Episode 832 - David Alan Grier / Joe Mande
Marc:All right, let's do this.
Marc:How are you?
Marc:What the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fucking ears?
Marc:What the fucksters?
Marc:What the fuckadelics?
Marc:What's happening?
Marc:I'm Mark Maron.
Marc:This is my podcast WTF.
Marc:Thank you for tuning in.
Marc:I appreciate it.
Marc:How's it going?
Marc:Hey, you know, if it's I don't know what's going to happen.
Marc:I'm recording this the day before.
Marc:So Thursday, if there's still time, as there is, call your senators.
Marc:Call your senators.
Marc:Email them.
Marc:Do whatever you need to do to voice your disapproval of rushing this heinous, murderous health care repeal bill through Congress, through the Senate.
Marc:Do it.
Marc:You don't want to see your neighbors die because they can't get health insurance or they lose the stuff they got.
Marc:You just want to watch your neighbors and co-workers and
Marc:friends or people that work for you people you know just all of a sudden lose all hope because it's pulled out from under them for what reason for what reason this is america we should be the best not the fucking most embarrassing shit show circus on the planet if anybody's feeling extraordinarily excited and proud of what we're going through as a country right now
Marc:I don't know, man.
Marc:I don't know what's up with you.
Marc:I really don't.
Marc:I know you probably don't like me, but man, man, where's your humanity?
Marc:Where's your fucking class?
Marc:Where's your dignity?
Marc:Where's your national pride?
Marc:What a fucking shit show.
Marc:You just don't know what's going to happen from one day, the next, and you don't know when it's going to be all over because all of a sudden it's not about the country anymore.
Marc:It's just about protecting a narcissistic, spiteful lunatic who wants, who does not give shit number one about the United States of America.
Marc:Zero shits he gives.
Marc:All about himself.
Marc:You guys just keep being proud to protect him.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, that's good.
Marc:What's America all about?
Marc:Protecting a lunatic from himself.
Marc:Great.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What a vision for the future.
Marc:How's it going?
Marc:Are you all right?
Marc:We got a big show today.
Marc:I'm not going to ramble on too much.
Marc:I thought I'd just give a chipper little nudge.
Marc:To stay active.
Marc:And anybody who thinks it's not that it's a liberal or conservative issue, health care, you're out of your mind.
Marc:You think there's some sort of wrestling show that ends in the apocalypse.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:The world's greatest heel.
Marc:The last great heel.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I can't.
Marc:Now, like I see, like right there, you felt that pause?
Marc:Fell right down the ditch.
Marc:Right down the rabbit hole.
Marc:of of horrendous darkness it's always right there it's like hovering beside you now what's that next to you oh that is uh that's i thought that was an invisible tunnel to hell no no no it's not we're all going through it we're all it's all the yeah all of us the entire world
Marc:being sucked through a selfish tunnel to hell hey but if you're proud and excited godspeed if you're terrified and angry speak up make those phone calls hit those streets god damn
Marc:All right.
Marc:On a lighter note, I got an email here.
Marc:Subject line, you just got better without trying.
Marc:Mark, a few days ago, I had a three hour drive up north to run the San Francisco Marathon.
Marc:I had a few unlistened to episodes of WTF on deck, but I wanted to save those for the marathon and decided to try another top rated podcast through iTunes.
Marc:It sucked.
Marc:Tried another.
Marc:It was boring.
Marc:Tried a third.
Marc:The guy was being overly dramatic for the subject matter.
Marc:I've listened to most of your 800 plus episodes while running and they helped the miles slip past.
Marc:I've been growing concerned that you might hang it up soon because you're sounding a bit over it.
Marc:If you stop, I may quit running and get fat.
Marc:That's on your shoulders.
Marc:Thanks for all of your effort, Soren.
Marc:I'm not over the podcast.
Marc:I'm a bit over almost everything, pal.
Marc:I'm just trying to get by like the rest of you is.
Marc:But no, yeah, I'm not going to let you get fat, pal.
Marc:And I wish I could apply that to me listening to podcast thing to me getting out and running.
Marc:I'm exercising.
Marc:I'm not running enough.
Marc:But you know what?
Marc:Who cares?
Marc:Big show today.
Marc:Can't ramble on too long.
Marc:Got two guests.
Marc:Got a shorty and a longy.
Marc:Got Joe Mandy coming up, who I love.
Marc:Joe Mandy, the very funny comedian.
Marc:And then David Allen Greer.
Marc:One of the funniest people alive coming up.
Marc:Joe Mandy has been on this show before, and he's a very funny guy, a very bright guy.
Marc:I was happy that he came over.
Marc:I like talking to Joe.
Marc:He has a new stand-up special called Joe Mandy's Award-Winning Stand-Up Special that is now streaming on Netflix.
Marc:And he stopped by here.
Marc:He stopped by the garage to chat a little bit.
Marc:This is me and the sharp and funny Joe Mandy.
Marc:It's no place good, Joe.
Guest:I don't think so.
Guest:I mean, I'm doing great.
Guest:That's what I'm dealing with right now.
Guest:Me too.
Guest:It's a hellscape everywhere, but my immediate surroundings.
Marc:Yeah, but it's probably a little... The perimeter is probably bigger than just immediate surroundings, but...
Marc:But if you are engaged and you are paying attention, you feel a little shitty about feeling okay about yourself.
Marc:But I always had that in my head, though.
Marc:I've talked about that a bit on stage where there's always been part of me, no matter how good things are, which they haven't been this good for me personally ever.
Marc:But there's always part of me that wants to be like, nah, but it's still kind of fucked.
Marc:But now it's like it is.
Marc:You know, it's not, I'm not making it up.
Guest:No.
Guest:It's kind of fucked.
Guest:No, it's super fucked.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like cartoonish.
Guest:Scary.
Guest:How evil.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like, this is hack.
Guest:Like, if someone pitched some of this stuff, I'd be like, this is too much.
Marc:But what have you been up to?
Marc:You're coming over on a Saturday.
Marc:I assume you're writing somewhere.
Guest:Yeah, I'm writing on a show called The Good Place right now on NBC.com.
Guest:Oh, wait.
Guest:Who's in that?
Guest:That's Kristen Bell and Ted Danson are the two stars.
Guest:Ted Danson is a part of my daily life, which is cool.
Guest:It's the coolest.
Guest:Is he a good guy?
Guest:Yeah, he really is.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah, it was a relief.
Guest:That's the type of person you just hope when- You don't know, right?
Guest:Yeah, you really don't.
Guest:But he's a person, his reputation precedes him.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You're just like, okay, well, we'll see.
Guest:And then it's all true.
Guest:He's the coolest.
Marc:Oh, that's great.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's so bizarrely disappointing to identify or know somebody your whole life on television.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And then they're just fucking monsters.
Guest:I know.
Guest:It's a very particular sadness that's hard, because you don't want to tell people about it.
Guest:You want people to just continue believing that.
Marc:Well, that's the weird thing that you learn in show business is that, you know, some people are, you know, it's a degree.
Marc:You know, it's a sad thing about how connected everybody is because there is an element of like, you know, respecting somebody's work and then realizing they're an asshole.
Marc:But, you know, party is like, no, I got to tell everybody.
Marc:No, I definitely have no trouble telling.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But now it's sort of like, oh, fuck.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You got to fight the urge to tell the world.
Guest:It's mostly like when you go home and you're hanging out with people from high school.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:Or whatever.
Marc:And they're like, what's going on?
Marc:So you know so and so?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Then you're like, yeah, he's cool.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Right.
Marc:You know, because it's like, what's the point of it?
Marc:I have to be careful with it because I've been pretty diplomatic the last few years.
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Marc:But now that I feel okay about myself, that's when I start to say the, I start throwing people under the bus.
Marc:Right, right, right.
Marc:But not in a bad way, not my friends necessarily, but you learn in show business, it's sort of like, just be nice and say, yeah, that guy's pretty good.
Guest:I wish I had that in me.
Guest:I have a couple friends who can go
Guest:Like they'll be at a party where everyone is talking shit.
Guest:And then you like go home and you're like, Oh, that person didn't say a single thing.
Guest:They laughed and nodded, but it made nothing.
Guest:Nothing.
Guest:And then you're like, how do I trust that guy?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I guess they're talking shit about that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What's up with that?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What's he going to say?
Marc:What is it?
Marc:Is this new special?
Marc:Cause I know you wanted me to do something for it and I didn't.
Marc:And I'm sorry.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:No, it's fine.
Marc:No, I, I, no, it was.
Marc:What was the angle?
Marc:What did you, what, what makes it different?
Marc:Cause I know there was a, it's not, it's not just a straight standup special.
Guest:It is.
Guest:I mean, there's, it's an hour standup.
Guest:It's sort of bookended with this sketch stuff that I wrote.
Guest:Oh yeah.
Guest:Sort of the, the premise of the sketch stuff is that I'm trying to, uh, I'm trying to do perform like the perfect special.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I'm getting the first part is like, I'm getting advice from, you know, uh,
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:From peers and heroes and whatnot.
Guest:Yes, exactly.
Guest:And then it's the special.
Guest:It's all building up to this award show called the American Humor Awards.
Guest:And then when the special ends, then we actually shot the fake award show.
Guest:It's a fake award show?
Guest:Yeah, it's not a real thing.
Guest:I mean, it's super.
Guest:We made it look like...
Guest:the oscars mixed with like the mark twain prize yeah it's really stupid um yeah but i reached out to you i reached out to a couple people it was you know and it was like the first time i've ever kind of ever felt like a yeah producer doing anything because i was just like desperately just trying to like who'd you get uh for that for that particular bit it was uh george wallace and bo burnham are the two people giving wow that's it
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But that's outside the box.
Guest:That's good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then George was, man, they're both so funny in it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was like- George is something.
Guest:Yeah, he really is.
Guest:Was he wearing his beret?
Guest:Of course he was, yeah.
Guest:He didn't always wear it.
Guest:I don't know when that started happening.
Guest:I remember him pre-beret.
Guest:The main bit in the special is that I'm performing my special for the Council of Judges.
Guest:Oh, for the award show.
Guest:So, like, there are a few cutaways to these, like, very, like, prestigious-looking judges.
Guest:So, like, they're, like, taking notes, but that's it.
Guest:Oh, that's interesting.
Guest:So, you know, you made it, you created a narrative outside of the stand-up.
Guest:Right, but it's not, I hope, you know, from what, from my perspective, I didn't think it, like, was distracting us.
Marc:Well, you're a great standup and you're a great joke writer.
Marc:And it's like one of those things where when I see you on Conan or something, I'm like, this guy's so good.
Marc:But, you know, you definitely have, you're a writer.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And how's that struggle going?
Guest:I mean, right now it's just sort of bipolar.
Guest:Like I spend like six months or so writing on whatever.
Guest:And then we'll just spend the rest of the year like touring and
Guest:Now, did you get married?
Guest:I did, yeah.
Guest:How long ago was that?
Guest:A couple years ago.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I haven't talked to you that long in any way.
Guest:How's the marriage?
Guest:Good, yeah.
Guest:Do you have a kid?
Guest:No kid.
Guest:I mean, we have two dogs we treat like children.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And what does she do?
Guest:Is she in show business?
Guest:She is not.
Guest:She works for the ASPCA.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Does she do like...
Guest:hands-on stuff um sometimes she's mostly does like marketing and uh for aspca yeah and like copywriting and they and what what is what do they what do they do exactly um i mean they have a lot of it seems like they have tat they have uh shelters in new york yeah but they also have tat these they fund these task forces that work up like dog fighting rings and cock fighting rings oh really like
Guest:Yeah, like, you know, those stories where you hear about, like, hoarders who have, like, 12 cats.
Guest:Or, like, horses that are just, you know, skeletons.
Marc:Yeah, the ones where they find the cats in the garbage.
Marc:Yeah, I mean, like.
Marc:You know, just, like, the bones.
Guest:Yeah, the, like, pancakes.
Marc:Yeah, and the lady's like, I wondered what happened to them.
Guest:I mean, that's sort of like, it's mostly like when they, it's like usually bigger cases where like they have to bring in like, they essentially have like a SWAT team on call to like- For like people with 50 cats?
