Episode 843 - Warren Hutcherson

Episode 843 • Released September 3, 2017 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Marc:Lock the gates!

00:00:09Marc:Alright, let's do this.

00:00:10Marc:How are you, what the fuckers?

00:00:12Marc:What the fuck buddies?

00:00:13Marc:What the fuckineers?

00:00:14Marc:What the fucknicks?

00:00:16Marc:What's happening?

00:00:16Marc:I'm Mark Maron.

00:00:17Marc:This is my podcast, WTF.

00:00:19Marc:Welcome to it.

00:00:20Marc:How's it going?

00:00:22Marc:Alright, look, before I get into anything, I just need to do some self-promoting.

00:00:26Marc:My new special, my stand-up special on Netflix, Two Real Podcasts.

00:00:30Marc:That's what it's called.

00:00:32Marc:Premieres tomorrow, September 5th on Netflix.

00:00:35Marc:You can go add it to your queue right now so you can stream it as soon as it's available.

00:00:40Marc:Very proud of this.

00:00:41Marc:It looks good.

00:00:42Marc:It's tight.

00:00:44Marc:It really is a good looking special.

00:00:46Marc:Lynn Shelton did an amazing job with the direction.

00:00:50Marc:And all the people want to thank the people of Minneapolis again.

00:00:53Marc:But proud of it.

00:00:55Marc:So, yeah, tomorrow, Too Real, my new Netflix special, will be available.

00:01:01Marc:Dig it.

00:01:02Marc:Did I mention today on the show I have a comedy writer and comedian?

00:01:07Marc:He was more of a comedian back when I knew him.

00:01:08Marc:Now he's more of a comedy writer.

00:01:09Marc:Warren Hutcherson, who I started with, who I've been wanting to talk to for a while because he was really a funny guy.

00:01:15Marc:And I just hadn't we had not talked to him probably 10, 15 years, 20 years.

00:01:20Marc:What's happening?

00:01:21Marc:Is it hot?

00:01:22Marc:Is it hot where you are?

00:01:23Marc:Is it hot and horrible?

00:01:25Marc:It's hot as fuck here, but it's weird.

00:01:29Marc:In these end times to sometimes take a minute to just appreciate the relentlessness of the fucking weather.

00:01:37Marc:I'm a little weird.

00:01:38Marc:I enjoy a bit of desert heat sometimes, though it's a little bit much here.

00:01:44Marc:We're not quite in the desert, but L.A.

00:01:46Marc:is kind of a desert.

00:01:47Marc:But I kind of like it, man.

00:01:48Marc:I kind of like 104 degree temperatures.

00:01:53Marc:Because given that I don't do any drugs and I don't partake, there's something about that feeling of being baked.

00:02:03Marc:You walk outside and you're immediately dehydrated and everything slows down.

00:02:09Marc:You can feel your heart slowing down.

00:02:11Marc:Sweat doesn't even have time to build up before it evaporates.

00:02:15Marc:And it's a bit...

00:02:17Marc:Mind-altering.

00:02:18Marc:I don't know if anyone else feels the same way.

00:02:21Marc:A lot of people here, they complain about the heat constantly.

00:02:23Marc:It does get hot here during the summer months.

00:02:27Marc:I guess it has been a little relentless weather-wise.

00:02:30Marc:I guess really what I'm doing is kind of rationalizing the fact that every fucking day seems like either the beginning or the middle or maybe close to the end of the world ending.

00:02:43Marc:That's the way my brain puts it all together.

00:02:45Marc:Why not connect the dots?

00:02:47Marc:There's no reason not to connect the dots.

00:02:49Marc:You can connect the global warming dots.

00:02:51Marc:You can connect the nuclear Armageddon dots.

00:02:55Marc:You can connect the biblical end time dots.

00:02:58Marc:It's great that this president facilitates this portal to connect all the end time dots every day.

00:03:05Marc:Out here, the L.A.

00:03:06Marc:'s partially on fire.

00:03:08Marc:That's the other thing.

00:03:09Marc:The fires are here.

00:03:10Marc:They're there.

00:03:11Marc:I'm not even sure how close they are to my house.

00:03:13Marc:They're kind of close, but there are people here in L.A.

00:03:16Marc:literally just going on their roofs to watch the watch the city burn.

00:03:21Marc:They're watching it burn.

00:03:24Marc:I don't know if we're going to have to evacuate.

00:03:25Marc:I think it's still far off from here.

00:03:28Marc:I don't think I don't know at this point how many homes have been swallowed by flames, but it's fire season in L.A.

00:03:35Marc:And that's just something we've grown to accept.

00:03:37Marc:It's hot and it's fire season.

00:03:40Marc:But that's the positive spin.

00:03:42Marc:The other spin is like, oh, this is it.

00:03:44Marc:The facilitator has arrived.

00:03:46Marc:Satan's minion has come and the evangelicals are working with him.

00:03:51Marc:It's time to follow the instructions of the last book.

00:03:54Marc:Here it comes.

00:03:54Marc:We just need to clear that temple mount and get that ready for the re-arrival of the Great One.

00:04:00Marc:And he will lift us all up right in time for the brush fires to just totally engulf Marin's house.

00:04:08Marc:That's actually in Revelations.

00:04:11Marc:We will be lifted off just in time for the brush fire to engulf Marin's house.

00:04:16Marc:Maybe I'm personalizing it.

00:04:18Marc:I don't know.

00:04:19Marc:Maybe.

00:04:19Marc:I got to look at it again.

00:04:20Marc:I haven't checked in with the cryptic poetry of the final chapter of the instruction book.

00:04:28Marc:for how to get to heaven but perhaps i shall maybe i'm not mentioned i you know i'm not trying to be morose people i'm not trying to be depressed i'm trying to have a good time i'm trying to sort of like not uh not get hung up on dark futures or or lack of or lack thereof and try to be in the present and enjoy myself and oh i know what you're wondering i know what you're asking yourself mark how's it going without the nicotine did you fucking go back

00:04:55Marc:Did you go back to it?

00:04:56Marc:Did you give in to the charm of the need and darkness and perverse malignant desire that is compulsive addiction?

00:05:09Marc:Did you give in to it?

00:05:13Marc:Nope.

00:05:15Marc:Nope.

00:05:15Marc:I did not.

00:05:17Marc:I have not.

00:05:17Marc:I did not.

00:05:19Marc:I'm still a little itchy.

00:05:20Marc:Got the soul itch.

00:05:21Marc:Got the skin skeeves.

00:05:22Marc:But not too bad.

00:05:24Marc:Not too bad.

00:05:25Marc:It's more of a mental thing now.

00:05:26Marc:I guess it's been, what has it been, about a week?

00:05:29Marc:Solid week in a day, maybe a week in a day.

00:05:32Marc:The physical need for caffeine and nicotine has passed.

00:05:37Marc:And I'm feeling better.

00:05:38Marc:My guts are working better.

00:05:40Marc:My brain feels better.

00:05:42Marc:My energy is better.

00:05:44Marc:If you call mania having more energy.

00:05:48Yeah.

00:05:49Marc:Yeah, so right now I'm just kind of focusing on rebuilding my gut bugs.

00:05:54Marc:That's my new project.

00:05:55Marc:I'm doing a gut bug project.

00:05:57Marc:It's just that when you eat the nicotine, you drink all that caffeine.

00:05:59Marc:Caffeine's a diuretic.

00:06:01Marc:It also is a poop-eretic.

00:06:03Marc:And the nicotine...

00:06:05Marc:Lozenges are made with one of the tals, the mannitols or the seropisorbitols as a laxative effect to some degree.

00:06:12Marc:So your guts are kind of fucked up from both of those things.

00:06:15Marc:So I've been probiotic-ing by eating kimchi and various krauts with the occasional probiotic shot of 450 billion acidophilus monsters.

00:06:29Marc:But then like now I've kind of got this brain thing going on about my guts.

00:06:34Marc:that uh amanda the lady who trains me she told me that there's a prebiotic a prebiotic so now like after i got off the nicotine i just dumped a bunch of those uh those good probiotic uh bacterial monsters into my guts because that's supposed to be healthy but apparently they need to be fed and what they like to be fed is um

00:06:58Marc:Cooked yams that aren't hot and jicama and some asparagus.

00:07:02Marc:So I've been focusing on feeding the new bugs in my intestines the stuff they like.

00:07:09Marc:And that's that's that's how I'm occupying my time post nicotine.

00:07:14Marc:Just concerned about the kind of living environment of my insides.

00:07:20Marc:That's the new project.

00:07:22Marc:My gut bugs feel good, and apparently if you got your gut bugs in check, the rest of it falls into place.

00:07:28Marc:That's the theory.

00:07:29Marc:That's the theory.

00:07:31Marc:I don't know.

00:07:32Marc:Warren Hutcherson is here.

00:07:34Marc:We talked for a bit.

00:07:36Marc:Like I said, I haven't seen him in a long time.

00:07:37Marc:He used to have these great jokes about his dad and about being black and about things.

00:07:43Marc:I always had a lot of respect from his comic, and I know he went on to be on the writing stuff of the Bernie Mac show and other stuff.

00:07:50Marc:I don't know.

00:07:51Marc:Things just came around and we were able to make it happen.

00:07:57Marc:You know, I talked to his I think his wife reached out to me and I emailed her and then she contacted him.

00:08:03Marc:Yeah.

00:08:05Marc:I mean, in the house.

00:08:06Marc:I mean, I think just down the hall.

00:08:08Marc:But nonetheless, let's talk to Warren Hutcherson now about stuff.

00:08:14Guest:Yeah.

00:08:18Marc:So, Warren, like, I don't think I've seen you in a decade.

00:08:21Marc:Is that possible?

00:08:21Marc:I think it's maybe two decades when you think about it.

00:08:25Marc:Maybe we ran into each other here or there quick, you know, like once or twice.

00:08:29Marc:Right.

00:08:30Marc:But, you know, back in the day, I see you all the time.

00:08:33Guest:Yeah.

00:08:34Marc:It's weird.

00:08:34Marc:I've known you a long time.

00:08:35Marc:I always liked you.

00:08:37Marc:I always liked your stand-up.

00:08:38Marc:And, you know, and I remember at some point you were one of the first guys that I realized, like, well, I guess he's just writing now.

00:08:46Marc:yeah like there was like you know like like you know you i used to love the bits and then all of a sudden it's like warren got a job writing and i'm like is that something we can do because i don't want to do that

00:08:58Guest:Don't blame you.

00:09:00Guest:You know what?

00:09:02Guest:Because, and I think this is the thing that you realize either you are committing the slowest suicide in the world.

00:09:11Guest:Yeah.

00:09:12Guest:Or you found the other way.

00:09:16Guest:You found like, you know what?

00:09:19Guest:I was working too hard at something else, and now I got this.

00:09:26Guest:But I know now, and part of me even being here, part of me when I said- I think it's a practical decision.

00:09:31Guest:I'm not condescending it at all.

00:09:33Guest:No, but that's the thing.

00:09:35Guest:That's the slow suicide of it.

00:09:36Guest:Right.

00:09:37Guest:Once you decide, I think, this is my philosophy.

00:09:41Guest:Right.

00:09:41Guest:Once you decide to do stand-up,

00:09:44Guest:And once you do it and then you become like good at it and you start thinking, I think I can define myself as a stand up.

00:09:52Guest:Right.

00:09:54Guest:Then you sort of slide into the writing.

00:09:57Guest:There's a new definite.

00:09:58Guest:You got to sit down and go, OK, there's a new definition now.

00:10:02Guest:Now, not that you can't myself for myself, not that you can't be a stand up and a writer.

00:10:07Guest:Right.

00:10:08Guest:Right.

00:10:08Guest:But to be just a writer now, which is a lot of stand-ups, you go, oh, what are you doing?

00:10:14Guest:And you're like, well, you know, I'm writing this, I'm writing that.

00:10:16Guest:And then the stage thing is gone.

00:10:19Marc:But as you get older, and even as, you know, before you get older, I mean, there's fewer and fewer stand-ups that are going to be like, ah, you pussy.

00:10:26Marc:You know what I mean?

00:10:27Marc:Like, unless you have that guy inside of you.

00:10:29Guest:Yeah, well, that guy is definitely inside of me.

00:10:32Guest:And pussy is a...

00:10:36Guest:is a charitable way.

00:10:38Guest:The things that I hear from that guy, I would love it.

00:10:44Guest:I'm like, can you just stay at Pussy?

00:10:47Guest:You are really Jesus.

00:10:49Guest:He's creative, huh?

00:10:51Guest:Well, he's creative.

00:10:52Guest:What is he?

00:10:52Guest:He's consistent because I'm letting down everybody.

00:10:56Guest:By not doing stand-up or a lot of things?

00:10:59Guest:I'm tearing.

00:11:00Guest:I'm destroying the race.

00:11:02Guest:I'm destroying myself.

00:11:04Guest:By being a

00:11:04Guest:i'm letting my family down you know it's just all kinds of stuff uh he's very active huh he's got he's on stage a lot that guy that guy in your head well that's the thing it's like when i was on stage you could calm down and just go yeah you know these people whatever he had a voice yeah but now he's like oh it's just me in here oh okay you're cool and this is what you want then right you just want me to fuck with you because you ain't even going out doing nothing

00:11:28Marc:That's a good question, though.

