Episode 340 - Jay Mohr
Guest:Lock the gates!
Guest:All right, let's do this.
Guest:How are you, what the fuckers?
Guest:What the fuck, buddies?
Guest:What the fuck in ears?
Guest:What the fuck, Knicks?
Guest:What the fuck, Aristas?
Guest:What the fuckstables?
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Man, I just, I'm Mark Maron, and I am, I just finished a Honeycrisp apple that was the size of a baby's head.
Marc:I know they're mutated apples.
Marc:I know they are invented.
Marc:They genetically were created.
Marc:But they are a masterpiece.
Marc:I know they come out of Minnesota.
Marc:I'm not sure where.
Marc:I could have done some research.
Marc:But why change my ways?
Marc:Pow!
Marc:I just shit my pants.
Marc:JustCoffee.coop.
Marc:Available at WTFPod.com.
Marc:Jay Moore is on the show today.
Marc:And Jay I've known since he was a child, I believe.
Marc:I remember when Jay started coming around the New York scene.
Marc:He must have been 16 or 17 years old, this kid from New Jersey, this cocky kid with a lot of attitude.
Marc:And now he's an older guy with a slightly tempered attitude.
Marc:There's still the juice of Jay Moore, but he has been humbled.
Marc:which always makes for a better person and a better conversation.
Marc:Now let's get back to me.
Marc:All right, look, I just want to give you an update on a couple of things.
Marc:Boomer has not showed up again.
Marc:The sadness persists.
Marc:I will be in Philadelphia this weekend, the 6th through the 8th at Helium.
Marc:Looking forward to that.
Marc:I will be sitting down with Tom Sharpling over that weekend, hopefully to get a couple more episodes of the Mark and Tom show.
Marc:I would like to say there is a few more box sets of the DVDs, the first 100 episodes of WTF available here on the site.
Marc:And if you're looking for a Christmas present, that's a good one.
Marc:I believe we are going to repackage them and do another run of them.
Marc:They sold very well.
Marc:And I appreciate that.
Marc:That is really one of the only ways you can get and own the first 100 of these things that I do.
Marc:And I believe we're going to do the second 100 as well.
Marc:What's another update that you need?
Marc:I just did a laundry intervention with my girlfriend, Jessica, who I've I've lost faith in her ability to know what's clean and what isn't clean or what she wears or doesn't wear.
Marc:You walk into a room and there is just an ocean of clothing and it's troublesome.
Marc:So I tried to do it as casually as possible.
Marc:You know, I had some friends come over and we just sat her down in her room in this nest of clothes and said, this is really a problem and it's unmanageable.
Marc:So she's she's doing a load of wash now and she'll probably do one other one.
Marc:And that'll be the extent of the attempt at dealing with the laundry problem.
Marc:I don't know if this is a girl thing or a woman thing or just a person thing, but it's just I guess we all got our things, man.
Marc:Yeah, I've got a record thing.
Marc:So the update on that is now instead of masturbating or napping, I find myself going up to permanent records.
Marc:I never thought I would be this kid again where I'm hanging around a fucking record store trying to be cool, hoping that these people that run the record store are gonna like me, like their approval is important to me.
Marc:These people that run a used record store.
Marc:What am I, 14 again?
Marc:I'm gonna sit there and talk about records
Marc:I think they're just indulging me.
Marc:I think that it's, you know, I'm just days away from like, oh, here comes that guy again.
Marc:I just don't know.
Marc:I think I have these fantasies of completion, re my house, my guitar situation, cataloging my books, getting rid of books, you know, stuccoing this weird, you know, added room on my house that was added God knows when that the wood is rotting.
Marc:Fantasies of completion.
Marc:In my mind, I'm finishing them, getting a window treatment for my girlfriend's room.
Marc:In my mind, I'm finishing everything.
Marc:Manifesting the finishing is not happening.
Marc:How do I manifest the finishing?
Marc:I'll get to it.
Marc:I don't know, man.
Marc:I'm 49 years old.
Marc:I'm starting to think there's some shit I am not going to get to and it's right here in this room and I'm going to have to fucking live with that.
Marc:And just remain fantasizing about finishing.
Marc:I got to get my house painted because I do.
Marc:I can see it in my head.
Marc:Looks good.
Marc:Wish I could show it to you people, but I can't because it's a fucking fantasy.
Marc:And all I got to do is call a guy and pick a color.
Marc:But even just saying that, I got exhausted by just standing in front of the paints, the swatches.
Marc:This is how I work.
Marc:This is my belief system.
Marc:The fantasy of finishing, the fantasy of completion, the fantasies of being perfect.
Marc:I need to put a good hour together.
Marc:I would like to tape a comedy special next year.
Marc:And I've got a lot of stuff to work with.
Marc:I've got a beautiful new hour.
Marc:I'd like it to be as efficient as possible, but not overwrought.
Marc:And I need to punch it up a little bit.
Marc:So I should do that.
Marc:Will I do that if I look at the history of me?
Marc:Maybe.
Marc:Maybe.
Marc:I saw him once, 1981, Tattoo You Tour, Madison Square Garden, four seats.
Guest:That's a good one.
Guest:Steel Wheels was a really good tour.
Guest:You saw it?
Guest:I did see it at Shea Stadium, and I was so far in the back.
Guest:What year was that?
Guest:Were you like, oh, really?
Guest:You weren't a guy yet?
Marc:You weren't like Jay Moran with the band?
Guest:No, I was just out of high school and it was Steel Wheels and it was their big comebacks.
Guest:Pretty good album, Steel Wheels.
Guest:Not as good as, but Voodoo Lounge is really the one that no one ever talks about that I think is super underrated Stones album.
Marc:Yeah, I don't know if I bought it even.
Marc:Love Strong.
Marc:You're so sweet.
Marc:Come on, the last great Stones album, maybe some girls for a whole record, Emotional Rescue had a couple of good songs on it.
Marc:But there's a couple of real clunkers in Emotional Rescue.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Listen to Voodoo Lounge.
Guest:You'll love it.
Guest:The real fun thing is when you listen to, on YouTube, you can find Keith doing, because he writes a lot of it, if not all except Wild Horses, apparently.
Marc:That's the weird thing about reading that book.
Marc:It's like you kind of wonder how much of this is just a stick.
Marc:There's some heavy shit in there.
Marc:Arguably, he killed a kid.
Guest:arguably yes you know what i mean you can see on youtube keith you can hear on youtube keith recording himself doing love is strong but he only knew love is strong and he knew the bridge was like love is strong it's so sweet love is strong and love is strong baby that's it it's great it's just a single vocal track
Guest:uh with with all the instruments like he because as we know from happy keith can sit down and do bass drums and just go you know i'm just feeling happy right now the whole thing in montserrat i just feel like record where because charlie watts was staying like four hours away bill wyman was on a boat and they all just it took so long like i feel like like now that you're talking about like the exile shit like i feel like just you saying that like i actually have from reading that book i feel like i have memories of being there
Guest:i do too it's weird you were just describing i'm like oh yeah i remember that with the boat they had the boat and i i got such a more uh better understanding of like mick taylor like he must have been the biggest passive the best musician they ever had great guitar player i got a great jim marshall photo of keith and mick at the mic stand uh at montserrat and you just and mick is just in mid scream yeah yeah yeah and then uh and mick looks all dopey
Guest:He's just screaming.
Guest:He's like, rocks off, man.
Guest:And then Keith's got a cigarette in his hand, and he's wearing a Rolling Stones t-shirt, which I'm like, that was the beginning of the coolest shit that ever happened.
Guest:How do you feel about bands wearing their own shirts on stage?
Marc:You know, I don't know.
Marc:I don't know if I have an opinion on it.
Marc:Let me really process it.
Marc:I'd rather not.
Marc:You want me to take a break?
Marc:Yeah, you want me to take a break?
Marc:It's nice and early, Jay.
Marc:Jay Moore in the garage didn't even introduce you.
Marc:That's all right.
Marc:Yeah, no problem.
Marc:Okay, so how'd you manage to grow up in New Jersey and end up a Stones guy, not a Springsteen guy?
Marc:How does that happen?
Marc:I'm a huge Springsteen guy.
Marc:So you're Springsteen and Stones.
Marc:And Beatles.
Marc:Well, that's, yeah.
Marc:Rufus Wainwright, Sinatra.
Marc:Wait, wait, wait.
Marc:That comes, yeah.
Marc:Rufus comes later.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:Then- Is he a Jersey guy?
Guest:No, just people that really made me go, there's something so much better than I could ever hope to accomplish.
Marc:But you're like, okay, so you're in high school.
Marc:When did you graduate high school?
Marc:88.
Marc:Okay, 88.
Marc:So you're driving around.
Guest:What are you driving?
Guest:Okay.
Guest:A Ford Fairmont, which was my sister's, then she went to college at Rutgers and realized she didn't need a car to just walk from house to house and get pie-eyed, so I just inherited the car.
Guest:Okay, so you're driving- A lot of Van Halen, because I was a mat rat, I wrestled, so there's a lot of Van Halen won.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I remember when that came out.
Marc:That came out when I was in high school.
Marc:That was like 1980, 79.
Guest:Yeah, it wasn't new, but it was what was up.
Marc:You were a wrestler.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That was your sport?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Was there other sports?
Guest:Baseball, average baseball.
Guest:But you were a jock guy.
Guest:See, people keep telling me that and I've always... Really, they come up to you on the street and go, you're a jock?
Guest:No, like the Paseins and the guys like you go like, well, you're a jock.
Guest:And I'm like, I'm not a fucking jock.
Guest:And they go like, well, no, you wrestled and Sunday you're going to be in the house watching football.
Guest:That's you're a jock.
Marc:Did you have a letter jacket?
Guest:four of them okay so that's it it's over there's no arguing the points yay it's just odd that i never if i knew i was a jock at the time i would have used it to my advantage come on you must have oh no wrestling's a whole like it's lone wolf you guys are like the retarded guys
Marc:We are.
Marc:Yeah, wrestlers seem to have their own pack, and they're not social.
Guest:And you're never together except for at the end of the day with those three hours of wrestling practice, and then you don't talk to each other because you just can't breathe.
Guest:How many kids were in your family?
