Episode 643 - Peaches
Marc:Lock the gates!
Marc:All right, let's do this.
Marc:How are you, what the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fucksters?
Marc:What the fuck nicks?
Marc:What the fuckadelics?
Marc:I am Mark Maron.
Marc:This is my show, WTF.
Marc:I'm broadcasting right now from a hotel room 12 floors up, overlooking, I think, what might be the first beautiful fall day in New York City.
Marc:Man, I didn't know if I was going to make it to New York City.
Marc:It's been a long few days.
Marc:And I'll tell you, last week,
Marc:Watching the Weather Channel or CNN or anything.
Marc:It's amazing.
Marc:It's the amount of intensity and speculation that goes into bad weather when they've got something to sink their teeth into.
Marc:I didn't think I was ever going to leave Raleigh, North Carolina, which is where I was at.
Marc:I went to Raleigh, North Carolina to see my girlfriend Sarah Kane's big art show.
Marc:a work on site at the Contemporary Art Museum in Raleigh, it was fucking astounding.
Marc:And now, okay, granted, I'm biased, but I'm an art guy.
Marc:I'll let it in.
Marc:I'll roll it around my soul, see what moves inside, and then move on or linger, whatever you need to do in front of a piece of art.
Marc:I do not condescend immediately.
Marc:Usually takes a bit of deliberation before I dismiss something in a condescending way or dismiss something at all.
Marc:Usually I'll blame myself first and say, I guess I don't get that.
Marc:But that's become less and less as I get older.
Marc:You would think that would become more and more.
Marc:But to see that fucking thing inside, I mean, she was down there for two weeks and this was a massive space.
Marc:And she did the entire bit of business, the entire painting in all its glory, live in that space inside of like nine days.
Marc:And it was a lot of space.
Marc:I mean, I've tweeted pictures of it, but if you're in it, if you're out, if you're down there in Raleigh,
Marc:or in that area within 100 miles, I would say go to the Contemporary Art Museum of Raleigh and see this piece of work because I've never seen anything like it.
Marc:And again, I'm emotionally involved with this woman, but when I got there and I sat there with it before people came in for the opening, I got a little teary-eyed and I couldn't explain it.
Marc:Obviously, I was proud of her and obviously I was impressed by her, but the art moves you.
Marc:Goddamn.
Marc:It's got some power to it.
Marc:So now I just have to deal with the fact that this woman that I'm seeing and who is in my life is this fucking genius, which is fine with me.
Marc:Primarily because there's no way I can do what she does, so I'm not threatened at all.
Marc:I'm man enough to admit that.
Marc:Sometimes you get into those situations where it's like, yeah, you're great at that, but I could do it.
Marc:I can't do it.
Marc:I can't do it at all, and I respect it.
Marc:So that was pretty exciting.
Marc:Did I mention the guest today?
Marc:I did not, I don't think.
Marc:Very important guest, speaking of art, actually, in a way.
Marc:Peaches, who I have to be honest with you, I knew very little about, but I'd received her book.
Marc:I'd talked to Kim Gordon about her, and I started poking around, looking at her work, and I got this book that had a lot of her photographs of her performances, and
Marc:And again, very easy to sort of be like, you know, performance art, that's ridiculous.
Marc:This is like, you know, bad comedy or what kind of clown bullshit is this or whatever you're going to do.
Marc:Why be a slave to your cultural expectations that are probably ingrained in you?
Marc:Without even your permission, why not push them out a bit and let it in?
Marc:Why not open your heart to things that you don't quite understand if it is a safe environment to do so?
Marc:Art shouldn't be safe at all, but taking it in should be relatively safe.
Marc:You shouldn't have to see a piece of art in a free fall without a shoot.
Marc:If you feel that way because of the art, then that's some good art there.
Marc:But that shouldn't be the opening of the exhibition.
Marc:You have to jump out of a plane and it's the last thing you see.
Marc:Look over there.
Marc:You see that thing in the sky that's blowing up and spinning around?
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Hope you enjoyed that.
Marc:R.I.P.
Marc:The point is, I was very taken with the audacity and the persistence and the strange courage of Peach's work that I saw in print in terms of photographs of her performances.
Marc:And then I listened to her music and it was fun.
Marc:It seemed to come from a place.
Marc:She seemed to have a thing, but she's a very, you know, quite a spectacle.
Marc:And she does a lot of stuff with prosthetics and costumes and haircuts and penises and things and boobs.
Marc:And, you know, a lot of different stuff.
Marc:So I did a little research.
Marc:I poked around a bit and learned some stuff about her.
Marc:And this was the most interesting thing.
Marc:There's a thing I do that I'm not sure is correct.
Marc:And that is there's two things is dismissing people as crazy without deeply acknowledging my own particular insanity.
Marc:The other thing is, is assuming people who are.
Marc:uniquely talented in a in a in an uncomfortable way are damaged i think is wrong i i think it might be wrong to assume people are damaged just because of their profession in most cases again look at yourself you know where are you coming from what's your lot in life what have you chosen to do with your life what are the reasons what are you hiding from what are the emotional scars that you're trying to solve
Marc:It was one of those situations where I'm speaking directly about my guest today, Peaches, where I'm like, she's got to be out of her fucking mind, which is a fairly conservative, frightened way to assess something you don't understand without really knowing.
Marc:And you'll find in my conversation with her, I was amazed at how grounded and focused and sort of deliberate she is in her path to her creativity and to her actual work.
Marc:So I learned a lesson.
Marc:Don't make assumptions, especially negative pathological assumptions about someone's psychological disposition based on their work because you might just be projecting and why don't you reckon with your own shit?
Marc:And hopefully whatever they're producing makes you go that full route and ask those questions of yourself so you can do that.
Marc:Sometimes art's supposed to do that.
Marc:Wow, this is fucking nuts.
Marc:Well, why is it affecting you like that?
Marc:Shut up, man.
Marc:Yeah, I did that, the New Yorker Festival interview with Khalifa Sana, who I'd never met before.
Marc:He writes for The New Yorker.
Marc:He writes a lot about music and stuff.
Marc:He's interviewed me before about some stuff.
Marc:But he did a good job, and I want to thank everybody for coming out for that.
Marc:That was a fun conversation.
Marc:I like to talk.
Marc:I'm always surprised that people want to see me talk in other... Sometimes I think, like, don't I talk enough?
Marc:Is anyone going to come to this?
Marc:Why would they come see me talk more in a different context?
Marc:But I'm glad you did because something always exciting happens when I do talk.
Marc:And tomorrow I will be at Princeton.
Marc:Princeton University in New Jersey, my friends.
Marc:I will be doing a free lecture, part of their lecture series out there.
Marc:That starts at 6 o'clock on Tuesday, October 6th.
Marc:I will be at Princeton.
Marc:Princeton in the McCosh Hall, room 50.
Marc:I'll be there giving a rap.
Marc:You're free to come, New Jersey people.
Marc:I'm going to be in the same room where Albert Einstein presented his theory of relativity.
Marc:Thanks for telling me that, guy who's running the lecture.
Marc:Oh, man, not a lot of pressure.
Marc:I better put something together.
Marc:Right?
Marc:I'm glad I made it out of Raleigh.
Marc:Boy, that hurricane that didn't happen almost had me buying a house down there.
Marc:So I didn't buy a house in Raleigh.
Marc:I'm in New York.
Marc:The clouds have broken.
Marc:And what I was going to say is I was surprised at how relieved I was to see rain and to experience the beginning of a season because L.A.
Marc:is slowly drying out on all levels.
Marc:It's fucking apocalyptic there.
Marc:I'm getting to a point, people.
Marc:I'm getting to a point where I'm about to run.
Marc:So let's now talk to my guest back in the garage, Peaches.
Marc:Her new album, Rub, is available now.
Marc:And Peaches is on tour as well at the current time.
Marc:Go to peachesrocks.com to see where she's going to be.
Marc:Also, that lovely coffee table book I got.
Marc:So this is my conversation with Peaches.
Peaches.
Marc:Want to work hands with your mullet hawk?
Guest:My mullet hawk.
Guest:I'm kind of like rocking five different hairdos.
Marc:You got some, what is it, a fade?
Marc:And a mullet.
Marc:Yep.
Marc:And a mohawk.
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Marc:And tips.
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Marc:Are those what those called?
Marc:Are they called like blonde tips?
Marc:Frosting.
Marc:Frosting.
Guest:I think that's the old school name.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's all your real hair?
Guest:Of course.
Marc:Oh, stop it.
Marc:Come on.
Marc:Here's the deal with you and me.
Marc:Kim Gordon mentioned you.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And then you and I did some Twittering at each other.
Guest:Tweeting.
Marc:Tweeting.
Guest:We tweeted.
Marc:Tweeted.
Marc:And then I'm like, all right, I got to reckon with peaches.
Marc:Yeah, figure out what this is all about.
Marc:And then I immersed myself in the music and the world and the book.
Marc:And then there was that moment like, wow, where the fuck have I been for the last 15 years to not be up to speed?
Marc:But you're not that easy to find, are you?
Guest:Um, well, peaches is a lot of different things, right?
Marc:Yeah, it's a world.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, but also, it's a fruit.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:It's a very, um, popular southern name.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:It's like, um, you know, uh, R.I.P.
Guest:Peaches Geldof.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:There's, um, you know, just so... Well, I mean, I was specific with my search.
Guest:I didn't... No, but that comes up, too.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, why peaches?
Yeah.
Guest:It's actually from a Nina Simone song.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I just watched a documentary on her.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Crazy.
Guest:It's incredible.
Guest:There was a lot of things I didn't know.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I didn't know that her music was banned that heavily.
Marc:When she became very politically active?
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:And that it was a threat?
Guest:I had no idea that, you know, I knew she was a powerful force.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But I didn't realize how much of a threat it was.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:During that time where, you know, there's that weird kind of combination of mania and activism.
Guest:Oh, yes.
