Episode 1605 - Ask Marc Anything: A Full Maron Special Presentation

Episode 1605 • Released January 2, 2025 • Speakers not detected

Episode 1605 artwork
00:00:00Lock the gates!
00:00:09All right, let's do this.
00:00:10How are you?
00:00:11What the fuckers?
00:00:12What the fuck buddies?
00:00:13What the fuck?
00:00:14Nick's what's happening?
00:00:15What's going on?
00:00:16I'm Mark Maron.
00:00:17This is my podcast.
00:00:18Welcome to it.
00:00:18Welcome to the year 2025.
00:00:21What a year it's going to be.
00:00:23I foresee.
00:00:23I don't know how you're feeling.
00:00:25I don't know what you did.
00:00:26How was your New Year's?
00:00:27Did you go out?
00:00:28Did you stay in?
00:00:28Did you ruminate?
00:00:29Did you despair?
00:00:30Did you make resolutions?
00:00:32Did you celebrate?
00:00:33Did you get fucked up?
00:00:34Did you get sober on the day after?
00:00:36What was that?
00:00:37Yesterday?
00:00:38Wednesday?
00:00:39What day is it?
00:00:40I'm tired of this holiday time.
00:00:41I'm always thinking it's Sunday when it's like Tuesday or Wednesday or Thursday.
00:00:46What did you do?
00:00:47Are you okay?
00:00:49Are you saddling up for the new year?
00:00:52Are you buckling up for the new year?
00:00:54Are you standing at the edge?
00:00:57of the new year at the ledge of the new year are you about to dive in what's happening where we at you all right i don't know i don't know what to tell you are you are you is it foreboding is that the word i want are you are you paralyzed with a sense of like oh my god oh my god here we go god damn it what's gonna happen
00:01:23Can't be good, but today's okay.
00:01:26How's that?
00:01:27Future's not looking great, but I'm having a good hour.
00:01:32Right?
00:01:34Well, look, I hope you got through safely.
00:01:35I hope everything's all right.
00:01:37I didn't do much.
00:01:38I don't usually do much.
00:01:39I certainly don't work.
00:01:41New Year's I gave that up a long time ago I was feeling a bit under the weather so we just kind of hung out and watched a Mike Lee movie I've been watching a lot of Mike Lee movies that guy is the master every fucking movie all the way back I can't even I can't tell you really a better movie than his first movie in a lot of ways bleak moments and
00:02:05He is a master of exploring and depicting the human condition with honesty and poetry and not the sort of jerk around of a story.
00:02:17Who needs a story when you just have the ebb and flows and tensions of human beings interacting with each other honestly?
00:02:24He's made some bigger movies, but man, yes, I'm going to talk to him.
00:02:28So I've been loading up on Mike Lee movies and that can go either way.
00:02:33Many of them are not what I would call uplifting.
00:02:36They're honest, but they're not uplifting.
00:02:37Let's talk about movies, but let's do some business first.
00:02:41Happy New Year.
00:02:41Did I say that already?
00:02:43We'll do what we can.
00:02:44We'll do what we can.
00:02:46Look, today, one of the regular things we've been doing since we started the full Marin bonus feed in 2022 is a series called Ask Mark Anything, me being Mark.
00:02:58So today's episode is made up of a collection of my answers to listener questions.
00:03:04It's basically like I'm the guest on today's episode and you folks are interviewing me.
00:03:09And just in case people are wondering why we do episodes like this around the holidays, there are a few reasons, I will tell you.
00:03:16For one, people are out of their routines during this time of year, so regular listening gets disrupted.
00:03:22And so things will get back to normal next week.
00:03:26And also, it's not a great proposition for guests.
00:03:29If someone's coming on because they're promoting something, they don't want their episode to air when people are out of their listening habits.
00:03:36So instead of skipping the week or re-airing an older episode, it's a good time to highlight some of the stuff we've been doing over there on the full Marin for you.
00:03:45So this is a collection of Ask Mark Anythings.
00:03:49And yeah, enjoy it.
00:03:51You know, maybe I'll answer a question that you have been wanting to ask me.
00:03:57Also, it's almost time for my tour dates to start again.
00:04:00I'll be in Sacramento, California at the Crest Theater Friday, January 10th, Napa at the Uptown Theater on January 11th, Fort Collins.
00:04:09at Lincoln Center Performance Hall Friday, January 17th.
00:04:12Be in Boulder at the Boulder Theater on Saturday, January 18th.
00:04:16I'll be in Santa Barbara, California at the Lobero Theater on Thursday, January 30th.
00:04:20I'll be in San Luis Obispo, California.
00:04:24I've been corrected.
00:04:26That's California at the Fremont Center on Friday, January 31st.
00:04:29And Monterey, California at the Golden State Theater on Saturday, February 1st.
00:04:34I know these first couple of dates are going to be with Ali Makovsky.
00:04:38We've got to decide whether we want to drive up.
00:04:41to Sacramento and Napa or drive down.
00:04:44There's an Indian place just outside of Bakersfield that we're pretty partial to, me and Makovsky, and we kind of want to go there.
00:04:50So that might be the reason we get into a car for five or six hours, to go to this Indian restaurant at basically a truck stop off the 5 in Bakersfield.
00:05:00But I'm also coming to Iowa, Missouri, North Carolina, Tennessee, Kentucky, Oklahoma, Texas, South Carolina, Illinois, and Michigan.
00:05:07You can go to wtfpod.com slash tour for all of my dates.
00:05:11So my New Year's was pretty low-key.
00:05:14It's always the way.
00:05:15I don't know if I already said this, but I don't work on New Year's, and I was feeling a little under the weather, so we just...
00:05:21I cooked some pasta.
00:05:22We watched a movie.
00:05:24You know, I kind of festered in mild illness, just a cold.
00:05:27But over the last week, I've been doing shit.
00:05:30I think it's a natural thing for New Year's, even if you don't plan on doing it, is to do some shit around the house or around your life or, you know, kind of get ready.
00:05:42Mark the transition by what did I do?
00:05:46I cleaned up all the rat shit in my basement.
00:05:49I got my power back out.
00:05:51Some listener made me very paranoid about ratchet in general and vacuum cleaners and bugs and viruses and things that, you know, I could inhale and die from.
00:06:00So I I wore a bit of a mask most of the time.
00:06:03And, you know, I think it was it might have been generational generations of ratchet down there.
00:06:09And we foamed up.
00:06:11I told you we put the foam in the hole.
00:06:12So I haven't seen any rats.
00:06:13They haven't showed up in the trap.
00:06:14So I did find one fairly what's a mummified carcass from many years ago, maybe the original rat of the basement.
00:06:24But I cleaned all that up.
00:06:25I got rid of a lot of shit down there and just tidied up, went through my stuff, tightened some things around the house, some
00:06:33Toilet paper rollers and, you know, I kind of bought a drying rack.
00:06:38That was a big purchase.
00:06:40A drying rack.
00:06:41I'm living large over here.
00:06:43I got a drying rack at Target.
00:06:44I went to Target the day after fucking New Year's.
00:06:48It was busy.
00:06:49But I stuck in.
00:06:50I bought a drying rack.
00:06:52Nice one.
00:06:52I think it's bamboo.
00:06:54Because I don't dry shirts.
00:06:57You know, I don't dry T-shirts.
00:06:58I don't put them in the dryer.
00:06:59I just think that burns them.
00:07:00It cooks them.
00:07:01It makes them bad.
00:07:02So drying rack.
00:07:03That's my big purchase for the new year.
00:07:06As opposed to just hanging them on chairs all around my house.
00:07:09Also, a little update on the plaid shirts.
00:07:13They've entered the Goodwill ecosystem.
00:07:16I appreciate all you people wanting them.
00:07:18A bit of the history.
00:07:20But I decided, you know, I thought, well, maybe I could sell them.
00:07:24Maybe I could get Dean to sell them.
00:07:25Maybe I could bring them over to a vintage place.
00:07:27Maybe I could start packing them up and giving them to people.
00:07:30But I decided...
00:07:31hey, if these are cool things that I've got to offer, let somebody have that moment at Goodwill.
00:07:37I mean, if you're a Goodwill shopper and you're doing it because you're looking for cool shit, not because you can't afford clothing, I mean,
00:07:49Sometimes it's nice to be like, holy shit, look at this.