Guest:Three, two girls.
Guest:I'm the youngest of three.
Marc:Two older sisters.
Marc:Virginia, Julie, and me.
Marc:It's like Louie.
Marc:So you grew up with a house full of girls.
Guest:All women, yeah.
Guest:And my dad was, you know, it's that classic weird thing that I don't think really happens anymore where your dad goes to work at 6.30 and comes home at 6.30 at night and your mom makes him dinner and then he reads a John Le Carr novel and tells you, get out of my light.
Yeah.
Guest:That's it?
Guest:That's your relationship?
Guest:Love you too.
Guest:What did he do?
Guest:I still don't know.
Guest:You have no idea?
Guest:And when you ask him, you just get this rambling... Come on, you have a general sense.
Guest:He went somewhere, right?
Guest:Yeah, Clark O'Neill was one company.
Guest:Something to do with pharmaceutical branding.
Guest:The closest I ever got to an explanation was my dad was doing his...
Guest:A dull explanation.
Guest:And I love my father very much.
Guest:So it's not like my dull old man over there in Jersey.
Guest:Is he still around?
Guest:Oh yeah.
Guest:They moved to Easton.
Guest:I guess that's like moving on.
Guest:From where?
Guest:Jersey.
Guest:Moving on sideways.
Guest:New Jersey to Eastern Pennsylvania.
Marc:Verona, New Jersey.
Marc:I can't get a sense of where that is because my whole family's from New Jersey.
Marc:Giant Stadium.
Marc:Right by where you grew up.
Marc:Right by where my mother grew up.
Marc:Pompton Lakes.
Marc:That's Route 23.
Marc:Right, Route 23.
Marc:23 south of Verona.
Marc:I lived in Wayne, New Jersey when I was very young.
Marc:And my grandmother lived in Pompton Lakes, but she'd take us to Willowbrook.
Marc:And I remember the most amazing thing that happened in my childhood to my grandmother was when they built Paramus Park Mall.
Marc:that was a big deal because it was closer to her no oh because it was i think i don't know if we talked about this did we i don't know but uh they had one of the they had i think the first food court so my grandmother would say like they have food from around the world and we'd drive and they had the whole upstairs was just the food court which is just who gives a now but like then it was like oh my god they do
Guest:So that became- Look, Mark, there's Korean.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:There's Italian.
Marc:Greek.
Marc:There was a Greek place.
Guest:I think it was the first time I had- I don't know why I made your grandmother sound like Louis Schaefer.
Guest:Yeah, I don't either.
Guest:But back then, don't you think maybe it was- Marky.
Guest:On the way in, on the ground floor of Food Court, I bet they really tried to make it from-
Marc:I think that was the idea, make it exotic, but it was probably the wok place, and they might have been privately owned.
Marc:They might have been.
Guest:And then you realize, we could just do this, get guys to come in from Montclair.
Guest:Yeah, do it everywhere.
Guest:Yeah, I know a wok guy in Bloomfield.
Marc:Yeah, but no, what's that wok restaurant that's at all those places?
Marc:I don't remember.
Marc:The Chinese place.
Marc:It's always a pun.
Marc:But were you hanging around the fountain at Willowbrook with your friends in your letter jacket?
Marc:You'd go on weekends and you'd just sit there all fucking day?
Guest:Well, yeah, because girls in my school would never talk to me, so I would go and reinvent... Is that true?
Guest:Yeah, listen.
Guest:I'm having a hard time you painting yourself as a show up.
Guest:I was a 105-pound blonde guy in an all-attent...
Guest:the jersey sure you had a lot of spunk and you were you know not not it wasn't harnessed at all mark it was bat shit bananas crazy oh my god you tell me you didn't get laid in high school with the letter jacket with the wrestling no i got laid in high school but it was always chicks from other towns because you can go and be whoever you want
Guest:Oh, so you'd go and be Christopher Walken somewhere else?
Guest:Yeah, I'd be like, hey, you know, I'm 14 and all.
Guest:I wrestle.
Guest:Nobody knows.
Guest:My record's two and nine.
Guest:And in your own school, I talked myself out of pretty much as in my adult life, my mouth is talking me out of copious amounts of money and friendships.
Marc:Why?
Marc:Because you're a dick?
Guest:Yeah, a lot of the time.
Guest:I don't mean to be, but we talked about it on the way over.
Guest:It's so funny you said that.
Guest:I said, apparently something about me, despite my best intentions and where I know my insides are, apparently there's something about me that's inherently unlikable.
Guest:Where people's first reaction to me is, whoa, back off a little there, annoying guy.
Marc:What do you think it is, man?
Marc:I mean, what do you think it is?
Marc:I'm trying to figure it out right now, too, because I remember there was a... Because you're like, I'm trying to figure it out, too, because I've never liked you, but I've kind of liked you.
Marc:No, I never had a problem with you, but I think what happened was that you're cocky, which is fine, and that doesn't necessarily come from a good place, but it is what it is.
Marc:It's a personality thing.
Marc:But I think that once you got on a roll, cockiness mixed with money and a little bit of fame is horrendous.
Guest:Yeah, and I've said that, I say that on more stories often, which is when you go do Jerry Maguire, you can't come back to the stoop and start breaking balls.
Guest:It is different.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like when they know you've gotten paid, you've been out and you've been doing, and then you're, yeah, I'm in town doing this picture perfect movie with who?
Guest:Oh, it's me and Jennifer Aniston.
Guest:Oh, you just did Jerry Maguire?
Guest:Yeah, and then that's a nice fucking shirt you got there, Keith Robinson.
Guest:Why don't you go fucking ask Jim Norton to sew that?
Guest:People just go, this guy's a dick.
Guest:Even though it's the exact same thing you said when you're all in the mire together.
Guest:But I think that could be some of it.
Guest:It really is something I wrestle with, not emotionally, because I know, I mean, if you really want to go actor studio, I know where my heart is and I know where my mind and soul is.
Guest:I'm certain of that.
Guest:and when you read comments or message boards which we all know is the death knell to all of our i read the one on my site and there's only usually at the most you know 15 posts at any given time and that's that's my limit i don't go to other message boards i typed in last night uh my showtime special was coming up and i'm like i want because i don't think showtime advertises at all i don't think so it's on you buddy yeah like actually at all did you do a tell show
Guest:I did.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So he's like, you know, I don't know.
Guest:He paid me himself.
Guest:He wrote me a check with his name on it.
Guest:I'm like, this is, I didn't cash it.
Guest:I couldn't cash my friend's check.
Guest:So I go and instead of the S I hit V. So it was Jay Moore Showtime is what I wanted to type.
Guest:And I wrote Jay Moore V and it came up Jay Moore versus.
Guest:And there was like a page of people's names.
Marc:like jay moore verse and here's the jay moore versus lynette carolla what yeah and i'm like well did you ever say anything these are people that they they spend their lives cataloging uh uh what or creating fights between people they like to do it it was on adam's message board
Guest:And it was tweets between me and Lynette.
Guest:Lynette and I have never had a word between each other other than like, how are you?
Guest:How are the twins?
Guest:Great.
Guest:I know Adam wants to have you on the show.
Guest:Oh, great.
Guest:Because I can't wait.
Guest:I can't get a hold of them.
Guest:That was my, you know, this is no way to court again.
Guest:You've been on the short show though, right?
Guest:Once.
Guest:I've been trying to get back on for a very long time and vice versa.
Guest:And I almost went on his, I was going to go on his network, but there was just, I just couldn't, he's other level busy.
Guest:Like he's out doing the standup and this stuff.
Guest:And I mean, this is the utmost compliment.
Guest:Like we should all be so busy and reaping the rewards of what we've shown.
Guest:And I said to, it was literally, you can look it or people can look it up.
Guest:It's Jay Moore versus Lynette Curl.
Guest:My tweet is, hey, is there a better way for me to get in touch with Adam?
Guest:I can't seem to get in touch with him.
Guest:This is no way to court a gal.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And she wrote back, you should come on my show.
Guest:I know he loves you.
Guest:Bring Nikki if you come on.
Guest:But I know he loves you and wants to talk to you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then the poster writes, to which Jay Moore responded, nope.
Guest:And then there's like two pages people going, he's always been a fucking asshole.
Marc:Well, what is it then?
Marc:I don't know what it is, but let's go back to high school, though.
Marc:So you go to other towns to get laid.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And you're telling me you weren't a cocky kid.
Marc:You weren't a shit starter.
Guest:Well, I was not as cocky as I was a mouthy guy.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So your teachers hated you?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Bad.
Guest:Like you disrupted class constantly.
Guest:Never bad.
Guest:Just almost OCD, like an inability to not have an addendum to whatever was being said.
Marc:So you just punchlined everything?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Smart ass.
Guest:Or corrected.
Guest:Were you ever thrown out of school?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I lost a wrestling match in a wrestling tournament at a very rich school.
Guest:Pingree.
Guest:Super wealthy.
Guest:And I lost to a guy I shouldn't have lost to.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then you got to sit around all day and watch everybody else wrestle.
Guest:A wrestling tournament is like eight hours.
Guest:yeah mind-numbing boredom unless you're wrestling right for five minutes i went to the library and i pushed over one of the bookcases and they all went down like in a three studios movie yeah and then me and this other kid mike ardilla went well fuck it and then we took the uh fire extinguishers and just hosed the whole this is like the harvard it's paint it's a private private super wealthy white white school so you're the match is still going on you're like fuck it let's go fuck some shit up
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:All right.
Guest:Mike Ardilla is now serving life in prison for kidnap and murder.
Guest:Was he your buddy?
Guest:Oh, no.
Guest:No one was Mike Ardilla's buddy.
Guest:You just knew the guy?
Guest:He was the bad seed.
Guest:But he was a wrestler?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He was a bad dude.
Guest:Do you keep it in touch?
Guest:No.
Guest:Yeah, I write him.
Guest:I'm trying to get him a bride while he's in the joint.
Guest:You hear something about Mike Gardilla.
Guest:He fell off Brookdale School in Verona.
Guest:You know, tennis balls go up on the roof of the school, and there's always that guy, like a monkey, climb up the pipe and get on the...
Guest:But it was only like one floor, one story.
