Episode 728 - Brian Scolaro
Marc:Lock the gates!
Marc:All right, let's do this.
Marc:How are you?
Marc:What the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fuck in here is what the fucksters?
Marc:What the fuck is happening?
Marc:Welcome to the show.
Marc:This is WTF.
Marc:This is my podcast.
Marc:It's your first time listening.
Marc:Hi.
Marc:Nice to see you.
Marc:Go ahead.
Marc:Have a seat with everybody else wherever you are on this planet.
Marc:Go ahead.
Marc:Sit down wherever you're going to sit down.
Marc:Just hang out.
Marc:Listen, feels like you're in the room, doesn't it?
Marc:We're all just hanging out.
Marc:All right.
Marc:What?
Marc:OK, look, Brian Scalero is on the show today.
Marc:And Brian Scalero is one of my favorite comics to watch.
Marc:Always makes me laugh.
Marc:This guy.
Marc:forever i like those goofy guys he's a pretty goofy guy but there's a there's a existential intensity to it he's a naturally funny cranky guy and i like that because when i'm cranky not always funny you know i'm saying
Marc:You know what I'm saying.
Marc:If anybody knows what I'm saying, it's you guys.
Marc:So look, some dates added.
Marc:Look, these Boston dates, they're not for a while, but they're selling pretty good.
Marc:I'm excited about it, but I think I should give you a heads up about it.
Marc:September 24th, I'll be at the Wilbur.
Marc:I'll be at Stand Up Live in Phoenix, August 20th.
Marc:Two shows, one night there, Saturday.
Marc:Probably get tickets for that.
Marc:I'm not that big in Phoenix.
Marc:I'll be in my hometown of Albuquerque, New Mexico, September 3rd.
Marc:You can go to wtfpod.com slash tour for links to all of these shows.
Marc:I'll be at the Comedy Club in Rochester, New York, September 9th and 10th for four shows.
Marc:And the Wilbur on the 24th of September.
Marc:College Street Music Hall on September 25th.
Marc:Troy Savings Bank Music Hall, October 14th.
Marc:The Carolina Theater, November 17th.
Marc:The Vic Theater in Chicago, December 3rd for two shows.
Marc:Ridgefield, Connecticut at the Ridgefield Playhouse.
Marc:That is October 13th.
Marc:Pushing it out there a bit.
Marc:What is happening?
Marc:I appreciate some of the input that I got over the last few days when I was talking about anger and about, you know, having a lifelong struggle with anger.
Marc:I'll read a couple emails from you folks.
Marc:I don't mind doing that.
Marc:This one subject line containing the lava.
Marc:Dear Mark, first of all, love your show.
Marc:Second of all, in your most recent podcast, you mentioned your continuing struggle with containing the lava, quote unquote, of your anger and rage that will bubble up in moments of intimacy, which sounds extremely familiar to me as I have suffered this problem in the past as well.
Marc:After talking about it with a counselor, friends and my fiance, I've come to a few realizations and steps that help manage this process.
Marc:Now I'm stepping out of the email for a second.
Marc:I've read about this.
Marc:I've done a lot of research.
Marc:I understand a lot of things.
Marc:Putting things into practice, not so easy.
Marc:See, what I usually do is just shove it down, behave differently, which is on some level all you can do without necessarily doing the work underneath.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Just getting by.
Marc:All right, back to the email.
Marc:So two things to think about when considering the concept of anger.
Marc:One, it is a stick of dynamite, and when it goes off, it is all-encompassing and cannot be controlled.
Okay.
Marc:That is true.
Marc:Sounds a little bit like Bernie supporters at this point.
Marc:Some of them.
Marc:Two, it is a secondary emotion.
Marc:Secondary is in all caps.
Marc:Anger is caused by one of the three primary emotions which occur before that dynamite goes off.
Marc:One, fear.
Marc:Two, frustration.
Marc:Three, hurt.
Marc:Most people will not even acknowledge any of those first three emotions and just jump straight into anger.
Marc:Doing so is essentially detonating the dynamite with the push of a button.
Marc:Yeah, I know, man.
Marc:I know.
Marc:I know I got it.
Marc:I got that button.
Marc:However, when confronted with fear or frustration or hurt, this essentially adds a timer to the dynamite and gives you time to address those primary emotions first, or as I call it,
Marc:diffusing the bomb naturally this idea seems simple until you're confronted by one of the big three but if you make a conscious decision of treating the primary emotions first the bomb will not go off as a person with a really short fuse i have found these steps to be extremely helpful and i rarely blow up at anyone anymore please excuse all the awful bomb puns and keep up the good work your fan richard
Marc:richard i gotta say upon reading this email i feel fear frustration and hurt you didn't cause the hurt but i'm a little hurt that i'm at this age i haven't dealt with some of this shit i'm frustrated because this sounds right to me and i'm frightened because well i don't want to deal with the the other things underneath
Marc:God damn it, Richard.
Marc:God damn it.
Marc:Thank you is what I meant to say.
Marc:What came out?
Marc:See what I did there?
Marc:I was frustrated.
Marc:I said, God damn it, twice.
Marc:And like a magical spell, I diffused the anger because I knew what I was feeling was frustrated.
Marc:So listen.
Marc:As you know, I don't do much politics anymore, and there's a reason.
Marc:I think most of you know where I stand for the most part, basically.
Marc:But here's what happens in my head.
Marc:Now, this is what happens.
Marc:This is my head.
Marc:This is how my head works.
Marc:Look, sometimes an open mind is great.
Marc:Sometimes if your mind is too open, people can dump garbage in it.
Marc:And if your open mind is not fortified by being grounded and understanding the risks of having an open mind, you can walk around with garbage head.
Marc:Here's what happens.
Marc:OK, so I watch the Republican National Convention, watched a little bit of the Democratic National Convention.
Marc:And I'm laying in bed the other night and I'm thinking like, all right.
Marc:And here's the thing.
Marc:That guy was right a little bit.
Marc:You know, I'm upset about the world.
Marc:But I'm also, you know, I think I'm a little skittish because I'm coming up on 17 years sober in August.
Marc:And as you get towards those occasions, there's a little part of your brain left that's still like, hey, man, birthday, that sober birthday, that sober anniversary is coming up.
Marc:Oh, fuck.
Marc:Can you believe we're fucking 17 years sober?
Marc:Let's go.
Marc:Let's just go fucking.
Marc:Let's go ruin something.
Marc:Let's ruin something somehow.
Marc:So I think got a little of that going on in the, you know, in the in the subconscious and the river, the rage river.
Marc:But getting back to the way my brain works, my head hits the pillow the other night, and I'm thinking like I'm laying there in Los Angeles, some of which is burning, but I think they're getting that under control.
Marc:And I just start thinking, I don't know where it started.
Marc:Donald Trump had mentioned the...
Marc:that there's going to be a nuclear terrorist attack.
Marc:And then I started thinking about, like, you know, were the Russians helping Donald Trump by releasing these or hacking the DNC, you know, against Hillary Clinton?
Marc:Were the Russians helping Trump?
Marc:Does Putin love Trump or Putin and Trump palsy-walsy?
Marc:Are they talking on the phone?
Marc:Is Putin looking for a sort of totalitarian bro-bud to kind of talk shop with?
Marc:As a global leader, is Putin trying to make Trump a franchise of what's left of the Russian ideology?
Marc:Do they have common ground in the way they think about ruling or governing?
Marc:Is this happening?
Marc:Is Putin going to subvert the entire world and American election and global safety by maybe helping Donald out by slipping some sort of renegade nuclear device onto a boat that they park outside of Santa Monica and they just fucking take L.A.
Marc:off the map?
Marc:So I'm just sitting there going like Putin's going to blow Los Angeles up to help Trump win the election.
Marc:And I couldn't sleep for a little while.
Marc:And then I started thinking, like, I bet you there's a lot of people in this country, specifically people who support a certain ideology, that would be like, well, no great loss, right?
Marc:So what?
Marc:We won't have movies or television or Disneyland or The Beach or Santa Monica or a lot of celebrities.
Marc:We wouldn't have a lot of exciting television options.
Marc:They'd be thrilled.
Marc:They'd be like, good riddance, those manipulators of the real thing.
Marc:Those people that put nothing but garbage into our heads.
Marc:They'd fucking just be.
Marc:And then the world would scramble.
Marc:It'd be a panic.
Marc:We lost a major American city and everybody would be freaked out.
Marc:And Trump would be like, I can handle it.
Marc:And Putin would be secretly laughing in his pajamas and talking to Trump in his pajamas at night going, did it go good?
Marc:And Trump goes, beautiful, baby.
Marc:I was perfect.
Marc:I don't know how to do it, Trump.
Marc:Anyway, see, this is how my brain works.
Marc:So if I'm not clear that that is my brain and not reality, then it becomes a problem.
Marc:And can my brain run away with me?
Marc:Sure, sure.
Marc:I'm very close to being one of the screamers on the floor of the Democratic National Convention.
Marc:Of course, I'm very prone to allowing my mind to run away with me and then to make it true.
Marc:A lot of things that's happened in the last five years that keep me from wandering the streets talking out loud to myself.
Marc:Drop it, Putin!
Marc:Gonna blow up Disneyland!
Marc:I'm never that far away from that.
Marc:Never far.
Marc:Woo!
Marc:I mean, you don't think that Trump and Putin are parking a nuclear device off the coast of L.A., do you?
Marc:I mean, they wouldn't do that, right?
Marc:I mean...
Marc:My guest today is somebody that I go back with a bit, had a little tension at the beginning, but I always love watching him.
Marc:This guy always fucking makes me laugh.
Marc:He's a very funny comedian.
Guest:Let's go now to my conversation with Brian Scolero.
Marc:Brian Scalero.
Marc:I don't need to say people's names because I'll do an intro, but I wanted to acknowledge that I know your full name and that you're here in the garage.
Guest:Yeah, I'm here.
Marc:I'm really excited about it.
Marc:I didn't want you to be nervous.
Guest:I was a little nervous.
Guest:I was nervous, but I was like, well, you know, from Obama to Scalero.
Guest:Hey, look, he went from Obama to Rich Voss, buddy.
Guest:Ha, ha, ha, ha.
Marc:Yeah, within two fucking episodes.
Marc:So I think you should move that worry out of the way.
Marc:Okay, okay.
Marc:But I was trying to think, man.
Marc:I mean, I've known you a long time, I guess.
Marc:Right?
Guest:I think we met in 95 at the old Gotham Comedy Club.
Guest:Oh, I remember that today.
Guest:Yeah, I remember.
Guest:It was a while ago.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But you were one of the first guys I met.
Guest:I think I met you before I really took it seriously, comedy, when I was doing pre-shows and stuff.
Guest:I met you and like Geraldo in the same week.
Guest:At the Old Gotham.