Guest:Yeah, it's nuts.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh my God.
Guest:I don't really, she's also like, she gets these phone calls that are like confidential and then she can't tell me, but she'll be like- Top secret animal.
Guest:Yeah, something is about to happen.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And does it break in the news?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, sometimes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It's crazy.
Guest:There's some shit going down.
Guest:There was a crazy thing a couple, like last year where she had to go to North Carolina for a week because there were so many animals at this place that they raided that they had to like essentially rent out an airport hangar and just like there was like hundreds of animals.
Guest:Of all different kinds?
Guest:Yeah, until they could like figure out where to put them all.
Guest:just oh my god hands on deck people flying in from all over the country to like aspca forces yeah yeah she was like cleaning out cat got a suburban zoo issue yeah basically yeah it's crazy there's a place in north carolina where they have tigers the tiger rescue oh really yeah it's pretty wild it's crazy i went to uh we went to a uh ostrich farm in solving recently in solving yeah
Guest:Wow, just a visit?
Guest:We were there for a wedding, but then, you know, we had a day to kill in Solvang.
Guest:It's like seeing dinosaurs.
Guest:It really is.
Guest:It's like the lamest Jurassic Park.
Guest:But they are freaky, and they just eat food out of your hands.
Guest:They're giant birds.
Guest:They're giant birds, and they run in a very funny fashion.
Marc:They're real dinosaurs.
Guest:They are, yeah.
Marc:It's wild.
Marc:What are they?
Marc:They farm them up there?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:For the meat?
Marc:I don't really know.
Marc:What else are you going to use it for?
Marc:What would you have an ostrich farm for?
Marc:People eat ostrich meat.
Guest:Yeah, they were selling ostrich jerky, but they also had ostrich eggs signed by Khloe Kardashian that was in a glass case.
Guest:Oh, that's important.
Guest:It is, yeah.
Marc:well how's now what's going on with the uh with the twitter feed what were you doing you were retweeting you made a career out of retweeting things yeah what was that what was the angle on that again just like corporate retweets i did that for a while what was it what was it though them doing i i used to have fun on um like 9 11 like 9 11 corporate tweets oh yeah it was fun yeah
Guest:Gun manufacturers often tweet funny stuff on holidays.
Guest:Now I'm just like, I'm so deep into like Trump, like idiot reverse that I like, I feel filthy.
Guest:Like I have- I've pulled out totally.
Guest:Oh, I'm fully in.
Guest:I can't, I can't, do you fight with Nazis?
Guest:oh yeah yeah yeah it's like it's very strange to just become completely desensitized to like seeing your face being shoved into a an oven by a cartoon frog or whatever so yeah okay you are desensitized totally 1000 it does nothing yeah it was your point where it did
Guest:I mean, it's... Dave Chappelle's monologue when he hosted SNL is just like, we have an internet troll as president.
Guest:That's what it is.
Guest:And so it's just trolling.
Guest:It doesn't really affect me.
Guest:If it were... I don't know.
Guest:If it were something else, maybe it would affect me, but I'm sort of desensitized to that.
Marc:Do you find that...
Marc:Well, let me ask you this, because what happened with me and Twitter was that once he took office, I was like, I'm done.
Marc:I'm done feeding this.
Marc:I don't want to fight.
Marc:It is taxing to me.
Marc:I'm not desensitized.
Marc:It's not so much I take it personally, but it's sort of like it takes up energy.
Marc:It causes me aggravation.
Marc:Because even if I'm being desensitized towards horror is one thing, but engaging in emotional fighting, the idea that you're going to win.
Guest:no yeah i mean like when you say like am i fighting with nazis not really like i'm i don't really respond to people that often right it's mostly like uh i'm i you'll tweet something out and you'll see it make fun of something like donald trump jr says or whatever seb gorka or any of those people yeah i haven't heard his name in a while
Marc:But, yeah, I just, I was like, I'm not feeding this anymore.
Marc:I feel you.
Marc:I mean, like, I... I feel better, dude.
Marc:I have more time.
Marc:That's great.
Marc:It's not, you know, I don't, I'm not great sitting with myself, but it's nice to know that that's still...
Guest:operative i know i mean it's super unhealthy it really is and i'm like i just vacillate between like just the darkest part of like trump twitter and then like to get relief i will then just read like nba trade rumors and that's like what makes me happy it's like one of the few things in the world so it's just like it's either basketball that makes me happy or just like i'm just like going back and forth but in the big picture do you feel as an intelligent person who fights a good fight do you feel that
Marc:That Twitter is doing anything good?
Guest:No.
Guest:I mean, well, the thing is, and not that it's like a noble fight, because it's not stupid, but there is something to the fact that this is the medium that the president has chosen to be his...
Guest:His lifeline to his people.
Guest:Right.
Marc:So you got to operate.
Marc:You got to be dragged down to his level.
Marc:That's a unique thing.
Marc:It's like we're all being dragged down to the president's level.
Guest:It's crazy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But, you know, there are... I actually just recently...
Guest:I paid some website like $12 to just delete all my old tweets from like anything older than like two years ago or something.
Guest:And they do that?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I don't know how, but it's just like, I was just like, I don't need a like permanent, I don't need like some, like whatever I was yelling at 10 years or 2010 to like haunt me later.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So yeah, just...
Marc:Well, I think that it's interesting because sometimes I'll look at Twitter.
Marc:I don't like occasionally I'll answer questions by primarily use it for promo now.
Marc:And like I'll answer questions sometimes if I'm but I used to be locked into it.
Marc:Like, you know, you'd spend hours there, you know, and now I do think that it does good because sometimes I get I learn things first there.
Yeah.
Marc:Because I'm not tapped into every news site.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And sometimes someone will tweet something like, oh, fuck.
Marc:Right.
Marc:That happened?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And also I think that organizing, I think sometimes it's proactive and it helps.
Marc:And it seems to me that the hashtag President Bannon actually got up Trump's ass.
Guest:Seemed like it.
Guest:More...
Guest:more the magazine cover oh that was that was it yeah i think that's that's how you get in that's how you something that gets ratings yeah it's like it's literally like whoever's on the cover of time magazine that'll do it yeah it's crazy he's a fucking child yeah yeah there's some big problems dude yeah i really don't know you know it's never a dull moment
Guest:i've never like i've never felt this like embarrassed before you know like even when like i know bush was president i didn't feel like i could like i would i could travel abroad and you know not feel like embarrassed yeah with bush you were sort of like i i didn't i didn't do that yeah right but this guy it's sort of like oh my god yeah
Guest:my favorite thing is to talk to people about like yeah you hate trump everyone hates trump in my world yeah um but it's like i love finding out who's who's like the second person you know because some days for me is jared kushner like i obsess over jared kushner he makes me crazy and then sometimes it's you know jeff sessions or whoever but it's like bannon's yours yeah you're a bannon guy i'm a bannon guy
Marc:I was a Bannon Stephen Miller guy, but I don't know.
Marc:Stephen Miller seems to have found his way up Jared's ass somehow.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:This weird alignment between white supremacists and grandchildren of Holocaust survivors.
Guest:Yeah, orthodox Jews.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's unbelievable.
Marc:I don't know what's happening at that level.
Marc:All right, so when's the special on?
Marc:July 25th.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And your dogs are good?
Marc:Dogs are great.
Marc:Wife is good?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You're happy with the special?
Marc:I think so.
Marc:Do you get that weird thing where you're like, but I'm a stand-up, not a writer?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I mean, I think it's pretty clear that I'm working through those issues in the special itself.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, I don't know.
Guest:It's like, totally.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, the money's good with writing.
Marc:You're in a good environment.
Marc:You like the show you're on.
Marc:You go pitch jokes.
Marc:But in your heart, you're a stand-up.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And then there are times where, like, I'll be on the road for three weeks.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I'm alone ordering, like, Domino's pizza in some awful place.
Guest:By yourself.
Guest:It's like, I should, like, go, I should be at my job.
Guest:What am I doing?
Guest:Is this the quality of life I'm looking forward to?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:So, I mean, I'm still trying to figure out, like, the right balance.
Guest:I definitely feel like I'm sort of half of both or whatever.
Marc:Well, yeah, but you know in your heart and your mind that, like, no matter how bad it's going to get over there at the office, I got WGA health insurance.
Marc:You know, I got a pretty steady paycheck as long as the show's on there.
Marc:Right, right.
Marc:That shit makes a difference.
Marc:Yeah, it does.
Marc:Totally.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:All right, well, it's good talking to you, Joe.
Marc:Good talking to you.
Guest:All right.
Marc:As I mentioned, Joe Mandy, that was Joe Mandy.
Marc:His new standup special called Joe Mandy's award-winning standup special is now streaming on Netflix.
Marc:Go enjoy that.
Marc:David Allen Greer.
Marc:Wow, Dag.
Marc:He's been around for a long time, and he's always been fucking funny.
Marc:Always been funny.
Marc:From Living Color to the movies, to being on Broadway, to being on the radio, to the Carmichael Show.
Marc:I mean, he just...
Marc:yeah he's been around a long time too man and we don't really know each other we might have met i think we met once but i was excited to talk to him he has a new show on gsn called snap decisions it premieres monday august 7th the series finale of the carmichael show airs august 9th on nbc i do want to make clear that when i talked to him i did not know that the show had been canceled and he he told me after
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:But I was sad to hear that.
Marc:I liked it.
Marc:But we talked about everything.
Marc:You know, there's a lot of stuff.
Marc:You know, he he had quite a life and he was, you know, he wanted to be an actor and he's a great actor, but he's also one of the funniest guys around.
Marc:This is me and David Alan Greer talking here in the garage.
Marc:you know if trump wanted to play by the same rules as obama what are the rules we get final cut they don't get to vet questions they you know like i mean he's pretty good like that i'm not sure what i would do with him or what point it would serve because i just think you'd have to just turn the thing on and just
Marc:I know, but what are you going to get?
Marc:Trump.
Marc:I know, but he gives that all the time, and it's all bullshit.
Marc:If I can get to the core of it, I mean, I grew up with a narcissistic dad.
Marc:I know what's in there.
Marc:I know it's at the core of that personality.
Guest:A whole lot of fuck you.
Guest:My dad was a psychiatrist.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So what do you make of it?
Marc:What do you make of your dad being a psychiatrist?
Guest:Well, he just passed.
Guest:Well, he didn't just pass.
Guest:He passed away about a year ago.
Guest:And what do I make of it?
Guest:He never got psychiatric on me.
Guest:That you know of?
Yeah.
Guest:Well, yeah, okay.
Guest:Except for one time.
Guest:Because I think the perception is, the routine comeback is, your father's a psychiatrist.
Guest:Well, did he analyze you?
Guest:No.
Guest:Day-to-day was not...
Guest:uh i think you're let's use our words oh right right no he was just like sit down shut up you know like a normal parent except for one time when i was like you know feeling myself i said dad what's the what's the definition of insanity and he just looked at me and smirked he goes it means nothing it is a legal definition like you idiot shut up yeah what are you talking out of the car i'll pick you up and i was like oh
Marc:words are weapons i i think that the the generally it seems to me that the the common thing about being the kid of a psychiatrist is uh is that they're always a little weird well yeah i married the child of a psychiatrist well then and but she was she didn't strike me as weird but then i knew some other kids and they seemed weird but i don't know why that would be maybe that's something we project onto people your dad's a shrink you it was always projected on me you
Guest:It was.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:But he passed away.
Guest:My father died, and we just got these papers, all this stuff, this writing that he did a long time ago about his life.
Guest:It was kind of like, I don't know what it was for.
Guest:Unpublished?
Guest:No, yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Guest:They were just private musings.
Guest:He had had a series of questions.
Guest:Clearly, this was an elongated biography.
Guest:My father also was an author, so I don't know at what time...
Guest:But he would always use any kind of method to write.
Guest:But the point being is, as an African-American, going to med school and desiring to become a psychiatrist at that time, I think there were one or two other...
Guest:Black students in med school at Michigan.
Guest:And so that's what was incredible.
Guest:And, you know, studying at the manager clinic and this and that.
Marc:It was at the manager clinic.
Guest:That's a big one.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And it was.
Marc:So it's a completely unique experience he's writing about.
