Episode 185 - Joel McHale, BJ Novak, Dwayne Perkins, Allan Havey, Jim & Eddie
Guest:Lock the gates!
Guest:Are we doing this?
Guest:Really?
Guest:Wait for it.
Guest:Are we doing this?
Guest:Wait for it.
Guest:Pow!
Guest:What the fuck?
Marc:And it's also, eh, what the fuck?
Marc:What's wrong with me?
Marc:It's time for WTF!
Guest:What the fuck?
Guest:With Mark Maron.
Guest:What the fuck?
Guest:Welcome to Live WTM at the Steve Allen Theater in Los Feliz, California.
Guest:How are you, what the fuckers?
Guest:What the fuck buddies?
Guest:What the fuckineers?
Marc:What the fuck nicks?
Marc:Man, I keep getting more of those things.
Marc:I keep getting more lists.
Marc:What the fuckstables I got recently.
Marc:What the fuckapinos is a new one.
Marc:I thought I'd ended that shit.
Marc:But no, they keep coming in.
Marc:How are you guys?
Marc:You all right?
Yes!
Marc:I got to try and focus, man.
Marc:You know, I've been feeling too good about myself, which, you know, is a problem for me.
Marc:People get nervous when I say I'm happy.
Marc:They're like, oh, shit, that's it.
Marc:I can't relate to him anymore.
Marc:Let's read some emails.
Marc:I have a great show tonight, by the way.
Marc:I have Alan Havy back there, Dwayne Perkins, BJ Novak, Joel McHale is actually right back there from television.
Marc:Real television people right in the back there.
Marc:Here we go.
Marc:Oh, this was just a sweet letter I thought I'd share with you.
Marc:I'm glad you got to come up to Santa Barbara and see Jonathan Winters.
Marc:About 25 years ago, he caused a bit of a stir in town for a little while.
Marc:He was crank calling businesses all over town with his various characters.
Marc:How fucking great is that?
Marc:Once it made the local news, he toned it down a bit.
Marc:No one really seemed to mind.
Marc:Take care.
Marc:Eric gets that at Barbara.
Marc:I just wanted to share that because just like, you know, you heard the Jonathan Winters thing.
Marc:Just a picture of him at home going, oh, hello.
Marc:It's, you know, oh, it's so fucking hilarious.
Marc:Thanks, Mark.
Marc:Subject line.
Marc:Hi Mark, I'm pretty sure you get plenty of emails like this, but I figured I'd send you one more.
Marc:I'm an aspiring filmmaker slash writer slash director slash comedian type person.
Marc:living in New York.
Marc:Glad he's gotten honed in on exactly what he wants to do, that guy.
Marc:I graduated from college about a year ago, and I'm currently knee-deep in the what-the-fuck-do-I-do-next phase of my life.
Marc:I can see that in your job description.
Marc:It was amidst one of my most self-doubting and hopeless time periods of the last few months that I came across your podcast.
Marc:I quickly became addicted to it, and long story short, thanks to you, I'm no longer anywhere near as frightened as I was.
Marc:In fact, I am feeling very optimistic.
Marc:Here are some of the lessons your podcast has taught me so far.
Marc:One, being a neurotic, self-deprecating mess puts me in excellent company in this business.
Marc:It isn't just the overly confident, the firm handshakers, the consistent eye contact makers that get the good gigs.
Marc:Two, I need to try stand-up, if for no other reason than to thicken my skin.
Marc:Three, if you are attempting to build a career in show business, your flaws and weaknesses will either cripple you, leading to failure, or they will be the sole reason you succeed.
Marc:If you embrace unique idiosyncrasies in who you really are, they will be the defining element most palpable in your success.
Marc:Four, honesty is what gives art life.
Marc:I will keep listening and keep learning.
Marc:I hope you're doing well.
Marc:Next time you have a gig in New York, I'll come see you and say hello.
Marc:Best, Matt.
Marc:P.S.
Marc:I'm nowhere near as intense as I come across in this email.
Marc:I'm just hanging out mostly.
Marc:We've had a series of letters like this.
Marc:Disagree with you.
Marc:I have to disagree with you that dogs do not do things to be sneaky.
Marc:I own six Shih Tzu and breed them as well.
Marc:I have a male that is so smart that he waits until we are not looking to get into things.
Marc:For instance, if he thinks we have left the house for a while, he will get up on the kitchen table.
Marc:He will look around first to see if we are around before he does it.
Marc:He also knows that if we are around to leave our in-session females alone, but as soon as we leave the room, he tries to mess with them.
Marc:Our older male tells on him, so he will stop.
Marc:One of my females likes to trick the others into going outside so she can take their softened rawhide.
Marc:They are quite the bunch.
Marc:I would love to hear your opinion now.
Marc:Barbie, Shih Tzu Palace puppies.
Marc:Now, if you listen to this show, you know I've gotten a series of these letters.
Marc:about lizards, about birds, and now about dogs.
Marc:Now I was happy just to be content in thinking that my fans are fucking out of their mind.
Marc:But then a smart fan wrote me a letter saying that my name is like Mark Maroney's name who hosts shows on Animal Planet.
Marc:So apparently these people just do a Google search on a Mark with a C that has a similar last name.
Marc:So I get these fucking animal emails
Marc:that I really think I should start answering.
Marc:Like, it'd be so great if I just wrote back, your dogs are fucked.
Marc:I've never heard of that shit from a Shih Tzu.
Marc:Weird dream, I like those.
Marc:Hey Mark, just woke up from a dream where you slept with Debbie Gibson in the back of a van.
Marc:When you came out of the van, there were bees everywhere that you appeared to be some sort of leader of.
Marc:Just thought you'd enjoy that as much as I did.
Marc:Love the podcast, thanks for doing it.
Marc:Also, I think you're perfect for my mom.
Marc:Too bad you're so far away, Lauren.
Marc:Dear Marc Maron, I'm 21, I'm a college student, I masturbate a lot.
Marc:These are my people.
Marc:I will, after, in fact, this email... masturbate, because that's how I've ordered things in my head.
Marc:Hey, at least the kid's got a plan, you know?
Marc:I didn't have a plan when I was 21.
Marc:I used to be struck by surprise with the need to masturbate.
Marc:This guy's got a schedule.
Marc:But what I want to know is why?
Marc:It's a moment of ego.
Marc:I don't care.
Marc:Why can I not actually get with women?
Marc:This doesn't seem to be a problem for you.
Marc:I'm frustrated.
Marc:A girl from one of my classes winks at me, plays with my pocket zipper, yet nothing goes beyond that.
Marc:Not just with her, but with every other woman in my life.
Marc:What the fuck, very respectfully, Zack.
Marc:All right, well, let's work this out.
Marc:I find that the best way to a woman's heart is making them cry.
Marc:And then spending as long as they stay with you after that apologizing in some form or another.
Marc:No?
Marc:Nothing?
Marc:Maybe, okay, what's his name?
Marc:Zack.
Marc:Try this.
Marc:Try just saying, would you just fuck me?
Marc:Please, would you just fuck me?
Marc:Or, oh, maybe this one.
Marc:I masturbate to you all the time.
Marc:You remember the time you played with my zipper?
Marc:In my mind, it doesn't stop there.
Marc:That's a good one.
Marc:Try that.
Marc:I got it.
Marc:Zach, just be a dick.
Marc:Just when she goes to play with her zipper next time, just say, you know what?
Marc:Just don't fucking do that.
Marc:You will so get fucked that way.
Marc:Anything?
Marc:Did that help?
Marc:Did that help you?
Marc:But when you're being a dick, you've got to be confident.
Marc:Don't be a half-assed dick.
Marc:You've got to commit to being a dick.
Marc:If they see through it, then you're like, yeah, you're not really a dick.
Marc:You're just a softie in a dick's clothing.
Marc:Which I used to think I am, but it turns out, no.
Marc:I'm a dick a bit.
Marc:I'm getting better, though.
Marc:I'm a recovering dick.
Marc:One more email, then we're... Don't worry, this email is positive.
Marc:I was making out with a girl last night while watching Almost Famous.
Marc:When you said your lock the gates line, I laughed a little and she got offended.
Marc:First that I was laughing at her, and then when she realized it was the movie that I wasn't paying enough attention to her.
Marc:When I said that sounded like something you would say, Mark, she said, I shouldn't act like I know you.
Marc:So I guess the real point of this email is that I want to make sure that you are cool with me acting like we're friends around strangers based solely on me listening to the podcast.
Marc:Let me be clear, I'm not saying that we are friends in the sense that I call you or we hang out, just that on occasion I say things like, I bet Mark would like that.
Marc:Or more commonly, I bet Mark would take issue with that.
Marc:For your information, I didn't make it to pound town last night.
Marc:Worth it.
Marc:Josh.
Marc:All right, let's bring out our first guest.
Marc:You know, I'm thrilled to have this guy on the show because I've known him and respected him for at least 20 years, 25 years.
Marc:I mean, when I first saw him, I think I was 12.
Marc:And I'm kidding, Alan.
Marc:That was a joke.
Marc:He's always been very difficult with me, and I'm glad he's here.
Marc:Please welcome Alan Havey to the stage.
Guest:Right here.
Guest:Hi, what the fuckers?
Marc:How are you?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Many of you might remember Alan from his show on the original Comedy Central back when it was on radio.
Marc:It was called Night After Night.
Marc:I'm sorry.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:We had that many viewers.
Marc:Can we get the ages of people when they were watching that show, please?
Marc:Oh, very good.
Marc:You had made a big impression.
Marc:I got an email today that said Alan Havy had me as his audience of one when I was a senior in high school on Night After Night, and I'm from a little town in Maine, and I was the hero of that town for one week.
Guest:Yeah, it was fun.
Guest:They were like the co-host of the show.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like the sidekick.
Marc:Wasn't it, like if I remember correctly, it was just a dude or a woman sitting there with some sort of rope?
Guest:We had a velvet rope.
Guest:They were in a theater seat off to the side.
Guest:Just one person.
Guest:And every now and then I would throw to them and get their comments and stuff like that.
Guest:We had people call up and say, I didn't get enough time.
Guest:You know, my family said, I really got screwed.
Guest:You spent more times with audiences of ones, you know.
Guest:Great way to meet women, though.
Guest:Really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Should we tell Zach that maybe he should create an audience of one situation?
Guest:He should keep his penis in his pocket.
Guest:So when they open it up, cock just comes out like that.
Marc:Now, am I remembering correctly?
Marc:I mean, you interviewed like fucking everybody.
Marc:You were on that, you were on every night for how many years?
Marc:Just over three years.
Marc:For three years.
Marc:Now, in my memory, did you interview Dave Mustaine from Megadeth?
Marc:How come I remember that?
Marc:Did something happen?
Guest:No, nothing.
Guest:It was just a regular interview.
Guest:That's you at home, you know, hitting the bong, jerking off.
Guest:We had Tupac on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah, we had Steve Allen.
Guest:Of the theater.
Guest:He's named for the theater.
Guest:Everyone in showbiz, anyone that couldn't get on Letterman or Arsenio or Carson got on our show.
Marc:Maybe you were like a boxing ring, a gym.
Marc:You can train for Letterman if you go to Havy.
Guest:I think they did that, actually.
Marc:What was the best guest that you ever had on there?
Guest:Is it like a weird... Dana Delaney was great.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:The actress.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:It was because I always wanted to meet her.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I had a big crush on her.
Guest:So, you know, they would say, who do you want on the show?