Guest:The Old Gotham, 22nd Street.
Marc:Yeah, the one on 22nd Street.
Marc:It was thin.
Guest:Yeah, and everybody would park.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then while the show was going on, they would tow all their cars.
Guest:Do you remember that?
Guest:You could be parked there between 10 and 11 p.m.
Guest:for some reason.
Guest:It was horrible.
Marc:Yeah, and that was like... I'm trying to remember...
Marc:Right, so I met you there.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And so 95, so... I haven't known you in at least 21 years.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Holy fucking shit.
Guest:No, actually, I met you way before that.
Guest:You probably remember.
Guest:We talked about this on WTF episode 100 or 101.
Marc:The live one?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:But you had on Comedy Central, it might have been Comedy Channel still,
Guest:you had a uh a pilot called the mark marron project that's right for hbo downtown yeah right i had graduated uh college in 95 yeah and my first intern job right was as a pa on your show really with robert small yeah uh he produced it yeah yeah robert small that's the guy i was working with robert small productions right right so then uh that's how i got with hbo downtown so how'd you get that job
Guest:Just because I thought maybe if I did behind the scenes, they would say, well, that guy's funny.
Marc:Yeah, throw him on camera.
Guest:Yeah, but that never would have happened.
Marc:Of course it could happen.
Guest:Never happened.
Guest:Happens all the time.
Guest:It happens to like Biff Henderson and people like that, but like people who can't.
Guest:Well, usually don't talk.
Marc:Stand that guy over there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Move the plant.
Guest:Put that guy there.
Guest:At some point, I had lost my shit and just quit the job.
Guest:Really, really traumatic.
Marc:Well, that was like, I guess that was me on the way out because I was a pilot after short attention span theater.
Marc:You're right.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So that's what, because you became a, you were, you were working down there at HBO downtown.
Marc:HBO downtown.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Right.
Marc:After I left.
Marc:Yeah, because if that was your first job, the pilot, I think that was like my swan song because they hadn't invented the Daily Show.
Marc:No.
Marc:So we were all up for it.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:You know, that was a pilot.
Marc:They were looking for a show.
Guest:That's what it was.
Guest:So we shot that.
Guest:Wow.
Marc:Yeah, and Dave Chappelle was my guest.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And Steven Weber.
Marc:Yes, he was.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And we did bits.
Marc:There were bits.
Marc:And Chuck Sklar was one of the writers.
Guest:And you had a little wheel that you'd spin.
Marc:That was a great bit.
Guest:Yeah, and whatever would stop on, you would riff on it.
Marc:That was the Chris Kelly who went on to write for Politically Incorrect for years.
Marc:Right.
Marc:We broke down the format of monologue jokes.
Marc:So what you would do is that you like how they work.
Marc:You know, there's a setup and then a twist.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So we put all the setups.
Marc:I'm trying to figure out how that wheel works.
Guest:Yeah, I think you either threw a dart or it stopped or something.
Marc:No, it's spin.
Marc:You'd spin it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And then you'd, I think you, I remember it was, you'd take one thing and compare it to another thing.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:So like you'd spin it twice.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And then you'd have to build a joke out of that.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:I loved that bit.
Guest:You know what I was doing when you were doing that?
Guest:What?
Guest:What?
Guest:Was new so all I saw was a little colored pieces of tape on the floor.
Guest:Yeah, and I was like well Nobody's telling me what to do.
Guest:I should probably pick up all these pieces of tape right me Well, they were your marks, and I was I was taking them away from you I tried to do a good job And then I stood outside with jelly beans for the audience members and
Guest:Oh, good.
Guest:So at one point, you came outside and you were like, dude, that was... And I was like, no, it was good.
Guest:We haven't even met you.
Guest:You're like, no, I don't know.
Guest:Really?
Guest:And I was like, yeah, it was very funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I thought it was very funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that was like the prime target audience member for those shows.
Marc:And I was already like leaning on you.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:I don't think I get the laughs I wanted.
Guest:But that was the first time I met you.
Guest:So where did you grow up?
Guest:Queens.
Guest:I was born in Brooklyn, and then it was Brooklyn and Queens.
Guest:Long time in Queens.
Guest:Really?
Guest:So at that point, I was living in Queens.
Guest:Like what part of Queens?
Guest:Well, Glendale, which is next to Forest Hills.
Guest:So I'd have to walk through the really nice Forest Hills to get to the subway to go to my college, high school.
Guest:And then I'd go back, walk through the really Jody and Ferraro houses, and then go to my shit apartment.
Guest:And your parents lived there?
Guest:My parents lived there, yeah, my brother.
Guest:So you got one brother?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:One brother and two parents.
Guest:Queens.
Guest:Queens.
Guest:It's an area between Long Island and Brooklyn where there's two separate personalities, and Queens is like, we're right here.
Marc:Yeah, we're just trying to keep our own identity.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, Brooklyn's pretty heavy, and Long Island's pretty heavy, and the further out you get on Long Island, the heavier it gets, right?
Marc:It does, right?
Marc:Then you get to Montauk, and it's nice again.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, but they don't let the crazies in there.
Marc:Yeah, the crazy sort of, what does it happen?
Marc:The crazy sort of gets thin and then the rich people come, right?
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And couldn't they get there and they complain about the crazies?
Marc:Right.
Marc:That guy working at the gas station is out of his mind.
Marc:You're a visitor here.
Marc:Fuck you.
Marc:But your voice is not necessarily Queen's.
Marc:It used to be.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I almost threw up.
Guest:I'm really sorry.
Guest:You almost threw up just then?
Guest:Right there.
Guest:But I used to have a very heavy accent.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I sounded like, remember the little kids in Jaws?
Guest:Come on, Dad, a little longer.
Guest:Get out of the boat.
Guest:That's what I sound like.
Guest:I got bit by a vampire.
Guest:But that was exactly what I looked like and exactly what I sounded like.
Guest:And then I guess being here for 15 years, it kind of like melded into this.
Guest:Did it?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, when I met you, you already sounded like Blair and Scarrow.
Marc:You think so?
Marc:I think so.
Marc:I had a deep voice.
Marc:I mean, I think there's a little Queens at the end of your sentences.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:Patrice used to imitate me.
Guest:He would just be like... Just sounds?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:He would just do a deep voice.
Marc:Isn't it funny how we talk about Patrice?
Marc:Oh, Patrice used to shit on me, too.
Marc:That was a compliment from Patrice.
Marc:Like, oh, yeah.
Marc:He paid attention enough to work something out to hurt me.
Guest:He used to call me Patton Oswalt.
Guest:Oh, he did?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's like, look, fuck up Patton Oswalt over here.
Guest:Then eventually he learned my name.
Guest:I was like, I made it, you know?
Marc:So the idea was to be an actor first when you were a kid?
Guest:Yeah, it was weird.
Guest:When I was in, I would say, first grade, my father would show us Marx Brothers and Laurel and Hardy.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:Was your dad an old guy?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, no, he's old now still.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:How old are you?
Guest:You're 10 years younger than me.
Guest:I'm 42, yeah.
Marc:And I'm 52.
Marc:Oh, right, right.
Marc:So your dad was a Marx Brothers fan?
Guest:Yeah, so we grew up watching that.
Marc:On Channel 11?
Guest:No, he had them on VHS.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:And I always remember, because you know Duck Soup, one of the greatest movies of all time.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:In order for us to watch the VHS, my father didn't want to get up.
Guest:We didn't have remote controls.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So he didn't want to press fast forward.
Guest:He would just leave the last five minutes of the movie before it.
Guest:and it was On Borrowed Time.
Guest:Did you ever see On Borrowed Time?
Guest:No.
Guest:It's a movie where there's death is in a tree, a little kid climbs a tree, and then he's supposed to die.
Guest:So the little kid dies at the end.
Guest:So we had to watch the little kid fall from a tree and die.
Guest:Then he goes to heaven going, Grandma, and then Duck Soup would start.
Guest:So it was like- Every time you watched it.
Guest:If he wanted happiness, he had to go through a little bit of pain first, which is the Scolaro family through and through.
Marc:And your dad's still around, though?
Guest:Yeah, yeah, luckily.
Guest:Yeah, and your mom?
Guest:Yeah, everybody's still around.
Guest:That's great.
Guest:Yeah, I've been very lucky.
Guest:They're also really fun, ridiculous people.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's nice.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And where's your brother?
Guest:He lives in New York.
Guest:And it's your little brother?
Guest:He's older, and he does not like to be talked about.
Guest:He's not on Facebook.
Guest:He's not on any social media.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:He does not want to be discussed.
Guest:So we're not discussing your brother.
Guest:I'm not telling you.
Guest:I'm just kind of telling everybody my brother's interesting.
Guest:He's like, I don't exist.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Well, he thinks he's like a spy, but meanwhile, he just works the job, you know?
Guest:He thinks he's a spy?
Guest:Everyone's out to get him?
Guest:Yeah, pretty much.
Guest:I think he's right, though.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:He's that kind of guy?
Guest:Some people don't like him.
Guest:Some people like me.
Guest:It's always weird when you meet people that don't like you.
Guest:Like, what did I do to upset you?
Marc:It's usually based on some... With me, like...
Marc:I remember you and I had... Not tension, but... At least 20 years ago, I didn't know.
Guest:I was like, yeah, I upset.
Marc:No way.
Marc:How would you know?
Marc:It was great.
Marc:Because we'll come back around that.
Marc:You started doing comedy around the same time my ex-wife did, I think.
Guest:I was a little above her on the food chain.
Guest:But you knew her.
Guest:Yeah, I knew about her, yeah.
Marc:Right, and I'm trying to remember...
Marc:It must have been like 99.
Marc:It must have been before it was okay for me to be touching her ass in public.
Guest:No, I was brand new.
Guest:And all I knew was Mark Maron.
Guest:I looked up to you.
Guest:And then I just knew that there was this...
Guest:young, sensitive girl that I was just becoming friends with.
Guest:Wasn't even interested in her.
Guest:To me, she was out of my league, so I wasn't.
Guest:She felt like she was out of everyone's league.
Guest:I was amazed I got her.
Guest:I'm still amazed.
Guest:So I was just like, there's no chance of me being with her.
Guest:But I was like, she was brand new, and she felt impressionable.
Guest:She would always ask me advice questions.
Guest:So when your hand was on her ass, I was like, you would let him do that?
Guest:I was learning.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I was brand new in the business.
Marc:So if he tries to do that to me, it's okay?
Guest:Yeah, that's what I was saying.
Guest:But my experience in the real world was even limited.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I used to work with mentally retarded people.
Guest:You did?
Guest:Yeah, and that's all.
Guest:I worked at college, and then there was mentally retarded people, and then there was day one on the job, and a guy I admire is filling up a girl that's always asking me for advice.
