Episode 16 - Eugene Mirman / Dr. Maron / Matthew
Guest 7:Lock the gates!
Guest 2:Are we doing this?
Guest 2:Really?
Guest 2:Wait for it.
Guest 2:Are we doing this?
Guest 2:Wait for it.
Guest 2:Pow!
Guest 2:What the fuck?
Guest 2:And it's also... Eh, what the fuck?
Guest 2:What's wrong with me?
Guest 2:It's time for WTF!
Guest 4:What the fuck?
Guest 4:With Mark Maron.
Marc:Okay, let's do this thing.
Marc:How you doing, what the fuckers?
Marc:Welcome to the show.
Marc:It's our Monday show.
Marc:If you download it on Monday, if you're downloading it later, well, you missed it when it came out, but that's okay.
Marc:On the show today, we've got a nice change of pace from my fucking shit.
Marc:is Eugene Merman, one of the great absurdists of his time.
Marc:And then later in the show, we're going to be talking to Matthew.
Marc:I know some of you miss Matthew.
Marc:I am on the fence.
Marc:I think I missed him.
Marc:I don't know until I see him, but we'll see.
Marc:We're going to talk about the movie Where the Wild Things Are.
Marc:Isn't that what it's called?
Marc:Where the Wild Things Are.
Marc:Brendan also saw it.
Marc:I personally thought it was spectacular for a lot of reasons.
Marc:It's a real movie.
Marc:It's a real art movie.
Marc:It's a real visionary piece of work.
Marc:It's a real grown up movie.
Marc:I really wonder how kids react to that movie.
Marc:So we'll have a conversation about that.
Marc:And we're going to have a conversation, hopefully try to get my father on the phone, because, you know, after our last conversation with his big idea, someone sent me an email.
Marc:And it turns out that I think someone's stolen my dad's idea.
Marc:And I think that my dad should know about that.
Marc:So we're going to try and get him on the phone in a bit.
Marc:I am very grateful to everybody who came out to the live taping at UCB in Los Angeles, getting a lot of great response for the live show, hoping we can do another one next month.
Marc:I've got it on the book, so it's really up to me.
Marc:If I get my shit together to get another live show together, we're going to get another live show together.
Marc:You can go to WTFpod.com for all your WTF podcast needs.
Marc:I got some merch up there.
Marc:There's a link to new merch.
Marc:And also, I want to say thank you.
Marc:deeply to all the people that have been donating to keep this podcast going all the people that have been signing up for the rolling donation of ten dollars a month that is a subscription donation i am working on your t-shirt orders as we speak they will be slightly different than the ones available on the site because i have to make them specifically for you i got a million things to do and all i'm thinking about is how am i going to get the subscribers the quality t-shirts that they deserve
Marc:I want them to be nice.
Marc:I want them to be American apparel.
Marc:I want them to be the color of the what the fuck podcast, that turquoise color.
Marc:I want the logo to look great.
Marc:I will send some stickers in the envelope, too, because I'm getting stickers made.
Marc:I'm pretty excited.
Marc:I've never had stickers before.
Marc:But as I said, it's all new to me and I'm out of my fucking mind.
Marc:I mean, how the fuck do people do this on a day to day basis?
Marc:I don't know how people manage their goddamn lives.
Marc:I just don't even understand it.
Marc:And I get a lot of emails about it.
Marc:I've managed to stay outside of the regular workforce for a long time because this is the life I've chosen for myself.
Marc:I don't have any issues with the life I've chosen for myself.
Marc:It's a difficult life.
Marc:I'm not feeling sorry for myself.
Marc:I've had a lot of great experiences.
Marc:I've done a lot of shit.
Marc:But let me tell you, just in dealing with the responsibilities that I'm dealing with now and making sure we get a good show and producing a good show, I'm almost out of my fucking mind.
Marc:And I really don't know how you people do it.
Marc:I don't know how you people go into work every day sometimes.
Marc:And I think you are the real heroes, you know, just by virtue of the fact that you got to do what you got to do.
Marc:But just day in, day out, you got to suck it up.
Marc:Don't overreact.
Marc:Do your job.
Marc:Act as if nothing is wrong.
Marc:Don't hit send.
Marc:Keep it to yourself.
Marc:Compromise.
Marc:Just put your head down and do what you got to do.
Marc:I would go fucking nuts.
Marc:I mean, you people deserve a fucking reward.
Marc:For not exploding every goddamn day.
Marc:I really don't know how you do it.
Marc:I'm getting a lot of email from you folks just about how when I present things to you and the frustrations that I have in speaking my mind that you feel that as well, but you're not in a position to express it.
Marc:You know, there ought to be one day a year.