Guest:And at like 14, he fell off the school.
Guest:He had a skull fracture.
Guest:And like the whole town was like, that kid's never been the same ever since he fell off Brookdale Avenue School.
Guest:And it was true.
Guest:And when we used to run stairs in wrestling, you'd have a guy on your back, like piggyback.
Guest:And you'd run single file up this...
Guest:tiny stair long what was the point of that quads with that building quads and the guy on top i guess just yeah just brutal the point is brutal and you can't stop because you're in like like picture a line of ants yeah so if one guy stops because he's tired everyone falls down the stairs and gets injured so you're just non-stop so there's always somebody come there's just enough room for a person running down to pass the person running up
Guest:and we'd play Van Halen 1, and when Running with the Devil came on, we would say Ardilla for Mike Ardilla instead of Devil.
Guest:And we knew when he was next to us, when we were the ones saying Ardilla, he would punch us in the face.
Guest:So that was the game that made us not... Some weird version of musical chairs.
Marc:You just don't want to be next to Mike Ardilla.
Guest:So when you saw him coming down, you would start giggling and running fast, like pushing people ahead.
Guest:And then if you knew full well, and it was just like the fun part was if you could just get past him and the guy behind you just got punched in the face.
Guest:And it was just by rote.
Guest:He didn't even do it with anger.
Guest:It was just what happened.
Guest:And he would punch a heavyweight, like a senior in the face.
Guest:And the senior wasn't like, quit, I'll fucking kick your ass.
Guest:That was the game.
Guest:It was like, oh, shit.
Guest:And then it turns out we were right because he stabbed the kid at a party, took his girlfriend in Jersey and got his tires shot out in New Mexico or something.
Guest:By cops.
Marc:That's a good run.
Marc:So he stabbed a kid, took his chick, and then drove from New Jersey to New Mexico?
Guest:Yeah, just railed out on coke.
Marc:That's some Badland shit.
Guest:It is Badland.
Marc:It's amazing you didn't kill people on the way.
Marc:You didn't kill anybody.
Guest:Make sure my pretty baby.
Marc:So, all right, so you were kind of a dick.
Marc:So you did the fire hose and the bookshelves.
Guest:Yeah, so I got tossed out of school for that.
Marc:But that's inspired.
Marc:I mean, that's not just sort of like, hey, what are we going to do?
Marc:You're like, fuck it.
Guest:I was always... It wasn't like a Rickles level.
Guest:Like, I would never just say I didn't like making fun of people.
Guest:I knew that because there was a lot of bullies.
Guest:It was Jersey Shore.
Guest:It really was.
Guest:My high school was Jersey Shore.
Guest:But you wouldn't consider yourself a bully?
Guest:Oh, no.
Guest:Absolutely not.
Marc:I was the champion of the bullied.
Marc:But let's talk about this.
Marc:So, like, I'm kind of hung up on this alpha male shit.
Marc:Like, I've been hearing that a lot lately.
Marc:Like, you know, you got into it with Rogan.
Marc:I don't know what about.
Guest:I've never said a word to Rogan other than hello and goodbye and good to see you backstage at April Foolishness.
Guest:Well, what the hell is all the bullshit that just happened?
Guest:Bert Kreischer was on Joe Rogan's podcast after being on mine maybe three times and on Rogan's three times.
Marc:Bert's a good guy.
Marc:You guys are friends.
Marc:We used to be friends.
Marc:We no longer speak.
Marc:To this day?
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:And I'll tell you why.
Marc:All right.
Marc:I don't want to make this a bummer.
Marc:I'm just curious.
Marc:No.
Guest:I don't keep up with the bullshit.
Guest:Here's the... You know what?
Guest:I've said more nice things about Joe Rogan than I've said about anybody in my professional career because I wanted to stay above the fray.
Guest:And Joe is like the head of the snake when it comes to this podcast thing.
Guest:Joe is the fucking guy.
Guest:And Joe's a guy that I've always liked and admired.
Marc:He's a guy you don't want to piss off.
Marc:That's...
Marc:That's for sure.
Guest:Well, no, I've always, and you know what?
Guest:I've never said this on a podcast, but I used to say it in private to my friends.
Guest:I said, there's two guys I know, Chappie from Boston, my buddy, Kevin Chapman.
Guest:I remember Chappie, yeah.
Guest:If you gave me a baseball bat in the first shot, there's only two men alive.
Guest:One is Chappie, the other one is Joe Rogan, where I would lay the bat down on the ground and go, nah, it's okay, you win.
Yeah.
Guest:Anyone else, you go, I don't give a fucking papa.
Guest:You just crack him across the face.
Guest:Bert used to do... Bert told me a Tracy Morgan story that happened to Bert.
Guest:I know this story.
Guest:This is the whole, the big night story, right?
Guest:That's how you get out of paying for the check, Bert.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And Bert told me that story on the... We were going to San Francisco.
Guest:We were in San Francisco at Cobbs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I think... Yeah, we were at Cobbs.
Guest:And I said, you have to tell that story on stage.
Guest:He goes, I can't do a Tracy Morgan...
Guest:mark i swear to god i have two sons i swear to god on four eyes yeah both of my sons sets of eyes yeah this is the god's honest truth yeah i swear to god i will not roll this or put light in any one because every story you put 20 perception your way right 15 that way to make it a little more fair this is exactly what happened
Guest:Bert said, you've got to tell that story on stage.
Guest:I said to Bert, you've got to tell that story on stage.
Guest:Bert said, I can't do a Tracy Morgan impression.
Guest:Will you do it?
Guest:You do it.
Guest:I said, tonight?
Guest:He goes, you have to do it.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:We're at Cobb's.
Guest:I do it.
Guest:Who's the redheaded gal?
Guest:Molly.
Guest:Molly that everybody's in love with?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Molly was there.
Guest:I think even Jeff Wills was there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Back when he was still involved.
Yeah.
Guest:I do it.
Guest:And as I'm doing it, it's destroying so hard.
Guest:I look to Bert and I say, how are you not doing this on stage?
Guest:This is absurd.
Guest:Second show Friday.
Guest:You're going to do Tracy again, right?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Really?
Guest:You have to.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Saturday.
Guest:You're going to do Tracy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Saturday, second show.
Guest:Sunday.
Guest:Do Tracy.
Guest:Will you do Tracy?
Marc:Okay.
Marc:This is Bert.
Marc:He just wants to watch you do it.
Guest:He wants to watch me do it.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Were you saying this happened to a friend of mine?
Guest:I said, my friend Bert, you know, Bert was just up here.
Guest:Bert was with Tracy Morgan.
Guest:That's how you get out.
Guest:And the punchline was, that's how you get out of paying for the check, Bert.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Good night.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like, there's no following that.
Guest:So I would just get off stage.
Guest:Then the next weekend, we're in Irvine.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Dan Godfrey, the manager of the Irvine Improv, was at the table, as was my wife, when Bert said to me, you're going to do Tracy again this weekend, right?
Guest:So now we're going up to 12 shows where Bert's saying, so then the week after that, I just kept doing it.
Guest:Always as Bert, always as Bert, always as Bert.
Guest:Now, this is where my...
Marc:Have you hashed this out before?
Marc:I mean, did you go on Joe's?
Guest:I talked about it with Greg Fitzsimmons.
Guest:Here's the thing.
Guest:Joe has invited me on the podcast twice and then rescinded the offer.
Guest:So now I kind of feel like Charlie Brown with the football.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's like, you need to come on.
Guest:We need to hug this shit out.
Guest:This is nonsense.
Guest:And then I go, okay, great.
Guest:And then you don't hear anything.
Guest:So, okay.
Guest:So, this is where my fearless moral inventory of myself comes into play.
Guest:You in the racket?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You didn't know that?
Guest:No.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was about to ask you when you were on my podcast-
Guest:for what which one about the racket yeah but i mean in the yeah there's many of them you know you're sober yeah oh really yeah oh good for you but i was i didn't realize how dry a drunk i was until about a year ago so that's when you kicked in uh no i went back i just went back and reapplied myself sure and can i just show up yeah well i was showing up here and there but i realized i'm just full of not working the
Marc:and when i went back and took that moral that fearless moral inventory i realized i am a fucking egomaniac that i mean axel rose doesn't have shit on me isn't that interesting though that fucking that that that exercise you know without you know uh you know press radio and film whatever that exercise of that moral inventory if you do it i think and those who know what we're talking about know we're talking about and those that we don't there's yeah you're just we're just looking at yourself the columns man
Marc:you know the the yeah yeah fuck it i mean i i'm i'm open about it it's uh it's fucking step four in any of the 12-step programs whatever your rack whatever your problem is but this thing is genius it was designed after a business you're in more than one well no i'm not but i mean you said which one like a degenerate gambler oh no there's plenty there's plenty you could be in any number addicts we're fine it's those fucking gamblers they really gotta get their acts together how about those codependents man thank god for them but god i got the rain
Guest:dangerous winning in the over like then you have a fucking problem i just like to get high yeah though there's some my dentist hands me vicodin what's your fucking problem right but you get it though i mean like you know any of the things whatever whether it's food other people uh gambling whatever the fucking thing is you get that juice you know food's the hardest thing of all time because you have to eat to live so it is weird like that's tough man and people that are bipolar that have to quit it's like take these six pills yeah or you're gonna murder someone but if you take seven we gotta take you to the nut house
Guest:That's a fucking tough ... I'm being ... I know, I know.
Guest:That's a tough hustle.
Guest:Somebody's bipolar or borderline personality disorder.
Guest:You must take Remron and this one, Celexa, take fucking lithium.
Guest:But if you take Xanax, then we have to have an intervention.
Guest:You're in trouble.
Guest:That's a complete ...
Marc:But the moral inventory is that you say, I am mad at this guy for this reason, and this is how it affected me, and this is my part in it.
Marc:So there's four columns.
Marc:And then if you do a thorough one and you look at that fourth column, you know exactly what kind of asshole you are.
Marc:Because the character defect will just be the same one over and over again.
Guest:Right.
Guest:What are my shortcomings?
Marc:What is all this?
Marc:Okay, so you found that you were a fucking self-centered ego fucking maniac.
Guest:David Lee Roth, Axl Rose combined.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Apparently.
