Episode 834 - Rory Scovel / Maz Jobrani
Marc:all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fucking ears what the fuck nicks what the fuck topians what's happening how are you i'm mark maron this is my podcast all right so on the show on the show on the show today
Marc:I got Maz Jobrani for a little chat about his new special, Maz Jobrani Immigrant.
Marc:And then after that, we got the long one with Rory Scovel about his new special called Rory Scovel Tries Stand-Up for the first time.
Marc:But before that, before them, before those, I was very sad about Sam Shepard dying.
Marc:It hit me when I saw it come up on the newsfeed.
Marc:Sam Shepard dies.
Marc:Horrible disease.
Marc:That ALS.
Marc:I just.
Marc:But Sam Shepard is gone.
Marc:You know, these guys of his generation.
Marc:You know, my heroes, many of our heroes.
Marc:I mean, I'm fifty three.
Marc:They're going.
Marc:And it's not like I've been up to speed.
Marc:It's not like I've been keeping up.
Marc:But I always like knowing they're here.
Marc:When they die, I'm like, oh, then that guy's not here.
Marc:It's not that I'm thinking about him every day.
Marc:But Sam Shepard's not here.
Marc:Sam Shepard.
Marc:That guy blew my fucking mind.
Marc:I was trying to wrap my brain around Sam Shepard for a decade or two.
Marc:I was in high school.
Marc:I was working at this bagel place across from the college.
Marc:This dude, Judson, Judson Fraundorf, hell of a name, was doing a production in this kind of like weird beat up theater space of Tooth of Crime.
Marc:Now, I don't remember if he was in it.
Marc:I know this painter.
Marc:I think his name was Raya Beta.
Marc:Played Crow.
Marc:The woman I lost my virginity to.
Marc:She was in it.
Marc:She was a waitress at the place.
Marc:Cheryl.
Marc:I remember that.
Marc:But I just remember going to this theater with all these college kids in this arty fucking space and that play, which is nearly incomprehensible, sort of a sci-fi rock and roll.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:It's a mixture of, you know, like fighting and charts and chart makers and rock.
Marc:I still don't know.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:I've never gone back to read it.
Marc:But I remember seeing it and just having that moment where I'm like, what the fuck is going on?
Marc:They're all talking and I don't understand any of it, but it's cool.
Marc:It's cool as shit.
Marc:The language is fucking amazing.
Marc:Everybody seems kind of fucked up and groovy.
Marc:And it's like it means something.
Marc:It's got to mean something.
Marc:This all means something.
Marc:It's so far out of my mind.
Marc:wheelhouse as a teenager but it just was one of those portals man was one of those portals into like oh god there's something out there something big and then you know you kind of lean into it you get the seven plays book
Marc:Try to read La Torista, Barry Child.
Marc:Try to read those early plays.
Marc:They're just rich and dense.
Marc:And Sam Shepard blew my mind.
Marc:I was obsessed.
Marc:Then he shows up in The Right Stuff.
Marc:And you're like, that's Sam Shepard.
Marc:Not only is he a cool fucking kind of drug, rock, cowboy, fucking hipster genius.
Marc:He can act like an astronaut.
Marc:Or a test pilot.
Marc:Who became an astronaut on his own.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That scene where Chuck Yeager pushes that new plane out and just barely got out to almost out of the atmosphere and into orbit.
Marc:He was like, fuck you.
Marc:I can drive my own plane into space, you assholes.
Marc:Got a stick of Beeman's.
Marc:Yeah, man.
Marc:Sam Shepard.
Marc:I did that failed monologue for Yale from a Sam Shepard play.
Marc:I don't remember what it was from.
Marc:Angel City or something.
Marc:I just love seeing him.
Marc:He was so cool.
Marc:So solid on screen.
Marc:And those plays just spent like it feels like a lifetime just trying to break into some of those early plays.
Marc:I saw Barry Child on Broadway, Gary Sinise's production, Terry Kinney.
Marc:And I tell a story about it.
Marc:That was the night, such an intense, heavy play.
Marc:And there's that scene where the character Watt comes in with all the corn he picked.
Marc:And the night I was there, he drops the corn and one of the corns just rolled all the way downstage, right to the lip of the stage.
Marc:And it was a powerful moment because two things happened.
Marc:There was that incomprehensible tableau of everybody in the room and he walks in with the corn and you're like, what the fuck is going on?
Marc:And in the meantime, he's slowly being upstaged by a rolling ear of corn.
Marc:The corn was like, I'm going to riff.
Marc:The corn riffed in Buried Child on Broadway.
Marc:It didn't last so long, but it was a beautiful production.
Marc:But it's just one of those things, man.
Marc:It's just like... I just got to deal now with a shepherdless...
Marc:earth with a sam shepherdless earth and a shepherdless earth in a lot of ways let's read into it let's let's keep rolling with the metaphor right
Marc:Maz Jabrani has been on this show several times.
Marc:I like Maz a lot.
Marc:And he's got a new comedy special out.
Marc:And he said, can I come on and talk about it?
Marc:And I said, yeah.
Marc:And we had some pretty relevant stuff to talk about.
Marc:He's Iranian.
Marc:He's been doing some stuff on stage.
Marc:about uh trump's policies and it was good i i wanted to talk to him and i'm glad he came by his new special uh maz jabrani immigrant is now streaming on netflix and this is a a little shorty with me and maz
Marc:So I saw you at the comedy store the other night, and so you're doing some stuff about being Iranian, Persian.
Marc:I've always talked about that.
Guest:No, no, no.
Marc:But I mean, just in relation to the new president.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I was wondering, because you do this thing about the cousin, the shitty cousin.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Now who you throw under the bus in a second.
Marc:He's the real problem.
Guest:Majid.
Guest:Majid.
Guest:Imagine, does that guy really exist?
Guest:He exists, and if you listen to the language of it, I'm not throwing him on the bus.
Guest:I'm actually saying, because in the middle of it, I go, because what I try to do is, because here's the thing.
Guest:A lot of people, I'm guessing a lot of Trump supporters in the sort, they hear Muslim, Islam, all this stuff, and they go, oh, you're all trying to bring Sharia law to America.
Guest:I don't know what they think, dude.
Guest:They just don't like brown people of any kind.
Guest:They just don't like brown people.
Guest:It's crazy.
Guest:And so then I'm trying to indicate that, look, I was born in a Muslim country, but I'm not really religious.
Guest:No, right.
Guest:And so I just say I'm Muslim-ish.
Guest:But then I go one step further, and I try to indicate that there is this guy named Majid who really exists who is a Muslim.
Guest:And he prays five times a day, and he fasts during Ramadan, and he's the sweetest guy in the world.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But in the joke, I go, well, you know, he's got to go.
Guest:He's got to go.
Guest:And then I go, I didn't say it.
Guest:Trump said it.
Guest:He's got to go.
Guest:So, yeah.
Guest:So poor Majid.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But I but I like the I think it's interesting, though, to, you know, because I think the bigger idea that a lot of them hold on to is there's no such thing as moderate Muslims.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And but, you know, when I as I've known you and I hear you talking, you know, I've known you for a few years now.
Marc:There are such things as Muslims that just kind of give half a shit.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, absolutely.
Marc:It's like religion's not part of my life.
Marc:Not at all.
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:And it's more like a cultural- Right, right.
Marc:You go to weddings.
Marc:You go to the holiday thing.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You go eat the feast once in a while.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And then you're like, oh, that's it.
Marc:That's enough.
Guest:That's it.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:And it's interesting because the reason I started really specifically saying that I'm not really religious is because I also didn't want people from the Muslim side to come see me and have a tequila in my hand and they're going, why are you drinking?
Guest:If you're Muslim, you shouldn't be drinking alcohol.
Guest:Does that happen?
Guest:No, not quite that far.
Guest:I feel like I've done events that have been clean, meaning really religious, and I've felt a little awkward there because I feel like there's some jokes I can't even do.
Guest:For example, the joke I do now where I say I'm Muslim-ish, and the only time I pray is if I'm almost in an accident, and then I just go, oh, Jesus.
Guest:And you don't feel like you can do that joke?
Guest:In front of a fully Muslim crowd.
Guest:You know what I'm saying?
Guest:I don't know what you're saying.
Marc:I'm supposed to do like there's like a- You're saying like if I were performing for Hasidim?
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:And I was doing like, who doesn't eat a little pork?
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:I just think that there's some- But it's not like you'd be punished.
Guest:You just wouldn't go over well.
Guest:It wouldn't go over well.
Guest:I don't think they'd laugh.
Guest:I used to do a joke.
Guest:Actually, I did this.
Guest:There was some Muslim festival.
Marc:I think they would laugh at that one.
Guest:But that's the thing.
Guest:The young people tend to laugh, but then you always feel like there's a big group judging you.
Marc:But this is the interesting thing about being a non-religious, ethnically Jewish person is that I'm never going to be in a situation where I'm performing for a crowd, even if it's a Jewish crowd, where I'm like, too many Hasidim here.
Marc:I guess the line is a little different.
Marc:There's a whole spectrum of Jews.
Marc:You got Hasidim, you got Orthodox, you got Ultra-Orthodox, and you got Conservative, you got the Reform.
Marc:But once you get to Conservative, it's all just sort of like, yeah, I'm kind of Jewish.
Marc:But there's never this situation where it's like these guys and those guys.
Guest:Well, yeah, but see, that's the thing.
Guest:The difference is, I mean, I agree.
Guest:A lot of the shows I do, my audiences tend to be mixed.
Guest:there's once in a while there's a couple of religious folks but usually they're all very uh secular or even if they're religious they're not hardcore right but i've been hired before like i got hired to do some like muslim fest in a while a few years ago yeah here uh it was in toronto okay and it was a thing actually i'm supposed to go back again and and when i did that one just simple jokes that for example like in islam if you convert out of islam yeah that's one of the worst
Guest:things.
Guest:And so there was a joke I used to do about how when you have a newborn, I was trying to sing my baby to sleep and she wouldn't fall asleep.
Guest:And at one point I'm just going, Lord Jesus Christ, please put her to sleep.
Guest:And then I go, I'm not even Christian.
Guest:Jesus put her to sleep.
Guest:And then I go, the first God that puts her to sleep, I'll convert.
Guest:Now, that's a joke that normally gets a laugh.
Guest:There.
Guest:But in that audience, the first guy that puts it in a convert, I feel the gasp.
Guest:Like, what?
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:Convert?
Guest:Did he just say convert?
Guest:Like, you know.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I don't know, again, maybe, you know how comedians are.
Guest:We're like, oh, my God, I just got judged by, you know, half the crowd.
Marc:Yeah, well, no, I know that feeling.
Marc:But I just think it's interesting because in Toronto, there's, like, from what I understand, there's friction.
Marc:And here, I guess, but I think the thing that fascinates me is that there's a lot of people that come from a lot of Muslim countries that just want to be American.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's not, you know, religious freedom is one thing, and they should have that.
Marc:But ultimately, they're like, look, I'm just, you know, we do the dinners.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:absolutely you know what i mean no absolutely and that's why like i mean i i try to make a point now when i even in my act a lot of times i say immigrants love america there's a reason why we can't we we're fleeing that country like when i was a kid and i came to america in late 78 we don't want sharia law here that's why we left that's why we left that's why we left we fled the revolution we come here then the hostage crisis happens and then they're blaming me for taking hostages no i don't know that guy i don't know that guy that's why we left
Marc:that's why i left we would have been hostages we would have been killed whatever i'm on your side yeah so but let me ask you though like in relation to these these uh limited bands that they've established has there been any effect on people you know or relatives that you have in
Guest:Yeah, I have a relative right now who's sick and in the hospital in America.
Guest:And then I have an aunt who wanted to come and see her.
Guest:Where is she?
Guest:She's in London.
Guest:She's a British citizen, but she's visited Iran.
Guest:So she got put on this list.
Guest:Now, the list, by the way, the history goes back to when the San Bernardino attacks happened.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:There was Congress passed the law that took this.
Guest:It was a visa waiver that existed before.
Guest:They said, if you have a British passport, you come, you land, you come in.
Guest:But Congress suddenly put, I don't know, 30 some odd, 40 countries on a list saying that they don't get the visa waiver.
Marc:If your passport's stamped with those countries.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:If you've visited those countries in the past five years, you got to go get a visa.
Guest:So when my aunt wants to come, she's got a British passport.
Guest:She wants to come from England to America.
Guest:She needs to get a special visa because she had been in Iran in the past five years just visiting relatives.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So, yeah, I got affected directly.
Guest:Now, that was something that was done under the Obama administration.
Guest:And that's an argument that a lot of Trump supporters make.
Guest:They go, when you go, hey, this Muslim ban, this travel ban is stupid.
Guest:Well, they go, well, these countries were put on the list from Obama.
