actually, it was cool at the time because no one else did it.
Guest:There was no one else doing it.
Guest:It was just me.
Guest:I would just go on stage, and I would read poems.
Guest:no one else did oh you didn't host it or anything no no no it was just me where'd you do it at at a place called squeeze nightclub which has since burned to the ground oh yeah so then suddenly then were you in a costume then no just you no i had started to dye my hair black at that point because my mother thought my mother's favorites were alice cooper and alice presley not in that order i was first oh she liked alice yes
Marc:He's got some good songs, man.
Guest:Yeah, 18.
Guest:18?
Guest:And you know what?
Guest:Ballad of Dwight Frye.
Marc:How about I'll Never Cry, dude?
Guest:I'll never cry.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:I heard you talk about that.
Guest:And Only Women Bleed, which is an inexplicable song because I remember seeing that on Solid Gold.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it just segues suddenly into the chorus with no explanation.
Yeah.
Guest:Only women bleed.
Guest:No, no, but it just goes out from, he stays out all night.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Doesn't go, hit you sometimes once in a while.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Only women bleed.
Guest:And that's it.
Guest:It just goes right into it.
Guest:It's no segue, no tampon commercial, but it would have been a great tampon commercial.
Guest:It really would have been.
Guest:I said that to Alex before.
Guest:And what did he say?
Guest:He said it was once.
Marc:He did?
Guest:Yeah, I guess it was once.
Guest:Well, he said it was.
Marc:All right, so, okay, so now you're dying your hair black, your mom likes Elvis Presley and Alice Cooper, you're doing these poems, and someone says you should be in a band, and you're like, I only play triangle.
Guest:I didn't say that, but yes.
Guest:No, I think the first two things I stole from the Canton Library before I moved to Florida were Doors' Greatest Hits cassette and Aerosmith's Greatest Hits cassette.
Marc:Five to one, baby.
Guest:One and five.
Guest:One and five, yeah.
Guest:So that's what I kind of learned to sing, too.
Marc:That makes sense, man.
Marc:That Live Doors record is a fucking great record.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And did you say the first Aerosmith record?
Guest:Well, no, the greatest hits one.
Guest:And I know...
Guest:oh so but at that time it was only those first four or five records right it was the first grade it was the red one yeah the white cover with uh which had it had uh come together which was in the sergeant pepper movie yeah which mama kin
Guest:No, but I get to meet Joe Perry because I know where he fucking lives, referring to my single.
Guest:Because I played him that song about seven months ago.
Guest:It's like, man, Joe Perry's the sweetest guy.
Guest:And I think it was seven months ago, was that when the Super Bowl was?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I don't either, because I don't follow sports that much.
Guest:But Joe was really in a weird place, and I just played him that song, and he lives...
Guest:in a place where i know where he fucking lives i played my song is it about you sort of yeah we know where you fucking live oh yeah yeah and i played him the song and he was excited and i go hey joe hey joe you're going with that gun in your hand i know where you fucking live yeah i said joe you just became the coolest motherfucker narrow smith you know why because of the super bowl commercial with skittles last night
Guest:And he had like a childish grin on his face.
Guest:He was so happy.
Guest:He's the most amazing.
Guest:I got to jam with Joe Perry and Giant Depp and Josh Homme.
Guest:We were writing a song together and Joe Perry's following me.
Guest:It was the most weirdest thing because the word jam doesn't even fall into my vocabulary normally.
Guest:But I was... Why?
Guest:I don't know because I just never... You don't jam?
Guest:Well, not really.
Guest:The dynamic between me and Tyler Bates on my new record and the last record, well, he'll sit like this distance.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Same distance as us.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I have his guitar plugged in.
Guest:I have this on headphones.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just like this.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:If you plugged your guitar in, it'll be the same thing.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So on the new record and on the last record, you'll hear the guitar bleed.
Guest:Oh, into your, yeah.
Guest:From your earphones.
Guest:Not only when we bleed, but my... Your earphones bleed guitar.
Guest:My microphone bleeds too.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And weeps.
Marc:Well, the new record, I listen to most of it.
Marc:It sounds like there's some pretty tight songs on there.
Marc:Some Satan stuff.
Marc:There's some murder stuff.
Guest:There's some Satan stuff.
Guest:Some murder stuff.
Guest:Thanks for diminishing it.
Marc:Come on.