Marc:Well, that would answer- Have nothing on me.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Well, that would answer your asshole question.
Marc:That would answer why people go, that guy's a dick.
Marc:Sure.
Guest:But the problem being, I can consciously do it, but that would make me a phony, remove confidence from inside me approaching a situation because that's why I'm successful at all.
Marc:But confidence can come from two different places, right?
Marc:Either you're genuinely confident, I'm like, I'm good with myself, or you're overcompensating, right?
Guest:Right.
Marc:I was never overcompensating.
Guest:You always felt good about yourself.
Guest:I was born that way.
Guest:Sometimes, to quote my wife, sometimes it's just the fucking way your hard drive is installed.
Marc:Yeah, no, I get it.
Marc:You're wired that way.
Guest:It's a fucking sunny day, man.
Guest:Let's get after it.
Marc:Let's go do it.
Marc:Let's do it.
Guest:Where the fuck does that come from?
Guest:I was born that way.
Guest:But you must have been- And I got two sisters.
Guest:I got one sister that'll tell you she was shortchanged with life, and she's owed a goddamn apology by the system.
Guest:I got another sister, if her house had no ceiling, she would tell you how nice the walls look.
Guest:And that's how I am.
Marc:So the one sister got the short end of the stick with the wiring.
Marc:She's fucking miserable.
Marc:just self-pitying and horrible and bitter mad mean mostly yeah mean and you think it was because what your your mother was nice or what i mean yeah i just think it's how your hard drive is installed i just i just think on the assembly line yeah i mean a higher power you're saying in utero yeah some people are born fucking depressed you know it's it's nature versus nurture but you feel comfortable with yourself
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:All right.
Marc:All right.
Guest:So anyway, so this thing with Bert, so that's fucking... So my inventory was I'm an absolute egomaniac to the point where like if I call a radio show or like when I check those iTunes charts, I'm like...
Guest:How did I get to eight?
Marc:What the fuck?
Marc:You can't rely.
Marc:I check them too, but the number's based on something weird.
Marc:Yes, on iTunes, it's a weird algorithm they have worked out.
Marc:But I realized- You did that research.
Marc:That's funny.
Marc:We all say the same thing.
Marc:No, it's an algorithm.
Marc:I don't even know what the fucking algorithm is, but I'm like, it's not right.
Guest:Do you really not know what an algorithm is?
Guest:No.
Guest:It's a math problem that goes linearly.
Guest:A logarithm is a math problem that goes linearly.
Marc:Yeah, but it doesn't explain anything to me.
Marc:Okay, so it's a weird algorithm.
Marc:Give me an example of how that would equate you being number eight.
Marc:New subscriptions.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:New.
Guest:Not subscriptions.
Guest:Like today.
Guest:Because you got more subscriptions.
Guest:You are the top of the chain all the time.
Guest:You get new subscriptions.
Guest:When people say like, what podcast should I listen to?
Guest:Everyone says WTF.
Guest:New subscriptions plus rankings, meaning like you actually put five stars, plus comment equals rankings.
Guest:As opposed to the actual, the number itself should be the ranking.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Whatever.
Guest:So, okay.
Guest:So my egomania...
Guest:I am complete dry drunk.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Which means you're a control freak.
Guest:I decided.
Guest:And aggravated.
Guest:I thought to myself, the audience wants this to have had happened to me.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So after doing all the shows with Bert, and we're talking about a brief amount of time where I said, I'm out with Tracy Morgan.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And he goes, that's how you get out of paying for the check, Jay Moores.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:That's the closing bit.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So you made an adjustment and stole the story.
Guest:Exactly.
Marc:Right.
Guest:I said to my wife what I was doing.
Guest:She said, you can't do that.
Guest:That's stealing.
Guest:Which wife?
Guest:My wife.
Marc:The new one.
Guest:One's been annulled, brother.
Guest:There's only one.
Marc:Oh, okay.
Guest:There's only one wife.
Marc:Come on.
Marc:Sorry, sorry.
Marc:The good one.
Marc:The right one.
Guest:I'm just trying to get a timeline on this.
Guest:Now.
Guest:All right.
Guest:She said, you can't do that.
Guest:That's stealing.
Guest:And I said to her, but I think the audience wants it to have happened to me.
Guest:So you're selling it to yourself.
Marc:You're rationalizing.
Marc:You're chipping away at it.
Marc:Like a crazy person.
Marc:Bird will understand.
Guest:Now, I don't even know if I thought about Bert.
Marc:Well, see, that's a problem.
Guest:Because Bert, in all intents and purposes, Bert, I wouldn't be doing this unless Bert insisted me do this over and over and over and over, like a rat hitting the fucking cookie.
Marc:No, I get that.
Marc:But if you had one of those times, like if the third time you did it, you said it happened to you, Bert would have said, Dad, that didn't happen to you.
Marc:That is correct.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:So then I switch it back.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:then uh bert goes to shit this whole podcast is going to be me rehashing the story and then it'll be more hate hate tweets from the joe rogan we don't have to do that i mean i you know but i would like any any chance i can say my side because one side is so aggressive
Guest:And so like, you fucking steal.
Guest:Mencia Moore, you steal.
Guest:And it's like, come see my show.
Guest:I don't steal dick.
Guest:I'll steal dick if given the opportunity.
Guest:I love dick.
Guest:A bag of dicks, gone.
Guest:Gone.
Guest:Can't stop yourself.
Guest:Can't stop, won't stop.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:One bag leads to another bag.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:One bag's too many.
Guest:and 50 bags of dick ain't enough so I switch it back Burt I do my Showtime special I do my encore and I tell that story the Burt the right way Burt version this happened to my friend Burt Kresher one of the best comics you'll ever see in your life great guy yeah
Guest:Bert goes to Amsterdam and the guy from Showtime goes, oh, you're Bert from Jay Moore's Tracy Morgan story.
Guest:And all the comics around Bert go, wait, what?
Guest:Wait, oh, what?
Guest:What?
Guest:And just starts this weird thing of, that's not cool.
Marc:Aren't they great?
Guest:He's not telling the story.
Marc:That's not cool.
Marc:That's your story.
Marc:Every day's high school in the comedy community.
Guest:And Bert told him, no, I told him to tell the story.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Bert told me on my podcast, and I quote, anyone fucking look it up, not you, just listener.
Guest:Bert said on my podcast, anybody that thinks, and he said this on Rogan's podcast, and this is a quote, anybody that thinks Jay stole from me is fucking retarded.
Guest:That's a quote from Bert.
Guest:Bert goes on Rogan's podcast, and they just...
Guest:After like two and a half hours of hanging with Bert, Joe just goes, so do you want to talk about it?
Guest:And Bert goes, you know, and they mentioned the Tracy Morgan story and Bert goes, here's the thing.
Guest:It's a story I never really wanted told, you know?
Guest:And I'm like, what?
Guest:I'm watching this, by the way, because Joe has that Ustream account.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And he goes, you know, because, and this is where it all goes south.
Guest:Joe goes, because it didn't happen to you.
Guest:It didn't happen to him, it happened to you.
Guest:And that's stealing.
Guest:Bert just lets it go.
Guest:And then Joe just continues a conversation about stealing.
Guest:And then I called Bert and said, how you could have said, no, that's not stealing.
Guest:I told Jay to say it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So Bert never said anything bad about me.
Guest:He just never said, no, it's not stealing.
Marc:Why don't you guys speak anymore?
Guest:Obviously Bert has some unresolved shit regarding me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because otherwise he would have gotten in front of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I said to Bert, I kind of need you to either say maybe a tweet.
Guest:Something needs to be said to the effect of Jay doesn't steal.
Guest:And I texted Bert live while he was on Joe's.
Guest:I'm watching Joe's podcast and Bert's sitting there.
Guest:And I said, can you ever imagine me being in a room where people were talking shit about you and not defending you?
Marc:Well, I think the big problem was when you you made the transition for however long you made the transition to making it about you.
Marc:Absolutely.
Marc:And then, you know, that was a regret.
Marc:You had permission to tell the story.
Marc:And one that I admitted very openly on Opie and Anthony.
Guest:I think one of my biggest mistakes is maybe is admitting when shit's gone south publicly.
Guest:Because if you just keep that shit in, that's the other thing about the internet and about podcasting.
Guest:Until you put a light on it, no one knows it exists.
Guest:Like people listening to this right now are going, who's Bert Kreischer?
Guest:Who's Joe Rogan?
Guest:Like there's a whole, I'm not saying anything derogatory about Bert and Joe.
Guest:I'm just saying like people, until you put, this is what I've figured, seen with my own eyes.
Guest:Until you put a light on a situation in podcast land,
Guest:pretty much your audience and my audience, and they really don't know what the fuck's going on.
Guest:They just listen to this because they drive trucks.
Marc:Right, yeah, they're a fan of you, they're a fan of me.
Marc:And they're like, wait, what?
Guest:What's going on?
Marc:Yeah, well, it's that whole radio war thing, too, that there was, I think, a time in radio, especially regionally, where, you know, people would, you know, start shit with the other radio stations, you know, to generate, you know, I don't really play that shit.
Marc:But I guess, I mean, from where I'm sitting, and I don't know, you know, I know that story.
Marc:But, I mean, you've had these issues before.
Marc:I think you talked about it in your book with Rick.
Marc:right yeah and that was like you know it's just a matter of how the brain works i mean there was a time in comedy where you know guys would be about to go up and one guy would say you doing the bit tonight or am i like there wasn't you know there wasn't this uh this idea that uh people weren't as proprietary or as uh you know as personal but uh you know i i just think that that little thing in your brain that enables you to do that that's a question you know what is that
Marc:I mean, what happened with Shapiro?
Marc:That was a character, but you made up with him, right?
Marc:Oh, no.
Guest:He's very angry.
Guest:I wrote a book with a full mea culpa saying Rick Shapiro, when I was on... See, now, you know...
Guest:If you've done something twice, then I guess the shoe fits.
Guest:Then I guess we've now, in a very short amount of time, through no fault of yours, going like, well, there's the Bert situation.
Guest:Now, what about the thing when you admitted to stealing Rick?
Guest:Then more of me goes, yeah, what the fuck is this?