00:07:51I can't believe I found this.
00:07:53I want to spread that joy.
00:07:55If people even like the kind of shit that I like, that they may find one of those things and be like, God damn, how often do you find good shit at goodwill anymore?
00:08:03But then again, this is my ego talking.
00:08:05I think that, yeah, my shit's cool, but who knows?
00:08:07It just could be old man, you know, cusp, boomer, Gen X cusp.
00:08:14flannel shirt bullshit i don't know but they've re-entered the ecosystem what else did i do on news i've been cooking my ass off like i own a restaurant because i'm finally i finally feel like i'm home for a bit and even the gigs i have coming up are uh you know around california so i just kind of dug in and cooked for the week and you know
00:08:36threw out a lot of stuff.
00:08:38That's the other thing, the garbage event of the new year, time to throw the shit away.
00:08:43I'm going to go through every room and get rid of everything that I haven't used in a year or two, whether it's a food product, clothing product, appliance product.
00:08:55It's all got to go, man.
00:08:56It's all got to go.
00:08:59Yeah, I don't like it when I get a cold because I can't exercise, and then I went out and exercised.
00:09:03I didn't feel good about that, but whatever, man.
00:09:06Whatever.
00:09:07It's the new year.
00:09:07My resolution for the new year is to act like I'm in the final fucking quarter here.
00:09:16I'm in the end zone.
00:09:18Time to give the zero fucks in some ways and just do what I want to do and live the life I want to live and not let my brain...
00:09:27drag me down every day.
00:09:29How about that?
00:09:30How about try to differentiate between what's happening in your fucking brain and what's happening in reality and stop thinking about what's happening on your phone.
00:09:42Look out for that dopamine charge.
00:09:44Look out for that dopamine distribution system you hold in your hand every day.
00:09:49God damn it.
00:09:50Look, reality is not thrilling, but it is reality.
00:09:55So between my phone and my brain, I'm stuck in the middle of bullshit.
00:10:00But all right, so let's try to I'm going to try to like, you know, reel it in on both sides and get grounded.
00:10:09There's a lot happening in my life that is very human and very tragic and very grounding in the way that I have to show up.
00:10:19I have to show up for some stuff.
00:10:22But aside from that, it's just time to appreciate how much time I have left.
00:10:27Who knows how much time and how things are going to change culturally.
00:10:31But, you know, I have to assume I'm fucking 61 that, you know.
00:10:37Do it now, pal.
00:10:39Do it now.
00:10:41Whatever that is.
00:10:42Unfortunately, a lot of times it's just like, you know, I just like to cook and play guitar and listen to records and, you know, do chores.
00:10:49Is that weird?
00:10:51Is that living it?
00:10:53Are you kidding me, man?
00:10:55I cleaned that rat shit out of my basement and I felt like, man, that was fucking awesome just to look at all that cleanness.
00:11:02Some people hire people to do that.
00:11:04Why deprive yourself of the joy of finishing that?
00:11:10I know how to live, folks.
00:11:11It's not about buying things.
00:11:12It's not about owning things.
00:11:13It's not about jumping out of planes.
00:11:15It's about simple, mundane tasks that you can finish and eat or throw away.
00:11:23Right?
00:11:24There you go.
00:11:25There's some Buddha wisdom.
00:11:27So, movies, been watching a lot of movies, as I said earlier, a lot of Mike Lee movies, which are just fucking profound.
00:11:34But I've seen a lot of the movies that might be nominated for Oscars, and I don't know if you want my opinion or how deep I'll go into any of these things, but I'll run through this little list in front of me just for the fuck of it.
00:11:46But I did go see Nosferatu, and...
00:11:50Kit's a big horror fan, and she doesn't like vampires.
00:11:53I can take it or leave it, but I do like that fella Eggers, the director, and I've liked all his fucking movies.
00:12:01I think he's meticulous, and he's a fan of history, and he has a vision.
00:12:08To be honest with you, I didn't really know the story.
00:12:12I don't think I've seen the original Nosferatu.
00:12:15I don't think I've seen many Draculas.
00:12:17I don't give a shit.
00:12:18So this was all new to me.
00:12:21And I thought it was a fucking masterpiece.
00:12:24I don't know what people were saying about it, but, you know, it is kind of paced in a slow way.
00:12:29But once it turns, it's fucking beautiful.
00:12:33And I didn't know it was kind of some sort of insanely toxic love story with the future of mankind in the balance.
00:12:41but God damn it.
00:12:43It was, uh, it, there was a humanity at the end of the thing that I didn't expect.
00:12:47And all the performances were great and it looked great.
00:12:51Uh, I, I would go see that again.
00:12:53I saw a Nora, which I think is also a fucking great film, uh,
00:12:58I would be more than happy if that won all the awards because it subverted all my expectations of what was going to happen in that story midway through.
00:13:06Once the Armenian thugs get involved, I was I was thinking that it was going to get violent and weird, but it got it got funny and sweet.
00:13:15And again, that second half, whether, you know, it starts off as sort of, what do you call it?
00:13:21Like this sort of fairy tale thing or what do you call it?
00:13:24A princess story or Cinderella story.
00:13:27And then it just turns into a very unique and subtle and and.
00:13:32Slightly disturbing love story.
00:13:36And I think it was great.
00:13:37The Brutalist, another big film.
00:13:40I thought that was astounding.
00:13:41Again, a long movie, a big movie.
00:13:43But man, what a performance by Adrian Brody.
00:13:46And what an interesting story about class, immigration, anti-Semitism, art, addiction.
00:13:54It's all sort of there in a fairly...
00:13:57unique and historical context.
00:13:59I thought it was a great movie.
00:14:01A Complete Unknown.
00:14:03I saw most of it.
00:14:04I had to dip out for five minutes to deal with my father spinning out, as I told you the last time I talked to you, but I thought A Complete Unknown was great.
00:14:13I thought he did a great job.
00:14:15I thought the look was great.
00:14:16I thought the clothes was great.
00:14:17It's a nice time for clothes.
00:14:19It was before things got weird in the late 60s and things were sort of cool.
00:14:24And there was a lot of rummaging of the late 50s for clothing going on.
00:14:30And I just thought it was stunning and all the music was good and it moved.
00:14:36I know he fudged some historical bits and pieces, but performances were great by everyone, really.
00:14:42And I was completely captivated by it.
00:14:46Did not see Conclave.
00:14:47saw a real pain.
00:14:49Uh, I, I liked it.
00:14:51Uh, I liked it.
00:14:52Uh, you know, being a bit neurotic, I, I, eventually I got anxious.
00:14:56Sing Sing is being talked about a lot.
00:14:58We talked to, uh, uh, the guy from that Clarence Macklin, which was one of the great conversations.
00:15:04And I thought it was very human, interesting movie and a look inside a world that we don't really get to see in an honest way.
00:15:12The Substance.
00:15:13Big fan.
00:15:14Again, not a horror movie, but that was my kind of horror movie.
00:15:18Wicked.
00:15:18I thought that was okay.
00:15:20You know, everyone seems to love it, which I'm very happy about.
00:15:23As far as musicals goes, I thought it was pretty.
00:15:26The songs were nice.
00:15:27It was long.
00:15:27But, you know, in terms of my ability to judge a musical, I'll give it good grades.
00:15:33Movies have been sort of saving my sanity.
00:15:36And this sort of journey into Mike Lee has just been great.
00:15:39We'll see what happens.
00:15:41We'll be here.
00:15:42Our schedule picks up.
00:15:44This is the last of the special episodes for the holidays.
00:15:47And we'll get back to doing what me and Brendan do the best, which is this show, these conversations, the people we talk to.
00:15:54And...
00:15:55We'll deal with things as they come.
00:15:57And I will remain engaged.
00:16:01I will remain engaged with the people in here and you out there.
00:16:07And now I'm sort of 100% focused on putting my stand-up set together and moving towards...
00:16:13That's special.
00:16:14I like when I just have the podcast and the stand-up to do.
00:16:17It's my wheelhouse, and I can keep my facial hair and not try to figure out how to be someone else.
00:16:27We can do it.
00:16:29We'll do this together, folks.
00:16:32Whatever may come.
00:16:33Okay, so look.
00:16:37This show today is a collection of questions that have been asked across many of the Ask Mark Anything episodes we've done on the Full Marin.