00:11:30Marc:Do you want it?

00:11:30Marc:Like, you know, when you have those kind of feelings about yourself and those kind of patterns in yourself.

00:11:35Marc:I was just talking about this to my brother the other day, yesterday, where it's sort of like, you know, you circle around, you end up in the same place emotionally, psychologically, you know, where you're beating the shit out of yourself.

00:11:46Marc:And after a certain point, you're like, well, some part of you is comfortable here.

00:11:49Marc:Right.

00:11:50Marc:Exactly.

00:11:50Marc:You know, it's not healthy.

00:11:52Marc:It's not good.

00:11:53Marc:It doesn't lead to a good place.

00:11:55Marc:But something in you is used to it.

00:11:57Guest:But you're good here.

00:11:58Guest:Yeah.

00:11:58Guest:So what are you bitching about?

00:12:00Guest:Just shut up and be here.

00:12:02Guest:That's it.

00:12:02Guest:The acceptance thing.

00:12:03Guest:And that's the thing.

00:12:04Guest:It's like you know in your heart that acceptance is the right place to be.

00:12:08Guest:But then it's like, what am I accepting, though?

00:12:10Guest:Yeah.

00:12:11Guest:Am I accepting the best of myself or have I given up?

00:12:14Marc:So you just take it to another level.

00:12:16Guest:Like, you know, like, okay, I get it, but you know, it's still shitty.

00:12:19Guest:It's still shit.

00:12:20Guest:And it's like, well, I feel like, look, I'll say this.

00:12:23Guest:Maybe this is a comparison that's fair.

00:12:25Guest:Maybe it's not.

00:12:26Guest:I just did the thing.

00:12:27Guest:I'm, you know, I'm 54.

00:12:29Guest:I think we're both 54.

00:12:30Guest:I'm 53, 54 September.

00:12:32Guest:And I'm 54 in October, but I'm the kind of person who just says 54.

00:12:36Guest:Yeah.

00:12:36Guest:i'm just jumping ahead yeah i'm 60 man uh no you're not i'm 53 but it's coming if i'm lucky yeah so yeah um so i'm 53 54 in october i just did my colonoscopy because you know yeah you gotta do that i did it last year or two years ago i did it and and so first of all i got the number like here's the deal like my doctor's in my regular doctor's office there's a guy who does it

00:13:03Marc:Oh, really?

00:13:04Marc:You didn't have to go?

00:13:04Marc:No.

00:13:05Marc:I went to some weird sort of place that doctors use to do those things.

00:13:09Guest:Well, no, I'm sorry.

00:13:10Guest:Yeah, we went to a place.

00:13:11Guest:Oh, okay.

00:13:11Guest:But I mean, I didn't have to go find a doctor who does it.

00:13:15Guest:Right, right, right.

00:13:16Guest:The doctor was right over there.

00:13:17Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:13:18Guest:I said to him...

00:13:20Guest:I'm actually 51.

00:13:21Guest:I said, I'm 51 now.

00:13:23Guest:And I know that at 50, I'm supposed to do that.

00:13:26Guest:Everybody says, do this thing.

00:13:27Guest:And he goes, oh yeah, you're 51.

00:13:30Guest:Sure.

00:13:30Guest:Uh, you want me to recommend somebody?

00:13:32Guest:And I say, yeah, please.

00:13:34Guest:And he goes, there's this guy next door, which immediately you go, is that a real recommendation?

00:13:39Guest:Or are you just helping out your suite mate?

00:13:41Guest:And then, and then, uh,

00:13:44Guest:Like I said, I just did it.

00:13:45Guest:I just did it like three months ago.

00:13:47Marc:So that means- You put it off.

00:13:48Marc:It took me, yeah, that long to get- Well, what was it?

00:13:50Marc:You didn't want to see the results or you didn't want to have something in your ass?

00:13:54Marc:I didn't want to see the results.

00:13:56Marc:Oh, okay.

00:13:56Guest:I didn't want to see.

00:13:57Guest:It was probably both.

00:13:59Guest:Yeah.

00:14:00Guest:But-

00:14:00Guest:But it was more the results.

00:14:02Guest:And then when I got the results, when he says, you know, I got the paper and he says, yeah, you're good for another 10 years.

00:14:09Guest:Right.

00:14:09Guest:Yeah.

00:14:10Guest:I said, immediately, I was like, 10 years?

00:14:14Guest:Fuck, that guy's going to be retired.

00:14:15Guest:He's an old guy.

00:14:16Guest:Oh, right.

00:14:17Guest:I'm already coming up in my brain with why 10 years is a bad thing.

00:14:22Guest:Right.

00:14:22Guest:As opposed to I'm clean for 10 years.

00:14:24Guest:Yeah.

00:14:25Guest:Yeah.

00:14:25Guest:So and I'm saying like in what we were talking about, like, I don't know if I should go.

00:14:30Guest:Can you just be satisfied with what you where you are right now and not be so worried about 10 years from now?

00:14:38Guest:Or is it legitimate?

00:14:40Guest:You know, and I feel like in this case, it's a case by case basis in this case.

00:14:45Marc:Well, yeah, I mean, that's a weird way to go with it.

00:14:47Marc:You know what I mean?

00:14:48Marc:In the sense that, like, I know people like that.

00:14:50Marc:I'm very anxious in the moment.

00:14:54Marc:But I think when they told me I had, you know, I didn't have eight to 10 years, I'm good.

00:14:58Marc:Well, I thought, well, that's like, see, what I do is like, well, that's off the list.

00:15:02Marc:Let's check out the liver.

00:15:04Marc:How's the, you know, which of the other organs are going to go?

00:15:07Marc:Something else could happen.

00:15:08Marc:That's right.

00:15:09Marc:Like that one's good for now.

00:15:10Marc:That part of me is operating fine.

00:15:13Marc:But let's do the prostate again.

00:15:16Marc:Let's figure out what's up with that.

00:15:17Guest:Yeah, that was, I might get into that, but I get more arrogant about it because I feel like, yeah, hey man, my ass is clean.

00:15:26Guest:Liver, prostate, they better be clean.

00:15:29Guest:Yeah, right.

00:15:29Guest:Because then I'm going to be like, that guy in my head will be like, what's up with you, prostate?

00:15:33Guest:The ass is clean, but look at you.

00:15:35Guest:You got to grab onto some cancer, you stupid ass.

00:15:40Guest:Thank you, Mr. Asshole.

00:15:41Guest:Right, right.

00:15:42Guest:Oh, I'm sorry.

00:15:42Guest:How far can I?

00:15:43Guest:You can go.

00:15:44Marc:I can say whatever.

00:15:45Marc:But you grew up with it, because I remember the early bits and the defining bits and the fact that you're still thinking about this stuff without a release valve.

00:15:54Marc:Yeah.

00:15:54Marc:It must be a little hard to handle.

00:15:58Marc:I mean, that must be a source of some of your self-criticism that, you know, at the beginning when you were doing jokes about your father and your grandmother and the unique sort of set of circumstances that you grew up in ideologically.

00:16:11Marc:Right.

00:16:12Marc:You know, at least you had that release valve.

00:16:15Marc:So now you're kind of festering.

00:16:17Guest:Well, yeah, no, I mean, yes, you're right, and then it's deeper than that.

00:16:24Guest:What I realized is my release valve was some fake-oration.

00:16:32Guest:Fake-oration.

00:16:33Guest:Some fakery.

00:16:34Guest:I was not being as honest as I could be.

00:16:41Marc:Well, I mean, you're doing comedy, you know, and you kind of, you know, you could progress to that.

00:16:46Guest:Yeah.

00:16:47Guest:Yeah.

00:16:47Guest:And I know.

00:16:48Guest:And I think that's why comedy became my thing.

00:16:53Guest:And that's why, like I'm saying, now I'm torn between comedy and history.

00:16:57Guest:Maybe I'm not torn.

00:16:58Guest:Maybe I'll figure out how to weave it all together.

00:17:01Guest:Where did you grow up?

00:17:03Guest:I grew up in Baltimore.

00:17:04Guest:right i grew up in baltimore maryland i'm sorry just for your listeners i grew up in baltimore city uh-huh so anybody who goes oh i grew up in baltimore and then they say yeah pikesville or ricer's town these are all little areas yeah on baltimore no yeah baltimore city

00:17:23Guest:And that means something.

00:17:26Guest:It totally means something.

00:17:28Guest:My point of reference is The Wire.

00:17:30Guest:The Wire is, for the most part, about the part of Baltimore City I grew up in.

00:17:38Guest:And how big was the family?

00:17:42Guest:My family was pretty big, I think.

00:17:44Guest:I'll put it like this.

00:17:45Guest:My mom had three older brothers, and my dad had three, well, surviving, he had three siblings.

00:17:57Guest:He had two older brothers and an older sister.

00:17:59Guest:Yeah.

00:18:00Guest:So both were the babies of the family.

00:18:03Guest:Right.

00:18:04Guest:But they were three siblings.

00:18:05Guest:And everybody was around?

00:18:07Yeah.

00:18:08Guest:Everybody, my mom's oldest brother, Uncle Everett, was a crazy vet.

00:18:17Guest:He was Army, Vietnam.

00:18:19Guest:He died in Vietnam.

00:18:20Guest:He did?

00:18:21Guest:Yeah, it's weird to say died.

00:18:23Guest:He was killed in Vietnam.

00:18:26Guest:He expired over there.

00:18:30Guest:He was...

00:18:33Guest:Like he, as I remember, you know, I mean, you're dealing with kids' memories.

00:18:38Guest:But I remember he was really a good uncle and he was really nice and crazy, which is what you want sometimes from a good uncle.

00:18:46Marc:You got to know him between tours or before he went?

00:18:49Guest:Yeah, he'd come home between tours and then...

00:18:52Guest:i mean i'm sure i knew him before he went but i was really right right yeah yeah yeah uh but me and my cousin his son yeah my cousin everett we both lived with my grandmother my mom's my maternal grandmother for a while um and so yeah and and we lived in the room i mean it was a little it was public housing

00:19:13Guest:And there were only two bedrooms.

00:19:16Guest:So so at one point, I mean, we're all in the same room.

00:19:21Guest:And then my grandmother, because this is who she is, and she just moved downstairs.

00:19:27Guest:It's like a little huge staircase.

00:19:30Guest:She just basically made the couch.

00:19:33Guest:That was her room.

00:19:34Guest:The living room was her room.

00:19:34Guest:And you and your cousin lived upstairs?

00:19:36Guest:Me and my cousin lived in one room, and then the other room was when my Uncle Everett came home, and sometimes Uncle Richard and Uncle William.

00:19:45Guest:And where was your mom?

00:19:47Guest:She was gone.

00:19:49Guest:My mother...

00:19:51Guest:and my grandmother had a really contentious relationship yeah my mother had a contentious relationship with a lot of people but my mother is a very loving person but and and there's so much about her that i'm

00:20:08Guest:I know there's so much about me that she's responsible.

00:20:12Guest:She's still around.

00:20:13Guest:Yeah.

00:20:13Guest:Yeah, absolutely.

00:20:16Guest:That's good.

00:20:17Guest:But she's she.

00:20:19Guest:The thing, I guess, that really kills me is like she and my when she talks about her mother, my grandmother, they're so alike.

00:20:28Guest:They're so the same person that.

00:20:31Guest:I hope like someday before she expires, she sees that she sees that she's you are the daughter of this woman who is fighting the things that you were fighting, except she was fighting them 20 years.

00:20:46Guest:You know, she was fighting them before you.

00:20:48Marc:Yeah.

00:20:49Guest:um it's weird that blindsiding people you know like the the the the parent you fight the most is probably the one you're the most like totally like that yeah and i've seen it oh i see it with my friends i see it all the time yeah and my yeah my mom because my mom talks about like sometimes when she there's like four or five like consistent stories that my mother tells yeah and one of them is about when she got put out like her mom just said get out i don't want you here get out of the house

00:21:13Guest:Um, and she said, and I just, I was outside and I was a court and I was crying and I was begging, I was just begging her, please let me back in, please.

00:21:23Guest:And she said, no, it was like, like in one thing, cause I used to live with her.

00:21:27Guest:Like it was clear.

00:21:28Guest:My grandmother had a lot.

00:21:30Guest:She was an iron rod.

00:21:32Guest:Like this is it.

00:21:33Guest:Yeah.

00:21:34Guest:I have declared, I've made the statement and that's it.

00:21:38Guest:It's not changing.

00:21:39Guest:Right.

00:21:39Guest:Um, and so my mother was like, you know, she talks about how, like how, uh, terrible she felt and how humbled she felt and abandoned.

00:21:48Guest:And she was, I mean, you know, your mother says, get out of my house.

00:21:51Guest:I don't care where you go.

00:21:52Guest:I don't care what happens to you.

00:21:53Guest:What was the reason?

00:21:54Guest:I'm not, there's never been a very clear, uh,

00:21:57Guest:You know what I'm saying?

00:21:58Guest:When you tell that story, it's never like, oh, and this is because I had done this, which means to me, when, you know, people tell stories, you go, so you did something.

00:22:09Guest:Yeah.

