Episode 346 - Blues Traveler

Episode 346 • Released December 23, 2012 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Guest:Lock the gates!

00:00:07Marc:Are we doing this?

00:00:08Marc:Really?

00:00:08Marc:Wait for it.

00:00:09Marc:Are we doing this?

00:00:10Marc:Wait for it.

00:00:12Marc:Pow!

00:00:12Marc:What the fuck?

00:00:14Marc:And it's also... Eh, what the fuck?

00:00:16Marc:What's wrong with me?

00:00:17Marc:It's time for WTF!

00:00:19Guest:What the fuck?

00:00:20Guest:With Mark Maron.

00:00:24Marc:All right, let's do this.

00:00:25Marc:How are you?

00:00:25Marc:What the fuckers?

00:00:26Marc:What the fuck buddies?

00:00:27Marc:What the fucking ears?

00:00:28Marc:What the fucking avians?

00:00:29Marc:What the fuck nicks?

00:00:30Marc:What the fuck sticks?

00:00:31Marc:What the fuck a Mollins?

00:00:32Marc:What the fuck a Reekins?

00:00:35Marc:What the fucking fucks?

00:00:37Marc:Holy shit.

00:00:38Marc:Good morning.

00:00:38Marc:Good afternoon.

00:00:39Marc:Good evening.

00:00:40Marc:Hey, are you still up?

00:00:42Marc:Any of those can apply to you.

00:00:44Marc:Merry, happy holidays.

00:00:46Marc:I am Marc Maron.

00:00:47Marc:This is WTF.

00:00:49Marc:I'm going to do something a little unorthodox right at the beginning so you know, and so I know, I've told you.

00:00:55Marc:January 4th through 6th, I'll be at Fort Lauderdale Improv in the Hard Rock up against Jerry Seinfeld in the casino.

00:01:03Marc:Some of you are saying, hey, maybe it's time for an episode.

00:01:05Marc:And I'm saying, okay, could someone call him for me?

00:01:08Marc:I don't know how to get hold of that guy.

00:01:09Marc:I don't know if he likes me or I'm on his radar or he gives a shit.

00:01:13Marc:But we are going to be working right across from each other.

00:01:17Marc:Maybe I just reminded you that Seinfeld's playing.

00:01:19Marc:You're like, oh, fuck, man.

00:01:20Marc:I...

00:01:21Marc:I got to see Jerry.

00:01:23Marc:Come see me.

00:01:23Marc:I'll be at the at the Hard Rock Improv there.

00:01:26Marc:January 4th through 6th in Fort Lauderdale or go see Jerry or whatever.

00:01:32Marc:Maybe I can talk to him.

00:01:33Marc:We'll see.

00:01:35Marc:January 10th through 12th.

00:01:36Marc:Charlie Goodnights.

00:01:37Marc:Oh, it's not called that anymore because I haven't been there in 15 years.

00:01:40Marc:Raleigh, North Carolina.

00:01:41Marc:Goodnights.

00:01:43Marc:I'll be there.

00:01:44Marc:By the way.

00:01:45Marc:Mike Lawrence is going to be working with me in Fort Lauderdale.

00:01:49Marc:You've heard him on this show.

00:01:50Marc:Ryan Singer is going to be working with me in Raleigh.

00:01:54Marc:You know him.

00:01:54Marc:And when I come back to L.A., this is a rare full-hour L.A.

00:01:59Marc:experience at the Ice House, Pasadena, January 13th.

00:02:04Marc:And for my Boston people, New England area, I'll be doing a live WTF and a live stand-up show at the Wilbur, February 8th.

00:02:12Marc:Both shows at that night.

00:02:15Marc:That's a lot of work.

00:02:16Marc:Not really.

00:02:16Marc:It's what I do, right?

00:02:18Marc:Did I say Merry Whatever Christmas?

00:02:20Marc:Do you hear what I hear?

00:02:24Marc:I don't.

00:02:25Marc:I don't.

00:02:26Marc:Wasn't brought up with it.

00:02:27Marc:I don't hear any of it.

00:02:28Marc:I hear that song several times.

00:02:31Marc:That seems to be the only one that sticks in my head.

00:02:33Marc:Yeah, I mean, come they told me.

00:02:36Marc:I know that one.

00:02:37Marc:Joy to the world.

00:02:38Marc:I know that one.

00:02:39Marc:Jingle bells, jingle bells.

00:02:40Marc:I know that one.

00:02:41Marc:No, no, I know that one.

00:02:46Marc:Rudolph the red nose.

00:02:48Marc:I know that one.

00:02:49Marc:That's, by the way, all I know of all those songs.

00:02:52Marc:And then the melody, just the melody, maybe not the words.

00:02:55Marc:I probably know.

00:02:56Marc:I actually know a Latino one.

00:02:58Marc:De colores.

00:03:01Marc:Is that, I don't know, is that a Christmas song?

00:03:03Marc:I had to sing it when I was a kid, and I went to, yeah, I grew up in New Mexico.

00:03:06Marc:We made Biscuititos cookies with lard.

00:03:09Marc:I remember that.

00:03:10Marc:Lard and cinnamon.

00:03:11Marc:We had to sing those songs.

00:03:13Marc:Hey, how about, who's on the show?

00:03:15Marc:Who's on the show?

00:03:17Marc:Blues Traveler.

00:03:18Marc:The boys from Blues Traveler are here.

00:03:21Marc:i'm not even sure where the opportunity came up for me to to talk to these guys but it's their 25th anniversary together they put out a new record they're they're always out there working he's a fucking they're yeah he's an amazing fucking harmonica player and they have some driving fucking music and they got an interesting story and i had a great time in here with them it was uh they're fun dudes man jersey baby jersey

00:03:47Marc:Do you know what I know?

00:03:50Marc:I do not.

00:03:52Marc:I do not.

00:03:54Marc:That thing's very catchy.

00:03:55Marc:It's very catchy.

00:03:56Marc:Look, whatever it is, Jesus or no Jesus, whatever you believe in, it doesn't matter.

00:04:04Marc:You know, there's been a lot of horrible things going on in the world.

00:04:08Marc:He said in a general broad statement, not referring to anything specific, but we all know what we're talking about.

00:04:15Marc:And it's very easy to say like, oh, my family.

00:04:18Marc:Oh, I got to go.

00:04:18Marc:I got to buy presents.

00:04:21Marc:Any excuse that you have, whether you want to or not, to spend time with those people

00:04:28Marc:that either love you or you love or brought you up or ruined you or made a mess of your life or whatever it is.

00:04:35Marc:There's a very short menu of how people make a mess of things, but it's all sometimes repairable.

00:04:43Marc:And I'm starting to get to this, not melancholy or nostalgic, but, you know, you get older, it's like, you know, well, this might be it.

00:04:49Marc:There's a real good chance.

00:04:50Marc:So maybe I should take this in and do the best I can.

00:04:53Marc:And there's an excuse to give people presents.

00:04:56Marc:It's very nice.

00:04:57Marc:It's an excuse to spend time with family members, to transcend whatever bullshit and maybe have a good time.

00:05:03Marc:And fuck it, man.

00:05:04Marc:Take advantage of it.

00:05:06Marc:Do you hear what I hear?

00:05:14Marc:Do you see what I see?

00:05:15Marc:I don't know.

00:05:16Marc:I don't know.

00:05:17Marc:But I do want you to have a good holiday.

00:05:18Marc:And I know today is Christmas Eve.

00:05:21Marc:Do you open your presents tonight or tomorrow?

00:05:22Marc:Some people open them tonight.

00:05:24Marc:Do you do the Boxing Day thing?

00:05:25Marc:You know, maybe I'm jealous, man.

00:05:27Marc:You know, the Christians had all the fun stuff.

00:05:29Marc:You know, there was no cryptic language.

00:05:32Marc:You know, there was a tree.

00:05:34Marc:Everything happened all at once.

00:05:35Marc:It's this flurry of gift.

00:05:36Marc:I mean, you know, as a Jew, you rationalize.

00:05:38Marc:Like, yeah, we get one present at night.

00:05:40Marc:Yeah, but so what?

00:05:41Marc:All at once, man.

00:05:42Marc:How many more are there?

00:05:43Marc:Is this one for me, too?

00:05:45Marc:Those aren't things Jews say.

00:05:47Marc:Really?

00:05:47Marc:All four of these are for me?

00:05:49Marc:Oh, my God.

00:05:50Marc:And what, that thing in the garage is, too?

00:05:52Marc:Nope.

00:05:53Marc:We don't say that.

00:05:55Marc:We say, I wonder what we're going to get tomorrow.

00:05:58Marc:But as you get older, none of it fucking matters.

00:05:59Marc:Thank you for the Christmas cards from all of you.

00:06:02Marc:I appreciate it.

00:06:02Marc:It is very lovely.

00:06:03Marc:I got a bunch of cards.

00:06:04Marc:I got a bunch of well wishes.

00:06:06Marc:I'm getting records.

00:06:07Marc:I want to thank the guy from the band Caliphone that I never heard of.

00:06:13Marc:It's interesting.

00:06:13Marc:People are sending me vinyl and I love it.

00:06:16Marc:But I never heard of this band.

00:06:17Marc:This guy lives out here.

00:06:18Marc:His name's Tim Rotoli.

00:06:20Marc:He sent me all their back catalog and a new record and more records are coming in.

00:06:25Marc:I love it.

00:06:26Marc:If that's how you want to make the trade, if that's the deal you want to broker, thank you, Mark, for providing all this free entertainment.

00:06:32Marc:Here's some records.

00:06:34Marc:I'm all up for it.

00:06:34Marc:But I know that day is going to come where I'm going to be thumbing through my records just like I flipped through my iPod and I'm going to be like, yeah, fuck.

00:06:41Marc:I don't like any of them, but not yet.

00:06:43Marc:That hasn't happened.

00:06:44Marc:Thank you for the cards again.

00:06:45Marc:I want to repeat that.

00:06:46Marc:And also, some guy came up to me at the comedy store last night.

00:06:49Marc:A fellow named Richard Parks, who I believe is a writer, just handed me a bottle of pickled peppers, thanking me.

00:06:55Marc:Very nice.

00:06:56Marc:Look, I'm not tooting my own horn here, and I'm very humbled and grateful that so many of you get so much out of this show.

00:07:05Marc:And it's the season to feel that.

00:07:08Marc:There's a lot of people and a lot of pain out there.

00:07:11Marc:Keep that in your heart.

00:07:12Marc:It's not easy for anybody, all right?

00:07:14Marc:And it's certainly much harder for many right now.

00:07:17Marc:So remember that.

00:07:19Marc:And try to be nice to the people that fucked you up, all right?

00:07:24Marc:I think Jesus said that.

00:07:27Marc:Are you ready to hang out with some Jersey guys?

00:07:31Marc:With Blues Traveler?

00:07:33Marc:With John?

00:07:33Marc:And Chan?

00:07:36Marc:These are big boys.

00:07:37Marc:Big bar rocking boys.

00:07:39Marc:Who like to talk and jam.

00:07:41Marc:We're going to do both of them.

00:07:42Marc:So here we go.

00:07:44Marc:Let's talk to Blues Traveler.

00:07:48Marc:Isn't that unbelievable?

00:07:51Marc:You guys are old enough to be like, you have these old school stories about your roots.

00:07:55Guest:Not to mention that we've been together a quarter century.

00:07:59Marc:25 years.

00:08:00Marc:25 years traveler.

00:08:01Guest:When you can throw century down.

00:08:03Guest:I know, century.

00:08:04Guest:It's cool and really unsettling all at once.

00:08:08Guest:We've been a band longer than Prohibition.

00:08:10Marc:There you go.

00:08:10Marc:Sure, man.

00:08:11Marc:You remember Capone and his crew?

00:08:13Guest:Yeah, the blink of an eye.

00:08:14Guest:The entire Third Reich, half as long as the band.

00:08:16Marc:That's right.

00:08:17Marc:Yeah, and well, they did more damage, thank God.

00:08:19Marc:Well, it's early yet.

00:08:21Guest:Give us time.

00:08:22Guest:We're subtle.

00:08:23Guest:You're still building?

00:08:23Marc:That's open.

00:08:24Guest:That's open to discussion.

00:08:26Guest:Yeah, we're still going.

00:08:27Guest:How is the Blues Traveler Army holding up?

00:08:29Guest:We're more like Stalin.

00:08:30Guest:Okay.

00:08:30Guest:Our troops are generally in disarray, but that's how we like the formation to seem to the opposition.

00:08:36Guest:Uh-huh.

00:08:37Guest:Yeah, it's all part of our master plan.

00:08:39Guest:Yes.

00:08:39Guest:And we strike.

00:08:40Guest:As long as you've got the plan.

00:08:41Guest:You're like, they don't have any idea what they're doing.

00:08:43Guest:And that's when we come in.

00:08:45Guest:Yeah.

00:08:45Guest:We don't have any idea what we're doing.

00:08:46Guest:It's like the Charles Bronson movie where someone calls and goes, Miles to go before I sleep, and they spring into action.

00:08:51Guest:Bam.

00:08:51Guest:Yeah.

00:08:51Guest:Like Manchurian Canada.

00:08:53Guest:Manchurian, exactly.

00:08:53Guest:They're all going to wake up.

00:08:54Guest:I'm bad at movie references.

