Episode 67 - Robin Williams
Guest:are we doing this really wait for it are we doing this wait for it pow what the fuck and it's also what the fuck what's wrong with me it's time for wtf what the fuck with mark maron
Marc:Okay, what the fuckers, what the fuck buddies, what the fuckineers, let's do this.
Marc:I'm in a car.
Marc:I'm in San Francisco.
Marc:I'm driving down Lombard Street towards the Golden Gate Bridge.
Marc:As you know, I lived here for a couple years, but that's lost time.
Marc:I have no idea what happened.
Marc:I remember...
Marc:had coffee, I smoked a lot of pot, did a lot of comedy, and entrenched myself in a relationship that ultimately didn't work out.
Marc:But that's neither here nor there.
Marc:It's a beautiful day.
Marc:It's clear.
Marc:I'm heading towards the Golden Gate Bridge.
Marc:I have a lot of memories here, but as I said before, they're foggy, but I always liked the climate.
Marc:It's gorgeous.
Marc:I'm driving to Robin Williams' house to interview him.
Marc:Now, you guys know, he's probably on the fame scale the biggest interview I've done.
Marc:I've come in contact with him a few times over the years.
Marc:We've had a few conversations.
Marc:I get along with him.
Marc:He's a very sweet guy when he sits down and talks.
Marc:It's very disarming.
Marc:And it's one of those situations where I have to think about myself.
Marc:one of those situations is there any other kind of situation mark i am guilty of over the years dismissing robin williams in the sense of like you know i've heard things about him you know he stole jokes i don't know but the bottom line is as i get older i realize i
Marc:This is a man that had the career that really any comic wants.
Marc:I mean, Eve, if you want to look in retrospective, if you want to judge retroactively or try to claim that your judgment isn't bitter, then you can do that.
Marc:But the bottom line is this guy was the biggest movie star in the world for a long time.
Marc:He started as a comic, went to acting school, fine.
Marc:But the truth of the matter is, by the time he was in his late 20s, 25, 26, 27, whatever that was,
Marc:He was on a television show that was very popular, and then he parlayed that into an acting career in movies, both serious and comic, which not many people do.
Marc:And he sustained that career for upwards of 30 years.
Marc:So there's really no way you can dismiss all of it.
Marc:And the truth of the matter is, is that no matter how cynical I may be, you know, resentment plays a part in most of my judgments and that if I'm going to belittle anyone's career, belittle anyone's talent, you know, 90 percent of the time, if they're popular, it's driven by resentment or my own self-pity.
Marc:That's just a reality.
Marc:I don't like to admit it, but it's true.
Marc:But the few times I've talked to Robin, he's been incredibly sweet and disarming.
Marc:And then all of a sudden you're just filled with Robin.
Marc:You're sitting there and he's talking at you and you're just excited to have that small an audience with this guy.
Marc:I have no idea how it's going to go, but I'm a little nervous.
Marc:Maybe I should look at it that way.
Marc:Ooh, there's a Golden Gate Bridge.
Marc:There's no way you can't see that thing from where I am right now and not think it's one of the greatest cities in the world.
Marc:It's a fucking Golden Gate Bridge.
Marc:And I'm about to be on it.
Marc:Driving, not walking sadly to the middle with other intentions.
Guest:That's a good sign.
Marc:So I appreciate you doing this, and I was nervous.
Marc:I was nervous coming up here.
Marc:I usually don't get nervous.
Marc:Why?
Marc:I don't know why, you know, because we've hung out before, we've talked before, but then at some point in my mind, I'm getting ready to do this, and I'm like, I felt like I was interviewing a former president.
Marc:I never knew.
Marc:It's going to be like the Williams-Marin interviews.
Marc:This is going to go on for days.
Marc:What phone call?
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:What did I do?
Guest:It was a blackout.
Guest:I remember.
Guest:Was there a prostitute involved?
Marc:I don't know how long you were drinking for in this little run you took, but I have to assume that driving home had to be an inspiration to stop.
Guest:I only drove drunk that I remember once.
Guest:And then one time I woke up the next morning, oh, where's my car?
Guest:And it turned out the bartender had driven me home.
Guest:He was a sweet guy and he drove me home.
Guest:And the next day I couldn't find the car and I thought, oh, my God, my car's been stolen.
Guest:And they actually, no, they parked it for me in a safe parking lot.
Guest:So it's nice when people take care of you when you're that loaded.
Guest:It's the benefit of celebrity, I guess.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Take more home.
Guest:I get a cinema kind of, right?
Yeah.
Guest:What?
Guest:Now I can do this.
Guest:I walked home one time from a bar in Toronto, and I woke up the next morning.
Guest:To here?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:Yeah, that's a really great blackout.
Guest:I was a two-month walk, and I woke up the next morning with a mitten, and I went, oh, my God, this is a child's mitten.
Guest:And then the worst thought is the next morning, that's the man.
Guest:And it turned out a waitress had given me her, she had tiny hands, and she'd given me her mitten because I'd lost a glove, but that's the worst thing when you wake up going, what's this?
Guest:There's a road flare.
Marc:Oh, yeah, or your car has got blood and hair on the fender.
Guest:Is that human?
Guest:No, it's rabbit blood.
Guest:Oh, thank God.
Marc:So I was doing some poking around, you know, because there's a part of my comedy career that, you know, where, you know, I spent time at the comedy store, and, you know, you were this myth there at that time.
Marc:Oh, totally.
Marc:And, you know, I started looking at stuff.
Marc:And, you know, I talk to a lot of younger comics now, and their history of comedy really starts at Mr. Show or maybe 10 years ago.
Marc:And, you know, when you mention Robin Williams or Pryor or Kennison or anybody, they're like, yeah, I don't know.
Marc:I don't know.
Guest:Those are crazy times because Sam, you know, Sam's first night up was just, I remember seeing, who's the guy screaming?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And supposedly Sam got on because he rescued Mitzi from Argus.
Marc:Right, it was Argus Hamilton who was strangling her in some sort of drunk frenzy.
Guest:And then, ah, get away!
Guest:Sam rescued her and then they put Sam on.
Guest:My favorite nights were the nights that Pryor was working on Live on Sunset.
Guest:The first one before he set himself on fire, the first stand-up.
Guest:And you just it'd be these weird nights where you just watch him.
Guest:And then sometimes you get to go on after him once in a while.
Guest:Like he would, you know, have people come on stage with him.
Guest:And then there'd be people in the audience like Willie Nelson would play music at the end after everyone split.
Guest:And you go, it's like jazz.
Guest:It's pretty wonderful.
Guest:But now, did Pryor sort of take you under his wing somehow?
Guest:Well, he took everybody under his wing, because he had that variety show that he had on, I think it was NBC.
Guest:It was like, the first show was amazing, because he had this thing, it pans up here, he's not wearing, you think he's just got his shirt off, and he goes, look at me, it's Richard Pryor.
Guest:I'm on TV, I didn't have to give up anything.
Guest:I'm on NBC, live.
Guest:And then they panned down, and he's a Ken doll, he's got no genitalia.
Guest:And then after that, they started saying, you know, Richard, you can't do that, you know.
Guest:And then he... By the time the last show aired, they said, okay, Richard, you... He was kind of angry at them, and he said, okay, just film me doing stand-up.
Guest:And they said, oh, great.
Guest:They filmed him for 45 minutes.
Guest:They had 30 seconds they could use.
Guest:That was it.
Guest:Yeah, but it was like... He had... Everybody was Mooney, Sandra Bernhardt, everybody.
Guest:He just hired all the comics to be like his players in this comedy troupe, and it was pretty wonderful.
Guest:But it was...
Guest:I think he just loved hanging out there, you know, and, you know, you'd see him backstage.
Guest:One night somebody yelled out at him.
Guest:They said, Richard, do mud bow.
Guest:And he went, fuck you.
Guest:You do it.
Guest:You know it better than me.
Guest:And he did a piece one night that was the most beautiful piece I'd ever seen him do.
Guest:He did a piece about God coming back to earth to pick up his kid.