00:16:46We've done 19 of them and just posted a new one this week.
00:16:50If you want to sign up for the Full Marin, just go to the link in the episode description or go to WTFpod.com and click on WTF+.
00:16:58Here we go with your questions.
00:17:04Here we go.
00:17:12It's time for Ask Mark Anything.
00:17:15Got a lot of questions.
00:17:17A lot.
00:17:19Let's get into it.
00:17:21Who is the drummer on your intro track?
00:17:24He rocks.
00:17:26Well, that guy, that's John Montagna, who does all the instruments in the WTF theme.
00:17:31We solicited listeners for a theme.
00:17:34It was a long time ago because we had to move away.
00:17:38We used the opening chords of...
00:17:41down payment blues by acdc for a while and then we didn't really realize whether or not we were breaking some kind of rules so we solicited listeners for a theme we got quite a few uh uh entries but then john did it and there's a video out there somewhere if you can find it of him actually putting together the theme with all the uh instruments used and there's some toys involved as i recall
00:18:07Does Sandler still not want to do the show?
00:18:09Look, I don't know anything about Adam Sandler or if that is an active not want to do.
00:18:16I mean, I've asked him and he said he would.
00:18:19It didn't happen.
00:18:20Sometimes things just get lost or they don't find time or or maybe he's being polite.
00:18:24But I can't say that he is actively not wanting to do the show.
00:18:28All I know is he hasn't done it.
00:18:30He's been pitched it.
00:18:31But I don't know if that pitch outside of the one that I made personally got to him.
00:18:35or whether he really does this kind of thing outside of Stern or people that he's really close to in terms of talking on podcasts.
00:18:44Do you think character actors are more interesting and better conversationalists than leading men and women?
00:18:49Or are the leading actors just more guarded because they're more famous?
00:18:53Actors, it's a crapshoot.
00:18:55You don't really know what's in there, and you're usually invested in them for roles they've played and what you consider a character actor.
00:19:01I would say, in general, the conversations I've had with real character actors are always pretty good.
00:19:08You know, John C. Reilly, Michael Shannon...
00:19:13Paul Giamatti recently, Stephen Dorff.
00:19:18I would say, yeah, because they live a different life than movie stars.
00:19:24I think movie stars are guarded, but Josh Brolin was pretty amazing.
00:19:30But I would say...
00:19:32On a percentage basis, I would say probably character actors are not better guests, but they are better conversationalists or they live kind of interesting lives.
00:19:44Would you like to interview Taylor Swift?
00:19:45Sure, I would like to interview Taylor Swift.
00:19:48It'd be interesting.
00:19:49I don't know what she's like in a long-form interview.
00:19:52I don't know that she'd ever do it, but she's certainly one of the biggest performers on the planet.
00:19:57It would be interesting to talk to her.
00:20:00It's kind of amazing how any performer at that level, you know, does what they do.
00:20:05I mean, you know, I...
00:20:07It takes a lot out of me just to do a show for a thousand people in, you know, Chicago.
00:20:12I don't know how you perform for 20,000, 30,000 people.
00:20:16I think music's different, but yeah, I'd like to talk to her.
00:20:18Why not?
00:20:20You mentioned in a recent episode that Willem Dafoe didn't like you, but I went back and listened to that episode and he seemed perfectly engaged.
00:20:27What did I miss?
00:20:29I don't know.
00:20:29You missed how I was feeling in the room, how he was looking at me.
00:20:34Maybe it was just him.
00:20:36Far be it for me to project that stuff.
00:20:38I do that often.
00:20:40Would you ever sit down with Jon Stewart for a WTF episode?
00:20:43You two, for all your clashes many years ago, are very like-minded today in your cultural and political tone, conversations, and beliefs.
00:20:50Yeah, I would, but I doubt he ever would.
00:20:52And it wouldn't be fun.
00:20:55I recently listened to your Amy Mann episodes.
00:20:58In both episodes, Amy mentions that you should come over to the pool since they redid it.
00:21:03Have you been over there since those episodes aired?
00:21:06I have not.
00:21:07I ran into her at a restaurant recently.
00:21:10But no, I haven't been over.
00:21:13We haven't really been friends since then.
00:21:15How many guests roughly have you interviewed that didn't want the talk to be released?
00:21:20Conversely, are there any talks that WTF decided not to release?
00:21:24There's only been a couple where guests have said don't release it.
00:21:28Neil Brennan, the first time, the first one we did, he decided that I didn't give him the respect he deserved.
00:21:36And eventually we...
00:21:37made up and did another one.
00:21:39And David Fincher, I don't know why he didn't want it.
00:21:43Who knows?
00:21:44I don't know why.
00:21:45But we're sitting on that.
00:21:47There were some guests that asked us not to release the episode, but we convinced them it would be okay.
00:21:53There were a couple of those where they were just freaking out, a little insecure, looking back at it, wondering what they said.
00:22:00But but they eventually relented and were fine.
00:22:06There were guests we chose not to air for various reasons.
00:22:09No reason to say who they were.
00:22:10It was not necessarily their fault.
00:22:14It just was what it was.
00:22:16Would you categorize the Fincher talk as a good talk or a great talk?
00:22:19It's a great talk.
00:22:21We talked for a long time.
00:22:24Never to be heard, I guess.
00:22:27What made you decide to start doing repeat guests for a full show?
00:22:31And how do you decide who gets to come back to the garage?
00:22:34Well, it became apparent that after doing this since however long we've been doing it, which is a long time.
00:22:42What is it?
00:22:43It's like a long time since 2009.
00:22:47So there are people that we interviewed early on that have had entire lives since we talked to them.
00:22:53And it'd be silly not to be open to sort of kind of complete the arc or at least this portion of their life.
00:23:02So that's one of the reasons.
00:23:03Another reason is there are people that I like talking to.
00:23:07So a combination of those things is what decides whether they come back to the garage, whether I like them and we had a rapport.
00:23:15and mixed with how long it's been since I've been here.
00:23:21But sometimes people just like to hear me talk to people I know, and usually comics.
00:23:26So we figured, why not do more of that?
00:23:29Were there any talks you went into with low expectations and the guest exceeded them?
00:23:34Look, I got to be honest with you, and I say this a lot.
00:23:36I never know what's going to happen.
00:23:38I don't know if my expectations are low, but I don't really know...
00:23:43if most people can do what I want to do, which is have a loose conversation.
00:23:48I think one that comes to mind is Norm MacDonald, because I didn't even know if he could talk like a regular person.
00:23:56A lot of people who are somewhat characters on stage or have a certain style, I just don't know.
00:24:02Another good example is this past Monday, Melissa Villasenor.
00:24:06I always liked her.
00:24:07I worked with her all the time at the comedy store.
00:24:09I thought about having her on, but I didn't even know if she could have a full conversation.
00:24:12just by nature of what I thought her personality was, and I turned out to be wrong.
00:24:18Does it annoy you when a guest says they listen to your show all the time and then clearly know nothing about you?
00:24:24Yes, but I don't know who they think they're fooling.
00:24:29I can always tell when they say, yeah, I listened to your show, and they name an episode they listen to, and it's not last week's.
00:24:36I know they're lying.
00:24:38A lot of times, publicists or managers...
00:24:42When someone says they'll do the show, they'll go pop out a couple.
00:24:45So sometimes they'll mention like two, thinking they're fooling me.
00:24:48But I know, I know the truth.
00:24:52Do you have any stories of times when you run into someone that you've interviewed in the real world and not recognized or remembered that you've interviewed them?
00:25:00Yes, that happens a lot.
00:25:03And I don't mention it.
00:25:05Because I've done, like, what, almost 1,500 of these?
00:25:09I don't mention it.
00:25:13Because I know usually I've interviewed most people.
00:25:15But sometimes...
00:25:18There's a tell if they go, I should do the show sometimes.
00:25:21I'm like, oh, OK, great.
00:25:22I don't go, wait, I thought we did it already.
00:25:24But yeah, there's definitely more times than I'd like to admit where I know the person, but I don't remember whether I've interviewed them or not.
00:25:34But I have interviewed most people.
00:25:37The trickier thing is, do I approach people that I've interviewed thinking they'll remember me?
00:25:43It used to be different because I used to assume that was just sort of another interviewer that any famous person has to deal with and that I wasn't put in any other kind of light.