00:08:56Guest:I'm sorry.

00:08:56Guest:I think Frank Sinatra was in that movie.

00:08:58Guest:Yeah, I was Manchurian King and then Charles Bronson did a cheapo version later.

00:09:02Guest:That's right.

00:09:02Guest:I'm good at sci-fi.

00:09:03Guest:We could talk sci-fi.

00:09:04Guest:I'm no good at sci-fi.

00:09:05Guest:Me neither.

00:09:07Guest:I know that Game of Thrones would suck without the lesbian make-out session.

00:09:11Marc:Oh yeah, fantasy sci-fi.

00:09:12Guest:I'm good at fantasy as well.

00:09:13Marc:I don't dabble in either of them.

00:09:14Marc:I find them both tedious.

00:09:16Marc:I have a question for a fantasy sci-fi fan.

00:09:19Guest:Chan, how do you feel about people going to renaissance fairs dressed as Spock pretending to go back in time as Trekkies?

00:09:24Guest:completely unacceptable.

00:09:26Guest:I think it is the coolest idea ever.

00:09:29Guest:I've been to many renaissance fairs with my nerd son.

00:09:33Guest:God bless him, Aiden.

00:09:35Guest:It's all about the women in the garb and tankards and large

00:09:42Marc:But what is the window of time that they're allowed to dress for?

00:09:47Marc:That's what kills me is that some of them are dressing like Visigoths, some are dressing like... Right, but it's a renaissance.

00:09:53Marc:That's a real nerd who knows the difference.

00:09:55Guest:That's a history buff.

00:09:57Marc:That belt will not fly.

00:09:58Guest:The original renaissance fair started here in the Los Angeles area.

00:10:02Guest:Of course it did.

00:10:03Guest:And there are no Vikings allowed.

00:10:05Guest:You can't walk around with a Viking helmet.

00:10:07Guest:No.

00:10:07Guest:Yeah, the Renaissance was post-Middle Ages, was really what it was.

00:10:10Guest:They should be like Leonardo da Vinci is what they should be dressing like.

00:10:13Guest:That was the real Renaissance.

00:10:14Guest:What a buzzkill, John.

00:10:15Guest:Sorry.

00:10:15Guest:Sorry, I hated to ruin that.

00:10:17Guest:Everyone who's been to a Renaissance fair, but you're dressed completely inappropriate.

00:10:19Guest:It's really more like Dark Ages.

00:10:21Guest:It should be a Dark Ages fair.

00:10:23Guest:But it's cool, you know, they do, like, blown glass and they overspend.

00:10:26Guest:But the best part is you walk through this entire, like, three-hour gauntlet in the hot L.A.

00:10:31Guest:sun of wenches and taggers.

00:10:32Guest:That just made me realize I wish I was... And at the very end...

00:10:35Guest:They do, like, hardcore jousting.

00:10:38Guest:Yeah.

00:10:38Guest:Like, right now- On the horses.

00:10:39Guest:On the horses.

00:10:40Guest:They have this- They do a whole, like- Nobody dies.

00:10:43Guest:It's not hardcore.

00:10:43Guest:But it's an extreme jousting.

00:10:45Guest:Sometimes it happens.

00:10:45Guest:Yeah, absolutely.

00:10:46Guest:And the great part is, like, not welcomed.

00:10:47Guest:Someone backed over someone in a truck.

00:10:48Guest:You know, you finally get there with your, like, eight-year-old kid, and this thing starts, and next thing you know-

00:10:52Guest:They go through this whole skit, and somebody's neck gets slit, and they have the blood spewing out, and moms are just grabbing their kids.

00:11:00Guest:Everyone's crying hardcore.

00:11:02Guest:That's awesome.

00:11:02Guest:That's a stunt spectacular.

00:11:04Guest:It's awesome.

00:11:04Guest:That's their big closer.

00:11:05Guest:They wait to do that.

00:11:06Guest:But they blow glass at every one of these things?

00:11:08Guest:There's blown glass.

00:11:08Guest:There's all kinds of crappy crap.

00:11:09Guest:That just made me realize I wish my name was Philip Glass, because I'd go to these things and go, hey, I want to blow glass.

00:11:13Guest:Yeah.

00:11:14Guest:And then you kind of plink on it in a very rhythmic way.

00:11:17Guest:Or just not down.

00:11:17Guest:But let's get to these Star Trek guys, because that is really- They have their own convention.

00:11:21Guest:But it's so cool that they're going back in time.

00:11:23Guest:They're playing along.

00:11:24Guest:It's not cool.

00:11:24Guest:Like they're time travelers.

00:11:25Marc:How many times can you do that joke?

00:11:27Marc:Like, hey, I'm Spock.

00:11:27Marc:I'm here from the future.

00:11:29Guest:How often do you get to go to an entire time where people are dressed one way?

00:11:31Guest:You got to go to the Western shows.

00:11:33Marc:I get it, but is there a Spock at every Renaissance Fair trying to pull that same shit?

00:11:36Marc:No.

00:11:36Marc:It's not a joke to them.

00:11:38Guest:They're playing Spock.

00:11:38Guest:They really think they're back in time.

00:11:40Guest:This is for the Trekkies.

00:11:41Guest:I'm showing up at the next Star Trek convention in a night outfit.

00:11:46Guest:How did I get here?

00:11:46Guest:No, they would welcome you.

00:11:47Guest:They'd be playing along saying, oh no, someone got in our time warp and we have to educate him.

00:11:52Marc:I don't know if they'd welcome you.

00:11:52Guest:There's no welcoming.

00:11:54Guest:I'll bet you that's a good test.

00:11:55Guest:Somebody has to go as a renaissance person.

00:11:57Guest:The one in LA, which is awesome, Spock walking around would get gutted.

00:12:02Guest:I think if you dressed up in any of these outfits in LA, you'd get shot.

00:12:06Marc:Somebody would get shot if you went to one of these.

00:12:08Marc:It's sad that it's so exclusionary.

00:12:10Guest:Yeah, in both directions.

00:12:11Guest:It's not exclusionary as long as you're wearing some kind of corset.

00:12:14Marc:You are all dorks.

00:12:15Guest:You don't share the dorkdom.

00:12:16Marc:Why are you hungover, John?

00:12:17Marc:What happened last night?

00:12:18Guest:Do you remember?

00:12:20Guest:I do remember.

00:12:20Guest:There was a drink.

00:12:21Guest:We wanted to go to Kai Sushi, which was awesome, but it was quite full.

00:12:25Guest:And so we went to the Italian restaurant.

00:12:27Guest:In Hollywood?

00:12:28Guest:No, no, in Santa Barbara.

00:12:29Guest:So you were in Santa Barbara.

00:12:29Guest:You guys did a show up there?

00:12:30Guest:No, we were in, where the hell were we?

00:12:33Guest:Ventura.

00:12:34Guest:Uh-huh.

00:12:35Guest:And we played with Dr. John.

00:12:36Guest:It was fun.

00:12:37Guest:Really?

00:12:37Guest:Yeah, Dr. John said it.

00:12:38Guest:How's he holding up?

00:12:39Guest:He's great.

00:12:39Guest:He looks spectacular.

00:12:40Guest:Really?

00:12:41Guest:Yeah.

00:12:42Guest:We played with him about 10 years ago at like jazz fest, and he looked like in bad health.

00:12:48Guest:And we did a college show about four or five years ago, like in the middle of nowhere.

00:12:52Guest:He was looking pretty good.

00:12:53Guest:He looked great.

00:12:54Guest:I mean, he looks... He goes up and down.

00:12:57Marc:Yeah, I don't think I've seen him since the early 90s at the Village Gate in Greenwich Village.

00:13:03Marc:Nice.

00:13:04Marc:Do you remember that place?

00:13:04Marc:Yes, we played there.

00:13:06Marc:That was a good place.

00:13:07Marc:Do you remember Rafi, the guy who booked it?

00:13:08Marc:Yes!

00:13:09Marc:Yeah, his dad owned the place.

00:13:10Marc:There's a name out of the blue.

00:13:11Marc:Yeah, he used to sit and play chess in Washington Square Park.

00:13:14Guest:Or do Woody Allen jokes.

00:13:15Guest:Because we're digressing, we...

00:13:17Guest:We were affiliated with a new school.

00:13:19Guest:And so they got Blues Traveler a gig at the Village Gate.

00:13:23Guest:Well, they had sort of every Sunday night, new school students would sort of take over the jam session at the Village Gate, and they brought us up, and man, was it bad.

00:13:31Marc:Was that at the beginning, though?

00:13:32Marc:I took a class at the new school.

00:13:33Guest:When were you at the new school?

00:13:34Guest:Yeah, at the very beginning, the fall of 86, the jazz program that started there.

00:13:37Guest:Really?

00:13:38Guest:86, 87, and 88-ish.

00:13:39Guest:You were both at the new school?

00:13:42Guest:Well, he was going to NYU.

00:13:44Guest:I was glomming onto the studio space.

00:13:45Guest:I mean, a lot of people thought I was.

00:13:47Guest:Basically, our parents said, if you go to school, we'll pay for it.

00:13:50Guest:But if you don't, you have to get a job.

00:13:52Guest:So we all said, we'll go to school.

00:13:53Guest:And then we would skip school and just learn how to get gigs at the things.

00:13:56Guest:And we paid our rent.

00:13:57Guest:We quit school.

00:13:57Marc:So you never even paid attention to the classes?

00:14:00Guest:It was a music school, so it was handy.

00:14:02Guest:You're in a class with Chico Hamilton and Roland Hanna learning about how to play blues, but the thing is... We had gigs all the time.

00:14:09Guest:You'd have gigs at night, so you couldn't make the classes to learn how to get gigs.

00:14:13Guest:But you were learning practical things in the class.

00:14:16Guest:You were learning more like the ethereal, mystical, aesthetic school things, and then at night you learned how to sell booze and get people dancing.

00:14:23Guest:It was a combination.

00:14:24Guest:Try to get some butts in the seats.

00:14:26Marc:So now where did it start?

00:14:27Marc:It started in New Jersey?

00:14:28Guest:Princeton, New Jersey, yeah.

00:14:29Guest:High school.

00:14:30Guest:Princeton High School.

00:14:31Marc:But you didn't grow up in New Jersey or you did?

00:14:33Guest:I moved there in 82 when I was 16.

00:14:35Guest:Your family's from where?

00:14:36Guest:Well, I was born in Cleveland.

00:14:38Guest:Cleveland.

00:14:38Guest:And we moved to Stanford, Connecticut.

00:14:40Guest:Do you remember Cleveland?

00:14:41Guest:I go to Cleveland occasionally.

00:14:43Marc:Really?

00:14:43Marc:Yeah, to do comedy.

00:14:45Guest:We lived in a place called Chardon, Ohio, which is like the suburb out sort of east of Cleveland.

00:14:52Guest:It was like a farm community back then.

00:14:54Guest:And we had a pony that I don't really remember, but everyone could swim in the pool.

00:14:59Guest:Yeah, named Domino.

00:14:59Guest:I didn't know you had a pony.

00:15:00Guest:Here's where we learn.

00:15:03Guest:I've known this man for a long time.

00:15:04Guest:So everyone got to swim in the pool, but I got to swim in the trough of the pony.

00:15:08Guest:Oh, really?

00:15:09Guest:Throw the kid in the trough.

00:15:10Marc:It didn't matter.

00:15:11Marc:At that age, it's probably special.

00:15:13Guest:So I already have pool envy.

00:15:15Guest:At age what?

00:15:16Guest:I'm just a trough splasher.

00:15:17Marc:How old are you?

00:15:19Guest:This is like as a baby.

00:15:20Marc:I just remember that.

00:15:21Marc:It didn't stick too hard.

00:15:22Guest:And then we moved to Stanford when I was like two or three.

00:15:25Guest:What was the old man doing?

00:15:26Guest:Why did you move around?

00:15:28Guest:He's a Hungarian refugee.

00:15:30Guest:A Hungarian refugee?

00:15:31Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:15:32Guest:He escaped from Budapest in 1951.

00:15:33Guest:Really?

00:15:34Guest:From what?

00:15:35Guest:I'm ignorant.

00:15:36Marc:Why did he have to?

00:15:37Guest:Well, after World War II, you know, it was a communist.

00:15:39Guest:Right, that's right.

00:15:39Marc:The commies took over.

00:15:40Marc:Who was the head in charge?

00:15:41Marc:Tito?

00:15:42Marc:Was that hungry?

00:15:43Guest:No, no.

00:15:44Guest:Jorge.

00:15:47Guest:So your dad split for greener pastures?

00:15:49Guest:Yeah, you were allowed to leave in 56, and he got out in 51.

00:15:52Guest:He was like 18, and...

00:15:54Guest:He used his student ID.

00:15:56Guest:They were still rounding up refugees from World War II in the 50s.

00:16:00Guest:So he used his student ID to sort of bullshit his way through Europe.

00:16:04Guest:Like, I'm with the Swiss Secret Service.

00:16:06Guest:It was crazy.

00:16:07Guest:He got his way.

00:16:09Guest:He told me later.

00:16:10Guest:He had a really interesting past.

00:16:11Guest:He used to smuggle hogs during the war and booze.

00:16:14Guest:A hog smuggler.

00:16:15Guest:And booze.

00:16:16Guest:Yeah.