Marc:They had to be one of two or three African-Americans.
Guest:Yes, absolutely.
Marc:So that must have been why.
Marc:So it talks about his challenges, maybe?
Guest:He, he, he, he talks about it.
Guest:But more it was, you know, by rote, but there was some insight, meaning as a young student, you know, as a resident.
Guest:faced with probably 99.9% Caucasian men, just how do you get ahead?
Guest:And I know my father told me, he said, well, I really didn't have a choice.
Guest:If you wanted to be your own boss and you were a person of color, you had to be a doctor, lawyer, dentist, or else you're working for someone who's white who will subjugate you.
Marc:Or a shop owner of some kind.
Guest:Yes, exactly.
Guest:So you had to go into business for yourself.
Guest:And so that was the whole aim.
Marc:So it wasn't necessarily a passion to... You think that it was... Well, it must have been... No, my father was... You'd show psychiatry.
Marc:That's not like... When you're thinking about, I want to go into business...
Marc:I didn't go into it.
Guest:I wasn't smart enough.
Marc:That seems like a lot to put in.
Marc:You got to put in the medical school, the internship, the residency, all of it.
Guest:In 1940-something.
Guest:That's crazy.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:What were you thinking?
Guest:My dad is and was the smartest person I ever knew.
Guest:I think he went to college and he was 16.
Guest:He's brilliant.
Marc:He's really smart.
Marc:How much of this writing is there?
Guest:Well, I found two copies.
Guest:My brother and I, I think my father's widow.
Guest:Just two of you?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, my sister.
Guest:I'm the youngest.
Guest:But we found these papers.
Guest:They were given to us, you know, from his widow who's cleaning out stuff.
Guest:You guys might want to.
Guest:Two different copies of the same thing.
Guest:Most of it is family history.
Guest:My grandmother was born in 1900.
Guest:And I remember, you know, a ritual when I was with my grandmother.
Guest:When I was very little, we'd sleep, you know, do a sleepover.
Guest:And I'd see grandmother tell me about when you were a little girl.
Guest:And she would always start with these sweet stories.
Guest:And it was like, and then that boy was lynched and they cut his tongue out and hung him by his penis.
Yeah.
Guest:Anyway, who wants a cookie?
Guest:But as a kid, I just was fascinated.
Guest:It was like hearing about the Wild West.
Guest:Absolutely.
Guest:So as I got older, then I realized this is not just an adventure.
Guest:This is reality.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:It's racist and hate-filled.
Guest:You know, as a child, it's just the adventure.
Guest:Like when the stagecoach was raided by the Indians.
Guest:That's what it sounded like.
Marc:Well, you can't connect it to reality until you put things into context.
Marc:It's just a horrible story.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:So it sounds like your dad intended to publish this thing if there were two copies of it.
Guest:It ain't getting published now.
Guest:I know you're already.
Guest:So this is a painting that you found on the back of a masterpiece.
Guest:No, but it does.
Guest:You know, I have a daughter.
Guest:Why can't you publish it?
Guest:You can publish it.
Guest:Does he have a following?
Guest:He wrote a book.
Guest:He was 89.
Guest:Yeah, he had a big following in 68.
Guest:Yeah, in 1968.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:My father was the radical.
Guest:You know, he and my mom, they got a divorce.
Guest:He left.
Guest:He moved out to San Francisco.
Guest:Right.
Guest:The summer before the summer of love.
Marc:So he was on the cusp of the hypnosis.
Marc:So that was just the summer of racial bullshit.
Marc:Yes, whoa.
Marc:Before the summer of, well, it was just like 10 years of horrible racial tension.
Guest:Well, we had driven out.
Guest:I remember one summer vacation.
Guest:My brother just reminded me of this.
Guest:Like, we were kids in Detroit.
Guest:We went to Disneyland.
Guest:I was like nine years old.
Guest:We drove across country.
Guest:And every stop, you know, once we got to Amarillo, Texas, that was the first stop.
Guest:You know, my mom and father would come back to the car.
Guest:Guys, they don't like Negroes.
Guest:So let's keep our voice.
Guest:Boys, stay in the car, please.
Guest:Jeffrey, put your skateboard down.
Guest:Let's just listen with our ears.
Guest:There was a lot of that.
Guest:But as kids, I remember my brother and I, we'd go to these motels.
Guest:There'd be these white kids in the pool.
Guest:We'd jump in the pool.
Guest:They ran out.
Guest:And I'm like, let's go chase them.
Guest:My brother was like, man, get your motherfucking ass in the car.
Guest:They hate you, you big head.
Guest:You'd punch me.
Guest:But to me, it was like, no, man, let's go make them play with us.
Guest:You still didn't get it.
Guest:No.
Guest:To this day, I do not.
Guest:I'm telling you the truth.
Guest:Danny, um, Danny LeBright.
Guest:I'm at the airport early in the morning.
Guest:I see him, you know, and I just go over there and introduce myself.
Guest:We're on the same flight, whatever.
Guest:Two days later, I get an offer to do this film.
Guest:And I typed in my email of my agent.
Guest:I'm like, that is so crazy because, you know, Danny and I were on the same flight.
Guest:And I introduce myself and I get this offer.
Guest:The universe is bananas.
Guest:And there was a silence.
Guest:And then it's like...
Guest:yeah he said that he met you then he gave you the offer i said well yeah but what's the connection though there is none it's just providence you know i still didn't get it i still didn't that's why you got the offer you so that's that's great you live in a magical world if you're lucky everything is magic to you
Guest:but then there was like maybe i shouldn't verbalize i should just internalize so they don't realize what kind of way but i'm kind of interested in the idea so your dad moves to san francisco oh yeah okay so i'm gonna bounce around in 1968 well no here's what it went down you know my parents i remember there was a family meeting and my mom and dad's like you know your father and i are having problems
Guest:And we want you to know.
Guest:This was very psychiatric when I think back.
Guest:We want you kids to know.
Guest:It's not your fault.
Guest:It is our issue that we're going to work through.
Guest:And we're not getting a divorce.
Guest:And it was like, that's the word.
Guest:Like, what is a divorce?
Guest:These are the words I learned as a child.
Guest:What is assassination?
Guest:How is assassination different than murder?
Guest:Then I was told, you know, when Kennedy and all that.
Guest:So divorce, what is divorce?
Guest:And they told us and then they, anyway, we told all our friends we're supposed to move to California.
Guest:We packed up.
Guest:My father goes ahead and that was it.
Guest:You know, he writes to my mom a letter, by the way, you're not joining us.
Guest:So that's how it went down.
Guest:Very classic 60s divorce.
Guest:And so he got a waterbed.
Guest:a dashiki.
Guest:He was, come on.
Guest:He was like a midlife crisis.
Guest:It's the 60s.
Marc:Some African art and posters?
Guest:Not African art.
Guest:No.
Guest:But he did the peripheral Black Panther stuff.
Guest:Sure.
Marc:He had one of these Afro rakes.
Marc:Oh, yes.
Guest:Oh, yes.
Guest:My father taking us to the barbershop.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Cut these boys hair in an Afro.
Guest:You are not colored.
Guest:You're black.
Guest:I was like, oh, okay.
Guest:He made the jump.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:So when Obama was elected, my father was like, fuck him.
Guest:He's not black enough.
Guest:He should be telling all these white folks, kiss my ass.
Guest:Yeah, that would have helped out.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Yeah, daddy, he could do that, but he's probably not going to be president.
Marc:He didn't want to hear it.
Marc:So you went back and forth from Detroit to San Francisco as a kid?
Guest:Well, we went to visit my dad.
Guest:We would see him once a year.
Guest:Oh, absolutely.
Guest:Yeah, it was absolutely.
Guest:But I remember going to visit him.
Guest:So you've got to imagine this.
Guest:It was...
Guest:68 in San Francisco.
Guest:That's crazy.
Guest:A circus.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:Yeah, we get off the plane, and my father goes, I'm going to take you to People's Park.
Guest:And we're like, you know, you got to hear this.
Guest:This is our political education.
Guest:We're like, what kind of park is this?
Guest:You know, there's a fence around it, and there are no toys.
Marc:Where are the swings?
Guest:Yeah, you know, my father's like, the toys are in your mind.
Guest:Yeah, man.
Guest:Then he takes us to the Black Panther headquarters, and we see the hippies, and we're just like... He took you to Oakland?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:That was a tourist spot.
Guest:For your dad.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Here's the Panthers.
Guest:We got there the day that Bobby Hutton, who was a 16-year-old Black Panther, was murdered by the police.
Guest:It was his funeral.
Guest:And we were like, now you're taking us to a funeral?
Guest:What the fuck is this?
Guest:Where is Disney on it?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that was my life.
Guest:And then going back to Detroit, my dad had this huge book.
Guest:What book was it?
Guest:It was called Black Rage.
Marc:Was that his term?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:You have to Google it.
Guest:Before I say yes, I don't want to put my foot in it, but it became, whatever it was, it became popularized by this book.
Guest:This book was a huge bestseller.
Guest:What was it about?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was the black rage defense, meaning you, Mark, and your forefathers have subjugated and oppressed me so much that if I stab the fuck out of you right now, that's because of my inherent built-in black rage.
Marc:You had family in Eastern Europe?
Guest:I don't, man, I see what you're trying to do.
Guest:I see what you're trying.
Guest:No, but I mean, that's part of it.
Guest:My people were helping you.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:No, I have a Jewish friend.
Guest:She goes, so what?
Guest:My great grandmother was raped by the Cossacks.
Guest:We all have a crossing.
Guest:We tried to make up for it.
Guest:We were down there.
Guest:We got you the voting thing.
Guest:We were down there.
Guest:No, but I mean, so you have to read it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because one of the things my father did.
Guest:Did you read it?
Guest:Of course.
Guest:One of the things my father did for the rest of his life is like, you know, he hated when
Guest:That book was used as a legal defense.
Guest:He hated professional psychiatrists.
Guest:DeAndre was seven marks here because he felt oppressed by his white presence.
Guest:He didn't like all that stuff.
Marc:So he saw it more as an academic thing as opposed to a practical defense for any crime a black person might commit?
Guest:That's one aspect.
Guest:But he also didn't like people moving when he talked.
Guest:So you put them all together.
Guest:Literally.
Marc:Was he a clinical psychiatrist?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:So he had an office, people would come over.
Guest:Yes, yes, yes.
Guest:But he had an office.
Guest:And it was very 60s, because I remember going down to visit him.
Guest:In Detroit?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:There was a downtown plaza that was very hip.
Guest:It was called Lafayette Park.
Guest:And when he moved there, he had another office in downtown Detroit, like the book building, which was just right in downtown.
Guest:But he moved to this new office.
Guest:It had the double door, the couch.
Guest:It looked like a fucking James Bond movie.
Guest:And the white chick was the secretary.
Guest:Oh, hello, David.
Guest:And I was like,
Guest:Yeah, man, this is it.
Guest:This is how you live.
Guest:Hell yeah.
Guest:Drove a Buick 225.
Marc:Is that Detroit that you grew up in, is it gone?
Marc:I mean, like, what part of, like, I know, I hear things I don't want to judge.
Marc:I know that there's some areas of Detroit that are coming back.
Marc:I've performed outside of Detroit, but the news out now is that, you know, Detroit's sort of decimated.
Guest:All right, listen, I'm talking pre-riot, early 60s Detroit.
Guest:You know, in our minds...
Guest:industrial like powerhouse it was like before the japanese europeans would they we were king of the world glorious city fuck yeah it was like the fifth largest city in the world in america rather yeah and we thought i live in a cosmopolitan area you went to private schools and yeah very hip and cool and this is the life you know so you went do you went to a private school
Guest:For a while, for a while, like when we were very young, I just got these pictures from like kindergarten, first to second grade, and it's me and a sea of racists.
Guest:No, and a sea of like white kids, you know, and there's like the one other- Wearing a little jacket?
Guest:Were you wearing a little jacket?
Guest:Oh, suit and tie.
Guest:And I had this bolo-like, it was really little kid stuff.
Marc:So that's an interesting kind of upbringing in terms of like, you know, because people make assumptions that there was a very healthy black middle class in Detroit when you were growing up.