00:22:09Guest:Something that even now you go.

00:22:11Guest:That's the missing part.

00:22:12Guest:Yeah.

00:22:13Guest:Somehow this was your fault.

00:22:14Guest:Right.

00:22:16Guest:But.

00:22:16Guest:You had it coming.

00:22:17Guest:Yeah.

00:22:18Guest:Well, that part I wouldn't go that far.

00:22:21Guest:Right.

00:22:21Guest:But you should have known.

00:22:22Guest:Right.

00:22:23Guest:You knew you were dealing with.

00:22:24Guest:Right.

00:22:25Guest:Yeah.

00:22:25Guest:And and so this happened now at the same time when I was, I think, seven, certainly after school.

00:22:34Guest:Yeah.

00:22:34Guest:And my mother had this whole idea of how I was going to live my life and be this different after high school person after high school and after I joined the Marines.

00:22:45Guest:And then she was like, that's not happening.

00:22:51Guest:Because I was 17 when I graduated.

00:22:54Guest:And so, you know, you got to get a parent.

00:22:56Guest:You go and the recruiter's like, okay, sure.

00:23:00Guest:Just take this home and get your mom to sign it.

00:23:01Guest:And she's like, that ain't happening.

00:23:04Guest:I've seen, you know, and part of it was like, I've seen what they did to my brother.

00:23:08Guest:Both my oldest uncle ever died in Vietnam.

00:23:12Guest:Uncle Everett was Army.

00:23:14Guest:uncle william was marines right the marines were so impressed with him and it was the 60s and there was a whole need for negro officers uh-huh that they sent him uh to annapolis they're like you know what we want you to become an officer the academy we're okay with you as an officer yeah so they send him to the academy and he goes back as a captain

00:23:36Guest:but kind of around the time when the war's over, so then the war's over.

00:23:39Guest:And so I grew up around him, and I had a real... I admired him a lot.

00:23:46Guest:There's a lot of stuff about him I didn't like that much, but I had a real admiration for him as a man.

00:23:55Guest:And this is the thing.

00:23:56Guest:You grow up... And that was why I think this started with you talking about my act and my dad.

00:24:02Guest:A lot of my...

00:24:04Guest:talk of my dad.

00:24:06Guest:My dad is an amalgamation of a lot of stuff.

00:24:10Guest:Is he a real person?

00:24:12Guest:My dad is a real person.

00:24:13Guest:The things that my dad did that truly influenced me are things that I still kind of work with on a quieter basis.

00:24:26Guest:Because the dad I talked about on the stage is very much in your face and loud.

00:24:31Guest:That's that voice in my head.

00:24:33Guest:that I kind of give him credit for, but I think my dad wanted to be a lot of things.

00:24:44Guest:I think that my dad, if he were around,

00:24:50Guest:would be it's emotional sorry it's weird that was a weird thing i was gonna say i think he would be proud of me and i know that i never really thought of that because i think that what i did what i was doing when i was doing stand-up i think he would have really been like somebody to brag about that and he wasn't around already

00:25:10Guest:No, my dad died.

00:25:12Guest:My dad's story in my world is pure comedy.

00:25:19Guest:Some of it horribly funny.

00:25:21Guest:I think comedy.

00:25:25Guest:Can I tell you a few things about my dad on the WTF podcast?

00:25:30Guest:The F being father?

00:25:32Guest:Yeah.

00:25:34Guest:I remember early on, my mom used to date this guy, Clinton.

00:25:40Guest:And this guy taught me how to play chess.

00:25:43Guest:And I didn't like this guy.

00:25:47Guest:But at the time, I didn't like him.

00:25:50Guest:How old were you?

00:25:51Guest:around nine or 10.

00:25:55Guest:The deal was Clinton taught me to play chess.

00:25:57Guest:And one day my dad said, he saw there was a chess board at that house.

00:26:03Guest:And he said, oh, I don't know, you know how to play.

00:26:06Guest:And I said, yeah, sure.

00:26:08Guest:So he said, let's play.

00:26:08Guest:So we started to play a game of chess.

00:26:11Guest:And he's awful.

00:26:12Guest:Yeah.

00:26:13Guest:So, you know, I was like, hmm.

00:26:17Guest:All right.

00:26:17Guest:That's the move you're going to make.

00:26:19Guest:But then it got to a point.

00:26:21Guest:I think like a few moves in that I thought, I don't know.

00:26:25Guest:I don't want to beat him.

00:26:26Guest:I don't I don't want to beat my dad.

00:26:28Guest:I don't want to do this.

00:26:29Guest:yeah so i just stopped i was like i was like oh okay and i started making like stupid moves right and then uh and then he won and he was like yeah he said well you know i could help you out teach a few things and i said yeah yeah okay so that was the dynamic that was kind of the thing like it was like i'm protecting him and he's but he's a good guy like so this is the thing like later on once my dad came to me this stuck with me for years

00:26:58Guest:He came to me, he said, you got $2.

00:26:59Guest:And I did.

00:27:02Guest:He said, I need $2.

00:27:03Guest:He said, I just need $2.

00:27:06Guest:I got this $50, but I don't need to be out here in these streets with this $50 bill.

00:27:11Guest:I could use $2, two $1 bills.

00:27:14Guest:I said, here's what we're going to do.

00:27:18Guest:I'm going to give you the $50.

00:27:20Guest:You hold on to that.

00:27:22Guest:You give me the $2.

00:27:24Guest:I'm going to be back in about an hour and a half.

00:27:29Guest:If I don't come back, if I'm not a man of my word, if I don't come back here in an hour and a half, you keep that $50 bill.

00:27:37Guest:Right.

00:27:37Guest:Because you got to be a man of your word.

00:27:40Guest:Yeah.

00:27:41Guest:good okay that's a good deal right yeah you know so i give them the two dollars and i didn't even think about it i guess until like maybe 40 maybe an hour yeah like an hour into it i'm looking out the window i'm rubbing my hands together okay yes yeah i'm about to come up with 50 yeah and um

00:28:05Guest:Then he came back.

00:28:06Guest:He came back within the time limit.

00:28:08Guest:Yeah.

00:28:10Guest:And he gave him my $2 back.

00:28:12Guest:And I gave him his $50 back.

00:28:13Guest:But then for years, I was like, my dad is so... There's a lot of integrity.

00:28:20Guest:My dad's an honest guy.

00:28:22Guest:You know what I mean?

00:28:23Guest:He gave me $50 that I could have if he didn't stick to his word.

00:28:27Guest:I think I was probably in my mid-40s before I thought, really?

00:28:31Guest:Do you really think...

00:28:34Guest:That your dad would have let you keep that $50.

00:28:37Guest:Like if he'd have come back like two hours later and said, hey, man, listen.

00:28:42Guest:Yeah.

00:28:43Guest:I tell you what I'll do.

00:28:44Guest:I'll give you $3 back.

00:28:45Guest:Yeah.

00:28:46Guest:But you're going to give me my money.

00:28:47Guest:Right.

00:28:48Guest:But I don't really ever know.

00:28:50Guest:He might be.

00:28:51Guest:Because there's times with me, like, I take a very hard line about, you know what?

00:28:55Guest:No, I said I was going to be this way.

00:28:57Guest:And so, but I think some of that is because I'm still clinging to that, like, childhood thing.

00:29:02Guest:Like, that's what I always remember about him.

00:29:05Guest:And so, you know, we catch up and we made some things.

00:29:09Guest:He started, I said, I got to start exercising.

00:29:11Guest:I'm strong.

00:29:12Guest:I used to be a real scrawny kid.

00:29:14Guest:I said, I'm, you know.

00:29:15Guest:I need to bulk up a little bit, you know.

00:29:18Guest:And so he would send me exercises he's found, like, you know, and just stuff.

00:29:24Guest:Hey, man, you know, good to talk to you.

00:29:26Guest:Good to see you.

00:29:26Guest:Right.

00:29:27Guest:Six months later, I get this call.

00:29:29Guest:He's in the VA.

00:29:31Guest:Sick.

00:29:32Guest:He's got cancer.

00:29:33Guest:He's dying.

00:29:34Guest:Yeah.

00:29:35Guest:He's almost dead.

00:29:36Guest:Yeah.

00:29:37Guest:You know.

00:29:38Guest:And I said, fuck, that never came up.

00:29:41Guest:never came up he knew he must have known it's like six months come on uh and you know like for me thinking thinking back at it it was like because the call was so out of the blue so now it's like oh okay so like he gets this diagnosis and it's like let me try to tie up some loose ends yeah he's got this kid let me go talk to him and so um you know i was just like what

00:30:07Guest:okay you know my uncle his brother calls me and says yeah your daddy you gotta you're gonna go see him you know and I go yeah yeah so I go to the VA um and I was a little pissed you know because I'm like what why why didn't you you could have talked about this but I you know I'm in my head I'm back and forth yeah I guess he didn't know yeah why why talk about this thing that's bothering him and he wants to know what what's up with me and I guess he wants to know that

00:30:34Guest:I'm going to continue my journey and be okay.

00:30:39Guest:And I go and they let me in.

00:30:40Guest:And it's intensive care.

00:30:41Guest:So it was only a few people allowed at the time.

00:30:43Guest:And this nurse lets me in.

00:30:46Guest:And I go in.

00:30:47Guest:And like I said, I got all that in my head.

00:30:49Guest:This guy is being ravaged.

00:30:52Guest:So I know he knew he had this.

00:30:54Guest:Now it's like, look at it.

00:30:55Guest:It's so thin and weird.

00:30:58Guest:And I was like, I don't know what to say to you, man.

00:31:00Guest:And he's not conscious, really.

00:31:03Guest:I said, I just...

00:31:04Guest:I said, I'm kind of mad, but I don't want to be mad because I, you know, I want you to know that I'm, you know, and then the nurse taps me on my shoulder and says, piss me off.

00:31:15Guest:She goes, you're Hutcherson?

00:31:16Guest:And I go, yeah.

00:31:17Guest:She goes, over there.

00:31:20Guest:come on the wrong guy i was talking to the wrong so then i go over here but it's the same thing when i go over to the bed that she pointed me to i'm still like he's not he's out he's unconscious and and unrecognizable it's still like right yeah yeah i was still like okay

00:31:38Guest:Yeah, I can't even work myself up to what happened over there.

00:31:42Guest:You had a dry run in rehearsal.

00:31:45Guest:But that rehearsal was it.

00:31:46Guest:That's all that was in me.

00:31:47Guest:I said, man, I don't know what to say to you.

00:31:52Guest:I don't know if you can even hear me.

00:31:54Guest:And I'm looking at the...

00:31:56Guest:is there anything that's gonna show that there's a hint of recognition to the fact that I'm even here?

00:32:06Guest:And I'm like, no, I don't think so, you know?

00:32:09Guest:And I kind of patted his hand and I said, well, I came by, you know, I'm gonna come by again.

00:32:15Guest:And I left, you know, and I think like two days later, that same uncle called me up and we have issues.

00:32:22Guest:We had issues, we're very cool now.

00:32:24Guest:Because this is what he does.

00:32:26Guest:calls me up you know your daddy dead now right okay no no i didn't know that yeah yeah yeah he just did they just passed when i guess that he they the hospital had his number right right yeah and so it just happened and he was like yeah well that's that's over so the deal is and where he his the dad on stage came from

00:32:49Guest:So then I get this call, basically, like, well, you're 18 now.

00:32:53Guest:This is March, actually.

00:32:55Guest:I just turned 18 in October.

00:32:57Guest:Now it's March.

00:32:59Guest:And you're the executor of your dad's estate.

00:33:03Guest:You have to bury him.

00:33:04Guest:You have to take care of all of these things.

00:33:07Guest:Yeah.

00:33:09Yeah.

00:33:10Guest:You know, I called my friends who all had dads except for one who I think didn't.

00:33:16Guest:Well, I mean, everybody obviously has a dad.

00:33:18Guest:Right.

00:33:18Guest:You know, didn't know his dad.

00:33:21Guest:And they were, you know, consoling, but they didn't really get it.

00:33:25Guest:Because then there was a whole thing of like, dude, you never talked about your dad before.

00:33:29Guest:I go, yeah.

00:33:31Yeah.

00:33:31Guest:They're like, are you worried?

00:33:32Guest:Are you upset?

00:33:33Guest:I was like, yeah, I guess.

00:33:36Guest:I don't know.

00:33:36Guest:You know, when the one group, I had like three friends who kind of took me out drinking.

00:33:42Guest:So we got like, and we had the worst.

00:33:43Guest:We had like Thunderbird.

00:33:44Guest:Right.

00:33:45Guest:And Jack Daniels.

00:33:46Guest:And we kind of hung out.

00:33:48Guest:and uh it's actually a graveyard which is ridiculous and i drank uh i basically drank all night but felt nothing yeah you know like never i didn't remember feeling drunk and i totally remember like that night and then the next day because the next day i went to get my uncles and i was driving around yeah and they were like you were drinking last night and i said yeah i was and they were like

00:34:12Guest:why do you think that you're pretty steady yeah i mean i guess on some emotional i was trying to anesthetize that feeling that i did just like i don't even know what this feeling is but it's wrong you know yeah it wasn't grief it was it just sort of like it didn't have an effect that you thought it should yeah yeah you know i remember years ago i went to see a guy who talked about vietnam yeah he was uh uh he said that he worked in the uh he sorted body parts right

00:34:39Guest:So this is where I worked in like whatever the field hospital where I had to identify this body part goes with this.