00:16:17Guest:He had some crazy stories.

00:16:19Guest:It involved gunplay and...

00:16:21Guest:It was wacky.

00:16:22Guest:So your dad was like a... And then he ended up being a very successful businessman.

00:16:26Guest:And then he was like VP at Squibb.

00:16:31Guest:He's retired now, but yeah, he had a computer consulting firm and all that.

00:16:34Marc:I think it's those people that are enterprising in the darkest of times that end up...

00:16:38Guest:Learning a bit about business.

00:16:41Marc:When you're hungry.

00:16:41Marc:When you're hungry and hungry.

00:16:43Marc:Yeah.

00:16:43Marc:And you got to smuggle hogs and booze.

00:16:45Marc:Yeah.

00:16:45Marc:In the dark streets of Hungary.

00:16:47Marc:Yes.

00:16:48Guest:Yeah.

00:16:48Guest:Through the Nazi checkpoints.

00:16:49Guest:And then you ended up in the dirty streets of Princeton.

00:16:52Guest:Yeah.

00:16:53Guest:Yeah.

00:16:53Guest:Load out the mean streets.

00:16:55Guest:I know that place.

00:16:56Guest:I was just there, actually.

00:16:57Guest:It's kind of like the Sopranos, but with a much cuter accent.

00:16:59Guest:Well, you got to school there, so that kind of temper shit.

00:17:01Guest:My father always called it Brigadoon.

00:17:02Guest:And it's like Brigadoon.

00:17:05Guest:It's this magical, bubbly place where nothing bad happens.

00:17:08Guest:And it's like you hear Steven Spielberg music at the beginning of E.T.

00:17:11Guest:where the kids are riding home on bikes.

00:17:12Marc:Well, Rutgers is there, right?

00:17:14Marc:And Princeton.

00:17:15Guest:That's back in actual New Jersey.

00:17:17Guest:That's New Brunswick.

00:17:18Guest:You're right.

00:17:19Guest:That's not where Einstein never hung out there.

00:17:21Guest:We're talking about Princeton.

00:17:22Marc:There aren't floral displayed wreaths.

00:17:23Marc:I got them confused.

00:17:24Marc:I haven't been to Princeton in a while.

00:17:26Marc:I was in New Brunswick.

00:17:27Marc:My mistake.

00:17:28Guest:It's not Trenton.

00:17:29Marc:What'd your dad do?

00:17:31Guest:He was a professor at Princeton.

00:17:32Guest:Of what?

00:17:33Guest:Psychology.

00:17:34Guest:Oh, no kidding.

00:17:34Guest:You can see what I had to do.

00:17:36Guest:But it wasn't like psychology, it was perception, like how your brain and eyes and ears work.

00:17:41Marc:Oh, so it was actually- Experimental.

00:17:43Marc:Scientific psychology, not like, how are you feeling?

00:17:46Guest:That was awesome.

00:17:46Guest:He had big, large labs and all those computers with tape, binary.

00:17:52Marc:He never put you in a box?

00:17:53Guest:Yes, he did.

00:17:54Guest:I was a subject for eight or nine of his friends' experiments at school.

00:17:59Guest:Conditioning, that was a product of several experiments.

00:18:01Guest:I did Rorschach tests.

00:18:02Guest:You did?

00:18:03Guest:I did all kinds of stuff.

00:18:04Guest:Did he have that shit laying around?

00:18:05Guest:No, his friends would be trying to do something, so they'd be like, I got a buddy who needs to use you for the afternoon.

00:18:11Guest:Exactly.

00:18:12Guest:Loan him out for scientific experiments.

00:18:15Guest:It's a good group.

00:18:17Guest:It was like the hippie era.

00:18:19Guest:They always had these socials and get-togethers that were just ragers.

00:18:23Guest:Really?

00:18:24Marc:Drinking, smoking weed, hanging out, listening to music.

00:18:27Guest:The hippies, but they were doing cool stuff.

00:18:29Guest:Wow.

00:18:30Marc:Well, how old are you?

00:18:30Guest:43.

00:18:32Marc:And you?

00:18:33Marc:45.

00:18:33Marc:I'm 48.

00:18:35Marc:Thank you for being older than us.

00:18:38Marc:You're welcome.

00:18:39Marc:No kids here.

00:18:40Marc:But when you started playing in Jersey, what was the angle?

00:18:46Marc:What was the songs?

00:18:47Guest:What were you playing?

00:18:48Guest:Who was the original band?

00:18:50Guest:It was myself and Brendan started a band called Blues Band.

00:18:54Guest:Yeah, Blues Band.

00:18:56Guest:How many names did you go through, though?

00:18:57Guest:Well, that was like our... I'm trying to be matter of fact.

00:19:00Guest:That's what we are, but we were not.

00:19:02Guest:Which in Princeton you can get away with.

00:19:04Guest:And we were a little uptight.

00:19:06Guest:We were from the high school band and we were the one... I always look at it as half the band was embraced by our band teacher and half was rejected by the band teachers, dismissed as the druggies and...

00:19:18Guest:That was Chan and Bobby, our first bass player, Bob Sheehan.

00:19:21Marc:Yeah.

00:19:21Guest:And they were the ones that hung out and smoked a lot of weed.

00:19:23Guest:Right, right.

00:19:24Guest:And Chan, he wanted to play, but Mr. B gave him a guitar and sent him to the practice room, and you loved that.

00:19:29Guest:Well, no, Mr. B did not give me a guitar.

00:19:32Guest:I got in there as I was in the jazz.

00:19:36Marc:The stage band.

00:19:36Guest:The school had a great music program.

00:19:39Guest:It had a whole suite of studios and a closet full of amps.

00:19:43Guest:Award-winning jazz band.

00:19:44Guest:And then the jazz band was all... I got in there, and I was like, there's amps, and there's all these little studios.

00:19:49Guest:So I used to come to school, get baked a bejesus, and come in there, grab an amp, and sit in the studio, this little studio room, and practice.

00:19:57Guest:And that's how these guys met me.

00:19:58Guest:Like, who is this dude?

00:20:00Guest:Just jamming by yourself?

00:20:01Guest:Just sitting there practicing stuff.

00:20:02Guest:And they were like, I was always around, and that's how we kind of met.

00:20:05Guest:And you were in the jazz band?

00:20:06Guest:They were the big cheese, yeah.

00:20:07Guest:Yeah, I was playing.

00:20:08Guest:Well, I was actually, they heard me playing.

00:20:10Guest:I was in the school for, I was in the class for the, you know, the straight F kids.

00:20:14Guest:Yeah.

00:20:14Guest:Like all the black kids.

00:20:15Guest:Right.

00:20:16Guest:And they were like.

00:20:17Marc:So you fucked up in school completely.

00:20:18Guest:Oh, I made a resolution in seventh grade to not do homework.

00:20:21Guest:You're so dumb.

00:20:22Guest:I wanted to see if I could get away with doing no homework.

00:20:23Guest:Yeah, okay.

00:20:24Guest:But they heard me playing the harmonica, which I just started picking up.

00:20:27Guest:I want to be a comedian, and I saw the Blues Brothers.

00:20:28Guest:You want to be a comedian?

00:20:30Guest:Yeah, just, no, no.

00:20:30Guest:It's quite funny now.

00:20:31Guest:I'm almost there.

00:20:32Guest:Who are your guys?

00:20:33Guest:Well, Saturday Night Live and Steve Martin.

00:20:35Guest:See, that's where I saw the Blues Brothers.

00:20:36Guest:So that made me want to get a harmonica.

00:20:38Guest:Belushi made you want to get a harmonica.

00:20:40Marc:Oh, Ackroyd, yeah.

00:20:41Marc:Or Ackroyd play, that's right.

00:20:43Guest:So I didn't really know much about music.

00:20:44Guest:And I was just starting to get into it.

00:20:46Guest:And I was pretty good right away.

00:20:48Guest:And so they heard me, the remedial teacher I had, thought, you know, this will get him involved in school or something.

00:20:54Guest:So she sits me down with the band teacher.

00:20:56Guest:It looks something he can do.

00:20:57Guest:Yeah, it's something he can participate in.

00:20:59Guest:It'll vest him in his education.

00:21:00Guest:She was right.

00:21:01Guest:I mean, I was like showering once a week.

00:21:03Guest:I wasn't a very social person.

00:21:04Guest:What was that about?

00:21:05Guest:You weren't getting enough tension at home?

00:21:07Marc:What happened?

00:21:08Marc:I don't know.

00:21:09Guest:Was it a big fuck you to everybody?

00:21:11Guest:Did you smell terrific when you were 16?

00:21:12Marc:No, I'm just saying that like in order to commit to not doing well in school and just sort of like fuck you, I can live with this.

00:21:18Marc:And then all of a sudden the harmonica, you find yourself a savant of some kind.

00:21:21Marc:I don't know.

00:21:23Marc:I guess.

00:21:23Guest:Yeah.

00:21:24Guest:You weren't a druggie, though.

00:21:26Guest:No, no.

00:21:27Guest:I was pretty... I just watched a lot of TV.

00:21:29Guest:No, that was me and Bobby's fault.

00:21:30Guest:Yeah.

00:21:30Guest:See, I was pretty straight... I was told that drugs were bad.

00:21:34Guest:Yeah, and you believed it.

00:21:35Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:21:35Guest:No, I had an older brother who got pretty into drugs, so I mean, that was already demonized and stuff like that.

00:21:39Guest:But you had the older brother, so you got his records, too, though.

00:21:42Guest:Well, see, that's the thing.

00:21:42Guest:I was afraid of that.

00:21:43Guest:I heard Led Zeppelin up the hall.

00:21:44Guest:I was like, oh, that's the trouble.

00:21:45Guest:Come on.

00:21:46Guest:Yeah, I was like... You were the youngest?

00:21:49Guest:Second youngest.

00:21:49Guest:so like seven so there was five ahead of you um six ahead of you so five yes five ahead of me and one younger so you actually had to watch all of your siblings leave the house oh yeah you were just left with your parents at some point well no uh you know you know what he was basically just left alone and then you were like yeah i was like a latchkey have some have some cheese eventually eventually my mom worked so i mean it was we were kind of on our own yeah that high school time but they'd had enough

00:22:14Guest:for that child I would like skip school as much as I could because you know I just want to watch watch David Letterman and yeah like I didn't realize I was doing career work but that's really the thing that I was into and so the remedial teacher sits me down in front of the the band teachers like yeah I don't put much stock in the harmonica you ever want to play anything else I'm like I don't know a trumpet

00:22:32Guest:And bear in mind, my parents gave me music lessons at five.

00:22:35Guest:You know, I'm related distantly to this cellist, David Popper.

00:22:39Guest:So give him a cello.

00:22:40Guest:And I was terrible at it.

00:22:41Guest:Hated to practice.

00:22:42Guest:You could read music, though.

00:22:44Guest:No.

00:22:44Guest:I mean, I can figure it out.

00:22:47Guest:You know, every good bird does fly.

00:22:48Guest:So what was that moment where you picked up?

00:22:49Guest:Piano lessons at eight.

00:22:50Guest:Guitar lessons at 11.

00:22:53Guest:Every good bird does fly is what I was saying.

00:22:56Guest:And grizzly bears don't fuck around.

00:22:57Guest:That's the bass clef.

00:22:58Guest:but uh give the fat kid a tuba you know in the fourth grade I had a tuba really yeah they give you all kinds of lessons you were marching with a tuba no I didn't march I sucked at it it's like you know then they get you lessons and eventually you blow off the lessons because you don't want to read and you know that's work but what's it so where'd the harmonica come from who delivered it to you um I asked for one for my birthday and just a blues harp yeah that's how I got my first guitar too can I just ask my parents for one for my birthday

00:23:24Guest:And it was just no problem.

00:23:26Guest:I didn't have to read it.

00:23:27Guest:There is no tablature for harmonicas.

00:23:29Guest:But who were you listening to to get the sense of it?

00:23:31Guest:The Blues Brothers.

00:23:32Guest:And really, I was just playing it for fun.

00:23:35Marc:Really?

00:23:35Marc:So that was the only point of reference?

00:23:37Guest:That was the thing.

00:23:37Guest:No Sonny Boy, no Little Walter, no Jimi Hendrix.

00:23:40Guest:Well, eventually, that's the thing.

00:23:41Guest:The Blues Brothers led me to Paul Butterfield, which led me to the old blues guys because he was doing Muddy Waters tunes.

00:23:47Marc:Butterfield was good.

00:23:47Guest:And that somehow led me to Jimi Hendrix.

00:23:50Guest:And then I knew I wanted to be a musician.

00:23:52Marc:right but like when you got your chops because when i listen to your music it's a lot of it's not minor stuff a lot of it's major stuff and it's a lot of it's chromatic stuff very lyrical stuff it's not well you can get chromatic stuff out of a blues harp yeah but you can't like the you're not like you're not like from the tradition of that with sort of like whiny yeah well i i you always want to try and do something different but i love that i didn't mean to say whiny but you know yeah i get what you're saying though

00:24:14Guest:it's like Kim Wilson or like the thing that I've always resented is that the harmonica like the banjo has to keep this vocabulary that was established in the 20s and 30s or maybe even earlier than that while the guitar and the piano get to evolve or the saxophone get to evolve their vocabulary so I like took a page from Jimi Hendrix who would steal whatever sound he wanted and put it on his guitar and so I'd rip off guitar riffs I'd rip off sax riffs

00:24:38Guest:Like it's a horn.