Guest:I didn't know what to say.
Marc:I wasn't feeling her up.
Marc:That would be different.
Guest:Okay, and you're absolutely right.
Guest:Yeah, you were.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, and it must have been when we were sort of on the down low.
Marc:I couldn't imagine it was like out and out.
Guest:No, that's why I thought you were still married at that point.
Guest:I probably was still married at that point.
Guest:That's why I said something.
Guest:What a scumbag.
Guest:That guy's married.
Guest:I was like, do you know he's married?
Guest:That's what I said.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It was a long time ago.
Guest:And then when you brought it up to me, I was like, I realized she had told you, and it became this probably rolling snowball thing bigger than it was.
Marc:No, I remember you being around because I actually remember you...
Marc:At the bar at the cellar even.
Marc:I remember the night I met her.
Marc:I didn't really know her.
Marc:I met her briefly with Artie Fuqua.
Marc:She was just this live wire running around all pretty and kooky.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And then, like, I remember, like, the way I tell the story is I was holding court at the comedy cellar, rambling on, having one of those conversations, like, oh, I'll start it with Pryor, you know?
Marc:And I think you were there.
Marc:I mean, in my mind, you were there when she walked up to me and said, you look, you're Marc Maron.
Guest:At that point, I was so brand new, I wouldn't have even stepped in the cellar.
Guest:The point is, everybody thinks we don't like each other because we have this history, and that's like a tiny book.
Marc:I never didn't like you.
Marc:Always thought you were funny.
Marc:Never, never didn't like you.
Marc:You thought I didn't like you.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, that makes sense.
Marc:Oh, that.
Marc:Let's go down that list.
Guest:The people that Brian thinks don't like him.
Guest:Because you used to come up to me and say, you're going to do the garbage truck joke?
Marc:People always think that I'm being condescending.
Marc:It's not my fault if you don't like the joke.
Marc:If I like it... You know, I went up to...
Marc:I mean, like, I want to hear... Oh, it's so funny.
Marc:But it's true, isn't it?
Marc:I know that people do it to me, too.
Marc:Like, I went up to Joe Mattarise once.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I, you know, granted, I may not be up to speed on anyone's evolution as a comic.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But, like, I remember a joke.
Marc:I want to hear the joke.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Even as a comic, I don't take in... I'm not empathetic enough to realize, like, that joke might be 10 years ago.
Guest:Shame to that joke.
Guest:See, I know exactly what happened because I look at it... I see younger comics now who feature for me or whatever.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they'll walk away 90% of the time with a good experience.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But 10%, something I said, confused them where they thought it was evil.
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Oh, right, right.
Guest:And so that's, and then they'll post it online, Brian's going to say this, and I have to find the number and go, dude, I didn't mean it like that.
Guest:Oh, could you take the post out?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So it's like with that, with you, was I admired you so much.
Guest:Because I really did.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Oh, so you thought I was being a dick.
Guest:I thought you were like... Because I was self-aware of that joke compared to your good writing.
Guest:Oh, no.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:But you're just funny.
Marc:You're naturally funny.
Marc:I mean, I couldn't... I'm a nervous maniac.
Marc:But you're like... It's a rare thing.
Marc:Thanks, by the way.
Marc:Yeah, but it's a rare thing.
Marc:Like, you know, you're just going to get up there and you're going to be funny even if you're just standing there.
Marc:Me, I got work.
Guest:The way you've been wrapping up everything at the store, it's fantastic the way it all wraps up the stool bit.
Guest:It's wonderful how it all ends.
Guest:It's like a weird, perverted ballet.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Well, I'm trying to do that more because I don't like joke to joke.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I like going long form, but it's nice if you can start weaving things back in and back.
Marc:It's nothing new.
Guest:Yeah, but that's great.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:That's a talent I don't have yet.
Marc:You could if you wanted.
Marc:I'd have to really concentrate.
Marc:Here's what you do.
Marc:You do the garbage truck at the beginning, and then at the end, in another joke.
Marc:Did I do the same sound?
Marc:Yeah, but just as an aside in another joke.
Marc:Fucking genius.
Marc:So then the guy says, did you shit your pants?
Guest:And in the back, he called it back.
Guest:That's the first invention of the callback.
Guest:But I've been admiring what you've been doing.
Guest:You've been really fucking... I mean, moving on from that weird Mishnah topic.
Guest:I like the weird Mishnah topic.
Marc:Did you?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know, it's weird.
Marc:It's been so long.
Marc:I literally haven't seen her in like seven or eight years, which is fine.
Marc:But let's go back to you.
Okay.
Marc:So you're walking by Geraldine Ferraro's house.
Guest:I wanted to answer your question.
Guest:To get to school.
Guest:Acting or comedy.
Guest:That's what you're talking about.
Marc:We're back at home.
Marc:We saw the kid fall out of a tree.
Marc:We're watching Duck Soup.
Marc:Was your dad one of those guys that would laugh every time at the Marx Brothers?
Guest:Yeah, but I think seeing it through our eyes, my brother and I's eyes, it was more fun.
Guest:Like, I really get a kick.
Guest:Whatever girl I'm dating before she figures out what a mess I am and takes off, I always show them.
Marc:She can't tell that right away?
Guest:No.
Guest:That's wild.
Guest:Well, they usually can't.
Guest:Most of them can.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But the ones that can't, the ones that are a little dumber or crazier, like my level, it takes them a couple more weeks.
Yeah.
Guest:But I would show them a martial movie.
Guest:And the ones that really enjoy it, like when somebody's laughing at Harpo, you know they have a good soul.
Guest:Right, right, right.
Guest:And so when somebody's laughing at Grouchy, you know they have a little rough edge to them, you know?
Guest:You can read a person.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And if they don't laugh, you go, I don't know what this is.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I'm trying to think, like, because my grandfather liked slapstick, but that was slightly more elevated than slapstick because there was such a... Anarchist.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And, you know, Groucho was such a, you know, sharp wit.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And Harpro was, like, you know, the... Pantomime.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And then Chico was just...
Marc:This working class character.
Marc:And he was an idiot.
Marc:I guess so.
Marc:He was an idiot.
Guest:Yeah, so those three together, it was like a constant barrage.
Guest:When we were a kid, you'd play keep away.
Guest:You'd play Saludji.
Guest:Keep away, you'd keep somebody's hat and you'd throw them.
Guest:Keep away, keep away.
Guest:That's what I feel the Marx Brothers did with their movies.
Guest:They were like, well, we're taking this movie.
Guest:We're kidnapping this movie for an hour.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we'll give it back to you at the end.
Marc:I'd like to watch it again because I remember my grandfather loved it when I was a little kid.
Marc:And I didn't...
Marc:I don't mind slapstick, but it didn't immediately register with me.
Marc:What it registered with me was more like the guys that do the kind of comedy you do, which is sort of slightly cranky, sad sack guys.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, that was the shit that got me.
Marc:Or hostile comics.
Guest:Like W.C.
Guest:Fields or Archie Bunker?
Marc:Like Jackie Vernon, Archie Bunker.
Marc:I think W.C.
Marc:Field, if it didn't register, is really old to me.
Marc:I had a hard time.
Marc:I was very fascinated with black and white stuff, but it always seemed like I was watching dead people.
Marc:Well, you are.
Marc:I know.
Guest:I watch a movie now, and there's a dog, and I go, that dog's way dead.
Guest:I never think about that.
Guest:I do all the time.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah, I go, that dog.
Guest:Because you know what Bill Murray looks like now.
Guest:So if I'm watching Stripes and there's a dog in it, I go, that dog is way dead.
Marc:Of course the dog's dead.
Guest:Where is it?
Guest:Where is it buried?
Guest:Was it cremated?
Guest:Well, that shit interests me.
Marc:Buddy Hackett I liked.
Marc:Yeah, he was great.
Marc:But I watch those movies.
Marc:But it's interesting that it registered with you.
Marc:Like Laurel and Hardy, I could understand.
Guest:I love Laurel and Hardy.
Guest:What Laurel and Hardy did, this might sound boring.
Guest:It's not as interesting as the- No, it's not boring.
Marc:I've never talked about Laurel and Hardy on here except with Dick Van Dyke.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:Maybe one other person.
Guest:He really admired Stan Laurel.
Guest:But he went and visited him.
Guest:Yeah, I know.
Guest:And he basically mimicked him in a movie.
Guest:Found him in the film.
Guest:Yeah, the comic, right?
Guest:The comedian.
Guest:But if you look at what bust the key- This is what I try to do with scripts when somebody gives me a script.
Guest:You try to find five laughs in one line.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:When I first started, I was like, as long as I say the line.
Guest:Who said that?
Guest:I did.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm talking to you right now.
Guest:This is me.
Marc:No, but you've got to find five laughs in one line.
Marc:That was your own rule.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, in the beginning, on the first sitcom I did, they'd give me a line.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I would say the line, and the audience would go, yay.
Guest:And then I'd say three years later, I'm like, oh, if I stop the line here, I can get two laughs out of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So then they progressed.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So you break down each paragraph they give you and try to get more laughs.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like Big Bang Theory, those guys do that.
Guest:You'll notice that they'd stop a line.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So Buster Keaton, I felt like, would throw himself down a flight of stairs.
Guest:His foot would go in a bucket, and he'd fall down the stairs.
Guest:And it was brilliant because it was really him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But then when sound came in, Laurel and Hardy had to figure out what can we do with this.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They're like, well, let's slow down the fall.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Let's make five laughs on this one fall.
Guest:Like, we'll have Stan put the bucket on top of the stairs.
Guest:Ollie is walking, doesn't see the bucket, almost puts his foot in it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's a laugh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He does it again.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Second laugh.
Guest:Then he finally puts his foot in it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Then he falls down the stairs.
Guest:That's three laughs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then there's this whole 30-second sequence where he's just staring at Stan Laurel like,
Guest:instead of Laurel just trying to kind of hide behind a pole.
Marc:The weird, like, awkward beat that goes on forever between the two of them.
Guest:So they got five laughs out of one fall.
Marc:Didn't Ollie, like, hit Laurel or play with his tie or something?
Marc:Was there a physicality to it?
Guest:Ollie would play with it.
Guest:He would hit him with his handle on it.
Guest:He'd stare at him.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, I think I like them better.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Marshmothers I like because they weren't slapstick even.
Guest:They were just anarchists.
Marc:No, I liked Groucho because, like, that's really how jokes are to be delivered.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, if you're going to do jokes, it sort of starts there.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Like, he could land those one-liners, man, right?
Guest:Well, you know, they would go on the road, and they would take five big scenes from the upcoming movie, and they would time out the laughs, and then Groucho would try different laughs.
Guest:He'd meet with the writers afterwards and be like, let's try a different word there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So they would test the scenes for Night of the Opera and Day of the Races.