Marc:That she just took over the top.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I didn't know her stuff that well, and I certainly didn't know her story.
Marc:And it was sort of heartbreaking and amazing.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Did you listen to her when you were a kid?
Guest:Yeah, I listened to her a lot.
Guest:But that song, Four Women, at the end, she says, they call me Peaches.
Marc:And that's where you got it from?
Guest:So I was like, oh, I want her to sing that to me.
Marc:I'm going to be Peaches.
Guest:She's not going to be like, they call me Meryl.
Marc:Meryl's the real name?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Meryl what?
Guest:Meryl Nisker.
Marc:And it's Jewish.
Guest:It's Jewish.
Guest:It doesn't sound so Jewish, does it?
Marc:Not really.
Marc:I know those SKs with the ER sometimes.
Guest:Polish.
Marc:Yeah, Polish.
Marc:Yeah, I'm part Polish Jew.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Marc:Yeah, we all came from the same.
Guest:What's the other part?
Marc:i think there's a there's a lot of polish jew and i think there might be some lithuanian jew in there maybe maybe some austrian jew i because most of like the yeah you too i think my austrian polish it's kind of like melded because of you know yeah sure yeah all that eastern european jew stuff but but you come from canada yeah so your family ended up there and mine ended up here how'd they get to canada
Guest:Half my family went to New York and half went to Canada.
Guest:Actually, they went to a farm in Edmonton.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they were like, what are we doing here?
Guest:We're not farmers.
Marc:But isn't it weird how they end up there?
Marc:How do Jews end up there?
Marc:I never know what the process is.
Guest:I don't know.
Marc:But you didn't grow up in it.
Marc:They're wanderers.
Marc:Yeah, they are.
Marc:They're on the run is what they're, yeah.
Marc:What part did you grow up in though?
Marc:Toronto.
Marc:Toronto.
Guest:Toronto.
Marc:Toronto.
Marc:Is that how you say it?
Marc:Toronto.
Marc:Toronto.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's a good city.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's a big city.
Marc:It's a real city.
Guest:It is.
Guest:Well, yeah, it likes to think it's a real city.
Marc:Well, I mean, it is for Canadian city.
Guest:For a Canadian city, it is.
Guest:You know it's a real city for Canadians because all Canadians from everywhere else hate Toronto.
Guest:Oh, you're from Toronto.
Marc:Oh, the big city.
Marc:That's the corporate city.
Marc:Oh, corporate city?
Marc:Yeah, ooh, Toronto.
Marc:But it's weird.
Marc:I try to figure out what the difference is between a Canadian city and American cities, and it just seems to be a lack of general fear and terror in the streets.
Guest:You'll just hear a lot of, sorry.
Guest:Oh, sorry.
Guest:Like, Canadians will bump into you and the other person will apologize.
Marc:Yeah, right.
Guest:Oh, sorry, you bumped into me.
Marc:But what kind of family did you grow up in, though?
Marc:Can I ask these questions?
Marc:Yeah, you can ask me everything.
Marc:Because I want to know how you evolved into this event.
Marc:This ongoing event that is peaches.
Guest:Like, suburban Jewish kid.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Do you have a brother and sisters?
Guest:Yeah, I have a brother and a sister.
Marc:So there's a big little Jewish family.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Conservative Jews?
Guest:Conservative.
Guest:It's just so funny that it's conservative because we were conservative for no reason.
Marc:It doesn't mean anything, really.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It means tradition.
Guest:It means, like, I'm still scared of my parents and they were conservative, so we're going to be doing that, too.
Guest:But my... Were you bar mitzvahed?
Guest:This is the sad part.
Guest:What?
Guest:Because my brother got bar mitzvahed in Israel.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, the whole thing.
Marc:Like, we all went.
Marc:Oh, the big, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, and we all got dressed up like Canadians, you know, for bar mitzvah.
Guest:And then it was in, like, where, because my uncle lives in the Negev.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah, so we went to their synagogue and...
Guest:And everybody else is in like shorts and all the bar mitzvah boys are just like, yeah, another day, you know.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:And we're all like uptight in our outfits.
Guest:Dresses and suits.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then my, so my brother had that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My sister had a choice.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Either having a bat mitzvah.
Marc:Are they older?
Marc:Yeah, they're both older.
Guest:Okay, okay.
Guest:So my sister's three years older.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:She had a choice to either have a bat mitzvah or to go on a van tour across Israel with other 13-year-olds for a month.
Okay.
Marc:The teen tour.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:Just like in a van.
Guest:Not even like.
Marc:Not a bus.
Marc:Not.
Guest:Just like a van with like 10 other kids.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And she took that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:How amazing.
Guest:What a great experience.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So that's what they got.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And when it came to you.
Guest:Basement party.
Guest:They were about to renovate the basement.
Marc:But you had a bat mitzvah.
Guest:No.
Marc:You didn't.
Guest:I just had a basement party.
Guest:They're like, your brother's DJing.
Guest:That's it?
Marc:That's it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's probably what started your whole career.
Marc:That was the bitterness from the basement party.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I, you know, well, I went to half day Hebrew, half day English school.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I really was always like, well, I can't even learn English.
Guest:How can I learn Hebrew too?
Guest:And I was very spaced out, very spaced out kid.
Marc:But they were, but they were really Jewy.
Marc:I mean, that's not like, you know, sending, I mean, we all, eventually you get to Israel once.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:Me and my sister both went to half day Hebrew, half day English school.
Guest:She can speak Hebrew.
Guest:I can't because I just spaced out.
Guest:I was like, this is too much for me.
Marc:But do your parents both speak Hebrew?
Marc:No.
Marc:What's your old man do?
Guest:He's an accountant.
Guest:He used to be a pro baseball player.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:In Canada?
Guest:Yeah, he got discovered in a small park.
Guest:Because when his parents came over, they'd always bring people over.
Guest:They had no money, so everybody would live in their house.
Guest:They basically lived under the dining room table and then give away their room and everything.
Guest:And one person who stayed at their house took my father, who was... They had two sons.
Guest:My father was the younger one.
Guest:And he's like, kid, I'm going to show you how to pitch.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And he would pitch every day with my father.
Marc:And your dad became a pitcher?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:He was a pitcher.
Guest:And he was a pitcher at the time where you could still be a batter.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Marc:So... And for what team?
Guest:He was like the Cleveland Indian Farm Team.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So he never made the majors?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:No, his mother died when he was like 21.
Guest:And he was just like, I want to go home to my girlfriend and get married.
Guest:And then he became accountant.
Guest:But he's the most contented man.
Guest:He's like, no regrets.
Guest:So happy.
Guest:He's been with my mother since she was 14 and he was 17.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah, and they love each other.
Marc:Still?
Guest:Yeah, they're in their 70s.
Guest:They're so in love.
Guest:It's amazing.
Marc:That's so sweet.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's you're just like, I'll never have that.
Marc:Why do we assume that?
Guest:I don't know.
Marc:It's amazing.
Marc:We're getting up there like I've been through a few.
Guest:I've been through a few.
Guest:I tried.
Guest:I mean, I try.
Guest:You know, I have a good model.
Guest:So I've tried, you know.
Marc:I don't know what causes the fundamental inability or the dissatisfaction or the hunger to not relax into it or something.
Marc:I think that it seems like there is a lot of compromise that you just have to live with.
Guest:I think, you know, I was married.
Marc:For how long?
Guest:Well, I was with this person for nine years.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But, I mean, he was 21, I was 24.
Guest:We got married when I was 28.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you were with him?
Marc:In Canada.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So how long were you with him before you got married?
Guest:Five years.
Marc:And what did that guy do?
Guest:He was an artist.
Marc:Painter?
Yeah.
Guest:He was a painter and a sculptor.
Guest:He was really interested in making action figures.
Guest:So he used me as a model.
Guest:So he'd stare at my face and all my moving parts.
Guest:And then he made an action figure of me with 13 movable parts in my head.
Guest:For a year, he was just carving it and staring at me.
Marc:What were you doing at that time?
Guest:Well, I was doing music at night and my day job doing music with children.
Marc:How did you play piano?
Marc:Guitar?
Guest:I was learning acoustic guitar.
Marc:And you were 21?
Marc:Yeah, 21.
Marc:Getting back to your parents, what did your mom do?
Guest:She... Just hung out?
Guest:Hung out.
Guest:At 30, she went back to school.
Guest:Psychology.
Guest:Parent effectiveness training courses.
Guest:She started smoking.
Marc:Of course, because she had to be intense as a psychologist, the smoking kind, the thoughtful, intense one.
Guest:Yeah, she is.
Guest:That's exactly her.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah, very, very thoughtful, intense.
Marc:And did her parenting shift at 30?
Marc:How old were you when she was doing that, smoking and being a psychologist?
Guest:I think I was probably like 12.
Marc:Right?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So was there a big shift in the approach?
Yeah.
Guest:No, I didn't notice I was too spaced out.
Guest:Why are you so spaced out?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I was just spaced out.
Guest:I just didn't understand why all these... I don't know.
Guest:I just didn't understand why I had to go to this kind of school or why I lived in this life.
Guest:It wasn't more like a defiant thing.
Guest:It was more like...
Guest:I just don't get it.
Marc:You felt out of place?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Just uncomfortable around the regular people, around the life.
Guest:I didn't even know why, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:It wasn't like I was a loner.
Guest:I had friends and everything.
Marc:But inside, you were like, I'm different than this.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:I wasn't even like, no, I was just spaced out.
Marc:Really?
Guest:I was just like, what's going on?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:No drugs.
Guest:No drug.
Guest:I mean, I was 12.
Marc:Well, you know, it starts young.
Marc:Maybe not in Canada, but here, you know, you can get going pretty early.
Guest:Yeah, it's true.
Guest:You can.
Marc:So you're doing that.
Marc:You're being a spaced out kid.
Marc:And then when does the compulsion to create happen?