Marc:Where we could just walk up to the people that have been driving us crazy, you know, every other day that year and just go, shut the fuck up.
Marc:What the fuck is your problem?
Marc:Just fucking, you know, leave me the fuck alone.
Marc:One day a year.
Marc:How bad would that be?
Marc:But, you know, those kind of words have power.
Marc:And even if you had that one day a year, they would never forget that because people in power or people with positions that are supposed to be powerful or people who are ahead of you or above you in the work chain are little Napoleons that are just after control.
Marc:And if they have a little bit of it, they abuse it.
Marc:And there is no way around that.
Marc:I've never experienced it being any different, no matter how noble or how earnest or how good the person pretends to be.
Marc:And I want to expand the idea of this show.
Marc:I want it to be the five W's.
Marc:I want it to be, you know, not only what the fuck, but who the fuck, where the fuck, when the fuck and why the fuck.
Marc:I'm at this point in my life where just on a day to day basis, moving through the world, dealing with other people, getting on a train, doing the work that needs to be done is filling my life.
Marc:It's filling my mind.
Marc:I read an article recently in the New York Times magazine about anxiety and
Marc:It was a big cover article on anxiety about, you know, you know, is this is this the culture of anxiety?
Marc:Is this the age of anxiety?
Marc:And this is one of those articles where where I had sort of a light bulb go off in my head.
Marc:This guy, Jerome Kagan, did his 20 year research study, starting with babies all the way up to when they were.
Marc:in their late teens, in their early 20s, because he was of the belief that anxiety is learned, that it's behavioral, it's a nurture versus nature thing.
Marc:And then after 20 years of observing babies who were reactive, he called them a high reactive, had a high reactive nature when they were born, that they eventually became very anxious people.
Marc:And now anxiety, if I can read from the article,
Marc:clinical anxiety disorder, of which there are several forms, panic, social anxiety, phobia, obsessive compulsive, post-traumatic stress, and a catch-all called generalized anxiety disorder.
Marc:Taken together, they make anxiety the most common mental illness in America, affecting an estimated 40 million adults.
Marc:And I'm looking at that list and I'm like, those are all my hobbies.
Marc:This is my day to day life.
Marc:I don't know where the hell people have time to watch TV, to take in movies, to TiVo shit, to look at YouTube videos.
Marc:I mean, I am old school with my entertainment options.
Marc:For me, it's dread, panic and revenge fantasies.
Marc:That's where my brain goes.
Marc:That's where my imagination goes.
Marc:That's how I find satisfaction.
Marc:And now I find that I'm among 40 million people that have this disorder.
Marc:And on some level, it's it's a relief to me.
Marc:It's a relief to me to know that when I'm going, why the fuck, when the fuck, who the fuck, what the fuck, where the fuck, that that is a common experience that 40 million people have.
Marc:And it's just what you do with it, I think, that really makes a difference as to the quality of your life.
Marc:Because if you're one of those people that's saying that out loud everywhere you go, eventually you're going to annoy and alienate people and they're going to be like, you know, why the fuck are we hanging around with that guy?
Marc:Because his, you know, what the fuck, when the fuck, where the fuck is just tedious and annoying and he's draining me and I don't want to have anything to do with him.
Marc:I don't know if you've had this experience, you know, where you're invited to someone's house for dinner and you speak your mind and everybody is really taken by it and they're excited and, you know, maybe a little put off, but generally provoked by what you had to say.
Marc:And then you're being walked to the door by the host and
Marc:He says, look, we really appreciate what you had to say, but you're never coming back to our house.
Marc:That's my life on some level.
Marc:So how do you filter that?
Marc:There's a frustration that that even the things that you rely on don't.
Marc:pay off they don't do what they're supposed to do i my biggest problem in my life one of them is that i tend to believe people and i tend to believe in things it's just my nature i i guess you could call it a sucker maybe i'm a sucker but i sort of have child's mind about that stuff and i and i take people on their word and i believe when they say they're going to do something for me and i'm really always disappointed and i'm most of the time i'm frustrated and
Marc:And how can that not lead to fear?
Marc:But the experience I had the other night is, look, I've been living in Astoria for years.
Marc:And now they've built two bars, one on either side.
Marc:I have two bedrooms in this apartment.
Marc:I'm sweeping in the small one in the back because it was quieter.
Marc:Because they built this horrendous Euro fantastic cafe that is open until like 4 in the morning.
Marc:And they play this very strange music that has a beat that I can't quite quantify.
Marc:It's like...
Marc:It's like, I don't know if it's Euro hip hop.
Marc:I'm not sure what it is.
Marc:So I started sleeping in the back room and now there's this Croatian bar or some Baltic.