Guest:more moh sure you know uh the rick shapiro thing was i was on saturday night live about to be fired because i had nothing on the air ever yeah and then rick shapiro had a character of the irish bartender i remember that and i wrote it up verbatim and i hand it in like just at least it's good enough that i'm handing something because i had to hand it in a sketch they fucking pick it to be on the air and it's one of those situations do i go i just lifted this because
Guest:I hadn't written anything and I knew you guys were going to fire me or do I just ride it out and hope that Rick Shapiro doesn't watch or any of his friends watch Saturday Night Live and they put it on the air.
Guest:So that's a tough decision to make.
Guest:That's almost like a... It's not a tough decision to make.
Guest:You don't fucking steal and Rick and I used to go get lunch together and like,
Marc:No, you guys were friends.
Marc:I mean, because Rick, he's an impressive talent.
Marc:But I mean, the decision I'm telling you is that out of desperation, you had nothing of your own to offer.
Marc:You panicked.
Marc:You did that.
Marc:You knew that was wrong, right?
Guest:And a New York Times bestselling book saying, I did the unthinkable.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I stole.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:End of chapter, new chapter.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Rick Shapiro is a fantastic comic.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like, I really lay it all out and lay all the kudos out to Rick.
Marc:so so do you so what do you uh well because a lot of people wonder there's always that question and i guess we're talking about it wasn't wasn't my plan because i i you know despite what anyone thinks and in in certainly on this show i don't court controversy i don't you know when i interviewed mentia i had to do it twice because i didn't address anything with him the first time but um
Marc:But it wasn't my intention, but I think it's an interesting thing that you're one of the only people that's open about it.
Marc:So what do you think in those two?
Guest:See, I've seen Men see a cop to it on a documentary.
Guest:But it was weird.
Marc:You're goddamn right I'm taking that shit.
Marc:right but it almost seemed like you know i i it wasn't didn't play well well there was no contrition in it there was no thoughtful in it you know it was almost like you didn't know if he was just being a dick or whether he was really copping to it i i didn't get the sense there was no discussion around the weird thing is there's two situations literally 20 years apart with you right that i was super open and public about
Guest:If anyone ever came to see my stand-up show, they would say, not only is this not stolen, it's incredibly personal.
Guest:It's kind of, at times, very touching.
Guest:It's one-man show-ish.
Guest:And, of course, there's the impressions, you know, Norm and Tracy and Walken and fucking Keitel and Ian from the...
Guest:And you would sit as an audience member and say, if you were in court and you were sworn in with your hand on the Bible, you would say, I would say, it is absolutely impossible a syllable of that is stolen.
Marc:No, no, absolutely.
Marc:And I'm not arguing with that.
Marc:You're a funny guy.
Marc:You're a great impressionist.
Marc:You're a great performer.
Marc:And you're unique.
Marc:And people love you.
Marc:There's no doubt about that.
Marc:And it's a shame in a lot of ways that if once somebody is...
Marc:contrite admits their mistakes that you know there's still this this this kind of momentum to kind of keep the hate going but what I'm curious about is that you know what do you think in terms of like having taken a moral inventory and made those decisions what do you think it was inside you that made it okay for you to do that and it's an insatiable need for the people in front of me to be happy at that moment right and also for your own success
Guest:I don't think I, I'm being completely honest with you.
Guest:I don't think I thought it two steps ahead.
Guest:I thought these people in front of me right now, I need to kill.
Marc:Like if I- But you were killing when it was with Bert.
Marc:You were killing, you know what I mean?
Guest:You were killing when you were using, you were saying- Yeah, but me changing it to me doesn't really like help my career.
Guest:No, but I mean, but it does, you know, it puts you at the center of the story.
Guest:Oh, and real quick, the negativity that you're talking about, it really only comes from one very specific spout.
Guest:It really only comes from that spot, which is a very powerful faucet from where many opinions flow.
Guest:But those fans, that's really the only place where it happens.
Guest:But wait, have you thought about where that comes from?
Guest:Yeah, because a guy on his podcast said that's stealing.
Marc:No, I know that, but I mean, what purpose is that serving?
Marc:You know, like, I'm not always clear on that.
Guest:That, you know, to me, you know, people... What purpose does it serve for Burt to go on twice, say, anybody thinks that Jay Stole from me is retarded, and then have him on a third time to rehash it again?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think Burt obviously has some unresolved shit with me, because I emailed Burt.
Guest:You know, I've been called to the mat for saying things on Twitter to people.
Guest:Like, you don't take that to Twitter.
Guest:Like, well...
Guest:Why not?
Guest:Well, you don't.
Guest:You just don't.
Guest:But I didn't know you don't.
Guest:And I've emailed and texted Bert privately saying, I mean, people think I steal shit because of this thing that you didn't say on Rogan's show.
Guest:And I direct messaged Joe and said, you know...
Guest:i don't steal that's that that's the longest shadow possible to be cast upon a comic to say like you know in college he raped the chick like yeah but he's funny yeah but to say that a guy steals is that's i think that i think that casts the longest shadow right but but you're saying that like there were these two instances where that happened and and this is why they both happened and and you know i don't do it and i you know i i apologize and that's that
Marc:doesn't make it right was was the knee-jerk response that everyone's gonna give that doesn't mean it's fucking right he's a fucking shit and what's with his wife yeah i don't i don't know about that stuff yeah yeah yeah yeah so like when i it was interesting because when when i first saw you in in new york you were like 12 and you know you showed up this wonder kind from new jersey you know you remember yeah barry cats had uh i think found you at a high school i'd
Guest:Man, I really was impressed that you got that guy to take a stalling call and win the match 4-3.
Guest:Have you ever thought about doing stand-up comedy, man?
Guest:You should go up in your singlet and say you got to be home to do homework.
Guest:It'll kill man.
Marc:So when you first started, you were pretty funny pretty quickly.
Marc:I mean, I remember the jokes.
Marc:I remember your confidence.
Marc:And then, like, there was... Like, how did it all unfold for you?
Marc:I mean, so you did comedy for, what, two or three years before you got the big break or what?
Guest:I think if you have a big break, you're doing it wrong.
Guest:I think all of us have about 20 or 30 big, quote, big breaks.
Guest:MTV Half Hour Comedy Hour came when I was 19.
Marc:But we all did that, though.
Marc:That's a big break.
Marc:Is it?
Marc:When you're 19?
Marc:Everything seems like a big break until everyone fucking does the show.
Guest:It was a big break for me because then I can go perform at colleges.
Guest:You have a resume.
Guest:You have a line on your resume.
Guest:And you've been doing comedy, what, three years?
Guest:Yeah, three years.
Guest:16 you started.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But also it wasn't the confidence too.
Guest:Early on, I guess I was about, I was 18 years old.
Guest:I did an Arsenio Hall impression.
Guest:And I remember all my other impressions were pretty straightforward, like Andrew McCarthy.
Guest:What was your impression?
Guest:Yeah, what's that about?
Guest:I heard you was in a movie or something and something happened.
Guest:It was all crazy.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:What's that about?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Give it up for Robert De Niro.
Guest:You was in like Raging Bull or something.
Guest:Y'all was boxing.
Guest:Crazy, man.
Guest:But Lyle Alzado had gone on Arsenio and cried on his, like a week before he died of, you know, everything.
Guest:Brain cancer.
Guest:Everything broke down in his body from a horrible, ravaged steroid body.
Guest:And I did an impression of Arsenio interviewing him.
Guest:And then I actually cried.
Guest:I thought, you know what?
Guest:I can get into acting by doing comedy.
Guest:I can act on stage and people, it'll be like my own play.
Guest:So I would act out Lyle Alzado crying and I would actually make myself cry.
Guest:And then I would swing it back to where I sent it.
Guest:Like, and I knew I would never do drugs or, you know, I'm not obviously not doing that.
Guest:steroids ever again yeah and then it would just be like if the crowd was like what the fuck is going on right and then i would just shift in my seat and i realized they know i'm arsenio just from me changing my posture like this is kind of powerful stuff yeah and then i'll go yeah you play for the raiders or something
Guest:What's the rate is like, Oakland in the house.
Guest:And the place would go fucking bananas.
Guest:But it was a real early age that I realized they were only going bananas because of the abyss of silence I'd created.
Guest:And then it wasn't as much confidence.
Guest:I think it's the addict mentality of I got addicted to that making silences and pulling them back out.
Marc:No, but that's just craft.
Marc:I mean, you can say it's addiction, but at some point, you had a natural, innate sense of timing and that the way you structured... I mean, impressionists have always been part of show business and it's a very impressive skill and people love it and people love it when people do something different with it.
Marc:It's one thing to just do a voice and he does that voice really good, but to create a stage where you're doing a couple of voices and you're obviously scripting beats in your head and you realize that that silence is going to be relieved...
Marc:by this amazing switch up.
Marc:I mean, that's like joke writing.
Marc:That's like a turn of phrase.
Marc:It's the same thing.
Marc:And I think that in your defense that it's weird that both of the accusations of stealing were really to serve as an impression.
Marc:And that when you talk about it, because I remember seeing you early on, I remember you definitely had jokes.
Marc:You weren't just an impressionist.
Marc:You had the haunted house joke.
Guest:I never, to this day, don't consider myself an impressionist.
Guest:I can do six voices.
Marc:Well, you just did two that you don't do anymore, so that's eight.
Guest:I said do.
Marc:Right.
Guest:You know, I mean, plus, you know, Andrew McCarthy and Arsenio Hall would be like... Oh, I remember the Andrew McCarthy.
Guest:That was just a face, wasn't it?
Guest:I love her, man.
Guest:Yeah, it was a weird face.
Guest:It helped that I looked a little like him at the time.
Guest:You looked a little like him.
Guest:But yeah, like I'm a guy, I can close with Norm, you know, I just like spin the wheel, like Elvis Costello on tour will just spin the wheel of hits and wherever it lands, that's what he plays.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I know at the end of my show, like an old switchboard operator, I know my last four holes, I got Walken, I got Norm and I got Tracy.
Guest:Right.
Marc:So then, okay, so from there you did the colleges, but then you were on SNL for two seasons, Thoree, how long?
Guest:Two.
Marc:Just two?