Marc:In general, because I mean, with somebody that does all the things that you do, that it's hard to sort of categorize it and probably until later, but you seem to be pretty open to creativity in a big way.
Marc:So was there a specific thing that kind of triggered you?
Guest:Well, I memorized songs all the time.
Guest:You know, one of those kids.
Guest:I was just like almost in an autistic fashion.
Guest:Like I remember every song.
Guest:You know, I used to like New Year's when I was six, I would stay up and listen to AM radio and write down like the top 100.
Guest:And then I would like have it of that year.
Guest:And it would be very important to me.
Marc:To listen to all of them and to know all of them?
Guest:To know all of them, and I'd be so excited if I knew every song or things like that.
Guest:So I was really into music in my head, but I didn't know it meant anything.
Guest:And I didn't think you could be a musician if you didn't have training or anybody else around you that was doing it.
Marc:Who were the bands that sort of moved you early on?
Marc:Was it like disco music?
Guest:Rock music?
Guest:All of it.
Guest:I remember hearing Talking Heads on a classic rock station.
Guest:I'm like, this is different.
Marc:This is it.
Guest:This is not classic rock, but it's on this station.
Guest:I don't understand why I like it.
Marc:Like Psycho Killer or something?
Marc:Right, right.
Guest:And you're like, what?
Guest:I was like, why is this here?
Guest:And also, you know, when I was 12.
Guest:Usually it's always when I was 7, but it seems like today when I was 12.
Marc:12 is a big time for you.
Marc:That was a pivotal year, the 12.
Marc:Yeah, well, we used to have these... Before the basement party.
Guest:Yeah, right before, leading up to, but we used to have school dances.
Guest:This is after I went to Hafta Hebrew, Hafta, when I went to the public school, which is ironically called Zion Heights Junior High.
Marc:But it was not a Jewish school.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:But we would have school dances, and they would play a lot of early hip-hop, like first hip-hop songs, and early funk music and disco.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So that was like 70...
Guest:78.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so there was like a large.
Marc:Music you can dance to.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I love to dance.
Marc:You did.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:My dad and my brother made me play hockey because I'm Canadian.
Marc:You played hockey.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And all the games were Saturday nights.
Guest:But I was invited to like bat mitzvahs and bar mitzvahs.
Guest:So it was like a big problem for me.
Guest:I'm not going to play hockey.
Guest:I don't want to play hockey, dad.
Guest:I want to dance to the bat mitzvahs.
Marc:How were you on the skates?
Marc:Pretty good?
Guest:Horrible.
Marc:It was horrible.
Marc:I wanted a hockey success story.
Guest:There's no, no.
Marc:What did your siblings end up doing in life?
Guest:In life now?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, my brother is an editor.
Marc:Yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Film editor.
Marc:Oh, film editor?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He works on TV right now.
Marc:You have two?
Guest:And I have a sister.
Marc:And what does she do?
Guest:She is living life, and she's the most beautiful person ever.
Guest:She has a debilitating disease.
Guest:She has multiple sclerosis, and it's a galloping form, and she's just trying to get through the day all the time.
Guest:But she's so positive and the biggest inspiration of my life.
Marc:Is she in Canada?
Guest:No, she's in White Plains, New York.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And do you spend time with her whenever you can?
Guest:Yes, I try to spend a lot of time with her.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:she's an inspiration because of her determination yeah yeah yeah it's kind of amazing when you you know somebody you have somebody in your life that has to struggle with something so real and horrible and they can still manage she has so much love yeah for everybody because i i i have like you know jewish guilt sure and uh and also with her because i'm like oh yeah i'm just going to japan to play some shows and
Guest:She's like, oh, my God, you're so amazing.
Guest:I can't believe, you know, like so excited more.
Guest:But not in a phony one.
Guest:She's seriously excited.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because I don't want to, like, make her feel bad.
Marc:Right, right.
Guest:But she loves it.
Guest:She vicariously, you know, lives through it.
Marc:So she's excited for your success.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I have to, like, when I watch your stuff or when I listen to it, you know, in terms of how it's provocative, at what point did your parents say, like, I guess she's doing good?
Yeah.
Guest:When they read about it in the newspaper, then they're like, oh.
Guest:Because they're friends.
Guest:My mother had a harder time.
Guest:My dad was like, oh, we listened to Donna Summer in my car.
Guest:Bad girls.
Guest:I know what you're doing.
Guest:And then I remember he read an article on Little Kim once.
Guest:And he was like, oh, I read about Little Kim.
Guest:I know what you're doing.
Guest:I know what you're up to.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:So let's get back around to what provoked you creatively.
Marc:So you're listening to music, but at some point you started to evolve into this performance artist slash techno goddess thing.
Marc:Provocateur.
Marc:But it didn't start out that way, it doesn't sound like.
Guest:No, it's all very organic.
Guest:I mean, like I said, I didn't even know what art school was.
Guest:Like, I didn't know what that was.
Marc:Right, but you were 12.
Guest:You know, no, but also, like, even...
Guest:I didn't know about contemporary art or any of that stuff.
Guest:No, we had like a Dali print on my wall.
Guest:Of course.
Guest:So I was like, why is that watch melting or like Don Quixote, Picasso?
Guest:But I didn't know anything about that.
Marc:So something must have blown your mind at some point.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, it was all blowing my mind.
Guest:I didn't, you know, realize it.
Guest:But and then there was like a big theater element.
Guest:So because, you know, we'd go to visit family in New York and go to Broadway shows and things like that.
Guest:And it's such a typical.
Guest:There's two really typical Jewy stories.
Okay.
Guest:At my cousin's bar mitzvah when I was seven.
Guest:I asked my mom if I could sing with the band.
Guest:And she said, can you sing?
Guest:And I'm like, yeah, I think I can sing.
Guest:So I sang with the band.
Guest:Did you nail it?
Guest:I nailed it and I had to sing it at every bar mitzvah and wedding and stuff like that.
Guest:So, I mean, then the secret was out.
Guest:Meryl will sing.
Marc:Meryl can sing.
Guest:And so every Barbra Streisand album or anything that came out is like, there's a new Barbra Streisand.
Guest:Can you learn evergreen?
Guest:So, you know, I would sing all that.
Marc:And you liked learning lyrics.
Marc:So it wasn't a problem.
Guest:I loved it.
Guest:I loved it.
Guest:I remember waking up one morning and on the radio was like Barbra Streisand and Neil Diamond singing like, you don't bring me flowers.
Guest:I ran into my parents' room like, oh my God, they're singing together.
Marc:And you knew both of them?
Guest:Yeah, well, because that's all we listened to, you know.
Guest:And then my parents were like, yeah, that's cool.
Guest:And I couldn't believe they weren't as excited as I was.
Marc:About Neil Diamond and Barbra Streisand?
Guest:Singing together.
Marc:So you graduate high school?
Guest:Yeah, well, so I was very into theater because that's all I knew.
Marc:I was wondering about that.
Guest:Yeah, so I was very into theater, and then we had this really special program in my high school where in grade 11, so that's a Canadian thing.
Guest:You guys say like 11th grade.
Marc:Okay, well, similar though, right?
Marc:You do this.
Marc:So grade 11.
Marc:You go to 12, right?
Marc:Grades?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:13 okay yeah so in grade 11 they split everybody into actors and grade 12 was producers and grade 13 was directors so it was a real program yeah yeah so I got really into it and I couldn't wait to be the director and then you started as an actor yeah I had to be an actor and what plays like when you went to New York what do you remember being like oh my god
Guest:I don't know, just like Fiddler on the Roof or like West Side Story and stuff like that.
Marc:Like the revival of Fiddler with Topol as the main guy back again?
Marc:Probably.
Guest:And I think I stood up in the aisle and was dancing and my parents were like, sit down.
Guest:Actually, they let me.
Marc:You're like a dorky Jewish girl.
Guest:So dorky.
Guest:And then Fame.
Guest:Fame was my favorite movie.
Guest:And then there's that girl Doris who's singing.
Guest:Her mom's making her sing.
Guest:She was my favorite.
Marc:So you're in 11th grade and you're acting.
Guest:I was acting and then I was doing production.
Guest:And I started to like...
Guest:fight with teachers like why are we doing this but you know and stuff like that as a director yeah yeah or as a you know just like as a student as a student and just like you know questioning things and right um the rebellion started to happen finally yeah and then also i started to care about um my subjects and actually and writing yeah literature you know things like that so um i started to get into it and then i went to theater school for university
Marc:For all of it?
Marc:You finished?
Guest:No, I didn't.
Guest:I actually dropped acid and went, what am I doing?
Marc:Really?
Marc:You had that experience?
Guest:I really had that experience.
Guest:I dropped acid and the next day I was like, I do not want to be in this program.
Guest:And then I took all arts.
Guest:I took mixed media courses.
Marc:But you stayed in school?
Guest:Yeah, I stayed in school.
Marc:And you got a degree in arts?
Guest:I got a degree, yeah.
Marc:And you did like what?
Marc:All painting, drawing, sculpture?
Guest:Oh, I took a 101 like visual arts class and I was horrible.
Guest:I've never life drawn in my life.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the teacher would like come by and be like, she had this English accent.
Guest:She'd be like, you're stupid.
Guest:What are you doing?
Guest:And yelling at me and like, I don't know.
Guest:It's 101 drawing.
Guest:I'm trying.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:you know and then i um had to do a sculpture and i got scared so i just asked my friend to do it for me because i was like sculpture yeah and she she made me really manly with like this big chin and i got in trouble for that for your friend's chin of you she's just like that doesn't look like you you know so they were really sort of strict figurative kind of like the first half of the year and the second half was all like break out
Guest:Break out conceptual.
Guest:And then I was like, I get it.
Guest:And we learned about Duchamp.
Guest:And then, I don't know, you had to make a monster out of found objects.
Marc:Oh, that's the good stuff.
Guest:Yeah, and then I made some blender monster, and she loved it.
Guest:She's like, no, you're brilliant.
Guest:What happened to you?