Guest:I said, Dana Delaney.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, and she came on and we flirted and I sent her flowers afterwards.
Guest:Nothing happened.
Guest:It was just... It was exciting, you know.
Guest:How often did you try to contact her after?
Guest:Three or four times.
Guest:I wore my China Beach sweatshirt outside of the plaza.
Marc:No!
No!
Marc:Now, when we were in New York, I don't remember when I first met you, but I always thought that... February 1987.
Marc:Stop it.
Marc:Did you actually look that up?
Guest:No, you opened for me at Caroline's.
Guest:Oh, fuck.
Guest:How'd that go?
Guest:I just remember waiting for you to get the fuck off.
Guest:You would go up on stage, and you always did over.
Guest:You always went over your time.
Guest:That's why we didn't get along.
Guest:Is that why?
Guest:For 20 fucking years?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:Every time I sat across from you, I felt like... 20 fucking years, I come in today, you hug me, you give me pizza, come on.
Marc:That's because we broke the ice recently at the cellar.
Marc:We decided that we were okay with each other, or at least I decided... No, you decided you were okay.
Guest:I was fine.
Guest:You know, it was just... Caroline, you know, you're supposed to do 20 minutes, 25 minutes, 27 minutes.
Guest:You're on a stool, you know, kind of, hey, man, you're doing that, hey, you were the first, like, alt comedian.
Guest:So I go, what the fuck is this guy doing?
Guest:And he's on a stool, like, hey, man.
Guest:And, you know, and I'm offstage waiting for a punchline.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then like 28 minutes you, and then, okay, you get a big laugh and go, this is it, I'm ready to go on.
Guest:You gotta get your game head on.
Marc:Well, if it takes 28 minutes until you get my first laugh, I'm gonna stay on a little longer.
Guest:And then you would say, you would take a pause and go, so what else?
Guest:And I'd be backstage like, what the fuck?
Guest:Who is this guy?
Guest:And then a month later, I go to the punchline.
Guest:You're opening for me.
Guest:Same shit.
Guest:In San Francisco?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Oh, you're like, oh, fuck.
Guest:How did this guy get here?
Guest:And I remember talking to him.
Guest:I said, dude, listen, you really, you know, do your time.
Guest:Wear a watch.
Guest:And you said, I'm not into time, man.
Guest:Yeah, come on.
Guest:And I go, oh, shit.
Guest:And that's when comedy really started going downhill.
I think.
Guest:The same shirt, I think you had on.
Guest:Oh, fuck.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Am I going to take that?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:No, the cellar, the night you came in, it was like you were pissed off.
Guest:I think it was right after a divorce.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:So that could have been any day the last three years.
Guest:But it was fresh because I said, how's it going, Mark?
Guest:And then 38 minutes later, you know, you were done.
Guest:And I brought you up?
Guest:No, you were at the table at the Comedy Cellar upstairs in New York, and you're pissed off, and you're talking about this and that, and you're eating ice cream.
Guest:And Ben Bailey was there, Cash Cab.
Guest:Ben Bailey was there, he goes, how can you be pissed off eating ice cream?
Guest:It was like, it was chocolate, nuts, and you're like... Just enjoy a spoonful, then go back to the bitch, you know?
Guest:I was feeding the void, Alan.
Marc:I was trying to fill a gaping hole in my heart with ice cream.
Guest:But that's the only time I really have trouble with a comedian is when they go over, or they steal stuff, and you never stole anything.
Guest:No, no.
Marc:So that's good that that was really the core of the grudge, and we dealt with that.
Guest:You dealt with it.
Guest:I was fine.
Marc:I know, but I wasn't fine, so the relationship wasn't working.
Marc:But I've always had a good time when I've been around you if I didn't feel like we were mad at each other.
Marc:I always liked watching you.
Marc:It was weird because I honestly remember this.
Marc:I think I've talked to you about this before.
Marc:Before I started comedy, I think when I was still in college, I was watching TV and they had some sort of TV show where you were the guy.
Marc:I didn't know who you were, but they were following you around New York doing like nine spots.
Marc:Did you ever do some sort of news show or something?
Guest:Well, I did the news show in 84, the Lorne Michaels show.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Is that what I'm thinking of?
Guest:No.
Guest:Interview Magazine followed me around.
Guest:Right, right.
Marc:And it was one of those things.
Guest:And it was a Catch Your Rising star, and Warren Beatty was in the crowd.
Guest:And they came in following me with cameras, and he got up and ran out the door.
Guest:And I said to him, it's not about you.
Guest:And I've always wanted to say that to Warren Beatty.
Guest:How'd he take it?
Guest:He didn't like it.
Guest:He didn't like it at all.
Marc:So that was, what year was that?
Guest:That's like 88.
Guest:87, 88.
Marc:Yeah, that was in between me giving up and starting again.
Marc:I remember that.
Guest:Yeah, you looked like you had a lot of angst and a lot of pain.
Marc:Yeah, I feel better now.
Marc:The angst is softening and the pain is just life.
Marc:And I had to accept that.
Marc:Could that be the cats?
Marc:Yeah, the cats have helped.
Marc:I think I'm finally over the divorce.
Marc:I got a nice woman in my life today.
Marc:You got nice fans?
Marc:Yeah, the fans are nice.
Marc:This is good for you.
Marc:Yeah, I just don't know how to let it stay happy.
Marc:And I'm not going to ask you for advice, but there's that moment...
Marc:Why wouldn't you?
Marc:Well, because, like, do you have moments where you experience joy and your eyes well up and you look at the sky and go, yes.
Guest:My eyes don't well up, but... Oh, but you haven't?
Guest:No, yeah, I'm very grateful for a lot of things.
Marc:See, that's a gratitude thing I'm not good at.
Marc:Because I'm too busy, like, you know, what the fuck?
Guest:Wait, wait, wait, no, this... But don't lose that angst.
Guest:No, no, I don't think it's going away.
Guest:It's always there, but, you know...
Guest:Aren't you happy this is your gig and no one can fuck with you, no corporate guy, no one can say, don't do this, don't tell that joke, tone it down a little bit?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, that's it.
Guest:You've taken stand-up, which is why we love stand-up, because nobody fucks with us, really.
Guest:And you brought it into something new.
Guest:Yeah, where I don't have to have a punchline for 28 minutes.
Marc:I'm kidding.
Marc:See, it's starting again.
Marc:Right there, I felt the weird old Alan and Mark thing.
Marc:Like, I just, like, this is exactly what, like, I know you're one of those dudes where it's like, it's like, you know, if I just overstep a little bit, then all of a sudden shit gets real and I'm out.
Marc:Not here.
Marc:Not here.
Marc:This is my room.
Marc:This is my house.
Marc:Yeah, at the cellar.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I'm gonna have it out.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:No, but you're right.
Marc:I'm very happy about that, and recently I've been battling with a sort of free-floating resentment towards industry for no reason.
Guest:No, there is a reason.
Guest:There's always a reason to resent the industry at any level you're at.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, listen, when you were pissed off in the clubs, Young Comic, if you had gotten a sitcom, you would have been pissed off in the sitcoms.
Guest:It would have been horrible.
Guest:If you got in a movie, you say, fuck, opening weekend didn't go.
Guest:The fucking publicity sucks.
Guest:It doesn't matter.
Guest:When you're pissed off in this business at 19, unless you change or adapt, you're going to be pissed off the rest of your career.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Lorne Michaels told me, this is back in 84.
Guest:I was 29.
Guest:He said, if you're not happy, by the time you make it, you will never be fucking happy.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:And that was great advice.
Guest:So good that neither one of us really made it.
Guest:No.
No.
Marc:We don't have to cross that fucking... No.
Guest:What an asshole.
Man.
Guest:I'm in the same boat.
Guest:No, right now we're making it.
Guest:We're here.
Guest:We're on your show.
Guest:They're here.
Guest:This is it.
Marc:I think that's a good way to look at it.
Marc:Gratitude.
Marc:I should have gratitude.
Marc:And I should stop hanging on to that bullshit.
Marc:But here's my fucking problem.
Marc:Did you paper this room?
Marc:No.
Marc:But this is my problem.
Marc:Because I...
Marc:I got this crazy dad, right, and I know I should be over it, but the truth of the matter is... Is your dad still with us?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Okay, see, my dad's dead, and he's still crazy.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So... Why, because he's in you?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:And I fucking... Oh, they fucking... And times I love him.
Guest:I did a show about that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My dad would wake me up when I was a kid at eight years old in the middle of the night and wake me up to watch Carson.
Guest:Really?
Guest:When I was a kid, yeah.
Guest:If he had molested me, I'd be an agent.
Guest:But...
Guest:Oh, wow, we have some agents here tonight.
Guest:Well, I want to be an agent.
Guest:And I think it was his dream to be in show business.
Guest:And so when I got into show business, there was resentment from my dad.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah, I remember when Carlin came on in the early 70s.
Guest:And he hated Carlin.
Guest:He loved him up to that point when he came out with long hair and a beard.
Guest:I go, oh, this is my comedian.
Guest:That's where the gap started between me and my dad.
Guest:Up until then, I was my father's son.
Guest:After that, I was on my own.
Marc:Yeah, you were George Carlin.
Marc:Yeah, George Carlin had left him, and now you left him.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Because Carlin needs to be a short-haired guy.
Marc:I work with Jack Burns.
Marc:And funny.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Goofy.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But he woke up.
Guest:He used to wake you up to watch.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Come on, Alan.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:Your mom's the sleigh of skull.
Guest:Let's go.
Yeah.
Guest:You know, and I'd make Braunschweiger and... But you'd laugh together, right?
Guest:So that's nice.
Guest:Yes!
Guest:That's the fucking greatest.
Guest:And when my dad would watch, I was eight, nine years old, when he would laugh, I'd kind of, you know, oh, that's funny, and that's great.
Guest:So I would watch my dad watching Carson, you know, and that's how I got this bug.
Guest:It's one of the reasons.
Marc:Well, that's a nice thing.
Marc:Yeah, and I think that what I find my big problem was, and I'll just talk about this for a second, is that I'm very happy about the show and about the people that like the show, and I love doing the show, and all the things you say are true, but now I've got to stop myself from getting cocky and going, fuck you, I did it without you, you fuckers.
Guest:Without who?
Guest:Show business.
Guest:No, no, this is show business.
Marc:Oh, all right.
Guest:I guess I gotta be clearer on that.
Guest:Right now, you'd just be a guy ranting and fucking pissed off, but since they're here, it's show business.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Maybe I should clarify.
Marc:Corporate show business.
Marc:Like, you know, there's part of me that's sort of like, you know... You're in the Steve Allen theater.
Guest:It's not like, you know, you're in a fucking tent in Idaho.
Guest:Let's move it outside!
Marc:Now,
Marc:Now, this is a hard thing that I have to acknowledge is that you've been doing comedy longer than me and you've been on the road longer than me because I'm just now starting to work it diligently.
Marc:I go out every week and I love it.
Marc:But you start to realize, fuck, bombing or not doing as well as you might want to, that just happens.
Marc:And it's just part of the fucking gig.
Marc:And it's not the time to say, fuck you guys.
Guest:You don't get me.
Guest:Yeah, but you take more risks on stage than I do.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:because I have a lot of material that, you know, has punchlines over the years.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, no, punchlines.
Guest:Oh, really.
Guest:And I remember I was at a dinner party a couple years ago with my wife, and there were professionals, her friends, or friends of her friends, and I was the only comedian there, really the only artist.
Guest:There was a couple lawyers and a doctor and a dentist there.