Marc:Come on.
Marc:I like the Satan song.
Guest:Satan.
Guest:Satan.
Marc:I like it.
Guest:I like it, too.
Marc:I'm not diminishing it.
Guest:It's what you do.
Guest:But you said there's some Satan stuff and some murder stuff.
Marc:But the mix is a little different.
Guest:I get it.
Guest:It seems a little more grown up.
Guest:That's weird that you said that because everyone said that about Pale Emperor sounded more Dorsey, Rolling Stones.
Guest:It was more rock and roll, the last record.
Guest:yeah his record was the follow-up to that where tyler there he goes again bates and i yeah said to each other we sat next to each other and we said why don't we let's do something let's just start a song that reminds us of this shit that we listened to when we were growing up like a combination between like killing joke yeah no he actually said to me do you like killing joke and i said are you fucking kidding me i saw them live open for ministry yes of course i do
Guest:yeah kung joe joy division iggy yeah stones you know so we did bow house of course bowie alice cooper so we just we just you summoned i just said that yeah and i didn't have to because he scores films for a living i'd written all the lyrics for this record out and
Guest:Is that a first?
Guest:Well, strangely, in one notebook, yes.
Guest:Normally, I would have like 10 notebooks all scattered and chaotic.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I'd be trying to wrangle things in, which is a more difficult way of doing things.
Guest:It's almost like watching the movie Sympathy for the Devil.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They're trying to write one song, and it's very difficult.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But this came very naturally.
Guest:That's good.
Guest:We would just sit next to each other, and we would just put up a beat, a tempo, and she was like...
Marc:Just the two of you?
Guest:Yeah, just the two of us.
Guest:And then we would later go back, and then we would make it live, and we would record it.
Guest:But for the most part, just the two of us, and then Gil, Sharon, who also played drums in Dillinger Escape Project or Plan or whatever the band is.
Guest:But it's not very Marilyn Manson style, but the main point was that we wanted to do something that was completely...
Guest:opposite of what the last record was but at the same time it wasn't trying to harken back to what i used to do right it was just going back to what inspired me in the first place that's nice which was going to clubs in miami and doing what they called slam dancing at the time sure yeah to ministry and killing joke yeah and i think even i might even like slam dance to the pixies even though it wasn't appropriate at the time
Marc:Yeah, maybe.
Marc:It was either a slam dance or stand still.
Marc:Yeah, but back then it was slam dancing.
Guest:No, not moshing.
Guest:No, moshing.
Guest:Yeah, it was just sort of like... It's when you would get hurt.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just like dudes would just run in.
Guest:Yeah, that's how I broke my jaw, actually.
Marc:Is that true?
Guest:No.
Guest:No?
Guest:Yeah, no, it's true.
Marc:Broke your jaw slam dancing?
Marc:Ugh.
Guest:Somewhere along the line.
Marc:Now, how'd the last record sell?
Guest:I couldn't say for sure.
Guest:Do it all right, though?
Guest:I know that it did all right enough for them to give me a better deal this time.
Marc:Oh, that's good.
Marc:And when you go out, how big are the places you're doing?
Marc:Pretty big?
Guest:Well, we just did a bunch of festivals in Europe that we headlined, and we're doing shows in USA that are...
Guest:what i want to feel comfortable in yeah we could we could try to do different size venues but yeah i really prefer a certain size stage so when we even when we did festivals i made them make our stage the size of a club right
Guest:And they didn't understand it at first.
Guest:The crew and the other bands and other stuff because their stages were bigger.
Marc:So you made the stage like a rock club.
Guest:I made the same as a rock club because I want to be able to touch the people next to me.
Guest:And my drummer's right up front, which no one usually does.
Guest:So he's right in the front where the guitar player would be.
Guest:That's good.
Guest:But at the same time, we're doing a lot of big shows.
Guest:We're going to do the...
Guest:We're doing some show in San Bernardino with Rob Zombie sometime soon.
Guest:I'm not really sure when, but we're doing the LA Forum on our own later.
Marc:That's great.
Marc:You created this whole aesthetic that seemed to be supported by a lot of other creative people in the videos and the photos and your own sensibility and your own...
Marc:and everything else.
Marc:You really took whatever it is that you were doing to this level where it had a profound impact on the entire culture.
Marc:And you really seemed to piss off the Christians pretty well.
