Episode 352 - Elizabeth Banks
Marc:Alright, let's do this.
Marc:How are you, what the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fuckineers?
Marc:What the fuckanoids?
Marc:What the fuckatopians?
Marc:What the fuckyopians?
Marc:What the fuckaholics?
Marc:I am Marc Maron.
Marc:This is WTF.
Marc:The New World Order is out in my front yard.
Marc:We're all in trouble.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:You don't believe it.
Marc:The Bilderbergers, the Trilateral Commission, McDonald's, Sony, Arby's.
Marc:I mean, we're in trouble, man.
Marc:Wake up.
Marc:I mean, how clear does this have to be, people?
Marc:I mean, what do I got to do?
Marc:Spell it out for you?
Marc:Paint you a picture?
Marc:We're in trouble eating genetic modified foods.
Marc:When you eat genetically modified foods, your cells turn into cameras.
Marc:They're in us.
Marc:Do you understand?
Marc:The drones are everywhere.
Marc:Listen.
Marc:Do you hear?
Marc:That's a drone.
Marc:It's a very small drone.
Marc:Those aren't gnats in my house.
Marc:Those aren't gnats falling into my girlfriend's cranberry juice.
Marc:Those are dead drones.
Marc:They were sent here to attack us in a very small level with bacterial infection.
Marc:Don't trust vitamins.
Marc:Come on.
Marc:Don't you see what's happening?
Marc:They're taking away my gun fantasies.
Marc:They are taking away the fantasies that involve me holding firearms of any kind.
Marc:It's not just automatic firearms.
Marc:Sometimes I fantasize about having just a handgun or a Derringer.
Marc:It's a very small firearm, maybe a two-shot, .22 caliber Derringer that I bought at a thrift store for a very reasonable price.
Marc:That once belonged to somebody who hid it in his sleeve and was killed during a botched magic act.
Marc:That was a very elaborate fantasy, but I can't have it anymore because they're taking it away.
Marc:Who's taking it away?
Marc:Third or fourth generation foreigners.
Marc:People have been living here for all their lives.
Marc:They're still connected somehow to another country.
Marc:They're taking it away.
Marc:They're taking away my constitutional right to enjoy peace of mind in my own bathroom.
Marc:It's all happening right now.
Marc:Who's telling me this?
Marc:I'll tell you who's telling me this.
Marc:The Lord.
Marc:The Lord is telling me this.
Marc:Hold on.
Marc:He's saying something else.
Marc:I know the cat needs to go to the vet.
Marc:I know.
Marc:Stop bothering me.
Marc:Stop bothering me.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Cats are in trouble, too.
Marc:New World Order is on to my cats.
Marc:They know how attached I am to my cats, how important they are to me, that I understand that the cat is the only being that truly appreciates freedom, that knows its place in the world, that has freedom of thought.
Marc:Cats have more rights than I do.
Marc:That's clear.
Marc:Don't have to amend the cat constitution.
Marc:I mean, I've had it.
Marc:I've had it.
Marc:I've had it from the inside.
Marc:I've had it from the outside.
Marc:Quite frankly, I think my brain is a parasite.
Marc:My brain is no longer my brain.
Marc:It's feeding on my own thoughts.
Marc:And these are the ones that are coming out because these are the only ones left.
Marc:Soon they will all be eaten.
Marc:And I'll be forced to be put on some sort of medicine, which is the last and final frontier, the medicine that they give us to help us.
Marc:Drains us of our vitality.
Marc:I wouldn't be surprised, folks, if they were recording this right now.
Marc:If they were recording it and filing it and sharing it with others, perhaps on some sort of platform.
Marc:Because they know who I am.
Marc:They know who I am.
Marc:I'm the guy who's onto the dead drone in the glass.
Marc:I'm the guy who understands how the Illuminati built certain buildings, not structurally sound, enabled them to fall down.
Marc:They understand that.
Marc:They know who I am.
Marc:And now they're coming for my cats.
Marc:You can't take away my gun fantasies.
Marc:Okay?
Marc:With your medicine, with your genetically altered foods.
Marc:That's all I'm saying.
Marc:If Alex Jones didn't exist, they would have had to invent them.
Marc:I think I'm paraphrasing something there.
Marc:And Alex Jones owes a great debt of gratitude to the New World Order for his career.
Marc:Oh, boy.
Marc:Yeah, I used to think like that kind of.
Marc:I did.
Marc:I used to think like that kind of.
Marc:Welcome to the show.
Marc:Hi, it's Mark Maron.
Marc:I was temporarily possessed by a random sort of riff that kind of got into my head.
Marc:I want to thank everybody for buying the Boomer Lives t-shirts.
Marc:I hope you enjoy them because I am going to kick in a dollar for every shirt sold, and I think I've decided the charity.
Marc:It's the Animal Rescue Foundation.
Marc:You can check them out at www.animalrescue.com.
Marc:ARF.net.
Marc:They're dedicated to rescuing strays, getting them out of the kill shelters, and placing them with people.
Marc:Highest possible rating on Charity Navigator.
Marc:Did a little research.
Marc:Very little money.
Marc:The money goes to administration and fundraising.
Marc:Almost all of it is spent on the function of the charity, which is getting these little kitties homes.
Marc:But, you know, it's sort of weird.
Marc:I always wondered that.
Marc:Like, are my stray cats, are they at home?
Marc:I think they're at home.
Marc:They're the only ones that are free.
Marc:Don't take away my cat's rights.
Marc:But yeah, I checked him out on Charity Navigator.
Marc:You know, let's be honest.
Marc:That Piers Morgan thing, I watched it again.
Marc:I know it's old news, but that was mutual usage, my friends.
Marc:Mutual usage.
Marc:Symbiosis.
Marc:That should have been a sex tape.
Marc:And I have to admit that Alex Jones would have been the top in that one, in that particular sex tape.
Marc:And now let's talk to the very charming and talented, pretty, Elizabeth Banks.
Elizabeth Banks
Marc:can you handle microphones i love it can i handle a microphone kidding me put a big thing in front of my mouth no problem come on it's already getting racy what happened so wait what do you mean you have like a big day what's like what is a day like you know what happened well there was this huge shooting as we all know horrible that was horrible how old are your kids oh can you swear on this yeah
Guest:My children, I have a 21-month-old and a five-and-a-half-week-old.
Guest:Two boys.
Guest:Anyway, so they're doing this big sort of PSA.
Guest:A bunch of us celebs have all been convinced to go do a PSA as if us Hollywood liberals make a difference at all.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:Of course you do.
Guest:You don't think so?
Guest:Well, it feels good to be contributing to the conversation.
Yeah.
Marc:Didn't you do ads for Obama as well?
Guest:I did, yes.
Marc:So you're an unashamed, unabashed, upfront liberal person.
Guest:Pretty much.
Guest:Pretty much.
Guest:You know, I do feel, first of all, I would have been like that whether I was an actress or not.
Guest:I was raised as a concerned citizen of the world by, you know, parents who give a shit.
Marc:By good parents?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Where was that?
Guest:Nice parents.
Guest:In Pittsfield, Massachusetts.
Marc:Where is that Massachusetts?
Marc:Like how far away from things?
Guest:It's as far from Boston as you can get.
Guest:West?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It is on the border of New York, essentially.
Marc:Because I feel like I've done gigs there.
Marc:I've driven all over Massachusetts.
Marc:But it's like right by upstate New York kind of, right?
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:We are as close to Albany as, you know, to anything.
Marc:Right, I kind of know that.
Marc:You've got to drive all the way across.
Marc:It's miserable.
Marc:You can't just go to Boston.
Marc:It takes forever to drive.
Guest:No, it takes as long to go to Boston as it does to go to New York City.
Marc:So what kind of childhood?
Marc:Farm, rural, town?
Guest:I grew up, it's a very rural area, but my actual town was a GE factory town.
Guest:So it was one of those boom places in the baby boom, literally.
Guest:My dad went to high school, same high school I went to, Pittsfield High School.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Really.
Guest:The public school.
Marc:Are there pictures of your dad doing sports in the trophy frames or anything?
Guest:You know.
Marc:Is he a sports guy?
Guest:Not really.
Guest:He played baseball.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But there were so many freaking kids at the time that they had to go to school in shifts.
Guest:You either went to day school or afternoon school.
Marc:You wanted day school, right?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I think it didn't really matter.
Guest:But my dad literally went to school in shifts.
Marc:Oh, not you.
Marc:Your dad.
Guest:No.
Guest:Me, we were fine.
Marc:And that was all from the GE factory?
Marc:They pulled people in?
Guest:Just had so many, yeah.
Marc:And your dad worked there?
Guest:My dad worked there 33 years.
Guest:He didn't work in Pittsfield the whole time, though.
Guest:He was pink-slipped at least four times.
Marc:Is that factory still there?
Guest:No.
Marc:It's gone.
Guest:Gone.
Marc:Did the town die?
Guest:Oh, yeah, it's dead.
Marc:Sad.
Guest:Dead, dead.
Marc:Like, do you go back and it's like, oh, this is where I had that happen?
Guest:You know, it's weirdly...
Guest:Feels very much the same because nothing changes in small towns.
Marc:There was nothing much there to begin with?
Guest:No.
Guest:Like my house was built in 1899, the house I grew up in.
Guest:My mother still lives in it.
Guest:I mean, it's like.
Marc:Really?
Guest:It's still there.
Marc:Big old house?
Marc:Big old 1899.
Marc:How many kids in the fam?
Guest:Well, it's a duplex.
Guest:I grew up in a duplex.
Guest:It's not like some fancy thing.
Marc:No, but it was like a built house.
Guest:It was a house.
Guest:It was two story.
Marc:Correct.
Marc:How many kids?
Guest:Four of us.
Marc:So there's four of you?
Guest:Yeah, I'm the oldest of four.
Marc:Like Irish Catholic-y kind of?
Guest:Correct.
Guest:Let me tell you this.
Guest:This is crazy.
Marc:No, tell me.
Guest:My great-grandparents had, my great-grandmother had four girls, a boy.
Guest:I mean, sorry, three girls, a boy, and three girls.
Guest:Seven.
Guest:Okay, so seven kids.
Guest:My grandparents, my mom's mother, had three girls, a boy, and three girls.
Guest:So my mom is the oldest of seven, one brother, my Uncle Rick.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:And my mother had three.
Guest:She's the oldest.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My mother had three girls, a boy, and stopped.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And dad got the old V. Really?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:You can't have four freaking kids.
Guest:Jesus.
Guest:Too much.
Marc:But they didn't pressure her to keep going.
Marc:I don't know what that's about.
Marc:Why all the kids?
Marc:Why all the kids?
Guest:There was no abortion back in the day.
Guest:Why all the kids?
Marc:But there was birth control.
Marc:I mean, pull out.
Guest:Put something on it.
Guest:Not when my grandparents were having kids.
Marc:There's always been birth control of some kind.
Guest:Infanticide is back in the day.
Guest:I mean, are you kidding me?
Marc:But you could, you know, I mean, I'm not knocking it.
Marc:So you have a million fucking cousins.
Guest:I have so, I have the largest family.