Guest:And then I go, well, then my answer to you is, then why didn't you correct it?
Guest:Why don't you really look at the countries where there's terrorists coming in from and correct that?
Guest:Because a lot of Iranians that come here.
Guest:I can't believe you've had that thoughtful a conversation with Trump supporters.
Guest:No, I think about it.
Marc:You're making up a conversation.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Well, maybe you guys should do a little work and correct it.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:Well, I liked the new material like I saw the other night, and it's just sort of just the approach to it is sort of like, what are you doing?
Guest:Absolutely.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Absolutely.
Guest:I mean, listen, that's what's so, it is so confusing to me is that these people, like you just said, a lot of the people who buy the Kool-Aid, the Trump Kool-Aid, really don't, they really don't, there's no logic there.
Guest:They don't step back and go- It's very black and white.
Guest:Very black and white.
Guest:Get out of my country.
Guest:Why don't you go back to your country?
Guest:I left that country because I love this country.
Guest:I probably love the American freedoms more than you love the American freedoms.
Marc:Well, that's actually been, I think, historically true with a lot of immigrant communities.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That they're more patriotic and more grateful in a way that this country was their salvation from horror.
Guest:Absolutely.
Guest:I say like this, I was riffing the other night and I go, make America great again.
Guest:I'm like, America already is great, asshole.
Guest:You want to see how great America is?
Guest:Go see Egypt.
Guest:How about make Egypt great again?
Guest:They used to be, they had their own empire.
Guest:Now you could buy a house for a dollar.
Guest:I mean, it's like, and the other thing is, I said this when he first started.
Guest:When he first started, I said, I feel like I could sit down at a dinner with him and have disagreements and then move on with my life.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Well, he'll waffle on anything.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:There's a lot of comics that know him pretty well.
Marc:I mean, Jeff Ross hung out with the guy on his plane.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:And he said he makes you feel great, that guy.
Guest:I'm sure he's got some charisma.
Guest:You feel good.
Guest:But my worry was his supporters, and now my worry is obviously him as well, but his supporters.
Guest:I thought that these people taking his words for face value.
Guest:So then you hear the story of the guy in Kansas who takes a gun and shoots two Indian dudes and then goes and says, I just shot two Iranians.
Guest:He doesn't even know who was shot.
Guest:And he's shit faced and mad about something else.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's just, it's in those two, I read the whole, there was a whole article on it.
Guest:One of them died, one of them survived.
Guest:They were like Indian, Indians who'd come to America to be engineers and they were just leading.
Guest:They were trying to live the American dream.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And, and also help America.
Marc:Help America.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, this is where smart, good things happen.
Marc:Yeah, absolutely.
Marc:We're putting an end to that.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:It's just shamelessly dumb now.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I find myself sometimes in my standup having serious moments now.
Guest:I actually feel like I can get away from it.
Guest:One of the things I say, I go, he needs to start taking responsibility for his words.
Guest:He doesn't.
Guest:He doesn't.
Guest:And the next day he goes, it was just a joke.
Guest:I was just saying words.
Marc:The generals did it.
Marc:I mean, he's been sort of, we've all been sort of blessed that nothing horrendously horrible has happened where he actually has to lead and bring Americans together.
Guest:around a thing even the travel ban what you just said exactly what you just said because my one of my one of my arguments was why did they if they really wanted to do the travel ban they didn't want to you know hurt regular ordinary people they could have said look within the next 60 days if you don't have a visa we're not anybody else in why was it immediate because he likes to like that's a authoritarian trick
Guest:It's an authoritarian jury.
Guest:But then he's such a jackass that he turns around and goes, well, my, exactly.
Guest:The police, the authorities told me that if we had warned people, then ISIS would have had a lead time to then come in.
Guest:I go, ISIS are criminals.
Guest:If you ban seven countries, they'll create a passport from one of the countries that's not banned, a fake passport, and they'll still come in.
Marc:And also it had nothing to do with ISIS.
Marc:It had nothing to do with ISIS.
Marc:It was just, you know, he's riled up, you know, a small percentage, larger than you want it to be, of this country's anger and fear, and he honors them.
Guest:Well, you know what was sad was when I, because I talk about, again, going to the protests.
Guest:I went to the LAX protests, and I was watching all the news all over the country.
Guest:There was protests, and I felt like, oh, wow, Americans got it.
Guest:They realize what a sham this travel ban is.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:Then that night I'm listening to the radio and they go, a majority of Americans still support the travel ban.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it hit me that what you just said, listen, people have their day-to-day lives.
Guest:They're busy, whatever, on Instagram or whatever they're doing.
Guest:I wish they were more paying attention.
Guest:They're not paying attention.
Guest:So they go, oh, keep terrorists out of the country?
Marc:Sure, let's do it.
Marc:That's good.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I don't want terrorists here.
Jeez.
Marc:Yeah, it's scary, dude.
Marc:So what's going on with your aunt?
Guest:Well, my aunt was was she's now she had to go then to a to a visa interview and she's waiting to find out.
Guest:I'm hoping that they let her in.
Guest:Like I said, you know, it's the woman's sister.
Guest:No, it's actually my sister who's not doing well.
Guest:Oh, I'm sorry.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:But it just piggybacked on top was this thing that she couldn't get a visa to come here.
Guest:She needed a visa to come here.
Guest:She's a British citizen.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it's angering to another level.
Marc:And it's also bureaucratic.
Marc:It's bureaucratic and it's complicated and it's...
Guest:Listen, that day, I got so many people hitting me with emails of their personal stories.
Guest:When the travel ban, that day that it happened, one guy hit me up.
Guest:He goes, my parents were elderly.
Guest:They were one of the first couples that landed at LAX.
Guest:When the ban took effect, the Border Patrol had them sign away.
Guest:They waived their visa right.
Guest:They didn't know what they were doing.
Guest:They signed a paper thinking, oh, this will get us in.
Guest:But in reality, what it said was, we waive our visas.
Guest:They put them back on a plane and sent them back to Iran.
Guest:And they can never come back now.
Guest:Well, no, they eventually, because the courts then started challenging it, he got them in as soon as he could.
Guest:They like came in.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But there's people in limbo, right?
Guest:There was another lady, she hits me up.
Guest:This was crazy because when America did the travel ban, Iran reciprocated and said, we're not going to let any Americans into Iran.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So a lady wrote me.
Guest:She goes, listen, I'm an Iranian who was studying in India.
Guest:I met my American husband in India.
Guest:We're married now.
Guest:We got an interview for me to get my green card.
Guest:So we had to go to Turkey to the embassy there.
Guest:She goes, we landed in Turkey.
Guest:We got another email saying that our interview had been canceled.
Guest:She goes, I'm Iranian.
Guest:I'm not allowed into America.
Guest:He's American.
Guest:He's not allowed into Iran.
Guest:We're stuck in a hotel room in Ankara, Turkey.
Guest:Please help.
Okay.
Marc:And what happened with that?
Guest:I followed up with her.
Guest:And again, because these courts challenged this jackass, thank God, they were able to, a lot of people were able to get in.
Guest:In the window that they had.
Guest:In the window that they had.
Guest:But now because the Supreme Court, especially with this guy Gorsuch or whatever, the Supreme Court has said that we're going to hear the arguments in October for the travel ban.
Guest:They said, for now, it's legit.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But then they said close relatives can come.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then, of course, the administration goes right in and goes, okay, so close relatives are going to be mother, father, brother, sister, mother-in-law, but no grandparents.
Marc:But didn't the court step in on the grandparents?
Guest:They stepped in on that.
Guest:And the grandparents are coming.
Guest:Grandparents are coming.
Guest:It's going to be week to week.
Guest:It's crazy.
Guest:I mean, if you're working at customs, how do you do your job?
Guest:I mean, what do I know?
Guest:Every day someone's coming and going, oh.
Marc:Well, they'll err on the side of being bad.
Marc:Absolutely.
Marc:Absolutely.
Marc:You know, I don't want to take any chances.
Marc:You can't come in.
Guest:In this whole process with my aunt trying to get the visa, my cousin was telling me that he talked to a friend of his who had come to America in the past, again, a British guy who has been to Iran.
Guest:He's come and gone in the past.
Guest:He said this guy was coming for a wedding or something, and he told my cousin, he's like, it took seven hours of interrogations at the border.
Marc:Yeah, I don't want to imply that customs people are bad.
Marc:It's a tough job.
Marc:But, you know, it's like they err on the side of caution.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know, the first one was so fucking confusing.
Marc:But, well, I hope that your aunt is able to get in.
Marc:I know, man.
Marc:And when did the, so what's the special called?
Marc:Special's called Immigrant.
Guest:Maz Jobrani Immigrant.
Guest:Is this, what is this, your third one?
Guest:This is my fourth, fifth, hold on.
Guest:This is my fifth.
Guest:I had the Axis of Evil that was a group of us.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Then I did Brown and Friendly.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I Come in Peace.
Guest:I'm not a terrorist, but I played one on TV, and now it's Immigrant.
Guest:And this Netflix?
Guest:Netflix.
Guest:My first original Netflix.
Marc:Oh, so this is the first Netflix special.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we shot it at Kennedy Center.
Guest:Really?
Guest:So I'm excited.
Guest:I'm excited about it.
Guest:At Kennedy Center?
Guest:D.C.
Guest:Kennedy Center.
Guest:And the reason I called it immigrant was because one of the things that really upset me, you know, I realized this when I came to America, it was like, you know, when that hostage crisis happened, I remember getting bullied.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And this guy, Trump is a bully.
Guest:And that's why I get so upset.
Guest:First and foremost.
Guest:First and foremost.
Guest:And so when the whole thing happened where they're like, keep refugees out, keep immigrants out.
Guest:And I realized, look, what would have happened if this travel ban had happened when I was fleeing Iran and the revolution with my family?
Guest:If we landed in New York and they sent us back into the revolution, what kind of psychological effect would that have had on me, on my family?
Marc:You could have been imprisoned.
Marc:I could have been- In Iran.
Guest:A lot of stuff, exactly.
Guest:I could have been in prison.
Guest:I could have, I mean, I just- Your parents could.
Marc:I mean, that's a lot of problems with a lot of the Latin countries as well.
Marc:In Mexico, they're sending people back into horrendous situations where they have no recourse.
Marc:They have no lives.
Marc:People have been here for 20 years being deported to- No sympathy whatsoever.
Guest:They just send them right back into this hell.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so I wanted to put a face, like in the special, I have a picture of myself when I was like in the third grade, right around the time I come to America.
Guest:So I have that in the background to indicate part of the message is these are the immigrants that you guys are sending back.
Guest:You're sending back kids.
Guest:You're sending back grandparents.
Guest:You're not stopping ISIS.
Guest:ISIS, well, first of all, the terror attacks we've had in America have been American-born.
Guest:And secondly, they're criminals.
Guest:They will find ways to get in.
Marc:Yeah, those people will.
Marc:And also, I don't know why he's not – it seems like if I'm not –
Marc:misreading or wrongly reading certain articles, it seems like there's been some success in defeating ISIS in Iraq.
Marc:Yeah, absolutely.
Marc:And I don't know why he's not, why is he not saying anything about that?
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:Because he wants to keep promoting this anti-immigrant agenda here and doesn't want people to separate the fact that the actual organization, the armed organization of ISIS is on the ground fighting and they're getting their asses kicked in Iraq.
Marc:But it's like, no, okay, but we still got to get these guys out of here.
Guest:Well, fear is good.
Guest:It's this new thing with the MS-182 or whatever they are, the El Salvadorian gang.
Guest:I'm sure they're bad guys and they've been around.
Guest:But now, again, he puts this fear in people like this is who we're going after.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So people go, oh, great.
Guest:And they're on your street right now.
Guest:Yeah, and imagine like now a lot of his supporters are probably seeing some poor Mexican dude and going like, get out of my country.
Marc:Oh yeah, definitely, definitely.
Marc:It's like, but bring me my food first.
Marc:Yeah, bring me my food first.
Marc:Don't leave until you finish in the kitchen.
Marc:Bunch of assholes.
Marc:Yeah, man.
Marc:But yeah, it's good to see you.
Marc:And I'm glad that kids are all right.
Marc:Everybody's good.
Guest:Wife's good.
Guest:Kids are good.
Guest:Wife's good.
Guest:They're growing.
Guest:Kids grow fast.
Guest:How old are they now?
Guest:They're six and 10, dude.
Marc:It just goes by, right?
Guest:It's nuts.
Marc:I don't have any.
Marc:I'm just not acknowledging that I'm aging because I don't have the reminder.
Marc:I'm telling you, man.
Marc:My cats are getting old.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But they're holding up all right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, it's kids really remind.
Guest:I mean, I was watching videos of them when they were toddlers.