Marc:Which is fine with me.
Guest:I guess they had it coming.
Marc:Well, they're built to take it.
Guest:They kind of asked for it.
Marc:But I guess I have a couple of questions in that when they first, I think the first question is when it comes to ritual and when it comes to beliefs and all that stuff, can you explain Ali Esther Crowley to me?
Marc:Because I've read his fucking books and what do I got to do to make that make sense to me?
Guest:It's just another person's opinion.
Marc:But it's all written in poetry.
Marc:It's very difficult to get through.
Guest:Well, I wouldn't take anyone's written word, even my own, as lyrics, as something that's supposed to be.
Guest:You read it and it equals something.
Guest:You make it what you want.
Guest:Just with anything.
Guest:I learned that from the Bible.
Guest:I think a belief in something is the key.
Guest:whatever it is whatever it is good or bad but you know you always have to remember that you can put out good energy you can put out bad but I think that someone writes a book it doesn't make them any different from either of us I don't think that I'm saying yes Aleister Crowley had a big impact he was involved with a lot of people you know and obviously I've read his shit so I know it all of it
Guest:Not all of it.
Guest:See, my stomach just went down.
Marc:That's Alistair.
Guest:No, no, no, no.
Guest:It's not any disrespect to what he's written.
Guest:It's just that you understand that some people, a philosophy just in general.
Guest:Philosophy is just one person's opinion.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Nietzsche came as Descartes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Descartes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I used to like to make fun of his name.
Guest:Whatever.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Whatever person you want to pick.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's all just an opinion.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Freud, Jung.
Guest:You know, when you go to philosophy, I'm more of a Jungian person than a Freudian.
Guest:Because I like alchemy because it's where it started.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's basic.
Guest:It's turning lead into gold.
Guest:You take shit and you make it into something great.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:The basic concept of it.
Guest:Forget all the mystical part of it.
Guest:You just take something from nothing.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You make it into something great.
Marc:Now, in terms of...
Marc:When they hung all that shit on you and you had to fight for your life and your art.
Marc:You mean Columbine?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That was... Go ahead.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:In terms of taking on that machine, which you did courageously at the time.
Guest:I'll footnote that and say not exactly, but continue.
Marc:Not exactly?
Guest:No, no, I'll tell you.
Marc:Do you feel that you were able to recover from that?
Guest:When it happened, my entire career was shut down.
Guest:I had this really dope show, Giant Success, which is strange.
Guest:And ironically, the guy that edited that video, Bill Jukic, we jointly watched with the guy who did my own cover, Peru, this photographer.
Guest:We watched Combine happen in Chicago.
Guest:We were watching it live on TV.
Guest:And they were saying... The coverage.
Guest:Yeah, we were just watching it live on TV.
Guest:May or may not have been high on cocaine.
Guest:I won't convince the victim of any of my crimes.
Guest:But we were watching it, and I said, man, this is going to fuck me over because I know that they're going to blame it on me.
Guest:And they said...
Guest:seven kids dressed in Marilyn Manson costumes, and it just kept changing.
Guest:The story kept changing as it went along.
Guest:But so I sucked it up, but it was strange when the Las Vegas casinos were canceling my show.
Guest:So every show was canceled, and the record label did not back me up.
Guest:Huh.
Guest:So everything got ripped out from under me.
Guest:So I sat in my house and I wrote a story called Hollywood.
Guest:And I had a movie deal that was going to make what would be essentially, I guess, my version of The Wall they wanted me to make.
Guest:And it happened to inconveniently be about guns and kids.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that got just pulled out from under me.
Guest:And so I turned that into a record, into a book.
Guest:And someone asked me the other day about if I was going to make that book come true.
Guest:And I got re-inspired because the book actually sounds more relevant now than when I wrote it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you could still put out the book.
Guest:No, no, I'm going to, but it actually sounds, it would have sounded more dated when I wrote it than it would now because it sounds like what, you know, don't call me, you know, Nostra dumbass, but it sounds more like now than it did when I wrote it 15 years ago.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So that happened.
Guest:So the way I come out is shave my head, hold a gun, and just say fuck you and have a song called Love Song, Death Song, Fight Song.
Guest:I just came out with guns blazing.
Guest:They're going to blame me for violence.
Guest:This is the one thing that always amused me.
Guest:People always say that my music causes violence.