00:34:45Guest:And he said, he said, I drink two pints of Jack Daniels every day, every day.

00:34:53Guest:He said, I just drank that to get through it.

00:34:54Guest:He said, and I can't.

00:34:56Guest:There's nobody that can tell you that they ever saw me drunk.

00:34:59Guest:it was like just that is what i needed to deal with what i was doing right and i think that that drinking on that night was what i needed sure to deal with this thing like all these we're never going to have a discussion right we're never there's a million things that that are never going to happen right um

00:35:17Guest:for me and my dad.

00:35:19Guest:And I guess I had always sort of stuffed that away because he existed and I knew where he was.

00:35:26Guest:And it was like, well, at some point we'll have a relationship, but now that's not the case.

00:35:31Guest:So yeah, that was, that's the extent.

00:35:35Guest:So when did you start doing comedy?

00:35:37Guest:I started doing comedy.

00:35:38Guest:I started writing comedy.

00:35:41Guest:What happened was I was in, this is another, I don't know, maybe it was my dad, maybe somebody.

00:35:48Guest:Basically, we didn't believe in loans.

00:35:50Guest:I don't believe in loans.

00:35:51Guest:So to go to college, you got to work or live on some saved money.

00:35:58Guest:And so...

00:36:00Guest:And I didn't even wanna go.

00:36:02Guest:I was like, I don't see the point of this.

00:36:04Guest:I struggled for the last year of high school, not academically, but just like, what is this about?

00:36:10Guest:But anyway, at the Community College of Baltimore, I met a guy who wanted to do comedy.

00:36:18Guest:He wanted to be partners.

00:36:19Guest:I had no interest anymore in hard news, solid things.

00:36:23Guest:I was all about features.

00:36:24Guest:I was a feature writer for the college newspaper.

00:36:27Marc:So you'd be a reporter?

00:36:28Guest:No, I was actually in school for nursing.

00:36:32Guest:I was going to be a nurse.

00:36:34Marc:And did your mother put you out already?

00:36:36Guest:Yeah, she had.

00:36:37Guest:I was out.

00:36:38Guest:Was that a hostile thing?

00:36:40Guest:It was totally hostile.

00:36:41Guest:It was absolutely hostile.

00:36:42Guest:She was mad.

00:36:43Guest:What was she mad about?

00:36:44Guest:She was mad that I wasn't living, which I think was the exact same thing with her mother.

00:36:49Guest:I had a notion of what you would be like as an adult or as a young adult.

00:36:55Guest:and you're not living up to it.

00:36:56Guest:It was just like, I didn't, like I said, I wasn't really interested in a college thing.

00:37:02Guest:I had a job.

00:37:03Guest:I got a job immediately out of high school, but I was unfocused.

00:37:11Guest:And she was like, focus.

00:37:13Guest:You gotta focus, and the way out of this is college.

00:37:18Guest:And I was like, I'm not so sure the college is for me.

00:37:21Guest:And the way out of this, this isn't so bad, which parents hate.

00:37:27Guest:This is okay.

00:37:28Guest:We're all right.

00:37:29Guest:We're not okay.

00:37:31Guest:For a living?

00:37:31Guest:Yeah.

00:37:32Guest:I worked in a pharmacy.

00:37:33Guest:I started as just a clerk, but then the guy trained me.

00:37:37Guest:So I was like, the pharmacy tech.

00:37:38Guest:Okay.

00:37:39Marc:But that wasn't your future.

00:37:41Guest:No, but it could have been.

00:37:42Guest:Well, that was a whole deal, like kind of going into nursing.

00:37:44Guest:I was like, well, I could go into pharmacy or I could be a pharmacy tech.

00:37:48Guest:Pharmacy techs actually do the work.

00:37:52Guest:Yeah.

00:37:53Guest:The pharmacist takes the credit.

00:37:56Marc:But it wasn't necessarily something you want to do with your future.

00:37:58Marc:You're just doing a job.

00:37:59Guest:right you know but it's something i could have done for money and been fine right she didn't want she wasn't having it she was like dude you got to follow your thing you got to be like you know parents do that thing of like find yourself and you go well i'm right here i found myself right that's not you though so anyway i go and i say well uh okay um

00:38:20Guest:I mean, this guy, this guy's like, you know, basically I used to joke around the office.

00:38:26Marc:But eventually you went to community college and you're writing.

00:38:28Guest:I go to community college and yeah, I'm writing on the school paper because that was more fun and I enjoy writing.

00:38:34Marc:And your mom was happy?

00:38:35Guest:No.

00:38:36No.

00:38:36Guest:She's like, you're doing some more stuff.

00:38:39Guest:This is after I got put out, so we're not really communicating.

00:38:44Guest:What I do, I do.

00:38:47Guest:She probably cares, but I wasn't trying to open up to her.

00:38:49Guest:You came back around, though.

00:38:50Guest:Yeah, totally.

00:38:51Guest:I go, and I joke around in the office.

00:38:56Guest:I joke around a lot in the office of the newspaper.

00:39:00Guest:This guy goes, I'm thinking of going to this comedy club downtown.

00:39:04Guest:uh but we might it might be better off if like we're partners you want to partner up yeah and i go ah yeah sure why not you know whatever what the hell try it and um and so then he starts setting uh rehearsal times and he's got a schedule like let's get together and write

00:39:23Guest:i'm like dude are you crazy this is suddenly this is school again yeah do you understand were you performing as a team no this was the thing i'm like you get why i'm in community college right right because this is a last ditch effort yeah i i didn't this wasn't the plan yeah so he was like well i really want to do this i go here's what we'll do then

00:39:47Guest:why don't you run tell me some of the stuff that you want to do and he he goes through some jokes horrible yeah horrible were you a comedy fan i was a big fan of comedy um and uh and i say to this guy i'll write these i'll fix these jokes for you yeah you just go up

00:40:06Guest:I'll write.

00:40:07Guest:I'll do.

00:40:08Guest:Yeah.

00:40:08Guest:You and I are going to work on your writing.

00:40:12Guest:Right.

00:40:13Guest:But as a team, I don't know.

00:40:16Guest:So we go down.

00:40:17Guest:And it's a big splash.

00:40:20Guest:It's like open mic night.

00:40:21Guest:He gets up.

00:40:21Guest:People are like, wow, that guy is funny.

00:40:23Marc:With your jokes.

00:40:24Marc:Sure.

00:40:25Guest:Yeah.

00:40:26Guest:With a derivative of his.

00:40:28Guest:I'll say a couple of his premises.

00:40:30Guest:Yeah.

00:40:31Guest:But then, yeah, my jokes.

00:40:33Guest:And then.

00:40:35Guest:And what we didn't know was the whole notion of like working on a set, working on a routine.

00:40:39Guest:Right.

00:40:39Guest:So we basically like, well, we did those jokes.

00:40:41Guest:And the next week we went back with all new jokes.

00:40:43Guest:Right.

00:40:44Guest:And then again and again and again.

00:40:45Marc:That must have impressed the open micers.

00:40:47Marc:And there you go.

00:40:48Guest:Not so much the open micers, but certainly the club owners.

00:40:50Guest:Right.

00:40:51Guest:You know, so they were like, geez, this guy.

00:40:53Guest:About him.

00:40:53Marc:Yeah.

00:40:54Guest:Yeah.

00:40:54Guest:So when did you start doing it on your own?

00:40:56Guest:uh i guess about maybe two years after and it was really a matter the deal was they didn't know who i was sure that they didn't know i was writing this stuff and um and then one day and we started out a writer

00:41:12Guest:I started out a writer.

00:41:13Guest:Yeah.

00:41:14Guest:Exactly.

00:41:14Guest:But yeah.

00:41:15Guest:Yeah.

00:41:16Guest:As far as I started out.

00:41:18Guest:You knew enough to know that.

00:41:20Guest:I started out a save.

00:41:21Guest:I was saving this guy.

00:41:23Guest:Yeah.

00:41:24Marc:But it's interesting, though, that you were approaching jokes.

00:41:26Marc:You had a sense of it.

00:41:27Marc:Yeah, exactly.

00:41:28Guest:Yeah.

00:41:29Guest:And a sense of how to act on stage.

00:41:30Guest:Right.

00:41:30Guest:But then the thing is how I started out helping other people.

00:41:34Guest:Right.

00:41:35Guest:Because after a while, you know, like after after the show and you sit around and you're talking and people come over and I started helping other people.

00:41:45Guest:Yeah.

00:41:45Guest:Right.

00:41:46Guest:You should do this.

00:41:47Guest:You know that thing you do with the demon?

00:41:49Guest:And so they're like, this guy's funny.

00:41:52Guest:And then it becomes this thing where we kind of went out.

00:41:54Guest:We would always hang out after the show.

00:41:57Guest:It was always like, we're the comedians at Baltimore.

00:42:01Guest:And they started to get it.

00:42:03Guest:They started to go...

00:42:05Guest:one-on-one when you're with the two of them this is the funny guy right this guy is not so fast or funny right you know and they were like okay so you're writing his stuff right oh okay we get it yeah and so then there was this why don't you go up what's your deal like we're hanging out with you you're funny and blah blah and i was like i don't know and

00:42:24Guest:And then finally, I make this pact.

00:42:27Guest:I go like, there was this one guy who used to come.

00:42:29Guest:Yeah.

00:42:30Guest:The guy who actually, the first, the guy who got me, he was a drug dealer.

00:42:36Guest:And he used to come.

00:42:38Guest:And this was like a weird thing.

00:42:39Guest:Like, I didn't know he was a drug dealer.

00:42:40Guest:Yeah.

00:42:41Guest:But the deal was he would come and then he would disappear.

00:42:43Guest:Right.

00:42:44Guest:Come open mic night, disappear.

00:42:45Guest:Weeks.

00:42:46Guest:And then come back and be in the same place.

00:42:49Guest:Yeah.

00:42:50Guest:Like, you think if you went away, you thought about something.

00:42:52Guest:Right.

00:42:52Guest:Came back, you're much better.

00:42:53Right.

00:42:54Guest:What did he do on comedy?

00:42:56Guest:Yeah, he did comedy.

00:42:56Guest:He'd get on stage and he'd just be like, what is this guy doing?

00:43:00Guest:And then I said, if that guy ever comes back, the day that guy comes back, I'll get on stage.

00:43:06Guest:Because I can't stand to see the audience tortured by that guy.

00:43:12Guest:Right.

00:43:12Guest:He comes back.

00:43:13Guest:And I went up.

00:43:14Guest:The arrogance.

00:43:16Guest:I went up with so much.

00:43:18Guest:Because of everything I just told you.

00:43:20Guest:Because in my head, I'm like, I'm writing jokes for that guy.

00:43:23Guest:I'm writing jokes for this guy.

00:43:25Guest:I'm constantly coming up with tags and punchlines.

00:43:29Guest:I got to write.

00:43:30Guest:I'm going to write five minutes.

00:43:31Guest:You know what?

00:43:32Guest:I'm going to get up there and do five minutes.

00:43:34Guest:You clowns.

00:43:36Guest:I'll show you.

00:43:37Guest:It's a whole other thing.

00:43:39Guest:I got on stage like, oh.

00:43:41Guest:It's just a different world.

00:43:44Guest:Looking out at the people, looking back at you with the expectation in your eyes.

00:43:50Guest:And I just, I mumbled through some stuff.

00:43:54Guest:I got nothing.

00:43:55Guest:I got no love.

00:43:57Guest:And then I attacked some people.

00:44:00Guest:I mean, I call it a tact.

00:44:02Guest:I tried to talk to some people in the crowd.

00:44:04Guest:My heart is pounding.

00:44:06Guest:And it was awful.

00:44:07Marc:It's awful.

00:44:10Marc:And what happens when you get off?

00:44:11Guest:And so I get off and I was like, that is awful.

00:44:14Guest:That is the worst thing ever.

00:44:18Guest:I got to go on next week.

00:44:19Guest:Well, this is my thing.

00:44:22Guest:And that voice in my head thing is then I get forensic with it.

00:44:25Guest:I got to figure out all the variables.

00:44:27Guest:That doesn't make sense to me.

00:44:29Guest:I shouldn't have.

00:44:30Guest:Like all that other stuff I thought before about how I write for everybody else and I do this and that.

00:44:36Guest:So that shouldn't have happened.

00:44:37Marc:Right.

00:44:38Guest:So what happened?

00:44:39Guest:Like, okay, well, I wasn't prepared, obviously, so I got to prepare.

00:44:43Guest:But then all of those things, for me to suss out all the variables, I got to keep going back up.

00:44:48Marc:Right.

00:44:49Marc:You got to master this thing.

00:44:50Marc:You got to fix it.

00:44:51Guest:I have to, exactly.

00:44:52Guest:Got to save face.

00:44:53Guest:Right.