Guest:I don't remember that period.
Guest:I don't remember that.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And I just go, what the hell?
Guest:And it's like what you were just saying.
Guest:It's kids or some gray hairs once in a while.
Guest:Like when I grow out the beard and it gets gray.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I go, holy shit, I'm old.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I know I'm starting to see it a little more.
Marc:It's crazy.
Marc:It happened.
Marc:How old are you?
Marc:I'm 45.
Marc:Well, I'm 53.
Marc:In the 50s, there's a big shift.
Marc:I can feel it coming.
Marc:Like by 55, 56, it's sort of like, yep, now he's old Mark.
Marc:Well, you know what it is?
Guest:It's because when we were kids, like I think once people hit 40, they had the briefcases and there was like people were business.
Guest:They dress like grown.
Guest:Grownups.
Guest:They dress like grownups.
Guest:Yeah, no more.
Guest:I never walk around in shorts and t-shirts.
Marc:Why'd this work out?
Guest:No, it's fine.
Guest:It's fantastic.
Guest:I got sneakers on.
Marc:You were on stage on shorts.
Guest:I was.
Guest:That was, yeah.
Marc:You were telling the truth, though.
Marc:You just come from the hospital.
Marc:Yeah, I just come from the hospital.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Well, I hope that works out.
Marc:Thanks, man.
Marc:I hope so, too.
Marc:And it's good to see you.
Marc:Thanks, Mark.
Marc:Maz Jobrani, his show, the new special is called Maz Jobrani Immigrant on Netflix streaming now.
Marc:Dig it.
Marc:So Rory Scoville, fun guy, funny guy, nice dude.
Marc:I was happy to talk to him.
Marc:I see him around, kind of known him here and there for years.
Marc:But now he lives down the street from me.
Marc:So it was an easy commute for him to come over to talk about his new special that is streaming on Netflix.
Marc:Everything's on Netflix.
Marc:It's called Rory Scoville Tries Stand Up for the First Time.
Marc:And you can watch it right now if you want, right after you listen to me and Rory talk.
Marc:So this is me and Rory talking.
Guest:The one good thing about this job, too, is that you can easily go, well, I can get out of here.
Marc:I can get out of here for as long as I want.
Marc:Well, that's what becomes the indicator of whether or not you like your life as much as you think you do or whether you know you do or you don't is when you go on the road and you're like, oh, yeah.
Marc:I'm out.
Guest:Finally, I'm away from me.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:I don't have to clean this room.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, it's true.
Guest:Go downstairs and just tell the lady, hey, could someone do my room?
Guest:All right, good.
Guest:You start looking at your job as the vacation.
Guest:Oh, no doubt.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, I mean, that's kind of a cool thing, too, but then it is also kind of like, is that healthy?
Marc:Is that mentally healthy?
Marc:Well, I mean, a lot of people live out there.
Marc:You know, I imagine it could become sort of sad and stressful, but it's not as sad as it used to be.
Marc:I don't know what level you're at with the road, but it used to be like as soon as you got out there, you'd be you wouldn't be treated well.
Marc:So you'd be at the shitty hotel out where you can't drive anywhere.
Marc:And immediately you're like, oh, God, it's just time for wrong things.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, there's still those places that are doing like the condo or they're still doing like the shitty hotel, but luckily that's now, and it's because of things like podcasts and blogs and anything that's like any kind of media to where comics can actually complain.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So there's clubs now going like, oh, at least the smart ones who are like,
Guest:oh, I guess we didn't really know.
Guest:No, we'll get you guys a way better hotel.
Guest:We'll make changes.
Marc:Marriott Courtyard?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Hell yeah, they got breakfast.
Marc:Put me in that courtyard.
Marc:That's the best.
Marc:Give me that continental breakfast.
Marc:Oh, it just made me think about that fucking condo in San Antonio, man.
Marc:I feel like I've talked about it before, but it was just one of those ones that had just been through it, and there were just layers of bad decisions and sadness.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:The furniture didn't begin as new, and now it's just like generations...
Marc:the furniture started in a bad place day one it was in a bad spot exactly because i'm in that same zone you were talking about like i just spent like three four months on the road hammering out like an hour plus to do a special and now i'm in that place where i'm like i don't have to do anything yeah and like i'm not even sure i want to like i always get to this place where it's sort of like i don't feel like i need to do comedy and then like a week goes by you're like oh fuck i know i gotta who am i yeah what am i doing yeah i haven't talked to people
Guest:Well, that's what someone asked me.
Guest:They're like, do you see yourself like, uh, getting to a point where you're just like, I don't, I'm not going to do it anymore.
Guest:And I was like, I feel like every time you do it, you think maybe I'm not going to do it anymore.
Guest:But then it's like, you have that one show and you're like, what am I talking about?
Guest:This is my, this is my high.
Guest:It's like getting up here and doing this.
Guest:It's like best thing ever.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You can't picture not doing it.
Guest:It's one new bit.
Guest:It just takes one new one.
Guest:And not even like, like a minute, like a minute's worth of new words to say.
Marc:Half a bit.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like just, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:One half bit and you get that adrenaline again.
Guest:You're like, oh, I can build off this.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It wakes all the other shit up.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And until that stuff just falls away.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, 100%.
Marc:See, now I want to... Let's go do a set.
Marc:Let's go do one of those daytime sets.
Guest:10 in the morning.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Just pop in somewhere.
Guest:Do those coffee spots.
Guest:You could probably actually run a pretty successful...
Guest:9 a.m.
Guest:coffee shop show.
Marc:Do you imagine how annoyed people?
Marc:Crowds are coming in.
Marc:That would be a hilarious idea.
Marc:Propping up their laptops.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Like a morning coffee shop stand-up show just to see the looks on their faces.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Before they have their first cup of coffee, just like, are you fucking kidding me?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It's just a needy asshole in the corner going, hey, how's it going?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:How's everybody doing?
Guest:Trying to get into my Cortado and my puff pastry.
Yeah.
Marc:i don't even know what a cortado this guy up here talking about his job which he's at yeah so but the way you don't want to go back down you don't want to go back where are you from in the southern part of the united states south carolina see i don't even know greenville greenville south carolina really yeah i don't even know if i've been to south carolina what are the other cities charleston oh yeah probably the most popular that's by water
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I played at a nice theater down there.
Marc:Charleston's great.
Marc:Yeah, there's a nice little theater, and there was places to eat close by.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:And that's all that matters.
Marc:Yeah, but it was definitely Southern.
Guest:Yeah, you're there 24 hours.
Guest:You just need coffee and a place to eat.
Marc:Yeah, I can't remember the name of that space, but it was a respectable little venue.
Marc:But people came out.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:See, I romanticize the South now as much as I stereotyped it previously.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:I'm in the second half of my life where I'm like, the South is a great place.
Marc:There are misguided people everywhere, but the good ones are very decent, and there's a true history there.
Guest:Well, I think, I mean, I'm sure you've played Asheville in North Carolina.
Guest:Right, but that seems to be an outlier.
Guest:That's kind of like your Austin.
Marc:I know, but I worry about the survival of those places at this point in time.
Marc:It always felt tenuous to me.
Marc:Look what's happening in Portland.
Marc:I always knew there was something under the surface.
Marc:Right.
Marc:That was, you know, much older than that city's hipness.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's going to resurface.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Especially these times.
Marc:But Asheville's kind of dug in.
Marc:You got a lot of off the grid hippies that there's a, you know, there, I think there is a Southern disposition that isn't inherently political or wrong.
Marc:Just sort of like, you know, we live up here.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Just stay out of the yard.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:I mean, South Carolina and North Carolina, I mean, they're great states.
Guest:They have their pros and cons.
Guest:But, you know, there is an element of, like, there is a younger, more progressive vibe starting to happen, but it's still drowning in a sea of, like, some... I'm not saying all conservative ideas are bad, but it's drowning in a sea of really bad conservative ideas.
Guest:ideas where people socially can't wrap their minds around anything.
Guest:I saw a guy... I was just back in my hometown.
Guest:I saw a guy get out of his car.
Guest:I was just driving past.
Guest:This all happened in just a matter of seconds.
Guest:I saw the guy driving past...
Guest:And he had a sign.
Guest:And I was like, oh, the guy looks like he's going to protest.
Guest:I look across the street.
Guest:It's like a women's clinic.
Guest:I look back and I can now see the sign says abortion is wrong.
Guest:And this guy, this guy's entire afternoon is, well, no, it's 11 o'clock.
Guest:I go down.
Guest:I open the trunk.
Guest:I get the sign out.
Guest:And I stand across the street.
Guest:And as cars drive by, I'm just letting him know that abortion is wrong.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it's that.
Guest:That's his job.
Guest:That's his job.
Guest:He's doing it for God.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Those level of people.
Guest:A guy who could clearly go donate time at a soup kitchen or help orphans who do need some support.
Guest:But no, my thing is I need to go- Go help the babies that did happen.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I need to go stand out here in front of these women whose stories I can't possibly fathom or understand.
Guest:I have to stand here and tell them what I think.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And in his mind, he's doing the Lord's work.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, well, I mean, the South, it's tricky, you know, but historically, and not that long ago, there was some very bad business down there.
Marc:And, you know, in some ways, I think it's bounced back.
Marc:In some ways, people have progressed.
Marc:But there are some holdouts.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I think we're seeing a lot of holdouts.
Guest:A lot of holdouts.
Guest:A lot of people going, I like to hold on to a tradition, traditional stuff that makes no sense.
Marc:Just good old American racism and hate.
Guest:That's right.
Marc:I mean, that's what, you know, we believe in it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:My parents did.
Marc:My grandparents did.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:So who's to say they're wrong?
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:Everybody, the Constitution, things like that.
Guest:Yeah, well, what do they know?
Guest:The hope is that there are people, when I go back, I do hang out with a lot of people who aren't like that, but when you see young people who carry those ideals, it's like, oh, you truly don't possess the ability to think for yourself at all.
Guest:You can't plug into anyone other than what your uncle told you at one point.
Guest:You were like, well, that's my identity, too.
Marc:Yeah, and they'll accuse us of not being able to think for ourselves at all, that we've just let it go, that freedom was too much for us.
Guest:Mental freedom.
Marc:Look what freedom did to you, you hippie.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But when you do go back, I mean, what's your family like?
Marc:Are they frightening or...
Guest:No, my family is.
Guest:I mean, I've come from the kind of family where I I I'm pretty sure a lot of them, if they voted, voted for Trump.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I can't say that with any certainty.
Guest:They might have voted for.
Marc:So they keep it to themselves.
Guest:They keep it themselves because I think they're also... I mean, if you bring it up, someone might be like, well, I couldn't vote for... They're like, Trump is an idiot.
Guest:Like, oh, who'd you vote for?
Guest:I'm like, well, I couldn't vote for Hillary.
Guest:And so you're like, oh, you're that weird between that I don't... I can't relate to.
Marc:That's sort of like, I just couldn't bring my hand to... You know, it is that sort of thing like, well, I wasn't gonna... I mean, come on.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:What are you thinking?
Guest:Be a person.
Guest:What am I gonna... I'm gonna vote for her and then live with myself?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But there, I mean, I come from a family that's not like, I think everyone's probably got someone in their family who's probably said some racist stuff.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:You know, some of them are, as some people joke, grandfathered into that because they're maybe specifically grandfathers.
Guest:But I don't know.
Guest:I think I come from a pretty...
Guest:What was the business?
Guest:Did you have a family business?
Guest:No.
Guest:My dad worked at the post office.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah, my dad worked at the post office.
Guest:And my mom also worked at the post office.
Guest:She passed away when I was really young.
Guest:And then my dad, my stepmother, she also worked at the post office.
Guest:But then after they got married, she was at home and they had five kids.
Guest:So seven of us.
Guest:So pretty big family.
Guest:The age gap between me and my next sister just below me is like seven or eight years.
Guest:So they're like, how old are they now?
Guest:My youngest brother, the youngest sibling, just graduated high school on Wednesday.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I'm 36 going on 37 in like two months.
Guest:And are you all close?
Guest:We try to be.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think the- Because you were out of the house by the time- I was way out before a lot of the siblings were like, while they were growing up- So you're the wandering half-brother.
Guest:Yeah, but I just sort of, and I think the only reason maybe that I do, I am able to have a connection to, let's say specifically my youngest brother, is because of this job that we do.
Guest:I think it's, you know, if I was...
Guest:You know, I don't want to shit on people who are in accounting, but if I was in accounting, he would be like, we have nothing to talk about.
Marc:But like he can actually see you on television.
Guest:He can see on television also because I'm telling jokes.
Guest:He can kind of get to know my perspective through that.
Guest:So he can go, oh, while my brother is 36 and at the age of 18, he thinks that's 70 years old.
Guest:Right.