Guest:Why aren't they worried what I'm going to do?
Guest:really seriously like you personally yeah i mean personally it's like you're blaming me personally for shit that i didn't do why are you worried about what i'm gonna do yeah does it seem kind of odd like like if your neighbor said that there's there's human feces on the lawn yeah he blames on your cat yeah why is he blaming on you
Guest:Right.
Guest:Well, I mean... He's blaming your cat.
Guest:And he's blaming you as the owner of the cat.
Guest:He's not blaming you for pooping on his lawn.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But would you have rathered that?
Marc:I mean, what if they... They might as well have.
Marc:Well, that's what I'm saying is that they couldn't put you in prison for expressing yourself.
Marc:So they destroyed you for expressing yourself collectively.
Guest:Sort of, but in a sense, I didn't, I mean, and I'm not saying that what I've said in lyrics, especially in this new record, is not going to cause problems if people interpret anything that you say to cause problems, because that's...
Guest:People, it's like I could blame the church for causing me to write it.
Guest:I could blame you for asking me the question.
Guest:You can blame anyone.
Guest:No one has any responsibility anymore.
Guest:That's the whole point.
Guest:From the beginning, the name Marilyn Manson was created to prove the point that they're proving against me.
Guest:So it just proves it more.
Guest:But I can't get through them because I'm not trying to change the world because it's pointless.
Guest:You can't change the world when you can't even change your underwear.
Guest:That's what I go by now as my mom.
Guest:because I have it in several days.
Guest:No, but that sounded like, see, I always told you I divert to sarcasm.
Guest:It's hard to try to get, you can't get through a message to people except in art.
Guest:That's really all you can say.
Guest:You're doing this interview with me.
Guest:We're having our opinions.
Guest:And I listen to your shit.
Guest:I listen to it begrudgingly, but I listen to it.
Guest:yeah do a research first I watched your Netflix the new one the new one the other day that was pretty funny right I almost liked it a lot oh good I almost liked it a lot no I did like it no I watched it no I did you know yeah but I knew who you were no one told me oh I didn't know it was that guy well you just said it was that guy
Guest:I know that guy.
Guest:He's great.
Guest:He's fucking funny.
Guest:But people associate you with characters.
Guest:But I don't differentiate myself from a character that is Marilyn Manson.
Guest:Now, acting is great because it's the only time I get to have Halloween.
Guest:You've done some acting, yeah.
Guest:It's the only time I get to have Halloween.
Guest:Where you get to, what, dress up or...
Guest:Well, no, I can't do anything on Halloween.
Guest:Yeah, but acting, I get to be someone else.
Marc:But what do you mean you don't differentiate?
Marc:Because you just see it as a fluid extension of you.
Marc:You know, however, whatever you're manifesting at that time.
Marc:Because, I mean, you seem like a... Because, like, there's some people... I've talked to Iggy Pop.
Marc:I've talked to Alice Cooper.
Marc:You know, like, they're definitely not who they are on stage when they're talking to me.
Marc:No one's who they are on stage when they're talking to you.
Guest:Because we're not on stage.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because you know why?
Guest:Because you don't have teenage tits on you.
Guest:Right.
Marc:I get it.
Guest:No, I mean, in a way, because when you're on stage, you're performing.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:You're seducing.
Guest:You're taking the music that you spend a lot of time writing, which is totally different than performing.
Guest:A lot of people in my life that I've had relationships with don't understand the difference between writing a song and performing a song.
Guest:Performing a song is a lot different, you know, from doing comedy.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:It's different than writing.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Yeah, so what do you mean a lot of people in your life who you had relationships with didn't understand that?
Guest:I just mean it's not the same.
Guest:When you're performing, you're seducing someone.
Guest:You're trying to get people to be a part of what you're making.
Guest:It's almost sort of a... It's a giant seduction.
Guest:It is.
Guest:It is ritualistic in some strange way.
Guest:But it's not the same.
Guest:But making this last record, I would invite people into the studio.
Guest:mostly girls because when you invite girls in the studio then you have to sing better or you look bad so it's kind of like when you're performing you have to invite girls to make you look better yeah did you feel like you got into it for the girls there's a mathematics there's an algebra yeah to rock and roll yeah
Guest:guys go to concerts when i grew up in ohio yeah to meet girls girls go to concerts to fuck the band and they can't so they fuck the guys that go to the concerts it's math now i'm now i'm in a conundrum yeah because i'm in the band
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it becomes complicated.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:But the main reason rock and roll exists is because it brings people together, but the sexual thing- Unleashes something.