Guest:My dad, that's only one side.
Guest:My dad's from eight.
Marc:Oh my God.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That was crazy.
Guest:So I have 15 blood aunts and uncles and then all of their husbands and wives and then all of their second husbands and wives and then all of their kids and all of their kids' kids.
Marc:Is it a close family?
Marc:I mean, is there family events like you go and there's really 300?
Guest:It's not like it's we had, I think we had around 90 kids there.
Guest:Mitchell is my real last name.
Marc:So the Mitchell clan meets?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:The Mitchell clan meets.
Guest:That's my dad's side.
Marc:And you have to meet like new nieces and nephews.
Guest:Oh yeah.
Guest:And they do a photo of like the new babies that have been born since the last one.
Guest:Oh yeah.
Guest:It's really, it's lovely.
Marc:It is lovely.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's fun.
Marc:So you must be a fucking rock star.
Guest:You know, you really can't get, you cannot, it keeps you very sane.
Guest:No one really cares.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:I mean, they do, the little kids, especially like the sort of teenage girls.
Guest:The Hunger Games fans.
Guest:Oh, I mean, forget it.
Guest:Like the 11-year-old girls are like, they're beyond.
Marc:Is that worth the whole ride?
Marc:I mean, is that...
Guest:It is.
Guest:It's really fun.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's why you do it.
Marc:But your dad did what over at GE?
Marc:Anything interesting?
Guest:I believe he was a winder.
Guest:Back in the day.
Marc:Isn't it weird that so many people I talk to don't know what the hell their dad really did?
Guest:Yeah, I don't really know what he did.
Guest:He was a winder.
Guest:He worked the third shift for a long time.
Marc:He was a third shift winder?
Marc:And we don't know what a winder is.
Guest:Yeah, so he worked with wires.
Guest:I know, well, he worked on Transformers the second half of his career.
Guest:But in the beginning in Pittsfield, that factory was the factory in my town that got shut down.
Guest:Was a defense factory.
Guest:So we built... Remember when Dukakis rode around in the tank?
Marc:Yeah, sure.
Marc:That killed him.
Guest:Right.
Marc:That was the end of Dukakis.
Guest:I rode in that tank.
Guest:With Dukakis?
Guest:That tank was made in... It was a made in Massachusetts tank.
Guest:That's why the guy was riding around in it.
Guest:On family day at GE, we got to go in that tank.
Marc:How'd that feel?
Guest:It was awesome.
Guest:We thought it was amazing.
Guest:And I remember my dad, I believe for a little while, because we made missiles in the factory.
Guest:And he, I think he like literally did like some of the wiring, like winding.
Marc:And yet you were, so you're brought up sort of, you know, Massachusetts Democrat, that there was a sensibility, a progressive sensibility, even though your dad was making the machines that make the death.
Marc:A job is a job, yeah.
Guest:Well, and he was a union guy.
Guest:I mean, those are all union shops.
Guest:That's right, right.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:So, you know, it's very progressive in that way.
Guest:And also very socially progressive.
Guest:Massachusetts still is very socially progressive.
Marc:I lived there for like seven or eight years.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:I know the score there.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So what kind of, what were you like?
Marc:When did you start acting?
Marc:See, you're sort of like, I picture, let me project a personality.
Guest:I love that.
Guest:Put it onto me.
Marc:Sort of like I imagine that you were fairly intimidating.
Marc:You seem like sort of a tough chick to me.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Yeah, you came up to me at that party and you're like, when am I going to do the podcast?
Marc:I'm like, holy fuck, what's going to happen?
Marc:Is she going to hit me next?
Marc:I didn't even know she even listened or gave a shit about my podcast.
Marc:But I definitely felt like I had to honor whatever you needed at that moment.
Guest:First of all, I had had a couple drinks.
Guest:But no, I'm not that, no, I'm not, I don't think I'm that intimidating.
Guest:Well, look, let's be honest.
Guest:Cheerleader?
Guest:Cheerleader?
Guest:I was a cheerleader for a minute, but not in high school.
Guest:I broke my leg sliding into third base.
Guest:I was an athlete.
Marc:So you were a baseball player.
Guest:I played baseball, a little basketball.
Guest:I went to basketball camp.
Guest:That's how freaking athletic I was.
Marc:So you're like some sort of jock goddess?
Guest:I was a super jock back in the day.
Guest:Did you ever kick anyone's ass?
Guest:I skied and I played a little tennis and stuff.
Guest:Like athletic?
Guest:I was bullied.
Marc:Oh, come on, really?
Guest:Yeah, I was bullied in middle school.
Guest:I was so skinny.
Guest:I didn't wear clothes that fit me.
Guest:I'm not kidding you, until after college.
Marc:Because of the hand-me-down situation?
Guest:It was a bit of that.
Guest:It was also that when you grow up in a small town, our stores were like JCPenney.
Guest:If you went to TJ Maxx and really went through the racks...
Guest:You could find some sort of cooler designer names.
Guest:You know, you weren't getting anything that you saw in Vogue magazine.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But you could find a couple designer names, but you weren't getting a size two, which is what, I mean, I'm like a two.
Guest:I'm a little person.
Marc:Now?
Guest:Yeah, I'm still a little, I'm exactly, I'm almost exactly the same size I was when I was 12 years old.
Marc:Isn't that interesting?
Marc:Like, you're a little person, you're a huge movie star.
Marc:What is it, like, some movie stars I've met are, like, literally, like, the size of this coffee cup.
Guest:I know.
Marc:Like, I think Tom Cruise is as big as this cup.
Guest:No, there are people, the Olsen twins, I think, are like elves.
Guest:You can put them in your pocket.
Guest:They're literally, they're like of another, they're like fairies.
Marc:They're not real people.
Marc:Why is that?
Marc:Do you know?
Marc:Can you answer that question?
Marc:Why certain little people fit on screen?
Marc:I mean, you're not a dwarf by any means.
Guest:I'm not.
Guest:I'm actually bigger than a lot of, I feel large around certain people.
Guest:I was just hanging out with Reese Witherspoon and I was like,
Guest:Jesus.
Guest:She's tiny.
Marc:Is she tiny?
Guest:She's tinier than me, and I'm a tiny person.
Marc:Okay, so you're a basketball jock and a baseball jock.
Guest:I never had any size.
Guest:There's no size two growing up.
Guest:The basic size is like a six.
Guest:That's what I wear all the time, so I look like an idiot because I was wearing clothes way too big for me.
Guest:I had two sticks for legs, and I got bullied.
Guest:I ended up, this girl doing this thing in the lunch line,
Guest:After recess, going into school, and this girl, I believe her name was Lynn.
Guest:I'll just call her out on it.
Guest:She was doing that thing where she was having her friends push her into me.
Guest:So she'd be like, oh, what?
Guest:Like, oh, I'm falling into you.
Guest:But like, you know, hard, bitchy.
Guest:And she'd been doing it.
Guest:She'd been after me for quite some time.
Marc:This was a rivalry.
Guest:You felt the tension.
Guest:And I didn't even know this girl.
Guest:We did not hang out.
Guest:I mean, obviously.
Marc:But she decided you were her enemy.
Guest:And I don't know why she decided it, but I was.
Guest:And I turned around and clocked her in the face.
Guest:And she fell to the ground.
Marc:Man, that's some jail yard shit.
Guest:And I had that like adrenaline rush of like, whoa, like what just happened?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And I happened to be chewing gum.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And the teacher goes, Elizabeth Mitchell, which is my name.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I turn around and I was like, oh, she saw me.
Guest:Like this girl's been bullying me for months.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the one time I stand up for myself, the teacher sees me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It turns out she, I was like chomping my gum like an animal because I was so amped up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And she saw me chewing my gum and she said, get over here.
Guest:And she gave me detention for chewing the gum, not for the Lynn thing.
Marc:Clocking the girl.
Guest:Which was like the greatest lesson.
Guest:And let me tell you, standing up for yourself.
Marc:She had it coming though.
Marc:Why wouldn't you have not gotten in trouble with that?
Guest:It's everything though.
Guest:Like you have to stand up for yourself.
Guest:One time.
Marc:Were you like the king of the yard for a while?
Guest:Let me tell you, I never was bullied after that.
Guest:I wasn't.
Marc:Were people giving you presents?
Guest:Nothing like that.
Marc:Protection money?
Guest:But it was known that you didn't bully me anymore.
Guest:You didn't fuck with me?
Guest:If you fucked with me, I was going to humiliate you and lay you out.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:How Catholic were you?
Guest:Oh, every Sunday.
Guest:And CCD.
Guest:And I went through all the stages.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Believed in hell?
Guest:Oh, are you kidding me?
Marc:Really?
Marc:No sex for...
Guest:Well, that's the one that I broke.
Guest:No, I broke a lot of them.
Guest:I remember being really little.
Guest:God, how much can I admit on this show?
Marc:I hope you're not.
Marc:This is not a sex story, the really little part.
Guest:No.
Marc:I don't mind.
Marc:Either way, I'm not going to judge you.
Guest:No, I just remember thinking that if you masturbated, you definitely went to hell.
Guest:That was definitely.
Guest:And then I remember convincing myself in my mind that God gave this to us.
Marc:This is for me to use.
Guest:So he must want us to have this?
Marc:So every time you masturbated, you were riding this edge?
Guest:I was right there like, I'm either going to hell or this is like God's will.
Marc:But it's worth it.
Guest:But like, let's find out.
Marc:You still don't know.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I'm not going to know until the judgment day.
Marc:There's some part of me that wishes that masturbation when I was younger would have been that sort of almost life-threatening.
Guest:It does make an attempt.
Marc:You're like, okay, this better be worth it.
Marc:If I'm going to burn for eternity.
Guest:Well, but the great thing about Catholicism is then you just have a little confession.
Marc:Did you go confess to the priest that you surveyed you?
Guest:I did not confess that, but I also felt- It's important.
Guest:This is an important moment for you.
Guest:Also, by the way, I converted to Judaism for many reasons, but this is one of them.
Guest:I was like, you know what?
Guest:I'm good.
Guest:I'm going to remove this priest.
Guest:I can speak to God myself.
Guest:Directly.
Guest:I'll just say I'm sorry directly.
Marc:Get rid of the middle man.
Guest:Yeah, I don't need to go through this guy.
Marc:Who is that guy anyways?
Guest:I'll tell that guy I swear and I hit my sister and I disobeyed my parents.
Marc:But the masturbation thing?
Guest:He doesn't need to know about that.
Marc:That's between me and God.
Guest:Well, you know, I remember sitting in the pew with me and my- You masturbate in the pew?
Marc:No.
Marc:Oh, damn it.
Guest:I remember staying in the pew with some friends from high school and our friend Gordy.
Guest:I have so many great stories about Gordy.
Guest:He was the hockey goalie.
Guest:They won the state championship.
Guest:Boyfriend?
Guest:He was fantastic.
Guest:No.
Guest:We did not date.
Guest:I dated the captain of the team.
Guest:His name was Brian.
Guest:We were all in the pew waiting to go in to confession and Gordy went in.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the next thing we heard was like the priest screaming at him.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:We couldn't quite make out what was going on, but a ruckus was happening in there.