Marc:That's it.
Guest:Well, think about this.
Guest:You know, the car companies, when they were thriving,
Guest:That was a very comfortable middle-class existence that people could count on from high school until retirement.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that was guaranteed.
Guest:These were post-war union jobs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:African-Americans.
Guest:I mean, that's why all of these black people were in Chicago, Detroit.
Guest:I mean, that's what attracted them initially is these jobs.
Guest:I think my grandmother's
Guest:brothers so my grand uncles you know one comes then the whole family comes they were they from mississippi by way of alabama so forget about it if you're saying in the 30s yeah let's get the out oh hell yeah this is an actual life where we won't be oppressed and beaten and killed and lynched so that's the scenario uh and very progressive i mean we went to as a kid you know my father's friends we all went to this
Guest:quote progressive really progressive school at that time so that was the first kind of school i remember the school bus and all that stuff oh yeah like what progressive had not like a montessori school but just a integrated tolerant um uh kind of like this is the this is the way democracy works oh absolutely i remember being brought into the auditorium and watching
Guest:the assassination coverage of uh john f kennedy you know i think i was in first or second grade a 19 inch black and white television you do you do remember that oh absolutely i remember our class we wrote sympathy letters to jackie yeah yeah of course they were graded come on i'm not kidding you for years they sent them out with a b minus on them when david said i'm sorry that's a compound word i'm there was no
Marc:yeah and it was marked up but i lost the letter i wish i could find it because it was so that's like because you're a little older than me like i'm 53 i'm 47. oh i'm sorry i must have misread 47 you look great well thank you i just dyed my mustache yes i'm 61.
Guest:I'm 61.
Marc:61?
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Marc:So you do have memories.
Marc:Like, I was born the year that he got shot.
Marc:Two months before he was shot.
Marc:I don't have any memories.
Marc:I have memories of Watergate, but I, and Vietnam War, looking at the TV.
Guest:Watergate was boring to me after, like, everyone got shot.
Marc:It was just guys shitting at microphones.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Like, for hours.
Marc:Right, right.
Marc:But the Vietnam War, hell, I remember that on TV.
Marc:Like, it was terrifying.
Marc:I just remember guys in the jungle.
Marc:You know, like, just bad news.
Guest:Well, first of all, there was a kid, one of my best friends around the block,
Guest:His cousin, teenage cousin, went to Vietnam.
Guest:So I'd never heard a word like Vietnam.
Guest:It was like Klingon to me.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:I was like, what is a Vietnam?
Guest:Where is it?
Guest:And he said, you know, it's in Asia.
Guest:And his cousin fought in spider holes.
Guest:And immediately, I'm like...
Guest:they have spider holes big enough for people to crawl into in a place called vietnam i don't want to be there is that what they're fighting yeah so that was my introduction to it but i remember watching you've progressed that one haven't you i'm not much fake news i'm all for it come on isn't that what we do every night
Guest:Yeah, you live in Magic Land.
Guest:Yes, yes, of course.
Guest:There's no connection.
Guest:Mark, come on.
Guest:But I remember watching the draft lottery.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And my brother's number was 18, I think.
Guest:Like, he should have been on the first bus.
Guest:And he got out of it.
Guest:He's that much older than you?
Guest:He's four years older than me.
Guest:And it was like the end of the war, like 70, 71.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, right.
Marc:Bad then, because then they're just shoveling people to die.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:You know, like, if you got there that year, it's sort of like, this is just about me.
Marc:If you want me to go someplace I don't want to go, I'm gonna shoot you.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Well, so, you know, I'm talking about this because for years, I thought my dad was so brilliant.
Guest:He got my brother off.
Guest:And it wasn't until I was grown my dad goes, he had nothing to do with it.
Guest:You know, my brother like, you know, didn't bathe for like two weeks, you know, and just took a bunch of speed and walked in there talking crazy.
Guest:And they're like, you, sir, may remain home.
Marc:We don't need you.
Marc:And we don't know what you're talking about.
Marc:It seems like you understand it.
Guest:There's no connection, sir.
Marc:So where did you go to, like, how did it progress for you?
Marc:So when you were a kid, you grew up in a nice life, well-educated, good folks.
Guest:Beautiful house, same house.
Marc:What did your mom do?
Guest:She was just, well, I don't want to say just.
Guest:She was, as a young child, until my father left, she was a housewife.
Guest:And then once the divorce, he left, and then she went back to teaching, which she always hated.
Guest:There's a perverse comedy in there now, but she was just the... She hated it, but she had to do it.
Guest:She hated it?
Guest:Yeah, she was like a kindergarten teacher.
Marc:And she went back to that, hating kids.
Guest:Well, I feel bad, but I mean, we were like, you know, when you're kids, you're like, dude, come on, man.
Guest:I need Hot Wheels.
Guest:Let's go.
Guest:You don't want to hear about, you know, fulfillment.
Guest:No, you're just like, I am what's more important than me.
Marc:Well, what was your, like, what were you aspiring to as a kid?
Marc:Like when you did, well, you're in a magic bubble.
Marc:We've established that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:How dare you, sir.
Marc:What compelled you towards the arts?
Guest:You know what I used to do when I was a little kid?
Guest:At the back of Boy's Life.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:I haven't heard about that magazine in a while.
Guest:Boy's Life.
Guest:Yeah, can you draw this fawn?
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And I would do that test.
Guest:And they would be like, sir, you're brilliant.
Marc:Those animals with the human eyes-ish, sort of like compassionate eyes.
Marc:There was a squirrel or something.
Marc:Right, a fawn.
Guest:so you drew it sent it in sent it in and uh that was before i found out it was kind of a rip off but i mean i just remember like i wanted to be a painter yeah an artist or biology you know painter or biology sure animals i memorized every amphibian oh yeah toad and frog you still remember them yeah i know it's not in michigan because they used to put out these regional yeah yeah yeah i know that we don't have bullfrogs we have green frogs oh good good which was uh uh a
Guest:a little sadness sure but in in the event that someone goes look at that bullfrog you're like green over and then you have an argument maybe get hit i would argue you down sure sure because for um what was it show and tell uh-huh i would get up there with this book and just lecture the class on why we don't have pacific spotted sure lake turtles yeah in michigan because
Marc:You like the research of it.
Marc:I did.
Marc:Right?
Marc:Like I saw some map of rats yesterday.
Marc:You get the Norway rat.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And then you get tree rats.
Marc:First of all, tree rats.
Guest:Dude, no.
Marc:I think they are called tree rats.
Marc:They are.
Guest:That's what freaked me out.
Guest:They're here.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:That's that metal band around the palm trees.
Guest:I was like, is that for the homeless children so they don't climb?
Marc:Climb up for a coconut?
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:They want a date?
Guest:They have nests of rats in trees?
Guest:No, thank you.
Marc:Apparently, that's the ones we got here.
Marc:No, thank you.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So, you didn't go into biology.
Marc:You didn't go into painting.
Marc:It was too hard.
Guest:biology is required your dad probably well he probably had something to say about biology he had to do all that shit well i remember he goes so you know he left he's out there and so it was college time and so was he talking like hey man no he's like i assume that you're the profunderance of uh
Guest:Thoughts and feelings.
Guest:I mean, that's how he'd talk to me, and I'd be like, what?
Guest:He's like, you know very well what my musings mean.
Guest:I'm like, musings?
Guest:What the fuck?
Guest:He sent me this application for University of California, Berkeley's chemistry department.
Guest:And I'm like, are you insane?
Guest:Do you know I've been doing acid for the last four years?
Guest:I can't do this.
Guest:So I just went on to Michigan.
Guest:You were an acid guy?
Guest:Ah.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Mescaline, THC, more than I cared.
Guest:In high school?
Guest:Yeah, I started about 15, 14, windowpane.
Guest:So that was the good shit.
Guest:I've never been that high ever in my life.
Marc:What was that?
Marc:So what year was that, 70?
Marc:I'm going to say 71, something like that.
Marc:So it had trickled into the mainstream, like as it was around.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, we got it.
Guest:Same thing as like, give Billy your $5.
Guest:Okay.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And that was, you went out there, huh?
Marc:I did, man.
Guest:And it was, I put it like this.
Guest:It took me 12 hours to realize I was in a room with no ceiling that was on fire.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:So that's how high I was.
Marc:Was it really on fire?
Guest:No, it was my mom's living room.
Guest:What are you doing?
Guest:and my mom followed me around this is you're not supposed to trip with your mom exactly well that was never the plan my friends dropped me off on the front lawn and my mom found me at like three in the morning playing with the dog like see there's no connection oh my god
Guest:She was worried.
Guest:She was a single mom.
Guest:Sure, sure.
Guest:And her son's on acid playing with the dog.
Guest:Yeah, talking about Jimi Hendrix or whatever.
Marc:Oh, but you got to... It's so nice.
Marc:I envy that you were cognizant and engaged...
Marc:in the world when that shit was happening.
Marc:In 68, 72, I was nine.
Marc:So I'd see pictures.
Marc:I saw Mad Magazine, but you were a few years older, so you're like, I got the record, man.
Guest:Well, my brother actually saw Hendrix.
Guest:I never saw him, but there's a very- That's right, you got the older brother with the shit.
Guest:There's a story that needs to be told.
Guest:I've never actually... I wrote it down because I actually did research and stuff to go back and ask.
Guest:But this time that my brother told me that, Hendrix had come to Detroit and...
Guest:must have just turned 13.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he went, he wouldn't take me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he met Hendrix.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And Hendrix, they went to his dressing room and he brought him on stage.
Guest:This was a myth in my family.
Guest:And for years, I just thought my brother told me this to rub it in, you know, and he never made it up.
Guest:yeah i always thought i never really believed him and uh just a couple of years ago he told me how he got this email from his friend michael who had gone with him that night and he read me the email and i'm in the car and my eyes well up because it was like i remember all the cool stuff we did it's so great to connect with you remember that night with hendrix and how he talked to us and it was all you man like yeah and i'm sitting there going oh my god
Guest:my brother was a hobbit like really like he he met the dwarf king yeah and so i just was like oh my god i never believed it i still get goosebumps and so it was just a bonding thing like oh my gosh he wasn't lying oh my where's your brother at
Guest:He's living in Daly City.
Guest:He moved with my dad.
Guest:Oh, by your dad, yeah.
Guest:And he never came back.
Guest:I mean, he just stayed in the Bay Area.
Guest:What's he do?
Guest:He is retired.
Guest:He took care of my mom until the very end.
Guest:She lived 95 and a half.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:And he did the dirty work.
Guest:Oh, he did.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:F. Daly.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I can take it, man.
Guest:But I'm busy.
Guest:You know, I'm doing a lot of things, man.
Guest:Ding-a-lings.
Guest:I got Thursday to Sunday.
Guest:So, you know, it's in the money and stuff.
Guest:He is going to heaven.
Guest:I mean, trust me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So he's chillin'.
Guest:I mean, he's chillin'.
Guest:That's nice.
Guest:And your sister's still around?
Guest:She's living still in Detroit.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:And I'm the, you know, youngest.
Guest:And you're all close.
Guest:I'm closer to my brother.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But if you have brothers and sisters, it goes weird.
Guest:There was a point when I was... It goes in and out.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:I was closer to my sister when she moved near me when I was in New York, like in 75.
Marc:I think that has something to do with the fact that me and my brother are close, but when it gets too close and you know them inside and out, they know you inside and out, and if they're fucking up and they don't want to cop to it, then it gets a little trippy, right?
Marc:You're like, what's going on with you?
Marc:I'm all right.
Guest:Yeah, it's like, dude, get the... One time my brother goes, yeah, my nephew's 21 or whatever.
Guest:He's like...
Guest:i mean you know he's acting crazy and i'm like what like what give me an example man you know talk to me no i mean he's like like i'm crazy you know he's saying like i'm crazy but it's not me i know it's him i'm like oh get what what does the service say i was saying you know he's 19 20 whatever we can sit watch porn together i was like time out
Guest:See, that's inappropriate.
Guest:Why?
Guest:Well, both adults?
Guest:And I'm like, I never want to watch porn with my dad.
Guest:And he's like, okay.
Guest:Like, I guess you're crazy.