Guest:It always has been.
Guest:Girls go there because they're caught up and they want to fuck the band, either in their mind or however they want to.
Guest:Guys want to be the guy in the band, and sometimes it's the reverse.
Guest:Sometimes it's both.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Sometimes both, especially when you're someone like me who presents an image that is not too masculine for women and not too feminine for men.
Marc:But I mean, when you first summoned the character and you were doing these large stage shows with all your makeup and your hair and the songs that you wrote, you thought of yourself as like, I'm just rock and roll.
Guest:I was the first person to ever write an article about Marilyn Manson.
Guest:As Brian Warner, it said Marilyn Manson's music was amazing.
Guest:The best music ever made.
Guest:Greatest band since Black Sabbath.
Guest:By Brian Warner.
Guest:I had no fucking music.
Guest:People were like, oh, shit, what's this band?
Guest:So I had to make music to fill in the blank.
Guest:It was very Dolly, my hero.
Guest:And I had to make up.
Guest:I started a science project.
Guest:Oh, shit, what am I going to do now?
Guest:So as a kid, I just still feel trapped in the same pattern of being 23, essentially when my career took off.
Guest:I don't ever take things for granted.
Guest:I don't feel jaded.
Guest:I'll come here and I'll sit in your sweaty little garage.
Guest:I love you.
Guest:You're awesome.
Guest:But do you ever feel like you're caught in the same age when you started?
Marc:Yeah, when you don't have children, you don't really know.
Marc:You don't have something checking you.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Do you have children?
Marc:I have cats.
Marc:Yeah, I have cats too.
Marc:Two cats.
Marc:I have three.
Marc:But we don't have kids aging before you.
Marc:You don't have kids.
Marc:I don't.
Marc:I don't either.
Marc:So, yeah, I still don't have a clear handle on how old I am all the time.
Marc:Certainly not emotionally, but physically you start looking in the mirror and you're like, okay, it's happening.
Marc:You look like a hard 34.
Marc:That's very sweet of you.
Guest:No, honestly.
Marc:Yeah, you look like 38.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:We're doing all right.
Guest:I already told you my age, but it's okay.
Marc:I didn't.
Marc:You didn't tell me.
Guest:I was born in 1969, unless you're bad at math.
Guest:I was born in 63.
Guest:See, I'm older than you.
Marc:No, you're not.
Marc:I'm older than you.
Marc:See, you're bad at math.
Guest:Okay, that is true.
Guest:I hate math.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And meth.
Guest:I've never done that.
Guest:You don't like meth?
Guest:Not really meth.
Guest:What are you on these days?
Guest:Right now, I'm on your chair.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:I try to stay in the balance between doing healthy activity...
Guest:And also being able to drink the minimal amount of alcohol to be able to do that healthy activity.
Guest:It's a good balance.
Guest:I have a good teacher that teaches me how to be strong.
Guest:She teaches me how to drink within my limits of capacity.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Who's that?
Guest:Is that a coach?
Guest:It's a coach?
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:Romantic?
Guest:Some really... Don't tell her I said this, but some really...
Guest:slutty woman that does Pilates for me that learns how to teach me how to drink within my limits and do Pilates at the same time.
Guest:I didn't say that.
Guest:Sorry.
Guest:Sorry.
Guest:I didn't mean to say that.
Guest:Sorry.
Guest:Sorry, coach.
Guest:No more blow.
Guest:Were you trying to do blow right now?
Guest:What is blow?
Guest:That is so antiquated term.
Guest:What do you call it?
Guest:It's such an antiquated term.
Guest:I don't know.
Marc:Devil's dandruff.
Guest:I'm a sober guy.
Marc:I don't want to do blow.
Guest:You're a sober guy.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:You can call it blow.
Guest:You know what I have?
Guest:I have giant ups wig from blow.
Guest:I traded him my tits for mechanical animals.
Marc:You did?
Guest:So that's blow.
Guest:Is that true?
Guest:That is 100% true.
Marc:So like occasionally do a little blow?
Guest:Well, if you're trying to interrogate me, are you a cop?
Guest:Are you wearing a wire?
Guest:Wait, is anyone recording this?