Guest:That's not supposed to happen.
Guest:He was getting reamed out by the priest.
Marc:For what?
Guest:We don't know.
Marc:You still don't know.
Guest:He came out.
Guest:He was bright red.
Guest:He couldn't look at any of us.
Guest:I mean, there's only four of us in there.
Guest:We were very close friends.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he couldn't look at us, and then he went to the front, and we were like, holy shit, what the...
Guest:he went to pray what yeah you got to go to your penance right then front of course i don't know how this works yeah you got to do your penance right then and there you come out and you go up to the thing you start praying yeah you do your hail mary's exactly he so then we are all we were freaked out we're like what the hell so we stopped we were like we're not saying anything okay we're going in there we're being like i did a couple bad things yeah i turned in my homework late you know what i mean
Guest:And we get down and then we go and we do our, okay, do five Hail Marys, do blah, blah, blah.
Guest:You go up to the front, you do it.
Guest:And we then went outside of the church and waited.
Guest:And Gordy like never came out.
Guest:Like an hour later, he was still doing penance.
Guest:And to this day, I still don't know what the hell he did.
Guest:Are you still in touch with him?
Guest:But I love it.
Guest:I love that he got in that much trouble.
Marc:Are you in touch with him?
Marc:I'm not really know you want to find out now that you've told that story I'm kind of I love that like Gordy was you know so like how did sex pan out then I mean when did that happen oh it was you know it was not it was pretty early I'm only I'm only asking because I don't understand like I don't know a lot of Catholics I don't know the whole process but like I have to imagine that if you're somebody that believes in hell and you make these choices yeah everything's got to be pretty loaded and
Guest:You know, when I was eight years old, I remember coming home and saying to my mother, we were learning China was about to pass like the billion person mark.
Guest:And this is back when you had an encyclopedia that you had to flip through a book.
Guest:The Britannica.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I remember reading about China and they're all like, you know, they're not Catholic.
Guest:There's a billion of them and they're not Catholic.
Marc:That's a problem?
Guest:I just said to my mother like, mom.
Guest:You're telling me that Jesus is not going to let a billion Chinese people into heaven.
Guest:All these people don't get to go to heaven because they're not Catholic.
Guest:And the other thing about this story is my dad is Protestant.
Guest:So I often had to go to both the Catholic service and the Protestant service.
Marc:And the Protestants are a little lighter, right?
Guest:The Protestants are like, there's no Pope and you can talk directly to God.
Guest:So I already was sort of learning that it was a little fuzzy.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:How'd she respond to the China thing?
Guest:She didn't really have a great answer, as I recall.
Guest:And then going forward, I remember I said, Mom, I can't get confirmed in this religion.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:So you're fighting it.
Guest:Let's be serious.
Guest:I'm a feminist.
Guest:I believe in birth control.
Guest:There's no women in the hierarchy.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:You said that at what, 13 or 14?
Guest:I was almost 16.
Guest:You get confirmed when you're 16.
Guest:Really?
Guest:It goes on that long?
Guest:Yeah, I was a sophomore.
Guest:In high school.
Guest:And my mom convinced me.
Guest:She actually was kind of like, she didn't like force me.
Guest:But she basically said, you know, you don't know where your life's going and you might meet a Catholic guy and you're going to want to get married and raise your kids Catholic.
Guest:It'll be nice.
Guest:You want to get like the certificate that said you did it.
Guest:You know, like just do the steps.
Marc:You're Pope approved.
Guest:Yeah, just in case.
Guest:Of course, I've met and married a Jew.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, how could you not?
Guest:I went the complete other way.
Guest:But I did go through with the confirmation, even though, and I was very clear, I did not, I was not, it was not with a full heart.
Marc:But you're telling your mother that you believe in birth control and everything else, so had you had sex by the time you were confirmed?
Guest:Yes.
Marc:Yeah, so did you tell her that?
Guest:She found out.
Guest:I can't remember how she found out.
Guest:I just remember like we ended up having a discussion through the bathroom door like where she kind of asked me on the other side of the door and she kind of asked me.
Guest:I was like, yeah, but I assumed that she knew that I was having sex.
Guest:And then, and my sister was out in the kitchen where the door that, and she took off because she was having sex too.
Guest:She was like, I'm out of here.
Guest:I'm not answering these questions.
Guest:Younger.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:She's only 13 months younger.
Guest:We were both in high school and we were both in love.
Guest:And I recommend that to people, to young kids.
Marc:Oh, this is the, now you're going to teach?
Guest:Well, I just say, you know, just make sure that they're, they're a good guy.
Guest:That's going to, you don't, don't rush.
Guest:Don't do it fast.
Guest:There's lots of other things to do before you give it up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then when you give it up, make sure the guy's gonna stick around, take care of your heart for a while.
Guest:Did he?
Guest:I had the best high school boyfriend.
Guest:Was that the captain?
Guest:Fabulous.
Guest:Hockey team guy?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:He was a good guy?
Guest:He was an incredible human being.
Marc:Did he have a letter jacket?
Guest:He did.
Marc:Yeah, I don't like him.
Guest:I don't like him already.
Guest:He was really just the kindest.
Guest:Were you like homecoming queen or anything?
Guest:Most decent person.
Guest:I got voted a couple things.
Guest:But one of my nemeses ran the yearbook.
Guest:So when it came time to do the pics and all that stuff, they chose the worst photos of me.
Marc:Oh, that's hilarious.
Guest:And at the time, I was like, I'm a very happy-go-lucky person.
Guest:I was like, oh, okay.
Guest:And now when I look back on it, I'm like, fucking bitch, really?
Guest:You picked that photo?
Marc:Come on.
Marc:And you know she's doing it on purpose?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:When I look back on it, I go like, oh, I see what was happening.
Marc:What was she like?
Marc:Was she sort of nerdy and angry?
Marc:no she just she was popular too and you know I don't know well it's interesting talking to you because like when I was in high school it sounds like the life you were living was very far away from you'd be surprised we were a big group of dorks yeah oh come on you do not sound like a dork you're playing baseball and basketball I went to an Ivy League college that's all I cared about was going to like a great school
Marc:That was the whole agenda?
Guest:That was it for me.
Marc:What were your other hobbies in high school?
Marc:Latin club?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I'm not kidding you.
Guest:I was in the junior classical league.
Guest:I studied Latin for six years.
Marc:And so you understood the mass.
Guest:I did.
Guest:I did.
Guest:you actually could and you know you uh and and i was like on the school council i mean i was one of those like true you know super i was a real nerd ball real nerd ball we just happened to have a very weird and we talk about it to this day how weird our class was the really smart kids all most of them were also jocks yeah
Guest:And, you know, I mean, I look up the kids I went to school and they're like, you know, running like the New Republic.
Guest:They're like the editor in chief of this or that.
Guest:And they're, I mean.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Doing really well.
Marc:So you did your homework and you had sex and you played sports.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You're fucking well adjusted.
Guest:You're not kidding.
Guest:I'm not kidding you.
Guest:We used to, we used to watch like John Hughes movies and be like, and they are like 16 candles through that big party.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That was my life.
Guest:And I like, we would go to like raging house parties where like a TV would fly out the second story window and land in the thing.
Guest:And the cops would come.
Guest:We would all run in the woods.
Guest:yeah but you didn't get into trouble you must have friends you didn't get like arrested nobody was like nobody was like doing super bad stuff yeah there was not I mean we were all like it was in the height of the D.A.R.E.
Guest:program and the just say no and the don't drink and drive so you didn't do that so we you know we were really good no blow no not really you know no it just didn't happen it's like a sort of beautiful American childhood it was so Americana it was stupid
Guest:But I mean, we used to drag kegs into the woods in the winter.
Guest:Of course.
Guest:And make bonfires, and that's what we did.
Guest:That was a party.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Where'd you go to college?
Guest:I went to Penn in Philadelphia.
Marc:That's good college.
Guest:It's pretty nice.
Marc:Sorority?
Guest:Delta, delta, delta.
Guest:I know.
Guest:We couldn't be more opposites.
Marc:Do you want to clear, do you have anything you need to confess about horrible things you did to people in your sorority?
Marc:Men.
Guest:I mean.
Marc:Do you want to apologize to any men?
Marc:No.
Marc:For ruining their dreams and hearts?
Guest:I'm not kidding.
Guest:I have been with two, I broke up with my high school boyfriend to date my now husband.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah, I've been with my husband for 20 years.
Marc:I think I remember you talking about that on Letterman or something.
Guest:I have a very sweet story, actually.
Guest:I'm like a super monogamist.
Marc:So you've had sex with two guys in your life.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:I feel like this has been covered before.
Marc:Where did I hear it?
Marc:Did you talk to Conan about it or something?
Guest:Probably, yeah.
Guest:They love to hear that stuff on the late night shows, let me tell you.
Marc:Well, yeah, you're a rare thing.
Guest:It's very weird.
Marc:So you met a Jew at Penn.
Guest:Yeah, it's real hard.
Guest:It's like throw a dart.
Guest:I didn't know that either.
Guest:I didn't really know.
Guest:There were a few Jewish kids in my school.
Marc:Yeah, were they bullied?
Guest:Actually, you know what's funny is I grew up on the wrong side of the tracks.
Marc:The Catholic side of the tracks?
Guest:Yeah, I grew up on the duplex side of the tracks where the floor workers lived.
Guest:The winders.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:The management, they lived on the other side of the tracks in single-family homes.
Guest:And that's where all the Jews lived.
Guest:So I didn't actually meet a Jew until high school.
Guest:Because when I was in elementary school and middle school, the Jewish kids didn't live on my side of town.
Marc:Were they given any sort of, what was your sense of Jews before you met one?
Guest:Well, because I didn't meet them until high school, I didn't get invited to the bar and bat mitzvahs.
Marc:And now you're going to have to have two of them now.
Guest:I know.
Guest:Can you believe it?
Marc:But you know the Jews didn't get any bad press in your household?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:There was none of that.
Guest:No.
Guest:Again, progressive, liberal, lefties.
Guest:All right.
Marc:So at Penn, you're a sorority person.
Marc:What does that entail?
Marc:I like you.
Marc:I mean, I like you.
Marc:And I don't think I wouldn't have- You're so surprised.
Marc:Well, no, I knew I liked you when I met you.
Marc:So sad, Jesus.
Marc:What do you mean?
Marc:I mean, do you know, for me, sororities, fraternities, people that focused on their schoolwork, people that seemed to have their shit together, the good kids, the popular kids.
Marc:I mean, that was my war.
Marc:I had to figure out how to even communicate with people like you.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I'm gonna judge you because you are that person.
Guest:I know, it's all right.
Marc:Like, you're the kind of person like, okay, let's say we're in high school, we're hanging out.
Marc:I'm like, you know, kind of, you know, a little chubby, but nice guy, sweet guy, kind of lost.
Marc:I come up and say, like, you want to go out to a movie?
Marc:You would laugh.
Guest:No, I never laughed.
Guest:That happened to me.
Guest:I was very sweet.
Guest:And you'd be surprised.
Guest:My type is like...