Guest:Why?
Guest:In Vaudeville State?
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Or in the variety houses.
Guest:It's interesting.
Marc:Yeah, how'd you learn that?
Guest:The one books I do read are biographies of comedians.
Guest:I love it.
Guest:I got a Jack Benny one.
Guest:I got a George Carlin one.
Guest:The Jack Benny one's great?
Guest:Jack Benny one's really good.
Guest:It was written by one of his partners.
Guest:But it's just a lot of good stories about him on the road.
Marc:But all this technique is sort of interesting.
Marc:I never thought about... I know about making choices as an actor.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:You're great.
Marc:Yeah, but I don't ever think how many laughs can I get out of this line.
Marc:Now I'm going to have to think about that.
Guest:Well, you don't have to because your show's not like that.
Guest:Your show's like... Oh, yeah, that's right.
Guest:Your acting on the show is... I know it sounds like we're kissing your ass now, but I'm already here.
Guest:I'm already here.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You can just be honest.
Marc:Tell me how much you don't like me.
Guest:I do like it.
Marc:I can't believe you touched her ass.
Marc:I'm sorry.
Marc:It was inappropriate.
Marc:It was out of line.
Marc:I felt bad about it.
Marc:I should have been more honest with my wife quicker.
Marc:There's a lot of things.
Marc:I shouldn't have fucking touched her ass.
Marc:You know, dude, it would have saved me a lot of darkness and aggravation, but I don't know if I hadn't touched her ass if I'd ever have this fucking podcast.
Marc:It was a good time.
Marc:I would have ever gotten out of that marriage, the first marriage.
Marc:I would have had kids living in Queens doing some sort of local TV show if it still existed.
Marc:Or being dead.
Guest:Probably dead.
Guest:Being fucked up on coke.
Guest:Well, the person you want now is fantastic.
Guest:I was thinking about that the other day.
Guest:Tom Rhodes and I were talking about it.
Guest:What?
Guest:Like, you sent me that very nice email.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was like, and Tom was sitting next to me when it happened.
Guest:We were playing some fucking laundromat.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like, it was just like, ugh, horrible.
Guest:We're playing a laundromat.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so I'm looking at the email.
Guest:He goes, what's that?
Guest:I go, no, Mark sent me a really nice email.
Guest:I go, man, he's really, doesn't he really change?
Guest:Like, since the time I've met him, he's done a whole 180.
Guest:And I always use that for proof.
Guest:When people, like, say, look.
Guest:How often does this come up, Brian?
Guest:No, that's proof for me.
Guest:Oh, right.
Guest:Not for everybody else.
Guest:People like addictions or somebody was a jerk, and then it's like, well, people change.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I'm like, well, I haven't known anybody has changed.
Guest:Like, I know one.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:One guy.
Guest:Yeah, I swear to God, I've known one.
Marc:Well, I think what happens is, like,
Marc:i don't know like people generally people say people don't really change and and a lot of times people don't change much but the one thing if you take drugs and alcohol out of the mix and that was amplifying all of your fucking negative traits right that's going to be a big change yeah but it took a long time for me to stop being an asshole to get humbled enough and see that's why i'd like to thank mishnah and and you know kind of pat myself on the back for patting her on the ass because i
Marc:I would not have been humbled and humiliated enough to get hold of myself and understand who I really am had that chick not had enough of me.
Marc:See that?
Guest:Who you are now is great.
Marc:It works out.
Marc:We all have our little things.
Marc:What's your thing?
Marc:Pot and food?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Surprise.
Guest:I'm surprised you got that.
Guest:Yeah, that's exactly what it is.
Marc:But you're not a gambler or that kind of shit?
Marc:No, no, no.
Marc:That's good.
Marc:Because you seem like a sweet guy.
Marc:Pot and food, those are sweet guy ones.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, not Coke and booze.
Guest:No.
Guest:Well, I mean, there's been Coke.
Guest:Yeah, sure.
Guest:There's been booze.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I remember driving home drunk from the Comedy Cellar in, like, 2001.
Guest:I had to do the left eye thing where you close the left eye.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:I'm on that little lane on the side of the 59th Street Bridge.
Guest:You know, there's one lane.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It's here and a river.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Like a big fall on the river.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And like a pole built in the 30s.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm like, I was just like, you just watch those headlights in front of you.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And I wound up sleeping at that guy's house.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just following him up.
Guest:But there's been bad nights.
Guest:Oh, man.
Guest:There's been bad.
Marc:Don't you remember when you're in that shit, when you're doing that, and you're like, this is a skill.
Marc:It was a challenge that had to be overcome.
Marc:Just you in the river.
Marc:That reminds me of the Joe Mattaris joke that I asked him to do that he got mad about.
Marc:When he was talking about old video games, he's like, you remember Pong?
Marc:And he goes, you remember there's that one level where it's just you and the wall?
Guest:That was it.
Guest:I liked it.
Guest:I haven't seen that joke in a while.
Guest:I remember I always liked your...
Guest:I still think about it, the rage passing on joke.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And somehow it ends up in the Middle East.
Guest:Right, right, right.
Guest:That was around the same time you were doing the Yamaka joke.
Guest:You're like, where are my people?
Guest:Oh, there they are.
Guest:With the hats.
Marc:I used to do jokes.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Holy shit.
Marc:All right, so there you are in Queens.
Marc:Are you Catholic-y?
Marc:Are you Italian-y?
Marc:It's a dumb joke, but my father was Catholic.
Guest:I went to a Catholic high school, but I went to a Lutheran grammar school.
Guest:Good balance.
Guest:My joke is that I was Catherine.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was awful.
Guest:I did that once.
Marc:But there's a good balance there.
Marc:Lutherans are a little more forgiving than the Catholics who are relentlessly unforgiving.
Guest:But it's just, I just, I don't know, man.
Guest:It was interesting.
Guest:It sets you with that tone of being a good person.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But you feel like a real jerk when you fall from that.
Marc:But you believe that it instilled some sort of humility around being nice to other people?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's good.
Guest:It also instilled the necessary tools you need for a comic, which is, fuck you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Where you question authority at all times.
Guest:I made a teacher quit.
Guest:I quit the business as teaching.
Guest:In Catholic school?
Guest:Yeah, I was a complete dick.
Guest:High school.
Guest:I was a dick.
Guest:There's a dick in me.
Guest:I know that.
Guest:No, no, I believe that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I would write plays about him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Wouldn't tell him there about him.
Guest:I'd go, can I read this to the class?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he'd be like, sure.
Guest:Then I'd go up and just read horrible insults about this man.
Guest:And he quit.
Guest:I don't know if he quit.
Guest:Did he cry?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I'm sure he cried at some point, but not in front of me.
Guest:But I was always being a jerk.
Guest:The library was on the first floor.
Guest:And I would come in the library and go, hi, Mrs. Hagelin.
Guest:And then I'd crawl out the window, run around the front of the school, and come back in the library and go, hi, Mrs. Hagelin.
Guest:And crawl out the window and run around.
Guest:What's going on?
Guest:Was she old?
Guest:Yeah, but she got pissed.
Guest:Like, I would do things that were cute at first and then pass them.
Marc:But were you doing them for anybody?
Guest:No, because in Marx Brothers, when you watch Marx Brothers, this is what fucked my head, I think.
Guest:Nobody on the screen is laughing at Groucho insulting people.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:So to me, as a kid watching that, I go, it doesn't matter if nobody's laughing as long as the joke's done.
Marc:See, there was not a kid who was like, watch, I'm going to do it again.
Marc:You didn't have that guy?
Guest:No, I didn't.
Guest:You were just doing it for your own entertainment?
Guest:It was my own weird personality.
Marc:Was it satisfying?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it made me look nuts.
Guest:I found out years later.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:How'd you find that out?
Guest:I remember talking to somebody, a friend from high school, and his friends never did anything in the school.
Guest:They just laughed to smoke weed.
Guest:And his friends were like, my friends thought you were crazy.
Guest:I'm like, really?
Guest:Well, I guess I was.
Guest:Because to me, there was an audience in my head watching.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And they were like, Brian, you got to say that.
Guest:It doesn't matter you're going to get a detention.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It doesn't matter nobody's going to laugh.
Guest:You have to say that.
Guest:And I still have it.
Guest:Like, I was sitting with this guy eating dinner.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he goes, yeah, my father's friend just passed.
Guest:He was a really good doctor.
Guest:I'm like, well, I guess he wasn't that good a doctor.
Guest:Why am I saying this to the person?
Guest:There's no audience member there to laugh.
Guest:The guy just got so sad.
Guest:And I had to spend the next five minutes doing the old- Backpedaling?
Yeah.
Marc:Well, I think we do that to somehow, well, I mean, I do that too.
Marc:You know, I mean, like, you do it to sort of hide the emotion, you know, like, or to deal with the, you know, I think sometimes when we're as comics, you know, a feeling comes up and you're like, I better dismember that with a joke.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Disassemble that.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:That's funny.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I don't want to be sucked down into the set.
Marc:One of us has to stay afloat here.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Whoa, sorry.
Marc:You know, I've had moments like that fairly recently, you know, when you hear about people's passing or whatever, you're going to make a joke.
Marc:You can't help it.
Marc:But you should try to keep it off Twitter and maybe just keep it around people that can handle it.
Guest:That's why hanging with comics is fun.
Guest:Oh, it's the best.
Guest:Yeah, because you can say something really, really horrible and everyone's...
Marc:yeah yeah gonna be okay with it just like what okay yeah or get a laugh yeah i went out in public the other night to a regular a regular person party with my girlfriend yeah yeah yeah and one one woman was just going on and on about something that just was you know she's over intellectualizing it was getting annoying and you know it was it was an easy thing to to get the the gist of right and she just kept going and i'm like all right
Marc:Listen, this is what... I saw frightened faces for a second.
Marc:Yeah, because there's no microphone in your head.
Marc:Well, yeah, because the tone.
Marc:Like, I don't know my tone.
Marc:And my girlfriend's like, well, you yelled at her.
Marc:I'm like, that was a yelling?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That was a yelling.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Because you weren't on stage with a mic in your hand.
Marc:It becomes completely... It just became like ridiculous.
Marc:What are we doing?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Let's move on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's pretty much my whole life.
Guest:The worst is when you have to sit in the elevator.
Guest:Well, you don't live in an apartment building anymore, so you don't have that forced integration where you're like, I got five floors of listening to this guy trying to make me laugh because he saw me on TV, and it's just so painful.
Guest:It's so painful.
Guest:Like, tell me a joke.
Guest:All right, your girlfriend's fat.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's funny to me, but it's... Comedians are always depressive people.
Guest:My fucking dog died today, asshole.
Guest:I always have to be funny.
Marc:You said that to him?
Guest:No, I thought it.