Guest:And he's going, where's my boy?
Guest:And then, and he had everyone all the, you know, and they go, you want to tell him?
Guest:And he went, I don't know.
Guest:You know, get the Pope.
Guest:He'll tell him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Where's my son?
Guest:We killed him.
Guest:What do you mean?
Guest:Well, we killed him, but he came back, and then he split, and we haven't seen him.
Guest:And then Pryor looked around and went, and then God was about, I'm going to destroy him.
Guest:Then all of a sudden he took a moment and went, all right, that's it.
Guest:i'm leaving i'm not coming back i'm gonna leave you love and if you fuck that up you're on your own and they walked off stage and you can see the entire audience go like well they never did it again but it was a weird kind of like i just went the most strangely beautiful piece and the response of the audience was like
Guest:that wasn't a character yeah that was just him i love that kind of shit it was wonderful it's like those nights you see when you go on and someone says something so fucking wild and wonderful and deep deep so deep that even people in the audience are going that's deep i don't know how to respond yeah exactly deep it was yeah i that was one of the questions i was thinking of when i was coming down here is that you know despite whatever problems you had throughout your career that i never sensed any animosity towards an audience
Guest:Yeah!
Guest:Yeah!
Guest:Yeah!
Guest:And I was like, oh, fuck.
Guest:It was, I went, oh, I get it.
Guest:Did you do it?
Guest:No, I finally went, goodnight, because I went, I've got to stop, because you really just want to see me pass out, don't you?
Guest:And they would go, fuck yeah.
Guest:You know, it's that weird, you know, from Hanging with Sam, Crash and Burn, that's the way to go.
Marc:Well, I mean, but that's the way I did it.
Marc:Because I was trying to put into perspective, like, you know, despite my own drug and alcohol problems throughout the years, they never garnered me, you know, any... You know, if I was drunk or fucked up up there, I would go after an audience.
Marc:I would blame them.
Marc:I would...
Marc:I would say, I have open shows by saying, what do you fucking want?
Guest:Oh, the worst case of that I saw was Keith Jarrett played recently at the Civic, I guess the concert hall, Symphony Hall, Davies Symphony Hall.
Guest:And he's an amazing solo pianist and he plays his things, but he wants absolute quiet.
Guest:And if you cough, he literally, after he finishes the piece, he goes, listen, people don't cough when I play in my studio at home.
Guest:Can you try?
Guest:And he called it a failure in concentration.
Guest:The Japanese don't cough.
Guest:And then finally he played this beautiful piece and it got to a quiet part in this moment And you could see him literally go like this and after and then he went up to the mic again to start to talk tell people Hey, that's not cool.
Guest:Someone would just play
Guest:And I went, it was like, dance for me, black boy.
Guest:It was like, and you could see him kind of go, and he walked off.
Guest:And then he came back out, because he realized, wait a minute, I can't let you win.
Guest:He could have, because in Italy, he told everyone to go fuck themselves.
Guest:But he walked out on stage, and he said, okay, what do you want to hear?
Guest:And they started yelling requests, and he played some beautiful, like, old standard.
Guest:And then he played Somewhere Over the Rainbow, this jazz rendition, really beautifully.
Guest:And at that point, even the hardcore were like, great, I love you.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then he did, you know, he walked off stage, he got the first kind of, and I think the hardcore, the people that are angry going, just play, they split.
Guest:And then he did five encores, so by the fifth encore, it was just the people who knew, hey, and they were totally quiet, and it was so beautiful.
Guest:By the end, he had kind of done the Buddhist thing of rather than tell them to go fuck themselves, he said, what do you want, like you said.
Guest:He did what they wanted, and then the hardcore, the nasties, the entitled white people who are now picketing now today.
Guest:They split, and then what was left was the people go, I get it.
Guest:We're sharing this experience.
Guest:But it's like, you know, it's so weird.
Guest:Sometimes you get an audience that's just like the gift, and then other times you get the audience from hell.
Marc:I just don't completely understand the non-angry based comic.
Guest:I mean I guess what's hard to say when you know you've got like there's not a lot for me to be angry at you know I guess that's true I guess when you have like a show like especially when Mork and Mindy was on someone told me you used to come out and just you know say hi and people go ha ha you haven't said anything funny that's the scary thing is there's that kind of oh you're famous you're funny but the weird thing is what do you got to be pissed about you know it was like that weird thing I used to joke when I was 16 before I went to Europe no that doesn't sound good
Guest:you know don't you hate it when you have to walk to a private plane right right no fuck you know how many people have problems with their maid yeah well one of my houses it's like when all of a sudden there was the malibu fires and people are forced to leave their second home i went ain't life a bitch yeah right it's like i guess that's true it's but it's weird but you can still get angry with like you said ignorance or like just drunks but being angry at a drunk is like bitch slapping a cow it's not really effective yeah
Guest:And I guess that's true.
Guest:I mean, when did you do, how old were you when you did Mork?
Guest:I mean, I was about 20, 29, 27.
Guest:And that was crazy shit.
Guest:You know, I'd go from, you know, doing the show and then come to do the comedy store and then go to the improv.
Guest:And then you'd go hang out at clubs and then, you know, end up in the hills in some Coke dealer's house, you know.
Guest:Yeah, sure.
Guest:Angel, it's Robin.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And then you'd wake up the next morning going, oh, and I don't wake up if you haven't gone to sleep.
Guest:And, you know, you're like a vampire on a day pass going, how are you?
Hi.
Marc:yeah and then you have to go do it again you know I have no regrets I met a lot of interesting people logged a lot of hours a few pirates that you just like I mean you're Robin Williams and you're in this room with a guy who says he's a gaffer some guy with an eye patch and you're waiting for some other guy to bring shit that you don't even know where it came from and if you're famous most of the time you get it for free which is weird it's like the same thing when you get gift baskets at award shows going I don't need this stuff thank you but my cookies will go here dude
Guest:Yeah, we love you.
Guest:We want to see you die.
Guest:You want to see you die?
Guest:I don't want to get you high because it's part of our advertising campaign.
Guest:I got Robin loaded.
Guest:Yeah, and they like being connected to you.
Guest:And it's part of the whole thing of a little dust for you, and then you'll spread the word on other celebrities, and eventually if they get busted, then they can subpoena you.
Marc:Right.
Guest:But also they get to hang out with you.
Marc:Big time.
Guest:And then they realize, Jesus on Coke, you're a boring fuck.
Guest:You look out the window a lot.
Guest:Yeah, I do.
Guest:There's ninjas coming up the wall.
Marc:Ninjas and maybe just cops.
Guest:I mean, yeah.
Guest:What are you doing?
Guest:What's that noise?
Guest:It's a spider.
Marc:But that Hollywood Hills thing then, I can't even imagine what it was like.
Marc:Because by the time I was there with Sam, I mean, it seemed like the wave was crashing.
Marc:I mean, he was the most demonic manifestation of that scene.
Marc:I mean, shit, you were there.
Guest:I had to bail him out once.
Guest:I had to go...
Guest:i think it was one of the houses i don't know if you lived there but one of the houses he trashed a house and they were going to take him to court so i ended up paying the cleaning deposit and another time he did it to a hotel room in new york and they're about to take him when i ended up saying okay i'll cover your hotel bill but it was weird that whole kind of you know throwing tvs out the window you're going this old school yeah this old english but is it necessary fucking did it why are you doing that exactly shitting on the carpet yeah
Guest:Yeah, taking it, you know, what are you doing?
Guest:Took a dump on your RV.
Marc:Were you there doing it?
Marc:I was gone when he was doing that.
Marc:No, I know, because I was there.
Marc:Yeah, you were there.
Guest:There was talk of you.
Guest:Yeah, he'd gone.
Guest:At that point, I moved back up to Napa.
Marc:But you'd been clean then, by then, weren't you?
Guest:I had 20 years sober before I relapsed recently, and it was like...
Guest:It was that whole thing about my son being born.
Guest:It was just like, fuck, I can't do this anymore.