Guest:I'm like, yeah, dude.
Guest:So, you know, there's those things where sometimes you have to drop the hammer.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So what led you to the acting, man?
Guest:How did that happen?
Guest:Well, you know, I dropped out of school.
Guest:I went to Michigan.
Guest:Michigan State?
Guest:No, University.
Guest:Come on, man.
Guest:University of Michigan, brother.
Guest:That's a good one, right?
Guest:That's the good one.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Not a good one.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:In Michigan, that's the school.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Went there, dropped out my freshman year.
Guest:I always played really shitty guitar.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:Always, yeah.
Guest:Tons of songs, really bad.
Guest:You still play?
Guest:I do.
Guest:I do, badly.
Marc:I mean, now I have all the guitars of my dreams, like every other... I try to get them for free, and I don't go crazy.
Marc:I did spend some money on some amps.
Guest:Yeah, I've done all that.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Got a little money, you're like, I'm buying them all.
Guest:I'd like the Marshall.
Marc:Yeah, of course.
Guest:I never... Did you buy a Hendrix Strat?
Guest:No, because I always thought that was sacrilegious.
Guest:I can't play like Hendrix, man.
Guest:So what's your guitar?
Guest:Right now I'm into Les Pauls.
Guest:Yeah, me too.
Guest:And I was very late to the game.
Marc:Me too.
Marc:To Gibsons, late.
Marc:I was always a Fender guy.
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Marc:And now I got a couple of Gibsons and I'm like, holy shit, these are magic.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:They really are.
Guest:I mean, that guitar can do everything.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Which Les Paul you got?
Guest:I have a, well, what happened was, you know, one of my first guitars was like a 73 Les Paul Deluxe.
Guest:Yeah, the Gold Top?
Guest:No, it was a Cherry Red.
Uh-huh.
Marc:you could buy like 300 yeah you know and i customized it and all this it was stolen like every guitar ever yeah so i'd lend mine and then they disappear like i know who had them and where they went no but then you can't get them back no it usually went like
Guest:David David did Tommy's mom tell you to call me yeah mom what's going on all right I just don't want you to be upset mom what's going on son sit down and I was like mom what happened well I came home from school and I asked you to put the dishes in the sink I was like mom what she goes there's been a break-in right oh my god
Guest:go in my closet and look.
Guest:Well, I have to put the groceries down.
Guest:You know, she's there and I'll call you back.
Guest:There's no guitar.
Guest:So the guitar was stolen.
Guest:She gave me money and bought another one.
Guest:That's when I bought the Les Paul.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I wanted to replace that guitar.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Nostalgia.
Guest:And I started looking around and playing and I'd also had a big theft, you know, here in California.
Guest:I had a bunch of very valuable
Marc:vintage guitars that were stolen yeah and i just was done i'm done with old crusty yeah vintage i just want something that sounds good yeah and i can replace sure yeah i think i never got into that like i got some amps that are kind of classic but i won't do the i can't collect it i got a lot of guitars but i try to talk them out of the guys like hey i'll talk about them on the thing i'll play them on the show yeah i'll play them on the show you give me and i'll do the thing
Marc:And it takes a couple years, and eventually they relent.
Guest:Motorcycles I did that with.
Guest:But the guitars, I just, you know, most of my life, trading albums, selling albums, like in the 70s.
Guest:I'm still doing that.
Guest:Well, that was my currency.
Guest:I mean, when I was in college, I lived above a used record shop.
Guest:So whenever I was out of money, I would just go and trade albums.
Guest:Because that was instant cast.
Guest:The same with guitars.
Guest:I always...
Guest:bought really great vintage guitars when I was broke, I would sell them or, you know, do whatever.
Guest:I never hocked them.
Guest:I just sold them and it was like, okay, why?
Guest:You back into records?
Guest:I have a core, not currently, but I got into comedy albums, like the old black comedy albums.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:The best, you know, Blue Fly and Red Fox.
Guest:The Party Records?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, those are great.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, so that was probably my last runt.
Guest:yeah yeah i'm just i'm just back into it i'm in the rabbit hole with the records hey man yeah get it so all right so you drop out of michigan yeah so i went to new york i was reading cream magazine sure and soho weekly village voice and right then was the punk scene i was like the ramones and patty smith and all this 72 73 yeah 74 and i just felt like if i don't go at this moment then i'm gonna miss it and also
Guest:i looked upon it of course i didn't tell my mom yeah but this is my year abroad yeah so i just took my money and yeah really i took the tuition money and moved to new york city you know the lower east side 75 yeah there for a year oh yeah and at that time is when i started hanging out with actors in new york and i figured this is what i can do with my life because i really said look you you suck at guitar
Guest:what's the best you know you get an album a bald spot and you're fucked you're fucked in like nine years you're hot belly you know do acting you can get old doing it really you thought that you're yes you're thinking the long term yeah because i was already jaded i mean i was already you know by the 70s all those groups i'd seen everybody and led zeppelin all that stuff yeah but on some level it's sort of like what you said about your old man and about like uh you know getting into a business
Marc:Yes, yes.
Marc:That you could call your own.
Marc:But you at least acknowledged your talent to some degree.
Marc:I didn't know.
Guest:I didn't know if I had talent yet.
Marc:So you're hanging out with actors, and how do you proceed?
Guest:Here's what happened.
Guest:I'm going to tell you this.
Guest:So I worked at the Haagen-Dazs ice cream store.
Guest:It was on 86th Street.
Marc:Like the original one or something?
Guest:No, but back at that time.
Guest:In the 70s?
Guest:Haagen-Dazs.
Guest:Yes, Haagen-Dazs.
Guest:There were only two stores in the world.
Guest:This guy who owned these two stores, that you could walk in and get a cone.
Guest:Back then, Haagen-Dazs ice cream was exotic.
Guest:Yeah, sure.
Guest:And people would line up, and you would scoop until you had carpal tunnel.
Guest:So that's what I was doing.
Guest:A guy comes in, and I was tired.
Guest:I was tired.
Guest:It was the end of the night, and he asked me something.
Guest:I got up on the counter, and I did this whole routine, and I jumped down.
Guest:The guy was like...
Guest:I'm going to tell you something.
Guest:You are an actor, and you are wasting your life.
Guest:Now, you don't know who I am.
Guest:I'm not some pervert.
Guest:I'm going to give you this card.
Guest:This is an agent.
Guest:You need to go and call this person.
Guest:And it's your life, but this is what I feel you were destined to do.
Guest:This really happened.
Guest:So I said, OK.
Guest:And that's what started it.
Guest:That's what started it.
Guest:You called the guy?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I went to this agent, and they were legitimate.
Guest:And they were saying, like, look, you really need some training.
Guest:I mean, you've got to get into scene study.
Guest:And so then I applied to the Neighborhood Playhouse, Sanford Meisner.
Guest:Sanford Meisner, right.
Guest:Sat there and interviewed me.
Guest:But, you know, at the time, I was like, yeah, some old white guy.
Guest:He talked weird, whatever.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he interviewed me.
Guest:Like, we talked for, like, over an hour.
Guest:And he said, you know what?
Guest:I like you a lot.
Guest:I'll let you in.
Guest:But then I had to raise, like, the money to go there.
Guest:My mother would never pay for it.
Guest:So that led me to go back to Michigan and,
Guest:start acting there and then move back to New York I mean it just seemed like the logical thing you went back to school yes and I said because then I can you know I knew that my I would have the support of my family right my friend as long as you're in college and they could think like he won't stick with this yes that was it because I never majored in acting right I majored in journalism she's like well okay I'm a Negro reporter that's acceptable by the way David something's happened what mom we had another break in what
Guest:There were like five break-ins when I was in there, like every week.
Guest:Another guitar.
Guest:Oh, they took everything.
Guest:They, yeah.
Guest:So you finished Michigan?
Guest:Yeah, I finished Michigan, and at that point, you know, I was majoring in journalism.
Marc:But you're acting like in the stage troupe thing?
Marc:In everything.
Marc:In college or outside of college?
Marc:Oh, okay.
Guest:We formed our own theater company.
Guest:I was full on.
Guest:It was like, this is what I'm going to do.
Marc:But not training, really, just doing it.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, I was studying acting.
Guest:That's where really I took classes.
Guest:I just couldn't major, major in it.
Guest:At the school.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And then I applied to Yale.
Guest:got in my roommate who's reggie kathy people know because he's pretty pretty well known i guess yeah um we both got in yeah and then i went from yale it was like that was two years at yale before three three years at yale so that was and that's the preeminent acting program at that time meryl streep went there like juilliard and yale was it yeah i applied to juilliard and they're like no thank you sir
Marc:But Yale was big, right?
Marc:It was huge, man.
Marc:So you had to do the whole thing.
Marc:You had to do movement.
Marc:You had to do dance.
Marc:You had to do swordsmanship.
Marc:Fencing.
Marc:Yeah, fencing, ballroom, Alexander technique.
Guest:We didn't do ballroom, but we did do, yeah, some phonetics.
Guest:We had phonetics and we had, it was like, you know, the MGM, you know.
Guest:but you were who was in your class were there people people that went there with me around that you know rock dutton i met there yeah um kate burton jane kaczmarek jane kaczmarek john tuturo you know some people like that you know him yes we all were in school there yeah he like he like that's that's sort of that must have been amazing it was amazing it was amazing because there's like if you go to yale that's all you're doing because new haven's a shithole exactly
Guest:It was like going to school in Detroit, really.
Guest:But on the serious side, because it was only all about art.
Guest:That's all we did 24-7.
Guest:And you didn't have the pressure of your career.
Guest:Didn't have the pressure of, well, you were just in this...
Marc:strindberg one act how is that going to affect your tvq no we're just doing the work well at that in those years that you know a career was not the focus like they didn't you know there wasn't as many options it was a long shot and you got into it to do theater like you know yeah so i was bought in i was just
Guest:so you do it you're doing all you were doing schrimburg you were doing all of it all of it and i i in particular for some reason i did like 33 productions in three years i mean a million and all different kind of stuff it really changed my life and we would do you know we i started doing comedy like we do i think we did this uh evening of comedy you know at yale yes yes that in the cabaret
Guest:And I would sing.
Guest:I still wrote songs.
Guest:And I would go to New York and do workshops.
Guest:But at that point, those people I knew, like one of the guys, I guess, that I met while there, like Steve Forbert, who became kind of cool.
Guest:The singer?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, I remember him.
Guest:We would all do open mics, you know, that kind of stuff.
Marc:But anyway, that's when you were doing singing or doing stand up.
Guest:No, I never did stand up when I was in New York.
Guest:I was I was a musician.
Guest:Right.
Marc:A musician and actor.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, and then I tried comedy, which was, you know, what?
Guest:Nothing.
Guest:I lived around the block from the catch.
Guest:Catch a rising star in the 70s.
Guest:Well, that was actually I moved after I graduated and.
Guest:I moved back to New York, and that was my apartment.
Guest:And that's where I met Chris Rock.
Guest:I mean, a bunch of people.
Marc:Late 70s.
Guest:Yes, 80, actually.
Guest:81.
Marc:So you graduate Yale, having done everything from Shakespeare to David Rabe to Beckett.
Marc:Everything.
Guest:yeah and then what your first couple you get movies pretty quick right no i mean my first job was to star in a musical on broadway about jackie robinson the first african-american ball player yeah that's how it went down like you know my my mom what was it called is called the first yeah and on my graduation and my dad came and this was the one time where he was speechless oh yeah that's good like he's walking around and
Guest:After the show?
Guest:No, this is the graduation day.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:And he's like, yeah.
Guest:He's like, how did you do this?
Guest:Like, he was so disconnected.
Guest:He was like, so you want to join the circus?
Guest:When did this start?
Guest:And I was like, well, it's a passion.
Guest:And he was totally blown away.
Guest:And I just was like, God, please.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:please give me one job i will become a male hustler please just let them feel i have something and like magic but he was impressed though fuck yeah he was speechless and i went oh my god it was just a great feeling when you got the job and you could tell them well no first of all that day yeah and i literally made that prayer i said please give me one job i'll be unemployed for 10 years just to shut them up
Guest:And I got this role.
Guest:It was the star in this musical.