Guest:Oh, dentist, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, and they were real, real condescending to me.
Guest:Just, oh, the comedian, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Like that shit.
Guest:So, you know, I said, like, I'm like, fuck you, in my head, not for them.
Guest:And so the dentist said to me, hey, what's it like to bomb?
Guest:What's it like to be up there and not get laughs?
Guest:And I'm like, oh, okay, really?
Guest:Let me put this, and so I said, good, I'm gonna give it to him with both barrels.
Guest:So I said to this guy, I said, let me put it in terms you'll understand since you're a dentist.
Guest:You got an eight-year-old kid in the chair, right?
Guest:Trying to pull a tooth.
Guest:Tough tooth, won't come out.
Guest:So you go get a pliers from your toolbox.
Guest:You yank and yank on the head and the whole fucking head pops off.
Guest:The bloodstream from the kid's neck knocks your diploma off the wall.
Guest:You look out in the waiting room and you see your wife sucking the cocks of everyone you hated in high school.
Guest:Then you shit yourself, you jump out the window, you're holding the kid's head, and the head starts calling you a loser.
Guest:But it's not the kid's voice, it's your father's.
Guest:That's what it's like to bond.
Marc:Alan Haney, ladies and gentlemen.
Marc:My next guest, very funny, and he lives in my neighborhood.
Marc:He's been on Leno, he's been on Conan.
Marc:Please welcome the very hilarious Dwayne Perkins to the stage.
Marc:What's up, buddy?
Marc:Hey.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:Dwayne.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Highland Park.
Marc:Highland Park.
Marc:In the house.
Marc:How long do you live there?
Marc:You know our mailman, the guy who works at our post office is here.
Marc:Victor, how are you, buddy?
Guest:Oh, Victor.
Guest:Hey, what's up?
Marc:Do you go in there?
Marc:On work?
Marc:He helped me before and he said he knew you.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:You gave me a walking tour of Eagle Rock.
Guest:Did he?
Guest:Yeah, I haven't done it yet, but I will.
Marc:I will.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:He's very into the arts community thing.
Marc:Right.
Guest:But I live in Highland Park.
Guest:I'm very honest about that.
Guest:I don't lie about that.
Guest:Why would you lie about it?
Marc:They'd say what, Eagle Rock adjacent?
Guest:Well, I hang out in South Pass.
Guest:Because I think they're trying to change Highland Park.
Guest:You know how in New York, they change neighborhoods?
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Because I say I live in Highland Park, and the first thing anyone asks is, well, are you north or south of York?
Guest:Yeah, right.
Guest:And I'm like, oh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:This is what's happening now.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:I'm south of York.
Guest:Oh, shit.
Guest:Yeah, right.
Yeah.
Guest:But I'm close to South Pass on the other end.
Guest:These guys don't know our neighborhood.
Guest:By Fig?
Guest:Yeah, like South Avenue 57 is my exit.
Guest:So I can walk to Herman.
Guest:I can walk to South Pass.
Guest:And it's a Latino neighborhood.
Guest:And I'm from New York.
Guest:And in New York, it's like Puerto Ricans and blacks.
Guest:Yo, what's up?
Guest:Which New York is that?
Guest:No, we get along.
Guest:There's nothing in the hand.
Guest:What I mean is we get along, right?
Guest:Puerto Ricans and blacks.
Guest:It's fun.
Guest:My nephew, he's a quarter Puerto Rican.
Guest:And his name is Angel.
Guest:So he's almost full Puerto Rican with that name.
Guest:So I move into Highland Park.
Guest:You probably have no worries because you're a white guy.
Guest:Yeah, but I've heard about this.
Guest:I move in and like...
Guest:The next week, I just start reading all these articles about they're killing black guys in Highland Park.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:The Avenues gang.
Guest:Right, right.
Guest:Yeah, welcome to the neighborhood.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so now I hang out in South Pass, and sometimes I won't wear red or blue just so they don't get it confused.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it's a little bit limiting.
Guest:But no one's bothered me.
Guest:But you hear things.
Marc:You hear things.
Marc:It was in the paper.
Marc:Right, right, right.
Marc:No, I actually read those articles.
Marc:But you have not had any experience with anything?
Guest:No, it's cool.
Guest:It's cool.
Guest:But...
Guest:To be fair, I don't hang out in the neighborhood anymore.
Guest:My plan was to support the local businesses and everything.
Guest:And then I was like, oh, they're killing black people.
Guest:All right, well, I'm going to go to... I'm going to go to South Pass.
Guest:In South Pass, they love black people.
Guest:It's really nice.
Marc:But you grew up in Brooklyn?
Guest:I grew up in Brooklyn, yes.
Guest:What part of Brooklyn?
Guest:Coney Island, actually.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:So with all the dead rides?
Guest:Yeah, I grew up Coney Island in the 80s, the crack era.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it was a different kind of amusement park.
Guest:Yeah, it was... And people don't get that from me, because, you know, my look and everything.
Guest:But, yeah, I grew up with people, you know, trying to smoke crack in the elevator.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, you're like, can you just press six?
Guest:And, you know...
Guest:You know, when you finish with the crack.
Marc:When you go to Coney Island, you remember the roller coaster that they used in Annie Hall?
Guest:The Thunderbolt.
Guest:Cyclone.
Marc:No, no, no.
Marc:They built one, right?
Marc:No, no.
Guest:It was there.
Guest:It was an old one called the Thunderbolt.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:But it's all covered with ivy now, right?
Guest:Yeah, I think they knocked it down.
Guest:I think where it used to be is now the Mets minor league team plays there.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:The Cyclones.
Marc:Oh, but the Cyclone you're talking about is still that fucking, is that roller coaster?
Marc:It's still there.
Marc:It's so scary, it hurts your neck.
Marc:It's like fucking wooden tracks, and everybody wants to go on it because it's Coney Island, and you're always like, don't fucking go on it.
Marc:It's going to hurt you.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:We did a remote on night after night.
Guest:Oh, you did?
Guest:Yeah, where I wanted to go in the city, I go, let's go to Coney Island.
Guest:And so I went on the cyclone.
Marc:Oh, nice, Gary.
Marc:It's a little roller coaster, but for some reason, they haven't changed anything about it, and it just jerks you around, and it's not fun at all, but you think you've done something, and you don't realize you've hurt yourself.
Marc:Right, right.
Marc:Did you go on it a lot?
Guest:A lot, yeah.
I used to...
Guest:I love it.
Guest:I used to work down there for like a summer on a kiddie ride and whatever.
Guest:Really?
Marc:Which one?
Marc:Like the little boats or the bumper cars?
Guest:Just something that goes around like this.
Guest:Something for the kids that moves in this direction.
Guest:And it's weird because when you're a kid, it's exciting.
Guest:And even by the time you're like 16, you're like, I think these kids are retarded.
Guest:How could they like this?
Guest:You just have nothing else to do.
Guest:It's going one mile an hour.
Guest:How could they... So what were you doing in Culver City?
Guest:How come you came from Culver City?
Guest:Okay, in Culver City, there's a show called Hell's Kitchen.
Marc:Oh, shit.
Marc:Gordon Ramsay.
Guest:What's his name?
Guest:Yeah, it's Gordon Ramsay.
Marc:The British guy?
Guest:The British guy.
Guest:He's kind of nuts and a little angry, and now he's trying to do healthy shit?
Guest:He screams at people and things.
Guest:So I got tickets to be in the restaurant and just eat for free.
Guest:Oh, so you didn't appear on the show?
Guest:No, like, they might come to your table and say, how's the food?
Guest:But I was eating from Team Red, the Red team, the girls.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was cool.
Guest:I mean, you just hear him screaming at people.
Guest:And the only problem was the first episode of the season.
Guest:So the food was not as good.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because it's got to be an arc, right?
Guest:The first...
Guest:They can't come out like, voila, I know what they're doing.
Guest:Holy shit, this is the best thing ever.
Guest:You gotta go like, oh, you could do better.
Guest:And the blue people, the people who are waiting on the blue team, they didn't eat at all.
Guest:Yeah, because he got mad and he kicked the blue team out the kitchen.
Guest:No, he did not.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's like, you guys are a disgrace.
Guest:And he just had bread.
Guest:And I thought, you can't keep people for four hours and not give them a sandwich or something, right?
Guest:Not as a cooking show, I wouldn't think.
Guest:Yeah, a cooking show.
Guest:Well, they did that.
Guest:But I think that happens every... Has anyone here watched the show?
Guest:Oh, you watch it?
Guest:I think that happens a lot, right?
Guest:Like the first show.
Marc:He kicks him out of the kitchen.
Marc:And that's just okay behavior for a guy because he's on TV with a fucking apron on?
Marc:If I didn't have, my fucking wife leaves.
Marc:Right, right.
Guest:I do that all the time, but I can't say, like, I'm trying to make some good food.
Guest:But you know what else I learned?
Guest:This is the most interesting thing I learned today is that they had waiters there, and they're good-looking waiters and waitresses to help.
Guest:And they're actually actresses, right?
Guest:Surprise, surprise.
Guest:Not real.
Guest:So they could be real waiters.
Guest:And there's a woman there who runs a... The woman I'm eating with, she runs a real catering business, like not a TV thing.
Guest:And this catering business, when you go to get a job, you have to bring your head shot.
Yeah.
Guest:And they only hire really good-looking people to be caterers.
Guest:Because it can't be, oh, this is a great steak.
Guest:It's got to be, this is a great steak, she's hot as shit, and this is just really nice.
Marc:And I think the saddest part of that story is that they all have headshots.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That, like, there's never an apprehension.
Marc:Like, they might not have a headshot.
Marc:You're applying for a job as a caterer?
Marc:Do you have a headshot?
Marc:Oh, yeah, you want my newest one?
Guest:Right, right, yeah.
Guest:That's where we live, I guess.
Marc:Now, do you, like, I know you did Conan, and you did Leno, and did I, were you, I was just in England, and did you go to England?
Guest:I did, yeah, I just got back in South Africa as well.
Marc:You went to South Africa?
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:What the fuck was that like?
Guest:Well, you know, it's supposed to be dangerous.
Guest:Everybody lives behind a fence.
Guest:And I guess I live behind a fence here in L.A.
Guest:as well.
Guest:And I won't walk in my neighborhood.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So I felt at home.
Guest:I was actually there for the World Cup.
Guest:I was there just two weeks ago, but I was also there when the World Cup started.
Guest:And the thing is, the U.S., we had the number one attendance at the World Cup, which is kind of shocking.
Guest:So they all fly down?
Guest:Yeah, but it's like, that's a U.S.
Guest:thing.
Guest:It's mind-boggling.
Guest:I think that's why other countries hate us, because we kind of do douchey things.
Guest:Like, we're going to show up and just compete and beat the world at their sport that we don't play or watch.
Guest:And so...
Guest:Why don't people want to see us lose, too?
Guest:A lot of fans come just to watch us lose.
Guest:I know, but Americans were there, and it's not even our fifth favorite sport.
Guest:It's like in the U.S., soccer is right below the WWE and right above hide-and-seek.
Guest:That's kind of... That's where soccer is in the U.S.
Guest:But it is, you know...
Guest:South Africa is a bit, it's nice, but it's dangerous.
Guest:What it is, is what you talk about a lot, and people, like you read an email about capitalism, it's kind of like capitalism way that way, where like a few people have the money.
Guest:And you know, there's rich black people, like a new rich black class.
Guest:So a nicer fence?
Guest:Yeah, like a new rich black class and rich, you know, not all white people are rich, but some rich white people.