Marc:I remember you did material on that about having the kid and having it be like Coke.
Guest:Yeah, it's like you're awake, you haven't slept, you smell like shit and piss.
Marc:What the hell do you think happened this time?
Guest:What brought you out?
Guest:What brought me relapse?
Guest:I was up in Alaska in a place.
Marc:Enough said.
Marc:Yeah, there you go.
Guest:Who's up there?
Guest:People witness protection.
Guest:Go to the bar and say, nice tooth.
Guest:It's another planet.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Even when I was drinking there, even the bartender went, I thought you were sober.
Guest:I am.
Guest:Can you keep a secret?
Guest:And I started drinking a tiny little bottle of Jack Daniels, like the little ones you get in the airplane.
Guest:And I thought, this is
Guest:fine yeah it's a small week later i was hiding them you know a big bottle of jack daniels and just like yeah it went quick and it was and it was just being in alaska what were you doing up there this movie called the big white and just totally just thinking what am i doing here this is crazy and then feeling kind of like isolated and all of a sudden went well there's one cure and all of a sudden you feel i feel warm after this and then it was just so fucking quick were you publicly drunk
Guest:A couple of times, yeah.
Guest:A couple of times that people had to kind of go, maybe you should go home now.
Guest:You know, it's nice.
Guest:It's like, I think you said this once at a Coke dealer.
Guest:Actually said, that's enough.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Sent me home.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was like, that's when they, when you know you're fucked up, when your dealer's going, I think you got to stop.
Guest:You got to go.
Guest:At least for the day.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:yeah they start talking that shit to you yeah you gotta clean up your act and then it was three years of just and denying and the whole myth that uh with alcoholics that vodka doesn't smell until you sweat oh yeah and then you just start acting out and acting out and acting out and acting out and then until eventually i was in can at a fundraiser on stage you know just drunk off my ass and i looked up and i went
Guest:Oh, that's a wall of cameras.
Guest:That's kind of cool.
Guest:At this point you're going, why don't you just take a shit on the stage and then people might notice.
Guest:What are you doing?
Marc:And you're not really the kind of guy where they're like, ah, it's Robin.
Guest:Yeah, no, no, at that point they're going...
Guest:Oh, this isn't good.
Marc:Oh, Opie's doing crack.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Can't pee.
Marc:And do you think it was some... You can really... I mean, I know drinking is just drinking and the mind says... No, no, I think it's trying to fill the hole and it's fear and you're kind of going, where am I doing in my career?
Guest:And you start thinking, you know what would be great at this point?
Guest:Rehab.
Guest:But it's the idea of...
Guest:Just you bottom out.
Marc:Yeah, you felt a sort of emptiness and a fear of where you go next.
Guest:Where do you go next and what am I doing?
Guest:And rather than kind of go, okay, this will pass, you go, no, this will pass quicker.
Marc:But it's so interesting to me that, you know, you have these experiences.
Marc:And, you know, I mean, you're an international superstar.
Guest:It should fade, so.
Guest:You know, the weird thing is people say, you have an Academy Award.
Guest:The Academy Award lasted about a week.
Guest:And then one week later, people go, hey, Mork.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, God.
Guest:So you're back.
Guest:And it's like...
Guest:all that stuff you know you still get that you don't get that anymore oh god yeah come on once in a while just because it's on nickelodeon or you get people kind of go that's the memory bank it's a show like that is in people's like kishik memory does that bother you no i go it paid for the ranch it paid for the house right and it was great experiences i got to meet wonderful people and it paid a lot of bills and kicked my career way in the ass
Guest:Don Barrera said, without that, where the fuck would you be?
Guest:I would go, you're right.
Guest:Did he say that recently?
Guest:No, that was, oh, fuck you.
Guest:But it's, you know, it was that weird fucking thing of, yeah, you have all this stuff, but the weird thing, the only sanity clause, that sounds like it much, but hey, that's, I don't believe in a sanity clause.
Guest:The idea is going on stage is the one salvation.
Guest:Now, how long did you stay away from stand-up?
Guest:Not long.
Guest:I mean, it would come and go.
Guest:It became like after the 2002 tour came after 9-11.
Guest:It was literally, we were doing this Mark Twain Award in Washington.
Guest:And it was like, I think, almost a month after 9-11.
Guest:And people were kind of going, you could see that there was just like, almost like lifting a siege.
Guest:And you went, oh, Jesus, man, it is good to get back out and do this shit, you know?
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:I mean, I saw you at Stand Up New York a couple of times.
Marc:That's what I love going on there.
Marc:And it's a very small place.
Marc:We're at the Comedy Cellar.
Marc:And, like, I mean, you, you know, I mean, your desire to connect and your style, like you were saying before, there's this weird thrill where the people, they see you get to take the stage.
Marc:But then the thrill wears off, and then you've got to find stage.
Marc:And then, yeah, you've got to get in it.
Marc:And we were talking about that before at the Comedy Cellar, that the honesty...
Marc:where you're at your point in your life now, where you're at the age you're at now and you're having the experiences you're at now, I mean, it takes some balls to really deal with that stuff.
Guest:To deal with it, I mean, I'm not to the point where prior could talk about it in so fucking deep, you know.
Guest:But that's your inspiration.
Guest:Yeah, my inspiration, and with the people I see doing, I mean, you talk about it honestly, Chris Rock, Chris did the most amazing thing recently, he said, you know, it's weird.
Guest:All of a sudden, if you get a sexual, you know, if you cheat on your wife, everything is a felony first degree.
Guest:But that should be like if you get a blowjob in Georgia from a stewardess, that should just be a misdemeanor.
Guest:If you fuck a best friend, that's a felony.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And you go like, have you turned this routine for your wife?
Guest:Not yet.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But it's that balls about what can you talk about?
Marc:Isn't it funny?
Marc:The balls is not it's not relative to to transgressing any cultural taboos, but it's like, well, I don't know if she'll take that shit.
Marc:Big time.
Marc:Those are the real butterflies.
Marc:They really are.
Guest:When you come home to that, you know.
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Even if you've only been dating them two months.
Guest:Big time.
Guest:And you go, well, can she tell the way that she... And then you can't pull that thing.
Marc:It's like, it's my act.
Marc:It's not your act.
Marc:I was with you when that happened.
Marc:That was us.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:that was me that thing when you look like you're going down on a girl that's what you look like yeah fuck off yeah and it's like you know that's the scariest part it's also people when you do like jokes about famous people or anybody and then you run into them what sand were it never forgave me for something serious
Marc:Kind of.
Marc:I mean, I did this joke where I used as a descriptive, you know, like I mocked Adam Sandler fans.
Marc:And then I run into him at the improv one night and he's like, I hear you're talking about me.
Marc:And I'm like, yeah, I did on television.
Marc:You've got to get over it.
Marc:Yeah, it's like, what's your problem?
Marc:And I'm like, dude, you're a cultural icon.
Marc:At some point, we can't, you know.
Marc:You don't get immunity.
Marc:Well, I'm in no position.
Marc:Like, you know, it's not like I have any cachet.
Marc:I'm still able to make those kind of mistakes.
Marc:The liability for me is like, well, you're not in the group.
Marc:You know, you will be excluded.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And also that you'll never get in now, you fuck.
Guest:You would never get in.
Guest:Do you want in?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:It's like Crouch and Mark said, do you want to be a member of a club that would have you as a member?
Guest:No.
Guest:It's that fucking frightening thing.
Guest:I mean, one time I was doing this thing, and it was a benign impression of Stallone, you know, as being monosyllabic.
Guest:And Billy Crystal leaned over and went, he's here.
Guest:Hi!
Guest:And then you've got to go, then you've got to deal with it.
Guest:How did he deal with it?
Guest:He was funny.
Guest:It's not that, he's not saying like what Bobcat said that during the Vietnam War he was teaching Jim the Swiss schoolgirls.
Guest:That, he was a little upset.
Guest:If you actually attack their character.
Guest:Yeah, if you attack their character and actually go after a real hardcore personal point, then they get like, I'll kill you again.