Guest:Just undermine the guy.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:So when did you start doing the stage shit?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:In fifth grade, I saw George Carlin at the Westbury Music Fair.
Guest:You did?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My parents, my mother, though my father showed us the old stuff, my mother would take us to see Blues Brothers.
Guest:The movie?
Guest:Caddyshack.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Would show us the best job of Lucy.
Guest:Did she enjoy him?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She liked that little edgier stuff that my father was against.
Guest:Against?
Guest:Not against, but he didn't embrace it.
Guest:He didn't show us George Carlin, but he would sit and watch us and laugh the whole time.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So we all went to see George Carlin.
Guest:Then we started Bill Cosby at Harris in Atlantic City.
Guest:wait in fourth grade what year would that be for that what what phase of carlin because i saw him when i was in fourth or fifth grade too well he did uh after after carnegie hall and carlin on campus those two hbo specials that i consider the great ones yeah then he did uh uh playing with your head which is the first one that i really saw and it came out like the same year as himself poe cosby himself and i was watching it going who is this guy
Guest:This is fantastic.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I just went and started digging up Occupation Fool.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Class clown.
Guest:AMS.
Guest:And I just discovered him.
Guest:And then my mother was like, you want to go see him?
Guest:And I was like, yeah.
Guest:So we just went.
Guest:And he became almost like a second dad to me.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:I was like, I love individuals, but I don't like groups.
Guest:Pretty soon, they're all wearing the same hats.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And so it just...
Guest:He taught me so much that my parents didn't teach me about religion and about groups of people and about politics and how to look into yourself.
Guest:Don't wear headphones all the time.
Guest:Why are you afraid of your own thoughts?
Guest:Things like that get in your head and you're like, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, philosophy.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, no, that's great.
Marc:Well, that's that's that's what a lot of us who are comedy fans get out of comedy.
Marc:You know, it makes you understand things.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:See things differently.
Guest:Maybe that's why we're depressed, because we see fucking angles of truth that nobody else wants to pay attention to.
Marc:Well, no, I think that's what saves us from falling into the depression permanently.
Guest:That's true.
Marc:You know, like, you know, you can go to a comedy club, and even now, like, you know, I see guys, they make you laugh.
Marc:Some guys will get you a new angle on things.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Some guys will do something, you're like, that was good.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And, you know, like, I never thought of that.
Marc:It still happens.
Marc:Oh, yeah, all the time.
Marc:It's one of the great things about being us.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It doesn't happen as often as when we were kids with the big guys.
Marc:So, yeah, but Cosby myself, too, that thing, I didn't watch that.
Marc:Until right before he got in all the trouble.
Marc:Really?
Marc:That was the one that made him.
Marc:I know, but I never cared really much.
Marc:I'd listen to his old records and stuff, and I knew he was a great comic, but he wasn't really my bag.
Marc:But I was listening to old stuff, and I watched himself.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Literally like six months to a year.
Marc:No, it was more than that.
Marc:It was probably five years ago where I sat down with it and let it make an impression on me.
Marc:It's very well done.
Marc:Well, it's weird.
Marc:You feel bad even talking well about the guy.
Marc:But before pre-rapist Bill Cosby.
Marc:The knowledge of rapist Bill Cosby.
Marc:Yeah, pre the knowledge of the rapist Bill Cosby, what I learned from myself was just that you own your material, that it's really up to you.
Marc:If you're going to sit there and tell a story, if you make it your own and you make it funny, it was like, they'll listen.
Guest:You decide the time as long as you keep it going.
Guest:It was so entertaining.
Guest:And we saw him in Atlantic City, and I remember there was an old man sitting behind me who was laughing just as hard as me.
Guest:And I was like 12.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And that struck a chord with me.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:There's nothing that I watched old people would watch.
Guest:My grandmother had never seen Star Wars.
Guest:It's a great moment.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Like, I'm just starting now to, you know, to really try to, like, I need to keep learning, you know, and I know that my evolution as a comic, like, whatever you're noticing is going on is that I really want to learn how to, you know, maintain a role.
Marc:And stay in it.
Marc:You're doing that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's a whole new thing for me.
Marc:Like as opposed to like, you know, waste, not waste time, but you know, let the, let the silences carry something.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:I really wanted to, and I wanted to make everybody laugh.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So like that's sort of been my new thing in the last couple of years.
Marc:That's wonderful.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because you're not just playing to a certain type of person.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you're playing.
Guest:And so the last few times I've seen at the store, there was one night where you had to go on like probably a
Guest:A half hour later than you're supposed to.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:On that first show.
Guest:And they're dropping checks on me.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:It's a fucking mess.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And you just dig yourself out in a really brilliant way and get everybody to identify without changing who you are.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like, a lot of people feel if you're going to make everybody laugh in the audience and you got to sell out a little bit.
Guest:Right.
Guest:To please everybody.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, I think, no, you don't.
Guest:I can't do that yet.
Guest:But what you did that night was make everybody laugh.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Well, I just, like, I started focusing on, I was never playing for a certain audience.
Marc:You know, it was just so, like, I was just doing what I knew how to do the way I knew how to do it.
Marc:And whatever moved me.
Marc:You know, like, I was defensive.
Marc:You know, I was less open.
Marc:You know, I wanted to push buttons.
Marc:You know, that was just because of who I am emotionally.
Marc:And I think that, you know, if I've changed it all, it's that, you know, I've opened up a little bit, certainly on stage.
Marc:And it's like, what do I got to make people uncomfortable for?
Marc:Is it really a point...
Marc:Is someone really going to go home?
Marc:But then when you talk about Carlin, people do go home and their minds are changed if you make them a little uncomfortable.
Marc:But is that the guy I want to be right now?
Marc:Maybe a little, but not overly.
Guest:Well, Carlin, most of his career, it made people think, but also- Oh, yeah.
Marc:He'd always be talking about weird little things, moles and things.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Listen, I love Bill Hicks.
Guest:If I listen to Bill Hicks, my comedy goes downhill.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I can't do what he did.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And if I try it, it's so people like, why don't you have this license to tell the truth and you're up there making this fucking tree cutting sound effects.
Guest:I'm like, well, that's what I do.
Guest:That's what Brian Regan does.
Guest:I'm still being honest with myself on stage.
Marc:Well, Hicks always, you know, every joke made a point.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You know, it's like, you know, you got to pick your places for that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Anyone, you can make a point.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But like, you know, if every joke you're making a point.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And then you get this sort of disposition of like, what are you people, stupid?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I love Bill.
Marc:I mean, there was no one like him and he was like one of the greatest, you know, satirists around.
Marc:But I realized that just the other day that like almost every joke is a point.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's good.
Marc:It's a hell of a task to write and to commit to that.
Guest:I would never be able to do it.
Marc:I tried to do it, but it's like the satisfaction isn't in being funny.
Marc:The satisfaction is in making a point and making it land.
Guest:Because a lot of times it's just a kick in the ball.
Guest:And it's not always our job to teach.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And so if I'm teaching people, there's a problem.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:It's like, what am I going to teach them?
Guest:Try not to masturbate more than three times a day because you're not going to get to the FedEx store.
Guest:No, you're not going to do anything.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, you need to get two naps involved in that day.
Marc:Don't masturbate when you get back from the FedEx store.
Guest:Right, right, right.
Guest:Make it a reward.
Marc:Unless you've got a big chunk of time in the afternoon.
Marc:Make it a reward for your errands.
Marc:Well, I think all that stuff is very simple, and that's what I started to realize, too, when I started doing the podcast, that people are just people.
Marc:I mean, everybody thinks, but you can blow minds and you can do that, but if you space it out with the masturbation stuff, it's good.
Marc:Bill knew that.
Guest:Bill had some good job.
Guest:Yeah, he was great.
Guest:I just can't do what he did.
Guest:Well, you don't watch it.
Guest:You do what you do.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:I always go out of my way to watch it.
Guest:Man, you have been back a long time ago.
Guest:You recommended Comedy Central give me a half-hour special.
Guest:I don't know if you remember doing that.
Guest:You're like, I came out of a meeting, I told them they should give you a special.
Guest:And I was like, really?
Guest:And I didn't really know that you liked me yet.
Guest:So I was like, really?
Guest:And he was like, yeah.
Guest:Did you get it?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think it was two years later, but I got it.
Guest:But all that helps.
Guest:All that shit helps.
Guest:And I've always been on the outskirts because of the fact
Guest:This is important for me.
Guest:Anybody who doesn't know me doesn't give a shit.
Guest:But because of the fact that my manager was theatrical-based, I never had any comedy direction.
Guest:Everything comedy, like the Conan shows and Montreal, all that had to come through me and my manager, but that wasn't his forte.
Guest:He's good at getting acting auditions.
Guest:So I decided to stay with him.
Guest:Because that seems like a lot of comics, the end goal anyway.
Guest:So I was like, well, I'll just have this covered.
Guest:But for comedy, I'll have to call these clubs.
Guest:And they're like, who are you?
Guest:I'm like, I've been on lots of shows.
Guest:Everybody on your list, they know me.
Guest:I'll have them call you.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Get ready for 52 phone messages.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And so it's always me.
Marc:You still have to do that?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I have to take crap money.
Guest:But because I didn't go that route.
Marc:So let's go back.
Marc:So you see George Carlin, and then when do you start getting on stage one way or the other?
Marc:Did you do theater?
Guest:Well, yeah, I did a lot of theater in, I would say, in high school.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:I always played, like, it was a Marx Brothers play called Room Service.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I played the Chinko character.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was like, I remember getting so many, there's this moment where we all have to eat the food really fast.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because we haven't eaten in days.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I'm shoving food in my face.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I just remember the audience laughing.
Guest:And I was breaking loads of bread over my head.
Guest:I was like spitting apple when I was talking to people.
Guest:I ate a whole apple in like five seconds.
Guest:It was just in my mouth.
Guest:I'm doing my lines and apples falling everywhere.
Guest:And I remember the principals laughing.
Guest:Old ladies that I've ever met are laughing.
Guest:Kids are laughing.
Guest:And I remember thinking right there, you can actually do this.
Guest:This isn't just something you want to do.
Guest:You can actually do this.
Guest:At that moment, I realized.
Guest:With Apple flying.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was like, I could do this.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it was Apple flying.
Guest:And it was, I don't know.
Guest:So right around then, I decided that's what I want to do most of all.
Guest:Be funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I like acting.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Theater is fun because you're acting the whole time you're on stage.
Guest:What kind of plays were you doing?
Guest:Mostly in high school?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was the bad guy.
Guest:Lee J. Cobb.
Guest:You were a Lee J. Cobb character with the kid?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like, you work your fucking heart out.
Guest:Ripping up the picture.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I did all that.
Guest:I'd love to see you in high school doing that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:High school plays are great.