Guest:Here's the thing.
Guest:Now.
Marc:I mean, obviously.
Guest:No, my type, I'm not kidding you.
Guest:My actor, like growing up when I was like, that guy is so cute.
Guest:Oh my God.
Guest:When I grew up, I wanted to marry that guy.
Guest:Who?
Guest:Rob Morrow on Northern Exposure.
Marc:Well, that's nice, sweet, Jewish.
Guest:I clearly had a type.
Guest:What type was your hockey player?
Guest:I liked nice boys.
Guest:He was a very nice non-Jewish boy.
Marc:Big Irish Catholic guy?
Guest:Well, he wasn't Irish Catholic, but he was a big boy.
Guest:You still in touch with him?
Guest:He was over six feet and he was a big guy.
Guest:Every once in a while, you know, like his grandma died.
Guest:I sent him an email.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:He lives in Europe.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah, he's an engineer.
Guest:He lives in Europe.
Marc:Isn't that wild how people sort of spread out?
Marc:And when you find out about somebody, you're like, oh my God.
Guest:I know.
Guest:Well, that's Facebook.
Guest:I mean, I'm not on it, but every once in a while I'll go on there and go like, where are these people?
Marc:You don't go on as an alias or anything?
Guest:I do have an alias and I kind of troll it a little bit, but honestly, because it's not a habit.
Marc:Yeah, I'm off of Facebook.
Marc:It got very complicated.
Marc:I don't know what's happening there.
Marc:I mean, I opened the page and I'm like, what the fuck is going on here?
Guest:I just find that I don't have time to hang out with the people that I like are here in present with me in my life.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So why am I don't have any?
Guest:I definitely don't have time to like troll around and be like, I wonder what, you know, and be wistful.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I'm not looking for anybody or anything.
Guest:Like I have my husband.
Guest:I've got kids.
Guest:I, you know, what do I need?
Guest:You know, when you hire a nanny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You go on Facebook and you look at the other families that she worked for to be like, all right.
Marc:All right.
Marc:She seems okay.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I can trust her with my children.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:These kids seem nice.
Guest:This family seemed like they knew what they were talking about.
Marc:It must be sort of scary to kind of interview a nanny.
Marc:I mean, it's a big job.
Guest:Well, you hear a lot of horror stories.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:We got to have some basic human trust.
Marc:No, I agree with you.
Marc:I'm overly trusting to the point where I lose a lot of money and get my feelings hurt and find myself in situations that are kind of sticky.
Guest:There's a fine line between trust and being taken advantage of.
Guest:It's true.
Marc:Do you know that line?
Guest:I've seen it.
Guest:I've stood on it.
Guest:I've walked right up to it and been like, wait a minute.
Guest:This doesn't quite feel right.
Marc:I've learned that hard lesson a couple of times.
Marc:So, all right.
Marc:So how do you make the shift from Jesus to Jew?
Marc:I mean, when did that happen?
Guest:Gosh, I like that you're so interested in the religious stuff.
Marc:Well, I mean, like at some point, you know, Jesus was your guy, you'd look at the cross, he was bleeding up there, it meant something to you.
Guest:I don't know, it didn't really, you know, here's the thing, I love, I like human rituals.
Guest:I mean, I believe that ritual, you know, we're all sort of tribal, it is what makes us human, we all, I mean, animals have rituals, we have rituals.
Guest:Um, you know, we don't walk around by ourselves on this earth.
Guest:We like band together and, and, um, and I do think that organized religion in terms of creating structure for family and having ritual, very cool, important.
Guest:Like I'm really glad I can walk in any church anywhere in the world and I know the mass, I can recite the mass.
Marc:So that's good as a Jew.
Guest:Well, it's just what I grew up with.
Guest:I know, I know.
Guest:And I think, so I'm not dismissive of religion, in other words.
Marc:Yeah, no, no, I'm with you on what you just said.
Guest:Yeah, I was dismissive, frankly, of like, you know, I would sit and listen to certain sermons and just be like, geez, I cannot get behind this.
Guest:Like, this is just not, in my bones, I don't believe, you know, in my bones, I don't think religion.
Guest:that jesus really doesn't expect everybody to go to heaven whatever that means i don't even know yeah but i i do know that it raised more questions than answers for me and so when man yeah yeah and the pope and the whole well yeah it turns out that it's not it's a very corrupt horrible you know i mean evil organization there's a lot of suffering in the world and if you go to the vatican and it's like oh it's like a giant vat of gold have you been there you know yeah it's pretty amazing right it's amazing
Marc:Yeah, it's like this is where all the money went.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:To this chair.
Marc:You literally go like, really?
Marc:Right, the actual cathedral is full of gold.
Guest:It's just gold.
Guest:It's literally the whole thing is lined with gold.
Marc:Yeah, it might as well have been peasants' fillings.
Guest:Yes, exactly.
Guest:So, you know, that bums me out on a certain level.
Guest:Rome's nice though, right?
Guest:And Rome is...
Marc:Were you shooting there or did you go for vacation?
Guest:No, I just went on my honeymoon, actually.
Guest:To Rome.
Marc:It's fucking amazing.
Marc:It does not disappoint, right?
Guest:Rome and Tuscany.
Marc:Tuscany, too.
Guest:It's just a museum.
Guest:You're just walking around the whole thing.
Guest:You turn a corner, the Colosseum's sitting there.
Guest:And I studied Latin, don't forget, for six years.
Guest:So this is my culture that I like.
Marc:Right, right.
Marc:Well, you're fascinated with it.
Guest:Love it.
Marc:And then when you go to the countryside with Tuscany or Umbria, you're like, it's exactly what you think it's going to be.
Guest:It's like perfect.
Guest:It is perfect.
Marc:It's un-fucking-real.
Guest:Yeah, it's perfect.
Marc:Were you just in Atlanta?
Marc:Is that where you were?
Guest:Yes, I loved it.
Guest:How long were you there?
Guest:I've made two movies there now, and this time I was only there for five weeks, almost six weeks.
Marc:With Corral?
Guest:No, he was there, was he there the same time?
Guest:Right before me.
Guest:I didn't work on that movie, different movie.
Guest:I was there for The Hunger Games.
Marc:The second one.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:And is that going to be great or what?
Guest:It's really great.
Guest:It really is.
Marc:You must have been fucking so excited to get that part.
Marc:It's kind of an odd part for you, isn't it?
Guest:You know, it's honestly, that is what I should be doing all the time.
Guest:I mean, those kind of like just outrageous.
Guest:Freakish roles.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Weirdos.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like what I do best.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They're just they don't come along.
Guest:I mean, they're they're rare.
Marc:But you're but you're so good at being sort of like the sexy kind of like funny, you know, a little bit intimidating.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Girl, woman.
Guest:Yeah, I love those too.
Guest:Physical comedy is my sweet spot.
Guest:And Effie is so physical.
Guest:Her whole demeanor is like a weird physicality of...
Marc:How do you prepare for something like that?
Guest:She's just a big contradiction.
Marc:You make real actor-y decisions because you're a real actress.
Guest:Yeah, you make big choices about what you're going to do.
Marc:Let's come back to Jesus and Yahweh and go back to Penn.
Marc:So you meet this Jew.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:What's his name?
Guest:Max.
Marc:Max, that's a Jew.
Guest:I'm not joking around.
Marc:No, I know.
Marc:His name wasn't Christian.
Yeah.
Marc:And you met in college, and how'd you fall in love?
Marc:Can you tell me that?
Guest:We met the first day.
Marc:The first day of college.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You're nervous.
Marc:It's a new environment.
Guest:I went to college.
Guest:And you're like, you just grabbed a Jew.
Marc:You grabbed a Jew.
Guest:Well, here's the thing.
Guest:I really loved my high school boyfriend.
Guest:As I said, I can't say enough good things about him.
Marc:Did you break up with him before you left?
Guest:No, I did not.
Marc:Holy fuck.
Guest:Well, I wanted to break up with him, but, you know, I felt bad.
Guest:Like, he really wanted to stay together.
Guest:And I was like, I'm going to college to, like, you know, get laid and, like, have a great time and, like, fuck around, basically.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You knew it.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:It was over.
Guest:Well, I just knew, like... Thank you for teaching me a few things.
Marc:I got the hang of it now.
Yeah.
Marc:You're a great dude.
Guest:You've emotionally taken care of me.
Guest:I really appreciate it.
Guest:You're lovely, but I'm going to go have some fun.
Guest:And I sort of thought, well, he'll do the same thing.
Guest:And then he didn't really do that right away.
Marc:He pined?
Guest:He pined a little bit.
Marc:Did he come up there?
Marc:Was there any drama?
Guest:There was massive drama.
Guest:Mark, there was so much drama.
Marc:What happened?
Guest:So what happened was I met Max.
Guest:There was a little start and stop there for like five days.
Marc:You felt guilty.
Guest:No, I didn't feel guilty at all.
Marc:The first five days of college, you mean?
Guest:Literally the first five days of college.
Guest:Well, I said to my- Please tell me you had sex with him in the first five days of college.
Guest:I didn't, but I said to my now husband, you should take my number and we should hang out.
Guest:And he was like, I don't have a phone.
Guest:really you can't figure out a single fucking way to call me okay well thank you i'll take my number back like you figure it out and and he's like no no no i you know it's the first day he really had not set up his phone that's what he meant but also he was on the make he immediately started talking to this girl kate who ended up being like a hot nursing student with a twin and um right away you saw that yeah oh we i mean we were both we were we met and we were in it for the same thing
Marc:But you were generally, like this was just, you didn't know what you wanted to do yet.
Marc:You were just going to college.
Guest:I was just going to college and I met this cute kid and he was like cute and whatever.
Guest:And then we ended up running into each other like every day randomly.
Guest:And actually like one of my best friends on my floor was the best friend growing up of his freshman girlfriend.
Guest:So she's like, let's go up to this frat house.
Guest:And he was like working the door like the next night.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he's like, do you remember me?
Guest:Yeah, of course.
Guest:I remember.
Guest:Guy without the phone.
Guest:You know, and then we went up to his room where they have like the good liquor, not just like the shitty.
Guest:In the frat house.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Not just the shitty.
Guest:Horrendous.
Guest:I mean, literally, I'm right out of John Hughes.
Guest:It's a Jewish fraternity.
Guest:ZBT?
Guest:Which one?
Guest:No.
Guest:So A pie.
Guest:What does ZBT mean to you?
Guest:Well, ZBT at Penn was like, it was so douchey.
Guest:It was like... I don't even know what it is.
Guest:I only know my... It was like Long Island guys who wore their white baseball cap backwards and did a little blow.
Marc:Oh, so it was... Okay, all right.
Guest:They were fast.
Guest:They were fast for me.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:Just kind of... Sweezy... Well, they were going to go run Wall Street.
Guest:And they do, by the way.
Marc:And practice on a bunch of schicks.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:I guess.
Guest:Anyway.
Guest:Yeah, so he's a doorman.
Guest:You go up to the room, the good liquor.
Guest:We just kept running into each other.
Guest:So then finally he took me on the greatest date of my life.
Guest:I mean, it really was amazing.