Guest:how do you take it when people it's hard it hurts but then you realize and and you what do you do for a living i make fun of people good luck thank you yeah it's a i guess you have to get buddhist and say you're you're there dude like you said you're in you're in the mix when you fuck up you're in the mix like yeah like a week ago i did this thing on letterman and i thought this is pretty benign i just come back from australia and he said how's australia you know australians are like english rednecks
Guest:Cut to, I land in L.A., and they said the prime minister of Australia was offended by the remark.
Guest:He basically said, perhaps Mr. Williams should spend some time in Alabama before he calls someone a redneck, which triggered the governor of Alabama to call the prime minister of Australia and said, you know, people in Alabama are decent, hardworking people.
Guest:In other words, we're not rednecks either.
Guest:Now he's campaigning against Australia to keep a seat.
Guest:No, no, I have to have a linguist.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They go, no, you don't ever call us there.
Guest:G'day, no, what are you saying?
No.
Guest:And it was just weird to go, oh, wow, I pissed off a prime minister.
Guest:That's this weird thing.
Guest:But then it was like, then I went on Australian radio going, I was talking linguistically.
Guest:If you combine an English accent and a good old boy, you get this.
Guest:You know, if you go, hello, good to see you.
Guest:And hey, how are you?
Guest:You get, hi, good eye, yo.
Guest:and it's just that was the joke the joke was i didn't even say that joke that was the joke i did that wasn't spin you were trying to i didn't know i was trying to spin it back so i don't get you know land in australia and get a cavity search hi you know roman step back here i'm being fried we're putting on an oven mitt when i talked to uh yeah it's a very coincidental but i i actually uh had steve pearl in my hotel room yesterday
Guest:Fucking A. He said that.
Guest:He's been so wonderful to see him back here and so sane again.
Guest:And he would be funny as shit because he got so dark when he lived in L.A.
Guest:I know.
Guest:And that's how I knew him.
Guest:That's when I met him.
Guest:You knew him in the dark, dark Steven.
Guest:Well, that's what's called.
Guest:The anti-Steven.
Guest:And now he's still fucking hilariously funny.
Guest:But it's like he's got a girlfriend and he's up here and he's away from the black hole.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And the black hole in himself seems to have filled in a little bit.
Guest:Oh, big time.
Guest:He's happy.
Guest:He's chipper and he's like sparky.
Guest:But he's still like, he's fucking, he does the same.
Guest:I'll tell you right now.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he does all this.
Guest:And he's like, you see him at the Throckmorton and he's like, he kicks ass.
Marc:Is he killing?
Marc:Killing.
Marc:Well, that was the interesting thing because like, you know, in the San Francisco, like I get a lot of comedy nerds that listen to this show.
Marc:And they're sort of an elite bunch, some of them.
Marc:That must be a weird group.
Marc:Well, they are weird.
Guest:Just this side of comic people.
Marc:Well, exactly.
Marc:But they've sort of latched on.
Marc:I think it started with Mr. Show, with Bob and Dave.
Marc:And there's a sort of intelligentsia element to it.
Guest:People who know I've found.
Guest:And I also think people like finding young comics.
Guest:They find niche comics.
Guest:So they go, I found this guy.
Guest:No one knows him.
Marc:Well, that's what it is.
Marc:There's a whole community around that.
Marc:Like, you performed at the UCB, I think, a couple of times.
Marc:My favorite.
Marc:Yeah, and that's sort of like, you know, ground zero of that.
Marc:That's ground zero for weird, strange, like, kicking it comedy.
Marc:Well, that's like the analogy I was trying to make and trying to talk to Pearl when I could talk to him, you know, when I wasn't.
Marc:When you were swimming upstream.
Marc:Being bombarded with the history of civilization in small fragments.
Marc:Was that, you know, San Francisco, I guess in the late 70s and early 80s, when you guys were here, really defined a type of comedy.
Marc:And I don't think people really talk about it that much.
Marc:And I think that you and Pearl were sort of at the center of what became a riff style.
Marc:There was a lot of people.
Guest:There was him, Pearl.
Guest:There was Paula Poundstone.
Guest:There was all these weird A. Whitney Brown.
Guest:Now he says the Whitney Brown.
Guest:There's all the, and Dana, Carvey, and a lot of, because it had weird clubs.
Guest:Bobby Slayton.
Guest:Jews, old Jews.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Jews and Chinese.
Marc:The battle of the ancient cultures.
Marc:Give me the Mo.
Marc:I want the Mo.
Guest:Well, you've got to think the clubs kind of brought that out, like the Holy City Zoo, which is a weird kind of wine bar next to a hardcore rock and roll bar, or the other cafe located near.
Guest:The streetcars are going by.
Guest:All of a sudden, you'd be doing a show, and then you'd see the weird people getting off.
Guest:And it was that, the other cafe, some cobs when it was down in the marina, weird clubs that kind of brought out weird styles.
Marc:And it seemed like the community in San Francisco sort of indulged your indulgence.
Marc:Totally.
Marc:You can't do it anywhere else.
Guest:No, I mean, I think you're right.
Guest:It was an eclectic mix, you know, that allowed, you know, like weird comedy, like Freaky Ralph, who eventually set himself on fire.
Guest:To close?
Guest:No, to end his life.
Guest:Oh, no, to close.
Guest:Yeah, that's the ultimate closing.
Guest:But seriously, I'll be here until five minutes from now.
Guest:God, man, you're killing yourself.
Guest:Oh, shit.
Guest:Oh, fuck.
Guest:You have to close.
Guest:Only a comic record.
Guest:To close.
Guest:How did you see the first or second show?
Guest:It's not an opener.
Guest:Oh, God.
Guest:So the style that you like.
Guest:Mine was just based on the fact that I didn't use a mic.
Guest:Because if you're on mic, if I can go off mic, and also wading into these clubs is the only way to kind of, you know, wading.
Guest:If people started heckling you, you'd just wade over into the audience and kind of go in near their table or move away from them and use the other side of the room and fuck the loud people over here and the drunks at the bar.
Guest:So you're you from the beginning.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And just playing off a shit that was going on or just kind of go, OK, what's coming in with some ideas, but not like good evening, ladies and gentlemen.
Guest:One of the great strange performers at that time was Jeremy Kramer.
Guest:There is an eclectic name that Jeremy would go on and just do loud, wonderful characters.
Guest:He was like the West Coast Gilbert Gottfried.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And he would be loud.
Guest:Hi, everybody.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he would do, you know, weird kind of wonderful, strange characters that literally if people would love him or drive people out of the room, there was no middle ground.
Marc:Well, there was some integrity to that at a certain point in time that people left.
Guest:You know, when Gilbert would do the entire rock opera of Tommy as Jerry Lewis.
Guest:That's a ballsy move until he'd empty the room and the only person left was Larry David.
Guest:That's when you go, that's commitment.
Marc:Yeah, and I think that there's still something to be said for that.
Marc:You don't see people with that much balls anymore.
Marc:I think it does take a certain amount of balls to cut that type of territory on stage.
Guest:Cut that type of territory and realize, or...
Guest:like lenny schultz in the middle of one time this is the strangest name in comedy you know giant lenny steroid pumped up lenny on stage doing a children's showcase for a nickelodeon uh-huh and at one point he realizes this isn't going well then he pulls out a double-headed dildo how is this for your fucking kids and then starts playing playing it with playing turkey in the straw with a double-headed dildo and going oh man
Guest:That's comedy.
Guest:That's comedy.
Guest:That's the real stuff.
Marc:That's the business, my boy.
Marc:Well, that's interesting, though.
Marc:So you come out of Juilliard doing it.
Marc:You did stand up.
Guest:I left school.
Guest:I fell in love with this girl.
Guest:Did you finish?
Guest:No, I didn't finish.
Guest:They even wanted me to finish, and they kept saying, come back.
Guest:And I went, I fell in love with this girl, moved back here, couldn't find acting work, and one day went...
Guest:Well, there's a weird comedy workshop.