00:24:40Guest:I mean, Sugar Blue is a great player to do that.

00:24:42Guest:I think Butterfield did that a little bit too.

00:24:45Guest:Stevie Wonder.

00:24:45Guest:Stevie Wonder, but he's playing a chromatic, so that ultimately is a different instrument.

00:24:48Guest:But yeah, I would try and sound like a chromatic harp.

00:24:51Guest:It gives you an idea of what a harmonica could do.

00:24:53Marc:But if you wanted to, could you kick out some Little Walter?

00:24:57Marc:Sure.

00:24:58Guest:Not as well as Little Walter.

00:24:59Guest:Right, right, right, right.

00:25:01Guest:You know, the thing we learned in the new school, one of the academic things we learned by being affiliated with at school is things like the blues is a sound a baby makes when it cries for the first time.

00:25:10Guest:Because after that, he knows he'll be picked up and it's all show business.

00:25:13Guest:It's about getting the true sound.

00:25:14Guest:It doesn't have to be a 12-bar blues.

00:25:16Guest:It just has to be honest.

00:25:17Marc:It's just really interesting.

00:25:18Marc:That's one of the few things maybe that you really remember.

00:25:21Marc:It isn't weird what you remember.

00:25:22Marc:You cling to that.

00:25:23Marc:Yeah, you cling to the good stuff.

00:25:24Guest:These weird little moments.

00:25:25Guest:I mean, the cool thing was is the things they were learning at the new school at that time, me and Bobby were in town.

00:25:30Guest:Oh, they were there for that.

00:25:32Guest:But...

00:25:32Guest:Brendan and John were giving us the things they were learning in class.

00:25:37Guest:And these guys would show up to the class sometimes too and just be a fly on the wall.

00:25:40Guest:It's not like you weren't allowed to.

00:25:42Guest:In the new school, anyone could go.

00:25:43Guest:We were playing gigs every night in crappy little bars in New York.

00:25:47Guest:But it was drifting down.

00:25:49Guest:We were getting some stuff out of it.

00:25:50Guest:Which bars?

00:25:51Guest:The Nightingales was the first place.

00:25:53Guest:We went to the jam session at Dan Lynch.

00:25:56Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:25:56Guest:We immediately rip into a 7-4 at the top volume.

00:25:59Guest:We had no sense of finance.

00:26:00Guest:I remember that.

00:26:01Guest:They stopped us and threw us out, and luckily next door was the Nightingales bar.

00:26:04Guest:Wonderland, John.

00:26:05Guest:Wonderland was our first gig.

00:26:07Guest:It was like open mic night, and we would come up as a band because we had no other gigs.

00:26:12Guest:And go to the auditions, yeah.

00:26:13Guest:But those were our first gigs.

00:26:15Guest:What was it called?

00:26:16Guest:Dan Lynch?

00:26:17Guest:Dan Lynch is still there.

00:26:18Marc:What was it?

00:26:18Marc:Like a blues open mic on Mondays?

00:26:20Marc:It was Sunday afternoon.

00:26:21Marc:Sunday afternoon.

00:26:22Marc:Like all that four hours or five hours, right?

00:26:25Marc:Yeah.

00:26:25Marc:I kind of fucking remember that.

00:26:26Guest:We never got asked back to Wonderland because the owner, she loved Elvis Presley absurdly.

00:26:33Guest:And we had this version of Hound Dog.

00:26:35Guest:It was like a funky, you know, like a Jimi Hendrix.

00:26:40Guest:He ain't nothing but a hound dog.

00:26:42Guest:And it was like that kind of a sort of rock me baby version of Hound Dog.

00:26:45Guest:But

00:26:45Marc:She hated it.

00:26:49Marc:She did not cotton to that at all.

00:26:52Guest:But a really interesting thing, when we first moved to New York, it had happened, and the cabaret law had been lifted.

00:26:58Guest:And up to that point, you had to have a special license to have more than three musicians on stage.

00:27:03Guest:Even to the point where we first showed up,

00:27:05Guest:They put a musician in a closet.

00:27:07Guest:Or the bass player would have a long chord and sit at the bar.

00:27:09Guest:And that just got lifted in the 80s?

00:27:10Guest:And it just got lifted.

00:27:11Guest:Right as we got there.

00:27:12Guest:Right as we got there in 87.

00:27:12Guest:Suddenly there was all this need for bands.

00:27:14Guest:So we played like five, six nights a week at like any old place.

00:27:17Guest:Suddenly we were in the right place with the right connections going to these bars where the older bands like the Worms and...

00:27:23Guest:was the surreal mccoys would take us under their wing and we would be opening for them and we were so annoying they had to yeah and then we're just always there and our friends from the colleges that we were all attending you know uh brendan got into he got into a program at rutgers and he started going to the new school and bobby got into uh liu let's not talk about bobby going to school that's true that was really more really on a joke he never went but basically all of our friends who we knew would come to these shows on monday where we'd get like a gig you know all the kids from jersey i mean

00:27:52Guest:And the colleges we were going to.

00:27:54Guest:We'd party in New York.

00:27:56Guest:Well, it's all about flyers.

00:27:57Guest:Actually, our first big gigs in New York were at this place called Lismore Lounge.

00:28:01Guest:So the lounge part, the lights were off, so it was just Lismore Lowe.

00:28:05Guest:And the first big gigs we did, we had this guy who was a drug dealer, and we put flyers all over NYU and New School and all around there, offering free nitrous and mushroom tea and joints.

00:28:18Guest:and everyone started showing up at the gigs at the Liz Marlowe, the Halloween gig.

00:28:23Guest:It's amazing if you offer free drugs, people will come.

00:28:26Guest:So all of a sudden, we had packed a couple of those things, and we started getting all the rest of our gigs, but that was our big move.

00:28:34Guest:It was also something we started in New Jersey.

00:28:35Guest:We'd have keg parties, and it got to the point where we had to.

00:28:38Guest:At his house.

00:28:38Guest:Whoever's house.

00:28:39Guest:Whoever's parents weren't home.

00:28:41Guest:Right.

00:28:41Guest:But the thing is, we had to leave New Jersey because the cops could tell when we were warming up, they knew there was underage drinking going on.

00:28:47Guest:There's that sound.

00:28:48Guest:It's time for us to leave town.

00:28:50Guest:By the end of it, it was like two songs in, boom, party busted.

00:28:54Marc:So y'all moved to New York.

00:28:56Guest:Right up to New York.

00:28:57Marc:So it wasn't that big a jump.

00:28:58Marc:You could still go home and eat.

00:28:59Guest:Oh, exactly.

00:28:59Marc:You came home for the weekends with laundry and your parents had money.

00:29:02Guest:Yeah.

00:29:03Guest:Yeah, exactly.

00:29:04Guest:Jump on the dinky, and there you are.

00:29:05Guest:And actually, Bobby lost his dad, and his mom moved to Brooklyn Heights.

00:29:09Guest:So we even had a parent in the city.

00:29:11Guest:Right.

00:29:12Guest:Right at that time, moved to Brooklyn Heights.

00:29:13Guest:Yeah.

00:29:14Marc:And did you guys know, who were some of the other bands that were doing it?

00:29:17Marc:Because I remember this time.

00:29:18Marc:I was in New York.

00:29:19Marc:I guess the first time I went to New York, moved there was 89.

00:29:22Guest:Yeah, okay.

00:29:23Guest:See, now, a guy who graduated in my... These guys graduated in 87.

00:29:27Guest:Right.

00:29:27Guest:I graduated a year before in 86.

00:29:29Guest:Right.

00:29:29Guest:So I would come home on the weekends and play with them and stuff, and when they were ready to move in, we all got a place in Bergen, and I talked to my friend Chris Gross, who graduated with me, but he was in Princeton still.

00:29:41Guest:He took a room above the music shop in Princeton.

00:29:43Guest:Yeah, he was a king of Princeton.

00:29:44Guest:Yeah.

00:29:44Guest:Serenade the girls.

00:29:45Guest:Is he still there?

00:29:46Guest:Well, he wound up coming to the city.

00:29:48Guest:Turning into Chris Barron.

00:29:49Guest:He turned into Chris Barron, and then he met Eric Shankman at the new school, and they became the Spindockers.

00:29:54Guest:I just saw him.

00:29:54Guest:He's the lead singer?

00:29:55Guest:Yeah.

00:29:56Marc:I saw him.

00:29:57Marc:I was walking down the street in New York City.

00:29:59Marc:I mean, this was like six months ago, walking by a place on Houston, a bar.

00:30:03Marc:Yeah.

00:30:04Marc:And I heard a band, and I'm like, that sounds better than a bar band.

00:30:06Guest:Down in Houston, National.

00:30:07Marc:Yeah, and I stuck my head in, and it's him, and I'm like, what the fuck?

00:30:11Guest:Yeah, he's got a little soul band on him.

00:30:13Guest:That's a cool band.

00:30:13Marc:I think he ended up with a chick that used to work at a comedy club.

00:30:16Guest:She's an actress.

00:30:17Guest:She's a Broadway actress.

00:30:19Guest:But there was also Joan Osborne.

00:30:22Guest:Well, Joan Osborne was at those jam sessions the first person I met.

00:30:26Guest:And we tried getting a little sideband going with...

00:30:29Guest:Johnny Allen, who you've never heard of, but he was a real great guitar player.

00:30:33Guest:Oh, just killed it at those clubs.

00:30:34Guest:He was like our idol.

00:30:35Guest:Yeah, and he's the one that took us to the Mondo Connie, where we met Adolph, who really gave us a lot of gigs.

00:30:40Marc:Isn't it weird how many of those guys, like, you know, guys that people come up with, even in what I do in comedy and in music, there are these guys that are great.

00:30:46Guest:Yes.

00:30:47Marc:And then you're just sort of like, what?

00:30:48Guest:And he was a star, too.

00:30:49Guest:He was super charismatic.

00:30:51Guest:Riffed the guitar.

00:30:52Guest:What happened?

00:30:53Guest:Well, you know, a lot of things can happen.

00:30:55Guest:Well, his gig was playing hardcore blues.

00:30:57Guest:Right.

00:30:59Guest:And covers.

00:30:59Guest:Yeah, he never really wrote his own songs.

00:31:01Guest:I think you got to write your own material.

00:31:03Guest:That's a huge part of it.

00:31:04Marc:Right, or have enough of a personality or a new twist on the old shit.

00:31:07Guest:Talking about Adolph, we were playing these blues clubs where that's what you're supposed to do.

00:31:10Guest:Right.

00:31:10Guest:And we'd come in all hippies and rip clothes and play all our own stuff, which is blues-based.

00:31:16Guest:And the mob that owned the place would be like,

00:31:19Guest:what are you doing having these people in there?

00:31:21Guest:And Adolph would stand up for him.

00:31:22Guest:It's like, you know, you're booking a club?

00:31:24Guest:You can book the bands.

00:31:26Guest:Until then, these guys are playing.

00:31:28Guest:But he was, and that wound up paying off.

00:31:30Marc:But you guys pulled from, more from, you guys, and there's like a Van Morrison influence, isn't there?

00:31:34Guest:I think back then we were all, like, especially on Bobby's side, he was very, like, he took a very Grateful Dead model approach to it.

00:31:40Guest:I was very Led Zeppelin.

00:31:41Guest:Yeah?

00:31:41Guest:Yeah.

00:31:42Guest:I was always trying to be Jimi Hendrix.

00:31:43Guest:We liked all kinds of things.

00:31:44Guest:but you but did like that's the thing when six people come into your show it's all in your head anyway so you know i mean at times i felt like charlie parker playing to nobody sure but i mean a grateful dead model means a lot that that is more of a more of a uh what was a word of mouth thing jammy thing and lots of drugs and lots of drugs but also there was there's an agenda to the grateful dead model yeah where we're going to go and score some weed score some weed but also that was going on that was definitely happening people together and

00:32:07Guest:Build a community, yeah.

00:32:09Guest:A community where you can get some acid.

00:32:11Guest:At Nightingale, when we first started, there were like three, four people for our Monday night gig.

00:32:17Guest:Right.

00:32:18Guest:Two of them were looking for acid.

00:32:19Guest:Did they get it?

00:32:20Guest:And then Gina showed up.

00:32:22Guest:Eventually, yes.

00:32:22Guest:But then slowly but surely, we had that thing packed down the street.

00:32:25Guest:It looked like outside Madison Square Garden, the dead plate there.

00:32:29Guest:Right.

00:32:29Guest:line and they were acting that way like can you get in yeah it was all about hanging out i got two for tuesday but that's how you didn't even come in get it going they would hang outside and get done and so it was that kind of model and just like listen from outside and just because they couldn't get inside it was just enjoy being high out at the you know feel the vibe of the

00:32:44Guest:But there was this great group of bands from before us, like The Worms, The Authority, Joey Miserable.

00:32:54Guest:Joey Miserable was with The Worms.

00:32:55Guest:But there's a hardcore scene of these older guys who kind of came like semi-punk land.

00:33:00Guest:Right.