Marc:What was it?
Guest:We went to a jazz club in Philly.
Guest:So this is like the real deal.
Guest:That's just in Philly.
Guest:I think there was like six other white people in the whole place.
Guest:I mean, this place was legit.
Marc:So the Jew brought you to where black people are and you're like, this guy knows the ropes.
Guest:He knows, not only that, he took me in a taxi.
Guest:I'd never really been in a taxi other than like shitty taxis.
Guest:Like we didn't have yellow cabs in Pittsfield, Massachusetts.
Guest:Um,
Guest:And in the city, when we went to visit, we took public transportation.
Guest:I was on buses and subways.
Guest:So he took me in a taxi, and he gave him a 20, and he said, like, just give me two back or something.
Guest:Like, very worldly, in my opinion.
Guest:And, like, right there I was like, oof, I'm going to bang this dude.
Marc:Tonight.
Guest:And then he took me to this amazing jazz club.
Guest:It was incredible.
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Guest:They didn't ask me for my ID.
Guest:They brought us bourbon on the rocks.
Guest:It was fabulous.
Guest:We had a great steak dinner.
Guest:And then he took me home.
Guest:And then I had to kiss him.
Guest:I made the first move.
Marc:At all, yeah.
Guest:And gosh, and then I just went from there.
Guest:But I still had this high school boyfriend to tie up.
Marc:You banged him after the jazz club.
Guest:I didn't bang him that night.
Guest:I don't know what happened.
Guest:It wasn't on me.
Guest:I probably would have gone there.
Guest:But he was like, eh, let's be slow.
Guest:Let's be cool.
Marc:Nothing happened?
Guest:That night nothing happened.
Marc:Just made out?
Guest:Then we made out.
Guest:And then we went to a party like two nights later and he gave me like massive hickeys all over my neck.
Guest:And the next morning hungover.
Guest:I got on a bus to Penn State where my high school boyfriend was.
Guest:I was going to my first Penn State game.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:So I wear a turtleneck.
Marc:And a scarf.
Guest:And a scarf.
Guest:And I'm so hungover.
Guest:I'm dying on this bus.
Marc:Oh shit.
Guest:I'm puking.
Guest:It's disgusting.
Guest:And I get to Penn State and I get off the bus.
Guest:And he's there to greet me off the bus.
Guest:The boyfriend.
Guest:He's the sweetest.
Guest:I'm not kidding.
Guest:He's the nicest guy.
Marc:Had you fucked the Jew?
Guest:I had not, no.
Marc:He just marked you.
Guest:He marked me.
Marc:And he knew you were going, didn't he?
Guest:Yes, of course.
Marc:Did he cop to doing that on purpose?
Guest:Yeah, he did, of course.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:He didn't really mean to give me hickeys all over, but I was kind of doing the like, I kind of have a boyfriend.
Guest:I don't really know if I should be.
Guest:I got to like tie this up.
Guest:I'm a good person.
Guest:I'm not like a bad person.
Marc:That is a serious fucking political move.
Guest:So I really was trying not to screw him before I really had broken up with my boyfriend.
Guest:And I didn't.
Guest:I succeeded in that.
Marc:But what happened?
Guest:So basically I went to Penn State, I broke up with my boyfriend, and I went back, and my now husband and I had sex for the first time.
Marc:But the hickeys, did he find the hickeys?
Guest:It was sad.
Guest:It was like, this is it.
Guest:We're breaking up.
Guest:You know, he introduced me to all of his friends.
Marc:Did he see your neck?
Guest:Yes.
Marc:How did that happen?
Guest:We got naked to have sex.
Guest:Oh, no.
Guest:It was right there.
Marc:So you didn't break up to him before you got naked?
Guest:We had breakup sex.
Guest:We had like the bad.
Guest:So he was crying.
Guest:You were crying.
Guest:The crying breakup sex that you have.
Guest:So he saw the hickeys and he's like, I still love you.
Guest:This is the last time and we still love each other.
Guest:And I did love him as a person, but I was like, I needed to go be free and have other relationships.
Guest:And I didn't think I was going to marry my husband, Max.
Marc:No, I know.
Guest:I just thought, well, I'm going to go hang out with this guy.
Guest:I'm going to play the field a little bit.
Marc:Crying sex with hickeys is really...
Guest:It was so sad.
Guest:It was so tortured and sad.
Guest:And he had arranged for his roommate to be out of the room.
Marc:He had no idea what would hit him.
Marc:Did you break up before the sex?
Guest:Yeah, we did.
Marc:And you agreed to have sex, and then you explained the hickeys.
Guest:Oh, the hickey explanation.
Guest:I mean, the hickey explanation was a little bit like, look, I was at the party, and I was drunk, and the sky was on me.
Guest:Right.
Guest:No responsibility.
Guest:I didn't kiss back.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:So you basically said, I was almost raped, but I'm okay.
Marc:It wasn't my fault.
Guest:I didn't enjoy it.
Guest:He was a Jew.
Guest:But it happened.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:It'll never work out between us.
Guest:Don't worry.
Guest:Meanwhile, we're married.
Guest:Which does make me, by the way, feel a little bit better about breaking his heart at the time.
Guest:It's like, babe, I broke up with you for the guy that I spend the rest of my life with.
Marc:It's very hard, but it's just what people do.
Marc:You can't not hurt people.
Marc:I mean, it's just impossible.
Guest:When you're young, it's like... Ever.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:Even over little things.
Marc:So when did the acting start?
Guest:Well, I went to college.
Guest:I thought I would be like a broadcast journalist.
Guest:I don't know, or a doctor.
Guest:I mean, I had a lot of possibilities.
Guest:But I was acting.
Guest:After I broke my leg in- Swiding into third?
Guest:In eighth grade.
Guest:What phase were you swiding into?
Guest:Third, actually.
Guest:In eighth grade, I ended up in the school musical playing Pontius Pilate in Jesus Christ Superstar.
Guest:Speaking of Jesus.
Guest:And then I just kept doing the school play kind of thing.
Guest:To me, it was similar to sports.
Guest:I couldn't play sports anymore.
Guest:And I broke my leg really bad.
Guest:I had surgery and the whole thing.
Guest:I never had, they did what's called closed reduction surgery, so my foot was hanging at a right angle to my knee, and they just slowly, you know, they break it until they get it back in line, and then they, I didn't need pins to hold it together to heal it.
Marc:It worked?
Guest:And it worked, yeah.
Guest:You don't walk with the...
Guest:I don't, but I did for a little bit, which is why I had to have the surgery.
Guest:I literally was like a gimp for a minute.
Guest:I was a theater geek in high school.
Marc:Song and dance person?
Guest:Getting to college, I was sort of like, what am I gonna do for my activity?
Guest:Who am I gonna be?
Guest:And I was encouraged to try out for a play.
Guest:And I ended up not getting the cool play.
Guest:I ended up doing children's theater.
Guest:Which was a little sad.
Guest:I played Aunt Polly in a production of Tom Sawyer.
Guest:It was very sweet.
Guest:But not exactly, you know.
Guest:It wasn't the bee's knees.
Guest:But I was definitely bit, but never considered it as a career because I grew up poor and every actor I knew lived in the Lower East Village.
Guest:Was not practical.
Guest:No, it did not seem practical to me at all.
Guest:It felt like one of those ridiculous dreams.
Marc:What changed?
Guest:You know what changed was...
Guest:I applied to drama school because I was like, what the hell am I gonna do when I graduate?
Guest:I don't wanna be a lawyer, because everyone I knew was going to law school.
Guest:They were all pre-professional, and I didn't have any, I literally.
Marc:Heart wasn't in it.
Guest:I went on interviews at McKinsey & Company because when you go to Penn and you have a good GPA, those are the jobs you get.
Marc:You had a good GPA?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Like honors?
Guest:I graduated magna cum laude.
Marc:Is that the big one?
Guest:No, SUMA is the big one.
Guest:Oh, sorry.
Guest:It's the one just above.
Guest:I missed out on the big one.
Guest:So I was getting these crazy job interviews.
Guest:I was wearing a suit that was too big for me to like these interviews.
Guest:Pretend it was completely false.
Marc:What was your degree in?
Guest:It was totally liberal arts, communications.
Guest:I could have gone into journalism.
Guest:I looked at working at CNN.
Guest:The job I almost took, instead of going to grad school, to drama school, was working for this super wealthy guy.
Guest:He had a money manager in his apartment, and you're saying the nicest apartment to this day that I've ever seen.
Marc:Lucky you didn't fall for that one.
Marc:I know.
Guest:And this guy came in and was like, yeah, I need someone to do research on life.
Guest:This is literally the interview.
Guest:I need someone to do research on, for instance, right now we have a project.
Guest:We want to put in a new phone system on the yachts.
Guest:And we need to figure out what the best system is, how to tie it all together, what's going to have the best satellite.
Guest:I'm like, wait, that would be my job.
Guest:Like figuring out the yacht phone system.
Marc:It sounds like it's one step away of like, yeah, can we dress you differently too while you're around the outfit?
Guest:He had a personal shopper that came in that I was told he needed because he had five girlfriends all over the world.
Guest:And so this shopper- Who was this guy?
Guest:I don't want to say.
Guest:All right.
Guest:But he was known.
Marc:Still around?
Guest:Yeah, he's still around.
Guest:He's a known, you know, he's got a lot of money.
Guest:Known rich guy.
Guest:Known rich guy.
Guest:And I called my uncle who was one of my mentors.
Marc:Which uncle?
Guest:Who's rich.
Guest:The one uncle on my mom's side.
Guest:The one boy.
Guest:And he's a very successful lawyer.
Guest:And he said, you just graduated from Penn.
Guest:You're employable.
Guest:You'll be fine.
Guest:If you're getting job offers right now, you'll get them in two years.
Guest:It's a two year program.
Guest:Go to drama school.
Guest:It's your dream.
Guest:Go see what happens.
Guest:And I did.
Guest:And then I never looked back.
Marc:Which drama school?
Guest:I went to ACT in San Francisco.
Guest:It's the same school as Annette Bening and Denzel Washington and Winona Ryder, which was the big deal back then.
Marc:So you got to go to San Francisco.
Guest:That's a big shift.
Guest:I went to San Francisco in the height of the internet booms.
Guest:What year?
Guest:96.
Marc:Because I lived there in 92.
Marc:It's kind of an interesting city, huh?
Guest:You know, it's a beautiful place.
Guest:I was too young.
Guest:I had lived in New York and Philly and I was like, it's just, I couldn't deal with the like, let's all put on Birkenstocks and fleece and like go hike and the weather sucks.
Guest:I mean, God loves San Francisco.
Guest:It's absolutely beautiful.
Marc:I never could figure out what the hell was going on.
Guest:I had to leave every morning with like 12 layers because I never knew what the temperature was going to be.
Guest:I'm pretty used to that.
Guest:But there's no rhyme or reason to anything.
Guest:It's foggy half the time.
Guest:But I think on a social level.
Guest:There was horrible transportation.
Marc:On a social level too.
Guest:I found it very clicky.
Marc:Yeah, I just didn't know what was ever really going on there.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, there was that contingent when you're talking about the fleece and this and that.