Guest:Plus, it was like acting.
Guest:It was about black people, white people.
Guest:I sang songs like, Mama, I can play that game.
Guest:Son, it's not your time.
Guest:You know, that kind of stuff.
Guest:I can climb that tree.
Guest:You know, that kind of stuff.
Guest:And so my dad came.
Guest:Everybody came.
Guest:And I was like, thank you.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And my mom freaked the fuck out.
Guest:She just went nuts.
Guest:I mean, like, that's my son.
Guest:It was cool.
Guest:I mean, it's cool if you've had that moment.
Guest:I know not everybody does, but it was cool.
Marc:Sometimes it takes a long time, if at all, for them to realize, like, I guess he's doing something.
Marc:Right.
Guest:I always hated you.
Guest:But I mean, I got that.
Guest:So it really was.
Guest:But I'll tell you one time.
Guest:So when we closed, we only ran for three weeks.
Guest:We closed.
Guest:The world wasn't ready?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:It just flopped.
Guest:Real good hearted.
Guest:I mean, at that time, people would come from Brooklyn.
Guest:It was all about the Dodgers.
Guest:They would sit there and they would cry.
Guest:I mean, the scrim, our curtain, was the old...
Guest:fence from ebbets field they recreated it what was the audience was it was it mixed or it was papered it was because i remember one of the last performances again me in the class i go i think we're gonna make it you know like look it's almost a full house and like the stage manager goes kid that's your cue and i go yeah yeah but come on he goes the audience is papered i said what does paper mean there's jackie now and i had to run on stage
Guest:And I'm like, oh, God, now we even know.
Guest:But it was amazing.
Guest:It was like I was on cloud nine.
Marc:It must have been so exciting to be on a big stage.
Marc:And who cares if it's papered?
Marc:I mean, to be on Broadway.
Guest:That was the end.
Guest:Literally, for that period, everything I could have dreamt in my life was...
Guest:And the last day when we were closing, I had never gone through this.
Guest:And I remember I got in a cab and I said, take me around the park.
Guest:And the guy rode me around the park and I just like bawled like a kid.
Guest:You know, it's like it's and I come into the theater and everyone's crying.
Guest:Everyone like these are old.
Guest:hardened crew members were weeping.
Guest:And it just killed me.
Marc:Because they were attached to the show.
Marc:They thought it was a great show.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, it was a sweet show.
Guest:It was a very New York show.
Guest:And it was because really what the play was about, there's a great documentary about the Dodgers because this was a time in New York where they got it right.
Guest:you know and and ebbets field this cross section of brooklyn these are baseball players who lived in the community because they didn't make that much money yeah when they were not uh training they worked at like the appliance shop right or at a car dealership yeah uh so they were in the community and uh it was a very special time yeah so it was it was great i think you should revise it but
Guest:Only if I can play him now.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:There's young Jackie.
Guest:I'm a little older.
Guest:Well, I'm kind of stiff, boys.
Guest:You know, I've been married three times.
Guest:I'm like, what?
Guest:He's 22.
Guest:If Jackie had lived.
Guest:How long did he live?
Guest:Sadly, once he retired, it's like his body fell apart.
Guest:I mean, he developed diabetes.
Guest:He died in his 50s.
Guest:But the connection was that most...
Guest:African-Americans who excelled during that period, kind of like my dad, you had to be super exceptional.
Guest:I mean, Jackie Robinson got a letter, lettered in like three different sports.
Guest:He could have become an Olympic athlete, a baseball player, a football player, basketball player, anything.
Marc:Well, that's interesting.
Marc:You couldn't coast.
Marc:You couldn't take anything for granted because you had to not only make the cut, you had to be above it.
Guest:Man.
Marc:So no one could argue it.
Marc:Uh-uh.
Guest:You had to be like, I'm going to take these white people and let them know.
Guest:You couldn't be like, uh-uh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so, yeah, it was wild.
Guest:It was wild.
Guest:And then when did the movie start?
Guest:Well, after the musical, you know, I was nominated for a Tony that year, which was, you know, it brought me into the...
Guest:the community the world yeah i think professional acting i did a show called soldiers play at the negro ensemble and we all i think my first film was streamers with robert altman that's heavy man yeah man it was that was again it was like it's a heavy play are you kidding me god damn i'll tell you like david rabe
Guest:right i i met him at this place where yeah we all used to hang out and i go hey man david it's me david allen greer i'm a young negro actor and i'm gonna be in your play but we're doing a movie he goes i know i'm like okay it's kind of weird attitude i'm so excited he said you better not it up i was like okay i'm gonna go sit over here he scared the out of me but i saw him afterwards and he liked it so yeah there's some heavy monologues in that play hey man
Guest:And Robert Altman, man, come on.
Marc:It was, again, it was just... That was that period where Altman was shooting those plays.
Marc:When you're coming back to the Five and Dime, Streamers, and he did... There was another one.
Guest:Super 16 is what it was called.
Guest:And, of course, people laughed at him, you know, because I remember I would go into, like, real big movies, and they'd be like, I see you did Streamers.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:I remember this one well-known director, and he goes, yeah, you shoot on that Super 16.
Guest:All right, go ahead and read it.
Guest:yeah you know what was all been like at that point he was so great i mean he taught me about movie making yeah because first of all the dailies yeah that's all the footage you shot that day yeah um
Guest:The director and everybody, they have to watch everything to choose the takes.
Guest:And it was a completely open process.
Guest:That's where Altman was.
Guest:He said, look, I'm not going to hide anything from you.
Guest:I encourage you actors to come and see this work because he wanted us to buy into the process.
Guest:I want you to care about what we're doing.
Marc:You're going to learn.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So the next day, you're like, hey, we know what's up.
Marc:Exactly.
Guest:Maybe I should tone it down.
Marc:Yeah, right.
Marc:Oh, right.
Guest:All that.
Guest:And so we went.
Guest:We went every night.
Guest:There was like a little bar in the back and we would all watch.
Guest:And I learned so much on that movie.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:And so he didn't over direct.
Guest:I mean, he told me several times.
Guest:He's like, you know, my biggest job is casting.
Guest:So one of the things when we auditioned is we would read through the whole play, which is at his apartment.
Guest:He had this place on Central Park, and he would switch people out.
Guest:But I mean, you stay there.
Guest:You read the whole first act or the whole entire play.
Guest:And that's... I never have since had a...
Guest:audition process right well i i talked to a lot of directors and it turns out like a lot of them you know it's really like i cast you do what do what i hired you to do yes i already believe in you yeah exactly but uh so so it was great it was a real great learning process also it demystified it because before that film i didn't know how you got a film i was like well maybe i'm not doing it right yeah you know maybe i need to you know act film acting is different because this is what we were always told you
Marc:Yeah, well, there's a lot of stops and starts.
Marc:You can't get a groove going, really.
Marc:Action cut!
Guest:That's lunch!
Guest:So I didn't know the process, and it was really great.
Marc:And you going from there to Soldier Story?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That was another... That was Jewison?
Marc:Was it Norman Jewison?
Marc:Norman Jewison.
Marc:And that was... I remember that movie.
Marc:That movie is a devastating movie.
Guest:It is.
Guest:I mean, I'd been in the play and- It was called The Soldier's Play at that time?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And you know, Sam Jackson was in there.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:But his role was cut out of the movie.
Guest:And for like a few years, because I was rolling, Denzel Washington, who was a friend, we were all like, it was like, poor Sam, you think he'll ever get it together?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:He's really tall and weird.
Guest:Anyway.
Marc:He did all right.
Guest:Yeah, he's fine.
Guest:I mean, he just blew the fuck up.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:Denzel was in that too.
Marc:Yep.
Guest:you know the two i get confused what's the other one the civil war one all the black people yeah yeah yeah oh you mean glory yeah well he was great in glory oh man oh this is another so i read for glory yeah but at the time the guys who directed it the guy who directed it also had 30 something on the air which i loved and i was like
Guest:Listen, I don't really want to play a slave, but I'd love to do 30-something.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:So I'm like, yeah, David, you're playing J-Bo.
Guest:All right, go.
Guest:He's like, UK.
Guest:I got it.
Guest:You're like, thank you for coming in.
Guest:And I get in the car like, I think I really got his ear on the 30-something.
Guest:Yeah, again, I was wrong.
Marc:And you got to play J-Bo on 30-something.
Guest:No, I didn't.
Guest:Yes, of course.
Guest:I got nothing is what I got.
Guest:I got the call where your agents go, what happened today?
Guest:I think it was pretty good.
Marc:But the fascinating thing about your career is that whatever you did as an actor leading up to it, you have a very sort of varied actor's career.
Marc:I mean, you've done fucking everything.
Guest:But I always wanted to do it like that.
Marc:Yeah, but it's amazing because not everybody gets to do it like that.
Marc:You've never stopped working.
Marc:And, you know, you took opportunities where you could.
Marc:And the opportunity that makes you is like you're already three or four or five movies into whatever when In Living Color happens.
Marc:Right.
Guest:But dig that year that, you know, we had done I'm going to get you sucker.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Now, first of all, I got to roll back.
Guest:With the weigh-ins.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's where when I did Soldier's Story, I shared a honey wagon or a little dressing room with Robert Townsend.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Robert Townsend would do these routines.
Guest:And I'm like, this is the funniest dude I have ever seen in my life.
Guest:And he would go, I'd be like, is this your act?
Marc:I remember watching him on stage at the comedy store.
Guest:about improv, and he said, but Robert would go, he'd go, no, that's my boy's act, Damon.
Guest:He was doing Mo Money.
Guest:He would do a sprinkle of Keenan stuff, and I'm like, who are these people?
Guest:And I need to meet them.
Guest:So he introduced me to the Wayans, and I would hang out in comedy clubs with them.
Guest:Once I moved out,
Guest:That's what I did every night.
Marc:It was so interesting, those two guys as comedians, because when I was a doorman at the comedy store in 80, whatever the fuck it was, 87, Damon had not broke huge, so he was still doing stand-up.
Marc:I would sit there in the main room doing The Door, and I said, are you going to do that thing tonight?
Marc:He's like, no, tonight's going to be jazz set.
Marc:Hey, man.
Guest:Hey.
Guest:Him and Jim Carrey would talk about, do you remember that time I got in the piano and I stayed there for an hour and a half?
Guest:And I was like, that must have been uncomfortable.
Guest:Well, I don't get it.
Guest:Where was the punchline?
Marc:Could people hear you?
Marc:They were like, no, David.
Marc:Keenan was just straight up stand up.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And Damon was like out there.
Guest:Well, Keenan.
Guest:Keenan was like, hear the jokes.
Guest:He was in, when we were doing Soldier Story,
Guest:Keenan was in the centerfold of Right On magazine, with his shirt on.
Guest:He was like, ladies, what's up?
Guest:Laying this dick on all of y'all.
Guest:I was like, fuck, man, that's huge.
Guest:I remember we saw him on The Tonight Show in our motel,
Guest:in arkansas you know and i remember the bit he would do this bit like how the last person that got on the train subway train as the doors closed it was like watching a baby being born and he would physically do it it was hilarious and i'm like this guy's a genius too something in your family so long story short i would hang out with those guys and it was just by osmosis they said look you have to get on stage if you're going to be here and it was more like a dare yeah so
Guest:I just started for fun doing spots.
Guest:At the improv?
Guest:No, I chose the Laugh Factory because it was a black hole.
Guest:I remember that.
Guest:It was like a hallway.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:Nobody would go in there.
Marc:Next to that old Chinese restaurant that closed.
Marc:I remember that because I was at the doorman at the Comedy Store in the mid 80s.
Marc:And you'd go to the Laugh Factory and it was just like you'd walk in the door and you were in the room.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And in order to go to the bathroom, you had to walk down the right side to that door and the guy would be on stage right there.
Marc:And anytime you went there, Paul Mooney was on stage.
Marc:Well, you're exactly right.
Marc:And Frazier Smith.
Guest:It was Frazier Smith and Paul Mooney.
Guest:You're exactly right.
Guest:And Paul Mooney, this is when Paul Mooney was firing.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Brilliant.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I just felt like I could work out at the laugh.
Guest:I always hated the comedy store.
Guest:I was always intimidated, hated the improv.