00:33:01Guest:bridge between that right but they used to play just ripping bar rock the place was going off i mean that that we used to like come and just worship that and see that you know you gotta make people have huge horn sections and then the cabaret law went into effect so then they were all like converted into trios and it was

00:33:18Guest:kind of a sad time, and then the cabaret law is lifted, so all the horn section bands are back.

00:33:22Marc:Well, that's an interesting approach, too, because bar rock, it's a very specific thing that you've got to be on top of it, you've got to push it.

00:33:28Guest:And you've got to know covers, but you've also got to slip in your own stuff also without pissing anybody off.

00:33:33Guest:You've got to talk to the people.

00:33:35Guest:You've got to own that place where they remember you, but you're also giving them the generic stuff they want.

00:33:39Guest:Like what?

00:33:40Guest:And you're playing four hours a night.

00:33:42Guest:You're playing all your covers.

00:33:43Guest:Well, see, I was thinking we were the worst at the covers.

00:33:45Guest:Yeah.

00:33:45Guest:gloria we knew two chords yeah so like it was all about the noodling in between yes we became really excellent soloists right our big cover back then was gloria oh yeah version of gloria we did gloria for five hours it seemed like it well listen we had to play you get big and then we get small we had to play nightingale solo we had to play nightingales till 4 a.m.

00:34:04Guest:yeah from starting at 11 so

00:34:06Guest:Yeah.

00:34:07Guest:You had to stretch that shit out.

00:34:08Guest:You did a two-hour version.

00:34:09Guest:Half of it was Gloria.

00:34:10Guest:Half of it was Gloria.

00:34:11Guest:And you did 96 Thiers?

00:34:13Guest:No, the other bands did it.

00:34:14Guest:Oh, they did it.

00:34:15Guest:Like, I learned so many songs like, wait, that's not a Worms tune?

00:34:18Guest:And then finally it was Sly and the Family Stone, like so many.

00:34:21Guest:I mean, we were 18, 19.

00:34:22Guest:I mean.

00:34:23Marc:So when was the big break?

00:34:25Marc:I mean, who was the record guy that came in and said, you guys?

00:34:27Marc:Well, I mean, there were a few... Patrick Clifford.

00:34:28Guest:There were a few breaks, though, because one break was us playing... You know, the Wetlands was just starting out, and they'd scouted us at the Nightingales and said... Well, we'd go to Nightingales.

00:34:37Guest:We were the biggest band, and Mondo Connie.

00:34:39Guest:We were downtown.

00:34:40Guest:We were the band.

00:34:41Guest:The live band scene, and they said, we're making, like, a hippie bar, and you guys are a hippie band.

00:34:45Guest:This is a perfect thing.

00:34:46Guest:The Wetlands, yeah.

00:34:47Guest:Yeah, and it started there.

00:34:49Guest:Suddenly, we're getting seen more on a national level.

00:34:51Guest:And that was a big place, so that...

00:34:52Guest:And it was in Tribeca?

00:34:53Guest:Where was it?

00:34:54Guest:Yeah, Tribeca.

00:34:54Guest:Right by the Holland Tunnel.

00:34:55Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:34:56Guest:I want to say Late and Canal.

00:34:58Guest:Yeah.

00:34:59Guest:Something like that.

00:34:59Guest:Nice, John.

00:35:00Guest:Late.

00:35:01Guest:Yeah.

00:35:01Guest:Busted it.

00:35:02Guest:Nice.

00:35:02Guest:I always said it's like the Haydash bear.

00:35:04Guest:It's the Laydash bear.

00:35:05Marc:Nice.

00:35:05Marc:But there was no stigma to hippiness at that time.

00:35:07Marc:That was cool.

00:35:08Marc:We thought it was cool.

00:35:09Marc:Isn't that weird, though?

00:35:10Marc:Because there was an arc there where if you mentioned hippie on the Lower East Side or anywhere below 14th Street, you're like, fuck you.

00:35:16Guest:It just means you haven't done the drugs.

00:35:18Guest:Because hippie means drugs.

00:35:19Guest:Right.

00:35:19Guest:But the drugs were different.

00:35:20Guest:But to be honest, at the time when we were 19, if anyone said fuck you to us, we were like, fuck you.

00:35:26Guest:And we made a fucking big scene out of it.

00:35:28Guest:The last thing we were worried about was what other people thought.

00:35:31Guest:We had our own thing.

00:35:32Guest:Yeah, like we didn't live by a code of, we're hippies.

00:35:36Marc:It wasn't about the food.

00:35:38Guest:Yeah, we didn't seek to, whatever got us laid and got the drugs.

00:35:42Marc:Dead shows were a lot of fun though.

00:35:43Guest:I went to a couple when I was younger.

00:35:45Marc:Did you have fun?

00:35:46Marc:Yeah.

00:35:46Marc:Did you have any bad trips?

00:35:47Marc:I had one bad trip, but it was a Jerry Garcia concert.

00:35:51Guest:I had a few where I was convinced they were trying to brainwash because everybody was like, isn't this great?

00:35:55Guest:And you couldn't even get to listen to music because they're so busy telling you how great it is.

00:35:58Marc:I always had a problem with people's faces becoming evil.

00:36:01Guest:that was not like it when when you're on mushrooms and everybody looks sort of sweaty and then they'd be like they'd be oh i remember that yeah yeah yeah no it's and i stole my parents car through that to get out to you so much about yourself so kids i got a flat tire and i was rehearsing for the cops to get a tow truck yeah you're rehearsing well yeah like oh right so i have a flat tire yeah right i need a tow truck right yeah and i came up i was like

00:36:24Guest:I got me a big old flat tire over there.

00:36:26Guest:I don't know why I said that.

00:36:27Guest:Random great story.

00:36:28Guest:And he went.

00:36:30Guest:Random great story.

00:36:30Guest:I swear to God he had the head of a B. Random great story about Blue's Traveler speaking of cops.

00:36:35Guest:We.

00:36:36Guest:John had already moved up there.

00:36:38Guest:We were still in high school.

00:36:39Guest:Yeah.

00:36:39Guest:He was in Brooklyn.

00:36:40Guest:Me and Bobby.

00:36:40Guest:He was up in.

00:36:41Guest:At the Y. At the Y. Going to the new school.

00:36:44Guest:we're going up for a gig and at that point we were john popper's blues band we were like in between names we're going up blues literally from high school in a car and we drinking like a case of beer yeah and we crushed it all up and thrown it in the back yeah it was all over the floor of the car so we pull over somewhere up in around jersey city yeah and we're all sitting on the side of the road pissing yeah and the cops pull up behind us yeah

00:37:06Guest:Imagine that.

00:37:08Guest:The 18-year-old, 17 and 18-year-old's car just full of beer, pissing on the side of the road with their dicks in their hands.

00:37:13Guest:The cops look at it and they're like, well, you have a gig?

00:37:15Guest:They're like, yeah.

00:37:18Guest:All right, go ahead.

00:37:19Guest:When you're Bon Jovi, remember us.

00:37:21Guest:And let us drive into town.

00:37:22Guest:Yeah.

00:37:23Guest:Gotta love that.

00:37:24Guest:Those guys are the bomb.

00:37:25Guest:That doesn't happen anymore.

00:37:26Guest:That is a celebration of New Jersey right there.

00:37:28Guest:I mean, it was just horrible.

00:37:29Guest:That will not happen in New Jersey anymore.

00:37:31Guest:I don't know, man.

00:37:31Guest:You look a little like Bon Jovi.

00:37:32Guest:That must have got you by.

00:37:33Guest:Yeah, we need the next Bon Jovi test for remembrance.

00:37:37Guest:All right, get out of here, kids.

00:37:38Guest:Well, he hasn't lived up to that promise because we have remembered them.

00:37:42Guest:Yeah.

00:37:42Guest:I feel like we should send them something.

00:37:43Guest:Yeah, do you got their names?

00:37:44Guest:Those guys, man.

00:37:46Guest:I mean, we were so busted, but we had a gig.

00:37:48Guest:Yeah.

00:37:48Guest:And they were like kids up to their first gig.

00:37:50Guest:That's sweet.

00:37:50Guest:It's great when they let you out.

00:37:51Guest:No cop, whatever.

00:37:52Guest:I mean.

00:37:53Guest:I don't see that happening.

00:37:54Guest:God, I love those guys.

00:37:55Guest:I can't believe we got away with it.

00:37:57Guest:We were blessed in a lot of ways.

00:37:59Guest:Yeah.

00:37:59Guest:Little crap like that.

00:38:00Guest:Yeah.

00:38:01Marc:Okay, so how'd the first record come about?

00:38:03Guest:Well, another break for us was playing at the Barnard campus uptown.

00:38:09Guest:Barnard, yeah.

00:38:09Guest:Where Bill Graham's son saw us and then got in touch with his dad.

00:38:12Guest:Columbia.

00:38:13Guest:We were starting to get sniffed around for management and stuff like that.

00:38:15Guest:Bill Graham's son, who went to Columbia?

00:38:17Guest:David Graham, yeah.

00:38:17Guest:David Graham, and he told his dad, and his dad was like, I'm coming to New York at the end of August.

00:38:21Guest:and record companies people have been sniffing around up to that point yeah new music seminar they've seen us but you know they're always sniffing around but when Bill Graham gets on board all of a sudden it's it got serious and it was right then that the deal with A&M happened because of the new music seminar so Bill Graham came to town and he was our manager he signed on oh he signs you right there

00:38:37Guest:Well, yeah, Bill Graham was our manager, and these record companies had been sniffing around at that point.

00:38:41Guest:But once Bill Graham's your manager, he puts the whole thing together.

00:38:44Guest:So they signed us.

00:38:45Guest:A&M signed us.

00:38:46Marc:You were part of an incredible tradition with Bill Graham.

00:38:49Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:38:50Guest:What was he like?

00:38:51Guest:He's amazing.

00:38:51Guest:He was a real teacher for us.

00:38:53Guest:You tell us the old school way of putting a show on, and some of those are good habits and some aren't.

00:39:00Guest:Yeah, one of his things is there's three things to a show.

00:39:03Guest:Yeah.

00:39:03Guest:The crowd's got to go home happy, the band has to go home happy, and the house has to go home happy.

00:39:08Guest:If any one of those things isn't happening, it's a bad show.

00:39:12Guest:Really?

00:39:13Guest:What were some of the bad habits?

00:39:15Guest:Well, he was great for his tirades.

00:39:18Guest:Yeah.

00:39:19Guest:We got screamed at by Bill Graham.

00:39:21Guest:Really?

00:39:22Guest:I screamed back.

00:39:23Guest:No, it was awesome.

00:39:25Marc:It was the first time you're like, it's happening.

00:39:27Guest:I've heard of this.

00:39:28Guest:I have a Hungarian guy.

00:39:29Guest:It was right after we had a sold out show and we thought we were all... You with your epithets of hate.

00:39:36Guest:Epithets of hate?

00:39:37Guest:It was some internal thing between our road manager, Dave.

00:39:40Guest:What the hell does that mean?

00:39:41Marc:epithets of hate epaulets epaulets yeah thank you epaulets i like it when he says epaulets though that's funny but like who had epaulets on uh they didn't he didn't like our manager at the time our buddy from high school who was giving his son everyone was doing a lot of drugs yeah except bill of course but um yeah so you had a manager from high school and he was our road manager our road manager was our friend from high school i was just a road manager but he wasn't a regular manager at the time well dave was our overall manager really bill was but dave was running it and

00:40:11Guest:Oh, we made Sony.

00:40:12Guest:I mean, that was our fifth horror.

00:40:14Guest:And you've got to remember, Dave was our age, and we were all partying really hard.

00:40:17Guest:We don't have seven hours for the bad decisions we made.

00:40:18Guest:So when some money goes, where did that money go?

00:40:21Guest:Yeah.

00:40:22Guest:No, you're supposed to.

00:40:23Guest:And a little brouhaha swells up, and then Bill comes and goes, either he goes or I go.

00:40:29Guest:And I said, well, what am I supposed to do when your people are saying that I've got to fire these guys?

00:40:34Guest:And then our manager at the time, Dave Boucher, a great guy, threw down his clipboard.

00:40:37Guest:Oh, really?

00:40:37Guest:It was a big, dramatic scene.

00:40:38Marc:It was a big thing, yeah.

00:40:40Marc:When did this go down?

00:40:41Marc:87?

00:40:42Guest:I want to say 90.

00:40:44Guest:How many records in?

00:40:46Guest:No, this is before the first record.

00:40:48Guest:I thought it was the first record.

00:40:49Guest:Right around the first record, yeah.

00:40:51Guest:And I remember sitting, Bill took me in and talked to me and said, come on, tell me the truth.

00:40:55Guest:Dave Persher wants to rule the world, doesn't he?

00:40:58Guest:He said, he wants to rule the world, I want to rule the world.

00:41:00Guest:And Bill said, I don't want to rule the world.

00:41:01Guest:I said, you do rule the world.

00:41:03Guest:And then at that point, he changed his movie last.

00:41:05Guest:This is great stuff.

00:41:06Guest:But the best thing about Bill, career-wise, is then he proceeded to put us on tour, opening up for the Allman Brothers all summer, Carlos Santana, all around the country.

00:41:15Guest:Our first gig was the Housing Now benefit in front of 250,000 people.

00:41:17Guest:That was your first gig?

00:41:18Guest:We were playing a frat.

00:41:19Guest:We were playing for him, yeah.