Marc:But then there was a whole other thing going on across town.
Guest:I know.
Marc:And then you'd go into one area and you're like, I don't even understand.
Guest:I know.
Guest:Like, what's happening down here?
Marc:I never felt very grounded there.
Guest:I didn't either.
Guest:I didn't really.
Guest:I didn't either.
Marc:But you got a good education with the acting.
Guest:Well, I have no idea, but what I got was an agent and a career.
Guest:I didn't know when I graduated from college.
Marc:Where was your boyfriend during all this?
Marc:Did he move out there with you?
Guest:Yeah, he did.
Guest:He was working on Wall Street at the time and he transferred.
Marc:What's his racket?
Guest:Well, he was in public finance at the time, but he's a producer now.
Guest:But he just transferred, he worked for Solomon Smith Barney and he transferred to the San Francisco office so we could be together.
Marc:So you do two years in San Francisco and then you come to Los Angeles?
Marc:No, then I went to New York.
Guest:I don't think any young actor should start in LA.
Guest:Unless, look, unless you're gorgeous, you look like Katie Holmes off the dock, whatever, fine.
Marc:So you went to New York to do theater?
Guest:But that wasn't, I didn't.
Guest:Ostensibly?
Guest:I went to New York ostensibly to do theater.
Guest:I ended up in commercials.
Guest:I did 10 commercials my first year.
Marc:That's good.
Guest:I was living the high life.
Guest:I paid all my student loans.
Marc:Do you ever look at those commercials now?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, you're welcome.
Guest:I'm cool with it, man.
Guest:I'm all right with those life choices.
Marc:Yeah, for commercials for what?
Guest:Oh, Burger King, Zima.
Guest:I have like a real legendary Zima commercial.
Marc:Why is it legendary?
Guest:Well, I play three different women.
Guest:And it's a real, it's sort of like.
Marc:Did you use it as your reel for a while?
Guest:I don't remember actually if I did use it as my reel because then I started working by the time I aired.
Guest:But it's a very good indicator of my abilities.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then I loved that one.
Guest:I did a commercial for Crest for like a whitening toothpaste that ran forever and I'm not kidding you.
Guest:Show your teeth.
Guest:Paid off all the student loans.
Guest:That's awesome.
Guest:Yeah, that was a big winner.
Marc:When was the first movie part?
Guest:I had American Summer.
Marc:I know, and you and David Wayne have this thing now.
Guest:Yeah, we're in love.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's difficult for me.
Guest:He's, no, he's, well, look, he, I love him.
Guest:He's fantastic.
Marc:What were those shorts where you kissing all these actresses?
Marc:What was that one?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:He's always got me kissing multiple people at all times.
Guest:He just likes to.
Guest:Well, I make out with him.
Guest:I make out with this guy, Mather, who's great.
Guest:I make out with Josh Charles in a three-way with him and this other guy.
Guest:Then in the next one, I made out with a couple girls.
Guest:It's just always happening.
Marc:You don't have any problem with that.
Guest:I love it.
Guest:Like I said, I've been with two people in my life, so that's my outlet.
Marc:That's my fun times.
Marc:When you do that, because when I was shooting my show, I had to make out, acting make out.
Marc:But you make out.
Guest:Yeah, you just make out.
Marc:But you're a little detached from it, right?
Guest:It depends on the, I mean, I just did a, I won't say where this will happen, but I just had to make out with someone who was not an experienced, particularly experienced actor who was like a, you know, basically a background guy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I went to make out with him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he didn't open his mouth the first time.
Guest:And I was like, what are we, four?
Guest:Who doesn't, then I felt like I was like digging around trying to get my tongue in his lips.
Guest:I was like, this is, come on, I'm too old for this.
Guest:Really?
Marc:So when you screen make out, even open mouth.
Guest:I just felt bad for him because then I felt like he was like so embarrassed.
Guest:Like the whole thing was just, it was not the like dream day that I was hoping for.
Guest:Oh, I get to go have a little makey with some random person.
Guest:That'll be interesting.
Marc:He didn't come around?
Guest:He did because I essentially forced his mouth open.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:No, he did.
Guest:Well, he then realized, like, oh.
Guest:I can make out with Elizabeth Banks.
Guest:I can do it.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:I was like, yeah, let's just do this.
Marc:How do you decide?
Marc:Like, do you decide tongue or no tongue?
Guest:What?
Marc:Tell me.
Guest:I think you look at whatever the scene is and you go from there.
Guest:You know, is this character chased or is she a go-getter?
Marc:That's the differentiation in tongue or no tongue?
Guest:Yeah, pretty much.
Guest:Well, and if it's like very sweet and romantic or if it's like, I mean, if you're trying to make it funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Which is normally what I'm trying to do with the makeout scenes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Then you just do.
Guest:I remember making out.
Guest:Swappy tongue.
Guest:In What Had American Summer, I make out with Paul Rudd.
Guest:And I mean, we were like eating each other's faces.
Guest:Just like anywhere.
Guest:Where is it too wrong to put this tongue?
Marc:Are you guys buddies?
Guest:Yeah, we are.
Guest:We've made like five movies together, maybe six.
Guest:A lot of movies together.
Yeah.
Marc:You've made movies with a lot of funny people.
Guest:I mean, the list is long.
Marc:What about working with Oliver Stone, playing George Bush's wife?
Marc:Amazing.
Marc:Given your politics.
Guest:You know what, actually, I didn't bring any, I played a wife.
Guest:I played a loving wife, and I believe.
Marc:It was a conscious decision, I imagine.
Guest:Yeah, well look, that's acting.
Guest:If you play Hitler, you gotta figure out how to respect Hitler.
Marc:Is that your dream role?
Guest:it probably you know what someone will do it i'd be there um but no you gotta you gotta yeah you gotta figure it out so i for her for laura i actually think she's a very interesting i mean she's a really interesting lady he did a great job with it there's a lot of interesting stuff in that movie yeah i can't say i love the whole movie but i like to i like his movie making he's definitely he's one of the sort of
Marc:Very engaged.
Guest:Well, he's one of the most, in my opinion, patriotic American filmmaker.
Guest:I mean, he really marks his movies by asking sort of central questions about what it is to be an American citizen.
Guest:Like, what do we believe in?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He's also like, I have no sense other than stories.
Marc:I mean, what was he like on set?
Guest:I mean, he's awesome.
Guest:The stories are true.
Guest:He's out of his mind.
Guest:I love him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I mostly love him because the stories are fucking great.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he's, you know, and he doesn't disappoint.
Guest:And he's a great filmmaker.
Guest:You, as an actor, he's everything that you want in a director.
Guest:He's clear.
Guest:He doesn't bullshit around.
Guest:He knows what he wants.
Guest:You know, he's already got the movie.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He trusts you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:If he doesn't trust you, it's a shit show.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Why?
Marc:What happened?
Guest:But he liked me and he liked my Laura Bush, so we were good.
Marc:Yeah, but you saw some other shit going down.
Guest:I saw some other people he didn't like as much.
Guest:He kind of thought like, eh, that's not exactly what he was looking for.
Marc:Yeah, Brolin's great.
Guest:Amazing.
Marc:Great actor.
Guest:Oh, Jesus.
Guest:He's so good.
Marc:All right, I do want to get back to this Jew thing.
Marc:Now, was there pressure on you to be a Jew?
Guest:It's so surprising that you want to get back to the Jew thing.
Marc:Well, you're a Jew.
Marc:You're a Jew.
Guest:You're one of us now.
Guest:There was not a lot of pressure.
Marc:We have to own you now.
Guest:I know.
Guest:It's amazing, actually.
Guest:It is.
Marc:I mean, you're like that fucking shiksa goddess Jew.
Guest:People love that when the shiksa's come over.
Guest:You know, I, I, well, no, no religion meant as much to me as Judaism meant to my husband.
Marc:He's real Jewy.
Guest:He's not super Jewy, but like it's, you know, he doesn't want.
Marc:But he had that thing.
Guest:He's not going to go to church.
Guest:It was never like he was going to go the other way.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I definitely didn't care about.
Guest:Going to church.
Marc:Was there pressure from like his family?
Guest:Yeah, for sure.
Guest:His dad did not.
Guest:We got married after 10 and a half years.
Guest:And for the first five years, I'm positive that his father did not learn my last name.
Marc:I believe it.
Guest:I'm positive that his dad was like, this girl's not.
Guest:This is Point Norris complaint.
Guest:She's not going to hang out.
Guest:This is not going to go.
Guest:My son will come around.
Guest:He'll marry a Jewish girl.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And so he just never, like, I mean, they were nice.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:They were fine.
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:But they were not.
Guest:It was not big open arms.
Marc:That weird tension.
Guest:Embracing me, you know.
Guest:I blazed a trail there in the family.
Guest:But they really just cared about, well, they really just care about are the kids going to be Jewish?
Guest:That's all they care about.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They want the grandchildren to be Jewish.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And my kids are Jewish, and so they're happy.
Marc:But what did you have to do to be Jew?
Marc:What is that?
Marc:I don't even know.
Guest:I had to have a Jewish wedding.
Guest:I don't even say had to.
Guest:I wanted to have a Jewish wedding.
Marc:But I mean, did you become a Jew before you had, like, are you stamped and approved?
Marc:You got the paperwork?
Guest:I did not have my mikvah, actually.
Guest:So I am not technically converted.
Marc:Well, just go take a bath with some girls.
Guest:That's what you gotta do.
Marc:In the mikvah, yeah.
Guest:It's just never really, I'll be honest with you, I have not lived in LA a long enough chunk of time to, like, commit to the program, basically, to do it.
Guest:So I studied with a couple rabbis.
Guest:And, you know, we belong to a temple, but it's like, OK, come to the 11 week, you know, you're a Jew now class and then get your mikvah.
Guest:I'm like, I don't I'm not here for 11 weeks in a row.
Guest:Like, I can't.
Guest:That's not going to happen.
Guest:You know, I've come on.
Guest:You're at a level now.
Marc:Can't you get a rabbi on set?
Guest:I mean, but that's what I would have to do.
Guest:And I'm kind of like, I mean.
Guest:sit around in a trailer with a rabbi get around to it that'd be hilarious is like you know you've got your yeah do my bible study my old testament did you learn how to do hebrew and uh no but i but i have i've got it all lined up i got my hebrew helpers on the so this is all pretty new or what no no no no i've been essentially a jew for like 15 years for a long time but you got i haven't had a christmas tree in 15 years but you but are you like like officially a jew i
Guest:I am not officially stamped, but by all accounts, yes.
Guest:My kids go to Jewish preschool.
Guest:We only celebrate Jewish holidays.
Guest:I love Seder.
Marc:Yeah, but I don't get it.
Marc:Why aren't you going the full ride?
Marc:I mean, there seems to be an obstacle here that's not just time.
Guest:No, I'm telling you, literally the obstacle is just like, it's very hard to get three rabbis to be like, okay, you can be Jewish if you haven't gone through some learning process.
Marc:Have they seen the Hunger Games?
Marc:I mean, don't they know?
Guest:Don't they know who I am?