Guest:And, you know, because I'd done a lot of.
Guest:What year are we talking?
Guest:Probably 76.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Three years ago, you know, probably maybe even 75.
Guest:And just doing this comedy workshop in the basement of the intersection coffee house.
Guest:And then all of a sudden there was they had a night of lesbian poetry and stand up comedy, which is a great audience to begin with.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:Because you know they're going to like you just being a man.
Guest:A man, yeah.
Guest:There's going to be a lot of love there.
Guest:Big male penis violence.
Guest:But it was weird and starting with that and then this weird kind of comedy thing of a lot like the zoo had one night of comedy.
Guest:And a lot of clubs at that time were kind of going, we'll try a night of comedy.
Guest:Whereas in the 80s, everything, every disco, every other club had a comedy night.
Marc:But I think that whole no mic thing really defines, you know, still that.
Marc:Because when I go off mic, the control you have of a room changes dramatically.
Marc:Totally.
Marc:People are forced to kind of go, what?
Marc:Yeah, they're like, take it in.
Guest:And so you were able to sort of like, you know.
Guest:But I know guys who do that, you know, who really, that's why when I do stand-up, I use a wireless mic.
Guest:I just, I don't, this is hard for me to go, okay, good evening, thanks.
Guest:And it seemed to me almost old school to go, hi, everybody, nice to be here.
Guest:Holding the mic.
Guest:Holding the mic.
Guest:and when i've had to go do clubs where i do i kind of i leave it in the stand and kind of come and go to it it's almost like oh come back point of reference come back but it was also the thing i gotta move a moving target literally and you still like you know you still like put it out there man i mean you got it for me and the reason like when we go on at the comedy cellar it's therapy it's it's a it's it's a relief from that shit like you said of this this weird thing of this celebrity and all that other crazy shit
Guest:where you can go on stage and especially like you go on stage late and like you said with an audience it's kind of especially i don't know there's certain audiences want to go okay so it's something new right and they're a little beaten up if you go on late you know and it's they're beaten up and then they're going and then you know if you find something new it's new then it's new and also different or really honest or really like you said deep or just fucking crazy shit
Marc:But I think the personal truth becomes more daunting.
Marc:For me, it's a difficult thing to do.
Marc:It's like if you want to pontificate or take a soapbox, which I've done plenty of in my life, and I'm just at this point, and I'm a little younger than you, where it seems to me that the real risk, the one thing that all of us share is that existential fear, the panic of what does it really all fucking mean?
Marc:What do we do with this anger?
Guest:uh and and what do you do with the anger and what do you do with the beneath the angers of fear like you said what's the fear yeah and i talk about that and you talk about it to a 20 something and they're going because they're they're like immune at that point well yeah i do a bit about how like i've gotten old enough to uh to resent people for being young
Marc:Like, and I'll ask someone in the audience, how old are you?
Marc:And if they go like 22, I go, you know, fuck you.
Marc:You're 22.
Marc:You think you got life by the balls?
Marc:And I tell them, I say, you do.
Marc:You do have life by the balls.
Marc:But what you don't realize is that the cock of life is planted firmly in your ass.
Marc:And you're just helping it along.
Yeah.
Marc:And they don't really know what to do with that because there's no way they can... You can't fathom that.
Marc:Well, I do the podcast.
Marc:You know who can fathom it?
Marc:There's this, like, I get emails from 14 to 18-year-old guys saying, you know, I really understand where you're at, the frustration, all this stuff.
Marc:And then when they get about 20, you know, 20 to 35, which is the prime demographic, I got nothing for them.
Marc:But, you know, 18...
Marc:14 to 18 year old kids, they understand the fear and the pain and everything else.
Marc:And then the cocky time comes.
Marc:And then when you get in your mid 30s, you're like, oh, now I get it.
Marc:So I've alienated the only profitable demographic.
Marc:I'm very clever like that.
Marc:You're basically 18 to 25.
Guest:Fuck off.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's why I want to talk about Twitter to me.
Guest:I go Twitter.
Guest:Why would I Twitter?
Guest:The next step for me is stalker.
Guest:you know i'm having lunch i know yeah yeah i might know the table near you well there's a there's a website where they say uh you know where you know people are twittering so much that you know for criminals they're like well he's not home he just told us he wasn't there and they talked about it in the news and went great even now they now you're giving them even more of a clue what the fuck like yeah look i'm having lunch yes oh fucking hey we're at your house yeah thanks for the stuff yeah and your dog is not here
Guest:well how do you now like i notice and now with the with the last one the weapons of self-destruction is that what it was yeah that you are taking you know more risks than you have before with your own life and your yourself it's also you know it's that weird thing of still talking kind of in general terms versus hardcore specific terms which is like that thing that you leave either for that at one point i had a therapist go are you comfortable talking about this i went
Guest:maybe you know it's that idea of like i told you with chris he was talking about stuff i went wow would that i had the balls you know but at the time i was in the middle of a divorce you're going not good
Guest:Initially, I was going to call the tour, remember the alimony, and they went, maybe not.
Guest:Not until we get the paper signed.
Guest:You're not paying alimony, number one.
Guest:Number two, not profitable.
Guest:The idea of... Well, that's bitter.
Guest:There's a line where... Yeah, I mean, someone said recently that they saw John Cleese, who was going through this divorce, and he was on stage, and he was so angry that the audience at one point was like, stop, you know.
Marc:Right, because bitterness is not, I tried to sell it for a long time, and it's really just amplified self-pity.
Marc:Totally.
Marc:And it reads that way.
Marc:And people kind of go, I get it, but you move on.
Guest:Right, that's the weird thing about people.
Guest:If you can talk, it's that old acting thing.
Guest:The more personal you make it, the more specific you make it, the more people relate to you.
Guest:Because they'll go, as personal as you think it is, there's a lot of people going, I feel that.
Right.
Marc:Well, that's where you get them.
Marc:But where to get that in comedy is a little trickier.
Guest:Yeah, because you walk over that line and going, I feel this and I want to burn.
Guest:And you go, no, no, we don't feel that.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Or they go, don't share that part.
Marc:Well, then you have to accept that idea that where they can, you know, where either they laugh with you or they laugh at you.
Marc:At some point, you have to be comfortable if they're laughing at you.
Guest:You're comfortable with either one laughing at you.
Guest:Can you tolerate that?
Guest:And that's maybe sometimes where I go.
Guest:oh you know the insecure part goes no no what do you what are you afraid will happen i guess it's that fear of you'll recognize that you know as you know how insecure are we really yeah how desperately insecure that we that made us do this for a living well i just i went to your imdb page and over the the 25 years of of uh appearance changes i think that they can
Marc:Big time going, why the beard?
Guest:You have a beard.
Guest:You have a beard.
Guest:You're fat.
Guest:You're thin.
Guest:You're blonde hair.
Guest:You're bald.
Guest:It's that weird thing.
Guest:But those are a lot of times for characters.
Guest:But it's the idea of at what point, you know, what level of acceptance, like you said.
Guest:And look what we do for a living in terms of stand-up.
Guest:You get to do stuff that if you did it, you know, just on the street, people go...
Guest:Batman.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He talked about his penis to me openly.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And you're going, but you're doing it in a club.
Guest:All of a sudden there's license to thrill that old thing.
Guest:You can do this stuff.
Guest:But like you said, the line stepping over and back over the line of like, what are you going to find out?
Guest:You're going to find out that, you know, you're this weird, insecure guy who does this and looks and looking like Lenny Bruce said for love going and
Guest:do you love me yeah temporarily yeah kind of yeah and then and can you put that at risk going i don't care if you love me i gotta say this shit and that's why i guess sometimes you go is that an artist or is that a sociopath yeah or a psychopath well let's not make labels let's not call i'm not gonna label him in fact he stabbed that family but he's genius you know he's a genius he's a good man that's what's his name buddy hitler yeah that's the norman mailer school he can write that guy oh boy god bless him yeah
Marc:But do you find that you, do you really feel like you, like when you grew up, because like my relationship with my parents sort of defined, you know, who I am.