Guest:Same teacher?
Guest:Yeah, yeah, same teacher.
Marc:That's amazing.
Guest:Yeah, that was fun.
Marc:So the acid thing, what was that?
Marc:How did that happen to a dorky Jewish girl?
Marc:Who were you hanging out with that said, do this?
Guest:Oh, no, no, no.
Guest:It was just like, you know, Monday nights we would go dancing at this place, RPM.
Guest:And so one night we're like, let's do acid.
Marc:And that was a tough few days.
Guest:No, it was just fun.
Guest:I think I did only like a half.
Guest:I've only done acid twice.
Guest:And it was just like sparkly.
Guest:But then I just went, I am dropping out of that program.
Marc:That was the inspiration.
Marc:The life changer.
Marc:When did you start playing the guitar?
Guest:Probably at the end of high school.
Guest:I always dated guys who played guitar instead of playing guitar myself at first, and then I realized, I'm like, it's me who wants to play guitar, not dating a guy playing guitar.
Marc:Did you date rock guys or folk guys?
Guest:um the first one was a folk guy who played like no he played it was horrible he played actually i was better friends with his brother and then i went out with him it was like not good yeah but uh he played he played like piano man on the guitar that's wrong right how can you play piano man on guitar yeah but you like the song
Guest:Not really.
Guest:I was just like, he plays guitar.
Guest:You know, I was like 15 or something.
Marc:And then the next guy?
Guest:He was more like into African rhythms.
Marc:The next guy was?
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:He was really talented.
Marc:Yeah, what was that called?
Marc:Juju pop?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Juju music.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And then the next guy?
Guest:Then the next guy was a girl who played acoustic guitar.
Guest:And then I was like, yeah, we should jam together.
Guest:And then she's like, I only play my own songs.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:And I was like, oh, you only play your own songs.
Guest:And then we ended up having a band together, which was my first band.
Marc:What was that called?
Guest:Mermaid Cafe.
Marc:And that's where it started?
Guest:Yeah, it was like after a Joni Mitchell song.
Marc:So you were doing folk?
Guest:Yeah, we got one gig at this kind of legendary small folk club where like the Barenaked Ladies started and there's other people.
Guest:And we brought a lot of people.
Guest:So he gave us a weekly gig and then we just kept writing songs.
Guest:And then that's when I was playing folk music.
Guest:And then another friend joined who had taught me to play guitar.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Joseph Greenbaum joined.
Yeah.
Guest:And then it was only Jewish kids coming to our shows, and I was like, I'm trying to break away from the scene.
Marc:Was the girl you were seeing Jewish?
Guest:She was Jewish, too.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But she's not Jewish.
Guest:Her family, they weren't very... Right, but it didn't matter.
Marc:It was just Jews.
Guest:But it's just like, you know, it's Toronto.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, my God.
Marc:I would not have assumed.
Marc:Jewy, Jewy Louie.
Marc:You make assumptions about people.
Marc:I did a little research.
Marc:I knew you were Jewish, but I didn't know how entrenched.
Guest:But I broke away.
Marc:But did you break away hostily?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:The folk band was quite popular with the Jewish community.
Marc:Like older people would come out?
Guest:No, no, it was all like 14-year-old girls crying to our music.
Marc:Did you say a documentary?
Guest:There's a documentary that two of those girls are doing right now about the relationship between queer culture and Jewish summer camps.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Because that's where we met, me and this girl.
Marc:Did you go to Jewish summer camp?
Guest:I did.
Guest:I also taught drama at another camp where like the kids would go home and the counselors would stay over.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:And what is the connection between queer culture and Jewish summer camp?
Guest:Nothing.
Guest:That's what they're trying.
Guest:And also.
Marc:Oh, they're trying to prove.
Marc:I didn't know that.
Marc:No, they're not trying to prove it.
Guest:And they're also Jewish culture and Jewish summer camps.
Marc:Right.
Guest:That's also like, what is the connection there?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then camps and camps.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I went to camps.
Marc:I went to a Jewish day camp.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, Kaitana.
Guest:Kaitana?
Marc:I think so.
Marc:Not Kaikana.
Marc:Kaitana.
Guest:I have a friend named Kaiki.
Guest:It's very difficult for me.
Guest:A Jewish friend?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:He's Brazilian.
Guest:And I was like, I don't want to call you that.
Guest:I feel weird calling you that.
Marc:But isn't that weird, though?
Marc:There is this weird connection that I think Jews feel.
Marc:I haven't talked about it in a while, but there's a familiarity there.
Marc:When you walk into a room full of Jews, you're like, I get it.
Marc:And even I imagine that's the same in Canada.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:There's this thing that we... It's a weird kind of...
Marc:With exceptionalism.
Marc:You're sort of brought up as a Jew to believe the Jews are insanely special.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, and there you are with a bunch of Jews singing songs.
Guest:Great.
Guest:But there's no Jewish culture involved in these summer camps.
Guest:It's just hanging.
Marc:No, really?
Marc:No singing?
Marc:No.
Marc:None?
Guest:There was none in the ones I went to.
Marc:I think maybe it was just a plan to keep us marrying each other.
Guest:This is what they were talking about, the two queer girls.
Guest:Yeah, they're just like, and then what were we supposed to do being queer?
Marc:Right.
Guest:And then Mermaid Cafe, our big song that people would come and cry to, was about two young boys who were in love, and the mother catches them in bed, and one of the boys runs out of the house and gets on his motorcycle and drives away and gets hit by a bus.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:So dramatic.
Marc:That was your big song?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Who wrote that one?
Guest:Andy D, the other girl.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And did- She wrote a motorcycle.
Guest:It was kind of about her.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:But not the park getting hit.
Marc:But you didn't want to make it girls?
Guest:No, she made it about boys.
Guest:I don't know why.
Marc:It was just- But was that the first sort of time you started to kind of push the envelope a little bit and present that life?
Yeah.
Guest:I don't think I even thought about it as pushing the envelope at that point.
Marc:No, but I mean, like, how was it being received about, you know, having a song, a relationship about two boys who were in love with each other?
Guest:That was, like, totally the song.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:And it was, like, all the Jewish kids in the, you know, heteronormative community, they loved it.
Guest:It was, like, they were also, like, Andy and Meryl are sleeping together.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:There was also that, right?
Marc:Oh, okay.
Marc:So the gossip was there.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Of course.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Heteronormative.
Marc:That's the word?
Marc:That's the classification?
Guest:Heteronormative.
Marc:I've never heard that before.
Marc:Really?
Marc:I like it.
Marc:No, I mean, I'm not up to speed on the classifications of us all.
Guest:It's not really, yeah.
Guest:I guess it's not really.
Marc:I guess I'm kind of heteronormative.
Marc:I'm okay with it.
Guest:Welcome.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Thanks.
Marc:So how do you get from playing in a folk duo to Fancy Pants Hoodlum?
Marc:How does that happen?
Guest:Because I didn't want to play folk music anymore.
Guest:So I just started experimenting around.
Marc:With what?
Guest:With other musicians.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Like jazzers or whatever.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And just like using my voice more.
Guest:I love, you know, I love Nina Hagen or, you know.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:Diamanda Galas and just like.
Marc:Diamanda Galas.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That was heavy shit, man.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She's amazing.
Marc:Do you know her?
Guest:I do know her.
Marc:You do?
Guest:She's a really sweet, beautiful person.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I remember when that was, when was, when was those, those first couple records were huge for a while.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, the one with like John Paul... Yeah, yeah, that one.
Marc:John Paul Jones.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:That was a wild... 90s, early 90s, yeah.
Marc:So you started to get into that.
Marc:Did you sort of shift peer groups?
Guest:Yeah, I mean, I was... Even before like Mermaid Cafe, I was already living downtown Toronto with like, you know, different friends who I met at university.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And stuff like that.
Guest:So dancers and musicians.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You know.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Who weren't Jewish.
Marc:Who weren't Jewish.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And now how are your parents like handling all this?
Guest:No, they're fine with that.
Guest:It was all good because I was still in Toronto.
Marc:But wasn't there the fear like she's going to be an artist?
Guest:Oh, no, no, no.
Guest:They didn't care about that.
Guest:No, they had a problem with, you know, with me dating a woman.
Marc:They did.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, that's how I, you know, stopped living at home.
Marc:What did they say?
Marc:What was their approach?
Guest:It was just like, are you gay?
Guest:And I was kind of laughing, like, oh, my God, my parents are asking me if I'm gay.
Guest:I don't even know.
Guest:It's like, I like people.
Marc:And did they kick you off?
Guest:It was funny, yeah.
Guest:It was funny because I think my dad was trying to be angry.
Guest:In my mind, I was like, he's not really angry.
Guest:But my mother was.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She's come a long way.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, she was very open and liberal, but still, you know, when it's your own child, it's quite different.
Marc:That's sort of interesting, isn't it?
Guest:Yeah, it's very interesting.
Marc:I know it's a bad word, but I mean... Yeah, yeah.
Guest:No, but it's appropriate.
Marc:Yeah, but I mean...
Marc:How did she reconcile that?
Marc:I mean, she was the one that reacted.
Marc:Is it out of fear?
Marc:Or do they think, oh, your life is going to be so difficult?
Guest:That's what it is also.
Guest:I think she's just worried that it's the 1950s still and that life is going to be so difficult if you have an interracial marriage.
Marc:People are going to judge you.
Marc:You're never going to be able to go outside.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, things like that.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It's weird about parents, especially open-minded ones, when people get into the arts or have sexual preferences that they don't agree with.
Marc:You know, their anger is really this weird concern.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Like, you know, how are you going to exist?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like, basically, I couldn't deal with that if that was me, you know, also.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:And how did she eventually come around the smoking psychologist?
Yeah.
Guest:The smoking psychologist, she'll never like that girl.
Marc:Oh, that one.
Marc:Yeah, she'll never like her.
Marc:That one girl.
Guest:Yeah, she'll never like that girl.