00:25:57Just, oh, yeah, I remember I did because I'm like that.
00:26:00I do a lot of press.
00:26:01I don't really always remember who they are, to be honest with you.
00:26:06even if they're long interviews.
00:26:08I remember one time I saw Jack White at LAX, and I approached him.
00:26:15I'm like, hey, man, Marc Maron, I interviewed you once.
00:26:18And he was like, yeah, of course I know who you are.
00:26:21And I'm like, oh, all right, well, that's nice.
00:26:25Was there a conscious decision to stop doing live WTFs or did it just fade away?
00:26:30Well, we did those primarily to create a revenue stream for the podcast, which was almost impossible to do back when we were doing that.
00:26:38We would allow people to donate money.
00:26:40This would be for Patreon.
00:26:42And also the live WTFs were purchasable through a separate pay site.
00:26:47And also it was a big ordeal to get it done.
00:26:49And it was really a different show.
00:26:51So it was a mixture of fading away and also getting more ad money and shifting out of that economic model or that pay model.
00:27:02When you're on the road, do you take a portable podcast recording setup with you in the event you get a spontaneous opportunity to interview someone in their home city?
00:27:11I usually bring it in order to specifically record Monday's show or Thursdays, depending on how long I'm away.
00:27:19But always the opportunity is there.
00:27:23If it's there to interview somebody, I'll do it.
00:27:25It doesn't happen too often, but I do take the rig with me when I go out there.
00:27:30Do you ever listen to the produced version of the podcast to see what made it in and what editing liberties Brendan took?
00:27:37Not really.
00:27:37I will listen to episodes that Brendan, like, thought came out amazing or that he did a miraculous job editing.
00:27:48Or if I can just tell that he was proud of the work.
00:27:53But generally, I trust him personally.
00:27:56A hundred percent.
00:27:57And he'll tell me, like, sometimes I'll just ask him, I'm like, did that thing make it in?
00:28:01He's like, nope.
00:28:02And I'm like, all right.
00:28:06What are your thoughts on so many celebrities starting interview podcast years after you and a few others brought it mainstream?
00:28:12Do you think it dilutes what you are doing when the same guest is having multiple long form discussions at the same time?
00:28:18I don't know.
00:28:19I don't pay attention to any of them.
00:28:21I don't listen to any podcasts.
00:28:23Brendan's on top of it sometimes.
00:28:25But ultimately, it was like that at the beginning.
00:28:28It was even worse at the beginning of podcasting because there was only a handful of us.
00:28:32And especially with the comics, a lot of them would go from show to show.
00:28:36I think the thing that I resent the most is that because of their peer group, some of these bigger celebrities have a lot easier access to certain other celebrities that I may want to interview and we can't just get to them.
00:28:51So that bums me out.
00:28:54But other than that, I don't know.
00:28:55I don't know what's going on out there.
00:28:56We do what we do and generally we do it differently.
00:28:59Was there a specific point where you and Brendan realized WTF was going to pay all the bills or did it just sort of ease in?
00:29:07No, there was a point.
00:29:10You know, I was all in all the time, as was Brendan.
00:29:13But Brendan, you know, had to have another job because he has a family and he's smart and he doesn't.
00:29:22He's a responsible human being.
00:29:25So he had another job for the first.
00:29:27Oh, my God.
00:29:28Must have been.
00:29:29four or five years um more what probably yeah probably five years he had a job until 2013 and he was secretly working as you know my partner on wtf and editing everything he was doing the same job he just couldn't tell anybody about it it always bummed me out because i always wanted to bring him up in interviews and i couldn't because he had a no compete clause
00:29:54at his other job.
00:29:56So it was on the down low.
00:29:58And then in 2013, he said, look, I'm going to go full-time with WTF.
00:30:02And I said, hey, man, you don't have to do that.
00:30:04Don't take any chances.
00:30:06I was freaked out.
00:30:07I'm like, you got a family, man.
00:30:08Look, I could lose everything.
00:30:11I don't care.
00:30:12But don't do it, man.
00:30:13But he was like...
00:30:15Don't worry about me.
00:30:16I did the research.
00:30:17I know what I'm doing.
00:30:18And I'm like, all right.
00:30:19And that instilled a certain amount of confidence in me as well.
00:30:22Because I don't pay attention to numbers, really.
00:30:25So I don't know what the fuck is going on.
00:30:28But that was the point.
00:30:31One episode that has always stood out to me was Cheech and Chong.
00:30:33Do you have any fond memories of that interview?
00:30:35I loved every second of that interview.
00:30:38That interview was amazing because I grew up with Cheech and Chong listening to their records.
00:30:43And I couldn't believe I was going to get to interview them both together.
00:30:46And when I had the headphones on and they were just sitting there talking, they sounded exactly like Cheech and Chong.
00:30:52It was fucking hilarious.
00:30:54What a great day that was.
00:30:56I've been listening to WTF since almost the beginning, but I'm still confused by some of the stand up lingo.
00:31:02What is a bringer show?
00:31:03What is the difference between a feature spot and a headliner?
00:31:07What is a middle?
00:31:08When you say closer, does that only refer to jokes or are headliners also called closers?
00:31:14OK, well, let's go down the list.
00:31:16A bringer show is basically a show where in order to get on stage, you have to bring people.
00:31:24Usually there's a number of people, friends, family, whatever.
00:31:27But that is what gets you your spot is if you bring audience paying audience members.
00:31:33What is the difference between a feature spot and a headliner?
00:31:35The feature spot is either the middle spot, which is the one between the opener and the headliner, or the first act on a two-person show, say at a theater.
00:31:44Someone's featuring for you.
00:31:45That's usually how it's used.
00:31:47Like the opener is usually in a club.
00:31:50The person who does like five, ten minutes up front brings and hosts the show generally.
00:31:55And then the feature is the next act or the middle.
00:31:58The middle act is...
00:31:59is essentially the act between the opener and the headliner.
00:32:04Closer.
00:32:05A closer is somebody who closes the show.
00:32:08Now, obviously, if you're at a club, the closer would be the headliner or on a long show or, like, maybe there's five acts on who's closing.
00:32:16So, yeah, it's the same as the headliner, but not always because it could be just on a show where everybody's doing the same amount of time and somebody's got to close.
00:32:24So, like, when am I going on?
00:32:26You're closing, right?
00:32:29And yes, a closing bit is a closing bit.
00:32:33What's your closer?
00:32:34Closing bit.
00:32:36Can you expand about why the night of the Chevy Chase roast was such a bad night for you personally?
00:32:41Well, I can.
00:32:43I had accepted to do the roast.
00:32:46I'm not really a roast comic.
00:32:48I don't really know how to do it.
00:32:49I still don't.
00:32:51I didn't really know how to do it then.
00:32:53I'm not very good at insult comedy as a genre.
00:32:58You know, I can be funny in an insulting way, but I didn't really know the format.
00:33:03Made me nervous.
00:33:05I had to write a bunch of jokes.
00:33:06My ex-wife Mishnah wrote a couple jokes, and it was before the roasts were really a thing.
00:33:14But the bottom line was, it was a huge dais.
00:33:18There were just, it seemed like 100 people on it.
00:33:20Many of them had nothing to do with roasting.
00:33:23The audience was huge.
00:33:24It was at the Hilton, I think, in New York City.
00:33:26And they were eating.
00:33:28And it was just a flat night.
00:33:30Chevy didn't really want to engage or be there.
00:33:33Everyone was bombing.
00:33:35And I just had a very hard time bombing that hard in front of that many people and my peers.
00:33:42And it just kind of sent me spiraling into a kind of not a nervous breakdown, but it was it was embarrassing.
00:33:51It was hard to bomb that hard.
00:33:54Look, they made it look good, but it just felt like a very public humiliation.
00:34:01Now, granted, any bomb is that in a way, but you do get used to it.
00:34:05But I just didn't feel.
00:34:06It just felt like a very almost.
00:34:13Dismissive room.
00:34:14Chevy wasn't fun.
00:34:15There was nothing fun about it.
00:34:17And once the joke started crapping out, it's just like any other bomb.
00:34:21It was just a big one.
00:34:23And I felt like it made me look bad.
00:34:25I felt like everyone was judging me, even though everyone else was bombing, except for maybe a couple of people.
00:34:31And I don't know.