Marc:Mine too.
Marc:But like, were your parents absent?
Guest:No.
Guest:My father, when I was young, he was off, he was a vice president of Lincoln Mercury, so like a sales division.
Guest:So he was all over the Midwest.
Guest:He'd come back and I know he'd come back because all of a sudden there'd be like this new corgi toy.
Guest:He'd be like, I brought you back a little, like a thing.
Guest:It was like,
Guest:Cool.
Guest:You were only child?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I have two half brothers.
Guest:One I found out later on.
Guest:For a long time, they told me he was my cousin.
Guest:It's a bit like Nicholson.
Guest:Lauren's your cousin.
Guest:Then when I got to be 12, I went, no, actually, he's your half brother.
Guest:It's like, you know, I felt like Nicholson should walk in.
Guest:What is it?
Guest:Is it your brother or your cousin?
Guest:and then you know my mother and your cousin very very really funny terminal optimist everything is wonderful beautiful my father is you know the hardcore pessimist you know i asked when i told him i wanted to be an actor he said great have a backup profession like welding but it was like the between the two of them i got this weird kind of
Guest:Not cynical, but hyper-realism and this hyper-optimism of my mother.
Guest:Everything is rainbows and beauty.
Guest:And a bit like Tom Cruise, all you need is vitamins and exercise.
Guest:And then you'll be fine.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Even while I'm addicted to coke, we can get you through that.
Guest:That's vitamins.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Vitamin C, Colombian calcium.
Guest:But it was like between the two of them, you get this weird desire to connect with her using kind of comedy and entertainment.
Guest:And my father about, you know, look at the world realistically, be hardcore, you know, that pony's going to shit sometime.
Guest:I guess it was this old... I don't know who said this years ago.
Guest:Your mother knows how to push your buttons because she installed them.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I used to have this pillow that my mother saw that said, if it's not one thing, it's your mother.
Guest:And she was, what does that mean?
Guest:I went, I don't know, Mom.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:What do you want it to mean?
Guest:See, them or the wife.
Marc:Someone's going to... Someone's going to get like, oh.
Marc:So how... Because it seems like you're back on the scene, you know, doing stand-up regularly.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And you've got the big... How do you deal with the bitterness of your peers and...
Marc:And what they direct at you?
Marc:Because, you know, things are said in the community.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, a lot of it's old school and a lot of it's true from the way past.
Guest:But, you know, I don't hang out in the community.
Guest:I mean, the community up here is pretty mild compared to down there.
Guest:I mean, in New York, I feel safe.
Guest:L.A., I get kind of like...
Marc:What about the whole like, you know, I mean, I'd be remiss if I didn't address it, because it's something that I want to talk to you about.
Marc:And it's something I hear all the time.
Marc:And I think it's demeaning that this whole stealing issue.
Guest:I think in the old days, it was if you hang out in comedy clubs when I was doing almost 24 seven, you you hear things.
Guest:And then if you're improvising, you all of a sudden you repeat it going, oh, shit.
Guest:right that's the way your brain works my brain was working that way now i went and then i went i literally had to go through a period and went i'm not going to hang out anymore i can't because i don't want to be getting into that thing and i was also like the bank of comedy went oh shit here here you go here's money i'm sorry i didn't know that oh shit is that how you dealt with it i just paid shit loads of cash i was just like here you go i'm sorry and then and then after a while i went i bought that line already i saw it and then they have to pay again i went oh fuck i'm sorry
Guest:So just guys who would come up to you and say... Well, say, you know, I do that.
Guest:And I wouldn't go, but so does everybody.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's like there's other stuff that's common material.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And there's other things that you go, fuck, you're right.
Guest:I'm sorry.
Guest:I heard that.
Guest:And then it was like, okay.
Guest:And then I went, I can't hang out in here anymore.
Guest:And then it took literally going...
Guest:when i go here to throckmorton i'll see friends and i can hang out like with overton sure or you see steven and all these other guys and it's like oh cool i'm okay that's why it's kind of like living up here i don't worry about it in new york i go i can go on and hang up upstairs in the restaurant and not and then go on stage i don't want to sit down and watch comics all the time but you know in the old days yeah there was that whole thing about just going from club to club to club yeah yeah there are a lot of people that was like you would say like there were styles and you're like but he's doing him i go
Guest:Yeah, it's Andrew Berthardt's doing Taylor Negron.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:You know, you go like at that point, you're going, look at the blending.
Marc:Well, behind every genius, there's a guy going, he stole my soul.
Guest:But it's that whole thing of what's the bitterness versus do you want to hang out?
Guest:Do you engage?
Guest:And you say, what's the truth of it?
Guest:Yeah, I know the truth of the old days, but now it's like.
Guest:I don't hang, so I don't know.
Marc:Well, that's the weirdest thing is that, like, there's this idea that when you have show business, which is just a community of bitter people aspiring to something, and they're children because what they're aspiring to is ridiculous.
Marc:And, I mean, you've had it...
Marc:you've had a tremendous career for for a lot of reasons but there's a lot of people that you know that they just they go to hollywood i used to do a line where i said it took me years to realize hollywood was my parents that you you go wow looking for approval well yeah just like i'm here where's my where's my trailer uh and and and i think that the bitterness that when when people dismiss somebody who's had a career you know as big and huge as yours that the idea that like you know if he didn't take that one joke he wouldn't be robin williams i mean it's ridiculous
Guest:I mean, even you look at someone like Pryor, who literally did Cosby for the first two years of his life.
Marc:Before the auteur theory of comedy happened in the late 50s, where comics actually owned their point of view, I mean, it was what people did.
Marc:I mean, you know, the Worshbelt guys were like, are you doing that bit about the uncle tonight?
Marc:Can I do it?
Marc:All right.
Guest:And it was interchangeable.
Guest:It's also the idea of, you know, common ground when you say, when there's certain fucking subjects, you go, are you talking about the president?
Guest:Fuck, I talk about the president.
Guest:Well, yeah, but there's a difference between like... But a joke joke.
Guest:A joke joke.
Guest:You can get why it's a crafted thing going, if someone does a joke joke.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But then there's also jokes that are so fucking public domain.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:Public domain just happens.
Marc:How can everyone not?
Marc:There's 10,000 comedians.
Marc:We're all drawing from the same reality pool.
Guest:Yeah, you're like, okay, I got the Olympic joke.
Guest:Of course.
Guest:You got to stop masturbating.
Guest:Why?
Guest:Because I'm trying to examine you.
Guest:It's like these things.
Guest:But then the truly unique guys don't give a fuck.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:They're just like, well, I won't do it anymore.
Guest:But no one ever accused Andy Kaufman because he was so strange.
Guest:Right.
Guest:He's a genius.
Guest:Yeah, fucking A. Did you know him well?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, I was talking to someone the other day.
Guest:I only had one conversation with Andy where he wasn't talking to me as a character.
Guest:And what was that like?
Marc:Were you concerned?
Guest:Not at all.
Guest:He just went, hi, Robin.
Guest:How are you?
Guest:I went, good, Andy.
Guest:How are you?
Guest:Really good.
Guest:I'm just here buying something.
Guest:It was at some health food store.
Guest:And then by the end of the conversation, slowly but surely, he went back to this.
Guest:And I went, OK, I'll see you.
Guest:Take care.
Marc:And that was that?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What were some of the most powerful moments for you, either in movies or just with people?
Marc:I mean, you've worked with everybody.
Marc:Where you were like, you know, that's who this guy is.
Marc:I never, you know, like De Niro or Pacino or, you know, or Pryor, any of those.
Guest:There's a great moment with De Niro.
Guest:We're shooting Awakenings and we're, you know, we're doing a scene where I'm taking him into the Bronx.
Guest:He's on the medication and we're taking him in a car in the Bronx for the first time out of the hospital.
Guest:We do one take and I'm driving around for another setup.
Guest:And all of a sudden this old black wino sees him in the front seat.
Guest:And yells out, hey, Bobby, you still like black pussy?