Guest:Then there's a lot of poor people.
Guest:So that's a bad combination.
Guest:That's going to lead to kidnappings and things of that nature.
Guest:My buddy there, he's one of the top comics, and he lives in like a subdivision in South Africa, but it could be Valencia, you know, or whatever.
Guest:The Valley.
Guest:Yeah, right.
Guest:And I go to his house, and because it's Africa, it's a weird mix.
Guest:Because on Saturday, I'm there on Sunday, we're having a party,
Guest:But on Saturday, he killed a sheep in his backyard.
Guest:On purpose?
Guest:Yeah, like he bought it from the butchers, took it home, and killed it.
Guest:And I go, and then took it back to the butcher to have the butcher cut it up.
Guest:And I go, why didn't you let the butcher just cut it up?
Guest:And they're like, well, you know, the blood has to be spilled here in this house because we're giving thanks.
Guest:And I go, I guess foolishly, oh, you mean kind of like a sacrifice.
Guest:And they're like, hey, hey, hey, hey.
Guest:Hey.
Guest:Easy.
Guest:Easy.
Guest:I thought that's what a sac... Okay, all right.
Guest:Killing a sheep by any other name.
Guest:Was it a religious thing?
Guest:No, just... It's a tradition.
Guest:I think what happens is people keep things, keep traditions, but they lost contact with what it meant.
Guest:Drastic tradition.
Guest:Someone told him he had to do it.
Guest:He killed...
Guest:His father told him he had to do it, and his father before that said, you got to kill a sheep in the backyard.
Guest:We ate the sheep.
Guest:And if I tell people that story without mentioning it was a subdivision, people go, oh, Africa, yeah, you went to hunt, you killed it, you fucking hunted, you got a sheep, you know what I mean?
Guest:It's like, no, he went to the butcher, he bought the sheep, he put it in his Mercedes Benz, and he drove back home.
Marc:Well, on some level, that'd be a pretty shitty safari.
Marc:Right, right.
Marc:What's your bag?
Marc:Yeah, a little sheep.
Marc:Got a little sheep out there.
Marc:You know, and the Serling, Serling Getty.
Marc:You know, there's a lot of other animals, but the sheep are, you know, those are really, they're the fun ones to kill.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Can't kill an elephant.
Marc:That's a lot to drive home.
Guest:Right, right, exactly.
Guest:You can't put that in a mini.
Guest:And how was England for you?
Guest:England is great.
Guest:You know, I don't,
Guest:The shows are great.
Guest:They have an interval, which you probably know that.
Marc:That's the weirdest thing to me.
Marc:You're right in the middle of your acting, and you're like, okay, go to the bathroom.
Marc:I'll be back in a second.
Marc:You get used to it, though.
Guest:You get used to it.
Guest:It works, because the crowd, they get refueled, and here, you would lose the crowd.
Guest:But there, you don't lose.
Guest:They come back, and they're ready.
Guest:They smoke.
Guest:They have a drink.
Guest:They're used to it, yeah.
Guest:And they don't do drink orders during the show.
Guest:And they don't give people their checks while you're on stage.
Guest:Yeah, it's better.
Marc:It's amazing.
Marc:And it's culturally, they know it's going to happen.
Marc:But the first time I dealt with that, I'm like, what the fuck are you doing?
Marc:Because you're dealing with American audiences.
Marc:They're going to turn into seven-year-olds if you let them stray for a few minutes.
Marc:That's why you only do 20 minutes.
Huh?
Marc:Oh, you like that?
Marc:You like that?
Guest:But you did all right over there?
Guest:Yeah, I did well.
Guest:I don't have a social base over there, so it's not that... What does that mean?
Marc:Friends?
Guest:Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Guest:So... Social base.
Guest:Sort of like a subdivision.
Marc:I don't know why I said that.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:So it's good.
Guest:I just...
Guest:It's like I'm home.
Guest:I work out every day.
Guest:I go to Starbucks and write, and then I do my shows.
Guest:So it's not exciting.
Marc:Well, it's good that you got out and worked out.
Marc:I couldn't do that in Europe because I have a problem with the metric system.
Marc:I can't get on treadmills that are in kilometers because I'm like,
Marc:how the fuck do I know how long I went?
Marc:I don't want to lift weights if they're in kilograms.
Marc:It doesn't make sense to me.
Marc:I'm such an idiotic American.
Marc:I'm up on my computer trying to figure out how many kilometers is a mile and how long would I have to run in kilometers to do what I did?
Marc:And by that time, I'm like, I'm napping.
Marc:Yeah, no, it's stuff.
Guest:Well, I'm doing P90X, right?
Guest:What does that mean?
Guest:It's a workout thing.
Guest:Push-ups, pull-ups.
Guest:It's the X. It's extreme.
Guest:Is this like one of those infomercials?
Guest:Yeah, it's 90 days of an extreme workout.
Guest:And how's that going?
Guest:You go like this.
Guest:You go, X. You do that by yourself?
Guest:Well, they do it in a tape, and you feel good when you do it.
Guest:X. You know what I mean?
Guest:But you're doing that in your hotel room, and you're going to X?
Guest:I do it everywhere, yeah, I do it.
Guest:But I try to do it in the park.
Guest:It was a nice day in England, in London.
Guest:I'm like, I'm gonna go to the park and do chin-ups and push-ups, right?
Guest:We do that in New York.
Guest:We do chin-ups at the don't walk sign.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And then we get arrested.
Guest:So I try to go to this park, in Hyde Park in London.
Guest:Nice, it's that winter, it's nice.
Guest:I wanna go to the monkey bars, and it's a kiddie park, and they won't let me in, because I don't have a kid with me.
Guest:So now I'm like a pedophile.
Guest:Now it's a situation, and everyone's looking like, did he just get denied park entry?
Guest:Like, what's his deal?
Guest:And it was uncomfortable, so I had to go to a tree, and I worked out.
Guest:I did pull-ups on a tree branch, yeah.
Guest:Dwayne Perkins, ladies and gentlemen.
Guest:Thank you, man.
Marc:Thank you very much.
Guest:Let's move down.
Marc:We leave the mic.
Marc:Moved down.
Marc:I'm thrilled to have this next guy on.
Marc:I actually am.
Marc:Because I gotta talk to him.
Marc:I met him a while back.
Marc:I think right around when he got here to L.A.
Marc:And then, you know, it seemed like within days, he was on television.
Marc:Please welcome BJ Novak to the stage.
Marc:BJ...
Guest:Hey.
Marc:Hello, BJ.
Guest:Hey, Mark.
Guest:Thanks for having me on.
Marc:I love your show.
Marc:It's very nice of you to be here.
Marc:But what I want to know is this, is that you came, you grew up in Newton.
Marc:I did some research.
Marc:Like, you know, I talked to Conan about this, and you went to Harvard?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What does it do to you people?
Guest:Well, it means you're very serious before you get there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's probably the most telling detail.
Marc:Which means what?
Marc:You were just constantly doing homework, compulsive, focused?
Guest:Yeah, you're just very intense.
Guest:Anything you pursue, if you write for the school paper, you take it as life and death, which I did.
Guest:If you're in a school play, you commit to your character in Anything Goes, the musical.
Guest:So I think it probably, if it says anything, it means you were very, very serious before.
Guest:And then you went to a place where there were other people exactly like that, that same level of focus and seriousness.
Marc:So was there like a, is that, would you call that healthy competition?
Guest:I don't think it's competition.
Guest:It is for some people.
Guest:For me, it was intensity.
Guest:And if you love comedy, you want to make Dr. Strangelove.
Guest:You're not fucking around if you're in that group.
Guest:What did you study?
Guest:I studied literature.
Marc:Did you write a thesis or anything?
Guest:I wrote a thesis on the films of Hamlet.
Marc:So you were a Shakespeare guy?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I haven't read all the plays.
Guest:I'm very unwell-read for a literature student.
Marc:Me too.
Marc:It was an easy major.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Just kind of bullshit your way through it.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, it's more about can you write a great paper on the same book again and again?
Guest:And you don't really... I couldn't tell you a thing that happens in The Great Gatsby and Huckleberry Finn.
Guest:I mean...
Guest:I also have a bad memory for literature a lot, but I'm exaggerating somewhat, but I'm extremely not well-read.
Guest:But Hamlet.
Marc:Tell me about Hamlet.
Marc:Hamlet.
Marc:He was fucked up.
Marc:Hamlet, I know.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And he was fucked up.
Marc:He was involved with a crazy woman, right?
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Marc:Am I getting it right?
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Well, you see what you want to see.
Yeah.
Guest:Keep going.
Marc:But, like, I'm one of these guys who, like, I read a lot and I studied literature, but I don't fucking like Shakespeare.
Marc:You just responded, look how invested you got in Hamlet.
Marc:I'm invested in fucking eating.
Marc:You know, I...
Marc:My intensity is not relative.
Marc:I'm excited about it because I don't know about it, but I know I should like it, and that's what makes you a smart person.
Marc:Can you riff on a little Shakespeare?
Marc:Can you give me a little right now?
Guest:Can I give you a little?
Marc:Well, yeah.
Guest:Again, I'll show you how not well-read I am.
Guest:I wrote my literature thesis on Hamlet, and it was on the line, to be or not to be.
Guest:So, again, I did not range that far from what you would absorb watching Looney Tunes.
Guest:LAUGHTER
Guest:But my thesis was about... It was about to be or not to be.
Guest:That is the question.
Guest:I can give you that.
Guest:And it was about how... I did that this morning.
Guest:Right, there you go.
Guest:But I do it in my own language.
Guest:It's universal stuff, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, that struggle... I love Shakespeare.
Guest:I did.
Guest:And it was... To me, everything else of that era, I don't like old-timey stuff.
Guest:I don't like...
Guest:I don't 19th century British novels.
Guest:I mean, no, I don't like any of that.
Guest:But Shakespeare was, you know, I went to the Louvre once and I walked down that hallway and I was like, I'm not going to look at the Mona Lisa.
Guest:Like how that's so corny.
Marc:You're a rebel.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And then I walk and it's not like I recognize anything else or any other story.
Guest:So I'm like, I came all this way.
Guest:I'd be such a fucking idiot not to like, look at the Mona Lisa.
Guest:And you walk down that hallway and everything is so boring.
Guest:And partly it's because we know it's the Mona Lisa.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Still, you get there and everyone has this blank sort of royal face on all the paintings.
Guest:And then there's this one painting in the whole gallery that has any degree of wit to it.
Guest:And she's just smiling like that.
Guest:And you're like, that's the one.
Guest:That's the famous one.
Guest:And to me, that's what Shakespeare is.
Guest:It's the only one of that whole realm of classics that actually...
Guest:like gets it yeah you know it's actually not above it all or pristine or whatever so I really did like it but I don't think for the reasons that people you know in cartoons like Shakespeare because it's fancy yeah I hate that stuff I liked it because it actually wasn't fancy so you got it and everything else yes it talks about life and all its facets power class struggle
Guest:Sure.
Marc:Relationships, love, pain, death, and all of that.
Marc:It's all in there in every fucking sentence in a language that I can't fucking put together.
Marc:And if I read four lines of it, I'm like, I'm glazed over and tired.
Guest:I couldn't tell you what happens in...
Guest:most of the plays, you know, I glaze over Henry IV, I don't know, but I know when a guy's thinking of killing himself or obsessed with a crazy girl, I perk up or thinking of killing his wife, you know?