Marc:Yeah, I got hired with Attell and Sarah and Norm.
Guest:And what was your experience with Lauren like?
Guest:Sarah McLachlan, I got hired.
Guest:Yeah, that's interesting, yeah.
Guest:And we really just needed to save animals and make sure they were spayed.
Marc:She didn't fit in the cast.
Marc:They didn't know what to do.
Guest:They just wanted us to really help save homeless, runny-eyed cats.
Guest:And you should say, if you're listening, save as many animals as possible because dying, well, I'm all for, I have many animals.
Guest:And I think dying children really love when you show them healthy animals.
Guest:Sure, it's very nice.
Guest:Like, look, I just spayed and neutered my pet.
Guest:Sorry about your iron lung, Timmy.
Guest:But look, he's a Shih Tzu.
Guest:He only has one.
Guest:He's got one eye.
Guest:He's got one eye and I helped him.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:That's good.
Marc:That made you smile.
Guest:I have two eyes and I can't see because I'm dying.
Guest:Sorry.
Guest:So Norm, what was our what?
Marc:Oh, Lorne.
Marc:Lorne Michaels.
Guest:I oddly had no, at the end of the day, Lorne out of hundreds of thousands of comics went, I choose him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's never been lost on me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So, I mean, I could rant and rave about like my shit not getting on the air, but at the end of the day, I just wasn't, I did not, I was not the best representative of myself the two years I was there.
Guest:And Lauren had really, well, see, that's the thing.
Guest:You don't know how much Lauren, my favorite is yours.
Guest:I don't know what they're doing below 14th Street.
Guest:I say that to anyone that'll listen, like, if you think that's funny, Marc Maron's got the best one of all time.
Guest:Just being dismissive of a third of an island.
Guest:I don't know what's happening.
Guest:Yeah, so Lorne hired me, I guess.
Guest:And then behind closed doors, I don't know what he said about me, but we were always sort of friendly.
Marc:No one has ever said a bad fucking word about that guy on this show.
Marc:You realize that?
Marc:No, I don't.
Guest:Because I always thought people only say bad things about him.
Marc:Never.
Marc:Never publicly.
Guest:I've heard people just destroy, like Julia Sweeney.
Marc:It's like an uncle that molested you paying for college.
Marc:Yeah, but I never interviewed her.
Marc:But in this room, I have this perverse obsession.
Marc:You want them to.
Marc:I just want someone to say one shitty thing.
Marc:He fingered me.
Marc:Oh, thank you.
Marc:Warren Michaels fingered me.
Marc:Fingered Jay Moore.
Guest:I never told anybody that before.
Guest:But was it worth it?
Guest:Because I made it up and I stole it from a girl.
Absolutely.
Guest:But I remember once, Jay, do you know my office has its own bathroom?
Guest:And the next thing I know, prostate.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:We call this milking.
Guest:Some people call this finger blasting your ass.
Guest:Out in Montauk, we call it prostate milking.
Marc:Belushi enjoyed this.
Guest:Not John, Jim.
Guest:I can never get John in here.
Guest:John didn't use the bathroom often.
Guest:We call this prostate milking when you get visually west of Patchogue.
Guest:Yeah, I went into his office once because I was so upset with not being used, and I had a legal pad.
Guest:Were you crying?
Guest:No.
Guest:I waited.
Guest:I should have.
Guest:Maybe that would have worked, and I had a yellow legal pad of all my demands of what had to change if I was going to stay on the show.
Guest:you're calling you so i guess the confidence was always like you know what this is bull you know what but it's rational like here's things written down a b c itemized numbered like these are things that are fucking bullshit man man other shit has come to light man we made the fucking drop the editorial we man um
Guest:So they go, Lauren, we'll see you now.
Guest:I mean, I waited hours and then you just keep getting closer and there's like a wall of secretaries and there's another wall.
Guest:It was like getting close to Kennison back in the day.
Guest:I did that once, yeah.
Guest:And then finally they go, you can go on in, but his door is still closed and it's just very like, don't fucking come in.
Guest:It's like the city wall.
Guest:And then I push his door open and it catches on his carpet.
Guest:which had never happened ever before.
Guest:And I don't think Aaron, his secretary had to have carpet problems.
Guest:So it got about like, I don't know, 11 inches open on the arc.
Guest:And I have a decision to make.
Guest:Do I just squeeze my body through?
Guest:Do I fucking like a linebacker, just drill his door and make his carpet go up and risk a bending the coffee table with, oh, you broke my Rothko.
Guest:So I squeeze through.
Guest:I slither through.
Guest:I get down on my hands and knees, Mark, with my back.
Guest:He's sitting at his desk.
Guest:And I have to unroll his car.
Guest:I'm now inside his office on my hands and knees, unrolling his carpet away from the door and measuring how much of a roll will let the door accompany its arc.
Guest:And I do it.
Guest:I'm pretty proud of my estimation because it worked.
Guest:And I slide the door all the way open.
Guest:And then I unroll the carpet back.
Guest:And then I slide the door.
Guest:Because now I can slide the door over the carpet because it's going back towards its hinge.
Guest:And I click shut.
Guest:I stand up, turn around.
Guest:He's standing exactly like a monster movie.
Guest:Yeah, it's right there.
Guest:He's standing right in front of me.
Guest:He goes, I understand you wanted to talk to me about some complaints.
Guest:Now I got to go pick my fucking yellow notebook paper off the ground and find my pencil like when the girl in Scooby-Doo loses her glasses.
Guest:I'm rooting.
Marc:Isn't it amazing how heightened it is that you remember all those details that the processes you go through, all these different doors, all these different receptionists, and just that moment of that door is heightened to the point where you remember every fucking moment of it because you're about to confront that guy.
Guest:People always tell me I have an odd memory of things.
Guest:And then it was my wife said, oh, I know why.
Guest:And I said, why?
Guest:She goes, because you never had a job longer than two years.
Guest:So everything gets remembered.
Guest:If you're on a sitcom for five years and then another sitcom for five years and then you're on Las Vegas for six years, you don't remember shit.
Guest:It's all just glopped together.
Guest:But if you're on Saturday Night Live for two years and then don't work for three years and then you're on Jerry Maguire for 14 days, maybe that's why.
Guest:But I remember sitting there waiting and Tracy Morgan was waiting with me at some point.
Marc:I'm going to get Mark Marrow pregnant.
Marc:Yeah, but all I remember was that his hair was perfect.
Marc:like it was like you know it was shiny it was like i'd seen him before it was tight man that 19 like mid 80s afro well it was already a resurgence i think he really jim hill does it on the news here in la he's got he refuses to get rid of the afro it was it was just did tracy have his shirt on or off it was everything was on he was focused and together and grateful and like you know happy to be there and very polite
Marc:I'm the anti Tim Meadows.
Marc:He didn't even say, like, I didn't sense an ounce of arrogance in his being.
Marc:I'm scared, Lord Michaels.
Guest:I'm scared of what I could do to America on the airwaves.
Guest:If this is live, you're going to need a delay like Richard Pryor's gold shoes on.
Guest:Uh, so I told him, look, I got some, uh, and he goes, look, you're the future of the show.
Guest:We all know it.
Guest:So just sit tight, ask Mike Myers, uh, and some of the other guys that have been around a while.
Guest:It's a, it's a waiting game.
Guest:It's just the way the corporate world works.
Guest:But, um, we have big plans for you.
Marc:So you didn't even get to your pad.
Guest:I never picked it up off the floor.
Guest:No, I got the pad up.
Guest:I never found my pencil.
Guest:Did you sit down or was this all standing?
Guest:No, and that fucking prick let me unroll the carpet to get out.
Guest:He did.
Guest:So after he talked to you- He goes behind his desk and I don't know, like this is pre like everyone automatically goes on the internet.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So you just hands behind the head like,
Guest:You gonna let yourself out?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Tell Aaron when you're done.
Guest:And I had to unroll it like the world's biggest, furriest joint.
Guest:I had to unroll this carpet to get out.
Guest:And then I wasn't on for the next four shows.
Guest:And then I said, well...
Guest:who's a comic no one really knows that I could steal a bit that probably won't get traced back to them?
Guest:You know, it was fucking Rick Shapiro.
Guest:And Rick Shapiro, I told him in the book, if I ever see him on the street, I'll tell him, my God, I am so sorry.
Guest:But I saw a YouTube clip of Rick Shapiro going, people go, yeah, but he apologized.
Guest:He wrote a book.
Guest:He didn't fucking apologize to me.
Guest:I haven't seen you, Rick.
Guest:I apologize.
Guest:But on this, it sounds pretty ephemeral to just on a podcast go, Rick, I'm really sorry.
Guest:But it's deplorable.
Marc:So it's interesting to me that I wonder, let's talk about your career in that way.
Marc:So you were fired from SNL?
Guest:It's always ambiguous.
Guest:We want to extend you to June 15th, and then, you know what?
Guest:We need till July 10th, and now we need till July 30th.
Guest:Can you wait till August 13th?
Guest:And you go, no.
Guest:And they go, okay, good.
Guest:So you don't know.
Marc:So you fired yourself.
Guest:Even that you don't know.
Guest:They still fuck you on the way out.
Marc:But from what I can see, because we're going to be able to cover it all in detail, that there was an arc there that you were, whether you know it or not, you were ambitious, you were focused, you were hungry, and you had a lot of charisma, a lot of power.
Marc:And you got into Jerry Maguire, right?
Marc:And that was big.
Marc:And then you had a... I saw you in Go.
Marc:You did a couple other movies.
Marc:Are you writing?
Guest:I just thought of something.
Marc:Go ahead.
Marc:And there was an arc there where I think...
Marc:What I'm getting at now is that your career... Has ended.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:No, I mean, I think that the plan was, and I think that what you saw at one point in time, that you were going to have a big movie career.
Guest:I thought I was going to be named above the title guy.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And that was the goal, and there was no reason not to think that, given what you were doing.
Guest:Jerry Maguire, picture perfect.
Guest:You go, okay, I've set myself up perfectly for... And what happened?
Guest:I just realized, as you said this, I've had an epiphany.
Guest:SNL didn't work for me because it got in the way of my confidence.
Marc:Maybe that's right.