Guest:And then all of a sudden we get rolling.
Guest:And he's just like... He's laughing so hard that it's just like, oh, my God.
Guest:My other favorite moment is with Jeff Bridges.
Guest:We're shooting a scene and something screws up.
Guest:And he says to me, he said, it's okay.
Guest:It's a gift.
Guest:If something screws up, you know, it's like the idea that it's a gift.
Guest:Don't be afraid of it, you know.
Guest:It's like that idea of...
Guest:Every time when you're making a movie, that forces you to make something special where you didn't plan.
Guest:To get it real.
Guest:Yeah, so real.
Guest:But also, you know, you're in that moment and you're forced to deal with it and deal with it together with the other actor.
Guest:And with him, it was a blast because you're like, you know, you're playing off of someone who's so good.
Guest:That's why when he won finally, it was like, dude, you know.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Guest:I mean, it's high time.
Guest:He deserved it so many other times.
Guest:Oh, big time.
Guest:You know, he's one of those guys who's just like cranking away doing great work and finally went, no, take anything off the top shelf.
Guest:yeah you know the bottom line for me was comics and like you said about the bitterness or whatever you just realize it's the world and you also start to realize I know it's out there but I still enjoy doing this I still enjoy performing and you know say what you say it's alright does it still does it kind of sting sometimes fuck yeah but it's also I still love doing this I'm not going to stop because all of a sudden you're going you fucking hack I went
Guest:i may be but i love doing it you know i like and i occasionally i'll find something and i'll go um i think it's good and i'm getting more like when you see you like you said you go through your bitter phase and you come out the other side you go i just want to talk about this yeah the thing is is like about all that you know how people define comics and and and their bitterness the the the consistency that you have to light up a fucking room is
Marc:I mean, just to go on and just to try to light it up.
Marc:And people are just sitting there waiting.
Marc:When's Robin going to open it up?
Marc:And then you always deliver.
Marc:Is that something you... For me, it's a fun thing to say.
Guest:Open it up is the idea.
Guest:That's the operative word to say.
Guest:If that's what you're looking for, to go to find that moment where you can, like you get it.
Guest:And then when you don't get to open up, it's a bit like, okay, didn't get that moment tonight, but maybe you will.
Guest:It's like open field running for a running back.
Guest:All of a sudden, there's the whole...
Guest:they broke through and then you can do it and you found it i've seen you do that too where you look and you got an idea i think it's the idea of why do we do it because it's there but it's also that's still that same desire that started off going love me but now it's into something uh i'm okay i'm gonna still do it the one thing i'm trying to get rid of is it starts with love me and then i'm like do you still love me now do you
Guest:Well, I love you did the thing about, you said the thing about our old Jesus, if he'd lived.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Bitter Jesus.
Guest:Bitter Jesus in the water up to his ankles.
Guest:I used to be able to walk.
Marc:Well, that's it.
Marc:But it's like an amazing gift that I don't really, you know, like when people talk about stand up, like, I don't know where it comes from.
Marc:I don't know where the jokes come from.
Marc:I don't know how I stand up there and get the laughs.
Guest:Yeah, but you know, but it's a weird thing of when it comes from that place you don't know.
Guest:When you find a new thing, isn't it a bit like, it's like a high and like an endorphin what the fuck moment.
Marc:Well, yeah, I think that I, you know, I do what you do and to some degree is that like a lot of times I just have ideas and I'll start talking about them on stage and wait and hope something's delivered.
Marc:You're literally cornering yourself in a situation in front of people that you have to be funny to get out of this.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you're saying, OK, I'm going to go on stage and I'm going to.
Guest:i'm gonna find it because you're gonna help me find this right right if i feel comfortable and you're gonna empower me to break through right and if it's an intelligent audience you're gonna help me and if you're a drunken late night fucking bridge and tunnel crowd i'm gonna beat my brains out and it's not and you're gonna end up doing a dick joke that's right yeah that's right but it's the idea of you're hoping for that moment of you're gonna help me through this and that's the moment you know and then you just hope like i hope i can repeat that moment i can put that magic in the bottle
Marc:You know, how the fuck do I do that again?
Marc:I'll be back.
Marc:Yeah, I can find myself.
Guest:So are you are you happy?
Guest:All right.
Guest:Are you all right?
Guest:Yeah, really?
Guest:I mean divorce done done and you know dealt with I mean, I think as much love as we can do with that situation and Being around her being around my kids is really much more like I love you guys I live separately, but I'm okay.
Guest:You know how old are your kids?
Guest:28 now 21 almost and 18 so they're old enough to understand oh way way old enough and also to know that they're going you seem better I mean like they seem because I'm not like hey you know I mean it's difficult for them but they're all like they've dealt with it
Guest:i used to do a bit where i'd say uh you know i just uh i never recovered from my parents divorce i was 35 but uh it must be i mean it must be very hard because you know the whole idea of the unit yeah the unit is now two separate but if you guys aren't if there's not hostility and it's done it's no no i mean that is pretty amazing on that level and you have someone new in your life wonderful person and living here in this you know this place and i'm you know pretty much like okay it's a different game you know
Guest:the idea of going back out on the road right away no i'm all right right now how's the heart the heart's good the new the new valve yeah cow valve it sounds like a chris walken routine more cow valve but it's like it's working and as someone said i was talking to somebody saying like you realize that you've had so many second chances with you know number one the alcoholism coming out of that and then the heart surgery and divorce and all these different things going i
Guest:There's a lot to talk about, my friend.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you come out the other side going, what's to be angry about?
Guest:You're a live fucker.
Marc:Right.
Marc:I heard you talk about it on Kimmel's show or something.
Marc:Because I noticed it with Letterman, too.
Marc:After his surgery, the vulnerability.
Guest:Oh, he leaned over to me at one point.
Guest:Who, Kimmel?
Guest:No, Letterman leaned over and said, do you find yourself getting really emotional after this surgery?
Guest:And I started to go, yeah.
Guest:Did you?
Guest:And he said, we're back.
Guest:And I went, oh, fuck, I'm not going to break down.
Guest:I'm not going to pour a ball over Walters.
Guest:But it is, I think, you get more emotional because literally they've cracked the armor.
Guest:You know, you've all of a sudden, you know, guys are like, fuck you, man.
Guest:I'm armored up in the moment.
Guest:They seal you open and it's like literally you are, you know, you have this scar here.
Guest:They opened your ass up and literally to the world went inside, fixed the box and then sealed you back up again and said, you're back.
Marc:It's wild that that box is really is connected to the, that the heart is really the heart.
Marc:Huge.
Guest:And to that, and how men, I mean, I don't know if women are protected as much because they have the fun pillows, but the idea of guys will be like, you know, you'll see a guy toughen up like that, you know, while they're like that.
Guest:The typical body language of when the guys get tense is like, yeah, you can't fuck with me.
Guest:They suddenly tighten up here and tighten up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:hackles on the neck right and then when they crack that open did it stay with you i mean you are conscious of it yeah you're very conscious because there's wires and shit and you're literally like you're so vulnerable in a weird way and the drugs they give you are so powerful that you wake up going i went where am i cleveland why yeah heart surgery oh yeah the drug they gave me for the surgery was the drug that michael was using to sleep on
Guest:Michael Jackson was taking propofol basically for sleeping, and one doctor described this.
Guest:He said it's like taking propofol for sleep disorder is like doing chemotherapy because you're tired of shaving your head.
Guest:It is so fucking insanely powerful drug that it's designed for surgery.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And the fact that somebody was administering to this, even though it was a doctor, said you're administering basically the most powerful anesthesia there is.
Marc:Now, did you, like, before the heart surgery, were you somebody that was hung up on that?
Marc:The mortality element?
Guest:No.
Guest:Literally, I went, they found it.
Guest:I didn't go in going, you do, they say, what are the odds?
Guest:I knew with the doctor I picked that the odds are really great.
Guest:He'd done 4,000 surgeries.
Guest:All of them have gone well.