Marc:I went and watched William Hurt, I believe he did, you know, Richard II or something, the fourth, I don't fucking know what it was.
Marc:And I loved William Hurt and I said, this is how I'm going to get into Shakespeare.
Marc:I wanted to kill myself.
Marc:within a half an hour, and it went on for three fucking hours, and it looked like William Hurt had had enough.
Guest:Well, I don't... Look, I don't read it these days.
Guest:I'm not yelling at you.
Marc:I'm not saying you're here representing Shakespeare.
Marc:I'm not mad at you.
Guest:I wish I were.
Guest:I mean, it would be a very lofty thing to represent.
Marc:Well, let's represent The Office.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:You're on that show.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:A little bit.
Marc:Okay, okay.
Marc:You're definitely on that show.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:I saw you do stand-up, and the reason why I think that I started to like you was...
Marc:was there was some moment where I did a set, and you were in the room, it was at the improv, and I'd watch you do sets, and you were very calculating, you wrote great jokes, you had a very efficient delivery, and you were getting it.
Marc:But I still wasn't clear on who you were up there, and I don't know if you were either.
Guest:I completely agree with you.
Marc:And then like one time I did a set and I killed and it was just a 10 minute set and you walked up to me and he said, how'd you fucking do that?
Marc:And from that point on I said, I like this kid.
Guest:I definitely meant it.
Guest:I mean, not just that you were very impressive, but I,
Guest:You know, and other... Sometimes people would come up to me, not at your level, but people that were... I was sort of of the one-liner.
Guest:I didn't get it.
Guest:I didn't know who I was on stage, basically.
Guest:But I really wanted to do it.
Guest:I knew what a joke was, and I was too...
Guest:I didn't have the self-confidence to get on stage with anything other than what I thought was an airtight joke.
Guest:So I would work very hard on just, I know the audience won't feel I wasted their time if I give them this, you know, or at least I hope so.
Guest:Really, as tight a one-liner as you could do.
Guest:Oh, yeah, no, they were great.
Guest:Well, I'm not saying they were great, but they were tight.
Guest:I'm saying they were good.
Guest:Thank you very much.
Guest:They had no room for, it wasn't me on stage.
Marc:It was just the joke.
Guest:Yeah, it was the joke, and I was sort of jealous and, not in a negative way, but aspirational towards people who could get on stage and be themselves and make that interesting.
Guest:I didn't know how to do that.
Guest:I was still trying to learn to do that.
Guest:See, I'm liking you even more now.
Guest:Oh, Mark.
Marc:But now tell me, how did The Office come around?
Marc:Because you directed some episodes, you're a producer on the show, you seem to have... I don't know what... How did you do that?
Guest:Well, The Office...
Guest:Seriously.
Guest:I was hired as a writer-actor, which was sort of an experiment by Greg Daniels, which he then extended to some other people who had also worked wonderfully with, Mindy Kaling and Paul Lieberstein.
Guest:And the idea was to have the show be more like sketch comedy shows or British shows where people, it's kind of like a troupe.
Guest:They write it and they act it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like a Shakespearean group?
Guest:Like the British office or SNL.
Guest:I'm not here to be pretentious or preach about Shakespeare.
Guest:I'm not saying you were.
Guest:I was just trying to do a callback.
Guest:I'm sorry for stepping on.
Guest:That's all right.
Guest:So that, you know, just being there all the time in the writer's room, it meant you just naturally, first they call you staff writer and then story editor and then executive story editor and then producer.
Guest:It's all the same thing.
Guest:I mean, you're just there.
Guest:You're part of the council of... There's no pay grade?
Guest:Oh, there is, but you're doing... It just means you're three, you're four.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:Super-duper writer.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Did you get that one?
Guest:Super-duper writer?
Guest:I'm going for that.
Guest:That's next year if I stick around.
Guest:And they would let people, you know, writers direct and actors direct.
Guest:It's not really like doing five different jobs.
Guest:It's like committing your life to trying to make the office funny.
Marc:Right, and having good representation.
Guest:Yeah, sure.
LAUGHTER
Marc:Did you hear that laugh?
Marc:My manager, yeah.
Marc:I know that laugh.
Marc:That is a laugh that satisfied bitterness.
Marc:See, that laugh always comes after the other ones, and it comes from a place that can't be controlled.
Guest:That's what that was.
Marc:That's a joyous laugh to hear.
Marc:That guy feels better.
Marc:He just wants me to take some more shots at you.
Marc:Yep.
Marc:I'm not going to do that, though.
Marc:No, no, no.
Marc:No, it's a lovely conversation we're having.
Marc:God damn it.
Marc:So now tell me, now, did your dad... All right, I'm going to talk about your dad.
Marc:All right?
Marc:Well, we'll see where it goes.
Guest:But yeah, I love him.
Marc:But he was a writer as well.
Marc:Still is, yeah.
Marc:And did he or did he not edit a book of Jewish humor?
Guest:He did.
Marc:Now, did you grow up with that?
Marc:Was your dad the kind of guy that's like, come here, kid, listen to this one?
Guest:He is a sort of a cool-headed guy.
Marc:But he didn't tell you, like, yeah, like... He's not a rambunctious personality.
Guest:Well, the books were around, and I think he was happy when my brothers and I kind of discovered them.
Guest:But he wrote... He is also a ghostwriter, and also his first book was a...
Guest:a non-fiction account of the experience of using marijuana.
Guest:So he had a sort of a bookshelf devoted to all his research of all the books.
Guest:So there's a shelf in our house.
Guest:Did you just say your dad smoked a lot of weed in the house?
Guest:Not that I was aware of then.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I've pieced together.
Guest:There must have been more going on than I was aware of.
Guest:As evidenced, for example, by his kaleidoscope collection, which is his main hobby to this day.
Guest:He kept me in the dark.
Guest:I read the preface to that book, and I was like, oh, I guess sometimes nonfiction books have fictional prefaces, because otherwise it would say my dad's doing drugs.
Guest:But there was a shelf of drug books and a shelf of Jewish humor books and humor books, and I ran contra books and whatever, basketball books, whatever he was working on, and my brothers and I discovered the humor books, and he was, I think, quietly thrilled.
Guest:He didn't want to push humor on us and have us hate it, I think, but...
Guest:He was very happy.
Marc:That'd be horrible to have sons that hated humor.
Guest:It feels like a dark Twilight Zone.
Marc:You tell your kid a joke and the kid's just like, no.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Not funny, daddy.
Guest:Next.
Guest:I had this plot I always wanted, maybe I'll still do it for The Office, where Dwight's, it turns out Dwight's parents paid him to have fun and then one day stopped paying him so that he would never choose to have fun.
Guest:Which I think would be an incredible parenting technique.
Guest:so run it by me again because I may be a parent you say go out and have fun and come back and tell me and if you really had fun I'll give you a dollar and then daddy I went out and I did this and I had fun great here's a dollar then one day he comes back he's like I'm not paying you for that anymore you can do it if you want then the kid would come back and just not have fun he'd be like fuck that I'm not having fun for free I'll do my homework
Marc:I can't wait to be a parent.
Marc:It's a good theory.
Marc:Is that going to happen for you?
Marc:Are you getting married or anything?
Marc:Do you have a woman?
Guest:Someday I would love to.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:How's that go with you?
Marc:Joel has kids.
Guest:Oh, Joel's coming out in a second.
Marc:He's next, yeah.
Marc:Do you have any advice for the guy that can't get laid and masturbates a lot but girls touch his pocket zippers?
Guest:It sounds like he's doing well to me.
Marc:How are you with the ladies?
Marc:All right?
Guest:B minus.
Marc:Could be better, could be worse.
Marc:I just work on a pass-fail thing.
Guest:No, a pass.
Marc:I don't pressure myself with grades.
Guest:Well, so are you doing anything else that I can resent?
Guest:No.
Guest:Just the office.
Guest:Just the office.
Guest:Nice.
Guest:No big deal.
Guest:No, that's all.
Guest:That's all.
Marc:That's fucking awesome.
Marc:I love that feeling of laughing when I should cry.
Marc:How Jew-y are you exactly?
Marc:Um... Because, like, you're one of those... So that's a fail in Jewish.
Marc:You're right.
Marc:You have out-Jew-ed me, my friend.
Yeah.
Guest:Well played.
Guest:Were you brought up really Jew-y?
Guest:Jew-ish is the term.
Guest:I'm a Jew.
Marc:Can I feel free to use whatever word that I like to refer to my own people who I resent secretly?
Guest:Medium.
Marc:Medium Jew?
Marc:Me too.
Marc:So you did the bar mitzvah thing.
Guest:Everybody was happy.
Marc:You don't really remember it.
Marc:Did you get confirmed?
Guest:As what?
Marc:As a Jew?
Marc:Like after the bar mitzvah?
Marc:Jews don't get confirmed.
Marc:No, you do.
Marc:Maybe that was just a racket my synagogue did.
Marc:Where you'd get bar mitzvahed and then you had to go once a week for confirmation.
Marc:I think that's a Catholic thing.
Guest:We didn't get baptized either.
Marc:I guess I was a light Jew then.
Yeah.
Marc:No, we just had to keep going to Hebrew school to sort of seal the deal, and I just said, fuck that, I'm not going.
Guest:Right.
Guest:No, I remember stopping that, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:But let me ask you a question.
Marc:This might be too personal, but I just, like, because I have this theory about, because I'm, like, I'm, you know, I don't really activate any sort of God consciousness in my mind, because I just would rather be a, you know, a picky consumer and masturbate.
Marc:So...
Guest:You're pandering to that one listener right now.
Marc:Yeah, I do that all the time.
Marc:This show usually goes out to just one person at a time.
Marc:So there's no problem in pandering to one.
Marc:But were you ever taught as a Jew that God meant anything?
Marc:meant anything yeah like did you were you taught how to use god because i think you have to be taught how to use god to believe in god i mean i knew he was around apparently but no one ever planted any fear in me about it and no one ever said you have to believe in it it was just this idea that had no meaning to me whatsoever and i just wanted to know maybe this is too heavy interesting well no i mean it's a great it's a great point i think i think it's a hilarious setup
Guest:Well, we got our laughs.
Guest:I think I probably, I was raised sort of religiously similarly in the sense that it was not, God was left sort of with a sort of wise smirk for you to figure out.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But I think I took that in a more positive direction than maybe you did.
Marc:And I remember, you know, I was more... You didn't take it with the direction of,
Guest:Why are you laughing?
Guest:No.
Guest:But yeah, I think, I don't know.
Guest:I was a good kid.
Guest:I thought, oh, how wonderful.
Guest:Could be anything.
Marc:You're still a good kid.
Marc:Oh, thanks, Mark.
Marc:I keep looking for darkness in you.
Marc:Oh, there's darkness, sure.
Marc:Oh, good.
Marc:Can I have some of that?
Marc:You don't need any.
Marc:OK.
Marc:BJ Novak, ladies and gentlemen.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:Let's move down.
Marc:That was great.
Marc:That was very fun.
Marc:We're good, right?
Marc:We're cool?
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Sometimes I don't know if I'm controlling what I'm trying to hide.
Marc:I'm kidding.
Marc:That was horrible.
Marc:How you doing, Alan?
Guest:Good.
Marc:All right.
Marc:By the way, when I was a kid, God was everywhere.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Everywhere.
Guest:Catholic?
Guest:Yep.
Guest:Oh, God.
Guest:How'd you fucking survive?
Guest:Jerked off under the covers.
Guest:That's all I had.
Guest:So you were given the fear of God?
Guest:Oh, God, yes.