00:41:20Guest:We were playing like a little frat, and the next day, we're at the Washington Mall with the Capitol behind us.

00:41:25Guest:I look down here.

00:41:26Guest:And the New York homeless walked to D.C.

00:41:28Guest:and started fighting with the D.C.

00:41:29Guest:homeless.

00:41:30Guest:And I looked down and Bill, right before we started, he's wrestling with the homeless in the front row.

00:41:34Guest:Bill Graham wrestling with the homeless.

00:41:36Guest:He was an incredible man.

00:41:37Guest:He's got one leg over here and one arm there trying to get it off.

00:41:40Guest:So that was your first show?

00:41:41Guest:And it was great.

00:41:42Guest:The press conference was great.

00:41:43Guest:They're like, and who's the most traveler?

00:41:44Guest:And they're like, he's like, guys.

00:41:46Guest:it's underground come on yeah it's like the press is like it just made it feel like rules and it's my band I'm jamming on this and who was on the show um oh god Jefferson Jefferson Starship or was it C.B.

00:41:58Guest:Wonder Jefferson Starship no it was Jefferson Airplane Reunited right Mickey Hart was there I know that but what was it like to meet those guys when you oh so I mean how old are you 20 yeah about and I was like hi you know nice to meet you

00:42:14Guest:Did you get to meet Jerry?

00:42:17Guest:That was late.

00:42:18Guest:That was actually when Bill died at his memorial.

00:42:22Guest:We opened up for Jerry before Bill died.

00:42:23Guest:Yeah, we opened for him.

00:42:25Guest:Yeah, at the one in San Francisco.

00:42:27Guest:Warfield.

00:42:28Guest:What was he like?

00:42:29Guest:Oh, cool.

00:42:30Guest:Yeah.

00:42:30Guest:I mean, I didn't know what to say to the guy.

00:42:31Guest:They left me in a tent with him.

00:42:33Guest:I had this telescope on my harmonica belt at the time.

00:42:36Guest:I'm like playing with it.

00:42:38Guest:He's eating a cheeseburger just like...

00:42:39Guest:he just wants to be alone i can tell that i i know i have to say something yeah you know this is my moment to talk with moses here so i say after a long uncomfortable pause i'm a flurry of emotion that's what you said and then another long pause then he goes me too and that was it that was our that was yes the meeting of the mind jerry what about uh greg allman

00:43:05Guest:Oh, we've got a lot of Greg Allman stories.

00:43:08Guest:Bless your bones.

00:43:09Guest:That's about as far.

00:43:10Guest:Yeah, we should probably just leave that there.

00:43:12Guest:He's a sweet man.

00:43:13Guest:Yeah.

00:43:13Guest:He's a wonderful man.

00:43:15Guest:Yes, he is.

00:43:15Guest:Great singer.

00:43:16Guest:Yes.

00:43:16Guest:Yeah, on our second album, he sent him with us on Mountain Cry.

00:43:20Guest:Oh, he's amazing.

00:43:20Guest:He played, what did he play?

00:43:21Guest:Keyboards?

00:43:22Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:43:22Guest:Keyboards and sang on Mountain Cry.

00:43:24Guest:He's got a great voice.

00:43:25Guest:Well, my favorite thing Bill taught us, though, is the two things that you want as a musician is to make a living and express yourself.

00:43:32Guest:Right.

00:43:32Guest:And really, everything still breaks down to that.

00:43:35Guest:Right.

00:43:35Guest:It's a really cool thing.

00:43:36Marc:And so how many records did you have out when he was killed?

00:43:40Guest:It was the second record.

00:43:42Guest:Yeah.

00:43:42Guest:The one that I was on.

00:43:43Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:43:44Guest:I mean, we were devastated.

00:43:45Guest:Because, you know, I mean, we had, to us, it was like our whole world was turned upside down.

00:43:49Guest:Plus, you know, when you're kids, too, it's like a loss.

00:43:50Guest:You're just not used to it.

00:43:51Guest:I mean, we had been blessed up until that point.

00:43:53Guest:And were you friends with his son at that point?

00:43:55Guest:Oh, he's still one of my best friends.

00:43:56Guest:Really?

00:43:56Guest:Yeah, I love him.

00:43:57Guest:He's living in Pennsylvania now.

00:43:59Guest:In Pennsylvania?

00:44:00Guest:Yeah, Buckingham.

00:44:00Guest:why he's really kind of like his mom lived there and then his dad was in the bay area kind of yeah and he was not like his dad around there he's yeah dave's more of a poet yeah yeah that's the thing and you know i know like the the they sold the bill graham presents a long time ago so he must be fine with everything oh yeah no he's totally sad but um he that's the thing is i think bill wanted to make him another business guy right and he was trying

00:44:24Guest:And, you know, that very rarely happens that Alexander has a son who's as vicious as Alexander.

00:44:29Guest:Absolutely, yeah.

00:44:30Guest:I mean, actually, Alexander's father, Philip of Macedon, was... Was... Yeah, going history on you.

00:44:35Guest:Yeah, well, he didn't turn out as... It's just very rarely in history do you have one tough-ass leader who gets another tough-ass leader because...

00:44:43Marc:Yeah, because he's got trust fund.

00:44:45Marc:Alexander had a trust fund.

00:44:46Guest:And there's a charisma vacuum that happens where it's kind of hard to overshadow.

00:44:50Guest:He was such an enigmatic figure.

00:44:53Marc:It's very hard to live after your father no matter what.

00:44:55Marc:I mean, the best you can do is be big in a different way.

00:44:58Marc:Yeah, exactly.

00:44:59Marc:And you've got to be you.

00:45:02Marc:Unfortunately, that is the struggle.

00:45:05Marc:It's not how to be as good as your dad.

00:45:06Marc:It's like, how do I get out from under this shadow?

00:45:11Guest:And that is a real challenge.

00:45:12Guest:And, you know, I think Dave's done okay.

00:45:14Guest:Yeah, great.

00:45:14Guest:I mean, you know, as a parent, that's the thing.

00:45:17Marc:How many you got?

00:45:18Guest:I got two, but your kid's not going to be you.

00:45:21Guest:No.

00:45:21Guest:So whatever he's got that's going on, you got to back that up.

00:45:25Guest:Yes.

00:45:26Guest:But make sure he understands.

00:45:28Guest:Do it.

00:45:29Guest:Yeah.

00:45:30Guest:Don't, you know.

00:45:30Marc:How old are they?

00:45:31Marc:How old are they?

00:45:32Guest:14 and 8.

00:45:33Marc:Oh, so you got a teenager who's giving you a run for your money?

00:45:37Guest:No, he's actually pretty cool.

00:45:38Guest:He's a great kid.

00:45:39Guest:He just beat me twice today in Magic.

00:45:42Guest:I don't even know what that is.

00:45:43Guest:It's some weird fantasy thing.

00:45:45Guest:Kid's headed for trouble, I'm telling you.

00:45:47Guest:Nerd alert.

00:45:48Guest:It's going to come hard and fast.

00:45:49Guest:It's a strategy game.

00:45:50Guest:We've got a strategic con.

00:45:52Guest:We're going to suck it.

00:45:53Guest:I feel like he's going to be doing ice when he's 17 or something crazy.

00:45:57Guest:Oh, come on.

00:45:57Guest:No, Aidenator.

00:45:59Guest:That's his nickname.

00:46:00Guest:Aidenator.

00:46:01Guest:Aidenator?

00:46:02Guest:Come on.

00:46:03Guest:He does great.

00:46:03Marc:So, okay, so Bill Graham gets in that horrible accident, and you guys went to the funeral?

00:46:09Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:46:09Marc:That must have been insane.

00:46:10Guest:Actually, did we go to the actual funeral?

00:46:12Guest:No, we went to the big- Memorial service.

00:46:14Guest:Memorial.

00:46:14Guest:Memorial at the Golden Gate Park.

00:46:16Guest:The Golden Gate Park, which was- And that's where I got to trade licks with Carlos Santana.

00:46:18Guest:Yeah.

00:46:18Guest:Which is-

00:46:19Guest:Well, that was the last time we saw... Small little highlights of my life.

00:46:21Guest:That was the last time we saw him alive was at that show, the One Love Fest, I think.

00:46:26Guest:Oh, you're right, John.

00:46:26Guest:You're right.

00:46:26Guest:And that was the day Miles Davis died.

00:46:29Guest:And we sit in with Santana, and it was the most amazing experience.

00:46:32Guest:And then a month later, we're playing Bill's Memorial, and I signed with the dad there.

00:46:35Guest:On the same stage.

00:46:36Guest:On the same stage.

00:46:37Guest:It was really surreal.

00:46:38Marc:So Santana is a Bay Area guy, so you got to play with Santana.

00:46:40Guest:Yeah, he's awesome.

00:46:42Marc:That to us felt like our graduation.

00:46:44Marc:You love Santana.

00:46:45Guest:Oh, absolutely.

00:46:46Guest:Yeah.

00:46:46Guest:Yeah, I inducted him into the Hall of Fame.

00:46:49Guest:Let's talk about how we would get high and listen to Santana solos.

00:46:54Marc:But did you trade looks with him on harmonica?

00:46:57Guest:Oh, yeah, and chanted with him on the guitar, and then we would pass it back, and then basically it was just all of us trying to gang up on Santana.

00:47:02Guest:Trying to play with Santana as much as possible.

00:47:04Guest:It's very hard to know who handily swatted us.

00:47:07Guest:It was kind of a rush, so he borrowed a guitar, and he borrowed some crappy amp, and he gets up on stage, and it's the first note, and it sounds just like Santana.

00:47:17Guest:How is that possible?

00:47:18Guest:There's nothing to do with anything.

00:47:20Guest:I'm like, how does he do that?

00:47:21Guest:How does he do that?

00:47:22Marc:Because usually he's like an Ibanez Mesa boogie guy, right?

00:47:25Guest:Whatever.

00:47:25Guest:And it just was like, first note, it was Santana.

00:47:28Marc:And it went on for like 30 seconds, right?

00:47:29Marc:The first note.

00:47:30Guest:We had those overtones.

00:47:31Guest:Yeah.

00:47:31Guest:Yep.

00:47:32Guest:It was amazing.

00:47:32Guest:On like some borrowed stuff.

00:47:33Guest:It's like, ah, you know.

00:47:35Guest:So we're all thinking about it.

00:47:36Guest:We're like, you got to approach this carefully.

00:47:37Guest:Don't just give them all your game.

00:47:39Guest:Build, build.

00:47:40Guest:Okay, now give them a little more.

00:47:41Guest:Okay, now give it to them.

00:47:42Guest:Hold back.

00:47:42Guest:Don't give it up.

00:47:43Ah!

00:47:43Guest:So you think that way when it comes to songs?

00:47:46Guest:When you're dealing with a good player, you should.

00:47:47Guest:Oh, really?

00:47:48Guest:Don't blow your wad.

00:47:49Guest:That's the kind of stuff we learned early in those blues bars.

00:47:51Guest:Yeah?

00:47:51Guest:That's why it's a graduation.

00:47:52Guest:You could come out with a full flurry.

00:47:54Guest:Don't give it all away first.

00:47:55Guest:Don't give it all away.

00:47:56Guest:When you're playing with somebody else.

00:47:57Guest:If you blow your wad, then where do you have to go?

00:47:59Guest:Right.

00:48:00Guest:Don't give it away early, kid.

00:48:01Guest:Don't give it away early, kid.

00:48:03Guest:That's what he's remembering.

00:48:04Guest:Oh, what was his name?

00:48:05Guest:Wild Bill Durkin.

00:48:06Guest:Wild Bill Durkin kept saying, don't give it away early, son.

00:48:08Guest:Because I would just come in and be like...

00:48:10Guest:That was also while Bill's way of saying, I don't know how to answer that.

00:48:14Guest:It was a little of both.

00:48:15Guest:When they all go, don't go too fast, son.

00:48:16Guest:It's them going, Jesus, what am I supposed to say to that?

00:48:19Guest:Yeah.

00:48:20Guest:So what, you used to come out and just blast it all out?

00:48:22Guest:Oh, Chan was nuclear fire.

00:48:23Guest:Yeah.

00:48:24Guest:I mean, listen, I was in a band where I was the only chordal instrument.

00:48:29Guest:I mean, John was more of a lead instrument.

00:48:30Guest:Maybe he could do some stuff comping.

00:48:32Guest:Not really, yeah.

00:48:33Guest:And, you know, it's just my style of music.

00:48:34Guest:Right.

00:48:35Guest:Now I have keyboards back and it's nice because I can play a little bit.

00:48:38Marc:Yeah, it always amazes me that when you have like, when you're only one guitar, I mean, you got to hold a lot.

00:48:43Guest:You got to carry a lot of water.

00:48:44Guest:And it's like, go to the lead, the bottom drops out.

00:48:47Guest:You feel that.

00:48:48Guest:That's kind of how I learned.

00:48:49Guest:So there's a lot of syncopation to our band and he had to provide most of it.

00:48:51Guest:Right, so when the bottom drops out, the drummer's got to fill and the bass has got to fill, right?

00:48:55Guest:When the chords finish, then you've got to come right in the lead.

00:48:58Marc:That's like dropping off a cliff at first, I would imagine.

00:49:01Guest:So just go for gangbusters.

00:49:03Guest:And the way Bobby played bass, there wasn't a lot of syncopation.