Guest:I didn't know the after surgeries, but the idea that...
Guest:the idea of dying under the knife with with a valve replacement is really small but is it there you go is it possibility everybody around me was like oh god you know i went i made the choice once you make the choice you've gone like i'm i'm in you know this is going to be better because right now i'm flapping in the wind you know and the idea of you know if you didn't have the surgery then you really are playing dice you know
Marc:So before you had the heart problem, I mean, you don't seem to be someone who's morbidly fascinated or hung up on death.
Guest:No, I mean, it's weird.
Guest:I mean, when I was drinking, there was only one time, even for a moment, where I thought, oh, fuck life.
Guest:And then even my conscious brain went...
Guest:Did you honestly just say, fuck life?
Guest:You know, you have a pretty good life as it is right now.
Guest:Have you noticed the two houses?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Have you noticed the girlfriend?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Have you noticed that things are pretty good even though you may not be working right now?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Okay, let's put the suicide over here on discussable.
Guest:Let's leave that over here in the discussion area.
Guest:We'll talk about that.
Guest:do first of all you don't have the balls to do it i'm not going to say it out loud i mean have you thought about buying a gun no what are you going to do like cut your wrist with a water pick maybe so that's erosion what are you thinking about that so can i put this over here in the what the fuck category yes let's put that over here in what the fuck because can i ask you what you're doing right now you're sitting naked in a hotel room with a bottle of jack daniels yes is this maybe influencing your decision
Guest:possibly okay we're gonna put that over here and tomorrow morning and who's that in the bed there i don't know okay well don't discuss this with her because she may tweet it okay this may not be good let's put that over here in the what the fuck category we're gonna put that over here possibly for therapy if you want to talk about that therapy or maybe a podcast yeah two years from now you want to talk about in the podcast no i feel safe
Guest:Are you talking about it in a podcast?
Guest:I know.
Guest:Who is this?
Guest:It's your conscience, asshole.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:So, have you ever thought about it since then?
Guest:No.
Guest:During the surgery, were you thinking about death?
Guest:No.
Guest:Why?
Guest:Because you just were thinking everything's going to be fine.
Guest:Was that your mother talking?
Guest:Maybe.
Guest:She was a Christian scientist who had plastic surgery.
Wow.
Guest:is that a mixed message yeah that is okay well we're gonna go back to the podcast now because mark's sitting here we're talking now it's gonna be i know it feel like golf commentary but you know look tiger's back tiger's playing tiger's doing well i was hoping that some of the tweets would have golf metaphors like you know choke up rather than choke you know or or like you know i'm gonna i'm gonna hold you down and putt from the rough no he didn't say that you know it's all good we're back
Guest:Thank you.
Marc:That was wonderful.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:It's a nice interval.
Marc:A nice interval.
Marc:Discussions of death.
Marc:It's very freeing.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:I guess it's a little, you know, you've had all this stuff and that there really is a certain degree of like, it doesn't matter.
Marc:Big time.
Marc:It just doesn't matter.
Guest:That's kind of the freedom, the ultimate freedom of letting go in a weird way.
Guest:Like when you talked about all this stuff, the shit that they say about you.
Guest:I know it's out there, and it used to be it would immobilize me.
Guest:It would hurt your feelings.
Guest:Oh, it hurts everything.
Guest:You're just going to go, well, I shouldn't perform.
Guest:No, you love performing.
Guest:Go out and perform.
Guest:People will say good things, people will say bad things.
Guest:It's the nature of the world.
Guest:It's like Tina Fey once said, if you're ever feeling really good about yourself, there's this thing called the Internet.
Guest:Now, at this point in your life, going on stage, being around people you have a good time with, and seeing people like Pearl, seeing people like Overton, and hanging out with friends, and you go, oh, God, and hanging with you even at the Comedy Cellar, going upstairs and just riffing.
Guest:That's worth it to me more than worrying about, oh, how am I doing?
Guest:I got the gig.
Guest:I remember one night sitting with Rodney Dangerfield and he was, I think he was doing Blow, but he was going, I'm sweating.
Guest:I don't know why I'm sweating.
Guest:I own the club.
Guest:You know, it's weird.
Guest:It's crazy.
Guest:And they said, Robin, when you look in the mirror, how can you say you look normal?
Guest:At that point, he had like a weird kind of Afro, kind of a Jufro thing going on.
Guest:Rodney, I don't know.
Guest:Don't tell me.
Guest:It's weird.
Guest:Joe says I'm a celebrity.
Guest:My dog's looking at me.
Guest:And Joe answers it because you're a celebrity, Rodney.
Guest:But it's that weird thing of you got the gig at this point.
Guest:I mean, all that other stuff is like.
Guest:And you live like a person up here.
Guest:I mean, like you live like up here because there's no.
Marc:Well, there's this idea that celebrities, I mean, there is a rarefied air to it because you guys can't hang out with everybody.
Guest:But up here, up and living in Marin, which is kind of like north of San Francisco, is like the idea, I mean, if there's a paparazzi here, there's one.
Guest:And I don't know where he is.
Guest:And he's probably wandering around.
Guest:But it's not ostentatious.
Guest:It's comfortable.
Guest:It's comfortable.
Guest:I mean, that's basically life right now.
Guest:It's the idea of this is it.
Guest:I don't need to live.
Guest:i can't i mean i don't do well in la if i was living in a gated community yeah you know even though this is down a little hill and but all these people that got neighbors and they got kids and they run around and it's okay it's like when you go to new york you know the moment you walk on the streets in new york you get good you get bad hey you suck i love you hey fuck off you know i ain't open the door for you fuck you you know that's the idea of
Marc:Where do you live now?
Marc:Yeah, me?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I live up in Highland Park.
Marc:I live in a small two-bedroom cabin-like house overlooking the barrio of East L.A.
Marc:Oh, my God.
Marc:Oh, my God.
Marc:And it depends how I want people to experience the ride over.
Marc:If I want them to experience Juarez, I say, come down, York.
Marc:Ha, ha, ha.
Guest:if i want if i want them to experience this the upper middle class that's for me it was like when i come to la i had a friend who said you know you don't know la except for beverly hills yeah all of a sudden you go down lower melrose and you get into this other area oh yeah fucking hey dude so it's all that's where i found this bike shop i went this is my shop yeah single what is that about the bike thing you spend how much time you spend in france a year
Guest:I haven't been there since Lance quit, so it's been a while since they trashed Floyd, so I haven't been back.
Guest:Oh, you don't have a house over there or anything?
Guest:No, never.
Guest:You're not doing the Belzer?
Guest:No, the Belzer.
Guest:He's out there.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:That's a weird thing.
Guest:To live in France, I don't think I could.
Guest:I like visiting there.
Marc:It's Belzer, R. Crumb, and Johnny Depp.
Marc:That's the expatriate community over there.
Marc:That's a great my dinner with.
Marc:Yeah, I'll say.
Guest:Fuck, and I...
Guest:Well, you know, I thank you for the time.
Guest:I'm glad you're feeling well.
Guest:Me too, boss.
Guest:And thanks for coming here.
Guest:Thanks for making it easier than having to, you know, where are you going?
Guest:There's a hotel in the city.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Mr. Mann.
Guest:Yes, we are here.
Guest:Mr. Morgan, I love it for you.
Marc:Come on now.
Marc:That's what I thought.
Marc:Like, you know, thank God this is organized.
Marc:I didn't want to have like a, you know, King of Comedy moment where I'm in your house.
Marc:He's touching everything.
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Marc:Take care with the fuckers.
Marc:And just remember, if you want anything WTF-related, go to WTFPod.com.
Marc:Get some JustCoffee.coop.
Marc:Go to PunchlineMagazine.com for all your up-to-date comedy news, like about me interviewing Robin Williams, for instance.
Marc:That should be there.
Marc:Try to accept yourselves.
Marc:It ain't that bad.
Marc:It's pretty good, actually.
Marc:It's really fucking good, given that we don't know the alternative.
Marc:It's kind of a morose ending.
Marc:I need to eat.
you