Guest:SNL put an absolute- Made you insecure.
Guest:It made me completely insecure and really just stopped the entire train and said, like when you're on the tarmac and they go, we're just going to sit here for a while, and you go, well, what's a while?
Guest:How long are we on the tarmac?
Guest:Because I need to take off?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:because I got shit I need to do.
Guest:So what is, how long is the wait?
Guest:How long, because I don't want to play the bailiff and hand something to fucking, you know, Phil Hartman with no lines for two years.
Guest:That's not why I'm here.
Marc:Well, I think that's why, you know, I think that's why you probably stole in both instances is that you decided that, you know, in that moment that this was going to, you know, make the difference and it wasn't your shit.
Guest:just basically the joe biden of comedy if i can just take from bobby kennedy to deliver this tits out speech yeah in 88 yeah it'll put oh oh they they did fact checking in front i don't see in 10 years but that's what it comes from it's like what i got ain't good enough i'm going to do it this way
Marc:I suppose.
Marc:It's still abhorrent.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Well, so the arc is, it didn't work out.
Marc:And then, you know, I mean, you still make money in show business.
Marc:You're a popular actor.
Marc:You did the, what is it, The Ghost Whisperer.
Marc:You did your show, The Gary's Not Married.
Marc:What happened there?
Guest:I guess it just didn't make enough money to stay in the air.
Guest:I liked it.
Guest:I mean, it's a sitcom.
Guest:So, I mean, it is what it is.
Marc:When you were in an ensemble, especially in that show, were you a nice guy to your crew and your staff?
Guest:I would say...
Guest:I would say I would probably have a 99% approval rating with anybody in television I've ever worked with.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:You seem dubious.
Guest:You never heard any feelings?
Guest:I'm well aware of the fact that what we're doing is absurd.
Guest:And that goes back to action.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Now, that was supposed to be... I remember that.
Marc:That got a lot of hype.
Marc:It was like, you know, this is what it... No one watched it.
Guest:Yogi Berra said, if people don't want to come, we can't stop.
Guest:How is Ron Zimmerman?
Guest:Do you keep in touch?
Guest:We've direct messaged on Twitter a little bit.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Is he all right?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I said he can come on the podcast if he brings Cher.
Guest:Cher.
Guest:He dates Cher.
Guest:Does he?
Guest:He fucking dates Cher.
Guest:Ron Zimmerman pulled Cher.
Guest:Huh.
Guest:That's unbelievable.
Guest:You didn't know that?
Guest:No, I didn't know that.
Guest:I don't know what he's up to.
Guest:I knew... And you know what?
Guest:From working with Tom Cruise on Jerry Maguire, watching him and whatever you think about him now... Who, Tom?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was with him a long time ago every day for 30 days.
Guest:And I mean 15 hours a day every day.
Guest:You see the cracks.
Guest:You see people...
Guest:go screwy and get nutty and be like, well, where the fuck, then where is it?
Guest:It's not here is all I'm saying.
Guest:Never knew everyone, hey, Mark, hey, Matt, hey, Matt, that cat, that's not your cat.
Guest:That's after being separated from you for like a month, he'd come back and go, that's a lot of, you know, that's nice.
Guest:I noticed coming up to five and you're like, why does Tom Cruise know this much about me?
Guest:And every person's name and being on time and being polite and I went,
Guest:wow like that's how you behave and then you do a movie like a tv movie or something like jimmy woods where he's literally like calling people cunts and you go oh my god if that was my first movie that's how i would act for the next 20 years so tom cruise to me was always like that when you see documentaries about like a college coach that really put a kid on the right like made him go to class and son you can't like the john wooden type guy like that's how he was with me
Guest:So I was well aware of the fact in my first movie that the people that are not acting work 100 times as an understatement, 100 times harder than any of the actors.
Guest:The actors get to take naps.
Guest:You show up, they say, what would you like for breakfast?
Guest:We're not going to need you for three hours.
Guest:When do you go lay down?
Guest:What would you like for lunch?
Guest:hey there's a hot dog truck you want me to get you something do you want coffee how are you oh you're sick let's bring a doctor to you to make sure this keeps going where's the crew guys at lunch these guys fuck they're fucking gassed and hair and makeup got to get there an hour before you and they got to stay after everyone's wrapped so i guess tom cruise showed me through example there's a very long answer to your question have you ever lost it on a set
Guest:I don't have a specific sure it would be ridiculous to say no but I'm positive that if I ever lost it on the set the situation certainly warranted it if someone's disrespected on a set it makes me it's not okay which goes back to the champion for the bullied
Guest:yeah but you but you have a little bully in you right no all right so all right so i guess you really i you your perception of me though is it's being clear is that one of a bully no i think there's which i think is like we've covered this before on your podcast you like to bust balls and you know depending on but you would you would have to agree i bust balls probably 80 85 90 percent less than i did when you knew me
Marc:No, no, absolutely.
Guest:Okay, but I think the confidence and the breaking balls sort of you go, well, he's a fucking bully, even though you've never raised your fist or shoved anybody or really said, like, what the fuck's your deal?
Guest:You're an asshole.
Guest:Like, I've never felt that way about anybody.
Marc:Well, I think one thing that the difference that I see in you, you know, certainly now and in general, that bullies need...
Marc:a crew that you know i've noticed that a lot of times bullies need a like people to go like right am i right i never had one yeah i don't either i never had but i'm not saying that you might be a bully no but you know i might be a bully but if you don't have a crew you're just an asshole you know but you know if you gotta you know well there you have it
Marc:But if you got a crew, then you got your apostles and everyone's like, no, you're right, man.
Marc:No, that was right.
Marc:Fuck that guy.
Marc:But if it's just you, you got no- So I'm walking up St.
Guest:Mark's place going, hey, Maren, nice pants.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you're like, what the fuck?
Guest:I don't feel well.
Guest:I only left to get chicken soup because I have a fever and I have diarrhea.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I see Jay Moore on the street and he makes fun of my fucking pants.
Guest:You know what?
Guest:He's an asshole.
Marc:But it ain't Jay Moore and that guy and three other guys.
Guest:It's just me, which I completely understand.
Guest:And all I can say is that was exactly the way I behaved, yes.
Marc:but okay this is funny it's not you're not on the stand but what i think what's what sure i have no you're not every day we should be okay well what am i russell brand every day we should be mark yeah he was something he's something that guy get him on my show help me what have you tried he's the only one i want yeah he's fun to talk to most fascinating human alive he's a very smart guy and he's like you know he's very yeah he can talk about anything very lyrically you talk to him it's like shakespeare yeah yeah
Marc:But let's just deal with the arc of the disappointment.
Guest:People's disappointment in me?
Marc:No, you.
Marc:It's a bigger arc.
Marc:No, I mean, you're a working actor and you're a working comedian.
Marc:And you're a guy that was clearly poised to do something that you expected would be much bigger.
Marc:So now here we are now.
Marc:And, you know, I have to assume that on some level you seem to have a lot of self-awareness about the arc of your career.
Marc:And even if you're joking about it when you say my career is over, whatever, the fact of the matter is, you know, given what you did, you have to be disappointed and a little heartbroken about it.
Guest:Was.
Guest:I certainly was disappointed and at times heartbroken and frustrated.
Guest:There becomes that self-awareness through that inventory when you realize this quote unquote not, how do I put this succinctly without sounding like a douche?
Guest:Well, you know, I'll just say it and if I sound like a douche, that's never stopped me before.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So this place of concession that I find myself in through my inventory, I've realized is an extraordinary place to live.
Guest:It's way above.
Guest:If I was at a urinal in high school taking a leak and someone tapped me on the shoulder and say, hey, you're going to own a house, you're going to have a beautiful wife, you're going to have two beautiful boys.
Guest:and you'll make X amount of dollars a year, and you can do these places, and you'll do a show here.
Guest:I would go, if they just showed me the last three years of my career, I'd go, holy moly.
Guest:That's beyond what my dreams were when I started.
Guest:It's not until you get a taste of the catnip when you're eating lunch with Tom Cruise and Christopher Walken where you go, I might be hot shit.
Guest:This might be a really fucking big deal.
Marc:I can live like this.
Guest:And it was Martin Short as Jiminy Glick that really put it all in perspective for me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:On his Broadway show, he brought me up on stage.
Guest:He goes, I'm sitting here with David Spade.
Guest:And that was the gag.
Guest:And you play along and you go, actually, I'm Jay Moore.
Guest:And he goes, well, how come you're not David Spade?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he goes, oh, Jay Moore.
Guest:He's been at it for 30 years and seems to just be hovering along in the show business middle class.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I remember at the moment going, I was kind of fucked up to say in front of a Broadway audience.
Guest:And then also I went back to my hotel going, I am in the show business middle class and it's awesome.
Guest:But it's only awesome if I realize, if I'm not having illusions of where I am, it truly is awesome.
Guest:right it's you have a little humility is what you're saying in terms of like you know yeah well humility from where you thought you might have been right to realize like uh you know now it's you're gonna have to audition for this pilot great let's fucking do it right because you know if i don't i i love auditioning i think it favors me i think if you're willing to audition it favors you
Guest:Because a lot of people are like, well, they're not going to make me a fucking offer.
Guest:I'm like, I'll audition right now.
Guest:Because I know I can weed through the guys complaining about not having an offer.
Guest:But just being in the showbiz middle class, the acknowledgement and the awareness as Coltrane's album, that becomes the resolution.
Marc:Right.
Marc:I think that also that in talking about what we were talking about earlier, I think there was a time when you were on the rise or you were, you know, bigger in your game in terms of where you were headed.
Marc:I think one of the issues in terms of the interview thing or the inventory thing is that I don't know that you really gave a fuck what comics saw to you.
Guest:Uh, I always did.
Guest:Ego.
Guest:Right.
Marc:But I mean, but there was a time where you thought that, you know, your stature would transcend the rabble.
Guest:But if I found out like that guy thinks you're a dick, I would say, why?
Marc:Right.
Marc:But I mean, I think I'm just trying to sort of figure out like, you know, that, you know, when you were, you know, heading upward and you were willing to do, you know, certain things, you know, that may have hurt people or may be considered wrong.