00:49:06Guest:Bobby was more of a throbbing kind of a bass player, so he was really doing most of the syncopation.

00:49:10Guest:What happened with him?

00:49:10Guest:He died in 99.

00:49:13Guest:I think it was drugs.

00:49:15Guest:Yeah.

00:49:15Guest:I mean, I don't want to get too into it because we talked about it before and his mom got kind of upset about it.

00:49:21Guest:But you guys were all living in different places at that time?

00:49:23Guest:Yeah, he moved to New Orleans.

00:49:24Marc:But you were still a band?

00:49:25Guest:No, we took a break and we were getting ready to actually go down to New Orleans and work on another record.

00:49:29Guest:Yeah, I just finished a solo record.

00:49:31Guest:I took some time off to do that.

00:49:33Guest:And it was 10 days before it came out.

00:49:35Guest:That's when he died.

00:49:36Guest:So now, you guys lived it.

00:49:39Marc:You were already a band almost 10 years at that point, right?

00:49:43Marc:12 years.

00:49:44Guest:That's why it was exactly half the time of our 25 years was with Bobby and the band, and the other half was with the new band.

00:49:51Guest:But did you see it coming?

00:49:52Guest:You know, what's weird is looking back, you'd think you would, but I mean, we were all- I didn't see that coming.

00:49:56Guest:We didn't know- I was 400 pounds, and I really feel like- Yeah, we were more worried about John.

00:50:03Guest:That was the thing.

00:50:04Guest:It was sort of like we were codependent-ing, where I go, at least I'm not as bad as him, and he could go, at least I'm not as bad as you, and that sort of made it okay.

00:50:11Guest:When you have two people that are fucked up- Right.

00:50:14Guest:It's somehow, it seems normal.

00:50:17Marc:But I have to assume that after you opened for the Allman Brothers and you guys opened for the Stones too, that you had some sense, and also being that you were so young and you were with Bill Graham that you knew that the life was hard and that it might take its toll on somebody.

00:50:31Guest:Best joke.

00:50:32Guest:on Leno.

00:50:33Guest:Bobby got busted.

00:50:34Guest:He was smuggling.

00:50:34Guest:It was the first time that we were opening up for the Stones.

00:50:37Guest:It was the first time that they had gone back to Canada since Keith got busted.

00:50:39Guest:Right.

00:50:40Guest:And Bobby got busted.

00:50:41Guest:Bobby got busted going across the border.

00:50:42Guest:And Leno's like, did you hear that Keith Richards got busted going back to Canada for the first time?

00:50:47Guest:No, he got it wrong.

00:50:48Guest:He was carrying Bobby Cheehan over his shoulder.

00:50:50Guest:No, he did wrong.

00:50:50Guest:So the bass player from Blues Driver got busted.

00:50:52Guest:Apparently he had Keith Richards under his arm.

00:50:54Guest:Oh, right.

00:50:55Guest:Now, what was that like opening for the Stones?

00:50:57Marc:Amazing.

00:50:58Marc:How many gigs did you do?

00:50:59Marc:You did 10, I think.

00:51:01Marc:And were you able to hang out at all?

00:51:03Marc:A little bit at the beginning.

00:51:04Guest:They came and made their cursory, but they were nice enough to come right out and make their cursory.

00:51:08Guest:They bought us a case of champagne.

00:51:10Guest:They were very nice and cordial.

00:51:11Guest:They had a lot going on.

00:51:12Guest:I told Mick, if you want a harp player for Miss You, I'll play.

00:51:17Guest:And he's like, great, thanks.

00:51:18Guest:I didn't realize that he was doing that instead of Sugar Blue.

00:51:20Guest:I have a great story, though.

00:51:22Guest:when mick came to meet us he had been calling my house for the last uh my apartment in new york for the last like three months because he had met my wife in bali so i had messages from mick jagger it's like hello serena this is mick it's um what she did like he's trying to my wife so i meet mick jagger and i'm like i'm trying to like just small talk i'm like bond like i've got you know when you call i've got messages from you from the phone he's like

00:51:50Guest:And he left shortly thereafter.

00:51:52Guest:Really?

00:51:53Guest:I was trying to... I wasn't trying to bust his balls.

00:51:56Guest:I was just trying to make conversation.

00:51:58Guest:Make conversation about you trying to... I used it to bust his balls, though.

00:52:04Guest:I've used it to bust his balls when I saw him in a sushi restaurant, and I'm like, hi, I'm John from Blues Travel.

00:52:09Guest:You might remember my guitar player's wife, Serena?

00:52:11Guest:Did you do that?

00:52:12Guest:And then he started like, oh, yeah, hi.

00:52:14Guest:He just knows to feel a little guilty.

00:52:16Guest:I just remember the messages.

00:52:17Guest:I was like, that's so cool.

00:52:18Guest:You never once said, did you fuck him in Bali?

00:52:23Guest:At the time, we were in our love bubble.

00:52:25Guest:Okay, no way.

00:52:25Guest:It was all good.

00:52:26Guest:All right, buddy.

00:52:27Guest:All right.

00:52:28Guest:I've got other stories, but I would share them here.

00:52:31Guest:Man, that question's just hanging in the air.

00:52:33Guest:I know, isn't it?

00:52:34Guest:Just sitting there.

00:52:36Marc:But even if she did, it's like Mick Jagger, right?

00:52:38Marc:You give her a pass?

00:52:40Guest:Oh, no.

00:52:40Guest:I mean, you know, at the time, at the time, we were on the bubble.

00:52:44Guest:But later on, she fooled around a little bit.

00:52:46Guest:Those stories, I shan't share.

00:52:47Guest:But you're okay now.

00:52:48Guest:My wife and I are separated.

00:52:51Guest:Okay.

00:52:51Guest:But we're best friends.

00:52:52Guest:Cool.

00:52:52Guest:So I've heard all the naughty stories.

00:52:54Guest:Oh, really?

00:52:54Guest:I know.

00:52:55Guest:Oh, God.

00:52:56Marc:I guess that's the benefit of having kids is you got to keep seeing them.

00:53:00Guest:I won't tell people these stories because it'll ruin the Rolling Stones for everyone.

00:53:03Guest:Yeah.

00:53:04Guest:Right, that's what it'll ruin.

00:53:05Marc:Oh, really?

00:53:06Marc:Yeah, they can't take a hit, those guys.

00:53:07Guest:Rolling Stones will be devastated by what Chan says.

00:53:09Guest:That's why he's not talking.

00:53:10Guest:Just for everyone that might hear this story.

00:53:12Guest:Right.

00:53:13Guest:Oh, really?

00:53:14Guest:They might hear this story.

00:53:15Guest:Which stone will it ruin, Mick?

00:53:17Guest:It'll ruin Chan's stone when his wife kicks him really hard in them.

00:53:21Guest:Yeah.

00:53:22Yeah.

00:53:22Guest:His stones will be rolling.

00:53:25Guest:I'll leave it at that.

00:53:26Guest:All right, buddy.

00:53:27Guest:But you know, I had the best compliment, though.

00:53:28Guest:I was reading Rolling Stone interview, and apparently, ever since I said that to Mick, like, you need help sitting in harmonica on Miss You, they were teasing him about it.

00:53:38Guest:Because Keith goes, hey, maybe we'll get the blues traveler guy to help you play.

00:53:41Guest:And he's like, fuck off.

00:53:43Guest:And the interviewer goes, he's good.

00:53:45Guest:And Mick goes, yeah, too good.

00:53:47Marc:Really?

00:53:47Guest:I've got that in my house somewhere.

00:53:49Marc:They say that about a lot of people, I think.

00:53:51Marc:Yeah.

00:53:52Marc:Did you read that book?

00:53:53Marc:Which one?

00:53:54Marc:The autobiography of Keith Richards.

00:53:55Guest:Oh, I'm saving that.

00:53:56Marc:It's fucking great.

00:53:58Guest:What a storyteller, too.

00:54:00Marc:Yeah.

00:54:01Guest:And it's like, believe it or not,

00:54:03Guest:I remember it all.

00:54:04Marc:Yeah.

00:54:04Marc:Awesome.

00:54:05Marc:Every bit of it.

00:54:06Marc:Clearly, he spoke it to somebody, and they transcribed it.

00:54:09Guest:Well, he wrote it all in notebooks.

00:54:11Guest:He just scrawled out tons of stuff in notebooks, and he gives it to the writer his notebooks.

00:54:14Marc:It's a little large, and it's a little about Keith, but it's his fucking book.

00:54:18Guest:Well, it's his book.

00:54:18Guest:Yeah, but some of it was great.

00:54:20Guest:When I first met him, I pulled a knife on him because I hear he likes knives.

00:54:22Guest:I was like, look at my new knife.

00:54:24Guest:Yeah, and what did he do?

00:54:25Guest:He's like, hey, that's cool.

00:54:26Guest:And I also brought him some moss from my yard.

00:54:28Guest:I put it in a little Tiffany box.

00:54:30Guest:Moss?

00:54:30Guest:Why?

00:54:30Guest:Because I hear they don't gather any.

00:54:32Guest:Very clever.

00:54:34Guest:Did he get that?

00:54:35Guest:Yes, he did.

00:54:35Guest:Come on.

00:54:36Guest:He patted me on the head.

00:54:37Guest:And you're a gun guy, right?

00:54:38Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:54:39Guest:No, I didn't pull a gun on Keith Richards.

00:54:41Guest:But you got some guns.

00:54:43Marc:Not on me, no.

00:54:44Marc:What do you need?

00:54:44Marc:Well, no, I think my girlfriend was poking around, and she said, oh, he's got guns.

00:54:49Marc:Yeah, I have a few.

00:54:51Marc:They're fun to fire.

00:54:52Guest:I've enjoyed firing John's arsenal.

00:54:55Guest:Yes, and Knockwood, I haven't shot anyone.

00:54:58Guest:But what, you collect them or you just... I'll pretty much collect them at this point.

00:55:01Guest:Your bunker mentality?

00:55:03Guest:I like to think of it as a playful... Something my friends pointed out is they're not worried about me because I don't have a million rounds of ammunition.

00:55:09Guest:I got enough for each gun, but not like bunker style.

00:55:12Guest:Yeah, he's not... He doesn't have a special place for it.

00:55:15Guest:They're not organized in any fashion where I could... It's up in the attic.

00:55:18Guest:It's not like I could really... You're not waiting for this shit to go down.

00:55:21Guest:You're not waiting for your calling.

00:55:22Guest:I'm waiting as much as the next guy is.

00:55:24Guest:However, if shit does hit the bend, we're getting a tour bus to drive to John's house.

00:55:30Guest:I'll dig a trench, I guess.

00:55:31Guest:I'll try, but how far am I going to get?

00:55:34Guest:Where do you live?

00:55:34Guest:I'd say I got about two weeks when the big shit goes down.

00:55:37Guest:Yeah, you got about two weeks to make your stand and then you're done?

00:55:40Guest:Yeah, go try and take over a convenience store.

00:55:43Marc:Just be like your harmonica vest and some bullet belt.

00:55:45Guest:I think the best bet is to load up your car, drive to a convenience store, take that over,

00:55:50Guest:and just map out where the next convenience store and convenience store your way to the wilderness you got a plan that's something and anyone who wants to come with me you're more than happy in an armor-plated tour bus and we're gonna get on top so if you know yeah so if you want to chop wood or you know you're really a sexy woman come with me let's procreate does it sound like we've talked about this late night on the tour bus yeah we've had we've made up you got a plan where do you live though i live outside of a seattle place called snohomish

00:56:16Guest:Oh, it's pretty up there, man.

00:56:17Marc:Oh, it's gorgeous.

00:56:18Marc:You got like a big chunk of property and shit?

00:56:20Guest:About six acres now.

00:56:21Marc:That's a lot.

00:56:21Guest:Yeah.

00:56:22Guest:That's good.

00:56:22Guest:Had 32 acres in Pennsylvania, but it's kind of weird paying for the property tax on stuff you don't actually walk on and you just see it.

00:56:30Marc:Yeah, but is it worth- It felt like a country jam.

00:56:32Guest:You unloaded it?

00:56:33Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:56:34Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:56:35Marc:So why Pennsylvania?

00:56:36Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:56:36Guest:I was the last guy to move away from home.

00:56:39Guest:It was like New Jersey, but better gun laws.

00:56:42Guest:I could build a range in the backyard.

00:56:44Guest:New Jersey, you're allowed to have guns if you bury them and never think of them.

00:56:47Guest:Right.

00:56:47Guest:Did you get busted, though?

00:56:49Guest:In Washington, yeah.

00:56:50Guest:For guns?

00:56:51Guest:Actually, no, for weed.

00:56:53Guest:No, and this is the best thing.

00:56:54Guest:The pictures were all of this.

00:56:57Guest:He was coming back.

00:56:58Guest:They were all legal.

00:56:58Guest:We had been down doing an album down in Texas, and he was on his ride home, and he had them all locked securely, licensed for all of them.

00:57:07Guest:Unloaded.

00:57:08Guest:And he was driving, but then the cops are pulling them open.

00:57:11Guest:They're like, oh, my God.

00:57:11Guest:We were doing 111 miles an hour.

00:57:14Guest:Okay.

00:57:14Guest:And that and the pot.

00:57:15Guest:You forego some rights.