Guest:Too much pressure.
Guest:It was too much.
Guest:Yeah, it was too much.
Guest:And so that's where I started.
Guest:And from there, I remember standing in line, I'd done the pilot to In Living Color.
Guest:So you could only do it once a month.
Guest:So the next month, In Living Color had come on, and I'd done like- Do what once a month?
Guest:like the open mic, whatever their policy was at that time.
Guest:Oh, you had to follow the policy?
Marc:Yeah, because I wasn't anybody.
Marc:I was just there.
Marc:The policy, like Jamie Masada, who was working the register.
Marc:Yes, and the door.
Marc:Nobody, no, no, no, no.
Marc:When you walked in, you're just this mean Israeli dude.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:You'd be like, you just here last week.
Guest:No, brother, no, brother.
Guest:And I'm like, what are you kidding me?
Guest:There's like 40 seats in the place.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:But I remember the WANs, all those guys, when I would do spots, I have it on tape.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Do it again.
Guest:You're too long with the premise, man.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:Tell me this.
Guest:While you were on stage?
Guest:While I'm trying to do these bits.
Guest:And my bits were one-act plays.
Guest:Yeah, because that's where I came.
Guest:As the gentleman entered the bar.
Guest:I was like, shut up.
Guest:So at any rate.
Guest:The deal was, I come back a month later, and Living Color was on, my three national commercials, and these homeless comedians were like, what the fuck happened?
Guest:He did one spot, and this guy blew up.
Guest:And I could never bring myself to say, look, dude, I had a career, okay?
Marc:so that's what they thought that's interesting because like comedians it's sort of like they their trajectory is what it is you know you hammer it out then you get to break on the tonight show then maybe you get a deal to do a show here you're at you're at yale you're doing jackie robinson you did movies you did tv shows you got commercial you went the whole other way and then you show up in the comedy land they're like who the fuck is this guy to get this shit yeah
Marc:The guy's an open-miker.
Guest:That's exactly what happened.
Guest:I remember I did a spot at the Comedy Store, and they were like, this dude's funny.
Guest:They grabbed Mitzi.
Guest:They brought me to the main room.
Guest:What did she say?
Guest:Well, she was back there, and one of my big jokes was like, Detroit police, bang, freeze.
Guest:And she goes, that's Mike Binder's joke.
Guest:He's from Detroit.
Guest:You stole it.
Guest:And I was like, Mike, who?
Guest:He's like, you're a thief.
Guest:But she said, keep working and come back.
Marc:You're a thief, but I like you.
Guest:No, she said, that's his joke.
Guest:She was encouraging, but that room, it was too much.
Marc:The original room?
Marc:The little one?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:It's heavy, dude.
Marc:It takes a while to get comfortable there, and if you never get comfortable there, you'll never be comfortable there.
Marc:He lets you go in there tonight and feel that shit.
Guest:I probably could.
Guest:I mean, I performed there several times back in that period.
Guest:And they said, come by any time.
Guest:That just wasn't my room as a comic, you know what I mean?
Guest:That just wasn't the place where I could.
Guest:Laugh Factory was that place.
Marc:Right.
Marc:It's a little looser there.
Marc:You feel like you got less to lose for some reason.
Guest:I could just stretch out.
Guest:And back in the day, we would do like, I remember I'd get in a car, rent a wreck.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, rent a wreck.
Guest:I'd do as many spots as I could, four or five spots.
Guest:uh in prepare in preparing for living color no this was just because once i got into it you gotta prove yourself right it was just obsessive and i'll record every set and they all sound the same yeah one people i would kill one audience the next same energy saying it was just crickets yeah and finally i just stopped recording myself because it taught me nothing yeah i i record and then i don't listen that's my game
Marc:I would be like, guys, have you ever eaten popcorn?
Guest:And you know, on cheese doodles, the dust gets on your fingers.
Guest:You suck.
Guest:And like the next they're like screaming, hollering.
Guest:And I'm like, why?
Guest:I don't know why.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You can't figure out the magic.
Marc:So then how did the show come to be?
Guest:um was it it was on the air before you started on it no no we done uh you were there at the beginning right yeah we done i'm gonna get you sucker and you know when eddie murphy first popped wait is that i'm gonna get you sucker is that roberts or the wayans movie it was supposed to be both of them what was roberts first movie called the one with the credit hollywood shuffle okay that's it okay okay got it yeah yeah shuffle
Guest:So I'd come out to do a pilot.
Guest:I did this show for the Charles Brothers NBC.
Guest:It was called All is Forgiven, like in 86 or something.
Guest:First television show.
Guest:Anyway, in Living Color, everyone talked about doing, we should do, someone should do a black SNL.
Guest:We should do a black Saturday Night Live.
Guest:Eddie Murphy talked about doing it.
Guest:never came to fruition.
Guest:So Kenan just took up the mantle.
Guest:He is the first one to actually do it.
Guest:Like, he got this opportunity and he said, we're gonna do this sketch show.
Guest:And he called me up and he said, I want people to know how funny you are.
Guest:You know, because he'd seen me.
Guest:And hanging out with those guys.
Guest:Robert at that time was my best friend.
Guest:We hung out with each other all night.
Guest:How's he doing now?
Guest:I don't talk to him.
Guest:But the point is...
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I haven't seen him in a long time.
Guest:I haven't even seen him either.
Guest:I don't know where he is, but I know he and Kenan are still tight.
Guest:But so that was what it was.
Guest:He said, I think you should do this.
Guest:And it was in a year where I must have auditioned for 30 pilots.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And after years of trying to control the narrative, meaning, you know, Stephen Boschka was doing a singing replacement.
Guest:I can guarantee you, David, much like the Deaf Theater's production of Othello, this is going to kill.
Guest:And I'm like, wow.
Guest:You know, I just did In Living Color for fun because my friends were in it.
Guest:They didn't pay us any money that first year.
Guest:My agents did not want me to do it.
Guest:So I turned it down.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And Kim Wayans called me.
Guest:I moved back to New York in my old apartment and she called me and she talked me down.
Guest:She said, you've got to come back out.
Guest:You have to do this show.
Guest:I'm telling you, it'll change your life.
Guest:And I listened to her.
Guest:That's why.
Marc:And it did.
Guest:It absolutely did.
Marc:There's a lot of episodes, dude.
Marc:A lot of characters, a lot of... And everybody looked like they were having so much fucking fun and there's some weird shit going on.
Guest:Well, I remember we had this long table.
Guest:So we'd come in in the morning, and we'd have breakfast.
Guest:And we were comics.
Guest:We were young.
Guest:We didn't give a shit.
Guest:And it was all about making each other laugh.
Guest:So that was where I saw Fire Marshal Bill.
Guest:That's where half the characters came there.
Guest:And if you made each other laugh, like by the second or third day, you'd be like, Mark, you got to do that.
Guest:You got to do the radio guy.
Guest:You have to do it.
Guest:And you're like, okay.
Guest:And that's how it happened.
Guest:It was very organic.
Guest:There was no, I think I know what our audience, 15 to 20.
Guest:You didn't have any executive heat on you?
Guest:no and and it's to keenan's credit that we were protected uh we never felt that pressure he just said do whatever you want and then you know it's like you know you can't do the talking butthole or whatever they would just say you know within parameters and we just go and do it i mean he encouraged us he said don't wait for the writers yeah you guys have to write for yourself yeah
Guest:is he serious but it was and then you i guess you you probably made a built alliances with certain cast members that you work better with like you and damon did a lot yeah but you know damon um i remember he came to the dressing room early on he said look man because he was a writer also and he wrote with me he wrote calhoun tubs he said look you need a character david and i was like
Guest:Yeah, but doing announcing and bit parts in other people's sketches is working out.
Guest:He's like, no, you have to have a signature character.
Guest:So I told him about this guitar guy.
Guest:Like I told you, I loved playing guitar.
Guest:And we wrote it right in the dressing room.
Guest:He says, cool, put this on.
Guest:That was Calhoun Tubbs.
Guest:And that's what started it rolling.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because I never wanted to be, that's not my nature.
Guest:I never wanted to be on an SNL thing because basically you're crabs in a barrel.
Guest:I've hosted it twice.
Guest:And if you don't get, there is so much pressure.
Guest:If you don't get on as a writer, they're going to fucking fire me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I need you.
Guest:When you come in as a guest host, this guy in the back office, he's like, please do this avocado sketch, man.
Guest:I got kids.
Guest:Yeah, man, it is a death sentence.
Guest:And you're like, yo, man, that shit's not funny.
Guest:I'm sorry, I can't.
Guest:And he's like, oh.
Guest:Yeah, so I didn't want to be in that situation.
Guest:But Living Color wasn't that.
Guest:There was competition.
Marc:Sure, but it was healthy.
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:Everyone made each other better.
Marc:Theoretically, yes.
Guest:Well, yeah.
Marc:Well, I mean, if you didn't have the heat and the pressure from the outside.
Guest:It was brutal, too.
Guest:It was brutal.
Guest:I mean, because we would laugh.
Guest:Nothing made us happier than when someone sketch bombed Jim Carrey.
Guest:Of course.
Marc:That's the comic's laugh.
Marc:Oh, of course.
Marc:The singular laugh at the back of the room.
Guest:Ah!
Guest:Well, the way is no one has a more obnoxious laugh than them if you've ever been.
Guest:I'm like, no one laughs like that.
Marc:It was just an acknowledging.
Marc:It was punctuating your failure.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:I know that one.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:So Jim did, it was called the, what was it called?
Guest:The diplomat or something.
Guest:And he played, you know, this overwrought French diplomat with this big mustache.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And, you know, me and Tommy, we're in the sketch.
Guest:We get killed and we're behind the furniture.
Guest:And we can feel driplets of stuff.
Guest:I mean, we look up, Jim's just like fucking sweating.
Guest:The audience is like, what the fuck is this?
Guest:And we were crying.
Guest:We were crying.
Guest:I mean, our bodies are like, I am the diplomat.
Guest:No, nothing.
Guest:Nothing but crickets.
Guest:We fucking loved it.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:It's the best.
Marc:You don't see enough of that anymore.
Marc:The camaraderie of enjoying the failure.
Marc:When you die.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's become.
Marc:I don't know what happened to that.
Marc:But back in the day in comedy clubs, you'd see people losing their shit.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:On stage.
Guest:Well, I'll tell you what happened is the dude from Seinfeld, man.
Guest:I mean, you record that.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I guess that.
Marc:Well, that's true.
Marc:That's true.
Marc:But like, there's still like, it's weird.
Marc:Like, yeah, if you're at a certain celebrity status where people know that this is going to be something like, you know, I'm still under the radar and, you know, there's plenty of us who are still under the radar where there's not like, oh, I'm going to get him.
Marc:He shouldn't be saying that.
Marc:But you're right, there is a constant sort of predatory surveillance, a predatory tabloid surveillance.
Guest:Yeah, like when Tracy Morgan got all the controversy about his jokes and the homophobic stuff, I was like, have you heard the rest of his act?
Guest:And then finally, I think someone reviewed it in the Times.
Guest:When he came back, they were like, yes, this was offensive, so was everything.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:That's what he does.
Guest:Yeah, but also comedy clubs...
Guest:It used to be.
Guest:Like, I remember when Chris Rock was trying new jokes at the Comedy Cellar, and he got reviewed in the Times.
Guest:It's like, fuck that.
Guest:Come on, man.
Marc:It's right.
Marc:That used to be our place.
Marc:Back when I first got back to L.A., no one was going to the Comedy Store.
Marc:It was this dark hole.
Marc:And part of me was sort of like, good.
Marc:Now I can just go get some shit done, take some chances.
Guest:I loved your bit about fucking and eating the baby.
Guest:That was brilliant.
Guest:We'll shut you down.
Guest:Why aren't you doing that anymore?
Guest:This is a comic moment.
Guest:I was at the Montreal, and I run into Kevin Hart.
Guest:It's 2010.
Guest:This is before Kevin Hart became big.
Guest:Became the king of the universe?
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:He said, man, what's going on, Dave?
Guest:I was like, man, I'm going through a divorce.
Guest:He said, man, sit down.
Guest:Everybody's going through a divorce.