Guest:He can listen to my jokes and be like, well, maybe it's maybe that's not 70 years old.
Guest:Maybe that's actually he's still a silly.
Guest:But that's got to be cool.
Guest:Oh, I think so.
Guest:I think it's salvaged any chance of having a relationship is the fact that this job kind of keeps us young, I think.
Marc:Yeah, especially if you don't have children.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Once you start talking about children, then you're cutting off a few.
Marc:For sure.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:I didn't do that on purpose, but yeah.
Marc:I can now remain a perpetual adolescent on an ideological level, still be appealing emotionally to 15 year old.
Guest:The dream.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I did it.
Guest:I made it.
Marc:I never have to change.
Guest:Emotional appeal to teenagers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's all you, that's what, that's what business is.
Guest:That's when you know you've done it.
Guest:That's when you know you're good.
Marc:Yeah, but for me, it's very specific, troubled, sensitive, aggravated teenagers.
Marc:They're not having a good time.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:They're into me because I sort of validate, like, oh, see, you never have a good time.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:He's right.
Guest:This is our leader.
Marc:We've met him.
Guest:Never have fun.
Marc:He knows it's not going to be easy ever.
Marc:Yeah, that's what I did.
Marc:That's what I cultivated.
Marc:So the post office, though, they're civil servants to a degree.
Marc:For some reason, when you tell me that they work at the post office, I'm like, that's noble.
Marc:That's a tough job.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, at that time, and we're talking like the mid-70s, late-70s, when they started working there, that was a time when it was like, hey, if you're willing to leave college and go get this job, you can actually get a pretty good salary job at the post office.
Guest:yeah and it's like and soft so you're a government employee right that goes with its own benefits and yeah i think at the time there was that appeal and then i think maybe the rest of the world around the post office and and a lot of government jobs uh was like no the inflation and the price of things is that but the post office and all government like no you guys still make what you made and you know 77 yeah and the world around you will change and then let's hope one day let's hope you save money yeah it's it's a holdout like you know it's like this we yeah i uh
Marc:I don't know who I talked to, but there was, I think maybe it was, oh, I used to do a bit about it, you know, when people would snap the post, there was that trend there for a while.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:I just, like, I just saw it, like, just one day, it was just sort of like, this is never gonna stop.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:The letters just keep coming, you know, like, there's, like, you're never done, you know, and it just...
Guest:Yeah, if your OCD is like, I start a thing and I finish it.
Guest:It's like, no, the day one you started it.
Guest:And even when you retire, it won't have been done.
Guest:It goes on without you.
Guest:Right, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Kind of.
Marc:So were they post people?
Guest:Did they walk the beat?
Guest:I don't know what my mother did or my grandfather who also worked there.
Guest:No one was ever delivering mail.
Guest:Postal legacy.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:That's what I'm supposed to be doing, I think.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And that's my true calling.
Marc:You always have the post office.
Marc:Well, my grandfather said to my father, I don't remember whether he said it to me, but it was an idea he had in his head.
Marc:It's like you could always get a job at the post office.
Marc:It must have been at some point a big push.
Guest:Like the perfect plan B at that time.
Marc:You get benefits.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So he retired from the post office.
Guest:My dad is still working at the post office.
Guest:We just had a conversation recently where I was like, I think it's time.
Guest:Like he could have retired, but it's the thing where it's like, well, you stay on for several years.
Guest:Your percentage of your salary that you'll get continues to go up.
Guest:So he's been holding out to like get to a certain percentage.
Guest:And I was like, I think the time has come.
Marc:He's going for the golden watch kind of deal.
Guest:Like, you know, you're going to hit your points.
Guest:I don't really know.
Guest:I mean, I told him, I was like, look, I've been fortunate the past few years in what I do.
Guest:It's like, why don't you let me chip in?
Guest:Why don't you get out of there and we can figure out how to do it?
Guest:And he was more than happy to be like, oh, great.
Guest:It wasn't even like, I don't know.
Guest:You want to buy a house.
Guest:You got a favor.
Guest:He's like, great.
Guest:Yeah, let's do that.
Guest:Like instant, instantly.
Guest:Like as soon as I said it, I was like, oh, he's been waiting.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I've kind of done that with my dad a little bit, but he's still too proud.
Marc:Because I didn't offer him a plan.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:It wasn't, you know, because I don't know.
Marc:My dad had money, and then he fucked it up.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So it's a different situation, you know?
Marc:And I don't know.
Marc:But I have these conversations with him, but it's never like, let's just figure out where you're at monthly, and maybe I can chip in.
Marc:It's more like, do you need some now?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Are you in trouble?
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And he's been reluctant, you know?
Guest:We send you $100.
Marc:yeah you want that gonna hurt yeah i'll get a walk around yeah i'll send you a bond yes it's a check if you want to cash it some yeah yeah still i get some you want a chore to do this meet now you have to go to the bank oh i guess i gotta do it i guess it's our you have to right well i i think uh i didn't do it before because uh well you gotta have it the
Guest:You got to have it to do it.
Guest:And I've been trying to save.
Guest:And I've also been in that idea of like, well, you know, I could, you know, the amount of houses I could buy in my hometown, I doesn't even get me the one that I want here.
Guest:And so you go through that thing.
Guest:Like, what do I keep renting?
Guest:Do I buy?
Guest:All these things that I hate thinking about.
Guest:And I hate that we're kind of forced to like, well, one day you got to figure out blah, blah, blah.
Marc:You do have to figure it out, but you can spend your whole life trying to figure out or at the exact same place you're at right now.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I need to fix this house and I've needed to for a decade.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And ultimately it just becomes like, well, I guess I'm just going to wait till something falls off.
Marc:And then do it.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:When that thing, when the wall breaks.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I better fix that.
Guest:It's so stupid.
Guest:It's kind of like looking at insurance.
Guest:It's like, well, you should go get insurance and pay it every month.
Guest:And then when you don't need it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then, you know, there was a time when I didn't have insurance.
Guest:And then I went to a dermatologist.
Guest:I had to get some like moles cut off.
Guest:And so I went to do it.
Guest:And I told my aunt.
Guest:Well, I told my aunt, I was like, it cost me $700.
Guest:And she was like, well, I'll see if you had insurance.
Guest:You wouldn't have to pay that.
Guest:And I was like,
Guest:Yeah, but if I would have had insurance, I would have already paid $2,000 to have nothing done at all.
Guest:So I was like, I think I actually save money.
Guest:I feel like it's kind of like that with a house where you're like, well, hopefully when that wall falls off, it's not one that costs so much money.
Marc:Rolling the dice on the insurance.
Guest:And all the pipes come along with it.
Marc:The house is going to last longer than us, probably.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But I don't know.
Marc:You're married, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You got married not too long ago.
Guest:Married about three years ago.
Guest:I know her, right?
Guest:I met her a few times.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:No kids yet?
Guest:One kid.
Guest:She turns two in July.
Guest:You did that?
Guest:Yeah, we had a little girl.
Guest:You got a kid over there?
Guest:We got a little kid over there.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:It's crazy.
Guest:Is it?
Marc:Yeah, it's definitely the... See, I thought you were on Team No Kids, but no, you're just another one.
Guest:I was on Team No Kids for a while.
Guest:I thought, there's maybe a small percentage of me that's still on Team No Kids.
Guest:Right now.
Guest:Right now, you're on Team No Kids.
Guest:Whenever I want to go put something together and do it on my own, I'm like, ah, Team No Kids.
Guest:Really should have been here for this.
Guest:Oh, but that's exciting, right?
Guest:It's the greatest thing.
Guest:I've learned after having a kid that all the cliche things that people say, you go, oh, that's why people say them, and that's why it's become a cliche is because it's just- It's just the most amazing thing.
Guest:It's like when someone asks, what's the weather like in California?
Guest:We all say the exact same thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, it's sunny every day.
Guest:It's usually pretty good.
Guest:Yeah, and there's no different answer, but-
Marc:But I've gotten to the point where I'm like, it's creepy, the weather, actually.
Marc:We go through long periods of dryness.
Marc:There was a period there where I didn't know whether or not the earth would survive.
Marc:And then it rains, and you're like, oh, my God, thank God.
Guest:Yeah, when we had that, like, what, two weeks of rain?
Guest:And then you were like, well, wait, can our ground stay in this kind of... Is my house going to stay?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:When does the mudslide start?
Marc:No, I was so happy about the rain.
Marc:But so you're generally happy about the kid.
Guest:Very, very happy about it.
Guest:She's all healthy and good?
Guest:All healthy and good.
Guest:I am already a paranoid, anxious person all the time.
Guest:I mean, it's probably why we do what we do.
Guest:That's why I don't have kids.
Guest:This kind of adds to it a little bit where you're like, oh, it's even more paranoia and anxiety because you're like, what if something happens?
Guest:What if anything happens?
Guest:And I go down the road of all of the worst possible scenarios in every scenario, worst outcome.
Guest:And it's... I don't know.
Guest:Somehow it's still...
Guest:all completely trumped by the idea of like a kid seeing a brain grow and also you also realize like oh if we actually put all our efforts as human beings towards children's health and education yeah we could actually save society and the planet because you watch a kid's mind go
Guest:Oh, I'm like a computer.
Guest:I only know what you're going to tell me.
Guest:And then when I turn 16 and decide I want to learn on my own, whether that changes or not, you at least gave me the solid foundation of right and wrong and blah, blah, blah.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And then at 16, they go, fuck you.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:But, you know, I feel like the kids with that solid foundation, they say, fuck you, and they go away for a bit.
Guest:But then I think in their late 20s, they go, you know what?
Guest:You were right.
Guest:I didn't agree with everything, but the core of it, you were right.
Guest:Is that who you were?
Guest:I think so.
Guest:I mean, a little bit.
Guest:I think I wasn't a bad kid.
Guest:I was always afraid of getting in trouble, despite being a class clown and getting in trouble for talking.
Guest:Like minor stuff.
Guest:I never did a major... You weren't out blowing up cats.
Guest:Never.
Guest:I never did anything that I was like, oh, this is going to be...
Guest:I was so afraid to get in trouble.
Guest:Scar on my soul forever.
Guest:Right, exactly.
Marc:Yeah, I was with some bad people.
Guest:I was with some smokers, some teens who wanted to smoke.
Guest:And then everything hell broke loose.
Guest:We killed some frogs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was going through my greaser stage.
Guest:We were racing cars.
Guest:Well, that seems a little more exciting.
Marc:That actually would be great.
Guest:And hurting animals.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I think we missed the greaser thing, the racing cars.
Marc:But maybe in the South, it never goes away.
Guest:You know, I feel like that, you know, I don't know.
Guest:Mudding, mud-dogging, that was like the thing.
Guest:What was that, with the big wheels?
Guest:Big wheels, like a Jeep, go out and get stuck in mud and then get out of it, which I could not understand.
Guest:I watch people with videos of the man, look at me go over this boulder and it looks like my car's going to tip, but then it doesn't.
Marc:And there's just dudes sitting around the periphery watching.
Marc:Yeah, and loving.
Marc:Like the one guy in a wheelchair.
Marc:I used to do it.
Guest:I did it too until, you know, clearly...
Guest:clearly there's consequences i should have worn my belt i didn't i thought i had the boulder i thought i had it and it got on top of me so horrible i still love it i still love to watch yeah yeah yeah good for them so that's a you know tragedy you know the horrible consequences of doing something for no reason yeah yeah yeah yeah and also the high of it when it all works out isn't very good
Marc:no because you can't you can't recapture it you know at least with drugs you're like i'm gonna put this in my body and there's a 90 chance yeah it's gonna be pretty fucking good if it's not i just do more yeah but like to do whatever it is like if i can just make that jump it's like the odds are not with not consistent buzz
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:I was still having a kid.
Guest:I think that's when the drugs thing kind of hits you where you're like, you know, because I experiment with drugs, but then you're like, am I going to have the kid who experiments and never comes back?
Guest:Oh, that's a big deal.
Guest:Yeah, I just kept going.
Guest:I kept chasing the high.
Guest:And then you're like, well, talk to me like you again.
Guest:They're like, no, that person's gone.
Marc:Yeah, that person's gone.
Marc:I got to go now because I'm a little itchy.
Guest:I got to go.
Guest:I'm late for fish, so I got to get out there, get my nitrous on.
Yeah.
Guest:so you're like 36 so you grew up yeah it's a little different but so the so what so you moved over here for the school or um not really i mean when we moved to la six years ago we started in silver lake um just because brendan walsh walked us around silver lake and he was like yeah you want to be over here kind of on the east side by his house great yeah yeah he's like be my neighbor let's drive to shows together
Guest:um but yes i i so we like the east side and we just stayed over here but i i think my trying to slowly escape la oh yeah you keep going oh eagle rock and then eventually pasadena and then you're out in sun valley yeah exactly i'll be out in the desert trailer in joshua tree we're in vegas i'm driving in for my 10 minute spots every night i don't know how people live in vegas and i'm not saying that to upset people in vegas but i i just can't get near the place
Marc:Yeah, I don't.