Guest:I loved them.
Guest:It was always because I ran away with a show.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Nobody else was like, they're just trying to memorize their lines.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And not look stupid in front of the girls.
Guest:I'm just going for it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Teddy Roosevelt and Art's Thinking Old Lace.
Guest:So then after, I would say college, the drama department wouldn't use me because I wasn't in drama.
Guest:I was in communications.
Guest:So they would keep me out of the plays because I didn't know it.
Guest:So it's like my comic career now.
Guest:But was it an open audition?
Guest:Yeah, but it was all them.
Guest:It was all their friends every time.
Guest:Where'd you go to college?
Guest:New Paltz, upstate New York.
Guest:It's like Berkeley now.
Guest:It's a big marijuana school.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:What, SUNY New Paltz?
Guest:Yeah, yeah, SUNY New Paltz.
Guest:So I got my own radio show there for three years.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:That damn show, 9 p.m.
Guest:on Tuesdays.
Guest:Did you do bits?
Guest:They're all bits.
Guest:I'd write them in class.
Guest:I'd sit in class and just write the show.
Guest:And you had other guys doing the voices and shit?
Guest:They would come in, and I still work with these guys.
Guest:Really?
Guest:I still shoot skits with them.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:They're all out here now?
Guest:No, they live in New York, but they're like my best friends.
Guest:Do you have tapes of that radio stuff?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:One day my mother got confused and threw them all out, but they still exist on a computer that no longer works, but I got to get in there and get them.
Guest:Eventually.
Guest:As long as they're somewhere.
Guest:Yeah, they're there.
Guest:But I have a few of them on my lap.
Marc:So you graduated with a communications degree?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I do understand communications.
Guest:Good for you.
Guest:You're doing a very good job of it today.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was the perfect amount of marijuana.
Guest:Not too much where it's like my Joey Diaz appearance, but it's just enough to maintain.
Marc:You balanced it?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I made an ass of myself on Joey Diaz's podcast.
Guest:You did?
Guest:I was like, I am way too stumped.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's tough, man.
Marc:It's tough in the morning.
Marc:Do you go old school or do you vape?
Marc:Old school.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Vaping requires going to the store and buying things.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Just a little one-hitter.
Guest:A true marijuana smoker doesn't leave the house to buy marijuana preferentially.
Right.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:I'm an actual marijuana smoker.
Guest:Now I just do it in the street.
Guest:I remember walking down the street.
Guest:I had a girlfriend at the time.
Guest:And we're walking.
Guest:And I'm smoking a joint.
Guest:And there's a guy behind me going, you can't do that here.
Guest:You can't do that here.
Guest:Because there's a police across the street.
Guest:And I was like, all right.
Guest:And he ran across the street.
Guest:And me and my girlfriend are watching him tell the cops.
Guest:New York?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:52nd Street.
Guest:He's telling the cops.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:This guy is smoking weed over there.
Guest:And the cops just shrug their shoulder.
Guest:He goes, yeah, what do you want us to do?
Yeah.
Guest:And then he just walks away defeated.
Guest:It was a victory for me and a victory for weed against my girlfriend who wanted me to quit weed even though when we met I was fucking on weed.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:I like this person.
Guest:Let's change what made him likable.
Marc:Right, right.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:The weed.
Guest:See, Brian, you're likable without the weed.
Guest:Right now.
Guest:I know some people that feel differently.
Guest:There's a lot of I'm funny more and more people that don't like me.
Guest:I'm like wow.
Guest:Is that true?
Guest:Well you go through this the more I'm not known I'm not known right.
Guest:I'm known in like some areas Yeah, but like you're known but the more known you get the more some areas it might be slightly bigger areas But my parents both know you are and that to me means that you're famous.
Guest:Okay Well, my parents know you Louie David tell yeah, and Jeff Ross.
Guest:They know you for yeah, and they don't know you know they don't know Brian Regan and
Guest:Yeah, I know.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:It's weird about Brian Regan.
Marc:He's huge, and he's so fucking funny.
Marc:Here's the weird thing about me.
Marc:If I'm really down in the dumps and I'm alone, I'll watch Brian or I'll watch Kevin James.
Marc:Yeah, I love Kevin James.
Marc:He's hilarious.
Marc:He's a good actor, too.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:The turns he has to make on that show?
Marc:You're among those guys.
Marc:Guys who are on stage.
Marc:I could watch any of you guys.
Marc:I'd like to see you try to learn how to use a phone on stage.
Marc:You've got a new iPhone.
Marc:I'd like to give each of you a piece of technology that you don't know how to use and just stand on stage and try to figure it out.
Marc:That would be a great show, man.
Guest:Let's do that.
Guest:That would be so funny.
Guest:Wow, that'd be a funny idea.
Guest:You should book that show.
Guest:Really?
Guest:You just have five different people.
Guest:Comics trying to do things they don't know how to do?
Guest:And you just hand them something before they're set.
Guest:Like, okay.
Guest:Yeah, work it out.
Guest:Program this clock radio to wake up before 30 a.m.
Guest:You know?
Guest:I still don't do that.
Guest:I'm cold downstairs.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But no, it's just in the nature of it.
Marc:Those are the guys that I... I like watching joke guys, but I like goofy guys.
Guest:Yeah, no, that's... I think it's because...
Guest:how intelligent your stuff is, it's a release for you to watch Goofy.
Guest:Whereas why probably I love you so much, to watch you be smart, and I go, wow, that was really smart.
Marc:Well, it's funny, because I'm trying to be a little more goofy and a little more free, because I know I got it in me, but they're just people that, you can only do it in your way, you know what I mean?
Marc:But I can watch people write jokes and be like, that's a good joke, but if someone's not innately funny,
Marc:You know, and there are there are those guys around like they get off stage and you have a conversation with them.
Marc:Yeah, they're not gonna make you laugh.
Marc:We're never gonna talk again.
Marc:Well, yeah, just sort of like, you know, how do you even do like I know there are guys who are not naturally funny offstage or even naturally funny period who have gotten funny on stage.
Marc:I know that yeah, but I like the naturally funny people and I think it'd be surprising for people to know but you know that there are plenty of fucking comics and
Marc:And I'm not saying names are bad comics on stage, but they're really not that funny people.
Guest:Yeah, interpersonally.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Sometimes I'm afraid I come off like that, standing in front of some comedy club in St.
Guest:Louis, and I'm like, man, I can't believe they're making me do a midnight show.
Guest:They didn't tell me that.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And the comic's like, you're very negative.
Guest:I'm like, I don't even fucking know you.
Guest:I just gave you a cigarette.
Guest:Fuck you.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So now I got this guy on Reddit.
Guest:Brian Squire was not fun.
Guest:Oh, fuck it.
Guest:He's not fun.
Marc:Yeah, and I never go to Reddit.
Marc:I don't like when the young comics start shitting on the old comics.
Marc:That's weird, because it happens now.
Marc:Yeah, because there's so many of them.
Marc:But I mean, I guess I did it, too.
Marc:But there were fewer of us.
Marc:Well, we didn't do it publicly.
Marc:We did it behind their backs in clubs.
Marc:Yeah, like fucking comics.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I'm not posting it on Twitter.
Marc:Yeah, it's horrible.
Marc:Keep it in the family.
Marc:Just go gossip with some other assholes.
Marc:Just be professional.
Marc:And then get to a point where the guy hears it from another guy, not because he saw it on Facebook or Reddit or Twitter.
Marc:It's like, hey, Joe told me that you're saying some shit about me.
Guest:No, fuck Joe.
Guest:I was waiting for that phone call.
Guest:Have you looked at Facebook today?
Marc:No, what happened?
Marc:It's terrifying.
Guest:I don't like it.
Guest:It really bothers me.
Guest:When people try to draw me into arguments publicly, I'm like, nah.
Guest:Or when they start texting instead of calling.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So you got something to say.
Guest:Let's talk.
Marc:I'm a little guilty of that.
Marc:I've done that before.
Marc:Have you?
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Like where you just sort of like, hey, man, sorry that I ruined your life.
Marc:Well, that one, if it's an apology, I'm fine.
Marc:With a sad face emoji.
Marc:Fuck.
Marc:Okay, so you did radio, which is fun.
Guest:Yeah, and then I guess I graduated.
Guest:During college, I would come home to New York to visit my family, and I would do bringer shows at Stand Up New York and Gotham.
Guest:Oh, that's where you started with the bringers, huh?
Guest:Yeah, and then people were like, no, you should do open mics.
Guest:And I'm like, well, I only did like five or six shows.
Guest:But when did you get the job working with mentally retarded people?
Guest:When I graduated college, but I had been doing it already.
Guest:My high school had a piece of property where during the summer there would be camps for mentally retarded children or adults.
Guest:I still say retarded.
Guest:I don't think the word retarded is bad.
Guest:People are like, it's a bad word.
Guest:It's not a bad word if it gets to the point exactly.
Guest:If I say I worked with special people, you'd be like, oh, well, it makes it special.
Guest:Well, they're handicapped.
Guest:Well, it's broader.
Guest:It's broader.
Guest:How different.
Guest:Why are they handicapped?
Guest:They're retarded.
Guest:Okay, thanks.
Marc:Now they understand.
Marc:I've had that conversation before, and I used to do a bit on stage about that.
Marc:But the truth of the matter is, it's about respecting the families of the people.
Marc:The word just got negative.
Guest:I understand that.
Guest:But you did for 15 years?
Guest:For a long time.
Guest:And a lot of them are still my friends.
Guest:When I go home, I'll visit them.
Guest:I was there for when their parents died.
Guest:What compelled you?
Guest:Originally, it was just a job I felt comfortable doing.
Guest:It was a fun job, and it was up my league of what I do.
Guest:I would get fired from any other job from my mouth.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But this job supported my mouth.
Guest:So you were a smart ass.
Guest:Well, if you think about it this way, this is my favorite story of how I sum up my entire years working with him.
Guest:Chucky is an older, slight MR, slight mental retardation.
Guest:He was sitting in bed.
Guest:He wouldn't go to bed.
Guest:And I was like, Chucky, why aren't you going to bed?
Guest:You got to work tomorrow.
Guest:And he goes, there's a monster in my closet.
Guest:Now, I know Chucky's smart enough to know there's no monster in his closet.
Guest:So I go, really?
Guest:I go, holy shit, we got to get out of here.
Guest:And I pick up his whiffle bat, and I open the closet, and I start beating nothing.
Guest:You're not supposed to do this.
Guest:They would call me in an office and go, Brian, that's not the way.
Guest:You just tell Chucky to stop playing fantasy games.
Guest:But I would go along with it and pretend to beat the monster, and I would put my hand through the door acting like I was choking myself.
Guest:And then I'd be like, all right, he's dead, Chucky.
Guest:Everything's fine.