Guest:Dwayne, fear of God?
Guest:Yeah, but I was afraid of people in my neighborhood more.
Marc:See, I don't know if I missed out on something or what.
Marc:No one told me to be afraid of God or anything.
Marc:I didn't understand the language.
Marc:It didn't fucking matter to me.
Guest:You think he doth protest too much.
Guest:Hmm.
Guest:Huh, BJ?
Guest:Nice.
Marc:I've been sitting on that for 20 minutes.
Marc:I'm done.
Marc:That was the other option for his paper.
Marc:Right now, it's my pleasure to bring out a guy that I actually performed with at the Palms in Las Vegas.
Marc:What was that?
Marc:That must be five or six years ago.
Marc:Yeah, and your name was on the marquee, and I think I said, he doesn't even fucking do stand-up.
Marc:Was that... And from the... He's from TalkSoup and from the... What is it?
Marc:The Soup?
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:And then...
Marc:He's also on a very popular and very funny show called Community.
Marc:Please welcome Joel McHale to the stage.
Marc:Hey, man.
Marc:I'm well, you?
Marc:I'm feeling like I'm being such a dick.
Marc:Like, I had this moment where I was bringing you up and I was fucking things up and I wasn't doing it on purpose.
Marc:And I'm realizing, like, dude, you don't have to be such a dick.
Marc:These are just people.
Guest:You're not being a dick.
Guest:I mean, you were to BJ, but not to me yet.
Guest:You guys are fucking, you're doing great.
Guest:Congratulations.
Guest:Well, it's NBC, so... We're still fourth.
Guest:It's not like we're helping them.
Guest:Yeah, but you guys are doing... I mean, they're helping them.
Guest:But you're doing the good shows.
Marc:Community is a fucking interesting show.
Marc:I interviewed Dan Harmon.
Marc:The guy's a fucking genius.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:And it's just fucking solid.
Marc:I've never seen so much comedy packed into so little time in my life.
Marc:God bless you.
Marc:I'm not saying I like it, but I...
Guest:Right, you're just horrifically jealous.
Marc:That's all right.
Marc:As we established, the God thing doesn't really mean much to me.
Marc:But no, I think it's an ingenious show.
Marc:Thanks.
Marc:And you guys have really come together as an ensemble.
Marc:It's almost like a fucking band over there.
Marc:How does it feel for you?
Guest:Is that a vague question?
Guest:No, it's great.
Guest:No, it's very specific.
Guest:When I got here, it was what I always wanted, to be on a show that I liked.
Guest:And believe me, when I got the opportunity and it was happening, I was like, it's happening.
Guest:And it wasn't like we were Glee, who came out the same year and is on the same lot.
Guest:A lot of singing teenagers around?
Guest:They're everywhere.
Guest:They're thrilled.
Guest:They're driving Maseratis.
Guest:There's signs everywhere.
Guest:They have to take down, like, you know, like the McDonald's, like billions, how many Emmy nominations, and then you go to the community soundstage, which is next to Dr. Phil, and I'm not kidding.
Guest:Dr. Phil guests get in the way of our shooting.
Guest:I am not kidding.
Guest:You have crying people?
Guest:Yeah, losers everywhere, and...
Guest:Including Chevy.
Guest:No, I kid.
Guest:Chevy, I love you.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:Let's go there.
Guest:It is this great group of people that have come together.
Guest:Dan picked this great guy, including people like Donald Glover, who is like some sort of savant.
Marc:He is.
Marc:He's hilarious.
Marc:He's so quick.
Guest:And I just saw his rap show, his hip-hop show in Brooklyn two weeks ago.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:How was it?
Marc:It was amazing.
Marc:It was great?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He's another well-adjusted young person like BJ.
Marc:It's unbelievable.
Guest:It's very... And when I see... Because Donald just turned 27.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was just like, fuck.
Guest:If that was me, I would be dead of AIDS.
Guest:And...
Guest:I guess no need to ask that question anymore.
Guest:No, but it would have been... I don't even know how he keeps... Yeah, it's great.
Guest:And then you've got people like... I'm sorry, I'm all right.
Guest:I'm just promoting the show now.
Marc:Yeah, you're doing a great job.
Marc:I'm sure Chevy and Donald are going to be thrilled at the promotion.
Marc:I'm kidding.
Marc:No, but it's amazing.
Marc:Even with BJ, there's something... How old are you?
Marc:Be honest.
Guest:39.
Marc:No, seriously.
Guest:Uh, 39.
Guest:All right.
Guest:The, um... All right.
Guest:49.
Marc:No, but, like, when I was younger, I just don't know where these... Like, when I was 27, like you were just saying, I was living out of boxes.
Marc:I was drinking.
Marc:I had taken a woman hostage.
Marc:You know, I... Really?
Marc:Well, yeah.
Marc:I met her at my brother's wedding, and I figured, like, she was the maid of honor.
Marc:I was the best man.
Marc:I figured, okay, if your friend's gonna take my brother, I'm moving into your place in Boston.
Guest:And I lived... And that's... You see, that is not what a regular person thinks.
Yeah.
Marc:Who the fuck ever said I was a regular person?
Guest:Well, I know, but taking people... Like, most people are like, I was 27, living out of boxes, having pizza every day, kidnapping people.
Guest:You know, what everybody does.
Marc:I meant emotional hostage.
Marc:Emotional hostage.
Marc:I'm sorry, I injected a little recovery talk in there.
Marc:No.
Guest:No, that's where... And I was... Really?
Marc:What were you doing at 27?
Guest:At 27, I was starting graduate school for acting.
Guest:Oh, you're one of those guys?
Guest:Because I was like, I need to go to school to try to figure this out.
Marc:You went to graduate acting school?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Where?
Guest:The University of Washington.
Yeah.
Guest:Let that just... You're welcome.
Marc:Was that a good program?
Guest:It's the Harvard of... Yes.
Guest:No, it's... No, it actually is a very good program.
Guest:It's very different.
Guest:It's very progressive.
Guest:What does that mean?
Guest:How much more progressive is acting?
Guest:Listen to this.
Guest:We studied a Japanese form of acting called Suzuki.
Marc:I know that.
Guest:Suzuki is... Yes, it's marching.
Guest:I marched for three years.
Guest:I hurt my knees doing it.
Marc:Right.
Guest:I use it all the time.
Marc:The woman I took hostage did Suzuki.
Marc:She did?
Marc:Yeah, she was in a Suzuki class.
Marc:When she practiced, I'm like, you're being taken advantage of.
Guest:I definitely did feel that the first two and a half years.
Guest:By the third year, I was like, oh, this makes total sense.
Marc:But they keep telling you all you're doing is that squatting and marching, and this is what you have to perfect.
Guest:Yeah, and then you'd ask about it.
Guest:They were like, mm, just keep doing it.
Guest:What was the point of it?
Guest:Well, it was to do complicated physical acts that would exhaust you eventually, while at the same time in your brain doing whatever thing you were working on for your acting.
Guest:I know it sounds crazy, and it's kind of like you're trying to do a lot at once, and then it supposedly gets you out of your head.
Marc:Did that work?
Marc:No.
Guest:I think maybe it's... I don't know.
Marc:What other things did you take in acting class?
Marc:Because I'm fascinated by... No, that was the first four hours of the day.
Guest:That was Suzuki?
Guest:I am not kidding.
Guest:Holy fuck.
Guest:We would get there at nine and go until lunch.
Marc:Did the second half of the day involve sword fighting?
Guest:We did get certified as sword fighters.
Guest:You did?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah, as fighters and sword fighters.
Guest:Yeah, uh...
Guest:Yeah, it once again comes in very handy.
Guest:Did you do Meisner?
Guest:Yeah, we did a lot of Meisner technique.
Guest:No, well, we touched it.
Guest:I was thinking more of the Alexander technique.
Marc:Alexander technique.
Marc:What is that?
Marc:That's where you get your chakras or you get your chassis in line?
Guest:No.
Guest:In a way, yes.
Guest:Not your chakras, but your chassis in a way is that you're trying to undo all the bad habits that you have collected up until the moment.
Marc:But then what are you?
Marc:Once you undo those, you're just like...
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Did you get there?
Guest:No.
Guest:They constantly were disappointed.
Marc:But, like, give me an example of what, like, give me an Alexander technique exercise.
Guest:Well, it was always weird, because they would get, I would, she would be like, just walk across the room, and she'd be like, oh, boy.
Guest:And, uh...
Guest:And then she would touch one part.
Guest:She would go like this.
Guest:And she goes, just let that.
Guest:Just feel that.
Guest:And then I walk across.
Guest:I'm like, I do feel better.
Guest:And I swear to you.
Guest:So I had been doing it.
Guest:I had no idea what it was doing.
Guest:And then one day I was sitting in a theater.
Guest:And I began to have terrible back spasms.
Guest:And I was like, what the fuck's going on?
Guest:And it was because I was, for the first time in a long time, sitting up straight.
Guest:And I had done it for like three days straight, and my muscles flipped out.
Guest:I'm not joking.
Guest:And I know I sound like a loser.
Marc:So you had to learn how to sit up straight, because I don't do that.
Marc:Yeah, it's working now.
Marc:No, it really did work.
Marc:But that's just because you're around me.
Marc:Because I like literally, when I see myself on television, I'm like, what am I?
Marc:Do I have scoliosis?
Marc:Like every time, and I'm conscious, I'm like, you're on television, push your back up, and I'm still like...
Guest:Right, but if you look at a little kid, no little kid is slouching.
Marc:I did, I did.
Marc:Not only did I slouch, but I was a mouth breather.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Yeah, my dad would say, quit slouching.
Marc:What are you trying to catch flies?
Marc:That was my childhood.
Guest:When you were like five, you were doing that?
Guest:I mean, because little kids don't slouch.
Marc:So you're saying that when I was younger and just like kind of doing that, I didn't slouch?
Guest:Yeah, you probably moved like a dancer.
Marc:Yeah, that's probably right.
Guest:So yeah, there was a lot of, and it actually helped a lot, because if I had come here, it would have... Now, were you the star of your acting program?
Guest:Be honest.
Guest:No, I was not.
Guest:There was another guy who was awesome.
Marc:Really terrific.
Guest:And where's he now?
Guest:He lives in Seattle and is very successful in an advertising agency.
Marc:Okay, so he quit.
Guest:He didn't have the fucking... Well, he had kids, and yeah, it gets complicated.
Marc:No excuse.
Marc:I mean, what are we trying?
Marc:Are we artists or are we fucking pussies here?
Guest:Wow.
Guest:He's very happy...
Guest:Well, he's very happy, I think.
Marc:Yeah, sure he is.
Guest:Why don't you ask him how it worked out for him?
Guest:Well, we could call him and see how he... His name's Jason.
Guest:No, he really was tremendous.
Marc:I like how much of an effort you've put into protecting Jason, but fucking Donald and Chevy right under the bus.
Guest:I didn't throw Donald under the bus.
Marc:No, I know you didn't.
Marc:Don't all you guys look at me like I'm doing something wrong over here.
Marc:I'm having a conversation.
Marc:Fascinating.
Marc:Did you know Alan and I were in a movie together?
Marc:Really?
Marc:Yeah, did you do that research?
Marc:No, I don't do research.
Guest:You said you looked at my wiki.
Marc:I did, and apparently you're Italian.
Guest:No, I'm not Italian.
Guest:But I was born in Rome, thank you.
Marc:How did that happen?
Guest:My dad was like Jason Bourne.