00:57:16Guest:The thing is, I got busted for misdemeanor pot possession, and that's the part nobody cares about.

00:57:23Guest:They're like, oh, so what?

00:57:24Guest:The guns were all legal.

00:57:25Guest:He wasn't even driving 111.

00:57:27Guest:Yeah, I was smoking weed next to my friend who was driving my car 111 miles an hour.

00:57:31Guest:And the thing is, we were doing a buck 58 in Montana.

00:57:32Guest:Which isn't a good plan, by the way, kids.

00:57:34Guest:The moral of the story is, Spokane is population.

00:57:37Guest:You got to slow down there and go to the speed limit again.

00:57:39Guest:Especially if you're smoking weed.

00:57:41Guest:Yeah.

00:57:41Guest:Yeah, I would recommend that.

00:57:43Guest:So, okay.

00:57:43Guest:The next day was funny when I got to go to the airport.

00:57:46Guest:Yeah.

00:57:46Guest:There's a 44 Magnum in the back seat of the limo.

00:57:48Guest:Yeah.

00:57:49Guest:And the limo driver guy, he's trying to sell me a gun.

00:57:52Guest:He heard I like guns.

00:57:52Guest:Apparently, I'm all over the radio.

00:57:54Guest:Right.

00:57:54Guest:And my comments were, I don't want to get left behind if there's a national disaster.

00:57:58Guest:Right.

00:57:58Guest:And really the reason I have a siren in my car is that if there's an earthquake, people are getting the fuck out of my way.

00:58:03Guest:Right.

00:58:04Guest:But you don't say that to a cop.

00:58:05Guest:No, that's not a good idea.

00:58:06Guest:I'm in the airport and everyone's looking at me like they caught me masturbating.

00:58:09Guest:Yeah.

00:58:09Guest:Hi, John.

00:58:10Guest:Yeah.

00:58:11Guest:And the kicker is there was a big tin container of ganja in my jacket.

00:58:17Guest:Yeah.

00:58:18Guest:As I go through security, it went through.

00:58:21Guest:They don't look for that now.

00:58:22Guest:Apparently, I defeated the metal detectors.

00:58:23Guest:That's what I always tell people.

00:58:24Guest:It's like they're not looking for a little bit of power.

00:58:26Guest:That's the moments I believe in God, because it was like you said, you've had enough, son.

00:58:29Guest:That's the only moments you believe in God?

00:58:31Guest:Well, it's one of them.

00:58:32Guest:Yeah.

00:58:33Guest:Not a big God guy.

00:58:34Guest:Well, I mean, I believe in God, but you definitely aware when you're about to crash your motorcycle or when you're going to a metal detector So how does it feel now?

00:58:42Marc:Like I mean you guys had a pretty big but at your at the peak of the blues traveler experience What was what were the rooms you were playing?

00:58:50Marc:Stadiums.

00:58:51Guest:Yeah, we did a lot of these days would be like sort of a square garden We have like Saturday Night Live.

00:58:56Guest:We have all kinds of fun.

00:58:57Guest:What's the biggest room we did?

00:58:59Guest:Probably just Red Rock.

00:59:00Guest:Well, Madison Square Garden.

00:59:02Guest:Yeah, I'd say Madison Square Garden.

00:59:03Guest:Is that pretty exciting?

00:59:04Guest:Selling on MSG?

00:59:04Guest:That was fun.

00:59:05Guest:That was a highlight.

00:59:06Guest:And the whole time we thought we hadn't sold it out, and then we found out, oh, yeah, there's 6,000 more tickets we forgot about.

00:59:11Guest:Oh, really?

00:59:11Guest:Yeah, that's fun.

00:59:13Guest:And did you move them?

00:59:14Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:59:14Guest:It turns out we'd sold them and didn't know we had.

00:59:16Guest:So what year was that?

00:59:18Marc:96.

00:59:19Marc:Now, what have you guys been doing since?

00:59:23Marc:Still playing.

00:59:24Guest:Playing?

00:59:24Marc:Making records?

00:59:25Marc:Because you took a while off, you said.

00:59:27Guest:You took a time and you did some solo stuff.

00:59:29Guest:In 99, I took six months off and did a solo record.

00:59:33Guest:And then...

00:59:34Guest:Once Bobby died, we were really keen to keep the band going, and that meant getting a new bass player, and Chan's little brother, Tad, we'd known him forever, and he's a very different kind of bass player, and that's what we were interested in.

00:59:46Guest:We didn't want to turn Bobby into a ghost and have someone play like him.

00:59:49Guest:Try to recreate that thing.

00:59:50Guest:That must be hard.

00:59:51Marc:You were very conscious of that.

00:59:53Marc:Yeah.

00:59:54Guest:That's just gross.

00:59:54Guest:And Bobby always wanted to have keyboards.

00:59:56Guest:I mean, honestly, for the next three, four years, for five years, was trying to recapitulate what we were as a band with these new guys, which was an interesting and cool creative endeavor.

01:00:10Guest:And we slowly started to get it.

01:00:12Guest:And now it's got a great pocket.

01:00:14Marc:Well that like I listen to some of this record that Susie craps that cracks a whip right Susie craps the whips a whip that's a stringy meal she yes I'll say so So but that's the latest record yeah, and it sounds tight sounds hooky it sounds good We really had an epiphany with getting outside people to help us write songs like the co-writing thing I think we became a little to assembly line uh-huh We want you always want to do it all in-house where some pressure to repeat the sound though.

01:00:40Oh

01:00:40Guest:No, I think it was more of a rut.

01:00:42Guest:We were experimenting all the time.

01:00:45Guest:But it was cool because we'd write our songs and the stuff that worked clicked right away.

01:00:51Guest:That'd be like four or five songs was just Blues Traveler.

01:00:53Guest:Then we'd have some other music or John would have some other song ideas or we'd bring other songs in from other people.

01:01:00Guest:And that really fleshed out the album.

01:01:01Guest:So it wasn't just like five good songs and then...

01:01:03Guest:Yeah, so you find yourself writing the same song.

01:01:06Guest:You get like some good ideas, and then you have to make more.

01:01:08Guest:And so you're starting to write the same song over and over again.

01:01:11Guest:And our process was getting a little too rigid.

01:01:15Guest:It was, you know, somebody bring an idea that we'd get out of a band song idea, and then I'd go and sit in my car and write words to it.

01:01:22Guest:And then while I was doing that, they're working on the next song.

01:01:24Guest:And it was just too much of an assembly line thing.

01:01:27Guest:2009 and 10 I went and worked on another solo thing with a Jono Manson who was in one of those bands the worms yeah in the early days and I just put my own money in and it was really just fun to learn to co-write and I had a ball sometimes not writing anything and just being the vocalist yeah and then writing part of the music or part of the words and

01:01:49Guest:And that really got me excited.

01:01:52Guest:And I knew that these guys would love that process.

01:01:54Guest:And instead of going to my friends, we went to professional songwriters like Ron Sexsmith and Alejandro Escobedo and Cary Rodriguez.

01:02:02Marc:I love Alejandro Escobedo.

01:02:03Guest:Yeah.

01:02:03Guest:No, we wrote a really cool blues tune with him.

01:02:05Guest:And that...

01:02:07Guest:It was just so fun to watch them.

01:02:08Guest:I knew they would take to it like ducks in water, and I knew I wouldn't know where it was going to go.

01:02:12Guest:And that's the thing.

01:02:13Guest:It multiplied that effect of, wow, new ideas.

01:02:17Guest:Because I think what helps is having somebody go, you know what's cool about you guys?

01:02:21Guest:Yeah.

01:02:21Guest:Because when you're us, you don't know what's cool about you.

01:02:24Guest:You never know what's good about you.

01:02:26Guest:Probably becomes the opposite.

01:02:27Guest:Yeah.

01:02:27Guest:You fixate on the shit that nobody cares about.

01:02:30Guest:And so having somebody appreciate, that's the great thing about being an older band, is that people know you.

01:02:35Marc:Yeah.

01:02:36Guest:When you're young band, you're always trying to show what you can do and when you're old you get to sort of revel in what you are Right, and I think that's the advantage of a co-writing because then you get to go wow This is something I didn't know I could do yeah Yeah, yeah, and I think that's evident in Susie cracks whip and also Sam Hollander the producer

01:02:52Guest:Really, he knew how to get the vibe.

01:02:55Guest:I always liken it to a Quentin Tarantino movie where he doesn't really care as much about the continuity as much as he cares about the vibe and the feel of the song.

01:03:05Guest:And that's really what we need.

01:03:06Guest:I think we get hung up on the continuity too much.

01:03:08Guest:Like, no, this beat, it's sped up slightly.

01:03:10Guest:We have to keep it a rigid beat and we get too much like a metronome.

01:03:13Guest:Right.

01:03:14Guest:Instead of the fact that it's a fun feeling song.

01:03:16Marc:Right.

01:03:16Guest:Oh, that's good.

01:03:17Guest:He had a really great sense of that.

01:03:18Marc:Producers make a big difference like that.

01:03:19Guest:Oh, hell yeah.

01:03:20Marc:Can you want to do a song?

01:03:21Marc:Can you do a song?

01:03:22Guest:Of course.

01:03:23Guest:Hey.

01:03:25Guest:It's working for me.

01:03:29Guest:So we should just start that?

01:03:31Guest:All right.

01:03:31Guest:This is called You Don't Have to Love Me.

01:03:36Guest:The world is coming too and then it's gonna crumble in the sea The ice caps are all melting but you're still mad at me And all your reservations will be washed upon the sand

01:04:04Guest:And you don't have to love me But tonight I'll be your man Yeah, you don't have to love me Tonight I'll be your man

01:04:26Guest:Life in the Big Easy will probably never be that way.

01:04:33Guest:Sweet Lucinda Williams takes the glory over the fame.

01:04:39Guest:You and I are dreamers, they're gonna catch us in the end.

01:04:44Guest:And you don't have to love me But tonight I'll be your man Yeah, you don't have to love me Tonight I'll be your man If you don't love me You don't have to explain If you don't want me

01:05:05Guest:We'll just play this little game With everything that's going wrong Each day could be your last You don't have to love me You don't have to love me But tonight I'll be your man Oh yeah

01:06:02Guest:have to love me but tonight i'll be your man yeah you don't have to love me but tonight i'll be your man oh you don't have to love me tonight i'll be your man oh you don't have to love me

01:06:25Guest:But tonight'll be your man.

01:06:31Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:07:31Marc:Awesome.

01:07:31Marc:Thank you.

01:07:32Marc:That was great.

01:07:33Marc:Thanks, brother.

01:07:33Marc:Thanks, man.

01:07:34Marc:Thanks, John Chandler.

01:07:36Marc:Appreciate you coming.

01:07:36Guest:Thanks for having us.

01:07:38Guest:This was a great interview, man.

01:07:39Guest:You know what you're doing.

01:07:40Guest:Oh, that's very sweet of you.

01:07:41Guest:Really good interview.

01:07:42Marc:That was cool.

01:07:42Marc:It was fun.

01:07:43Marc:A lot of fun, man.

01:07:43Marc:Well, good luck with everything.

01:07:49Marc:That's it, my friends.

01:07:51Marc:Do you know what I know?

01:07:56Marc:That's it.

01:07:57Marc:That's the show.

01:07:59Marc:I love you.

01:07:59Marc:I love you all.

01:08:00Marc:I do.

01:08:01Marc:Even you people who are annoyed by me.

01:08:03Marc:I love you.

01:08:04Marc:I'm full of the unconditional love today.

01:08:06Marc:Now, if I could just give it to myself.

01:08:09Marc:I'm glad you guys like Dave's Old Porn, too.

01:08:11Marc:Wasn't that a great talk with John and Chan?

01:08:15Marc:Blue's Traveler.

01:08:18Marc:I'm glad you guys who watched it liked the Dave's old porn episode.

01:08:22Marc:That was fun.

01:08:23Marc:Hope you got some nice presents.

01:08:25Marc:I'll be in the Improv in Fort Lauderdale at the Hard Rock January 4th through 6th.

01:08:30Marc:And from what I understand, Jerry Seinfeld will also be literally 100 feet away from me.

01:08:36Marc:I'm going to try.

01:08:38Marc:I'll be at Good Nights in Raleigh, January 10th through 12th.

01:08:40Marc:I'll be at the Ice House in Pasadena, January 13th.

01:08:42Marc:I'll be at the Wilbur Theater in Boston, February 8th.

01:08:46Marc:And I'll be announcing many more dates very soon.

01:08:49Marc:Next week, probably.

01:08:51Marc:Go to WTFPod.com for all your WTFPod needs.

01:08:54Marc:Get on the mailing list.

01:08:56Marc:Get the app.

01:08:57Marc:Upgrade to the premium app.

01:09:00Marc:Leave some comments.

01:09:00Marc:Do whatever you got to do over there.

01:09:02Marc:You know, do the Libsyn thing.

01:09:04Marc:Get your JustCoffee.co up there.

01:09:06Marc:I just got some Boomer Libs buttons.

01:09:11Marc:It was a really sad thing.

01:09:12Marc:Because right when Boomy disappeared, just before I'd ordered a bunch of Boomer buttons because he was becoming a star, maybe that's what he did.

01:09:20Marc:He just couldn't handle the success.

01:09:26Marc:Happy holidays.