00:44:54Guest:And then I had a girlfriend at the time who was like,

00:44:56Guest:100 behind who was actually in the army she was like i had that was my military connection she was like you're gonna just not do it again i think maybe maybe that's best for me to not do it again she's like i don't know you i don't know that guy yeah and i said yeah you're right i'm gonna do it again i gotta do it i gotta kill it so um so yeah and then i had a whole conversation with andre where i go look here's what we gotta do because i'm gonna keep writing for you yeah

00:45:22Guest:But obviously, you know, we got to differentiate.

00:45:26Guest:So let's make a decision like you like he's very political.

00:45:30Guest:Yeah.

00:45:30Guest:He's like you like the political stuff.

00:45:32Guest:Yeah.

00:45:33Guest:I'm going to write that.

00:45:34Guest:I'm going to write these jokes for you.

00:45:36Guest:Yeah.

00:45:36Guest:And then I'm going to write the more lighthearted family junk.

00:45:40Guest:yeah for me you know but it's all it's all in the in the name of laughs yeah um and he said yeah cool for like a couple weeks and then he got to the point where he said you know what I think I got it yeah I can write my own jokes yeah and uh

00:45:57Guest:internet freed me you know and the only thing that i did make sure of was like to never step on his toes like like if he got up with some premise i go okay i'll leave that alone but um but uh so now you're doing it yeah i'm doing it

00:46:12Guest:And now, without that anchor, without being constrained, we're, like, working for everybody else.

00:46:19Guest:You know, suddenly, in a few months, I'm emceeing.

00:46:23Guest:Then I do a commercial.

00:46:24Guest:Like, there's this local commercial.

00:46:26Guest:These people come by and they see us.

00:46:28Guest:And they hire me and a couple other guys from the club.

00:46:31Guest:And we do these commercials.

00:46:33Guest:And now I'm known.

00:46:35Guest:Like, people, I go around.

00:46:36Guest:I walk around Baltimore.

00:46:38Guest:And people, like, I had made up.

00:46:40Guest:It's for a car dealership.

00:46:41Guest:Yeah.

00:46:42Guest:And I had made up the Reverend Mitsubishi.

00:46:44Guest:Yeah.

00:46:45Guest:Some people were like, oh, he's the Reverend.

00:46:46Guest:That's the guy.

00:46:47Guest:Mitsubishi, that's that guy, you know.

00:46:49Guest:And it's great in the city.

00:46:51Guest:It's just like being a local sportscaster.

00:46:53Guest:Sure.

00:46:53Guest:You're great in your city.

00:46:55Guest:Yeah.

00:46:55Guest:You step 20 miles out.

00:46:57Guest:Nobody knows who you are.

00:46:58Guest:Nobody cares.

00:46:59Guest:Yeah.

00:47:01Guest:Yeah.

00:47:01Guest:So, yeah, I started doing that, and then I started getting bookings.

00:47:04Guest:Didn't even have a phone.

00:47:05Guest:To book me, people called Dan Rose.

00:47:08Guest:Yeah.

00:47:09Guest:Because they were like, Dan had a phone.

00:47:12Guest:The way I was working, the way I had budgeted my money, I was like, I don't need to pay a phone.

00:47:19Guest:Everybody I know, I just go see them.

00:47:21Guest:So you did shit to kind of hold yourself back on some level.

00:47:25Guest:Still, you know, from the beginning.

00:47:27Right.

00:47:27Guest:I'm so afraid.

00:47:29Guest:I'm making it harder for myself.

00:47:32Guest:And that's the thing where I'm at now.

00:47:34Guest:I'm still doing that.

00:47:36Guest:Or I started doing it again.

00:47:37Guest:And now I got to stop.

00:47:40Guest:Because now I make it all about my kid.

00:47:42Guest:And I'm like, you know what?

00:47:44Guest:That kid doesn't deserve to have me go.

00:47:48Guest:yeah, you know what, I turn my back on comedy because you need me too much.

00:47:54Guest:You know what I mean?

00:47:55Guest:I gotta be home and take care of you, whereas there'd be people who go, what a hero.

00:48:00Guest:I'm like, no, not really.

00:48:01Guest:What a coward.

00:48:03Guest:They don't... He's undiagnosed is the most true thing.

00:48:08Guest:Yeah.

00:48:08Guest:But it's clearly like cerebral palsy and, you know, he's nonverbal.

00:48:14Guest:Yeah.

00:48:14Guest:He's not mobile.

00:48:16Guest:You know, his limbs don't obey his commands.

00:48:19Guest:Uh-huh.

00:48:22Guest:And...

00:48:24Guest:I mean, there's a host of things to deal with.

00:48:30Guest:And he's also, in my estimation, very smart, very clever.

00:48:41Guest:And the thing I realize about kids, if there's anything about them, they absolutely kind of come, if you're paying attention to them,

00:48:50Guest:They're here to help you, I think.

00:48:53Guest:I really feel that way.

00:48:54Guest:I feel like, and we're both of them.

00:48:56Guest:I said this to a friend of mine.

00:48:58Guest:I said, you know what I realized?

00:48:59Guest:There's nothing I say to my kids.

00:49:01Guest:There's not one piece of, and I'm talking about a 10-year-old and a 7-year-old.

00:49:06Guest:There's not one piece of advice that I say to them that is not absolutely intended for me.

00:49:13Absolutely.

00:49:13Guest:Absolutely.

00:49:15Guest:Some circumstances change, but you go, look, who cares what the other kids in your class think about you?

00:49:23Guest:What's important is how you feel and what you do.

00:49:26Guest:You can have that argument with them and then look at yourself in the mirror and go...

00:49:30Guest:Well, really?

00:49:32Guest:You want to tell yourself that right now?

00:49:34Guest:You're still telling yourself that.

00:49:35Guest:Exactly.

00:49:36Guest:You know what I mean?

00:49:39Guest:But they make it more concise.

00:49:42Guest:They make it more clear.

00:49:43Guest:And this is the deal with my son and the fear and all the stuff that we talked about.

00:49:48Guest:There's stuff that my son can do.

00:49:54Guest:Yeah.

00:49:56Guest:that he doesn't do because he's a 10-year-old boy in a wheelchair that people have affection for.

00:50:05Guest:And so as I'm constantly saying to him, dude, you have to stop relying on that.

00:50:11Guest:Because there's going to be a point where he goes to the school where they have 30% of the kids are special needs.

00:50:19Guest:Everything.

00:50:20Guest:All along the spectrum of special needs.

00:50:22Guest:And not to say spectrum because that leans to autism.

00:50:25Guest:All different kinds of special needs, yeah.

00:50:27Guest:But everything.

00:50:28Guest:And this is what puts me in a place where I'm like, I guess, any other parent.

00:50:33Guest:You want your kid, you want to say to your kid, you understand how lucky you are?

00:50:36Guest:You understand what a great opportunity this is?

00:50:38Guest:Yeah.

00:50:39Guest:And in a way, my kids say, yeah, I totally get it, which is why I don't talk, which is why I make sure.

00:50:44Guest:Yeah.

00:50:45Guest:He does this.

00:50:46Guest:He'll start crying and kicking.

00:50:49Guest:And I go, here's the deal.

00:50:52Guest:And I've been doing this for four years now.

00:50:54Guest:I'm like, what do you need?

00:50:58Guest:You know, in Chinese, yes is hi.

00:51:02Guest:You can say hi, you know.

00:51:04Guest:So, instead of you trying to make your mouth, wrap your mouth around the word yes, here's the deal.

00:51:14Guest:When you want something, if I ask you something and the answer is affirmative, if the answer is yes, say hi.

00:51:20Guest:Do you get it?

00:51:20Guest:And I'm going to write down all these things.

00:51:23Guest:Like, I'll educate your teachers.

00:51:24Guest:It's going to be your language.

00:51:26Guest:Right.

00:51:26Guest:You know, it's going to be Zay's language based on what he's based on what you can do based on me seeing what you can do.

00:51:34Guest:Did he get it?

00:51:35Guest:I think he absolutely gets it.

00:51:36Guest:Does he do it?

00:51:37Guest:No, dude, here's what I'm going to do.

00:51:40Guest:I'm going to scream and cry, and you are going to figure it out like everybody else.

00:51:48Guest:I mean, that's what infants do.

00:51:49Guest:Like, this is what I say to them.

00:51:50Guest:I go, that's what infants do.

00:51:52Guest:They cry.

00:51:53Guest:The parents pick them up, and they say, what's wrong?

00:51:56Guest:Are you hungry?

00:51:57Guest:You got to go to the bathroom.

00:51:58Guest:You need to be burned.

00:51:59Guest:And they...

00:52:01Guest:figure it out eventually yeah and then you know and then the kid gets satisfied and then they get whatever they what they get out of that is like yeah okay you care about me you hung out you figured it out yeah and i didn't have to jump through any hoops exactly or try to do something this is what and so that we have that conversation constantly

00:52:20Guest:But at the school, they do have to jump through that hoop.

00:52:24Guest:If he's in class and he starts screaming, well, the teacher's got to figure it out.

00:52:28Guest:And then sometimes she just says to, there's an aide, and he goes, take him to the bathroom.

00:52:34Guest:And I talk to the aides, and I'll go, what happened?

00:52:37Guest:And they'll go, well, like he started screaming.

00:52:40Guest:And I said, it sounds like if they describe the day, they describe what was going on, especially if they were doing math.

00:52:46Guest:Yeah.

00:52:47Guest:And I'll say, so what happened?

00:52:50Guest:So you took him out?

00:52:51Guest:And I'll say, yeah, well, so we left to go to the bathroom.

00:52:55Guest:And then he stopped.

00:52:56Guest:And I go, let me ask you this.

00:52:58Guest:Did he stop the minute you walked out of the class?

00:53:00Guest:Or did he stop when you got to the bathroom?

00:53:02Guest:And they'll go...

00:53:04Guest:oh yeah you know he actually stopped like as soon as we walked out of the class and i said and he didn't go to the bathroom right and i go yeah no he's just kind of sat yeah he sat and then i got him up and then we went back to the class and he started screaming again and i go dude he doesn't want to do math doesn't want yeah exactly he doesn't want to do math and then you you do this thing this you go to this infantile behavior because you know there's going to be more

00:53:28Guest:You're going to get more credit for that.

00:53:31Guest:There's going to be more sympathy.

00:53:33Guest:And then I want to go – I don't want to go.

00:53:35Guest:I say to him, I go, look, that sympathy goes away.

00:53:39Guest:Trust me, when you're the 15-year-old screaming like a baby –

00:53:43Guest:In the corner, people are going, can somebody please shut that kid up?

00:53:47Guest:You're telling him this.

00:53:49Guest:I'm telling him this all the time.

00:53:50Guest:I'm telling him all the time.

00:53:52Marc:So this is the struggle.

00:53:53Guest:Come on, man.

00:53:55Guest:This is the beautiful struggle.

00:53:57Guest:And at the same time, like I'm saying to you, I have these long conversations with him.

00:54:02Guest:And then I go and look in the mirror and go,

00:54:04Guest:Really, dude?

00:54:05Guest:Really?

00:54:06Guest:Yeah.

00:54:06Guest:You just had that?

00:54:07Guest:You're sitting here crying and screaming, oh, I'm writing for everybody else.

00:54:11Guest:I need to get myself together and back on stage.

00:54:15Guest:Everything you say to him.

00:54:16Marc:So this is something that's eating at you every day.

00:54:20Marc:um well i mean yeah i mean i can't say eating at me but it's in my head it's present right so let's go back so okay so you do comedy eventually moved to new york where i met you yeah and you're doing those shows that i did the caroline's comedy hour the evening at the improv we're all getting those first breaks yeah yeah uh so when so your first job was you go to snl the writing job first writing job but how long were you in comedy then like five like six seven years

00:54:45Guest:Maybe six, well, I'll tell you this.

00:54:48Guest:Yeah, because I remember this.

00:54:50Guest:There was a show at SNL.

00:54:53Guest:I remember the Jordan, is it Michael Jordan and Public Enemy?

00:54:57Guest:That was the year my, that was my 10-year reunion, 10-year high school reunion.

00:55:02Guest:And I thought it out and I was like, okay, so I started, I graduated at 17.

00:55:07Guest:I started comedy at 22.

00:55:08Guest:Yeah.

00:55:11Guest:So I'm 27 now.

00:55:13Guest:so five years five years from when i started you're working at snl so now at that point though were you like you know this this comedy life looks you know why not take that gig the deal with the snl thing was i miscalculated yeah i basically you know i worked i'm from baltimore i'm used to going up and down 95 right to do my gigs every once in a while i go west never came as far as out here

00:55:39Marc:Doing the Jersey shit, Boston shit.

00:55:41Guest:Yeah, I did the Jersey.

00:55:42Guest:I never, I did Boston shit.

00:55:44Guest:Philly shit.

00:55:44Guest:I did the Philly shit, but I didn't do Boston shit until I moved to New York.

00:55:48Guest:Right.

00:55:50Guest:I was doing a little, Chillicothe, Ohio.

00:55:53Guest:Yeah.

00:55:53Guest:Midland.

00:55:54Guest:Prestonsburg, Kentucky.

00:55:56Guest:I had gotten to the point where I was headlining.

00:55:57Guest:Yeah.

00:55:58Guest:And then I got to the point where I realized the only thing I like about headlining was every once in a while, a nice small crowd to talk to.