Guest:Don't they know I want to be Jewish?
Marc:Yeah, can't you just give you the pass?
Marc:Look what you've done.
Guest:So I don't know.
Guest:And then frankly, because I'm already doing everything, I don't feel, I feel like I'm as Jewish as I am ever gonna be.
Marc:Did you like the Hanukkah candles and do all that stuff?
Guest:Yeah, of course, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, we did it all.
Marc:And are the in-laws now like, you know.
Guest:Oh, they love it.
Marc:Because of the kids.
Guest:Well, here's the thing.
Guest:So like my other, I have a sister-in-law who's great.
Guest:She converted to sort of get married to my brother-in-law.
Marc:Your husband's brother.
Guest:My husband's brother has a wife.
Marc:So both brothers married non-Jews.
Guest:Correct.
Marc:And there's only, I bet you they're the only two, right?
Marc:Do they have sisters?
Guest:There's two sisters.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:And the one sister just married a Jew, so.
Marc:Thank God they got one, huh?
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:Okay.
Okay.
Guest:And she converted and did the whole thing.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But they still have Christmas.
Marc:My mother likes Christmas lights.
Marc:There's nothing you can.
Guest:I mean.
Marc:And she's a born Jew.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:They like the Christmas.
Marc:Well, the kids probably like the Christmas.
Guest:Sure.
Marc:So your kids going to Hebrew school?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You don't know.
Guest:They're too young.
Guest:Well, they're going to Hebrew preschool.
Yeah.
Marc:You just had a baby or got a baby.
Guest:I did, yeah, I just got a baby.
Guest:I had a baby.
Marc:You had a baby.
Guest:Well, it's my baby.
Guest:He came out of me nine months early.
Guest:That's how we talk about it.
Marc:How does that work?
Guest:It's a real crazy scientific process.
Marc:So both your kids are surrogates?
Guest:Correct.
Guest:Both my kids were born via gestational surrogates.
Guest:They're both mine and my husband's.
Guest:They are biologically and genetically 100% me.
Guest:That's so wild.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Why that decision?
Guest:It's like a test tube baby and then you grow it.
Guest:It was not my decision.
Guest:At all.
Guest:It's not the way I would have done it.
Guest:It was literally the only chance for me to have kids that were mine.
Marc:So they take your egg and they take his sperm and they fertilize it outside and then they put it in another person.
Guest:And then they grow it in another oven.
Marc:Did you use the same oven?
Guest:I did use the same oven, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, it was amazing.
Guest:The most amazing woman.
Marc:How do you meet an oven?
Guest:They have agencies.
Guest:They have people.
Guest:They have facilitators that find lovely people and then hook you up, basically.
Guest:I use the same people as Elton John.
Marc:Did they use his egg?
Guest:Yeah, they used his egg.
Guest:I'm sorry.
Marc:That's interesting to me.
Guest:Not a choice.
Guest:For the gays that do it, they don't have a womb, so that's the only chance they get.
Guest:Not my choice.
Marc:People think that you make that choice?
Guest:I have no idea.
Guest:I don't want to know what people think.
Guest:People are idiots about this stuff, for sure.
Marc:Well, my brother adopted three kids from three different people and he, you know, and he, you know, it was a situation where, you know, you meet the woman who's having your baby before and it all seems so gnarly to me in terms of like, you know, because that the person, even your surrogate, I imagine, even though it's your egg and your husband's sperm has a connection to this.
Guest:You know, they do, but when it's not biologically theirs, it,
Guest:It is a lot less.
Guest:I mean, and they also you're good.
Guest:They're going into it the entire time.
Guest:Their their big win in the scenario is handing you the baby.
Guest:I mean, that's that's their goal is to give.
Guest:Now, is this somebody has done it for other people?
Guest:Is she?
Guest:No, we were there first.
Guest:We were her there.
Guest:I say there because there's she has a husband who's amazing and they they're an incredible couple that did this for us.
Guest:and they have their own kids.
Guest:They have kids.
Guest:They have three kids.
Marc:That's fascinating.
Marc:How much do you get to know about these people?
Marc:How do you decide on a surrogate?
Marc:What needs to be in place for them to be able to do that other than the desire?
Marc:Because there's no genetic material really.
Guest:Really, the main questions you have when you go into it is, is this woman, is she going to let me make every decision as if it's mine and as if it's my body?
Guest:And that's what you're really concerned.
Guest:No one is concerned that they're not gonna give you the baby at the end.
Guest:Your biggest concern is that they're going to force a baby on you that you don't want.
Guest:That's your biggest concern.
Guest:In surrogacy.
Guest:Meaning, the baby has spina bifida and is going to be born severely...
Guest:you know, malformed, is 100% going to die.
Guest:So you don't want someone, if that's not what you want, if you don't believe in that, if you don't believe in giving life then to something that's just gonna die maybe minutes later, and by the way, if not minutes later, then cost you a million dollars in medical expenses.
Guest:then don't get involved with surrogacy.
Guest:You need someone that you trust is going to honor your wishes about what's going on.
Marc:Oh, I see, I see.
Marc:So you're saying that if you wanted to terminate the pregnancy for whatever reason, that they would have to agree to do that?
Guest:Correct, because you can't force somebody to do that.
Marc:Interesting.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So, well, everything worked out.
Guest:Yeah, we got two beautiful babies, thank goodness.
Marc:Now, does your relationship with this couple and family still exist after?
Marc:Really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Like they come over for Christmas and stuff?
Guest:Well, I'm writing them their Christmas cards right now.
Marc:And do they feel any sort of pride or connection to the kids?
Guest:They do, they're really like, yeah, they do.
Guest:But that's like aunties.
Guest:That's so wild to me.
Marc:Isn't it amazing that there's so many of these different avenues for which people can live their dream of having a child?
Guest:It's amazing.
Guest:The fact that we were able to have our own children despite the fact that my womb basically doesn't work is amazing to me.
Guest:It's amazing.
Guest:you know, it was a super bummer getting there.
Guest:It's not a fun path to take.
Marc:When you found out that you couldn't.
Guest:It's horrible.
Guest:It's horrible, yeah.
Guest:You have to mourn, you know, you essentially mourn the loss of your fertility.
Guest:Your, you know, your superiority over men is that you can carry babies.
Guest:Like, ha ha, suckers.
Guest:Like, you get higher incomes.
Right.
Right.
Guest:But you can't do this without us.
Guest:But you die sooner and you don't get to have babies.
Guest:And suddenly I had to let go of one of those.
Guest:I had to let go of my womanhood in a way.
Guest:And just sort of give over to a process that I didn't willingly go into.
Guest:I mean, I went into it...
Guest:I went into it willingly, but I didn't go into it happily.
Guest:You know, I went into it from a darker place.
Guest:And then in the end, it's all light and amazing.
Guest:And that's what they tell you when you start.
Guest:They say in the end, there'll be a baby and you'll be so happy and you'll forget everything.
Guest:And you do forget everything.
Marc:Was there the process of struggling, deciding how you wanted to do it, like thinking about adoption and that kind of stuff?
Guest:Yeah, we thought about that.
Guest:I don't think that adoption, I think people forget that adoption is not, anyone can adopt whether you're fertile or infertile, it doesn't matter.
Guest:So it's a way to be a parent.
Guest:But it is not a solution or a, it's not a prescription for infertility.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's just a way to be a parent, to parent a kid.
Marc:So it was important to you.
Guest:But it was not a way, it's not a way to have your own child.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's certainly not a way to, you know, certainly.
Guest:So it was, it was secondary to gestational surrogacy for us always.
Guest:Because we all, we wanted, you know, we've been together for 20 years.
Guest:And there really is something unique and special about making a little, you know, half me, half him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, having your.
Marc:And now you can see it.
Guest:Having, you know, your genetics go on.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:And you can see it in the kids.
Guest:You can see it.
Guest:You really can see it.
Guest:It's amazing.
Yeah.
Guest:And people that adopt are like huge souls.
Guest:I mean, I have so much respect for people who go that route.
Guest:It wasn't what we chose.
Guest:I get a lot of, not a lot.
Guest:I don't get a lot.
Guest:But every once in a while, you get someone who is like, why didn't you just adopt?
Guest:There's so many babies out there that need love, da, da, da, da, da.
Guest:And I think, well, you just want me to validate your thing, number one.
Guest:And number two, adoption is no picnic.
Guest:no I know yeah it is not a picnic it's not easy and it's it's not easy I know a lot of people that have gone through even more I just I just this process ended with me getting my own child yeah the adoption process was just like another maze of maybe kind of who knows and also like genetics that you're like you'll never really know yeah not for a while
Guest:You're not going to maybe get the information that Aunt Sally had cancer at 20.
Guest:You just don't know what you're getting.
Guest:That felt like a path that was fraught in a way that I was kind of done with being fraught because I had been through a lot already trying to conceive on my own.
Marc:Yeah, that must be horrible.
Guest:Frustrating.
Marc:It's not fun.
Marc:And before I knew that you did that, before I did any research, I don't usually do, and I think I saw you at that thing with Judd, and you were like, I just had a baby.
Marc:I'm like, wow, she's really up and out.
Guest:Yeah, that happens a lot, actually.
Marc:And I go, yeah, yeah.
Marc:You're like, yeah.
Guest:I like to believe that if I had carried my own baby, I would have bounced back, but.
Guest:Who knows?
Guest:And by the way, it's such a horrible... Women should not be expected to bounce back.
Marc:I don't know how they do it.
Guest:It's, I think, a true disservice what's going on right now with all these celebrity moms.
Marc:Worried about their tummies?
Guest:First, I just want to remind people that celebrities generally are genetically superior human beings on a certain level anyway.
Marc:Are they?
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, they're like, I mean, they're mostly thin, you know, they got trainers, they work out, they've got money, they've got the ability, you know, and they are normally genetically predisposed to being thin people anyway.
Guest:So like these women who are holding up, you know, certain people as their benchmark after they've had a child, like just go be with your kid for a minute.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, don't freak out.
Guest:Don't get to the gym right away, it's all right.
Guest:This is not how it's supposed to be, everybody.
Guest:Calm down.
Marc:There is a freakish class thing that people put celebrities in this certain light.
Marc:I mean, the speculation that goes around just regular people around celebrities, it's bizarre.
Marc:Because even my girlfriend is sort of a gossip person.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And when she says things to me, I'm like, they're probably not doing any of that.
Marc:Where do they have the fucking time?
Marc:I mean, if you read gossip, you'd think that all celebrities are doing is sordid weird ass shit.
Marc:I mean, they're just people.
Marc:I mean, have you had experiences where you hear something about yourself and you're like, holy fuck.
Guest:Oh, sure.
Guest:I mean, my other issue is like, I feel like the only time they ever take my picture is like the morning when I'm like, I can leave the house looking like crap.
Guest:It's fine.
Guest:And they're like, they're there.
Marc:And they're waiting for you?
Guest:They're always there.
Guest:So literally, I think to my, and they always take my picture on Sunday.
Guest:And I'm like, you know what?
Guest:I'm sorry.
Guest:Fuck off.
Guest:Like, I'm not going full hair and makeup on my Sunday morning.