Marc:Because she sees that girl as the one that did it?
Guest:Yeah, I don't know.
Guest:So whatever.
Guest:It's fine.
Marc:To this day, she's not going to like that.
Guest:Yeah, even if I play shows in Toronto and if Andy comes in, my mother's still a bit like, hello, Andy.
Guest:It's fun.
Guest:It's fun for me.
Guest:I'm always like, Andy's here.
Marc:Oh, that's interesting.
Marc:When I was listening to music and filling my head with Peach's material, which I do, and I don't always know.
Guest:You're rubbing your head while you're saying this and closing your head.
Guest:Was it all right for you?
Marc:No, it was great.
Marc:It was great.
Marc:But I started to realize that probably seeing you live and experiencing what you do on stage and how it sort of is put together there.
Marc:I mean, the music's great, but it seems like a lot of the stuff is a visual experience.
Marc:I mean, even the videos, the album covers, but then the few live things that I was able to see, it seems like it's half, if not more, of the experience of what you do is the visual element.
Guest:yeah it could be for some people for other people they don't even know my name but they know songs like fuck the pain away or boys want to be here sure you know without knowing me right like i've met people you know like kids and they're like so what do you do i'm like oh you know my artist and peaches and they're like oh yeah yeah what do you sing and i'm like electro music and they're like oh yeah i'm like you know that song fuck the pain away they're fuck the pain away that's my jam yeah and i'm like that's me and they're like what yeah
Guest:I love that moment.
Guest:Because to me, that's even the music transcending any image, any message.
Guest:So that's exciting for me.
Guest:Or when it's used on certain shows like South Park or 30 Rock.
Guest:And I'm just like, whoa.
Guest:It's like beyond anything that I have to feed.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:It exists without you and will exist without you forever.
Marc:And it's just out there.
Marc:And people have a relationship with it.
Marc:That was a hit.
Guest:uh fuck the playaway it was but not of course it was never um radio or anything hard to be played yeah but everybody knew it this was like just before you know internet was right yeah so it's like 2000 just missed the cut just barely no yeah but which was great because um i was getting you know attention from a lot of huge artists like loving this song and everything and also
Guest:Yeah, just it was going around.
Guest:People are always like, oh, yeah, that was my, you know, I've conceived to that album.
Guest:I've given birth to that album.
Marc:That's my high school song.
Guest:I came out to the song.
Guest:That's my high school song.
Guest:That's, you know, so many stories.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:What's a powerful message?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, it's actually a breakup song, obviously.
Marc:Yeah, obviously.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:How are you going to get rid of heartbreak?
Marc:You got to fuck your way through it.
Guest:Yeah, so.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Does that work?
Marc:It doesn't always work.
Guest:It was fun.
Marc:It was fun.
Marc:It was fun at the time.
Marc:The tricky thing about fucking the pain away is that then all of a sudden at the end of your self-therapy of fucking pain away, you're like, oh my God.
Marc:I'm tired.
Marc:Yeah, I fucked my heart numb.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:i'm tired now yeah but well you hope maybe something will come out you know like you're just trying to be yourself again right sure and then maybe something you know something will stick you know you know that theory of like i'm not gonna think about it and then who was the breakup with what's her name
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:It was with my ex-husband.
Marc:The eight-year guy.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you went from the folky relationship with, what's her name?
Marc:I want to know her name.
Marc:Andy D. Andy D. Just to irritate your mom.
Marc:So Andy D. Would you consider her the first love of your life?
Guest:Uh, no, Robert, Robert, Robert Morton was the first love of my life.
Marc:So you met the high school relationship.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And then the husband's name?
Guest:Jordan Sonnenberg.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:He really kept in the tribe.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, Jordan, he was not into being Jewish at all.
Marc:Except for his name.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And he was an artist who made action figures.
Guest:Yeah, he made incredible things.
Guest:He also made a model of himself with a big claw and a big heart on.
Guest:I would really like to relieve myself, but I can't because I have a big claw for a hand.
Guest:Does that mean I was bad in bed?
Marc:That means he's got some problems.
Guest:Yes, so he had a lot of issues to work out.
Marc:But was that an inspiration to you?
Marc:It sounds like your reverence for the dude in terms of how he conceived of things visually was pretty high.
Guest:Yeah, he also was like a wealth of knowledge for like, you know...
Guest:visual arts and he went to art school, he'd be reading about something, he'd be like, what's that?
Guest:He'd be like, I'm reading a book about the situationists.
Guest:I'm like, who are they?
Guest:And then he'd roll his eyes.
Marc:Right, that relationship.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:You know that movie with Bernadette Peters, Slaves of New York?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And the boy, you remember their relationship?
Guest:Not really.
Guest:And he's like, what is it I hate about you most?
Guest:We used to say that to each other.
Marc:Oh, that was the tagline?
Marc:Yeah, and that's kind of like.
Marc:You kind of picked it up?
Guest:It's kind of right.
Guest:yeah yeah how we were just like there was like a negative kind of thing it sounds like it sounds like true love yeah it was true love so we broke up but you got married first we got married we were like yeah it was my idea was it uh ironic or was it i was like let's get married maybe we can move to the states maybe it'll be easier we'll get green cards you know we did love each other but it was more like let's get married okay you weren't thinking about having a family no no just getting married he has a family now he does yeah he leveled off is he still an artist
Marc:he's still an artist that's good yeah he hung in there yeah but um when did you when did it start to like when did you start to put together this very versatile stage persona where you were you you kind of found your groove i know it happens organically but at some point you you knew you were gonna you know challenge assumptions
Guest:Well, I guess after, you know, Fancy Pants Hoodlum was fun for me, but I didn't really have an audience.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I was asked by a friend's band, Spin the Susan, you know, like a Lazy Susan.
Guest:That was the name of their band.
Guest:They were very much like a Beyond the Valley of the Dolls kind of band.
Guest:in the way they were presented themselves presented and the music okay and um there were two girls in in that band and i was like girls making music awesome so we played together and then one of the girls i wanted to start a band with and um i was like i want a girl band let's have a girl band together and she said well my next door neighbor he's a guy and he has like instruments in his basement let's just go over there and jam and there's this other guy i have a crush on let's just get together i'm like
Guest:girl band no but she's like just come so uh i met these two guys i didn't even meet them we just basically we all smoked a joint and then we started jamming and then we started writing songs about each other without knowing each other like with sexual innuendos and it was crazy and then we just kept switching instruments which i'd never done in my life
Guest:All of a sudden they're like, play the drums.
Guest:I'm playing drums and then I'm playing keyboards, which in my mind was like rock and roll does not have keyboards.
Guest:You know, I was like, that is like number one.
Marc:You were a purist.
Marc:Yeah, I was.
Marc:No synthesizers.
Guest:And now I'm like synthesizer.
Guest:Yeah, it's like that was the moment I got on the synthesizer and, you know.
Marc:On a Roland.
Guest:No, it wasn't the groove box, but it was like a Moog.
Guest:Like the real like... Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And I was like... Yeah.
Guest:And so after that, we all hung out.
Guest:It was like Maki, who's a really good, awesome musician, maybe you know him, and Chili Gonzalez.
Guest:After that practice, we got together.
Guest:We all gave each other names.
Guest:That's where I gave myself peaches.
Guest:And we called ourselves the shit.
Guest:And we're like, we're the shit.
Guest:Because we were all dissatisfied with our music.
Guest:And actually, we became pretty popular.
Guest:And just in terms of you could tell audience liked it.
Guest:And we were enjoying it.
Guest:It was kind of like art rock and really sexual.
Guest:So that's kind of where the seeds of it all came.
Marc:Sexual in just the musical content, not the performance necessarily.
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, no, we weren't like rubbing against each other.
Guest:We were mostly screaming.
Guest:In my mind, we were like Pussy Galore.
Marc:Okay, sure.
Marc:That was like my favorite.
Marc:But it was rock in your mind.
Guest:But it was rock.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:But it was arty, you know, with keyboards and stuff.
Marc:Were you into Sonic Youth?
Marc:Were you into art rock bands?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, that's what happened.
Guest:Mermaid Cafe was, like, 1989, 1990, and I heard, like, Pavement and, you know, Sonic Youth and Bung Water.
Guest:I was really into Bung Water.
Marc:She was great.
Marc:I can see that influence, Magnuson.
Marc:I can see that a lot in the way you construct, you know, songs.
Marc:Like, they're kind of funny, and they got good turns of phrase.
Guest:Yeah, she was really funny.
Marc:Yeah, and Kramer was sort of a mastermind for a while.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But Sonic Youth, too, they were a big influence.
Guest:Yeah, I loved Kim Gordon and I loved Pussy Galore.
Marc:And what about Suicide?
Guest:The band Suicide.
Marc:Well, not the idea.
Guest:I always say, and I'm very influenced by Suicide.
Guest:And then I'm like, God, some people don't know what you're saying.
Guest:You have to say the band.
Guest:yeah yeah i did i just got turned on to them i miss fucking everything okay well wait wait this i miss them too because um so after the shit everybody moved away and that's when i got the wrong groove box and i was like i'm gonna make a band anyway it's gonna just by myself yeah and that's why i thought it was being rock and roll and then all of a sudden it was kind of an electro and that was that became teachers of peaches the big one yeah that was my first album yeah
Marc:So it is sort of an organic evolution.
Marc:Very organic.
Marc:With all these art rock people and you're doing this weird shit and then you're like, fuck it, I need more freedom.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I need more point of view.
Marc:And you got that rolling, what is it, MC505?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And you're like, I can do it all.
Guest:Yeah, and I was recording on an ADAT machine.
Marc:So what were you going to say about suicide?
Guest:Well, then I was playing a gig.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:By yourself.
Guest:Yeah, by myself.
Guest:It was actually a folk night, but I was playing the keyboard.
Marc:So you just start with a beat and then people will be like, what's happening?
Guest:Yeah, and they'd be like, what is this?