00:34:34It was humiliating and it made me doubt myself in a very deep way.
00:34:39I have to assume there are some comics you don't enjoy as much as others.
00:34:42Without or with naming names, what is it about certain comics that you don't enjoy?
00:34:47Perhaps type of material or stage presence or something else.
00:34:52Well, I don't like not being able to see somebody's being.
00:34:56You know, I don't like people that are so distanced from their material or from their style that I can't get a sense of who they are.
00:35:04I don't like hackneyed jokes.
00:35:06I don't like comics that don't have very good material in terms of originality or how it's executed.
00:35:15I don't like people that aren't necessarily interesting or innately funny.
00:35:21But I can appreciate a pretty broad spectrum of comedy, but I like to see, I like it to be a full, fully realized thing, both on behalf of the comic and his or her or their character.
00:35:36connection to the material.
00:35:38I don't like people that that do cheap comedy or or or just I can even handle a little bit of hackiness from comics if they at least approach it in a different way.
00:35:50It's really a mixed bag of why I register people as being not funny or I can't watch it.
00:35:58Sometimes I'm embarrassed for them.
00:35:59Sometimes I feel like it's hard for me to watch.
00:36:02There's a few different reasons.
00:36:05To the best of your knowledge, what are the demographics of your audience?
00:36:08Have they shifted at all throughout your career?
00:36:11Do you have thoughts on why your audience is who it is?
00:36:14Well, early on, I didn't have an audience.
00:36:16And after the podcast, I had some people who were kind of left over from my political radio show on Air America, and they were still around.
00:36:25But then a new group of people, podcast fans came and they didn't really know me as a stand up.
00:36:30And they used to say they they would come to support me, which I didn't need.
00:36:34But I've noticed that my my fans are either sort of sensitive and intelligent younger people who kind of get where I'm coming from.
00:36:41people my age, couples and men.
00:36:46I used to see a lot of men coming to my shows alone just because I imagine that their friends didn't know who I was.
00:36:54I think those two groups are still with me.
00:36:57But it's usually intelligent people, like-minded people, grown-ups who tip well and behave.
00:37:04It's a real blessing.
00:37:06I'm very grateful for the audience that I've built over the years since I started the podcast.
00:37:12Do you have guitar face?
00:37:14Riff smirk?
00:37:15Do you make funny faces during playing?
00:37:17Or are you consciously trying to stay cool?
00:37:20And in your opinion, who has the best, funniest guitar face?
00:37:27I have seen footage of me playing and I do do a thing.
00:37:31There is definitely a guitar face there.
00:37:33It's not too dramatic.
00:37:35It's not forced.
00:37:36It does happen naturally.
00:37:38I'm very rarely consciously trying to stay cool.
00:37:43I can't seem to pull that off.
00:37:45But something does happen when you're sort of in it.
00:37:48And it happens to me.
00:37:50It's not particularly funny or over the top, but it's definitely there.
00:37:54I think the coolest guitar player still, for the most part, is probably Keith Richards.
00:38:02Because he does something with his whole body.
00:38:05That's kind of laid back.
00:38:07It's kind of a slow groove thing.
00:38:09And his face is always cool.
00:38:11He kind of leans back or leans into things.
00:38:14And I still think as somebody who becomes an extension of his guitar in a fairly honest way, when he's not, you know, really doing a showboat thing, it's got to be...
00:38:25It's got to be Keith.
00:38:27The funniest guitar face, just right off the top of my head, I think that Jimmy Page, as cool as he seems, has a very peculiar and funny guitar face and also physicality when he's playing guitar.
00:38:41When he's swooped over, you know, and his legs are kind of spread, he's cool, but he definitely has a goofy guitar face.
00:38:47But those are just ones that come to mind.
00:38:48I'm sure if you were to run a bunch by me, I could make other, you know...
00:38:54Other suggestions as to both of those best and funniest guitar face.
00:39:01Would you like to make a movie about your time as a door guy at the comedy store in Sam Kennison days?
00:39:09I don't know where that movie would go.
00:39:11I mean, and it would have to, if we were to really do it right, the scenes of us doing coke at the house, at the table, they would have to be like, you know, 18 hours long.
00:39:26I'd actually like to see that in a way.
00:39:29What the fuck could we have been doing, you know, from 2.30 in the morning till 10 the next morning?
00:39:36What could we have been doing?
00:39:38What could we have been talking about?
00:39:40Has that ever been documented?
00:39:42Like straight through?
00:39:43Just a table full of people doing blow for like eight or nine hours?
00:39:49I'd like to do that movie.
00:39:52Be like an Andy Warhol film.
00:39:54It'd be some sort of marathon just to see what it would look like.
00:39:57I'd like to see a documentary of that.
00:40:02Have you underachieved, overachieved, or achieved exactly what you'd hoped?
00:40:09That's a good question because I don't know if I see myself as an underachiever in terms of what I've actually accomplished.
00:40:15I do see myself as an underachiever in terms of what I think I should have or could have accomplished.
00:40:20But those don't really count because I've accomplished a lot in the sense that I don't know that I've overachieved, but I have achieved exactly what I wanted to do.
00:40:29I don't know if it's what I hoped I would do, but I've sort of slowly...
00:40:33done most of the things that I was interested in and wanted to do.
00:40:37And the reason I say hoped, because I don't know that my visibility in terms of my ego is as big as I hoped it would be, but I have actually somehow managed to do almost all the things that I set out to do when I got into show business.
00:40:56having my own show, doing stand-up comedy, directing some episodes of that show, playing music, acting in movies, and, well, obviously this podcast, but that was an outlier.
00:41:14I didn't expect this to happen at all.
00:41:16So I guess I have achieved exactly what I wanted to,
00:41:22I don't know if hoped is a good word because I'm not sure I have framed it properly most days that I feel like I could have not done more, but gotten more attention.
00:41:34So that hope didn't happen.
00:41:36And it's probably better off.
00:41:40Since you're currently in a relationship with a woman in her 30s, do you ever worry that you could get stuck with a kid?
00:41:46Well, you know, it's something we discuss.
00:41:49And Kit is really pretty clear about not wanting kids.
00:41:53We're both very involved with animals.
00:41:55When I met her, she worked at an animal shelter.
00:41:59She just got a new kitten, Maven, who's a half-sibling of Charlie.
00:42:03And we've talked about it, but I'm pretty clear that I don't want them.
00:42:07And she...
00:42:07is as well pretty clear on it, and for real reasons, and I don't really need to share those.
00:42:14So I don't worry I'll get stuck with a kid, with Kit.
00:42:19I've had those worries in the past, but that's the past.
00:42:24Have you been asked why you're never happy?
00:42:27I'm asked that question all the time, and each time I'm genuinely offended.
00:42:31Well, I've done jokes about that.
00:42:32I mean, I don't know what happy is.
00:42:34It's like, are you happy?
00:42:35I never really saw happiness as a goal.
00:42:37And I guess a lot of people do.
00:42:39I'm aspiring to okayness.
00:42:43So I've gotten that question plenty of times in my life.
00:42:45I don't know if I get...
00:42:48But I'm just sort of like, what does that even mean?
00:42:51How is that a goal?
00:42:52Happiness is fleeting.
00:42:53And I believe happiness is fleeting, but I do believe I experience it occasionally, more so now that I'm older.
00:42:59I'm definitely not never happy.
00:43:04I'm extremely interested in the contrast between my self-perception and others' perception of me.
00:43:10Curious about where you think this comes from because most people don't give a shit, it seems.
00:43:15Well, where it comes from for me is almost paralyzing insecurity and also from that comes paranoia and from that comes self-consciousness.
00:43:26And from that comes projection in terms of what you think other people are thinking about you, because a lot of times they're not thinking about you at all.
00:43:36But generally, I'm a lot harder on myself.
00:43:38And I think people see me in a way that I see myself, which is not always great.
00:43:43But they don't really see that.
00:43:45The friends I have see me for who I am and the good parts of me, because usually I'm comfortable to show those parts with those people.
00:43:54But I think all that stuff comes from just, you know, not tremendous parenting or given a sort of grounded sense of self.
00:44:02You're always going to be a little paranoid, a little hyper imaginative about your impact on things and people and and also just tremendously self-conscious.
00:44:13So it's sort of a curse.