Guest:No, there's no recording.
Guest:You don't have to tell me.
Guest:I was just curious.
Guest:Of course I do drugs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, but I think that doing drugs is...
Guest:It's supposed to be when you're in a good mood.
Guest:No, it's okay.
Marc:It's not exhausting.
Guest:You do drugs when you're in a bad mood, it's bad.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You do drugs when you're in a good mood, it's still bad.
Guest:But what I said about cocaine in the past is it just makes me less rich.
Guest:not poor but less rich yeah so it's like this knows makes money yeah and spends money I get it in the past that's what I used to say but no I do occasional drugs all the time you still talk to I'll occasionally do drugs all the time you still talk to Reznor or no I talked to him recently and I really liked all the things he did on Twin Peaks it was amazing
Marc:He also scored that Vietnam documentary that Ken Burns just made called The Vietnam War.
Marc:I didn't see that.
Guest:I'm not on bad terms with Trent at all.
Guest:In fact, I really have a new appreciation and great fondness for the fact that we had a falling out, and a lot of it was really anger and drug-related and just confusion and record labels, mostly record labels fucking with us.
Guest:How long ago was that?
Guest:It's a while ago, right?
Guest:Well, when our big falling out came about was mostly, it really had to do with record labels.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And when I watched the Deviant Ones, the thing with Jimmy Iovine.
Guest:Defiant Ones?
Guest:Defiant Ones.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I thought it was the Deviant Ones.
Guest:I would have called it the Deviant Ones myself.
Guest:I know what it's called.
Guest:I was just fucking with it.
Guest:That's good.
Guest:Because my nickname that week was Deviant, was Building Face.
Guest:It was called Building Face.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because my face was on the building, so it's Building Face.
Guest:Got it.
Guest:But I talked to him because he's the one who sent me the link to it, and he said... Trent did.
Guest:Yeah, Trent did, and he said that he really liked the part that included us because...
Guest:I won't deny in any way whatsoever that he discovered and found what he wanted.
Guest:And we had a tussle.
Guest:He's the one who found me, signed me.
Guest:And I think he understood me a lot better than Jimmy.
Guest:But I think I may have underestimated how much Jimmy understood me because we never really had a conversation because there was a wall that was separated by Trent.
Guest:So it wasn't necessarily... I was mad at both people.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But mostly it was just a misunderstanding, I think.
Marc:About what the... Did they drop you or what happened?
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:No, well... I don't know the story.
Marc:I'm sorry.
Guest:No, it was a fight between Nothing Records, which had Marilyn Manson.
Guest:Which is Trent's label.
Guest:Yeah, but Trent was not on Nothing.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It was his label.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And it just became down to a point where I just wanted to do what I do.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I think that's what Trent wanted to provide me with.
Guest:And he always did from the beginning.
Guest:But once you turn in something, it doesn't always mean it's what it goes out to the world, except now.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So now with my record label,
Guest:Loma Vista which is Tom Wally who was the person responsible who used to work at Interscope and then Warner Brothers the new record the new record Heaven Upside Down let's plug it boom boom boom boom boom he's the guy who put the billboard in Times Square of me with tits on Mechanical Animals yeah
Guest:Well, not tits exactly, but you know what I mean.
Guest:He was the one who stuck behind that then.
Guest:And then years later, he came to me about this record.
Guest:And he basically gave us this record deal for this album, Heaven Upside Down, without having heard anything but one song, Satan.
Guest:And we know where you fucking live.
Guest:Which I was just amazed that a record label would put out a song as a single, We Know Where You Fucking Live, and give me money for a video.
Guest:But he put out Pale Emperor too, right?
Guest:He was a part of it, but it was Cooking Final, and he wanted to be a bigger part of it.
Marc:Oh, I get it.
Guest:And I said, can you give us the same money as they gave us?
Guest:And he said, yes.
Guest:I said, good.
Guest:Can you give us a double?
Guest:And he said, okay.
Guest:Great.
Guest:Done.
Guest:And he hadn't heard any music.
Guest:So I'm a pimp.
Marc:Well, good, man.
Marc:Well, I'm happy that you're still working.
Marc:You seem okay.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Twin Peaks, you liked it, huh?
Guest:I did like Twin Peaks.
Guest:I'm not sure about the ending, though.
Guest:I didn't watch it.