Guest:It's one person, so is this faux?
Guest:I don't.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And then my friend, he had this band, Do Make Say Think.
Guest:I don't know if you know.
Guest:He's like, you need this.
Guest:And he put Suicide, the band's album.
Marc:The first album.
Guest:Yeah, under my arm.
Guest:He's like, you sound like this.
Wow.
Guest:And then somebody else in another gig did that with ESG.
Guest:Do you know that band, ESG?
Guest:There's like these girls from Brooklyn in the 80s.
Guest:No, the Bronx, sorry.
Guest:Their mom didn't want them to be part of gangs, so she got them all instruments.
Guest:And they became this great band.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:You probably know some of their music.
Guest:I'm lacking.
Marc:What kind of music is it?
Guest:It's, I mean, it's, I don't know, it's its own thing.
Marc:Really?
Guest:It's just like, the only boy in the band, I think his name was Tito, he's like playing kind of a bit of conga, and there's drums and bass, and very like simplified, but really good, and just a singer, I don't know.
Marc:When I heard Suicide, I was like, what the fuck?
Guest:I know, this is really good.
Marc:And then I went and looked up a video of Vega singing, and I'm like, what is that?
Guest:Yeah, I got to sing with them.
Marc:You did?
Guest:Yeah, Frankie Teardrops.
Guest:You did?
Guest:Yeah, they're like, please just come on up and sing with them.
Guest:I was jumping on them, and it was so fun.
Guest:I was just like, this is our dream.
Guest:yeah and when did that happen later um no yeah much later like after all right so you put together teaches the peaches by yourself yeah yeah i just in my room i was like um well fuck the pain away yeah the recording of it yeah was from a cassette off a soundboard the first time i ever played it right in a club for like 20 people and the sound girl i think her name was marlin she's like
Guest:I made a cassette of your set.
Guest:If you give me $5, you can have it.
Guest:And I was like, borrowed $5.
Guest:And I took it and then put that song on a demo, you know, as a demo.
Guest:And then, you know, recorded a few other.
Guest:And people heard that song.
Guest:And I thought I would get feedback.
Guest:And it was like, this song's awesome.
Guest:Like, it's great.
Guest:And I was like, oh, don't, you know, if it ain't broke, don't fix.
Guest:So I never recorded that song.
Guest:And that's the thing.
Marc:That was the recording?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That that sound girl made?
Guest:Well, yeah, she just recorded it.
Guest:I was doing it live.
Marc:She did it through the board?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:She just taped it off the board, but I was doing all the sound in the machine on stage.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Mixing it and making up the words.
Yeah.
Marc:And that's the version that's on the record?
Guest:That's the one that became the big... That's my lifeline.
Marc:That's amazing.
Guest:I love that.
Marc:So the big hit, the one that everyone knows you for in a way, is just something that happened live and in the moment?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's got to be a point of pride.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's fucking awesome.
Guest:And I didn't even realize it because I put it on the demo hoping for like, oh, I think that guy makes electronic music.
Guest:I'm going to ask him what he thinks.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:So how'd the record deal come about?
Guest:It wasn't really a record deal.
Guest:I went with Chili Gonzalez.
Guest:He had these two CD players.
Marc:What's his real name?
Guest:His real name's Jason.
Guest:He had two CD players and you could plug it into a system.
Guest:And I had my own groove box and we went to Europe.
Guest:We're like, let's go to Amsterdam and smoke weed.
Guest:That's all we wanted to do.
Guest:And he's like, but he had a place in Paris through friends.
Guest:And then we met somebody else in Berlin.
Guest:So we went there too.
Guest:But it was just by chance.
Guest:And we would be like, we have machines.
Guest:You can plug them into your stereo system and we could play music in your bar.
Guest:You know, this is before laptops and everything.
Guest:Now it's like, oh yeah, just plug it over there.
Guest:Like everybody with their phone and you know.
Marc:This was a more sort of organic techno experience.
Guest:Yeah, and it was like 1998.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then we got to Berlin, and we met some girl named Magda, and she was like, we were telling her, oh, what we do, and she's like, you should go to this place, Gallery Berlin Tokyo, which was just some weird underground art space.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we went there, and...
Guest:There was a guy from a very small label there and he's like, oh, I'm interested in what you guys are doing.
Guest:We didn't even sing.
Guest:We were just playing like experimental music.
Marc:Just the two of you.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then I had to go back home.
Guest:I had commitments.
Guest:And then I was like, I'm going to move to Berlin.
Guest:Should be fun or whatever.
Guest:And then I made Teachers of Peaches in Toronto during that time.
Marc:So this is post-Wall Berlin.
Marc:This is open city Berlin.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It's 1999 and stuff.
Marc:Later.
Marc:So 10 years later.
Marc:So...
Marc:What was the scene like there?
Marc:Because I've talked to people who were there early on when it was dark.
Marc:And, like, who did I talk to?
Marc:Like, Nick Cave and those people that, you know, gravitated towards the energy.
Marc:But was it still pretty vital?
Marc:I mean, was it still like a... It was incredible.
Guest:You, like, climb through windows to get into, like, parties where there's, like, five people partying all night long.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But, like, having the best time of their life, you know?
Marc:But what was the art scene like?
Marc:Did you see anything that was starting to kind of feed into what you were doing?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:There was a group, the Honeysuckle Collective.
Guest:They were just making videos and doing performances and things like that.
Marc:Were you considering yourself a performance artist?
Guest:No, actually, I wasn't.
Marc:You do get labeled that?
Guest:I did get labeled that.
Guest:Well, I remember when I played my... Because people weren't used to also just like a machine.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know, they were used to people with a machine looking down, pretending that it was rocket science.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:So I was like, fuck that.
Guest:I'm going to put a rock and roll energy.
Guest:I'm going to perform with what I have, like Iggy Pop style.
Guest:That's my thing.
Guest:But I'm going to play electronics.
Guest:So it's going to confuse people.
Guest:It's going to confuse people that I'm a girl in little pink shorts.
Guest:And you see my pubic hairs, and I'm aggressive.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I'm seeing these sex things really positive.
Guest:So I was just like, let's go.
Guest:And people were just freaked out about it.
Guest:And they saw it as art or punk rockers loved it.
Guest:Because it was different.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And a lot of the Berliner punk rock people started their own electro one person bands after that.
Marc:You planted the seed.
Guest:Yeah, it was pretty, but there was also like Atari Teenage Riot, which was, you know, more of a digital hardcore scene, which came right before what I was doing, which was like more like angry version.
Marc:Right.
Guest:You know, and I was like, let's have fun with it more.
Marc:So you're not driven by any anger.
Guest:No, there's definitely anger and stuff, but it's playful.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So was Iggy a big influence on what you wanted to do on stage?
Guest:Yeah, but even more, like raw power, all the riffage.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I wanted to get that.
Guest:into electronics which is aka suicide the band sure i didn't know who they were right so yeah and then of course my dreams came true when i met iggy pop at um like some award show where i just ran in and was like hey and i don't know he was in some kind of great mood and i said to you i love you and then he held my hand and we were just kind of looking at each other like
Guest:yeah man thanks and his girlfriend was there and she's like Iggy this is Peaches she's the shit and he's like oh cool and I was like where do you live and he's in Miami and I'm like oh I'm playing there next week wanna come so when I played in Miami my guest list was Iggy plus one yeah and he showed up oh that's amazing so he always gives me time you know like if I see him he'll hang out it's like yeah he'll he's usually eating a steak and drinking one glass of red wine you know
Marc:He's very lucid.
Marc:You make assumptions about those guys.
Marc:It's all still in there.
Marc:His memory is clear as a bell and he's a real thinker.
Guest:Yes, totally.
Marc:It was really surprising to me to have him sitting here and just lock in.
Marc:Like Rollins once said, there's sort of this weird difference between Jim and Iggy.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Like, you know, if you talk to Jim, you're going to get a very sophisticated, thoughtful guy.
Marc:And then when he becomes Iggy, that's a whole different thing.
Guest:Yeah, he's like, fuck all that.
Marc:Yeah, it's a very defined difference.
Marc:So when did you start, you know, integrating, you know, spandex and cocks and hair?
Guest:Well...
Guest:Yeah, well... Multiple boobs.
Guest:Well, this is the thing.
Guest:When I started playing, I got a really cheap pink bathing suit because I'm like, I should wear something girly because I was mentioning I was being so aggressive on stage.
Guest:And people started to point at my bathing suit shorts because they would see pubic hairs.
Guest:And I was like, oh my God, they're freaked out that they see a few pubic hairs.
Guest:This is amazing.
Guest:Yeah, right.
Guest:And the album cover is a picture...
Guest:Of that pink.
Guest:Of that, which is from a live show.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then I started to make like crotch galleries and things like that because people would be taking pictures of my crotch because they couldn't believe it.
Marc:That there was pubic hairs coming out?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That was so challenging.
Marc:Yeah, challenging.
Marc:Because it sort of, it kind of, I guess the idea is that it undermines the sexual excitement of the shorts.
Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:The heteronormative.
Marc:Heteronormative interpretation of what those shorts mean.
Guest:Exactly.
Marc:It's like, that's not clean.
Marc:There's hair coming out of it.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:So, and I would play on that and armpit hair and stuff like that, which is now.
Marc:You liked doing that, challenging this heteronormative.
Marc:Well, I was just lazy.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:Is it?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I really don't want to shave there all the time.
Marc:No, no, no, no.
Marc:I know.
Marc:But you knew that you were on to something.
Guest:Yeah, but I was like, yeah, that's fine.
Marc:Let's just do that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But then you decided to keep upping the ante a little bit.
Guest:a little bit performance wise once you realize that people are like yeah no just keep people were playing into it too they were making me costumes like that that you talked about this multiple boob costume with the barbie heads that i had yeah um that was made by one of my dancers she just presented she's like i made you this
Marc:The woman I'm seeing is a painter and she turned me on to Louise Bourgeois.