Guest:He said, how you doing?
Guest:I said, I'm good now.
Guest:I don't want my ex-wife to die, but I do want her to get cancer to pussy.
Guest:And he fell.
Guest:Ow.
Guest:He was like, you have got to talk about that on stage.
Guest:I'm like, what are you, nuts?
Guest:I have a daughter.
Guest:She's going to fucking sue me.
Guest:No, I can't talk about that on stage.
Guest:You know?
Guest:And he didn't do it?
Guest:No.
Guest:I can't.
Guest:I can't.
Guest:I can't look my daughter in.
Guest:Why did you talk about mommy's vagina?
Guest:Daddy was angry.
Guest:It was a joke.
Guest:It was a joke.
Guest:You gotta learn sometimes jokes.
Guest:They just look at you like, what?
Guest:How old is she?
Guest:She's nine.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:And still though, I remember I showed her something that was really funny to me.
Guest:She just looked at it like, what are you, nuts?
Marc:They take it literally.
Guest:She just doesn't get it.
Marc:She's not supposed to.
Marc:She will.
Guest:Hopefully.
Guest:Hopefully.
Guest:But I performed...
Guest:A few months ago in San Francisco, and the local comics, always some of the best, intelligent, most insightful comics.
Guest:These guys, I didn't know them.
Guest:But they were so paranoid that every joke was an explanation of why it's not racist.
Guest:You know, I got on the bus and there were two black guys.
Guest:But, I mean, good looking and they can do anything.
Guest:Seriously.
Guest:No, no, no, no, no.
Guest:Wait, wait, wait.
Guest:No.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was like, dude, just tell the joke.
Guest:They were like, you don't know what it's like.
Guest:I'm like, I guess not.
I don't know.
Guest:Call me old school.
Guest:It's different.
Marc:But the thing that fascinated me was that you always work.
Marc:You do everything that an actor does, but also a comic actor.
Marc:You have a lot of range, and it's beautiful.
Marc:And you're working with Gerard now, and he's great.
Marc:And that character is like... It's a rare fucking thing, and congratulations, not only to have such a kind of nonstop career, but then to age into a role that you can own at your age.
Guest:You know, I met Gerard in Montreal.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's shiny.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:He's very shiny.
Guest:He doesn't sweat, he's just... Yeah, I don't know if he's human.
Guest:Well, he's a different kind of Negro.
Guest:Yes, he is.
Guest:Anyway, but my thing is...
Guest:I want to be funny today.
Guest:I want to be funny right now.
Guest:And I still love it.
Guest:I mean, I still love the performing.
Guest:Feels good, right?
Guest:Fuck yeah.
Guest:I didn't know people would want to hear from me now.
Guest:And most of them don't.
Marc:That's not true.
Marc:They just don't know that they do.
Guest:There you go.
Guest:There you go.
Guest:No, but I mean, that's it.
Guest:I mean, I want to be the older actor that I wanted to work with when I was younger.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Not the dude who comes in like, listen, kid, you're going to suck cock if you want me.
Guest:That's what you got to do.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I'm like, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, I want to be that guy.
Guest:And you can start now.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:I want to be that guy.
Guest:There were some older actors who still had life and belief and believed in the art and the craft.
Guest:That's what I want to be.
Marc:But I also think the fact that, like, you can't stop yourself from getting on a mic or getting on a stage or taking a gig.
Marc:Like, you know, you did a lot of work with Corolla.
Marc:You went through a lot of pain and trouble with divorces in a very candid format.
Marc:And ultimately what happens is, as some guy who is a too much information guy, is people get to know you too well.
Marc:And, you know, and that's not a bad thing because you help a lot of people when you do that.
Marc:I didn't count on that.
Marc:I didn't.
Marc:I know, but like, you know, you're going to get on radio and you're going to do, if you're going to do Loveline and Corolla, they're going to, they're going to, we got a live one here.
Marc:He's broken and he's wide open.
Guest:But you know what, man?
Guest:I remember I was in a, I was in Dean and DeLuca.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:A couple of things.
Guest:First of all,
Marc:Down on... Back when it was... It's still there.
Marc:West Broadway.
Marc:Yeah, West Broadway or whatever.
Guest:I got to go back.
Guest:When Living Color was canceled, I really thought at that time, okay, I have about 18 months where I can headline clubs and venues.
Guest:Then that's going to go away.
Guest:And then I just have to go on with my career.
Guest:Because there was no internet, no YouTube, none of that.
Guest:I couldn't picture...
Guest:this, the technological ability to press a button and collect all the favorite sketches you had.
Guest:So I didn't see the longevity of this show.
Marc:It was not part of your job description to foresee technology.
Guest:No, so that's what I mean.
Guest:I didn't think it would be like this.
Marc:But you knew from seeing other people do it, you knew you had a window if you played it right.
Guest:Yes, which I did, but I didn't think at this point people would still be talking about In Living Color.
Guest:I just didn't see it.
Guest:Jim Carrey saw it.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Because he said from the beginning, he said, what we're doing is history.
Guest:And I was like, what are you, nuts?
Marc:Yeah, it's TV.
Marc:What do you mean history?
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:This is not history.
Guest:He saw that.
Guest:I mean, I didn't see that.
Guest:So here we are.
Marc:But no, but the beautiful thing is, is you're doing this character.
Marc:After everything you put out in the world, you've got this great character on a great sitcom with creative guys.
Marc:And then you do, and now you've got this gig.
Marc:I don't know what this game show is, but I think at the end here, we should pay some lip service to it.
Guest:It is a money.
Marc:let me tell you no I know but like I was gonna tell you the premise though I like the premise it is it's basically you just it relies on your prejudices right I think it's an interesting idea because I'm in here every fucking day with guys like you and whoever likes me or celebrities and I think I know something and I'm always fucking wrong and it's sort of fascinating to me how we judge people
Marc:Does it do any service to that?
Marc:I mean, is there something socially relevant about the show?
Marc:No, it's for fun.
Guest:It's for fun.
Guest:No, we don't sit there.
Guest:There's no PBS moment.
Guest:Your dad's not there going, I understand.
Guest:I'll put it like this.
Guest:My dad was still alive when I did Dancing with the Stars.
Guest:And so I got eliminated.
Guest:My father, he wrote me.
Guest:An email, he said, shall I mobilize the troops?
Guest:Is it because you're just too good looking and you have a Yale education that these bastards are jealous of you?
Guest:I was like, no, not really, dad, thanks.
Guest:But it was very sweet.
Guest:In these moments, I was like, my dad loves me.
Guest:In a twisted, inappropriate way, but he loves me.
Marc:Well, no, it's nice when you can see through it when they get to that point where they get past their competitiveness and their own dumb pride.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:When you have a certain type of father, you got to find those moments of weakness where you're like, oh, he likes me.
Guest:Well, you have to read way between the lines.
Guest:And by the way, that email was not a joke.
Guest:Right.
Guest:He wasn't being funny.
Guest:This is when he lost?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:He wasn't being funny.
Marc:I mean, he was absolutely serious.
Marc:Yeah, he was coming to your defense.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Clearly, this is another...
Guest:Another example.
Guest:Well, the white man has denied my son.
Guest:And I was like, pipe down, Dan.
Marc:But anyway.
Marc:Well, good.
Marc:Well, man, it was great talking to you, and it was a lot of fun.
Marc:Big fan of the show.
Guest:Oh, thank you.
Guest:Judd Apatow.
Guest:I've listened to that interview like three or four times.
Guest:Judd used to hang around in Living Color.
Guest:I'm sure.
Guest:And he'd try and give jokes to you.
Guest:Sure.
Marc:He sat there going like, I'm going to be the biggest thing in Hollywood comedy.
Guest:No.
Guest:Well, I finally did a Judd Apatow movie.
Guest:I did The Big Sick.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:I saw that.
Marc:You were great.
Marc:That was great.
Marc:Well, it's a very small role.
Marc:Yeah, but it's an important role.
Marc:The club owner is the important role.
Marc:The coked up club owner or club manager.
Guest:Oh, he's not the owner.
Marc:He's the club manager.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:Who does stand up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Isn't that in every club?
Guest:Like the dude who is there that no one thinks is funny.
Guest:Right.
Marc:But they know they need him.
Marc:He controls everything.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:You know, that whole system has gotten a little exhausted, you know, because you can sort of circumvent it now.
Marc:The one guy in the town that's deciding whether or not you get on stage.
Marc:But they still exist.
Marc:Well, that... Anyway, Emily Gordon... And you know what?
Marc:They're the biggest fucking criminals.
Marc:They are the fucking monsters.
Guest:Well, they've been hacked by Russia.
Marc:Everybody has.
Marc:but emily gordon she was a writer yeah she's great on the carmichael show she told me she was doing a movie i was like great your little movie i'll do it she's like okay so that's how it came about i didn't know did you like the movie when you watched it of course it was awesome you know what's awesome about it is like you you watch it and you're like there's no way this was made up you know and it's so rare to see something translated like that like a very unique love story that the darkness of it is so real
Guest:The only thing they didn't capture is that.
Guest:So Emily is one of the happiest people I've ever met.
Guest:Like so joyous that I stopped her.
Guest:This is how the conversation started.
Guest:Why are you so fucking happy?
Guest:And she goes, because everybody should be, because it's an amazing day.
Guest:And I'm like, no really, cut the bullshit.
Guest:Why?
Guest:And she told me the story.
Guest:Well, you know, I almost died.
Guest:And I'm like, you're lying.
Guest:And she goes, no.
Guest:I wrote a book about it and blah, blah, blah.
Guest:And I'm like, what?
Guest:And she goes, yeah.
Guest:And we wrote a script about it.
Guest:And I'm like, what?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know?
Guest:And I was like, knee jerk.
Guest:Yeah, I'll do it.
Guest:She goes, really?
Guest:I said, yeah, I'll do anything.
Guest:So that's what happened.
Marc:It's great.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's great.
Guest:Congratulations to them.
Marc:You're a busy man and it's good.
Marc:I got to go to work.
Marc:You do?
Marc:Where are you going?
Guest:I'm going back home.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:To just chill.
Guest:Do you live nearby?
Guest:I do not.
Guest:Now, I have questions.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I live in the Hollywood Hills, but what is this neighborhood?
Marc:Highland Park.
Marc:Highland Park.
Marc:You'll get back easy.
Marc:So are you going to go to the 134 or something?
Marc:Yeah, but is it Glendale?
Guest:No.
Marc:Oh, you're close.
Marc:It's sort of between Pasadena and Glendale.
Marc:Highland Park.
Guest:This is a hip little pocket here.
Marc:Yeah, it's a nice little shtetl of hipsters.
Guest:How long have you been here?
Marc:I've been here since 2004, and it's a nice little neighborhood.
Marc:I didn't know anything about the neighborhood.
Marc:I was driving a guy around who was looking to rent a house, and I saw this house for sale, and I had a little deal money.
Marc:I'd never bought a house before.
Marc:I'm like, that one seems good.
Marc:And when I first moved here, and I was driving back and forth in the comedy store, I'm like, where the fuck do I live?
Guest:What did I do?
Marc:But now it's like, fuck it.
Marc:It's great, man.
Marc:I'm glad we talked.
Guest:Absolutely.
Marc:Funny guy.
Marc:Definitely paid his dues.
Marc:Definitely deserves all the work he gets and works a lot.
Marc:David Alan Greer.
Marc:It was very nice having him here.
Marc:You can always go to WTFPod.com for all your WTFPod needs.
Marc:Seems a lot of people don't check there before they tell me to have a guest on.
Marc:WTFpod.com slash podcast will get you a search bar where you can search all 800 and however many episodes.
Marc:All right?
Marc:You dig it?
Marc:I believe I may be talking to Vice President Al Gore next week.
Marc:That should be exciting and harrowing and scary.
Marc:but informative.
Marc:Hopefully infused with a bit of hope.
Marc:Should we play some guitar?
Marc:I'm set up.
Marc:Everything's clean.
Marc:Some nice stuff, not too crazy.
Marc:Probably something I've done before.
Marc:Why not?
Marc:Why not do it?
Marc:Why not?
Marc:Why not?
Why not?
Thank you.
Marc:Boomer Lives!