00:44:16But as I get older, I also realize like, you know, I'm definitely not as bad as I think I am or as awkward and fucked up as I think I am.
00:44:25And also many people only see, you know, the part of me that is genuine.
00:44:32And there's more of that lately.
00:44:35So I don't know.
00:44:36I have a little more self-acceptance.
00:44:38Do you ever wake up in the middle of the night and think, fuck, why did I say that?
00:44:42Or generally have regrets about revealing too much of yourself?
00:44:48I don't think it's like waking up in the middle of the night.
00:44:51But after a stand-up show or after something on the podcast, I have to kind of accept that I said it and live with the decision.
00:45:02Usually I don't regret it, but I don't always know why I do it.
00:45:07And I do feel a little exposed by it.
00:45:13But that is a big part of how I do what I do.
00:45:19Inside your comedian brain, what is the difference between you standing on stage trying to make a live audience laugh, you sitting alone with a microphone trying to make your podcast audience laugh, and you in private conversation trying to make an individual friend laugh?
00:45:34Or is it all the same to you?
00:45:37No, they're all very different.
00:45:40You know, when you're on stage, you know, that's that's your purpose.
00:45:44That's your intent.
00:45:45And you're moving towards them.
00:45:46And, you know, it's very immediate.
00:45:48And that is the job of the comic.
00:45:50You want to get laughs where you decide to get them.
00:45:53Sometimes it's impulsive.
00:45:54Sometimes it's improvised.
00:45:56But generally, that is your job.
00:45:58You get up there and you focus and you do the job and and the craft of making the audience laugh.
00:46:05And there is a version of me that lives up there.
00:46:09These versions are not that different.
00:46:12Sitting alone with a microphone here, I'm not that as conscious of trying to make people laugh.
00:46:17And I wouldn't say that I'm always funny.
00:46:19I think that I'm more varied.
00:46:23I would say I'm less funny here than the other people.
00:46:27Certainly on a stand-up mic.
00:46:29I know when I've got something funny to say and I know how to innately pace it, but it's not my intent on this mic to be funny all the time.
00:46:40I can relax.
00:46:42In private conversation, well, look, man, if I've got a friend and you're kind of riffing it out, you're going back and forth, they say something, I say something.
00:46:49So it's more spontaneous.
00:46:51It's more exciting.
00:46:52It's part of the exchange.
00:46:54And I think that is where...
00:46:57the idea of being naturally funny becomes very apparent.
00:47:02It does on the stand-up stage as well in improvising, but in conversation where you're kind of in an interaction, a relationship, in a conversation,
00:47:13And it kind of moves the conversation along or to add something to it.
00:47:16You know, I do it a lot with Sam, with Jerry, all my friends.
00:47:19I like making those guys laugh.
00:47:22And sometimes out of those conversations comes great ideas for stand-up.
00:47:26Not directly, but, you know, sometimes we're talking about humor.
00:47:31But they're all very different, the things that you –
00:47:35That you talked about here.
00:47:37The three me's.
00:47:39There's probably a couple other ones too.
00:47:41My dad recently started dating after my mom died.
00:47:43I'm wondering how your grief comes up in your current relationship with Kit.
00:47:48Well, I mean, my relationship with Kit began in the shadow of Lynn's death.
00:47:55within four, like five months.
00:47:59And it was, you know, the thing with Kit has evolved.
00:48:02I mean, we didn't know it would keep going.
00:48:03We were in the middle of COVID.
00:48:04I was paralyzed with sadness.
00:48:06She was dealing with her own grief around things in her life.
00:48:11And it was more of a companionship thing that we didn't have very big expectations of, out of, or if any.
00:48:19And it went on a long time like that, and then it became a little deeper, and it became a little bigger.
00:48:25But it's still there, and I can talk freely about it.
00:48:32And she has a full understanding of it.
00:48:42It comes up sometimes.
00:48:44Have you made a will?
00:48:46If so, who are you leaving everything to?
00:48:49Well, I just redid my will.
00:48:51And a good portion will go to my brother if he lives.
00:48:59I've given a nice chunk of change to some people who are important in my life.
00:49:05Good friends.
00:49:07I've also left Brendan a large sum if it still exists when I do die to disperse to charities that at that time are currently in need.
00:49:22And I've left my records to Dan at the record store.
00:49:30Where and when are you able to find peaceful moments in your life?
00:49:35I don't know.
00:49:35I can find them anywhere.
00:49:37You know, I like sitting around playing guitar.
00:49:39I like being out here, sitting here.
00:49:41I like my couch.
00:49:44Sometimes I like hiking up the mountain.
00:49:46I like sitting on my porch.
00:49:48I do like sitting on the porch sometimes.
00:49:49I liked it more when I was smoking cigars.
00:49:54But yeah, I can find peaceful moments on my couch.
00:49:57I can find them anywhere.
00:49:59My car.
00:50:00They don't last long.
00:50:01Here, I'll do one for you now.
00:50:05That was good.
00:50:05Did you feel it?
00:50:07That's a good one.
00:50:11I find a tremendous amount of peace cooking.
00:50:15That is something I do often.
00:50:18I like to do it.
00:50:20I like to have the food I like to eat, but I do like cooking.
00:50:24And as a matter of fact, I'm going to cook a banana bread right now, a vegan banana bread, because I got three almost rotten bananas.
00:50:30And I'm looking forward to it.
00:50:35What is the best sandwich you've ever made?
00:50:38Shit, I don't know.
00:50:39That's a good question.
00:50:41The best sandwich I ever made.
00:50:44I used to enjoy making a patty melt for reals, you know, with a good burger and Swiss cheese and fried onions, fried nice and brown on rye bread, crispy toasted rye bread or grilled rye bread.
00:51:00You get the patty.
00:51:02You put the bread into the butter or oil in the pan on one side.
00:51:07Put the slices of cheese on each one.
00:51:09Get them good and fucking toasty.
00:51:12Put the patty in there already cooked.
00:51:15And then the grilled onions.
00:51:16And then put the other piece on top.
00:51:19And then press it a little bit.
00:51:21That's a pretty good fucking sandwich.
00:51:24Really good sandwich.
00:51:26I do enjoy the post-Thanksgiving turkey chopped liver sandwich, sometimes with a little cranberry sauce.
00:51:37That's a pretty good sandwich.
00:51:39Do you snack at the movies?
00:51:41Yeah, I'll have a big popcorn, no butter, giant Diet Coke.
00:51:44Since you've been sober, what is the absolute closest you've come to drinking or taking drugs again?
00:51:50I don't think I've come close to drinking.
00:51:52I don't think I've come close to cocaine or weed.
00:51:55The closest I've come is, you know, the moment where you have pain medicine prescribed for pain, but you know you don't, you know, the pain's not as bad as would require medicine, but you figure, well, I've got the medicine, right?
00:52:11And, you know, I've got a pass here.
00:52:14Why not take it?
00:52:15But I don't.
00:52:19But I do know that pain meds, when I've gotten surgery or something like that, they work.
00:52:26So I have taken oxycodone when I had my tooth ripped out of my head, but just one.
00:52:32And then eventually I throw them out.
00:52:34But they do linger in the cabinet longer than they should.
00:52:37I'm curious what your relapse back into drugs and alcohol many decades ago was like and what precipitated it.
00:52:43I know you have 20 plus years of sobriety now, but you've been in the recovery community for a long time.
00:52:49I just think your answer might be helpful to the newcomer.
00:52:53Well, I don't know what if there was a precipitating factor.
00:52:56I think that when I first got sober, oh, very early on, when I got sober after the first time I got sober was 1988.
00:53:05You know, and I'm coming up on 24 years, and it's, what is it, 2023.
00:53:11So do the math.
00:53:13You know, it took me a long time to put together the years in a row.
00:53:17But the first time I got sober, I went into rehab because I was, you know, psychotic from sweep deprivation and cocaine abuse.
00:53:23And, you know, just to get out of the—I got into rehab and—
00:53:29Afterwards, I didn't really lock into the program.
00:53:32I went to a few meetings when I went back to New York and then I just kind of didn't do anything.
00:53:36And I stayed sober for about a year and a half.
00:53:38And then and then that was sort of the pattern.
00:53:40You know, I'd go out for a year or two and then I'd stay sober for a year and a half.
00:53:44But it wasn't until the last time I got sober, really, in ninety nine.