Marc:My wife is from there.
Marc:What?
Marc:So we go visit her parents.
Marc:They still live there.
Marc:I just see everything in Vegas being corrupted by what Vegas is.
Marc:But I guess people have regular lives there as well.
Guest:They do and they like it.
Guest:But you have to you have to like that specific lifestyle.
Guest:I mean, my her parents are in real estate.
Guest:So they're doing great.
Guest:They're in residential and commercial real estate.
Marc:I guess there's some people that are in Vegas, and they're like, we never go to the Strip.
Guest:We don't go over there.
Guest:Yeah, they don't.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And also, if they want to go gamble, they're not going to the ones on the Strip.
Guest:They're going to those ones that are off the beaten path in a gas station.
Marc:Joe's Casino.
Marc:In the back curtained room, and it's just one poker machine.
Marc:Oh, you were just in that movie about a casino.
Marc:uh yeah the house yeah i watched it because i talked to uh manzoukas yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah well that's great he is great yeah he's a good guy he's very he's very uh upfront earnest dude right seems to know i'd have a good time yeah yeah yeah uh but yeah the movie was ridiculous but okay it's funny you had a big part i was happy i was the whole time we were doing it i was in my head it was just like all right hopefully this doesn't get cut
Guest:I'm at that level where I'm 100% if they're like, we're long on time.
Guest:We'll cut the guy no one really knows.
Guest:I know where I'm at.
Marc:But no, you had like three or four scenes you pop up in.
Marc:That's a pretty big movie part.
Guest:Oh, huge.
Marc:I saw a lot of comedians' faces in there that said nothing.
Guest:kyle had a little thing yeah kyle that whole cast it was great i mean the whole time we you know i haven't done it i was in dimitri's uh movie i saw that too you were the you were the roommate guy or the friend yeah the friend on la cat yeah yeah yeah that was good that was a good part that was both of those were things i had never done so i was like in that fake it till you make it mentality but you know when someone's like hey come and uh open for me and it's a lot of people and you got to kind of lie and be like oh yeah i've done
Guest:that before so put your faith in me yeah that's right this was kind of this yeah that i was like oh i can act i know what i'm doing yeah you just that's the only way to do it yeah yeah i mean you can freak yourself out and go take classes and stuff but ultimately as a comic you're like yeah i think yeah i think maybe as comics that's what uh if someone's like we got this really dramatic role and it's all riding on you it's like well then i'm gonna go take a really good notes you know can you have someone's business card yeah who might teach me how to do this yeah
Guest:But when someone's like, hey, it's a comedy, and we're literally asking you to say the punchline, you're like, well, I've done that enough.
Guest:I can save the money.
Guest:And you knew everybody over there.
Guest:Oh, that's what made it great.
Guest:And the fact that it's Amy Poehler, it's Will Ferrell, you can immediately understand this is going to be a fun tone to all of this.
Marc:It got a little over the top.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It got a little messy.
Guest:I haven't seen the total- Oh, you haven't?
Guest:I was out of town when they did a screening for it.
Marc:One thing that happens very quickly in those kind of movies is you go like, oh, this could never happen.
Marc:There's no reason for any of this to connect and make sense.
Guest:Most comedies are like, well, that wouldn't happen.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:But like I told Mantzuka, so I said, towards the end, the good guys, which are basically Will and Amy, the parents, they've completely morally corrupted themselves to a point where they were unredeemable.
Marc:So there was part of me at the end where it's sort of like, they don't deserve...
Marc:To have the happy ending?
Guest:Right, yeah, yeah.
Guest:This is not how it's supposed to.
Guest:They cross the line.
Guest:They cross the line.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:They don't get away with that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I was overthinking it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But what was the scene like?
Marc:When did you start doing the standup?
Guest:I started in 2004 in D.C.
Guest:Really?
Guest:I moved up there because my sister lived there, my older sister.
Guest:but you never did any in the south uh no i mean i did one show in the south uh it was uh the thing that like got me started was like an open mic poetry night and i asked if i could uh do jokes instead of poetry and i brought the entire audience because it was all my friends right and they were like oh this is let's go sure go grab beers and watch rory make an ass of himself did they stay for the poets
Guest:You know, the poets asked, there was only three poets.
Guest:And honestly, it was a place called Guitar Bar.
Guest:And it was an awesome bar, had a nice little showroom.
Guest:And the poets were like, do you mind going at the end?
Guest:So people like watch.
Guest:And new to it, you don't even understand that
Guest:So I'm like, yeah, I don't know what I'm doing.
Guest:So you guys tell me when to go because I don't know what any of this is.
Guest:I wrote down some things that I think my friends will laugh at, but no one else can relate to.
Guest:And it was... I brought enough people where the...
Guest:The guy running the bar, I was like, so how long do I go up there?
Guest:And he was like, you brought everybody.
Guest:He's like, I would love it if you just went up there for as long as possible because they'll just keep drinking.
Guest:It's a Monday night and you brought the entire audience.
Guest:So in a way, it looked good for me to the bar and to the poets because they're like, oh, we never have an audience.
Guest:This guy brought an audience and now he's going last and they're buying drinks.
Guest:It's a big night for them.
Yeah.
Guest:So I didn't understand any.
Guest:I just went up there and like fucked around.
Guest:So they did it.
Marc:The poets got their audience.
Marc:They got their audience.
Guest:And my friends all sat there, you know, like nice to be like, oh, this is.
Guest:You probably have nice friends.
Guest:Nobody heckled the poets.
Marc:There's a poet somewhere in South Carolina saying like, do you remember that night?
Marc:That was the best night.
Guest:That was our Madison Square Garden when those 40 drunk college kids showed up to heckle their friend.
Guest:So you were in college?
Guest:It was just after college, about a year out of college.
Guest:And you just did it because you thought you could do it?
Guest:What made you think you could do that?
Guest:I didn't know what to do.
Guest:I kind of wanted to get into filmmaking since I was like 14.
Guest:I was like, oh, I want to make movies and be an actor.
Guest:I think it's fun.
Guest:But then my buddy in high school, he was like, you know, a lot of the people on Saturday Night Live, he's like, there's a lot of them are stand-up comics and they're writers.
Guest:And all of that, I was like, oh, I can't see myself doing that.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because I didn't really know what stand-up comedy was.
Guest:I wasn't one of the people that like...
Guest:You know, snuck over to listen to Pryor or Carlin.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I didn't have any interest.
Guest:I watched like the Marx Brothers and like Abbott and Costello.
Guest:You went way back.
Guest:How'd that happen?
Guest:Well, my dad, it was on like AMC, a thing.
Guest:And my dad was like, you should watch that.
Guest:Well, I grew up watching these guys.
Guest:You watch this.
Guest:And that was like that time where as a kid, I was like...
Guest:Oh, adults are silly.
Guest:Like they do silly stuff.
Guest:I can continue to just kind of be a jackass my whole life.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then I wanted to be a filmmaker.
Guest:And then after I got out of college, I was like, oh, I have this thing in my head that I want to do and I've done nothing to do and I don't know how to do it.
Guest:I was like...
Guest:And you start realizing like, oh, this is what people talk about when they talk about dreams and being ridiculous and never doing anything.
Marc:This is why, yeah, they don't do it because they don't figure out how to do it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I started running camera for a local news station.
Guest:I was just in the studio doing like the 5 o'clock, 7 o'clock, 11 o'clock, whatever all the times were.
Guest:They always kept changing at that time.
Guest:Just running, listening to the director being like, I frame it up a little bit.
Guest:You're a little heavy on the right.
Guest:Like just, we got to get the car running.
Guest:Like move it over so we can get the image and like, you know, just doing that.
Marc:Were you in college?
Guest:This was a year out of college.
Guest:I just stayed in my college town.
Marc:You got the gig at the local station?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:With no experience?
Guest:No experience.
Guest:I went up there, and they basically were like, I was on a camera, and they were like, all right, pan right, pan left.
Guest:All right, you know the terms.
Guest:Like, if you knew pan, you were fine.
Guest:So it wasn't a union gig, I'm assuming.
Guest:No.
Guest:I mean, it was like the bare minimum.
Guest:I think I was making like $6 or $7 an hour.
Marc:Was that the first time you had that moment?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:when I go on the road, sometimes you do the local TV, and you walk into a space, and it's just this big empty space with the set, and you're like, this is it?
Guest:Yes, yeah.
Guest:The magic is immediately, you go, oh, okay, so there is no magic to anything.
Guest:Nothing, nothing.
Guest:It's just, these cameras have sold us a lie a whole lot.
Marc:Yeah, frame it up, and if you pull back, there's just two guys.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:sitting there and one guy has a coffee a raggedy curtain covering a window from the parking lot and then when they do those like if you're you're doing local tv and you're following like a like a cooking segment from the guy who's got a restaurant in town that kind of thing yeah like oh my god this is it's so stripped down it's so weird there's nothing magic to it the illusion of it
Marc:So you learned how to pan right and left?
Guest:Yeah, I was basically doing that.
Guest:And, you know, that was fine if you're like, oh, I can still go out after my shift.
Guest:I can sleep all day and then go to work at, you know, 5 o'clock or whatever it was.
Guest:And, like, nothing is expected of me but to, like...
Guest:No.
Guest:When I need a two-shot?
Guest:When do I need everybody?
Guest:When are we going to sports?
Guest:Am I on weather?
Guest:If you're on the weather camera, they're like, all right, this one's tougher because you have to make sure you see what the green screen's giving you.
Guest:You're pointing at nothing.
Marc:Make sure you get them pointing at nothing so we can put the stuff on.
Marc:But in your mind, you were like, well, I'm taking steps.
Guest:In my mind, I was like, oh, okay, instead of becoming a filmmaker, I'll go down this road and try to work my way up, and maybe I'll be a guy that shoots segments for Dateline or something.
Guest:I kind of thought, and I think it's because I majored in journalism, so my degree was communications journalism, even though I had no passion for it.
Guest:I only took that because there were film classes you could take if that was your focus.
Marc:Then you took those.
Guest:So I took the film course with a history of film, anything in film where you got to some classes you got to be hands on and actually make something.
Marc:But I like how quickly you just accommodated your dream to the job you got.
Marc:No, I could do this for Dateline.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:I could pan right and left for Dateline.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Well, I think that's what it was in my head.
Guest:I was like, oh, I'm doing this.
Guest:And maybe this all kind of contributes back to my mother passing away as a kid.
Guest:How'd she die?
Guest:She had cancer, lymphatic cancer.
Guest:So she, Hodgkin's disease when I was, it was on my first birthday.
Guest:oh my god yeah so you have no real memory i have no memory of it and i've told people i was like it's one of those like you you can't you don't know if that's a better way to deal with it or like who would i be today if she died when i was 13 right right you have the memory and also i'm 13 the horrible yeah so it's you look at your how old's your other sibling so my oldest sister natalie she was i think two and a half so you really neither one of you have anything really and how when did the stepmom come in
Guest:My dad remarried when I was seven.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:And so they dated, I think, for like two or three years.
Guest:And so she's your mom, kind of.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:My aunt stepped in and took care of us.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:So that kind of became such a mother figure.
Guest:And then at seven, when my dad remarried, it was like, all right, well, now you have to go.
Guest:And this other person is coming in, which only as I get older and start to realize how fucked up I actually am, I look back on these things like, oh, for a kid, that was kind of crazy.
Guest:Your mother passed away, but here's this person.
Guest:And now that person is going to go away.
Guest:It was your mom's sister?
Guest:No, my dad's sister.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Marc:But you still saw her.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It just wasn't his hands-on.
Guest:Well, she also was trying to become a teacher, so she moved pretty far away, probably a three-hour drive away.
Guest:So it wasn't like seeing each other all the time.
Guest:It was like every now and then you visit, and it's truly one of those things you look back on, and you're like, oh, I... If someone was like, what will you talk about with a therapist?
Guest:I was like, I think I'd start there, because that's probably the root of anything.
Guest:It probably starts with that.
Guest:But you're not that fucked up.
Guest:I don't think so.
Guest:I mean, I think I...
Guest:probably have you know i feel like on the outside i'm not fucked up i think on the outside i make decent decisions on the inside it's like oh there's these i'm terrified all the time i think so yeah i live in a state of paranoia anyone i get to know i'm just like all right well what will what will i wear to their funeral like you're just immediately thinking when are you leaving when are you permanently gone
Guest:But I think kind of going back to that, I think the point where I was like, why would I do that?
Guest:Why would I try to become a dateline, you know, segment creator?