Guest:And Chucky would sit there and laugh, and then that satisfied him, and he'd go to bed.
Guest:That's the way I would handle things.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Because there's no other councils around to tell me what to do.
Marc:But he probably knew there wasn't a monster, and he probably just wanted to... Attention.
Marc:Yeah, and by the time you did that, I thought you were going to end that story with him saying, like, I know there's no monster.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:That would be the intelligent way to do it.
Guest:So I did that job, and also was flexible.
Guest:I would do 20 hours on a Sunday, 20 hours on a Wednesday.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So now I had the rest of the week open for auditions and spots.
Marc:What did you learn from that experience, though?
Marc:Because, like, you know, one of my...
Marc:misunderstood yet yet i still feel is that because of you know there's a lot of about humanity you can learn from people that are that don't have a filter exactly that's the thing that that's a much smarter way of putting it and i just say you they can't hide how they're feeling right that's what i used to say right
Guest:So I remember one of the guy's mothers passed away.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So he would stand in front of me and just occasionally pretend, look over my shoulder and wave at a ghost and then look at me surprised like, oh, you weren't supposed to see.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was so obviously he was saying, I want to believe my mother's still alive and I want to believe that we have something special and Brian doesn't know about it.
Guest:All right.
Guest:And I would be like, okay.
Guest:I was like, that's how we go along with it to appease him.
Guest:But they can't hide how they're feeling.
Guest:And then you learn a lot about human behavior.
Guest:Like when somebody wants to apologize to you, let's say I'm apologizing to you, but I can't deal with the fact that it's 100% my fault.
Guest:So I'm going to split the responsibility onto you in my apology.
Guest:And be like, I did this because you did this.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I could see through that as that's not an apology.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That's splitting the apology and sharing the blame with me because you can't look at what you did.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that's something that you can, I learned from dealing with mentally retarded people.
Guest:It's like, yeah, you can cut through people's obvious bullshit.
Marc:And they take it and they understand that?
Marc:Who?
Guest:That mentally retarded people?
Guest:Well, they just are happy to get the sandwiches.
Guest:Like the grind stopped beating us.
Guest:That's fine.
Yeah.
Guest:But I see people.
Guest:My point is now that's what I took away from.
Marc:Yeah, right.
Marc:And when you still have relationships with these guys who are probably older now.
Marc:Yeah, they're not good.
Guest:Yeah, but they're happy to see you.
Guest:The ones I remember, I remember when I was first on, I did that TV show called Three Sisters in 2001.
Guest:Nobody watched it because 9-11 happened the next day.
Guest:It was my career.
Guest:And I suppose not people who died had it worse.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But when I first appeared on the TV, I was like, you see me, Paul?
Guest:There's me right there.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:Couldn't handle the fact that I was in the room and on the TV at the same time.
Guest:Right.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:And he walked out of the room.
Guest:It was frustrating for him to handle both.
Marc:Yeah, that's hilarious.
Marc:Yeah, isn't that interesting?
Marc:Well, yeah, it's honest.
Marc:I mean, I've had that experience with me on TV.
Marc:LAUGHTER
Marc:You had to leave the room.
Marc:I'm like, no, no.
Marc:Turn it off.
Marc:Turn it off.
Marc:Oh, fuck.
Marc:But I think that's a noble thing.
Marc:Do you track any of that back to service, to the idea of Catholic?
Guest:That's how it started at the Catholic high school.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And originally I went to those camps just to make young girls uncomfortable.
Guest:What do you mean, which girls?
Guest:The counselors.
Guest:Yeah, all right.
Guest:From the Catholic high school guys.
Guest:I'm like, I'll go up there, and I'll hit on them, and they'll turn me down, and I'll drag off to them, and then we'll all leave and never talk to each other again.
Marc:And I'll work with mentally challenged people.
Guest:Yeah, which I still do both of those, you know?
Guest:Sure.
Guest:In a weird way.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But that's, I don't know, that's just, I trace it back to that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then at some, when I got the money to move, when they gave me money to move for a pilot here, I was like, okay, that's it.
Marc:So you were doing bringer shows, and then you graduated to other shows.
Guest:Well, in 95, I got into Boston Comedy Club.
Guest:Yeah, the Boston.
Guest:Yeah, which was fun.
Marc:It was.
Guest:And I was with Barry Katz.
Guest:And then I started- You were managed by Barry?
Guest:At the time, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then I started playing the Gotham, and I started playing Statham, New York, and Dangerfields.
Guest:And when I got past the cellar, that's when I became a comic.
Marc:So the guy pulled you in, got you working?
Guest:Robert Kelly gave me an audition at the cellar.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's back when you had a VHS tape.
Guest:And I had to stand out in the hallway and give it to SD and be like, hey, listen, this is my tape.
Guest:I'll come back.
Guest:And I would come back every week for, like, I would say about eight months.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was at the Boston Comedy Club.
Guest:I would walk over.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And eventually she threw me on for five minutes on a Saturday trial by fire.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it went really well.
Guest:Oh, good.
Guest:I started getting spots.
Guest:I made Manny laugh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the waitstaff liked me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I think that's when I became a comic of 97.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And suddenly, everybody knew my name.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And it just was, I was pounding.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Every night, having to keep up with you guys.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And every comic back in those days, before Manny passed,
Guest:I feel like that club was firing on all cylinders at all times, and every comic on stage was fantastic.
Guest:Well, you had to be there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Even if you weren't, you had to be.
Guest:So I think that that's what made me a better comic.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That's what started me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Remember Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That line where he goes, if you look out the window with the right pair of eyes, you can almost see that place where the wave broke and finally rolled back.
Guest:I feel that's the seller in 95 to 2001, probably.
Marc:I think so.
Marc:That's what defined it, certainly.
Marc:And now it's defined by the people who are huge stars that came out of there that now show up there.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:You're right, you're right.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:But to me, that's it.
Guest:What did Kurt Metzger call it?
Guest:Louis tourism.
Guest:Louis tourism.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I love the fact he went to the pizza store.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they were like, hey, that's the guy who made our place famous.
Guest:We're so famous now because of you.
Guest:The pizza place?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:$1.75.
Guest:They still charged him for the pizza.
Guest:And a slice.
Guest:That was a pretty good slice.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I forget.
Marc:He probably made that whole block famous.
Guest:Yeah, he did.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I tell people now, you get off of the train station from Louis, and they go, West 4th.
Guest:I'm like, yeah.
Guest:It's amazing.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:You know I do the voiceover for that show?
Guest:You do?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Coming up next on Louie.
Guest:Oh, dear.
Guest:All new.
Guest:The following program is rated TV MLA for strong language in adult situations.
Guest:You just do it for Louie?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But he didn't even hire me.
Guest:The audition was do an old man voice and do a subway announcer.
Guest:And so I was like, Louie, Louie, come Thursday 10.
Guest:On FX.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they were like, hey, you got the job.
Guest:And then they didn't want me to do that at all.
Guest:Which is weird.
Guest:But Louis now knows me.
Guest:He didn't before?
Guest:Well, he knew me, but he never knew my name.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And so it's like, you knew my name.
Marc:right that's something i gotta give credit to you i think that you were approachable uh back to a young younger yeah yeah definitely yeah yeah insecure and needy i guess what you want to call that yeah i thought you were nice no no yeah i mean i i like comics i'm still that way i just don't like uh you know even when i shoot my show like i don't i never consider it to be like you know i'm the boss or it's my show i'm just like i'm a guy working with other people
Marc:I have my moments where I'm like, why isn't this going well?
Marc:Who's in charge?
Marc:Oh, I can probably do something.
Guest:I'm in charge because you can't act like the way other people show.
Guest:They'll kick you right off.
Marc:That's what I figured out.
Marc:It's just better to go through life being... I don't know if it's insecure or just sort of not thinking that way.
Marc:I just don't have...
Marc:I'm competitive and I still get a little snippy and jealous, but in terms of working, I always defer to who's guiding.
Marc:If I'm working with a director or other actors, I'm not going to pull rank on anybody.
Marc:It's like, I'm here to work with everybody.
Marc:Let's work together.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I like that approach better.
Guest:Like, hey, we're putting on a show, Little Rascals.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Some people, they have camps between the writers and actors.
Guest:I remember the second show I was on as a regular, there was a camp between the two, and it was, like, uncomfortable.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:What show was that?
Guest:Well, it was called Stacked.
Marc:with uh it was pam anderson and christopher lloyd yeah and me and those shows never work out well you know if you got that shit going on it's like what i don't understand like you know when you hear these stories about people you know pulling rank and being prima donnas or doing crazy shit just to show that they can it's like i don't understand i don't understand where the fuck that comes from like i'm not gonna i'm not going to set today until they you know get me the shoes i want it's like what are you fucking for
Marc:I just don't understand that.
Guest:Well, that show wasn't like that, but I've seen it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I've seen it on other shows.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That show was actually pretty present most of the time.
Guest:Oh, good.
Guest:That's the guy from Modern Family.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:He's good.
Guest:But I've been on shows where you're like, is this really happening?
Guest:Like this guy, they gave him a gun, a plastic water gun.
Guest:They're like, your plot line is you play a water gun with the grandson.
Guest:And he's like, well, I don't support guns.
Guest:Well, yeah, but this is a character and we're paying you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then he does the whole episode and at the end he goes up to the producers and just smashes the water gun right in front of their faces.
Guest:I'm like, that's crazy behavior.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Marc:He made his point.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:And now he's telling a different version of that story.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I showed them.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm guilty of that, too.
Guest:I was doing a show, and they were, like, really coming at me with fat jokes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was like, hey, I don't mind fat jokes.
Guest:Can I say something back?
Guest:Can we spread them out?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Can the plot line be for every episode?
Guest:Can it not be that nobody wants to fuck me?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:That's when I wrote that bit.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it's like, and they're like, well, he doesn't like fat jokes.
Guest:And then it becomes Telephone Game.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like, he doesn't like fat jokes.
Guest:Brian threw a squad.
Marc:More people being copied on email.
Guest:Yeah, and then it's like at the end, you're flipping over the craft service table in the story.
Guest:Brian went nuts.
Guest:Like I said one thing to one person in a nice way.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they asked me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Did you flip over a craft service table?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:What I'm saying is that it changes.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Oh, I see what you're saying.
Marc:I see what you're saying.
Marc:Like, yeah, he killed a man.
Guest:Yeah, right, right.
Guest:It's a telephone game.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:It just gets worse and worse and worse.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:So it's like I've seen actors get jealous of other actors and have them fired from the show.
Guest:Like, I've seen that.
Guest:I've seen sitting at lunch with a really nice actor who's been around.
Guest:He's in movies.
Guest:And he's sitting, we're learning lines together.
Guest:And then he gets a phone call and he's fired right in front of my face because somebody else was jealous of the lines he was getting.