00:56:05Guest:um can i can i say like one quick story yeah like the one time i realized this is what i love to do but this is what i love to do with these people yeah me and patten yeah in alaska yeah right uh i don't know if it's juno some one of those towns and one of the cities and uh we do it we do our show i think we were there for a week and we we you know it's fine a week was fine last show yeah

00:56:33Guest:Six people.

00:56:35Guest:Yeah.

00:56:36Guest:Best show of the week.

00:56:37Guest:Two couples.

00:56:37Guest:Yeah.

00:56:38Guest:Well, for me.

00:56:38Guest:Yeah.

00:56:39Guest:Patton was like, I don't know what the hell this is.

00:56:41Guest:And six black people.

00:56:42Guest:Right.

00:56:42Guest:Six black people of Alaska.

00:56:44Guest:Uh-huh.

00:56:46Guest:And they come to this show.

00:56:48Guest:And like, yeah, Patton goes up and he does his thing.

00:56:51Guest:He does his Patton thing.

00:56:51Guest:And he's fine.

00:56:52Guest:And they're very respectful of him.

00:56:54Guest:You know, it's like Patton's like, if I was a superhero, juice would come out of my fingers.

00:56:57Guest:Right.

00:56:58Guest:Yeah.

00:56:59Guest:Early Patton.

00:57:00Guest:Yeah.

00:57:02Guest:And so he comes, he sits down, he goes, man, I don't know what to tell you.

00:57:04Guest:Good luck.

00:57:07Guest:And I get up and I start talking to them.

00:57:09Guest:Yeah.

00:57:10Guest:And I asked a guy, it was two couples and then two, you know, and I said, I said, you guys...

00:57:19Guest:Like when you came in and you noticed that the crowd wasn't filling up around you, did you think for a second, maybe we shouldn't stay?

00:57:27Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:57:28Guest:I always wondered that.

00:57:29Guest:And they said, this guy said, well, this was the last night.

00:57:33Guest:Yeah.

00:57:33Guest:He said, well, we made this plan to come here and we came to see you.

00:57:40Guest:I was like, but now, now the pressure's on.

00:57:43Guest:And now, and like everything I'm just talking to you about, like the old, like I'm responsible for these people.

00:57:49Guest:This is a community thing.

00:57:51Guest:These people live all the way in Alaska.

00:57:52Guest:I have no idea what their life is like.

00:57:55Guest:But there's six black people who came to see me.

00:57:59Guest:And then these people start coming in and being loud.

00:58:04Guest:And the deal was there was some wedding at another hotel across the street.

00:58:08Guest:And it was so crowded over there that they decided to come over here.

00:58:12Guest:And this doesn't look like a comedy show.

00:58:15Guest:This looks like one guy on stage talking to his friends.

00:58:17Guest:So then I got to deal with them.

00:58:19Guest:But then I start talking about them to these people.

00:58:21Guest:I'm like, see, now if that was us, they were all like, oh, these loud black people.

00:58:26Guest:And they started laughing.

00:58:27Guest:And I think I did like half act.

00:58:29Guest:have conversations with those people.

00:58:31Guest:And I was like, this is good.

00:58:34Guest:This is what I want to do.

00:58:35Guest:And this was years after I couldn't figure out what the hell with SNL.

00:58:41Guest:So SNL was, money-wise,

00:58:46Guest:I was like, where's my money going?

00:58:48Guest:New York is expensive as hell.

00:58:50Guest:And it just got to that point.

00:58:51Guest:I was like, where the hell is my money?

00:58:53Guest:I'm very good with my money.

00:58:55Guest:And it's leaving.

00:58:58Guest:It's going too fast.

00:58:59Guest:And I think at the point I was doing SNL, I was doing, I had catch.

00:59:03Guest:I was emceeing a catch on Sunday night and Tuesday night.

00:59:06Marc:Catch Rising Star.

00:59:07Marc:Yes.

00:59:07Marc:It was like early 90s, yeah.

00:59:09Guest:Early 90s, the Louis Ferranda years.

00:59:12Guest:Oh, God, yeah.

00:59:15Guest:And I was still working around, you know.

00:59:17Guest:And I didn't understand what the hell was up with the money.

00:59:22Guest:And I realized, yeah, I'm driving twice.

00:59:24Guest:The gig that I used to have every year in North Carolina, I used to drive from Baltimore to North Carolina.

00:59:30Marc:Right, so now you're flying.

00:59:31Marc:Yeah.

00:59:31Guest:No, I'm still driving, but I'm driving down.

00:59:35Guest:First, I'm doing a New Jersey Turnpike, and then I'm going over the bridge.

00:59:39Guest:I'm paying these tolls.

00:59:40Guest:I'm spending more money eating food.

00:59:42Guest:New York, just coming through the damn tunnel is $5.

00:59:45Guest:I come in, and everything is $2 more than it is living in Baltimore.

00:59:49Guest:Everything is crazy.

00:59:50Marc:And you're doing SNL.

00:59:51Marc:Well, and that's why I did SNL.

00:59:53Guest:I did SNL because I was like, this is a steady paycheck.

00:59:56Okay.

00:59:56Guest:Who was the cast then?

01:00:00Guest:The cast cast was Dana.

01:00:03Guest:Dana was kind of, it's not right to say in decline.

01:00:07Guest:Yeah.

01:00:07Guest:But Mike was definitely in ascendancy.

01:00:09Guest:Yeah.

01:00:11Guest:So it was Dana and Mike and Phil Hartman, who was a stellar individual.

01:00:16Guest:Who was Update?

01:00:19Guest:Update was Nealon.

01:00:20Guest:Yeah.

01:00:20Guest:Kevin Nealon.

01:00:21Guest:What's his name?

01:00:22Guest:Dennis Miller just left.

01:00:26Guest:And then the boys.

01:00:28Guest:Rock and Sandler and Rob Schneider and Spade.

01:00:33Guest:Yeah.

01:00:34Marc:Good cast.

01:00:35Guest:Yeah, and Farley, who, you know, was doing his thing already.

01:00:41Guest:But yeah, yeah, definitely a good group of people.

01:00:44Guest:And then the year after me, they hired Ellen, Claycorn, and Timmy was there.

01:00:51Guest:And this was the thing, like, Tim, between Tim and Chris...

01:00:57Guest:And Ellen.

01:00:58Guest:Yeah.

01:00:59Guest:Probably the most until now.

01:01:02Guest:Yeah.

01:01:03Guest:They had kind of gone down the road of blackness.

01:01:06Guest:Right.

01:01:08Guest:But it was making me crazy sometimes, you know, because it was kind of, to me, I was like, what's happening here is, and Living Color is winning Emmys.

01:01:19Guest:Yeah.

01:01:19Guest:So Lauren hires Chris.

01:01:22Guest:Right.

01:01:22Guest:Who kind of came with an audience because people already knew Chris.

01:01:25Guest:Right.

01:01:25Guest:He didn't absolutely need SNL.

01:01:28Guest:So I got there and like in that particular show I'm talking about with Chris and Ellen and Timmy, like the next week we wrote this sketch because it was.

01:01:43Guest:It was Michael Jordan.

01:01:44Guest:It was...

01:01:45Guest:um public enemy musical guest spike lee came on and did a guest thing on uh chris used to do the sketch nat x and then uh jesse jackson came on because that week two people died miles davis died that uh week and uh and dr seuss died yeah and al franken had this is a good

01:02:09Guest:god bless him forever al franken said well you know what we should do we should get uh jesse jackson to come on and read an obituary we'll write something for dr seuss because of the rhyming yeah and i was like man jesse jackson ain't gonna do that man are you kidding

01:02:28Guest:He was on a plane.

01:02:31Guest:You send a plane for me.

01:02:34Guest:I guess his son played football in some college.

01:02:36Guest:He said, send a plane.

01:02:37Guest:I'm going to be here.

01:02:38Guest:So we did that, that show.

01:02:41Guest:And that show was so many different things for me.

01:02:43Guest:I, the best thing I remember was just sitting on a fire escape, just me and Chuck D just, just talking, just, just shooting it.

01:02:52Guest:Right.

01:02:53Um,

01:02:53Guest:and talking about Miles Davis.

01:02:55Guest:And it goes, Lauren had come to me.

01:02:57Guest:He had assigned me this.

01:02:58Guest:He was like, Miles Davis just died.

01:03:00Guest:Can you write a little something?

01:03:02Guest:A little something?

01:03:03Guest:What are they going to say?

01:03:05Guest:Yeah.

01:03:06Guest:Honestly.

01:03:07Guest:How long?

01:03:07Guest:How long is something before they go, bring the noise?

01:03:10Guest:What are you talking about?

01:03:12Guest:So Chuck just, I was like, why don't we just do a minute of silence or something like that for 20 seconds.

01:03:18Guest:So he did that.

01:03:20Guest:But

01:03:21Guest:Then the next week we wrote the sketch where like the opening monologue was Chris and Ellen and Tim.

01:03:30Guest:And I'm just going, okay, last week was probably the blackest Saturday Night Live, you know, with the three of us, plus Public Enemy, plus Michael Jordan, plus Jesse Jackson, plus Spike Lee.

01:03:43Guest:And then we wrote that.

01:03:47Guest:And then Lauren decided like kind of the last minute, no, I don't want to do that.

01:03:51Guest:He's like, you know, his thing was he didn't want to serialize the show.

01:03:54Guest:Now, that's valid.

01:03:54Guest:I'm like, okay, I get that.

01:03:56Guest:You don't want it to be like if you watch that show and you go, oh, I wonder what last week was.

01:04:00Guest:But then a part of me goes, that's actually selling.

01:04:02Guest:Now people have to go figure out what last week was.

01:04:05Guest:But that place, and I call it that place.

01:04:10Guest:Yeah.

01:04:11Guest:was not to me is like this place is not really conducive to just being creative and funny it's very conducive to being competitive yeah and I didn't come here for that right and then you know when I think back on it it was kind of being competitive like so in the end I go to Lauren I think at the like the end of my second year I go I'm writing this stuff and I love Chris I love Chris I love Timmy

01:04:41Guest:But honestly, I don't think either one of them knows where I'm coming from sometimes, but the things are right.

01:04:47Guest:And he, I don't know if he acknowledged that or not, he just listened.

01:04:53Guest:I had gotten fed up with, I wrote this thing for Tim, because I felt like he was underserved, underutilized.

01:05:03Guest:Tim Meadows.

01:05:04Guest:Tim Meadows.

01:05:05Guest:And I said,

01:05:06Guest:It was Ali's, I don't know, 50th, 60th birthday.

01:05:11Guest:And I wrote this thing where it started out, I wrote a whole slow roll until he got to a peak.

01:05:17Guest:And basically at the peak, it was him calling himself the greatest feature player of all time.

01:05:23Guest:I'm the greatest of all time.

01:05:25Guest:Yeah.

01:05:25Guest:I don't care about no Chris Rock.

01:05:28Guest:I don't care about this.

01:05:29Guest:Just in everybody's face.

01:05:32Guest:I'm Tim Meadows.

01:05:34Guest:Yeah.

01:05:34Guest:I came here.

01:05:35Guest:And at the read through, people loved it.

01:05:39Guest:Yeah.

01:05:40Guest:And then I felt like the more, the closer we got to air.

01:05:45Guest:Yeah.

01:05:46Guest:Dude started.

01:05:48Guest:It just got less and less appealing.

01:05:50Guest:And not like the words of it.

01:05:52Guest:but the the commitment tim's commitment seemed to be like like even to the point jim down he said i don't know what's going to happen with that piece because timmy he's like i don't the timmy's run through his his read-through performance of that piece yeah was amazing yeah everybody like look at tim yeah and then it was like huh and it didn't go

01:06:14Guest:And then go, and I was like, okay.

01:06:17Guest:I could have done it.

01:06:18Guest:So I go to Lauren, and I go, I'm not, I know you got your thing.

01:06:23Guest:I don't want to be, clearly I'm not saying make me a member of the cast.

01:06:28Guest:You got to earn that.

01:06:32Guest:And I'm not even saying make me a feature player.

01:06:34Guest:From time to time, I got to write something that I know I can do.

01:06:39Guest:Right.

01:06:41Guest:I agree, but Jim has a real issue if I take the writers, when I make writers feature players or performers on the show, he says to me, he says, yeah, so I don't want to upset Jim, I love him, and there's this whole thing about him.

01:07:03Guest:He blames it all on Jim Downey.

01:07:06Guest:okay cool um and i go to leave now i had two like they're like there are cliques there and i can't pretend i didn't have my little crew yeah uh but they were like the younger dave mandel and steve corin were my uh boys yeah and they asked like what happened they knew what i was gonna do yeah and they asked what happened and i go man he's blamed it all on jim and it's like

01:07:31Guest:Because then Lauren said, go talk to Jim.

01:07:33Guest:Yeah.

01:07:33Guest:If you talk to Jim and Jim says it's okay, then you got it.

01:07:39Guest:So I leave and I say to them, all right, I'm out.

01:07:43Guest:I'm out of here.

01:07:45Guest:And what did he say?

01:07:45Guest:I said, he said, talk to Jim.

01:07:47Guest:But come on, man.

01:07:48Guest:Yeah.