Guest:I don't even, that's how little I know, but I don't even know what the term is for what that person does.
Marc:I think a segment producer.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:segment producer i think i got out of that because i was just like uh i was like oh that you know my mother passed away at 25 and here i am like is this you know is this the is this a life right is this what i want to do like not not shitting on people that want to do that but i clearly didn't want to do but also you're coming from a family of postal workers exactly so you knew that like i knew my true calling
Marc:But yeah, but that's also one of those things like, well, you know, once you're in it, that's it.
Marc:That's what happens.
Marc:Yeah, I think so.
Marc:The creativity element was not necessary.
Guest:I mean, my dad would get up at like 5 a.m.
Guest:I could hear him get ready and he would then go to work.
Guest:He was gone.
Guest:And the days that he worked, he was gone before we woke up to get ready for school.
Guest:And I really remember as a kid hearing that and being like, I don't ever...
Guest:want to do that.
Guest:I don't want to wake up at 5 a.m.
Guest:and go.
Guest:In that weird zone where you're like, what?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Someone's doing something now?
Guest:But I think I also looked at it like, well, that's what he has to do.
Guest:That's what we all have to do.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I think I was driven to say, well, I don't want to have to do
Guest:I want to decide what I'm going to do.
Guest:And if at the end of the day, if I die because I have no money, I think I kind of thought, well, you know, my mother passed away.
Guest:I think I should try to do something.
Guest:And if I fail and die, I fail and die.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And so, I mean, in a way, kind of a great motivation to be like...
Guest:Yeah, drive to that fucking open mic, you lazy piece of shit.
Guest:Yeah, fuck it.
Guest:Because this is what you're trying to do.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then I heard a David Cross, his first album he put out.
Guest:And I think that was the first time I heard stand-up.
Guest:Shut up, you fucking baby.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think it was the first time I heard stand-up that wasn't in a suit, very polished.
Guest:I think it was the first time my brain was like, oh, you can wear what you want.
Guest:And you can... I loved that album.
Guest:It's great.
Guest:But I was also like, oh, you don't have to like...
Guest:set up punchline.
Guest:You don't have to have this well-constructed... It sounds like I'm shitting on his style of comedy, but honestly, his style of comedy inspired me to be like, oh, this is more personality-driven, and I think I relate more to that than this tight, concise... I've specifically...
Guest:Today, I don't write jokes where I go, where's the fat?
Guest:I don't care about the fat.
Guest:I like all of it.
Guest:I like having all that in there.
Guest:Keep the fat in.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it's only now that I, at that point, I was like, oh, if you can do it that way, maybe I should try this.
Guest:I've been a class clown my whole life.
Guest:I've always been like, you know, in any group, I'm like, try to be the funny person, you know, desperately.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was like, well, let's give this a try.
Guest:So that's what led me to even think.
Guest:I'm capable of doing it as one.
Guest:There's no rules.
Marc:Well, that's funny.
Marc:Cause Dave, like I started with him and you know, it's always exciting to watch him and it definitely is, you know, he is unto himself, but he used to do like, cause you do that Southern character sometimes for hours.
Marc:I love it.
Guest:I got addicted to it.
Marc:He used to do one.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He used to go on stage as this gay Southern guy.
Guest:Nice.
Marc:Back when he started.
Marc:Right, yeah, yeah.
Marc:But he wouldn't let on.
Marc:They would bring him up with a fake name, and he'd be like, hi, y'all.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And he'd start talking about his dogs.
Marc:And he'd talk about their names and their personalities.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And then people started just laughing at him.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And he would push it.
Marc:He'd stay in it until he'd stop.
Marc:He'd go like, I can't tell if y'all are laughing with me.
Right.
Marc:Or at me.
Marc:You know, and he'd make it really uncomfortable.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it was great.
Marc:He actually did Jesus as a gay Southern man was one of his early bits.
Marc:I wonder if I've heard that bit.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I was just at Lazarus' tune.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:I've heard that.
Marc:His hair is a mess.
Yeah.
Guest:yeah i think yeah i like that kind of stuff like when people are like you know i i feel like it's always easy to go to like seinfeld as an example because it's like oh here's a guy in a suit i i always thought uh well that's what stand-up is oh it's johnny carson look he said a thing and then he got a laugh and he said a thing and he got a laugh right it's just like oh this seems like a lot of pressure to play that type of music you know it's everything it's relevant to music you see someone like uh
Guest:A lot of those guys, like all of you guys out of Boston, that was like very personality-driven stand-up.
Guest:I think it was inspiring to a lot of people to be like, oh, that's more the music that I play.
Guest:I like to say that's something more like jazz, where it's like, oh, it can be anything.
Guest:You just have to know how to play it.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:You just have to get up there and figure out how to make that your territory.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You can do whatever.
Marc:That's what compelled me is that you can do anything you want up there.
Marc:I mean, you should get laughs at some point.
Marc:But outside of that, do whatever the fuck you want.
Marc:And that to me was amazing.
Marc:It's just like you go up there and do what you want.
Marc:It wasn't until lately that I really got more disciplined.
Marc:Like I think early on I wrote jokes and I could see them and they were definitely jokes.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But then I kind of broke it open and, and, you know, and just kind of did the other thing.
Marc:But now like I've gotten to the point where if I'm working on a special, there's like a bit or two in there that really require some focus on timing and the beats.
Marc:And like, I'm sort of like,
Marc:I force myself to do it and I am sort of like, Oh, that's what that feels like.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You polish a thing.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know, where you like, you're actually this, I needed to, I need to time that.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And focus on it.
Marc:Like it didn't work at first.
Marc:I'm like, it's about this, this beat here.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And like, I'm glad that I can appreciate that at least now.
Guest:I think that's what makes it so fun, though, because then it's like you as the artist having that revelation.
Guest:It's like, well, then that's what keeps all of our albums sounding the same or talking about the same stuff.
Guest:If the next thing come out, it's like, oh, Mark's way more polished.
Guest:It's like, yeah, isn't that fun?
Guest:Because maybe before he wasn't.
Guest:And the next one probably won't be.
Guest:Right.
Marc:The next one will be another thing.
Marc:Well, I think I had this moment with, I think it was with watching Shanling, you know, cause like he was real kind of meticulous about timing and his jokes are kind of challenging in some ways.
Marc:And so much of it had to do with his personality, but also the way he, you know, timed things.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And for some reason he got through to me and this is later in life, like in the last five or six years where I'm like, that's interesting.
Marc:Cause, cause there's a part of me that thinks the same way.
Marc:It's like, why would you want to just do these tight jokes?
Marc:Right.
Marc:Like all the time.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And just like it just becomes something by rote.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But then like I got to this other level.
Marc:It's like, well, I can like try to make things that are not easy work.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Like they're not just the jokes.
Marc:It's sort of like he's talking about some pretty hard, you know, heavy, dark shit, but he's balancing it with this craftsmanship.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I'm going to try a couple of those.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's what I love, though.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, even even going back to as simple as like when I first started going on stage after hearing his out David Cross album.
Guest:I mean, I was going up doing my own jokes almost.
Guest:It would almost look like David Cross was doing an impression of me.
Guest:Doing like an actor I would go up and I was like well, that's how you talk and then you know Maybe that's how everybody starts or a lot of people and then you eventually go Oh, this isn't I actually don't move my arms like that.
Marc:I don't use that phrase I'm not that person you kind of absorb your people for a while.
Marc:Yeah Yeah, you kind of move through people
Guest:But I think that's what I love is that then as you, you know, as you progress through whatever the fuck this is, you then start to break down Shanling and you go, oh, there's a style there.
Guest:You know, I feel like maybe you start to understand it a little better.
Guest:Well, yeah, because... If you like wanting to try different... Like, yeah, I'm not a storyteller.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But if someone's like, hey, your next album or whatever your thing is, like, why don't you try to be a storyteller?
Guest:Like...
Guest:I'm not, but that kind of excites me to be like, well, how do I pull that off?
Marc:As you.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, yeah, that's like, you know, the last special, not the one I just taped, but it informed that one, too.
Marc:I'm like, I'm going to do, like, because I used to just, like, I always left a lot of room, you know, so I could just fuck off.
Marc:And I'm like, that's my style, man.
Marc:I'm going to bring a pad up.
Marc:That's my favorite.
Marc:Right, me too.
Marc:And I did a special like that, and it was pretty good.
Marc:I liked it.
Marc:But the next special, I'm like, I'm going to do a tight fucking hour, and it's going to have callbacks.
Marc:I'm going to have fucking callbacks.
Marc:I'm going to know exactly where I'm going.
Marc:And I just worked it like that.
Marc:And I thought it would be boring.
Marc:And it sort of wasn't because there was a distance you could get.
Marc:Like when you wing it, which is what I like to do.
Marc:And I always leave a little room for improv still.
Marc:But when I started to do these last two specials, I'm like, why don't you just try to tighten this thing up?
Marc:And that becomes the challenge.
Marc:Not sort of like, I'm going to leave some room.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Do you find, though, like when you do that, when you're like, I'm going to tighten.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Do you then find like you kind of get something out of it?
Guest:Whereas like when you go into a show, you're not like, well, we'll see how this goes.
Guest:You kind of are like, oh, I kind of know how this is going to go.
Guest:And that's exciting in its own way.
Guest:Whereas before you maybe were like, well, if I already know how it's going to go, then what is exciting about it?
Guest:But you like what you're saying, though.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, I guess, but what I realize is that you don't ever know how it's going to go.
Marc:Right, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And a lot of the times when you say, I don't know how this is going to go, it's just to protect yourself from being scared.
Marc:Right, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And then you go out there and you just kind of like, blah, and of course that's going to get a reaction.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But what you don't know when you do it that way is whether that's going to work again.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So like to make something like, you know, because I got more responsible just because I figured like I've been doing this half my fucking life.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You know, why not put the effort in to tighten it up?
Marc:Like, you know, because I know guys that are professionals and like, you know, like, he don't talk to the audience.
Marc:He's not going to riff up there.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And he looks at it as, you know, like this is my job and every year I'm going to write this hour and I'm going to polish it and do it.
Marc:And that's the package.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And I'm like, well, you know, like, what is that?
Marc:But, you know, it's pretty fucking daunting.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I'm like, well, I can do that then.
Marc:So.
Marc:So the satisfaction comes from actually making something, you know, ultimately we all have our acts and we're counting on it to work.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But to really sort of like for the excitement to be like, well, I really like this joke and it works great.
Marc:And like I have room in it.
Marc:Like, you know, now I can deliver it without it being so immediate and like life or death.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Cause I've built it out.
Marc:Cause I think even if you work like you and I do, you know, the jokes at work and then you can kind of go fuck off.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But you don't, I don't know if we appreciate them as much as we should.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Cause there's something about callbacks and about packaging that putting the thing together where, you know, like I'm going to bring this back later and it's going to blow it up.
Guest:I think my regret is I, some of those jokes that I really love that I fuck off with.
Guest:I'm just like,
Guest:Oh, man, who knows where that could have actually gone.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I just fucked off with it so much that I finally got to a point where I was over it.
Guest:Yeah, you tired it out.
Guest:Maybe actually crafted it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, who knows?
Guest:Maybe I would still get tired of it, but you never see the true potential.
Marc:Oh, yeah, I used to do that all the time.
Marc:I'd do Conan.
Marc:They'd call me up to do panel back in New York when someone didn't show up.
Marc:And I'd go up there with half jokes, just premises.
Marc:So I'd do panel, and he'd save it, or eventually I'd find something.
Marc:There's so many times I've been on TV where I'm like, that joke's so much better now.
Marc:That's like half the joke.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Right?
Marc:So that used to piss me off.
Marc:But in this last special, the one I just did, I was working with an hour and a half, hour 40.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I really needed it to be... They wanted it to be like 70 minutes max.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:65, 70.
Marc:And up to the two shows before the fucking...
Marc:taping i was still at an hour and a half yeah like i that last week i'm like well i gotta get this down yeah to 70 so i had to do like i gotta go like that whole part of that joke is out that's hard to do i know but like i was surprised where at this point in my career where specials aren't necessarily that special and you know i got paid well they are for i mean right i know i'm here like talking about mine but at the same time there's so many exactly you're like it's almost the
Marc:wrong word for it right so it's just a job right so it's like what we it's part of what we do the product we make right and it's a great thing but like what it's not going to break make or break me why not just make it good and like it i was so matter of fact about it i'm like this is going to go this is going to go and i you know i want i had a through line i had callbacks you know i knew where i wanted to end up i wasn't sure if i wanted to move this thing to the end or whether that thing was going to go but in the last two shows before the special i
Marc:I fucking made the cuts and, you know, I got it in my head how it all fit together.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I did it.
Marc:I wasn't freaked out about it.