Guest:The new one.
Guest:I didn't watch the new one.
Guest:Spoiler alert.
Guest:No, it got really good.
Guest:A lot of people were wary about it, including myself.
Guest:and I get to work with Lynch once if you want to hear the Lynch story so when I did Lost Highway yeah oh that's right yeah which is strangely and I won't I'm not making is that the one with Bob Robert Blake yes it's a weird face yes yeah and I'm naked in it yeah yeah and Robert Lozier and Michael Massey oh yeah I was just projected on wall and there's Dave Lynch he's like
Guest:Now, Marilyn, listen.
Guest:You're going to be covered in blood.
Guest:You're going to die.
Guest:You're going to fall down.
Guest:Why?
Guest:Doesn't matter.
Guest:Now, listen.
Guest:Patricia is very sensitive about her breasts.
Guest:So don't talk to her about her breasts, okay?
Guest:Like, yeah.
Guest:So why am I dying?
Guest:Doesn't matter.
Guest:So first thing, I'm on set, and I have this weird gauze thing over my cock and balls, but I'm ass naked in front of the camera.
Guest:And I just look at Patricia Arquette, and I say, hey, I liked you on the Dream Warriors 4 docking video.
Guest:She goes, how do you know that?
Guest:He goes, in action.
Guest:She was really pissed off.
Marc:It was fucking hilarious.
Guest:It was one of the funniest things ever.
Guest:Was she in that video?
Guest:Yeah, she was in the Doc and Dream Warriors video.
Guest:Pick it up.
Guest:But that was my David Lynch experience when I first met him.
Guest:And he's always been, he's a wildcat.
Guest:He wanted me to be in Mulholland Drive singing.
Guest:I want you to sing Heidi, Heidi Ho, Marilyn.
Guest:I totally want to sing that.
Guest:Cap Calloway.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Heidi, Heidi.
Guest:I need it to be done today.
Guest:I'm on tour.
Guest:I'm in Peru or Europe or somewhere other.
Guest:I need it today.
Guest:Can you do it over the phone?
Guest:Can you podcast yourself in a Skype over the phone?
Guest:He just needed your voice.
Guest:He really talks very loud.
Guest:And you did Eastbound and Down?
Guest:Yeah, that was just kind of a fun friend thing.
Guest:Your buddies with?
Guest:With Danny McBride.
Guest:He's so fucking funny, man.
Guest:He is very much Kenny Powers.
Guest:So when's the whole record come out?
Guest:October 6th.
Guest:This video comes out October 15th, or it came out October 15th.
Guest:With the nuns.
Guest:Nuns and guns.
Guest:Guns.
Guest:I think the biggest controversy in this is that nuns are wearing latex.
Guest:And I know that Catholics are not allowed to use condoms, so I think the big controversy should be stuck there.
Guest:It's about prophylactics.
Guest:It's not about guns shooting mortar launchers into minivans.
Guest:It's about nuns using their vaginas to rape an innocent Christian family who's not Catholic.
Guest:Or about me being in charge of it while shooting other firearms.
Guest:It's more about the Catholics being upset about prophylactics.
Guest:And I think that we should cut to a commercial from Trojan.
Guest:Coming up next, the Trojan condom from MM and MM.
Marc:You could have put that in there.
Guest:MM and MM.
Guest:Double, triple... Quadruple M. Quadruple M. Coming to your life.
Guest:The time when you want to just not pull out the new condom, the new Trojan horse from quadruple M. When you just want to sneak into her and tell her afterwards that you're not wearing a condom, it's just simply a rubber ring around the bottom of your penis.
Guest:New quadruple M from...
Guest:Mark Maron.
Marc:No, from... And Marilyn Manson.
Marc:Marilyn Manson.
Marc:You're welcome.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Peace out.
Marc:Thanks for talking.
Marc:Okay, so there, I don't know if you felt the arc of it, if you felt the tone of the conversation kind of become a little loopier towards the end, but it was nice to meet him.
Marc:It was nice to have him over, and I hope he's feeling better.
Marc:I hope he's bouncing back.
Marc:Yeah, so again, go get the book if you want.
Marc:Come to see us in San Francisco tomorrow night.
Marc:Me and Brendan are doing our thing for the book event at the Alamo Drafthouse for Litquake.
Guest:And I will play some guitar for you.
Marc:Boomer lives!