Guest:So you don't know where he is?
Guest:No, but every once in a while, he'll come out and break some necks.
Guest:My dad grew up in Chicago, and all he wanted to do was leave Chicago.
Guest:Now he loves it, but he saw a movie.
Guest:I think it was like he saw a movie like Roman Hall.
Guest:Yeah, and he was like, I need to go there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He was going to Loyola University in Chicago, and then they have a campus in Rome.
Guest:And my mom's family moved from Vancouver, BC, because my grandfather worked for the UN.
Guest:What are you hiding?
Guest:In the fisheries department.
Guest:I'm not kidding.
Guest:He would go around the world and try to help stimulate fish populations, which was always not going well.
Guest:LAUGHTER
Guest:I'm not kidding.
Guest:Since the 60s, the fish population has declined to the point where every meeting was like, well, they're using dynamite now to blow a fish.
Guest:So I hope everybody's happy.
Guest:I'd love to hear one of those fish tirades.
Guest:Oh, they were great.
Guest:Yeah, I bet you they were.
Guest:He would just go nuts.
Guest:Did he really?
Guest:No, he was always very kind of like, well, that's what happens.
Guest:Just eat it until you die.
Guest:So that's how you ended up being born in Rome.
Guest:Yeah, they met.
Guest:My dad was the dean of students.
Guest:My mom was a student.
Guest:And love happened.
Marc:That's sweet.
Marc:And in Rome it happened, which is a great place for it.
Guest:Did it hold up?
Guest:Yes, they're still married.
Guest:That's fucking amazing.
Marc:Congratulations.
Guest:No, it's great.
Guest:Yeah, and they still go back.
Marc:My aunt and uncle still lives there.
Marc:Oh, that's fucking awesome.
Marc:So what was the movie you were in with Alan?
Marc:I'm sorry, I didn't mean to take it away from it.
Marc:The Informant.
Marc:Oh, that was a good movie.
Marc:You guys were funny in that.
Marc:I remember you in that.
Marc:And I saw you just recently on Ray Show.
Marc:I just watched all of Men of a Certain Age, the new season.
Marc:That episode meant a lot to me, and that's all I'm going to say.
Marc:We did stand up at the Palms, me, you, and my ex-wife.
Guest:Well, no, you did stand up.
Guest:I got out there and... But I'm busting on you.
Marc:But you drew people, you know, and you're a funny guy.
Guest:It was because of the soup, which was starting out at that point.
Marc:Right.
Guest:It was small.
Guest:But you did something masterful there where that woman, I don't know if you remember it, but a woman basically was disrupting your set.
Guest:She was screaming and drunk, and you turned your power.
Guest:The Death Star shifted.
Guest:Did I touch your shoulder?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:But you slay... It was terrific.
Guest:And...
Guest:I still think back to that.
Guest:I was like, this is what you do when someone is doing this.
Guest:And it was masterful to watch you take apart this.
Guest:Because then you started interviewing her friends.
Guest:You're like, you're with this woman right now.
Guest:And you're like, how much of a disaster did you think this was going?
Guest:How much did she drink in the room?
Guest:And she kept on cackling.
Guest:And you were like, you are a black hole.
Guest:They are praying that you pass out here.
Guest:And they will leave you.
Guest:And to the point where she eventually shut up.
Guest:She was so wonderfully hurt.
Guest:And then she literally is like, I've been there, done that.
Guest:And then you, that was when, yeah, talk about Jason Bourne getting the asset to be put into the game.
Marc:Are you saying that's when the fun stopped for everybody?
Marc:No, that's when you're like, you're going to use that fun.
Guest:phrase, here, now, and you jumped all over.
Guest:It was great.
Marc:Oh, boy.
Marc:Yeah, I don't know whether to be proud or not.
Marc:But I'm glad they hadn't left an impression.
Guest:And then we saw each other again at that weird NPR interview thing.
Marc:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Guest:That round table of... What was that?
Marc:It was like... Where the fuck was that?
Marc:Help me out.
Guest:It was in Pasadena, I want to say.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Guest:And that lady on NPR that does the... The political show.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Pat Morrison.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Pat Morrison.
Guest:That sounds right.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And it was three or four of us.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was the topics of the day.
Guest:Right.
Marc:That's right.
Guest:It wasn't too long ago.
Guest:No, that was like...
Guest:Three years ago.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:My first question was, hey, how's your wife?
Guest:And she's like, she left me.
Guest:And I'm like, fuck.
Marc:I was pretty open about that.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:All right, so let's talk about Chevy Chase.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Because doing that roast to him was one of the worst nights of my life.
Marc:And I've talked about it.
Marc:And he was very difficult.
Marc:You were really funny.
Marc:I mean, as you know.
Marc:But they edited it well.
Marc:It was really a horrendous evening.
Marc:And he was so nasty.
Marc:Is he better?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:No, he is better in that he is very, I mean, I've seen that roast, and that was a crazy night, but he is very happy to be on the show, and he does like the show a lot, and he likes, as he keeps calling us, the kids, and I'm like, I'm almost 40.
Guest:Do you guys treat him like a handicapped person?
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Guest:Well, Dan did this year where Dan broke his legs on a trampoline and then made him addicted to pills.
Guest:So I'm not kidding.
Guest:His character was in a wheelchair and pills for half the season.
Guest:So we literally had to treat him like a handicap at one point.
Guest:And then we were looking for this.
Guest:In one episode, we lost a pen.
Guest:it all pointed to his cast that we had to saw them off and look for his pen.
Guest:And there was like beef jerky and other pens and it was, yeah, the smell was terrible.
Marc:Now let's talk about this gym problem you have because I've noticed that, you know, I watch on Community and I say like, Joel is going to the gym a lot.
Marc:I'm no Dwayne.
Marc:What's up?
Guest:I ran into him in an airport about three weeks ago, and he just built like a brick shithouse.
Guest:I said, you know, how often do you work out?
Guest:He goes, I just run and starve myself.
Guest:No, I don't run either.
Guest:I starve myself, and I do push-ups.
Guest:That's it?
Guest:I swear to you on my list.
Guest:Do you think this is a healthy?
Guest:I even read a thing where, and Dwayne will back me up.
Guest:If you do pull-ups and push-ups, that's really all you need to do.
Guest:If you use your own body.
Guest:If you do push-ups, you're in a plank position.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So you're technically working on your abs at the same time.
Marc:And your butt.
Marc:What about your butt?
Marc:Oh, your butt too, if you're locked in at the core?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Are we fucking men doing this right now?
Guest:If you look at... Well, if you look at Herschel Walker, who never once in his life has lifted a weight.
Guest:He just did sit-ups and he did push-ups.
Guest:Alan, just because you got cut in the combine doesn't mean you need to hold it against Herschel Walker.
Guest:You can do jailhouse push-ups too, like...
Guest:A push-up, raise one leg, push-up, raise the other leg.
Guest:That's core.
Guest:And that's this.
Guest:And now he's almost 50 and is doing great in the UFC.
Marc:I don't know if this just became horribly sad.
Marc:Or horribly awesome.
Marc:Or that we're actually helping Peker.
Guest:But no, I really, I just don't, and Hershel Walker eats one meal a day.
Marc:So you eat one meal a day.
Marc:So you're basically an anorexic who compulsively does push-up.
Marc:Bulimic.
Marc:You throw up?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:I'm surprised you haven't noticed my breath.
Guest:No, I can't believe what I'm talking about.
Guest:I can.
Guest:Full-grown men do not need to eat nearly as much as we think we should because we're already full-grown.
Guest:There's no more growing to do other than out.
Marc:You're Mr. Control Freak.
Marc:I mean, where do you have joy in your life?
Marc:Don't you ever do?
Guest:Booze.
Booze.
Guest:Booze, booze, booze.
Marc:I do love wine.
Marc:And you've got children, right?
Guest:Yeah, those are the joys of my life.
Guest:And my lovely wife.
Marc:How many kids do you have?
Guest:I have 11.
Guest:Wow.
Marc:Well, thank God your career worked out.
Marc:We're Mormons.
Guest:No, I have two.
Guest:A six and a three-year-old.
Marc:And you like them.
Guest:I love them.
Guest:I would cut my arm off for them.
Guest:No, how would you do push-ups then?
Guest:True.
Guest:Well, you're right, I wouldn't.
Guest:I would not do that for them.
Guest:Joel McHale, ladies and gentlemen.
Guest:Keep it going for everybody.
Guest:Joel McHale, BJ Novak, Dwayne Perkins, Alan Avey.
Guest:You guys can exit if you'd like.
Marc:I'm going to bring the other two guys out solo.
Marc:I'm really glad you guys came.
Marc:Hang out for a minute if you don't have to run off.
Marc:Have a slice of pizza.
Marc:Everybody good?
Marc:You guys good?
Marc:Right now, for this month's obituaries, we have the wonderful Jim Earl for the monthly obituaries.
Marc:Please welcome Jim Earl.
Marc:Now, I have to say that I'd forgotten the obituary music, but are we going to try to see if that CD will work?
Marc:Okay.
Okay.
Marc:But they're singing, right?
Marc:Try another track.
Guest:What is that, Christmas song?
Marc:He just found this CD.
Marc:What is it?
Marc:Maybe... I like it.
Marc:Is it sad, though?
Guest:It makes me sad.
Marc:All right, so let's use that.
Marc:And now this month's obituaries with Jim Earl.
Guest:Don Fisher, founder of The Gap.
Guest:Don Fisher, whose company's slogan, Fall into the Gap, became synonymous with the dread most people feel when they realize there's no other place in town to buy jeans, fell into another gap recently.
Guest:This one four feet wide and six feet deep.
Guest:Doctors say Fisher died at his home in San Francisco after a long battle with taste.
Guest:Fisher opened his first gap in 1969 with little more than a pocketful of gumption and the insatiable desire to measure the unspeakably scandalous distance between the bottom of a man's cuff and the tip of a man's penis.
Guest:You do what you can.
Guest:Yeah, I know.
Guest:His store soon caught on and became as commonplace as McDonald's.
Guest:Even so, you still couldn't get cancer by eating one of Fisher's pants.
Marc:A little statement in that.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:An avid art collector, Mr. Fisher was known for his vast collection of paintings, now housed at the Museum of Modern Art in the sickening Pastels Wing.
LAUGHTER
Guest:A lot of pastels.
Guest:Fisher asks that his body be washed in cold water, cremated on low, and immediately removed from the oven to avoid wrinkling.
Guest:Osama bin Laden.
Guest:Billionaire, industrialist.
Guest:Businessman, entrepreneur, religious icon, and chick magnet.
Guest:Osama bin Laden, the shy yet dedicated business major who turned his father's construction business into a worldwide concern, is dead at the age of 52 after guiding his head and chest areas at a speed of 600 miles an hour into two American bullets.
Guest:Navy SEALs found him hiding out in between the old vaudeville towns of Abbottabad and Costelloabad.
Guest:Two very funny towns always getting into mischief.
Guest:Mr. Laden was officially declared dead on May 2nd.
Guest:The White House still insists President Obama refused to release bin Laden's death pictures for security reasons, and not because they were lost at the local photo Abbottabad mat.
LAUGHTER
Guest:Two jokes on the Abbottabad.
Guest:Photo... Photo mat.
Guest:Photo mat in Abbott... Who would set up a photo mat in Abbottabad?
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:That's why that joke works so well.
Marc:Probably.
Guest:According to the White House website, there's absolutely no way you can see Bin Laden's death photos unless you upgrade to a premium subscription and download their assassination app.