01:07:50Guest:Then they convinced me.

01:07:51Guest:Yeah.

01:07:52Guest:I let them convince me that if you never talk to Jim, you'll never know.

01:07:55Guest:You got to talk to Jim.

01:07:56Guest:Yeah.

01:07:57Guest:And so I talk.

01:08:00Guest:So I wait to talk to Jim.

01:08:01Guest:I'm like, here's the thing.

01:08:02Guest:This is the crazy.

01:08:02Guest:I've heard Scott a million times better.

01:08:05Guest:There's a dysfunction.

01:08:05Guest:There was a huge dysfunction there about time and people's work ethic.

01:08:10Guest:Like I used to get to work when I worked at SNL.

01:08:13Guest:Yeah.

01:08:13Guest:I used to get there.

01:08:14Guest:10 o'clock because somebody told me those were the hours right 10 o'clock in the morning 10 a.m yeah so i left home every day 10 a.m get to snl we didn't start work till like 6 7 o'clock 7 p.m 6 7 so what were you doing all day i was hanging out i was talking to and that was the other thing like it wasn't like i would ever say i'll just leave and yeah wait until somebody calls me because that's what would happen right and

01:08:38Guest:people would like just not be there and they'll say hey call me when when this is real basically and uh yeah so i would i hung out with the office staff yeah those guys love me you know i had a good time with them yeah and i think that was i think like they didn't really get talked you know it was a whole hierarchy yeah and then they got crazy because then i said we start work at seven

01:09:01Guest:and you're tired well like you know we're gonna go from like seven to two to work on these sketches so yeah around 11 30 12 i'm getting drowsy yeah uh you know i would doze off and then there'll be some of the writers jesus

01:09:16Guest:Warren, what are you, you know, like, what's your issue?

01:09:19Guest:And that was like, it's Saturday Night Live.

01:09:21Guest:So the initial assumption is he's high, but it was like, people knew I was pretty straight.

01:09:27Guest:So it's like, he's not high.

01:09:28Guest:It's just, what are you doing?

01:09:29Guest:You can't stay up?

01:09:31Guest:And oddly enough, one of the reasons I love Jim Downey, he knew Jim was like, get a scat break.

01:09:37Guest:He's been here since 10 o'clock.

01:09:39Guest:Like, how do you know since the whole reason we're starting at seven is because you didn't get here until seven o'clock.

01:09:46Guest:Did you tell someone about that thing?

01:09:47Guest:So I go talk to him.

01:09:49Guest:Yes.

01:09:50Guest:But the reason I brought that story up is because my meeting with Lauren was supposed to be at 9 p.m.

01:09:57Guest:I talked to Lauren maybe at 2 in the morning.

01:10:01Guest:So I walk out of Lauren's office and then I say to Jim's assistant, I got to talk to Jim.

01:10:07Guest:Yeah.

01:10:07Guest:And I'll have this conversation, I guess, tomorrow.

01:10:09Guest:And she goes, he's still here.

01:10:11Guest:You want to wait a half hour?

01:10:12Guest:You can talk to him now.

01:10:13Guest:OK.

01:10:13Guest:Well, half an hour becomes four in the morning.

01:10:16Guest:Yeah.

01:10:16Guest:So I talked to Jim before.

01:10:17Guest:And this is the thing now.

01:10:18Guest:I'm tired.

01:10:19Guest:This is like this is some some cult stuff.

01:10:23Guest:And I say, Jim, yeah, well, here's a conversation I had with Lauren.

01:10:28Guest:And Jim just starts laughing.

01:10:30Guest:He's like, what are you talking about?

01:10:31Guest:And Lauren said, what?

01:10:33Guest:He goes, do you know how many people Lauren puts on?

01:10:36Guest:He said, okay, all right, well, then here's the deal.

01:10:40Guest:You go back to Lauren.

01:10:41Guest:I'll write it down.

01:10:42Guest:You want me to write it down for you?

01:10:44Guest:Go back to the Lord and you tell him that Jim's fine with it.

01:10:50Guest:And you can do whatever you please.

01:10:52Guest:I'd love it if you're on camera or not.

01:10:55Guest:It's fine with me.

01:10:56Guest:And then I have Jim's office and I left Jim's office and I looked at my boys and I go, okay, now I'm out of here.

01:11:02Guest:Like I've talked to him.

01:11:04Guest:Yeah.

01:11:04Guest:And I was like, I got to go.

01:11:07Guest:And then the weird thing is, and I talked to Townsend come by.

01:11:10Guest:Robert.

01:11:11Guest:Robert Townsend had come by and he wanted to start this show out here.

01:11:16Guest:He was doing and he kept calling it the other side of In Living Color because at this point he and Kenan had had their big falling out.

01:11:24Guest:So, you know, he asked me about SNL and what it was like and how things worked.

01:11:31Guest:And I told him about that sort of back and forth.

01:11:34Guest:And he goes, dude, I'm going to use you as talent and a writer.

01:11:38Guest:Basically, I'm giving you what you want on my show.

01:11:44Guest:So I said, good.

01:11:46Guest:Love it.

01:11:46Guest:And that's where you went?

01:11:47Guest:Yeah, I moved out here.

01:11:50Guest:Now, that was a time when Abby was like, what?

01:11:52Guest:No.

01:11:54Guest:It was like, wait, you're going to leave SNL, which is an established joggernaut.

01:12:01Guest:Yeah.

01:12:01Guest:To go to Fox because that was a deal.

01:12:04Guest:It was a Fox show when this was a point where Fox didn't even have a full day's worth of programming.

01:12:12Guest:Right.

01:12:12Guest:To work with Robert Townsend, who, you know, he had partners in crime stuff.

01:12:16Guest:But, you know, he was not a proven entity and they were everybody was against it.

01:12:23Guest:And I was like, yeah, but I think just creatively this is going to work for me.

01:12:28Guest:Got you out here.

01:12:29Guest:Well, but there's this thing.

01:12:30Guest:I'm still in that place where I can write, but I'm a performer.

01:12:35Guest:That was always my thing.

01:12:37Guest:So Robert was feeling that.

01:12:39Guest:He was hitting that note for me.

01:12:42Guest:But then what he would do is he hired all these writers.

01:12:46Guest:We had a nice little writer's room.

01:12:48Guest:And we'd turn in these sketches and then we'd watch the show was filmed and we watched the show and then go, I don't recognize any of this.

01:12:59Guest:Did you write that?

01:13:00Guest:Right.

01:13:01Guest:So sometimes you go, wait, I think this is my sketch because I wrote a sketch about a cafeteria.

01:13:07Guest:And here's a sketch that's in a restaurant.

01:13:11Guest:And I think that this is what became of my sketch.

01:13:14Guest:So Townsend did this thing where he would just rewrite everything based on what he thought was best in the sketch.

01:13:21Guest:And it was not working.

01:13:23Guest:Then the weird thing was, I get this call from Fox executives.

01:13:27Guest:They say, come in.

01:13:29Guest:I go over and they go, what do you think is working about the show?

01:13:34Guest:And I say, oh, it's a

01:13:35Guest:great the writers amazing it's a good group uh i think you know whatever i could give him a whole long line list of things that are working they say what do you think is not working i think you guys got to talk to robert and sometimes he's maybe a little in his own head he's only a little too much they say uh oh i'm sorry the question was posed is what do you think would make the show work better and uh and i give him this whole thing like you know you got to do this number one thing talk to rob yeah

01:14:04Guest:And look at me and go, what else do you think would make the show work better?

01:14:08Guest:Oh, so you're not going to talk to Robert.

01:14:10Guest:OK, I don't know.

01:14:11Guest:And they say, look, here's the thing.

01:14:13Guest:That show is not going to be.

01:14:14Guest:We're getting rid of that show.

01:14:16Guest:But and then I think back in these days for Fox, it was like they're a new franchise.

01:14:23Guest:Yeah.

01:14:24Guest:So just cachet wise.

01:14:26Guest:I'm a guy who wrote a couple years on SNL and I work for Fox now.

01:14:32Guest:Yeah.

01:14:32Guest:They don't want me leaving.

01:14:33Guest:Right.

01:14:34Guest:The Fox farm team.

01:14:35Guest:Right.

01:14:36Guest:And so they're like, well, you know, we know that you have friends on In Living Color.

01:14:42Guest:Yeah.

01:14:43Guest:You know, I think, you know, some people over at Martin.

01:14:46Guest:We have this show called Living Single.

01:14:47Guest:So they throw those out at me.

01:14:49Guest:uh i couldn't resist i'm like did you just just tell me the three black shows you have on your network yeah not take into account i just came here from snl right oh no of course you know this whole thing like oh no married with children would love you we can set up a meeting and i was like i get it just you gotta watch that you know what i mean and this is who i am i mean i shouldn't be talking about that but that's where i was um

01:15:17Guest:So, you know, I have my issues with those.

01:15:19Guest:I'm not trying to be part of a clique, so I'm like, well, I don't know anybody at Living Single.

01:15:25Guest:And of those shows, that one, you know, even Married with Children, I'm like...

01:15:34Guest:There's a barrage of jokes.

01:15:36Guest:And the only new thing for me to learn is story, the story structure.

01:15:40Guest:And this living single thing seems to be more along those lines.

01:15:46Guest:And I go over there, and this woman, Yvette Lee, at the time, Yvette Denise Lee, now she's Yvette Bowser,

01:15:52Guest:but we had our meeting and i also like the fact like you know at this point you know new york the comic yeah not so much the club owners i'm just i'm getting really fed up right with the lies and all this nonsense in the business and i i talked to her and she says well you know we started like we're on show number six and i used to have this guy here like there's only one black male writer on the show

01:16:15Guest:And so I said, honestly, are you hiring me?

01:16:21Guest:You're looking at me because I'm a funny guy?

01:16:24Guest:I'm a funny, talented guy who you think could fit in here?

01:16:29Guest:Or you're just talking to me because I'm another black guy and you need another black guy?

01:16:33Guest:And she goes...

01:16:35Guest:this town is full of funny, talented writers.

01:16:38Guest:I'm talking to you because you're another black guy.

01:16:42Guest:She said, but a funny, talented black guy.

01:16:44Guest:And I said, I got nothing but respect for that.

01:16:47Guest:I appreciate that.

01:16:48Guest:You could have, oh my God.

01:16:51Guest:I've asked that question before and I've gotten, oh my God, no, we totally respect them.

01:16:56Guest:I'm like, hmm.

01:16:57Guest:Just like my dad with the lies.

01:17:01Guest:So there, and that was the thing.

01:17:03Guest:I learned, and she's big on story structure.

01:17:07Guest:I might not have always liked the stories or where they went, but as far as setting them up, taking things to a different place, I'm like, okay, this is sitcom, story structure, I'm learning something.

01:17:19Guest:And there would be days I felt like, I mean, I was there almost to the last season,

01:17:26Guest:The only reason I wasn't there last season is because I sold my own show to NBC.

01:17:31Guest:So I was like, I got to go because I got a show to do.

01:17:34Marc:How many did they do?

01:17:37Guest:Of your show.

01:17:38Guest:What was that called?

01:17:39Guest:It was called Built to Last.

01:17:41Guest:How hard is that?

01:17:43Guest:First show canceled.

01:17:47Guest:I think we did eight, but they aired maybe three.

01:17:51Marc:Yeah.

01:17:52Marc:And so that was the first like you're like, oh, now I'm in it.

01:17:56Marc:Fucking heartbreak.

01:17:57Guest:Yes.

01:17:58Guest:Yes.

01:17:58Guest:Although when it was canceled, honestly, the day that they called to say we're done, you're canceled.

01:18:05Guest:I had already I was on my way to New York that I already knew that call was coming.

01:18:10Guest:Yeah.

01:18:11Guest:But I was leaving that day.

01:18:12Guest:I was only hanging around the offices.

01:18:14Guest:Right.

01:18:15Guest:Because I had to go to San Francisco to do my half hour comedy.

01:18:18Guest:So I was like, maybe this is what it was supposed to be.

01:18:21Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:18:22Guest:I'm going to go do this half hour.

01:18:24Guest:And this is always doing stand up.

01:18:26Guest:Yeah, at that point, I still had my stand-up.

01:18:29Guest:So I did live in single until I got my own show, until I sold that show.

01:18:35Guest:I mean, I created that show.

01:18:37Guest:It was for Royale Watkins.

01:18:38Guest:I don't know if you remember him.

01:18:39Guest:I remember him.

01:18:40Guest:Is he all right?

01:18:41Guest:He's good.

01:18:41Guest:He's actually doing real good.

01:18:42Guest:He's got all kinds of stuff happening with Kevin Hart.

01:18:45Guest:He's doing real good.

01:18:47Guest:But I did his show, and then we got canceled.

01:18:49Guest:Um, and part of the thing that made me crazy was like, okay, I got my own show on, but I wasn't a show runner.

01:18:57Guest:Yeah.

01:18:57Guest:And so that was like, now that's the next thing.

01:19:00Guest:It's just like when I did comedy, it was like, okay, why didn't that work?

01:19:03Guest:Yeah.

01:19:04Guest:All right.

01:19:04Guest:Now the variable is I got to be in charge of the vision.

01:19:08Guest:Right.