Marc:Oh, yes.
Marc:Today.
Guest:Yes, she's amazing.
Guest:And she has like one of those multiple boob.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But she also does all kinds of all those interesting sculptures that are kind of claws, kind of clits, kind of cocks.
Marc:And you're like, what?
Marc:And then spiders.
Guest:She's incredible.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It's kind of mind blowing along that front of provoking heteronormative culture.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I'm getting it.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Give me some other classifications.
Marc:But at some point, you must have realized that there was a following accumulating around, you know, what you were doing with, you know, sort of turning gender stuff inside out and pushing those buttons.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, I really was speaking about it sincerely.
Guest:I wasn't, like, trying to, like, think about, you know, some kind of... It was just kind of happening.
Marc:It wasn't an activist movement.
Guest:No, I was just, you know...
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And there was a lot of, there's comedy to it.
Guest:Yeah, there's comedy because that's the best way to let people know what you're thinking, you know.
Marc:Right.
Guest:It's like that's the way you get through to people.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:They laugh and then it goes in deeper.
Guest:Sure.
Marc:And when you do something as big as some of the outfits you wear and some of the effects that you have, and if you've got a dildo on somehow, it is hilarious, but it's also sort of like, what the fuck?
Guest:Yeah, the dildo is funny because right before I moved from Toronto,
Marc:To Bruin?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was seeing this girl who was a leather maker.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And she made me my first red leather shorts.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And she made me two leather dildos.
Marc:They were leather dildos?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Wow.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Those ones weren't used.
Guest:Those were more for show.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:So, and then, so I gave them to my two dancers.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:And they wore them.
Guest:I mean, I wore them.
Guest:I wore it.
Guest:I wore it on face mask.
Guest:I didn't even think it was controversial because I just- I don't know if it's controversial.
Marc:It's just provocative.
Guest:provocative I don't know I just thought it was funny yeah it's hilarious yeah why not so and I almost got arrested actually when I opened for Queens of the Stone Age at the Palladium really because I was wearing that dildo because I have a song Shake Your Dicks yeah so me and my you know gal pal sidekick Mignon were both wearing them and singing Shake Your Dicks and yeah
Guest:And then after there was like a whole team of people thinking about, you know, should we call the police?
Guest:Is this indecent exposure?
Marc:It isn't.
Marc:They're prosthetics.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:They're not.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:It's not real dicks.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So, but it was amazing to me that there was even a discussion about it.
Marc:But the law enforcement is like, I don't know if this counts, if they're not real cops.
Guest:Yeah, that conversation would have been good.
Marc:That would have been real good.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But between Teachers of Peaches and the next album, there's a lot of years.
Guest:Three years.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Fatherfucker, next one.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And what were you doing?
Guest:Well, I always made an album and then toured for two years.
Marc:Two years?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And when you toured, did you do roughly the same stage shows, same costumes?
Marc:Like, did you get, like, was there a show that you hit every time?
Marc:Because you had dancers and everything, right?
Guest:Not Teachers of Peaches was just me.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know, and I'd go through the machine and then sometimes just playback.
Guest:And it was a lot about interplay between the audience.
Guest:Right.
Guest:By the end of the show, I'd be always like, I don't know, I remember one show being on someone's shoulders, eating a hot dog in the middle of the audience, people just dancing around, stuff like that.
Marc:But you never got into drugs?
Marc:To work?
Guest:No, not for work.
Guest:I did cocaine once before a show.
Guest:That's bad.
Guest:There's footage.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:I'm just like jumping and sweating.
Guest:It's not good.
Guest:It's not cute.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But yeah, I'm a marijuana person.
Marc:Sure.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But do you ever think like you've clearly had a profound influence on a lot of other artists and how do you do you register that?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, do you look at people like Lady Gaga or other people that are taking the type of kind of humorous?
Marc:Like, it seems to me that you planted a seed of something that she is aware of.
Guest:Yeah, of course.
Marc:Do you know her?
Guest:No, I don't know.
Marc:How do you feel about her?
Guest:I mean, what she does is quite different because she's taken the greatest influences of the last 30 years and put them all into her show.
Marc:Meaning Madonna.
Guest:Grace Jones.
Marc:Sure.
Guest:Rosine Murphy.
Marc:So you think she's real aware of what she's appropriating.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She's very, you know, she knows all that for sure.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So you see yourself as a different type of performer.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, I'm just organically doing this thing and it happened or whatever.
Guest:But, you know, I'm not mad at being, like, part of this, you know, like, let's look at an iconic history and build Gaga.
Guest:Grace Jones, Madonna, Peaches.
Guest:I'm like, yes.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Ellen John, okay, cool.
Guest:I'll be in that gang.
Guest:Thank you.
Marc:I guess what I'm asking as a person that has spent a lot of time in my past judging myself against others, are you happy with where your career is as you are?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:I am so happy I'm not.
Marc:Huge?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm so happy I'm not Lady Gaga.
Marc:Right.
Guest:It's not my goal.
Guest:Right now, it's even such a good time with this new album.
Guest:In the book?
Guest:In the book, yeah.
Guest:With the new album, Rub, now I'm doing interviews and people are like, you're important.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Things that you said happened.
Guest:Like what?
Guest:Well, because I was always like, I'm not moving towards the mainstream.
Guest:The mainstream has to move towards me, you know, with like gender issues and like gay rights and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
Marc:Now, how do you feel about, you know, obviously the pressure on someone like Gaga to sort of maintain whatever the hell she's doing at the level she's doing at and then to take the sort of weird courage to change things up and do interesting things?
Marc:becomes a pressure, but do you find you've been put in the position as an example or a role model or a spokesperson for gender issues?
Guest:Sometimes, yeah.
Marc:But that's cool.
Guest:Yeah, I'll say whatever I need to say about it.
Guest:And if I can't, you know, I'm not an authority.
Guest:I'm, you know.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Do people come up to you and go, I could change my life.
Marc:I was locked up in a small town and I didn't think I could get out.
Guest:I constantly hear that.
Guest:It's incredible.
Guest:It's incredible.
Marc:And what kind of people usually are influenced?
Marc:Like people that didn't think they had a way to express who they were?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Or coming out or musicians or feeling like they had to be.
Guest:Just feeling.
Guest:My whole thing is I want people to feel comfortable in their own skin.
Guest:Whichever way that is.
Guest:And that's the most important thing you can do for yourself.
Marc:But it's interesting because your journey doesn't seem to involve trauma.
Marc:and and involve like you know any real sort of restriction that you know you sort of kind of came to it with with a certain freedom of mind that wasn't sort of like you know i'm gonna you know fuck all this yeah yeah it's funny because i think about that because people are always like yeah and then you know we had this horrible relationship yeah i it's true
Guest:yeah it's it's nice yeah no it's like it's nice people are like oh she's actually nice like there's well you make an album called father fucker and people are like oh my dad loved that title he thought it was brilliant he did yeah he was like i totally you know it was well because it's all based on like motherfucker this motherfucker that so it's like it's a turn it's a turn on a phrase that's what it is right it's just like what if we said father fucker all the time like oh no
Guest:you know yeah yeah yeah so he got the joke and he was yeah he loved it he was like your beard looked so cute on the cover so they've really embraced your success and yeah my dad cries and shows like you know i'm saying they're like whipping my pants around my head and like doing somersaults and he's like that's my baby yeah yeah he loves it but then they they constantly even now more than ever my mom's like we're so proud of you and
Guest:You're doing really important, wonderful things.
Guest:But the thing we love most is that you're a good person.
Guest:That's really sweet.
Marc:That's true.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because it's weird culturally, me being a representative heteronormative, that you... I think you're overusing the word now.
Marc:No, no.
Marc:I'm going to put it on a sign.
Marc:Milk it.
Marc:Milk it.
Marc:No, but to classify in terms of our assumptions about what you do.
Marc:So there's always going to be this sort of like, oh, she must be fucked up.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's just not the case.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I think that's an amazing thing.
Marc:And it gives you a sort of power to come from a place of fun and really creatively embracing all these possibilities comedically and otherwise and challenging from a place that isn't sort of like, you know, that has an ax to grind.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Some sort of, yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I just want people to feel comfortable in their body.
Guest:I swear.
Marc:No matter what.
Marc:I swear.
Marc:No matter what.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Just feel comfortable in your body.
Marc:Life's too short.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You might as well be whole.
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, isn't that what we try and do our whole lives?
Guest:I don't fucking know what we're trying to do.
Guest:Yeah, you're trying to find out who you are.
Marc:That's right.
Guest:That's it.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:And that's being comfortable in your own body, right?
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:And then there's, you know, religion and politics that tell you you have to be this way, this way, and mainstream this way, this way.
Guest:And that's where, you know, all the problems start and all the hidden secrets and all the Republicans going on the, you know, affair sites.
Guest:And then you find out the truth.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:What repression causes and what fear causes.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:It's all why are we giving into the repression and the fear?
Guest:And it's not like, yeah, let's just fuck everybody all the time.
Guest:I have my standards, but I just really honor yourself that way.
Marc:And when you did Impeach My Bush, that record, was that, obviously there's a political statement in the title, but other than that, the one tune, did you see it as a political record?
Guest:I see each album now, in retrospect.
Guest:I see Teaches of Peaches as a masturbation album in a very positive sense.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:I see Father Fucker as role playing.
Guest:I see Impeach My Bush as a call to revolution.
Guest:And then I Feel Cream is exploring my vulnerable side.
Guest:And Rub, which is my new album.
Marc:Return to masturbation?
Guest:Yeah, return to masturbation.
Guest:Always return to masturbation.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Go full circle.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But the one, I Feel Cream, your vulnerable side, in what way?
Marc:When you were putting that album together, were you thinking, like, I'm a grown person and now I'm grounded enough to do this other thing?
Yeah.
Guest:I think it was, A, I decided to collaborate with people.
Guest:I was like, I'm just going to collaborate with these people that I want to work with.