Marc:And I knew that the shit that I'd chosen worked.
Marc:And that was that.
Guest:Oh, that is that's huge.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it came in at seven, like at 70, man.
Guest:What the fuck?
Guest:I had to go back and in the edit take stuff out, which is so painful.
Marc:I did that the last one.
Guest:And it's like, were you doing like a minute?
Guest:Anything.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Even like a pause that was too long.
Guest:It's like, well, there's two or three seconds.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's the worst.
Guest:You feel like Gary Sinise in Apollo 13 looking for any power he can find through his combination of buttons.
Guest:Where can I pull any amount of time out of this stretch of jokes?
Guest:It's brutal.
Marc:But it's weird.
Marc:Whether you do it in the editing room or whether you do it before you do the show, it's usually better.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:You're the only one that knows.
Marc:Right, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And the audiences that saw the longer version.
Marc:That's the thing we always forget.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You're like, oh, you're the only one who truly knows what you think it could have been.
Guest:And at the same time, what you think was great.
Guest:Like, no, let's put it out there at 80.
Guest:And then people were like, I thought it was a little too long.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Oh, shit.
Guest:I could have.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I could have not been.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think you do.
Guest:Is this your first one?
Guest:This is the second one.
Guest:So the first one, I was completely DIY, put up my own money, and I was pretty confident that I was like, if we don't go crazy with the budget and we're super conservative about the spending, that someone will, I can make that money back.
Guest:And maybe I don't make money, but maybe it's whatever.
Guest:And we sold it to CISO, and so it got however much attention you could get with CISO.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:As much as anything can get.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah, but I think the cool thing about where I'm at now and having done the things, I've finally gotten over the idea that anything is going to lead to some big thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think I now just look at it as like, well, if anything leads to one next thing.
Guest:That's it.
Guest:And that's kind of the best you can hope for.
Guest:And, you know, some people in this world, they do one thing and it leads to a super huge big thing.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Even in my own fantasies of my career, I can't even picture that happening or what that would look like.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:What is a super big thing now?
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:Who the fuck knows?
Guest:Right, yeah, yeah.
Guest:If someone's like, oh, you put this one thing out, and now you're selling out all these theaters and people are giving you offers for acting and stuff, when you're starting out, you truly think that's how it works.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then you finally start to realize, like...
Guest:Oh, it's... And I feel like there's something that Roger Waters was saying about Pink Floyd, or maybe himself specifically, where he realized everything we're creating, this isn't the audition to eventually create this thing.
Guest:We're already in the middle of it.
Guest:Yeah, we're doing it.
Guest:I think I started to enjoy this a lot more when I was like...
Guest:Oh, every day, even if I'm going up and someone's like, you know, go up and do eight minutes.
Guest:Like even that eight minutes is this is today right now with this crowd.
Guest:And I don't know who's in that crowd.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But it is an opportunity for someone in that crowd go, I'm going to, you know what?
Guest:I'm going to invest in this dude the rest of my life because I think I sync up with where he's at.
Guest:And it's even at a shitty show with like, you know, 15, 20 people.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:And I think I started to realize like, oh, quit downplaying stuff and quit thinking that the bigger stuff is big.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:who knows yeah this is anything this is it yeah you either enjoy it or you don't and that that made it that made going into these specials feel so much better like oh yeah there's cameras yeah honestly once we submit the final edit and people can see it who still truly gives a shit because by the time the the public can see the thing i created there's no question i will absolutely hate it
Guest:So who cares?
Guest:Tonight with these cameras on, I like this.
Guest:But by the time this is edited and there's coloring and however we finally sell it, I will 100% hate this.
Guest:But it'll also be a year ago.
Guest:Exactly, exactly.
Marc:It's not even a matter of hating it.
Marc:You're like, oh yeah, I did that.
Marc:I'm glad people are going to see it, but I'm now working at the post office.
Guest:I have election jokes in my special because it was October 1st.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And people were like, you know, by the time this sells, wherever it sells and wherever it ends up, you know, that stuff's going to be outdated.
Guest:And I was like, I've thought about it since day one.
Guest:I was like, when I watch it, I cringe.
Guest:But I got to be honest, the night that we recorded that, that was my favorite thing.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And it feels dishonest to take it out.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I was like, I think I got to leave in the thing where I was when I did it.
Guest:Yeah, I think that.
Marc:That's good.
Marc:I tried to do, like, the last two specials, I tried to, I don't talk about current, I try to talk about anything but current events.
Marc:But in the last one, just because, like, everyone can do those jokes.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You know, it's very, like, if you're doing specific jokes about things that happen in the world, there's a 98% chance that someone else is doing a similar joke.
Guest:Anything on that level of topical.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But this special, there was a couple of things that I did that were not, they were not election jokes, but they were specific to what we're living in now.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I thought they'd hold.
Marc:Like, I thought they were broad enough to hold.
Marc:So, like, unless, you know, he has a stroke or is pushed out of office or the world ends, I think this shit will still be okay in October or September, whenever the fuck they put it out.
Marc:Right, right, right.
Marc:I think it'll still be relevant.
Guest:I think so, too.
Guest:And even if it's not relevant, there's no way anyone has forgotten what today feels like.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But there is that thing that you do want it to be something fresh.
Marc:Like, you do want people... Well, I don't want you to second-guess yourself.
Guest:Oh, there's no way to avoid it no matter what.
Yeah.
Marc:there's no matter there's nothing that could be said that would make me do or not do that but i think that's true though about the job and about like the opportunities it really isn't about the next big thing so much especially if you're a comic because one thing that we're afforded that other people in show business are and is we can just always work you know we're not waiting for a role right like we can go out tonight and get a spot right do the thing
Marc:But it's just that like there are jobs that we are able to do.
Marc:Like, you know, like I'm going to be on a talk show.
Marc:I'm going to do panel on a thing.
Marc:I'm going to host this thing.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You know, yeah, I'll do that goofy part in that thing.
Marc:And then I'll do my stand up.
Marc:Those are the jobs.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So like as long as you can keep doing those jobs.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You're good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I think I think you also get to the point where you start stop thinking about your perfect track record of the things that you put out there.
Guest:No one gives a shit.
Guest:Like, oh, but I don't want to do anything until I have my own thing.
Guest:It's like, well, that's just not realistic.
Guest:And also, no one cares.
Guest:And also, no matter how big you think you are, the majority of people do not know who you are.
Marc:Well, right.
Marc:That's the fucked up thing about the way the media landscape works now.
Marc:It's like, you know, I've done like five fucking CDs or like five or six specials.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:I've been on Conan 50 times and Letterman four times.
Marc:Right.
Guest:All right.
Guest:I fantasize, I'm going to put it all in a giant box set, and then we'll see.
Guest:I'll show you who I am.
Guest:That's exactly the train of thought.
Guest:You're always the box set.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And there it all is.
Guest:I'm like, I don't care.
Guest:I'll just YouTube this shit.
Guest:I can get all this for free.
Guest:I'm not buying your $100 box set.
Guest:I used to talk to Swistle about that.
Guest:I'm like, let's just put my first four CDs in one box.
Yeah.
Marc:We'll do a cool box.
Marc:No.
Marc:You know what the risk of that is?
Marc:Is that you do it and you sell 20.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And you've manufactured all of this hard copy.
Guest:You're in a fucking garage full of shit.
Guest:Cool design.
Guest:It's great.
Guest:Oh, no one cares.
Guest:No, it's over.
Guest:No one needs to hold anything.
Guest:No one even has the machines for that anymore.
Guest:It takes up too much space.
Guest:That needs to be digital space.
Marc:But you did... Weren't you on a big...
Marc:Didn't you get the sitcom shot?
Guest:I did.
Guest:I was on a show called Ground Floor on TBS.
Guest:And that was my first kind of like, hey, you're a regular on this thing and you have a job.
Marc:But how many episodes did you do?
Guest:We did two seasons for a total of 20 episodes.
Marc:What's his name's producing it?
Guest:Bill Lawrence.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He likes you, right?
Guest:Yeah, he's great.
Guest:I mean, he saw my stand-up.
Guest:He was like, I have a role in this thing, and you should come and do it.
Guest:So I got to go in and...
Guest:in front of him and the casting director kind of read the part and he was basically like well i'm gonna try to get you to do i think you should do this yeah you know there was in this world of acting very few people are like hey you should i've got a thing for you know you think it's a door you can't knock down yeah and then someone like bill comes along and he's like no i see the value in you and i'm gonna put you on my thing and it's gonna work out and
Guest:I mean, my character was just the goofy office weirdo.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like, oh, I got it.
Marc:I can easily... Well, I mean, comics have always had a place in at least situational comedy on television.
Marc:100%.
Marc:They're like, well, that's the guy.
Marc:He's already fully baked.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Put him in the thing.
Guest:I feel like every show has... And maybe there was a different term before, but I just look at a Kramer.
Guest:It's like every show has a Kramer.
Guest:Like, oh, you're the Kramer of the show.
Guest:We're not...
Guest:you're, you're probably never going to have any a story, but we need you to deliver the jokes when we go to you.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Oh yeah.
Guest:There's all that.
Guest:I, I, I absolutely, I used to make fun of like the multicam format and I used to be like, ah, it's so horrible.
Guest:And then, you know, I was working on a idea with BJ Porter and he was like, you know, well, one of the greatest shows ever was a multicam.
Guest:So are they that bad?
Guest:And I, then when I did this one, I was referring to Seinfeld Seinfeld.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was like,
Guest:oh yeah you're right it was like multicams can be cheesy and horrible but they can also be good like there could actually be a style to it well yeah they are what they are I mean you know two and a half men and Big Bang Theory are just fucking vaudeville yeah yeah just like here's your stage and even as like the person showing up it's like well do you do you love that paycheck and that parking spot and that schedule and after doing a multicam I'm like I really do like that parking spot and that schedule I like how all this panned out yeah yeah
Guest:I don't have to write it.
Guest:I'm at home at a reasonable hour.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:And I liked that show, the cast.
Guest:I mean, if you're on a show like that and you like the whole cast, it's kind of like, I mean, anybody who has a job like that that complains about it, you must have had a pretty blessed life if you're complaining about this and this is your job.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I've never done one.
Marc:I've never even done, I don't think I've even done a guest appearance on a multicam.
Marc:I've never been on a set like that to do a show like that.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Like where you're on a stage and like I've done talk shows, but I've never done the guest spot where I walk in and I'm like, hey, how's everybody doing?
Guest:Right, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It must be.
Guest:You know, having the live audience is great because I was nervous about it as an actor, but then, you know, as we've had, you know, so much training in the idea of like, oh, if they're laughing, oh, yeah, I'll just hold.
Guest:Yeah, you know how to time it.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:Because in our heads, we're like, oh, yeah, sure, you can act.
Guest:You want to be an actor to go ahead and act.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I'm going to wait until they're almost silent, and then I'll say the next thing right at this perfect moment.
Guest:Because I know it innately.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:It's what I do for a living.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:Wait for the laugh to die down.
Guest:You're like, well, it's not a believable acting.
Guest:It's like, well, I wouldn't know how to do that anyways.
Guest:I just know when I should say this line, and hopefully they laugh again.
Guest:So getting that job and being like, hey, this is your first acting role.
Guest:I was like, oh, this definitely, even to this day, it's helped me be like, oh, I'm in this setting of acting.
Guest:And I, oh, those are cameras.
Guest:Those are terms.
Guest:Those are people's jobs.
Guest:To learn it in a setting that isn't so daunting and intimidating.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I think it has helped me as an actor to go shoot anything.
Guest:It's like, I kind of know what everybody does now and I understand the schedule.
Marc:Right, yeah.
Marc:Well, even when I did my own show, there was not a live audience, so I didn't have that luxury.
Marc:I would like to know what that feels like.
Marc:Yeah, to get the instant feedback.
Marc:Well, yeah, because I don't know if I felt that since I did a play in high school.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:That's really what it is, is that you have the skill set, and I guess in getting that job, you realized you had the skill set.
Marc:It's sort of like, oh, they just wrote me this funny joke.
Marc:And even that, even just doing, I'm going to do their joke.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, I did stuff that other people wrote, but there was no audience there.
Marc:So you don't know how it lands.
Marc:Right.
Marc:To actually have the script and be like, no, it seems funny.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's not my joke, but they have confidence in it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Go out and just delivering someone else's joke and having it work.
Marc:That must be pretty good.
Guest:I think that's what people, when someone's like that, and when an actor can look at something and they know why that is a joke, I think people are like, all right, well, this should land then.
Guest:Because he gets, just saying, I understand why this is funny.
Guest:It's like, well, then you should know how to say it.
Guest:You know why it's funny.
Guest:The whole structure should be right there.
Guest:And it is, right?