00:53:51that I really learned how to take in the program, understand the program, use the program, understand powerlessness, work the steps.
00:54:03It wasn't until 99 that I really did that.
00:54:05And within that year or two, upon getting sober in the late 90s, I was in and out a bit, but not much and not for very long.
00:54:14I didn't really relapse.
00:54:15Once 99 came along, that was it.
00:54:17And I just did what I was supposed to do.
00:54:20I listened to the suggestions.
00:54:22I went to meetings at least once a day for years.
00:54:25I got sponsors.
00:54:27And it was just a matter of doing the work.
00:54:31And also, it was helpful that I met a lot of people in the program.
00:54:34The woman who became my second wife in a disastrous marriage got me sober.
00:54:39And I think a lot of...
00:54:40Getting me into the program was driven by me wanting to be with her, even though that didn't work out.
00:54:47I'm still grateful for that.
00:54:51Have you healed from your attachment trauma from childhood?
00:54:55Now, this is a big question.
00:54:58I have never heard...
00:55:01of the condition of attachment trauma.
00:55:04So I had to look it up.
00:55:07And I definitely have that.
00:55:11I'll read you the definition here from the internet.
00:55:15Attachment trauma is considered to be a traumatic experience an infant or child has when a primary caregiver does not or cannot provide adequate care, affection, and comfort.
00:55:28That is the core of my emotional foundation is that both of my parents were not really capable at any type of safe selflessness or nurturing type of care.
00:55:47My mother was very self-involved.
00:55:49My father was completely self-involved.
00:55:52And neither one of them really kind of lived up to the emotional responsibility of being parents.
00:55:59My mother, I believe, resented my brother and I. There are incidents with my brother where, you know, he was crying and she would just, you know, lock him in a bedroom because she couldn't handle it.
00:56:10Turns out he had a milk allergy.
00:56:12And there are just a lot of different stories.
00:56:14And I've talked about this with my mother.
00:56:16So but seeing it written out like this attachment trauma and looking at it is attachment trauma.
00:56:24PTSD is a question here on the Internet.
00:56:27Attachment disorders are nearly always a symptom of C-PTSD, complex post-traumatic stress disorder, oftentimes looks like.
00:56:35It looks like this attachment issues and relationship struggles, intimacy issues, flashbacks, mood swings, anxiety, depression, addiction issues, eating disorders, personality disorder traits.
00:56:46That sounds to me a lot like borderline.
00:56:48And I think that would also probably fall under the umbrella of this.
00:56:53But I have certainly had a lot of these.
00:56:58Relationship struggles, intimacy issues, flashbacks, mood swings, anxiety, depression, addiction issues, eating disorders, personality disorder traits.
00:57:08Check, check, check, check, check.
00:57:10this is all relative to attachment trauma.
00:57:15I imagine there's degrees of it.
00:57:17My parents were present, but they just saw me as extensions of themselves and their own sort of concern, panic, worry, anger.
00:57:27And it really left me emotionally crippled in some respects.
00:57:32And you're asking me,
00:57:34I've had to break this down.
00:57:36I like that you gave me this new term, this new language, attachment trauma.
00:57:42But I've dealt with it in a lot of different ways.
00:57:44I am hyper aware of it.
00:57:45I found the fantasy bond by Robert Firestone very helpful.
00:57:48I found sobriety very helpful.
00:57:50But the truth of the matter is, no.
00:57:56I don't think I have healed.
00:57:57I don't know if I will.
00:57:59I've worked hard on accepting who I am, and I've certainly worked hard on awareness around it.
00:58:05And certainly my addiction issues are not the drugs that I used to do, but I'm very compulsive about caffeine, and now I'm sort of back on nicotine a bit with the lozenges.
00:58:16I've had sexual compulsion.
00:58:20I've had very...
00:58:22Certainly an eating disorder and certainly anxiety in like I don't know.
00:58:28You know, sadly, you know, the people that you attract and that you're connected to when you have trauma are going to be people with trauma in various forms of recovery or unrecovery as you are.
00:58:41And a lot of that kind of leads to relationship issues.
00:58:46My intimacy issues, I'm aware of.
00:58:48I'm aware of that I have a hard time receiving love because I can't really fundamentally trust it.
00:58:53I have a hard time.
00:58:54I don't have a hard time showing up for people or being supportive or being there for them.
00:58:59But to really sort of let myself love people is tricky.
00:59:04And I've sort of taken the path of least resistance forward.
00:59:08In some cases, I'm not I'm getting old and I'm not wired for the drama of like minded people, even though the emotions can be strong.
00:59:20And I don't know if I'm ever going to heal.
00:59:23I think I've healed, but I don't know if I'm ever going to overcome them and become a functioning emotional person.
00:59:29You know, what comes with acceptance is also the idea that I'm old or older.
00:59:34And I don't know if I want to go through what it would take to sort of try to, you know, learn how to be loved and learn how to love, you know, with a full open heart, even though people say it's amazing.
00:59:46I don't know.
00:59:48Maybe it is, but I don't know.
00:59:49I don't seem to be doing the work.
00:59:53That would get me there, but I do seem to have a certain amount of self-acceptance.
00:59:57I don't know.
00:59:59So, yes, I have healed...
01:00:02to a degree, but I've also become a bit callous, I guess, or not callous, a bit shut down maybe, or a bit sort of, I've surrendered to maybe not doing the work, but I think I've healed in the way of self-awareness and behavior for the most part, but I don't know if I got back what I lost or what I never had.
01:00:33What is your retirement plan?
01:00:35Will you ever retire?
01:00:36I seem to think I will.
01:00:38I do feel like I could.
01:00:40I don't know if that's real.
01:00:42My retirement plan right now is to get permanent residency in Canada, which is like a green card where if I spend two out of five years up there, I can get health care and also work.
01:00:55And there's a lot to work up there.
01:00:56I don't see it as giving up my citizenship.
01:00:59But in my mind, it's a fantasy.
01:01:02It's a retirement fantasy.
01:01:04And, yeah, I do feel like I would like to wind down.
01:01:07I feel like I would like to detach from show business entirely sometimes if I could, if I had the willpower.
01:01:17How do you cope with getting older?
01:01:18You interviewed a bunch of older folks, and they seemed at peace with their age.
01:01:22Did you take away any useful advice?
01:01:25I seem to acknowledge that I'm getting older.
01:01:27I can see that I'm getting older.
01:01:28I'm kind of fascinated with the idea that I'm getting older.
01:01:31I do feel my body...
01:01:33Getting beat up because of my compulsive nature around exercise.
01:01:38I think I'm coping okay.
01:01:41I'm a little afraid of what may happen to my body, my brain, inside my body.
01:01:47I think the mortality fear, it's there.
01:01:52And if I let myself do it, it gets me anxious.
01:01:56But in terms of the actual aging and being the age I am, I'm okay with it now.
01:02:04Do you have any phobias?
01:02:05Doesn't need to be clinically recognized.
01:02:07Just anything that particularly scares you or creeps you out.
01:02:12I don't like being scared by things in the moment, but there's very few things that I'm scared of in a way that is sort of ongoing.
01:02:21I don't like being startled by, you know, wild animals.
01:02:27insects, humans.
01:02:30But that's not really a phobia.
01:02:31I would say that my longest and sort of pronounced phobia is of water I cannot see the bottom of.
01:02:39Large bodies of water or even smaller bodies of water that are too deep for me to assess.
01:02:45I think I have a fear of that.
01:02:48I don't love flying.
01:02:49I'm afraid of it, but I've had to accept and live with that one.
01:02:53I don't love the idea of plummeting out of the air.
01:02:57I have a terrible fear of being T-boned in my car.
01:03:01There was an accident that happened in Albuquerque where a drunk driver was barreling down a side street so fast, ran a stop sign and struck broadsided another car, but drove right through it.
01:03:15It hit it and soared over it and decapitated four people in it.
01:03:21Being T-boned in a car is really my day-to-day most active fear because I'm not out on the ocean all the time.
01:03:32I don't like flying over water either.
01:03:34That's a double whammy.
01:03:36I'm so afraid the combination of flying and flying over large bodies of water is just horrifying to me.
01:03:43The idea of crashing into the water and just being strapped into a seat at the bottom of the ocean is probably metaphorically the loneliest image I can possibly even think of.