Marc:Which is vulnerable.
Guest:Which is vulnerable, exactly.
Guest:And then some of the songs became very vulnerable.
Guest:And also, I'm always like, I'm challenging myself.
Guest:So why don't you challenge yourself to also use that side, the vulnerable side.
Marc:How did it feel?
Guest:It was great.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:It was great, yeah.
Yeah.
Marc:And what is Rub?
Marc:What is it?
Guest:Rub, it just sounds good.
Guest:It's lazy.
Marc:No, I like it.
Marc:Is the music, though, different?
Guest:It's very classic me.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Classic Peaches?
Guest:Yeah, songs like Dick in the Air, a song called Rub, of course.
Marc:And in terms of making dance music, that's a whole other world in itself.
Guest:Yeah, what is dance music?
Guest:I don't really... No, but techno gets its reputation.
Guest:I'm not techno.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, for techno people, they'd be like, ha, ha.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:Kindergarten.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:I have to say it in a German accent.
Guest:It's kindergarten music.
Guest:No.
Guest:It's nice, but I wouldn't say it's techno.
Guest:I mean, there's a place in Berlin called Berkheim.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I don't know if you ever heard of this place.
Guest:It's like the Mecca for techno.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And everybody goes there.
Guest:You go there on a Thursday and leave on a Monday morning, and everybody's just naked, and the music's like... It's like a crazy... Yeah.
Marc:movie maybe i'm thinking electronic dance music how's that is that better edm yeah is that that's what it's called yeah no that's like yeah it's but you do i do i call it electro i don't even know what to call it no but it is like it is sort of like music that can transcend you know boundaries because of the beat like i noticed okay that's a good way to put it the
Marc:That there is certain music that has a sort of international feel because it's catchy and it is danceable and it can go on for anywhere from four to an hour minutes.
Marc:And it doesn't matter what culture is listening to it.
Marc:They're going to have the same reaction.
Marc:They're going to be like, yeah, I'm dancing.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then I'm putting these lyrics in.
Guest:So they're dancing.
Guest:And they're going, yeah.
Guest:I'm singing along.
Guest:What am I singing along to?
Marc:I just said that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:So, okay.
Marc:The other question I have, what was this Jesus Christ superstar business?
Guest:Are you a fan of that musical?
Marc:Yeah, I am, actually.
Marc:I saw it when I was younger.
Marc:I saw the movie, and there are certain parts of it I can't ever get out of my head.
Marc:Like which parts?
Marc:Well, I like King Herod's song.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:And I just thought it was great.
Marc:So you are the Christ, y'all.
Marc:So gay.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:So good.
Marc:And I liked, what's the Mary Magdalene song?
Guest:Yvonne Ellman, who is like her and Irene Cara, they are my favorite.
Marc:Right.
Marc:I don't know how to love him.
Marc:Is that it?
Guest:Yvonne Ellman's voice.
Guest:And she was also a Saturday Night Fever.
Guest:She wasn't in it, but she sang like, if I can't have you, I don't want.
Marc:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:But her voice is just so creamy and beautiful.
Marc:I love it.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So you did the musical.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, well, because people our age know it more as a rock album, I think.
Guest:And so I wanted to honor it as that, more than like, let's put a big production and everything.
Guest:So I wanted to sing all the parts, which I think a lot of people, our generation, probably sat in their room and sang along to me.
Marc:Oh, yeah, definitely.
Marc:So that's what I wanted to do.
Marc:You had that double album.
Guest:Yeah, so that's what I wanted to do in front of people because I was like, I think I can sing all this.
Marc:And you did it.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Where?
Where?
Guest:um well i had two runs in berlin and then um i did it in la i did it in san francisco in toronto in chicago um so you toured with it well received yeah yeah and chile gonzalez played everything on uh piano so he's sort of a wizard yeah he's a wizard and actually we didn't even know i didn't even know and he didn't know we both love this musical i was just telling him what i was going to do and he's like oh i'll play piano let's do it you know
Guest:I still do it, but he's not my piano player.
Guest:But I got asked to do it at a national state theater in Munich as a season this year.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like you know that you have five.
Guest:Part of the run.
Guest:Yeah, part of the run.
Guest:So I would have done it twice every month.
Guest:But I would screw up my album cycle, so I'm not going to do it.
Guest:I can't do it.
Guest:But I'm going to go do it once.
Marc:In Munich?
Guest:Yeah, in Munich on October 10th.
Marc:How is it different?
Marc:How is it staged?
Marc:What do you have up there?
Guest:It's just me.
Marc:Just with no props?
Guest:I have a whip for the second half when I have to give him 39 lashes.
Marc:Give myself, him, whatever.
Guest:There's a piano, there's me.
Guest:I have a very simple costume on the first half and then the second half I have more of an augmented like big gold costume.
Guest:And that's it.
Marc:What are the pictures I saw of you being crucified?
Guest:Oh, with the big... Dick.
Guest:Dick.
Guest:That also is like another... This Russian artist came up to me and he said, I bet you need a cross for this show.
Guest:I'm going to make you one.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I had no idea.
Guest:I didn't give him... I was like, okay.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And he made me this like... Giant cock cross.
Guest:I don't even know, like 30 foot long.
Guest:It's all muscle and there's a heart in it.
Guest:People don't realize like all the like body organs in it.
Guest:And then at the head and the head top is a penis.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Do you use that in the show?
Guest:I did on the Berlin run.
Guest:But now I just become the cross.
Marc:Oh, okay.
Guest:I just like roll down some extra gold.
Guest:So I am the cross.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Mostly because I couldn't travel with it.
Marc:Right.
Guest:And I think it was like an unnecessary like...
Marc:Why hit him over the head with a cock at the end?
Guest:Yeah, I mean, some people, that was, to them, they were like, finally, it's a Peaches version.
Guest:But I don't think it's essential to the show.
Guest:But it was there, and this artist made it, and it was great.
Marc:Where's the cock cross being housed now?
Guest:In a place called How Theater.
Guest:Yeah, where we did the original production.
Marc:It's there.
Guest:It's just under there.
Guest:And the Russian artist, every time I come back to Berlin, he's like, where's my penis cross?
Marc:And where are you with religion in general?
Marc:Like, how do you feel about it?
Guest:I'm pretty mad at it.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I think they screwed up.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you don't have any practice, spiritual practice?
Guest:The spiritual practice I'm not mad at.
Guest:I'm just mad at, like, you know, organized religion.
Marc:Sure.
Guest:You know, but spiritual practice.
Guest:I mean, I want to meditate.
Marc:Yeah, me too.
Guest:But do you?
Marc:No, I don't.
Marc:Yeah, I don't.
Marc:I want to.
Marc:Yeah, so we'll do it sometime.
Guest:Yeah, five minutes.
Guest:Why can't you do five minutes a day?
Guest:Why is that so hard?
Marc:That's something you get asked?
Marc:I get asked that.
Marc:No, that's why I ask myself.
Marc:You do?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Five minutes.
Marc:Just sit and breathe.
Marc:Clear your mind.
Guest:And then all of a sudden, what time is it?
Guest:Where's my phone?
Marc:yeah but people who do it are like so sort of like it is like it changes your life yeah and i don't fucking do it yeah i don't need to be in uh you know part of a tm or part of a group of it i just want to do a couple of them have hit me lately yeah tm people yeah they're like it's not a cult yeah you just have to pay some money yeah you just pay us yeah pay him once you just pay once
Guest:A lot, and you get a mantra.
Marc:Right, like three grand or something, right?
Guest:No, it's ridiculous.
Marc:Fuck it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What are you doing in L.A.?
Marc:Videos?
Guest:Living.
Marc:You live here?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I didn't know that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I live here in Berlin.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:I have a house here.
Marc:Where do you live?
Marc:What part of town?
Guest:Silver Lake.
Marc:Oh, you're right here?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You're down the street?
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Marc:Hanging out?
Guest:Yeah, coming to Amara Kitchen.
Marc:Did you ever do any of those performance art pieces in museums?
Guest:I tried, well, you know Cynthia Plastercaster?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:So she Plastercast my breasts and I asked her.
Guest:It's a change for her.
Guest:Yeah, no, she started that in the 90s.
Guest:She's like, I gotta do girls.
Guest:I gotta do boobs.
Guest:Enough cocks.
Guest:Yeah, so it's a lot of cocks.
Guest:So when I was in Chicago, I said, can we do it as a performance?
Guest:And I was playing like a little show at Weekend Records.
Guest:I don't think it exists anymore.
Guest:But we did a performance.
Guest:So my friend had to do one of the castings.
Guest:And she was really nervous because she's never done it live.
Guest:So we tried to make it like a live performance.
Marc:And it worked?
Guest:The boob that she did worked.
Guest:And my friend was so nervous.
Guest:My friend Malcolm is kind of like... He's like, I'm really close to your boob.
Guest:Help.
Marc:That one didn't come out as good?
Marc:No.
Marc:But it's okay.
Marc:Got one good boob out of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's all you can...
Guest:That's all you can ask for.
Marc:One good boob out of it.
Marc:One good boob.
Marc:Nice talking to you.
Marc:Nice talking to you.
Marc:It was great.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:Do you feel happy?
Guest:Very happy.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Well, good luck with the new record.
Guest:Thank you.
Marc:wasn't that great go check out her work it's mind-blowing and mind-fucking all the good things aren't supposed to do she'll mind-blow you and and also mind-fuck you that's what me okay i'll keep it personal i don't mind
Marc:All right, so you can go to WTFPod.com for all you WTFPod needs, as usual.
Marc:Get on the mailing list.
Marc:Check the episode guide.
Marc:Check my calendar.
Marc:I'm coming to Australia.
Marc:What else?
Marc:Oh, for those of you who noticed that we didn't get a Boomer Lives in, I spent so long trying to play Happy Birthday on my guitar that it actually eluded me.
Marc:So thank you for noticing.
Marc:Boomer Lives!
you