Guest:It's...
Marc:it's sad yeah i learned how like i knew that i wasn't that great an actor when i started i think i'm slightly better now but like i i always knew like i can understand that jealousy but like with me you start to realize like well if it's good it's good yeah you know if that guy's gonna steal the scene let him have it right it's only gonna help us yeah i mean it's like you know i mean a lot of times when you work with actors who are better than you you're better right yeah you know and it's just sort of like he can have the scene
Guest:Let him have the scene.
Guest:Like if they had done that with Jaleel White on Family Matters or Henry Winkler on fucking Happy Days when he was taking over more, with those shows, nobody would know them.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:If the guy who played Mr. What's his name?
Guest:Tom Bosley from fucking Happy Days was like, this show is about me, not about Henry Winkler.
Guest:The show would have been canceled.
Marc:It would have been terrible.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So which show did you move out for?
Marc:What brought you to L.A.
Marc:?
Guest:I did a pilot with Steve Korn first, with Tiffany Thiessen, and then they threw me on a show called Three Sisters with Vicki Lewis from News Radio, A.J.
Guest:Langer from My So-Called Life.
Guest:Diane Cannon was in it.
Marc:Oh, Diane Cannon.
Guest:And the writers now write The Middle.
Guest:It was a great show called The Middle, which they've had me on.
Guest:Because they're awesome girls.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So they didn't like me from the meeting.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because they had heard this guy was funny in the pilot.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So let's call him in.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I just said, you guys write me a scene and I'll show you.
Guest:I was like, interpersonally, I'm not that interesting.
Guest:Like, I'm sure all the listeners who are wondering how much time is left in this interview.
Guest:No.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:That's what they were like, how much time is left in this interview.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was like, just write me a scene.
Guest:So they wrote me a scene, and I got it.
Guest:And then they gave me $5,000 to move.
Guest:And then I moved really quickly.
Guest:And then literally, after the first episode, people are recognizing me online.
Guest:I'm like, wow, I'm on TV, on NBC, getting an unholy paycheck, paid off my student loans.
Guest:And then literally 9-11 happens, and the last thing people want to watch are three sisters on fucking NBC light comedy.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:It just died a slow death.
Guest:So that was unfortunate.
Marc:But you got your student loans paid off.
Guest:And I got to learn to act without anybody watching with network money.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, no, you're great on those shows.
Marc:And if I look at the thing here, you're a guy that shows up on shows.
Marc:I remember when I saw you on Mad Men, I was like, there's Brian!
Marc:Yeah, that was a thrill.
Marc:Thanks, man.
Marc:Thanks.
Guest:Scalero's on Mad Men!
Guest:Thanks, buddy.
Marc:You were someone's boyfriend, right?
Marc:Smoking a cigarette, I remember.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, and there was, like, how many series did you get that, you know, like, that went a season?
Guest:I was a regular on two network sitcoms.
Guest:Three Sisters ran a season.
Guest:And Stacked ran two seasons, but a short and first season.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that was a lot of fun.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Working with Christopher Lloyd was a lot of fun.
Guest:I bet.
Guest:It's exciting to work with those guys you grew up with.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you don't say anything to them for two weeks.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then, like, you sit down and you get the right thing to get them talking.
Yeah.
Marc:You know, it's a horrible thing to realize when you do, because the only experience I've had with television is doing my show.
Marc:And I've had big actors on it.
Marc:Eric Stolz, Judd Hirsch.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Alex Rocco.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:Elliot Gould.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:Sally Kellerman.
Marc:These are big movie stars from the 70s.
Marc:But after a certain point, come season three or four, you start to realize, they're actors.
Marc:Which is good because it's humanizing.
Marc:Because it's very hard to separate your childhood reverence for these people.
Marc:And then all of a sudden you realize, this is a job.
Marc:When we're casting, it's the most demystifying fucking thing you could ever do.
Marc:We got to cast this guy's old guy.
Marc:And then the casting agent sends you all this stuff, all these people that are available.
Marc:I'm like, you can just get that guy?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:That guy's great.
Guest:He's still working just because your DVD's still on the player.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But he hasn't worked since.
Guest:Or else I haven't seen him where he shows up and stuff.
Guest:But that's their job.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's a hard job.
Guest:It's a really shitty job.
Guest:You always have to apply constantly.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:When a guy gets, when you're on a regular show and everyone's like, I'm buying a house.
Guest:I'm like, just don't do that till season three.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Don't buy a house till season three.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I've known a lot of guys that did that.
Marc:Comics.
Marc:You know, guys who get the show built around them.
Marc:They're like, cars for everybody.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I miss that though.
Guest:And I'm trying to get back to it.
Guest:What?
Guest:Like, being a regular on something.
Guest:I was a recurring... After the writer's strike, it was just like, I'm a guest role now.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, now I'm fat and 42, now that half the shows are reality shows, and now the fat best friend has been replaced by the minority best friend.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So I'm like, there's less jobs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Plus, I'm heavy and old.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And in this business, it's like, they don't want heavy and old unless it's like the angle...
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:They show up.
Marc:I mean, it's like, you know, there are rare things.
Marc:Not even rare, but you don't know how something's going to come together or how someone's going to fit in.
Guest:It happens.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I just was close to a Chuck Lorre sitcom.
Guest:I was close to it.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they wanted a heavyset 42-year-old Italian.
Guest:And I'm like, okay.
Guest:I can do that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was like, I just have to show up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, I did.
Guest:And they were like, you're perfect.
Guest:And I'm like, thanks.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like, we're going to ask you.
Guest:I'm like, okay.
Guest:And then what happened?
Guest:We called them, and they're like, oh, we decided to change the character.
Guest:And I'm like, well, you changed it from a brother to a black guy?
Guest:What happened?
Guest:It just changed.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And so it's like, okay, I didn't get a chance because they changed the character, and that's not my fault.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But it's nice to know that it's been 10 years since Stacked, and I got close again.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I had a bunch of recurrings on four cable channels, shows.
Guest:It's not over.
Guest:Right.
Guest:For a while there, I felt it was over.
Guest:When you finally get...
Guest:what you've always wanted, and being on Stacked and watching it implode for one reason or another.
Guest:And you're like, man, nobody's listening to my point.
Guest:I was like, I don't know if this is not the job I wanted.
Guest:Or when you get there, when you finally achieve your goal in life,
Guest:You look around and go, have I been ignoring my parents?
Guest:And did I not go to Julia's fucking camp trip with her parents?
Guest:I could have been in that relationship still.
Guest:If I hadn't chased this goal my whole life.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Then you get your goal and you're like, I don't know if this was all worth it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So I was lost for, I would say, six years just going through the motions.
Guest:Doing comedy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But not writing.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I was just lost.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Is that when you're doing the drugs?
Marc:There were some drugs in there.
Guest:It was not a great six years.
Guest:I just didn't know what to do with myself.
Guest:I was like, well, I already did it.
Guest:I was a regular on two network sitcoms, and neither one of them went, and it's not my fault, but now it's what happens now.
Guest:Now I'm not the flavor of the moment.
Guest:The momentum has been killed because of the writer's strike.
Guest:What happens now?
Guest:What do I do?
Guest:I'm not even enjoying stand-up at that point in my life.
Guest:So what do I do?
Guest:Do I just wait until I die?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Am I now just a mentor to younger comics?
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like, what am I?
Guest:The guy sitting there?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Come talk to Brian.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:This is what you're going to do.
Guest:But it's like, I would say the past two years, I've had a little bit of an act three begin.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Where, like, I'm on Castle in two weeks.
Guest:Like, I'm learning back to how to audition again.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I'm like, if I put a video camera in front of me in my living room, just do the lines of my video camera, I'll watch it back and go, all right, that line could be better.
Guest:You should keep your eyes up here.
Guest:You're directing yourself.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so then when I go in, I'm alive.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And probably for years, I didn't care.
Guest:The point is, I'm caring again.
Guest:And I'm hoping Act 3, I'm hoping to God this isn't the end of Act 3.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:What, this podcast?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like, could this be the scene where Brian learns, you know?
Guest:And then, like, I get killed.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:I can tell you're funny now.
Marc:I mean, I can tell you're, like, into it.
Guest:Yeah, it's bad.
Marc:You get up there and we, you know, like, it's fun to go to the store now and see, like, guys like you and, you know, Dom and dudes who are, like, it's like there's a working man's ethic to it where it's like, you're going to do your job tonight?
Marc:Yeah, I'm going to do it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm going to try to do my job.
Guest:Not that I can.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm carrying it.
Guest:I want to go on stage and make it an experience.
Guest:I'm competing with very famous comedians.
Guest:Some are on TV currently.
Guest:Some are just really well-known, established legends.
Guest:And how are they going to remember me?
Guest:Well, I'm going to just give them 15 minutes of a lot of shit.
Guest:Yeah, it's funny.
Guest:And then I'm going to leave.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:You've been so supportive, man.
Marc:Yeah, well, it's been great.
Marc:It's always great to see you, and again, I'm sorry about that one role.
Guest:Oh, no, dude, you were so kind.
Guest:That's what I'm saying.
Guest:You were so kind about it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:When I saw him, were we allowed to talk about it?
Guest:You brought it up.
Sure.
Guest:When I saw Schubert go by in the golf cart, I'm like, it should go to him.
Guest:He was like, hey, Brian.
Guest:And I was like, that should go to him.
Guest:It just made sense.
Guest:I didn't even know he was auditioning.
Guest:Well, like I said, when I opened the part, I was like, I don't know if this is the part that would suit me best if somebody could tell the story better if they had that look.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I don't think I had that look.
Marc:Yeah, you both would have been good, but I wanted to be honest with you.
Guest:It was nice of you to write.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:That's my whole point, how you're a very given guy now.
Guest:And I stopped you in front of that girl, and I was like, you know, there's a lot of guys at your level that aren't as generous as you.
Guest:And I got to tell you, it really means a lot coming from your generosity.
Marc:Well, thank you, man.
Guest:And then you looked at your girl and you were like, did you hear that?
Guest:LAUGHTER
Guest:And he just walked away.
Marc:I guess I avoided a fight that night.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:All right, buddy.
Marc:Good talking to you.
Marc:Yeah, thanks for having me on.
Marc:Yeah, man, it's great.
Marc:I love him.
Marc:I love Brian.
Marc:If you want to have fun and get some laughs, go see Brian wherever you can.
Marc:And go check out WTFPod.com, powered by Squarespace, for all your WTF needs.
Marc:Yummy.
Yummy.
Marc:Oh, am I into playing guitar?
Marc:Can I play some really distorted fucking monster guitar?
Marc:Can I do that on a Les Paul in a fucking pedal business?
Marc:Brrrr!
Guest:Brrrr!
Guest:Boomer lives!