Marc:You were like, you know, what, what fucking difference is it going to make when I'm, you know, when I got everything.
Guest:No.
Guest:Categorically, no.
Guest:All right.
Guest:It mattered to me too much.
Guest:Ego.
Marc:Ego.
Marc:No, I get it.
Marc:But my point is that now you're back among us and you're fighting for your reputation.
Marc:I am?
Marc:Well, you know, you say, well, you want to resolve this.
Marc:You do not want to be in the shadow of, uh, you know, being accused of stealing.
Marc:And, you know, it's important to you that.
Guest:I understand what you're saying, but I also said the shadow of that accusation came from a very specific faucet.
Guest:No, like when I go do, you know, a Louisville improv or anywhere in the world, anywhere in the country, that's, that, that's not attached to me.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like when people come up to you on the street and tell you Robin Williams is a great comic.
Guest:No one has any idea that Robin Williams is accused of stealing copious amounts of material.
Marc:It's our community.
Guest:Like half hours at a time of material.
Guest:But when you were saying about, yes, it mattered very much to me about what people thought about me.
Guest:Very much.
Guest:It mattered.
Guest:It kept me awake if I knew a guy was unhappy with me and I would go out of my way to meet that guy and be nice to him.
Guest:It really mattered to me.
Guest:And you can frame it a different way, but that's... Oh, no, no, I'm not trying to frame anything.
Marc:I'm trying to understand.
Marc:Well, you framed it three different ways.
Marc:Well, I know, but I'm just trying... But none of them were to make you look bad.
Guest:It was to put some sort of... If privately somebody said to me...
Guest:I'm trying to think of somebody that was an equal or higher.
Guest:I always considered you, I always thought you were much cooler than me.
Guest:Higher, much cooler, obviously.
Guest:I mean, you had the Hound Dog Taylor records for crying out loud.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You turned me on to the real blues.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:If somebody said to me, Patton Oswald, he just thinks you're a dick, I would be so confounded as to why, because I love Patton Oswald.
Guest:And I would find Patton Oswald, and I would say, I've just heard through the grapevine that you have a problem with me, and I would need to sort it, and if the person said to me to my face, yeah, man, X, Y, and Z went down, I would say,
Guest:okay, good.
Guest:I can easily explain why that happened and I'm glad we're talking about it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But it really mattered to me.
Guest:Now for the first time, it doesn't because now I've realized the pie from which we're making up our comedian pie chart is so absurdly larger than any of us ever imagined.
Guest:It's great.
Guest:That guy doesn't like me.
Guest:There's nothing I can do about it because I know that all I'm trying to do is be nice to everybody.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:No, I mean, and I didn't bring you in here.
Marc:You know, I like you.
Marc:I'm not trying to.
Marc:You and I have always gone along with it.
Marc:Yeah, I'm not trying to.
Guest:To the chagrin of many others.
Marc:I'm not trying to accuse you of anything.
Marc:I mean, I think a lot of the reasons why I talk about certain things is my own sort of my own life.
Guest:I mean, I. I don't feel you're being accusatory.
Marc:All right.
Marc:When I look at your career and I see where you're at now and stuff, it's important to me to hear how somebody frames disappointment or frames transition in life.
Guest:I can give you a very good answer, I think.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:pre-hollywood uh middle class when i still when i was still chasing you know name above the title this that that like why aren't i jeremy renner's friend and the born legacy or so yeah that's disappointment once i can once i realize i'm no longer playing in yankee stadium and i move it over to shea yeah whatever i don't know you know sure sure once i'm no longer a laker and now i'm a clipper right
Guest:Now that I'm in the show, now it's not disappointment.
Guest:It's complete optimism.
Guest:And you're working.
Guest:Now in this arena of the middle class, let's get to work and let's see how much fruit we can shake from this tree.
Guest:So now it's the opposite of, but I understand what you're saying, but I think had I not had the awareness to realize through a joke from fucking Jiminy Glick-
Guest:That I was actually in the Hollywood middle class or showbiz middle class, I would be angry and disappointed.
Guest:But now knowing I am in the showbiz middle class, I've always been a disgusting optimist.
Marc:But those guys really in the long haul work more than the other ones.
Marc:Once you're in the show business mode class, it's a good place to be if you're capable and you're talented and you can change it up and do what's expected.
Marc:I think it also is very helpful to me to hear certain things because I'm in production for this show and I literally had a conversation.
Marc:We're in pre-production.
Marc:I had a conversation with my writers.
Marc:I said, should I go over to the production offices and say hi and make sure everything's going well?
Marc:It's my show.
Marc:But there's something, because I realize, and I think that what you're saying is that I've got to remember to do that.
Marc:When you're self-centered and you're full of ego, whether it's negative or even self-inflating, it can go either way.
Marc:If you think you're the shit or you think you're a piece of shit, it's the same amount of ego energy.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:so like the idea that you know like you you got to respect the people that are that are really working harder than you to make you know what you're part of work and you know and and you have to tell yourself it's like you go you know it's not instinctual when you're a self-centered person to to you know to go over and and make sure everybody's all right if you hate if you loathe yourself it's well why do they want to see me and if you love yourself it's well why don't they want to see why should i go over there and see them right
Marc:So it's an important lesson in life in general is to go out of your way to make sure other people are okay if you don't instinctively think that.
Marc:Some people are just like that.
Marc:They're like, that's their life.
Marc:I hope everyone's okay.
Marc:Unfortunately, mine is like, what about me?
Guest:I think you wanted your podcast to be more...
Guest:What about me?
Guest:It was originally.
Guest:And when you read old comments, it seems like you wanted to steer it that way towards almost self-saboteur.
Guest:I've already done all that.
Marc:Why am I going to sabotage something that it's just me in my garage?
Guest:But then I think as the podcast became the sum, what is it, greater than the sum of the parts, I think you had no choice to just steer it back into the light because-
Guest:When I listen to your podcast, which is, I mean, I listen to four.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Not four of yours, four total.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm always happy when I listen to yours because I go, this is the guy I had lunch with on the Lower East Side.
Guest:This is the guy.
Guest:Because you and I have always gotten along.
Guest:I mean, talk about strange bedfellows.
Guest:You and I are two guys that probably shouldn't be this comfortable with one another.
Guest:I'm a hack from way back, and you're a guy, and I said it on my podcast when you were on, no matter who's in front of me, I'm going to do whatever it takes to make them laugh.
Guest:If it's a prom crowd, I'm doing fucking prom jokes.
Guest:And you were from a school of thought of, I'm going to make people laugh
Guest:This way.
Guest:It's the only way I know how to do it.
Guest:It's a narrow beam of light I have.
Guest:And if you're in the beam, you get bathed in it.
Guest:And if not, then you know what?
Guest:Fuck you guys.
Guest:You don't get me.
Guest:Is that fair?
Marc:Yeah, it was.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then now you're realizing through the podcast that you're, I think from listening, I've deduced that almost begrudgingly you've realized you're much funnier than you've ever given yourself credit for on a much broader level.
Marc:Yeah, I know.
Marc:I think that's true.
Marc:It just happened the other night.
Marc:I'm doing these things about my relationship and stuff.
Marc:They're my stories, and I realize they're relatable.
Marc:And I think that at some point earlier on, I don't think I wanted to be relatable.
Marc:I thought I was different, and I am different.
Guest:I think that's also the guys you emulated, like Cross.
Guest:They never tried to be relatable.
Guest:And they would sabotage auditions all the time.
Guest:I watched David Cross at an audition for MTV where we were all like super excited up in Boston.
Guest:And he said, all right, audience, come on, clap your hands.
Guest:Ready?
Guest:And everybody at Duck Soup was clapping their hands.
Guest:And he goes, okay, ready?
Guest:A one, two.
Guest:That motherfucker counted to 400 until they all walked out.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He was literally going 201, 202.
Guest:That was his set.
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Now, in hindsight, you go, that's fucking brilliant.
Guest:Yeah, it's funny.
Guest:But in 1991, with everything on the line, and you have your crafted eight-minute set, you're like, he's blowing it for himself, man.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Well, people used to do that.
Marc:I don't think I emulated them.
Marc:I just think that the way I thought about life was fairly self-involved and specific, but I didn't know how to talk about it in any other way.
Guest:But then why did you steal?
Guest:I mean, you're a documented thief of hearts.
Marc:You steal people's hearts.
Marc:I've broke a couple of hearts.
Marc:Haven't we all?
Guest:And you steal Carrot Top's girlfriends.
I did not.
Guest:That was a great podcast.
Guest:Did he say that about me?
Guest:No.
Marc:No.
Guest:wow uh that you know i didn't want to love or like your podcast because again as comics we think the pie is we're competitive and we think the pie is much smaller than it is yeah and i i think i told you this on my podcast i was listening to you with carrot top on my way into customs to go to vancouver to do a gig
Guest:And I'm the next person at customs.
Guest:And Carrot Top goes, that crowd fucking sucked.
Guest:I had to dig out of a hole early.
Guest:And then the lady waves to me at customs, like move forward.
Guest:And I'm listening to you in my earbuds.
Guest:I'm reaching for my earbuds and you go now to Carrot Top.
Guest:You go, now for you, is it an actual shovel?
Guest:And I step to the lady by going, now there's nothing in my ears anymore.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I'm earbud less.
Guest:I remove them on the approach and she's reaching for my passport and I go, and I realize you fucker, you got me.
Marc:I'm in forever.
Marc:WTF all the way.
Marc:Thanks, buddy.
Marc:Thanks for being here.
Marc:Thanks for having me.
Marc:That's it, my friends.
Marc:That is it.
Marc:It was good catching up with him, having known him since he was however old.
Marc:A child.
Marc:And go to WTFPod.com.
Marc:Got the merch there.
Marc:The Boomy Lives.
Marc:Boomer Lives shirts are...
Marc:We'll be right back.
Marc:Leave a comment if you'd like.
Marc:Do whatever you need to do over there at WTFpod.com.
Marc:Come see me in Philadelphia at Helium, December 6th through 8th.
Marc:More tour dates forthcoming.
Marc:Just getting them solid.
Marc:Getting them set up.
Marc:Why do I lose phrases?
Marc:I gotta go to the record store.
Marc:Boomer lives!
you