Guest:Yeah, 100%, especially in that multicam setting.
Guest:The joke-to-joke sitcom.
Guest:And you're doing so many takes in front of a live audience that if a joke flops, it's unfortunate, but someone can come in, the writers all come in, they go, all right, well, what's a better tag?
Guest:What's a better line?
Marc:While the audience is sitting there?
Guest:While the audience is sitting there.
Guest:And also they could have throwaways pre-written being like, you know, in rehearsals, that one never landed.
Guest:So maybe it lands and we didn't know when was interpreting it right.
Guest:But if it doesn't land, here's five other options.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like come in.
Marc:Well, that would drive me nuts.
Marc:I think that that must get some getting used to is just knowing that they're the audience is just sitting there waiting.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because they know what the story, the score is.
Marc:But as a comic, you'd be like, hey, don't worry.
Guest:We're going to get a second now.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Like, did you have to do that stuff?
Guest:You know, we never had it.
Guest:I mean, it was never on my shoulder that just because it was my show.
Marc:It was the funny guy that was managing the crowd there.
Guest:They had a warm-up guy who was doing like- You could have had that job.
Guest:Which is insane.
Guest:Oh, man.
Guest:That's a comedian's job.
Guest:I did warm-up on a game show that they were trying out.
Guest:It never became a thing.
Guest:I didn't know what warm-up was.
Guest:I was like, oh, this is good money.
Guest:It was in New York.
Guest:I went into a studio.
Guest:I didn't even know what doing warm-up was.
Guest:So I was like, I guess I just do my act.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I went out and it was jokes that I shouldn't.
Guest:It was like I was doing jokes that I'd be doing at like a bar show.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And people are some, you know, sometimes people laugh every now and then.
Guest:Someone was like young enough to be like, oh, OK, I get it.
Guest:Oh, that's funny.
Guest:But most people being like, well, this is inappropriate.
Guest:Like, what the fuck is he talking about?
Guest:And I just basically just kept eating shit to the point where they're like, yeah, anytime the camera stops, you got to go out and keep everybody alive.
Guest:And sometimes the camera would stop and I'd be like, we're probably going to reset quick.
Guest:I'll just.
Guest:There's no need for me.
Guest:I don't want to get in the way.
Guest:You guys are trying to get your thing done.
Guest:You can tell people are looking at me like, we're paying you to go do this.
Guest:And I was just like, it was one of those jobs where I was like, you don't have to pay me.
Guest:I'll just leave now.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we both know this didn't work out.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I won't care that I was here for free for a little bit.
Guest:I got some chicken tenders at Crafty.
Guest:I'm fine.
Guest:I'll be fine.
Guest:Your show will more than likely never become a thing because it's a game show.
Guest:So it's already starting in a tough spot.
Marc:But that's like such a unique job.
Marc:It's crazy.
Marc:There are guys that have done it forever.
Marc:They're like, you know, I should talk to one of those guys.
Marc:Like just the warm up guys.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I will say anytime I've done like at midnight or I've seen Brody do it, I'm like, oh, it's only then was I like, oh, you could enjoy the way that he does it.
Guest:And I mean, it's his style of being funny anyways.
Guest:But after seeing that, I'm like, oh, if someone hired me today to go warm up a crowd, I would just try to do my best Brody impression for as long as possible because that is perfect.
Guest:Yeah, it's like energy, the way he gets going and he's being funny, but he's also, hey, here's what you should be doing and I'll make a joke, but don't fuck around and do exactly what I said.
Guest:It's like, oh, that's that's perfect.
Marc:Right there.
Marc:Sometimes you have stage managers that do it, but like shows like at midnight and so like Don Barris used to do Kimmel.
Marc:I don't know if he still does, but like it's definitely like, hey,
Guest:energy you know you really got to be a coach right yeah an audience coach yeah it's a very specific thing and it every time I see it I'm like oh this is a tough gig man such a tough game and I'm again also you got to think for a multicam like like we're saying I mean you're sometimes there for six to six to eight hours imagine keeping an audience alive for six to eight hours you're like I've done all my my gimmicks I don't know what else to do crowd worry music well then
Marc:And I guess they get locked into a thing they know that they can do for eight hours.
Guest:They find their eight-hour act, and they're rewarded handsomely.
Marc:Yeah, it's a union gig.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know, you get the full thing.
Marc:Like, Eddie Brill used to do Letterman.
Marc:You know, I remember those guys.
Marc:I wasn't cut out for it because I would be self-conscious.
Marc:Like, they don't like me.
Guest:It's like, it's not about you.
Marc:It's like, well, I don't know how to do it.
Guest:I'm not even good at just hosting a mic.
Guest:I go out and it feels the same way.
Guest:I'm like, I'm ruining the show.
Guest:Every time I host a mic ever, the moment someone comes out and we're shaking hands, I'm like, I'm so sorry.
Guest:If you bomb, it is my fault.
Guest:I sucked the energy.
Guest:I ruined this crap.
Guest:I fucked it up.
Guest:Sorry that you came down here tonight.
Marc:But you're one of those guys that, like, you know, I've seen you a few times and, like, you'll either do, like, there are guys that will do their act or they'll do, you know, like a jazz set and just fuck off for God knows how long.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Because it's fun.
Marc:So you do that.
Guest:I try to do that.
Guest:I mean, I prefer it.
Guest:That's what makes, that entertains me.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then if it's in front of an audience that gets on board with it, it's like, oh, great, this is one of those nights it all worked out.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:But, yeah, sometimes if I'm trying to do something like that and it's not working, I'll fall back into that, you know, the act and be like, all right, these things will work so I don't feel like I wasted too many people's time.
Marc:I used to do that to build the hours is like go to Steve Allen and rent it out for a night and just sort of like two hours of me rambling on.
Marc:Finding it.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:I don't know how to write other than that.
Guest:I can't.
Guest:I always, you know, when I started, people were like, I go to a coffee shop with my notebook and I write.
Guest:And I was always like, oh, one day I'll be able to do that because I can't do it now.
Guest:Me too.
Guest:But I reflect back.
Guest:I was a really bad student.
Guest:I never wanted to put in the time.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I also think I'm a little bit better if my back is against the wall, and it's like, well, clearly when you're on stage, it's put up or shut up now.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:There's no stalling.
Guest:You either do it or you don't.
Marc:Yeah, and it's going to come from wherever.
Marc:I'm exactly the same way.
Marc:It's like you're cornered.
Marc:You corner yourself.
Marc:It's like I'm a funny guy, and I know that's what I have to do, so it's going to happen.
Marc:Right, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It's got to happen.
Marc:plus i'll get out of it and i'll go to the next thing it might be getting out of it that's funny right yeah yeah oh i've i've built many jokes on hoping a joke bomb so i can do this other version right yeah well yeah because then you just like you put it out there but that's where the confidence comes in if you write like we do is that you know even if it's not working you can make light of that right and they'll be okay with it yeah and move on to the next idea you're not just going to go up there and tank right yeah yeah you know you're going to be able
Guest:Especially when you point it out.
Guest:I think what you got to do people always said like never comment on a joke But I was like, you know if you if a joke bombs and you comment on it the crowd is almost relieved to be like, oh good He's not a psychopath.
Marc:Well, right But then you get into that nuanced area of like yeah being lazy or being disciplined or like doing your act or not do live everything if every single joke You're like well now I got to talk about how that didn't work.
Guest:Yeah, well now that's either your act or
Guest:or it's not going well and you're not admitting it.
Marc:When I look at an hour, I don't ever know where it comes from.
Marc:There's no paper trail.
Marc:How'd you write that?
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:I don't know how it all happened.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, people say like, well, if people are like, well, what kind of comic are you?
Guest:What do you do jokes about?
Guest:It's kind of like, well, I don't, there's literally anything I think of that's funny.
Guest:I try to do that on stage as long as I can.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Until I hate it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it isn't like I'm specifically like,
Marc:you know i got i don't have anything on the church yeah like i'm not like focused on any specific thing i try not to say that when people like what do you do jokes about like no i don't do jokes really i'm not i'm not a joke guy yeah yeah but you're a comedian yeah but like i kind of talk through some stuff like this doesn't sound like a good show you're not really selling it you're on one of those five minute radio show phoneers like so what do you got for us tonight i'm working on some stuff
Guest:I got some space.
Guest:I got some open space to fill.
Guest:Yeah, I left a lot of room open for tonight's Saturday show.
Guest:I'll see how they respond to the feature and then I'll kind of guide it from there.
Guest:All right, well, it sounds like a good time.
Guest:All right, we got two free tickets tonight.
Guest:You know why they're free and you know why they're available.
Marc:Oh, my God.
Marc:I don't know how much of that comes from.
Marc:Like, I still don't know if the root of it is insecurity.
Marc:Like, you're just protecting yourself from, you know, the inevitable possibility of failure.
Guest:Like, I'm going to wing it.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:It can only, you know, so if that's the sort of bed you make, you're like, oh, who knows?
Guest:Like, anything could happen.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:But I think it's also, to build a career out of it, it's almost like,
Guest:I think at a certain point, if you're starting out and you're like, I just go up and wing it and we see what happens.
Guest:People are like, all right, so maybe you are protecting yourself.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But I think if you can build your career out of that style, it's almost, it almost turns into, oh, no, I actually have the talent to wing it.
Guest:Sure, right.
Guest:Even though I do admit and know that it's lazy, and maybe I could do that much better, I am capable of winging it, and we all seem to go home happy.
Guest:Right, it's entertaining.
Guest:Right, yeah, yeah.
Guest:I do the job.
Guest:How much winging it is on the new special?
Guest:Not a lot.
Guest:Everything I've ever done started out as winging it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But this one, because with my first special, I did not prepare for it very well at all.
Guest:I think I went and did two clubs.
Guest:And I was like, that's kind of the act.
Guest:And then we'll edit.
Guest:We have editing power.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And it was lazy.
Guest:I think that special was a C plus, B minus.
Guest:Right.
Guest:At its best, there's B minus moments.
Guest:And then at its worst, I don't think I do as bad as a C plus.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It didn't fail.
Guest:I passed the class.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But with the second one, I was like, well, we're going to, you know, someone else is putting up the money, you know, Third Man Records put up the money for it.
Guest:So I felt a little more responsible to really rein it in.
Guest:And I was like, you know what, let's tour all of September and I'll kind of have the hour ready, but then that will really solidify it.
Guest:And so...
Guest:as soon as i got a laugh i was like all right i'm that urge to go ah let's maybe i'll say one more thing about it instead i was like don't you fucking asshole just say the next thing and i kind of got used to that style it's not i don't think it's so much me but i i left a little bit of room for for playing in the special but it was more like these worked and i did it the way third man was involved in this new one yeah so they they produced it for netflix yeah yeah
Guest:No kidding.
Guest:So we did it on our own and then we went to them and said, this is the finished product.
Guest:We know you guys like to make your own, but I like the idea of artists kind of making their own thing.
Guest:I think it gives it more character, gives it more personality.
Guest:That's why I did my first one that way.
Guest:And if someone said, well, so-and-so will give you this much money, I mean, one, you probably never need that much money to shoot a special.
Marc:Is this the first film special they did?
Guest:Third Man.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I did a vinyl with them forever ago.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Forever.
Guest:It's like three years ago.
Guest:And then I went to them and I was like, I know you guys like to experiment.
Guest:You seem to take all this stuff and you make it cool.
Guest:And I have no idea if you ever want to get into film.
Guest:But, you know, if you do, this is a great first step into it.
Guest:Because I was like, I'm at a point in my career where you will make your money back.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I know that you will.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I don't know how much the profit will be and I have no idea where I'll end up.
Guest:But I know that...
Guest:you won't lose anything did netflix buy it netflix bought it yeah okay so i think it's so so third man was like yeah it worked out and i was like i wrote ben uh swank at third man i was like i i gotta be honest i didn't know that it would end up here but i was like that's kind of what i was hoping it would and then it did uh everybody everyone got well everyone did all right yeah so i was like i feel like i i i didn't let anybody down but i i went into it and luckily like i said they're they're awesome
Marc:Well, good, man.
Marc:So I'll watch it.
Marc:Cool.
Marc:Thank you.
Guest:I'll check it out.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Thanks for talking, buddy.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Thanks, man.
Marc:That's it.
Marc:That's our show.
Marc:That was Rory Scovel.
Marc:Before that was Maz Jobrani.
Marc:Before that, it was me rambling about Sam Shepard, going off on a couple of tangents, doing a couple of ads.
Marc:A Sam Shepard-less planet.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Look, you guys.
Marc:Go to WTFPod.com for all your WTFPod needs.
Marc:Get on the mailing list.
Marc:I'll mail you something.
Marc:I'll play a little guitar.
Marc:I'm not very inspired lately.
Guest:Boomer lives!