Guest:Like, this is my day to be in like my sweatpants and hang out.
Marc:How do they find you?
Guest:I need a day off.
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Guest:And but then I think if people's perception of my style is like the Sunday morning photos, I'm in so much trouble.
Marc:I mean, I really how do they find you?
Guest:I mean, I live my life.
Guest:I go to the farmer's market in the grocery store and they are there.
Marc:Do some people call ahead to get people to take?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:But the reality stars do that.
Guest:I don't know anyone who does that.
Marc:Because she told me that, and I'm like, really?
Guest:There are people that do that.
Marc:And publicists, that's their angle?
Guest:I think people do that, yeah.
Marc:All right, so what other, you just did the Hunger Games, and what else is happening?
Guest:Oh, gosh.
Guest:Well, you know, we just had Pitch Perfect this whole year, which was like my baby, my life's work that my husband and I produced.
Guest:Oh, I kind of watched that.
Guest:It's a great movie.
Guest:You would love it.
Guest:We shot it in Baton Rouge.
Guest:How come I missed it?
Guest:It's a huge universal movie.
Guest:It made so much money, we're going to make a sequel.
Guest:Yeah, you're just out of it.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:You're just out of it.
Guest:You just didn't, you passed by on this one.
Guest:It's okay.
Marc:I wait for a screener.
Marc:How come you didn't send me a screener?
Guest:You can buy the DVDs of today.
Guest:They don't send screeners unless they think they can get an Academy Award.
Guest:I don't think we're getting an Academy Award, unfortunately.
Marc:And it just came out last year?
Guest:By the way, this is one of my biggest pet peeves.
Guest:It's one of the major disappointments for me in this industry.
Guest:What?
Guest:Is how little credence is given to comedies over dramas.
Guest:I just saw The Hobbit.
Guest:Did you see The Hobbit?
Marc:No, I'm not going to see The Hobbit.
Guest:Why not?
Marc:Why would I?
Marc:I couldn't even wrap my brain around the books.
Marc:Those are those movies where it's sort of like, oh, if you read the book.
Guest:Are you not a fantasy guy?
Marc:No.
Guest:See, I'm a dork.
Guest:I like a lot of fantasy.
Guest:I like certain fantasy.
Guest:The Hobbit is so boring.
Marc:I think he gets lost in his tricks that Jackson felt.
Guest:This is the issue.
Guest:First of all, two hours and 50 minutes.
Guest:Guys, that's sort of an assault on the audience, in my opinion.
Guest:No movie needs to be two hours and 50.
Guest:Yeah, make some decisions.
Guest:Cut some shit.
Guest:Make a decision.
Guest:We're an hour in the Hobbit house while they're figuring out what they're going to do singing bad songs.
Guest:Like, come on.
Marc:Trim that thing.
Guest:It took forever.
Guest:I was like, if I was a 10-year-old boy, maybe I would like this movie.
Guest:But, like, it's really.
Marc:What movies did you like this movie?
Guest:It's not great.
Marc:Did you like The Master?
Guest:I thought this was a tough year, honestly.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I just watched David O. Russell's movie.
Marc:It's fucking great.
Guest:Yeah, I know.
Guest:He's so great.
Guest:Did you like it?
Guest:I haven't seen it yet.
Guest:He's so great.
Guest:And I obviously love Jennifer and I grew up with Bradley and I love everyone.
Guest:You grew up with him?
Guest:He was in my Hot American Summer.
Guest:He was in my very first movie, Bradley.
Marc:He really showed up for work this time.
Guest:Good.
Guest:Well, David O. Russell is a man I'm dying to work with him forever.
Guest:We had a movie going for a little bit and it didn't happen.
Marc:But you and your husband produced Pitch Perfect.
Guest:Yeah, but so the bummer for me is like, as a successful movie-going experience, like being moved, laughing, just the whole thing, I felt like, you know, pitch perfect to me.
Guest:I was like, The Hobbit, it's going to make a gajillion dollars.
Guest:It's just like special effects.
Guest:There's no emotion.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know, at least in Lord of the Rings, it's about the four Hobbits.
Guest:It's about their friendship and about, you know, getting back to the Shire and your home and all that.
Guest:They're kind of trying to do that with this movie, but...
Guest:At a certain point, you just go, guys, you're really taking advantage of us.
Guest:You're making The Hobbit into three movies, and they're all gonna be three hours long.
Marc:Yeah, we get it.
Guest:Come on.
Marc:You had a lot of money to spend.
Guest:You're killing us, yeah.
Marc:Now you gotta make it back.
Guest:Way to go.
Guest:But I think as an emotional journey, I mean, also I think the older you get, the harder it is to like anything.
Marc:So you wanna work with David O. Russell?
Guest:I do, absolutely.
Guest:Who else?
Guest:I still think Spielberg's got a bunch of good movies in him.
Marc:You wanna work with him?
Guest:I have worked with him, but it was a small role.
Guest:But I just, being on set with him, I just thought, oh man, he's a real.
Guest:What actor is he?
Guest:He's real special.
Guest:Channing Tatum.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Definitely.
Marc:That'd be funny.
Guest:Oh man, I would love it.
Guest:I would work that.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You just want to make out.
Guest:No, he's just really funny.
Guest:Yeah, he is funny.
Guest:I think he's funny and he's got a great vibe about him.
Guest:I don't know that he would do, I don't know that he's gonna do comedies.
Guest:I mean, this is the big, I haven't been in a lot of, I certainly have not been in a lot of what we call rom-coms, which is sort of a word I don't like, but
Marc:What, in terms of like a romantic comedy lead?
Guest:Yeah, in terms of, yeah, it's very hard to find great men, like true actors, actors that want to play at that level in a comedy that ultimately is romantic because you end up falling for each other.
Guest:But I would just like to make a really funny movie and also fall in love.
Guest:I did it a little bit with Zack and Mary Make a Porno.
Guest:I loved that movie.
Guest:I loved the movie making experience.
Guest:I do believe that movie is full of laughs and it's funny.
Guest:It's very in your face.
Guest:It's very Kevin Smith.
Guest:We didn't shy away from the porno part.
Guest:So it's not for everybody.
Guest:But it was really one of the few times where I felt like
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:This is, this feels really good.
Guest:Like I'm falling in love in a movie.
Guest:This is like a universal experience.
Guest:Everybody can relate to this.
Guest:And I'm, you know, we're doing physical comedy and it's really fun and funny and we're cracking jokes.
Guest:We're being clever.
Guest:There's like, this is firing on all cylinders.
Guest:This is great.
Guest:I love that.
Guest:I love that.
Marc:You just would like to do a little more of a mainstream romantic comedy.
Guest:I would like to do that more with guys who want to do that.
Guest:With truly comedic, funny men.
Guest:Leading men.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:That can carry a movie.
Guest:Correct.
Marc:How many of them are there?
Guest:There's not many.
Guest:There's not many.
Marc:But it'll happen.
Guest:Well, I mean, they make them.
Guest:They make them with bad actors.
Marc:That David O. Russell movie.
Guest:It's really funny.
Guest:I read that movie.
Marc:But it's like, it's a misleading romantic comedy because the first 45 minutes is so menacing that you don't realize that it's like structurally a classic romantic comedy.
Guest:I actually overheard, because I went to the 5 o'clock showing of The Hobbit.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I have two kids.
Guest:So it was us and a lot of elderly people.
Guest:And they, in the valet line afterwards, I heard one woman go about Silver Linings Playbook.
Guest:You know, that Jennifer Lawrence is a darling.
Guest:It took a long time to get to the feel-good part.
I thought...
Guest:I thought that was a good assessment.
Marc:That is the movie going public.
Guest:That's their opinion.
Marc:Don't make them wait too long for the feel good part.
Guest:They want the feel good part.
Guest:That's why they're there.
Marc:Well, how do we feel about this interview?
Marc:I feel good.
Marc:Yeah?
Guest:Sure.
Marc:All right.
Guest:Why not?
Marc:Were you nervous about it?
Guest:No.
Marc:All right.
Guest:I'm very open.
Marc:I was nervous about it.
Guest:Why?
Marc:Because you're fucking sitting in my garage.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:I've been in places.
Guest:I've been in some places.
Marc:That's what I hear.
Marc:I know you've been in places, but there's some people where I'm like, oh, my house is a mess.
Guest:God, where was I shooting?
Guest:We shot a place, and then we had to shoot in a garage for a minute.
Guest:We borrowed it so I could do a voiceover.
Guest:And like this guy, it was real bad.
Guest:Like the cat had died and was like still there.
Guest:And there was like pits everywhere.
Guest:And it was like, this is lovely compared to that.
Guest:So that's what I'm gonna compare it to.
Guest:What the hell situation was that?
Guest:We were in like a weird, in Baton Rouge.
Guest:What movie?
Guest:We were in Baton Rouge.
Marc:Oh, for your movie, Pitch Perfect.
Guest:And I had to do like a voiceover one day.
Guest:How did you end up locked into this?
Guest:We had to find a place that was nearby where our location already was.
Marc:For a home studio.
Guest:So you looked at guys.
Guest:Just for like an hour on one afternoon.
Guest:And we ended up in this.
Marc:You were stuck and you needed to do a pickup.
Guest:Guys, in this super scary, like if it was in the Texas Chainsaw Massacre, you would have believed it kind of garage that this guy had.
Marc:Thank you for coming.
Guest:Thank you.
Marc:Elizabeth Banks.
Marc:I feel like I didn't intro you.
Marc:Maybe we should try to do that.
Guest:Oh yeah, I'm Elizabeth Banks.
Marc:Okay, let's try it like we just got here.
Marc:Oh, Elizabeth Banks is in my garage.
Marc:How are you?
Guest:Hey, thank you for having me.
Marc:I'm so thrilled you're here.
Guest:You're sweet.
Marc:All right.
Marc:That got a little interesting and heavy at the end.
Marc:I enjoyed talking to her.
Marc:I would like to be friends with her.
Marc:Can I do that?
Marc:Would that be all right?
Marc:She's solid, right?
Marc:Am I right?
Marc:Did I tell you?
Marc:All right, as you know, all the tickets are on sale for the Marc Maron Out of the Garage Tour.
Marc:You can go to WTFPod.com for all that information.
Marc:Go to the calendar section.
Marc:Go to the episode section to see who's been on the show.
Marc:And don't pester me with requests that are meaningless in light of the fact that they have been on already.
Marc:Kick in a few shekels.
Marc:Get the app.
Marc:Upgrade to the premium app.
Marc:Get the Libsyn deal.
Marc:Get on the mailing list.
Marc:Look around.
Marc:Leave a comment.
Marc:Don't be a dick.
Marc:Do that stuff.
Marc:And that's that.
Marc:Again, thank you for supporting the show, supporting me with the Boomer Libs t-shirts, and supporting this amazing charity with Animal Rescue Foundation.
Marc:I'll let you know what the tally is on that in due time.
Marc:And that's that.
Marc:I'm going to Sundance with my IFC show.
Marc:I'm on a deadline.
Marc:I've got to finish my book by this week.
Guest:Boomer lives!