01:03:55even though I'll be dead.
01:03:57But that one really gets me.
01:04:00I got to do a lot of fucking be in the moment kind of stuff.
01:04:05A lot of self-talk flying over those large bodies of water.
01:04:10I found out my 16-year-old cat Vinny has a bone tumor on his leg.
01:04:14He has arthritis, so amputation isn't an option.
01:04:17The vet told me he has maybe six months.
01:04:20I'm 30, so you can imagine the emotional connection I have to a cat that I've had for more than half my life.
01:04:26I've never had to put an animal down before.
01:04:28I'm working hard to be present and enjoy this time, but the anticipatory grief is too much some days.
01:04:34Do you have any advice for this kind of grief or how to cope until that awful day?
01:04:39Well, no, no, there's no advice because what's happening is
01:04:48And what happened to me in these situations is I sort of made my cats hang on for as long as I could.
01:04:54And I think that alongside of your anticipatory grief is the realization that it's the right thing to do.
01:05:02And eventually that'll kind of become very obvious.
01:05:10And you'll just realize that keeping them alive is probably selfish.
01:05:15And that they'd be more... They'd be okay dead.
01:05:18And then they're not people.
01:05:21They're not experiencing this the same way you are.
01:05:25And, you know, you're doing something loving.
01:05:29And you're doing something necessary.
01:05:31It's the hardest part about owning pets.
01:05:36And I grew up with a mom that was very not present for it.
01:05:38She'd just drop them off and have them put down.
01:05:41But lately...
01:05:43For the last two cats I had put down, I was there with them and held them while it happened, which is closure and it's horrible, but it's pretty good.
01:05:58You feel like you're there from right up to the end, but there's nothing to do about that anticipatory grief other than know that you're doing the right thing and you'll sense when it's time.
01:06:08Because they will have had enough.
01:06:11And they've lived a pretty good long life.
01:06:13You gave them a good life.
01:06:15It's okay.
01:06:16It'll be sad for a while.
01:06:18And you'll always remember that guy.
01:06:21But there's plenty of kittens around, pal.
01:06:27I'm about 30 and I've been dealing with a lot of things like career stress, identity issues, depression, etc.
01:06:33I've had a couple of older individuals in my life tell me that it gets easier when you're into your late 30s, 40s and beyond.
01:06:39Would you agree with this?
01:06:40Do you have any advice to make these years easier?
01:06:43Well, look, I mean...
01:06:46It does get easier, but there's core things that, you know, will have an effect on your perception and disposition that are kind of deeply wired into you.
01:06:55And they'll, you know, they'll they'll fuck you up all the time.
01:06:58They'll they're just there to cause instability and and doubt.
01:07:06But you learn how to sort of manage those.
01:07:09I would say that.
01:07:11And I've said this before that the one regret I have is I was so hard on myself.
01:07:19And it sounds like you're being hard on yourself.
01:07:21And I don't know that there's a way not to be hard on yourself.
01:07:23But a lot of the things that are plaguing you now will resolve themselves naturally.
01:07:30It just will happen out of you won't even know it.
01:07:33And it's not a choice.
01:07:34So a lot of things you can't have answers for where you're at, but they will resolve themselves for better or for worse.
01:07:42So maybe be a little less hard on yourself and try to engage with the stuff that interests you and not be so, don't beat the shit out of yourself about all these things that seem so important.
01:07:55Because the reason why it gets a little easier is that in your...
01:07:5940s and beyond, you realize that they really aren't that important and they weren't, but you couldn't have looked at them that way while you were in it.
01:08:07I don't know if that's helpful.
01:08:10It might help because of the answer to this next question is sort of attached to that.
01:08:15How do you get yourself to do the things you don't want to do?
01:08:17I just told Kit this, and it's a habit I've gotten into.
01:08:21I really, in my mind, when I don't want to do something, those are the things that just sit there undone.
01:08:26You know, Kit got mad at me the other night because when I see something that needs to be done, I usually just freak out and do it.
01:08:33It's just the way I am now.
01:08:35Like, just so it doesn't stick in my craw or annoy me or get me obsessed.
01:08:40But things you don't want to do, I find, obviously, you have to do them, is really consider how much time it's going to take you.
01:08:47Because a lot of times, there are little things that are just annoying.
01:08:50Even if you're one of those people that you can't make your bed.
01:08:52Like, I make my bed every day.
01:08:54I never think not to make my bed.
01:08:56But if you have little things, even things that aren't so little...
01:09:00Just really kind of think, how long is this going to take me, really?
01:09:04This thing.
01:09:05And a lot of times it's like 10 minutes, 15 minutes, even if it's an hour, like working out.
01:09:10What's a fucking hour?
01:09:12What's a half hour?
01:09:13What's 15 minutes?
01:09:14What's 10 minutes?
01:09:15Just realize that, like, you don't want to do it.
01:09:18You fucking hate it.
01:09:19But it's only going to take you 13 minutes and it'll be done.
01:09:23Maybe that'll help you.
01:09:27I'm writing a series of children's books to promote mental health and wellness in the shit show that is modern times.
01:09:33What are some important topics you think should be addressed?
01:09:39Well, I used to do jokes about this, but you don't want to diminish a kid's spirit.
01:09:45in terms of what we see as happening in the real world.
01:09:51But I think a premium should be put on somehow making it understood that life can be difficult sometimes, and life can be scary sometimes, and sometimes there aren't answers for questions that you want answers to.
01:10:07And also, sometimes you have to realize in the moment that you like what you're doing and that it's important to you.
01:10:17And also, I think it's important to understand that sadness is part of life.
01:10:24As is happiness and as is sort of learning things.
01:10:29I guess these are all pretty normal children's book stuff, but I don't know how to handle death or sickness and stuff, but I think it's all in there.
01:10:38I think it's just trying to be funny and earnest, but not overbearing about the difficulties of the reality of life.
01:10:51and somehow try to make them perky.
01:10:55That's what I do with my comedy for grownups.
01:11:01In the future, after you've passed, somebody will discover WTF and become a devoted fan like the rest of us.
01:11:06What's your message to that person?
01:11:11Well, there's very little...
01:11:18that you won't know about me from all the work I've done.
01:11:24I've done all I can.
01:11:26I've done the best I could, and there's a lot of it.
01:11:33And if it sticks, welcome.
01:11:36And also, I'm saying this from the grave, which is exciting because it's being recorded.
01:11:45And that's just...
01:11:47exactly who i am i'm now talking to you from the grave just talking how would you describe yourself using only three words what is that some kind of is that a standard question uh i don't know how about i'm almost there i'm almost there
01:12:16Thanks for the questions, folks.
01:12:31Hey, Full Marin listeners get new Ask Mark Anything episodes every few weeks.
01:12:35We just released a new one today, so here's a little bit of that.
01:12:39What was your experience visiting the Criterion Closet?
01:12:41Did they reach out to you?
01:12:42What is the conversation before you go in there?
01:12:44Could you back up a truck and just say, load it up?
01:12:48No, I mean, they asked me to come on and I think it was connected to some sort of premiere or something, but I went over there to Criterion.
01:12:55Yeah, they invited me.
01:12:56No, you know, they show you the closet.
01:12:59It's just one person with a camera and they suggest that maybe you pull some stuff before you'll get a sense of what's in there and and decide kind of what you want before you pull it.
01:13:10or else you're going to get overwhelmed and not know what to pull.
01:13:13I imagine you could back up a truck, but I don't know what your life is like, but I've got more shit than I know what to deal with.
01:13:19I've got boxes of DVDs that I don't even watch anymore.
01:13:21I don't have an organized library.
01:13:24I don't generally need more shit.
01:13:26So the stuff I got, you know, I was curious about or I wanted to own, but I didn't want to overdo it, but they don't really put a limit on you.
01:13:34So I guess you could pull a truck up.
01:13:35If you want all the Ask Mark Anything episodes and all the other bonus episodes we release twice a week, just go to the link in the episode description or go to WTFpod.com and click on WTF+.
01:13:48On Monday, we've got Adrian Brody.
01:13:50And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by Acast.
01:13:55Here we go.
01:15:33Boomer lives.
01:15:35Monkey and LaFonda.
01:15:36Cat angels everywhere.
01:15:37Sweating.

Episode 1605 - Ask Marc Anything: A Full Maron Special Presentation

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