01:19:09Guest:So that I never really got the vision out with that.

01:19:12Guest:So now if I'm going to make this damn thing work, I got to be a show runner.

01:19:16Guest:Yeah.

01:19:17Guest:All right.

01:19:18Guest:Then, boom, what happens?

01:19:20Guest:Robert Townsend calls again because he had this show on Fox.

01:19:23Guest:Now it's called Apparently.

01:19:24Guest:He had a sitcom.

01:19:26Guest:Yeah.

01:19:27Guest:They need a showrunner.

01:19:28Guest:I talked to his partner.

01:19:29Guest:His partner and I had a better relationship.

01:19:33Guest:This woman who was like the partner in his company.

01:19:35Guest:Yeah.

01:19:37Guest:She's a genius.

01:19:38Guest:She wound up working at BET.

01:19:40Guest:Still a genius, even though now we don't.

01:19:43Guest:talk but she's a genius what's her name her name is laritha jones okay and um and this for parenthood parenthood so she's like you know we need a showrunner so i go over there and so now i got showrunner credentials okay and then i go from there and then moesha was like hey we need a showrunner can you come over here to help and there i helped the woman who created the show yeah and i even said well there's a lady there who created the show why do you need a showrunner

01:20:09Guest:and they said well it used to be her and her she was a partner yeah her and her partner created the show right and now her partner's leaving to work on another show and she's never run a show by herself yeah and i go okay all right that's what you say but then i do that and then i see how the networks how they uh undercut show runners i was like oh you know i basically kind of watched them try to devalue not even try to they devalued her by just by bringing you in

01:20:37Guest:Well, bringing me, and then that was the thing.

01:20:39Guest:First I had to make it clear to her, I'm not here to hurt you.

01:20:43Guest:Honestly, if I can help, I'll help.

01:20:46Guest:If you want me to shut up and get out of here and just make them happy because I'm here, I'll be that guy.

01:20:53Guest:So she and then the staff felt the same way.

01:20:56Guest:Like, who is this clown?

01:20:59Guest:And the staff was intimidating.

01:21:00Guest:My thing was, I know I'm funny.

01:21:02Guest:There's episodes of living single

01:21:06Guest:where i've 80 of the jokes that's me that's me that's me um story wise like i said that's where i needed my help at this place you know there's funny people they got good jokes and they know story and i mean i'm like dude there was there's a woman who i worked with

01:21:25Guest:who was a harvard mba she's writing jokes on moesha yeah and then a guy who has got two degrees he's got an english degree from um stanford and journalism from columbia he's working at moesha yeah and at the point where they fired the showrunner and i'm the showrunner now i'm their boss yeah you know and it was like a point i'm like whatever

01:21:46Guest:am i doing i shouldn't be there boss but then i was like but you know what they shouldn't be writing comedy fuck them i'm better at the jokes but um so then i got that and then uh if you talk to my wish of fans i ruined the show and that's we don't have time for that but then uh

01:22:07Guest:I left.

01:22:07Guest:Moesha was coming back.

01:22:08Guest:As we were told, Moesha was coming back.

01:22:10Guest:Yeah.

01:22:11Guest:And my agents were like, dude, you're going to be in this position.

01:22:14Guest:You're going to do this and that and other things.

01:22:16Guest:And I said, I can't do this.

01:22:18Guest:This is crazy.

01:22:19Guest:This show and these people, I like Brandy and I liked her mom.

01:22:24Guest:Her mom was getting vilified in the press, but she was cool to me and I got what she was up to.

01:22:33Yeah.

01:22:33Guest:but i was like i can't i got it i need something else and then larry had called me larry wilmore had uh called we had a mutual friend yeah and she said larry would like to talk to you we met in pasadena yeah and at hooters right that's totally larry so we met there and he told me about bernie he told me what he liked about it and everything and so i called my agent i said i'm gonna do this bernie mack thing

01:22:57Guest:uh and it was it was like snl all over for them they were having flashbacks i guess they were like but but but moesha's coming back right for for a full season that bernie mac thing is an experiment and fox might not do it and i was like let's do the bernie mac thing um and then moesha got canceled um

01:23:19Guest:I had already made the jump, which I think Larry appreciated.

01:23:24Guest:I had made the jump.

01:23:25Guest:He was a showrunner?

01:23:26Guest:Yeah, he was a showrunner and a creator, and that was the deal.

01:23:29Guest:I had decided I'm going to be part of this thing before Moesha blew up.

01:23:36Guest:It wasn't like, oh, I can't go back to Moesha, so hey, dude, can I have that job?

01:23:41Guest:It was like, I want this job instead of that job.

01:23:44Guest:And now was working with Bernie good?

01:23:47Yeah.

01:23:47Guest:That was amazing.

01:23:47Guest:I feel like that was the best work I've ever done.

01:23:50Guest:And especially since part of my fed upness and kind of even with Moesha was like, okay, I learned sitcom story structure, but I'm sick of it.

01:24:00Guest:I'm like, how does anybody at home who watches sitcoms for two years not know where these stories are going?

01:24:06Yeah.

01:24:06Guest:And then Bernie was like, we don't know where these stores are.

01:24:12Guest:This is great.

01:24:13Guest:We can go anywhere as long as we go somewhere funny and somewhere that's emotionally satisfying.

01:24:18Guest:It's like when we get to the end, if you look back through it emotionally, wherever Bernie was, of course it went that way.

01:24:25Guest:As opposed to like structure-wise where we set this up and he set this and that happened.

01:24:31Guest:Sure.

01:24:32Marc:He was driving it.

01:24:33Guest:totally and i and i love that and that was all and larry was like yeah no we're gonna do it this way um he was amazing bernie was amazing bernie was amazing like that that the the first two years of that show that was like all amazement and it was and it was what i needed because it was i got divorced on moesha yeah uh and in bernie and in the way i was living my life like at bernie was like it it bought me back to life you know what i mean yeah um

01:25:02Guest:and then you know and like i said the first two years were amazing it was the last three years which honestly the last two years is when i was running the show yeah but pale paled in comparison you were there the whole time i was there from first well the pilot no but then from first episode to last episode i was there were you tight with him bernie yeah yeah yeah and and and and

01:25:29Guest:yeah and i like i like i love bernie i know bernie i know oh i i'm sorry i did actually listen to john because somebody told me john mentioned me um like the people that i came out the people that i feel the best about me yeah in la uh who

01:25:46Guest:When John and I were working together.

01:25:50Guest:John Ridley.

01:25:50Guest:I love him.

01:25:52Guest:I mean, I feel like, first of all, I have defended John so many times to so many people because I really feel like he's like my little brother.

01:26:03Guest:Age-wise, he's younger than us.

01:26:06Yeah.

01:26:07Guest:But he's been so in your face about things.

01:26:11Guest:Yeah.

01:26:13Guest:And people are like, what's up with that fucking John Ridley?

01:26:15Guest:And I go, you know, hold on a second.

01:26:16Guest:Hold on, man.

01:26:17Guest:Hold on.

01:26:18Guest:Hold on.

01:26:19Guest:Yeah.

01:26:21Guest:John's got a point.

01:26:22Guest:Yeah.

01:26:22Guest:We don't have to agree with him.

01:26:24Guest:Right.

01:26:24Guest:You know, but he's got a point, you know, like he was not a big fan of going on strikes.

01:26:30Guest:So all the people like this fucking.

01:26:32Guest:Yeah.

01:26:33Guest:But... Him and Bernie were the guys.

01:26:37Guest:John, Bernie, and Larry.

01:26:39Guest:Yeah.

01:26:39Guest:I mean, Larry, I felt like John is close to a brother as I'm going to get.

01:26:45Guest:Larry was the best mentor ever and still is.

01:26:48Guest:And I'm like, Larry's like that kind of guy, like he's like that professor that I go, did you like that dissertation?

01:26:55Guest:Am I good?

01:26:56Guest:Is that anywhere close to what you were trying to teach me?

01:27:00Guest:You know, and he's also the kind of, Larry's definitely the kind of guy who does not suffer fools gladly.

01:27:05Guest:And I'm like, but I'm a fool.

01:27:07Guest:I'm kind of a fool.

01:27:08Guest:Yeah, yeah.

01:27:08Guest:uh and bernie just for a guy from the church bernie actually reminds me of my uncle everett although i don't i doubt he's ever had any live grenades yeah but uh just full blown about life that's it the thing is now

01:27:27Guest:I'm taking care of my kids.

01:27:28Guest:Yeah.

01:27:29Guest:I wanted I you know we couldn't get into it but you know I think you can get some of my thing is like to be a good dad.

01:27:35Guest:Yeah.

01:27:36Guest:And so with my kids I'm doing this whole thing like I'm family first.

01:27:41Guest:Yeah.

01:27:41Guest:I'm trying to be a good dad.

01:27:43Guest:And by my standards not somebody else's fucking standards.

01:27:47Guest:Right.

01:27:47Guest:But this is what I decide a good dad is.

01:27:49Guest:and um but then there's those times when i go i think i'm using that as an excuse i gotta i can be a good dad and a creative person and be out here and show the world who i am and maybe even get some respect because my daughter could care less about me but i i love her yeah so much i own this

01:28:10Guest:One story about my daughter?

01:28:12Guest:Because Father's Day was just gone.

01:28:15Guest:And she's going to this little summer camp slash summer school thing.

01:28:20Guest:And so they got black cardboard, black construction paper.

01:28:24Guest:They splatter white paint on it.

01:28:26Guest:It's going to be the stars.

01:28:27Guest:They paste a rocket ship and then a little picture of her.

01:28:32Yeah.

01:28:32Guest:And then on the side that the teachers had written, you know, I love you to the moon and back, happy Father's Day.

01:28:38Guest:So she does hers, love you to the moon and back, happy Father's Day.

01:28:41Guest:And then she writes over in the corner, but not really.

01:28:47Guest:Right?

01:28:47Guest:And I say, she goes,

01:28:48Guest:And she says, I wrote not really.

01:28:50Guest:But it's like she doesn't want to be fake.

01:28:52Guest:And so she goes, I go to her and look at it.

01:28:55Guest:She says, I had to write not really.

01:28:57Guest:I said, because you don't really feel this way, right?

01:28:59Guest:You don't know that expression.

01:29:00Guest:Love you to the moon and back.

01:29:01Guest:She's like, yeah, I don't know.

01:29:03Guest:I said, well, here's the thing, though.

01:29:04Guest:Just tell me this.

01:29:05Guest:Because I'm not my grandmother.

01:29:06Guest:I'm not beating her ass because she's not fitting in.

01:29:10Guest:I'm me, and I want to learn who my kids are.

01:29:13Guest:And I want them to be who they are.

01:29:15Guest:And I'm just going to guide them when they need guidance.

01:29:17Guest:I said, how far do you love me?

01:29:19Guest:Just, you know, it doesn't have to be to the moon and back.

01:29:21Guest:And we're standing, we just came in the house.

01:29:23Guest:And she showed me the thing.

01:29:25Guest:And she goes, oh, okay.

01:29:27Guest:And she looks around and she says, okay, maybe from here, from where we are in the foyer.

01:29:33Guest:And she walks to like the far end of the living room.

01:29:36Guest:She looks out the window.

01:29:36Guest:She says, probably from over there where I was to like the back of that house.

01:29:42And I'm like...

01:29:43Guest:okay you know what i'm saying that's something that's you doing you yeah which is what i'm like that's what i gotta allow myself to do this is like the moon in back who every fucking body in the classroom said that yeah without even knowing what it means exactly but from this foyer to that house across the back of that house across the street

01:30:05Marc:That's me and you, baby.

01:30:06Marc:Yeah, that's reasonable.

01:30:08Guest:So, yeah, so I'm all about that, and I got a couple projects that I'm working on, but I was like, I'm feeling like I got to wrap that up, and then I got to start doing me again, because I can't just go away, even though I feel like I've gone away.

01:30:24Marc:Well, I feel like you're back.

01:30:27Marc:Thank you, Mark.

01:30:27Marc:And it was nice talking to you, buddy.

01:30:29Guest:Yeah, it's good talking to you, man.

01:30:30Guest:Thanks, man.

01:30:30Marc:Thank you so much.

01:30:36Marc:There you go.

01:30:37Marc:That was Warren Hutcherson, a guy I started out with.

01:30:40Marc:Very funny guy.

01:30:41Marc:His life in show business and his life in life.

01:30:45Marc:The book, our book, Waiting for the Punch, can be pre-ordered at wtfpod.com and at markmarinbook.com.

01:30:53Marc:I've been emailing all the people in the book about them getting the book.

01:30:57Marc:Obviously, I'm going to send them a book, but it's very nice that everybody's getting back to me.

01:31:01Marc:Makes me feel like people like me.

01:31:04Marc:All right, I'm just going to play some unprepared guitar with no effects.

01:31:10Marc:People seem to enjoy it, but I got to people.

01:31:14Marc:The two guys that emailed.

01:31:17Marc:Yeah, it's just a strat into the dirty old man.

01:31:22Marc:58 Deluxe.

01:31:25Marc:Kind of cranked.

01:31:44Guest:Boomer lives.

Episode 843 - ​Warren Hutcherson

Episode 843 - Warren Hutcherson