LAUGHTER
Marc:They need money, I guess.
Guest:Yeah, that's right.
Guest:Kind of like Mark's site.
Guest:You've got to download the subscription and then, you know.
Marc:I will release the Jim Earl tapes.
Marc:I get it.
Marc:I get it, Jim.
Guest:Among the many items found in the compound were details of Bin Laden's new plot to make it so we just can't have nice things here.
Guest:Insidious.
Guest:I'll say.
Guest:The man was evil.
Guest:That cuts at the core of this country.
Marc:Oh, fuck.
Guest:You know.
Guest:9-11 changed all of us.
Guest:They also found Bin Laden's personal journal, from which I will now read a few choice excerpts.
Guest:Awesome.
Guest:That's great.
Guest:Dear Compound Diary.
Guest:9 a.m.
Guest:Last night I dreamed I was eating a giant ball of cotton candy, and then when I woke up, my beard was gone.
LAUGHTER
Guest:10 a.m.
Guest:Busy day today.
Guest:Everyone's running around like contractors with their heads cut off.
Guest:I didn't cut their fucking head off.
Guest:Give me a break.
Guest:12 noon.
Guest:12 noon.
Guest:I gotta get more exercise.
Guest:Mustn't let the guys see me get fatwa.
Guest:2 p.m.
Guest:Today, wife number three complained about being cooped up here and demanded I take her someplace she's never seen before, so I showed her the kitchen.
Guest:Then I cut off her head.
Guest:3 p.m.
Guest:What's the deal with socks?
Guest:How come there's no left sock or right sock?
Guest:There's just socks!
Guest:4 p.m.
Guest:First, I had my doubts about this neighborhood, but I think this place is really going to work out just fine.
Guest:And it kind of ends there, Mark.
Guest:I got a confession for you.
Guest:I didn't run an ending for this op-ed.
Marc:Gosh, Jim, you've already done more than your fair share of funny tonight.
Marc:In fact, I don't even know why I had any other guests on before you.
Marc:They're all a bunch of losers, in my opinion, and for the most part, do substandard work.
Marc:But we don't have time to discuss my petty jealousies, paralyzing self-hatred, and crippling fear of aluminum foil.
Marc:I know.
Marc:Why don't you do an impression?
Marc:Oh, wait.
Marc:Let me say that differently.
Marc:I know.
Marc:Why don't you do an impression of film legend Joseph Cotton doing a commercial for Star Kissed Tuna?
Guest:You mean the Joseph Cotton from Citizen Kane?
Guest:Yes, Jim.
Guest:Doing a Star Kiss Tuna?
Marc:Yeah, Star Kiss Tuna commercial.
Guest:Okay, here it goes.
Guest:Well, Charlie never really knew the meaning of love.
Guest:He just wanted everyone to love him.
Guest:Love me, I'm Charles Foster Tuna.
Guest:Well, here's to love on our own terms, Mark.
Guest:Say, you wouldn't happen to have a cigar around here, would you?
Guest:A lot of pretty nurses around here have the funny idea of keeping me alive.
Guest:What's that, Rosebud?
Guest:Yeah, that was Marion Davies' pussy.
Guest:Hey, nurse!
Guest:Oh, that's the end of that shitty impression.
Guest:Jim Earl, ladies and gentlemen.
Guest:Thank you.
Thank you.
Marc:Thank you, Jim.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:That was excellent.
Marc:Are we okay on tape and everything?
Marc:Do we still have tape?
Marc:Matt, we good?
Marc:Okay.
Marc:You ready?
Marc:Did you eat pizza?
Marc:This show has gone on forever.
Marc:This is the beauty of the Steve Allen.
Marc:We can just keep fucking going here.
Marc:It's fucking great.
Marc:It's Tuesday.
Marc:There's no fucking end to this.
Marc:I hope what you have to say is long and winded.
Marc:Not long-winded, long and winded.
Marc:Fucking Eddie, you better fucking bring it right now.
Marc:Eddie Pepitone, ladies and gentlemen.
Guest:I just want to say this, that comedians are the modern-day priests, okay?
Guest:We are the modern-day priests.
Guest:Fuck yes.
Guest:Yes, no one can shut us up.
Guest:Now the fact that we hate ourselves is an impediment to being a priest, I think.
Guest:Because a good priest would be rooted in love.
Guest:and he could really come at you with love and get you to come into his world.
Guest:But comedians are like, hey, I fucking dislike myself.
Guest:I really dislike myself, and there's other people I dislike.
Guest:Now, I am trying to change this around, except I do want to take issue with the fucking Hangover 2.
Guest:Are you in that movie?
Guest:No, I'm not.
Guest:That's why I'm taking... No, that is not.
Guest:That is not why I'm... Did you audition for it?
Guest:No, I auditioned for Hangover 1.
Guest:All right.
Guest:I auditioned for fucking Hangover 1.
Guest:And I had worked with Todd Phillips in Old School.
Guest:Did you?
Guest:Oh yeah, you were one of the guys in the thing.
Guest:I was one of the guys, like Mark says.
Guest:I was one of the guys.
Guest:At the fake fraternity.
Guest:At that fake fraternity.
Guest:And I thought I was gonna be one of the guys in Hangover.
Guest:But I just wanna say this.
Guest:What the fuck?
Guest:Is this premise for Hangover 2?
Guest:They wake up and they're fucked up again?
Guest:Here's some ideas for future premises.
Guest:How about Hangover 3?
Guest:They wake up and realize substance abuse is something you should take a good fucking look at in yourself.
Guest:Like, really fucking look at it.
Guest:What is this?
Guest:Oh, we're fucking, oh, we're fucking high.
Guest:We're stoned.
Guest:Oh, but everything is gonna, oh, and there's a funny fucking monkey.
Guest:In this one.
Guest:And by the way, whenever you see a monkey in a trailer, run the other fucking way.
Guest:I am serious.
Guest:I am serious.
Guest:I wish no one ill except a successful.
Guest:I know.
Guest:And I think that's the way it should be.
Guest:No, I understand.
Marc:Correct?
Marc:Yeah, no, you're good.
Guest:But fuck Hank.
Guest:Hangover three, okay?
Guest:So they wake up.
Guest:Now, what are they gonna keep doing?
Guest:Are they gonna keep going with this hangover shit?
Marc:As long as I saw Zach on a 7-Eleven cup.
Marc:I mean, this shit's happening.
Guest:I go to 7-Eleven.
Marc:You can get the whole set.
Marc:Ed Helms, all the people that you started with are now on cups.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:And he said it.
Guest:Did you hear what he said?
Guest:People you started with are now on cups.
Guest:It is not easy for me to make it through the day these days.
Guest:Yeah, and you said it.
Guest:I've been watching this whole show, and it's a lot of information, a lot of laughs, but I am back there watching the whole show going, Jesus fucking Christ, this is a rough business.
Guest:But I don't give a shit.
Guest:I don't give a shit because I, like you, am a truth teller.
Guest:But one thing that you haven't done, you haven't talked about the fact that America is on its fucking knees.
Guest:And this is why I bring up Hangover 2.
Guest:because we are in the fall of fucking Rome.
Guest:Do you understand that?
Guest:No, I do.
Guest:This is, folks, they are building mega prisons.
Guest:In Ohio, they have, there's no more manufacturing going on, and they've replaced the manufacturing companies with prisons.
Guest:Do you get that?
Guest:Do you get that?
Guest:Guys like me, who are angry, and who want the
Guest:corporate fucks, and if you are a corporate fuck, and you are listening to this podcast, know that your day is coming, and I don't mean the mid-level corporate fucks.
Guest:I don't mean the corporate fucks probably in this room, you know what I mean?
Guest:No, that's true.
Guest:You mean they're bosses.
Guest:They're top-level corporations.
Guest:Yes, you articulate my words so beautifully.
Guest:I mean the corporate fucks who listen to your podcast, and I'm sure they do, in like, you know, the 150th floor.
Guest:I don't know how far floors are going up.
Marc:Just on a very high floor.
LAUGHTER
Guest:You have a way with words.
Guest:A very high floor.
Guest:Sitting on a gold chair.
Guest:Sitting on a gold chair.
Marc:Just keep feeding me.
Marc:Yeah, they're just wiping their asses with money.
Marc:And they're saying, Eddie Pepitone can't get work.
Guest:Naked women.
Guest:Naked women are around them.
Guest:They are shooting animals.
Guest:Who's the fuck?
Guest:That's a big office.
Guest:No, these corporate fucks, they have wild animals running loose in their office.
Guest:There are zebras.
Guest:There are tigers.
Guest:Endangered species.
Guest:And they just shoot them because that's their last power trip.
Guest:You motherfuckers.
Guest:Do you hear this working class rage?
Guest:There is no more working class.
Guest:And I wish you would deal.
Guest:There's no more working class.
Guest:There's really no more middle class.
Guest:There's no teachers.
Guest:Now I know, and we talked about this the last podcast, this is not good fodder.
Guest:for comedy, but I think in this country they should open up stand-up tragedy clubs.
Guest:Do you understand that?
Guest:Let's get tragedy clubs opened up.
Guest:And they would go like this.
Guest:The comic would be like, how you doing, folks?
Guest:I spent today in my room staring at an old diary.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:What else is going on?
Guest:Oh, yeah, my wife killed herself in a tub about a half hour ago.
Guest:Thank you very much.
Guest:She killed herself because my children can't eat.
Guest:Speaking of my children, and thank you.
Guest:And they would want cell phones to go off.
Guest:That would be the difference with the stand-up tragedians.
Guest:They would be like, ah, there's still technology.
Marc:Do you know what I mean?
Marc:Yeah, I think you're right on all of these things.
Marc:You do?
Guest:What is it with the hangover?
Guest:And they're going to keep going with this shit.
Guest:They're so fucked up.
Guest:Hollywood, by the way.
Guest:Hollywood, and of course I want to work.
Guest:And if you're listening to this out there, yes, hire me.
Guest:But however...
Guest:Hollywood is still, what a fucking, what is Hangover Five gonna be like?
Guest:You know, they wake up, they're in Ohio, mega prisons, everybody around, they realize, oh my God, no one's got a job, but they're three lunatics running around, hey, America's falling.
Marc:Yeah, that's hilarious.
Marc:And then the monkeys with them... It would be an edge.
Marc:What would the monkey do?
Marc:Maybe they have to get the monkey on a little leash and get him dancing like an organ grinder monkey, and that's how they make money to get back home to finish the movie.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:I'm just trying to... You know, the monkey's on a cup, too.
Guest:Is he really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:How fucked up is that?
Guest:The monkey is on a cup!
Guest:Can't!
Guest:And this is, you know, I know people.
Marc:That's gotta be the name of your next CD, by the way.
Marc:The Monkey is on a Cup.
Marc:Eddie Peppertone.
Guest:Thank you, everybody.
Guest:Thank you so much for coming live WTF at the Steve Allen Theater.
Guest:Let's kick that music up.
Marc:This has been the longest live show we've ever done.
Marc:I hope you had a great time.
Marc:I certainly appreciate you listening.
Marc:Go to WTFPod.com and do that thing.
Marc:Really happy you came.
Marc:Hope you had a good time.
Marc:Get a free sticker.
Marc:Buy a t-shirt.
Marc:Say hi.
Marc:Good night.
Marc:Alan Havy, Joel McHale, BJ Novak, Dwayne Perkins, Jim Earl, Eddie Peppertone.
Guest:I'm Mark Maron.
Guest:Thank you.
Thank you.