Marc:It doesn't matter what it is, but they're playing some worse version of that music on a back patio.
Marc:Very loud.
Marc:It's like two thirty in the morning and it's raining out.
Marc:So that patio is not even open.
Marc:And this music is blaring and they're literally during the song.
Marc:I couldn't believe it.
Marc:During the song, there are like, you know, facsimile of like air raid sirens like that.
Marc:And I was like, I can't fucking take it.
Marc:Am I going to be that guy?
Marc:Look, all summer I said, look, it's late.
Marc:These people want to party.
Marc:All right, I'll sleep on the couch.
Marc:What am I?
Marc:What's my recourse?
Marc:Because I knew I assumed that what am I going to walk down there, walk into a bar where nobody speaks my language?
Marc:Go, yeah, in my bathrobe and slippers and say, hey, look, I'm trying to get some sleep.
Marc:Can we turn it down a little bit?
Marc:I don't know what would happen, but I'm not the guy to do that.
Marc:So last night, because I put up with it all summer, I called the police.
Marc:I called the police station, you know, thinking that maybe, you know, they could send a car over just to say, can you turn it down a little bit or close the back door?
Marc:No one's on the patio.
Marc:I mean, you know, what the fuck?
Marc:Just, you know, have a little respect.
Marc:I call the police.
Marc:I go, listen, you know, I live over here in the corner of this and this and that bar around the corner.
Marc:It's two thirty and they're blaring this music.
Marc:And he's like, yeah, yeah, I know.
Marc:And I'm like, OK, he goes, well, you know, you got it.
Marc:You know, you got taken to mind.
Marc:It's New York City.
Marc:And I'm like, I know where I live.
Marc:But I mean, don't people have to sleep?
Marc:It's like I. But, you know, that's what you know, this is.
Marc:This is New York.
Marc:And I'm like, listen, officer, help me out.
Marc:He's like, hey, look, it's the weekend.
Marc:What are you going to do?
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:I guess not call you.
Marc:What am I going to do?
Marc:I'm going to go blow the place up.
Marc:I don't know what I'm going to do.
Marc:Sweep on my fucking couch again.
Marc:You've got nothing for me.
Marc:I just got to put up with this because this is New York City.
Marc:I mean, what happened to having respect for your neighbors?
Marc:What happened to getting some sleep?
Marc:He's like, look, I don't know.
Marc:You know, it's New York.
Marc:It's the weekend.
Marc:I'm like, I get it.
Marc:He goes, hey, look, you know, if I I'll see if I can get a car to go over there.
Marc:I'm like, OK, yeah, let's just see if you can do that.
Marc:And I slept on my fucking couch and I got it.
Marc:I still heard the music and I seethed for a while.
Marc:It's very hard, man.
Marc:It's very hard.
Marc:All this stuff stacks up and there's no place to rest.
Marc:And I see it leaking into culture all the time.
Marc:I mean, like I'm in my car sometimes and I just change lanes and people shoot a look at me like there's some sort of competition going on where I just fucked up their day and I'm seeing that look all the time.
Marc:And I don't know how to make it better, but I did have this very, very specific, almost poetic moment on the train where you start to realize, like, if I just get out of my own head and be a decent person for just a second and not sit there, you know, just fuming or being like a dispenser of negativity, like I'm just sitting on the train.
Marc:And when you live in New York, you're on the train a lot.
Marc:And there's a lot of people on the train from everywhere giving you swine flu.
Marc:That's another thing.
Marc:I can't.
Marc:God damn it.
Marc:I mean, there are people getting the swine flu now.
Marc:Do you know anyone who's gotten it?
Marc:I knew some guy I talked to on the phone.
Marc:He's like, I had the swine flu.
Marc:And I'm like, oh, my God.
Marc:And I thought I was getting it over the phone.
Marc:I hung out the phone with him.
Marc:I'm like, holy shit.
Marc:I don't feel that good.
Marc:I'm probably getting the swine flu.
Marc:That's not the case.
Marc:So I'm on the train.
Marc:Just sitting there in my own head thinking like, I'm fucked.
Marc:This is fucked.
Marc:This is bullshit.
Marc:But then I have those moments where it's like, you know, those moments where you're on the line and you're looking at people and you could go either way.
Marc:Like, you know, people suck.
Marc:They're all fucked.
Marc:What a bunch of assholes.
Marc:What a bunch of selfish, fucked up people we are.
Marc:This is a disaster.
Marc:The jig is up.
Marc:Civilization is over.
Marc:Our culture is bankrupt.
Marc:These people's priorities are fucked.
Marc:I hate them all.
Marc:And that's just like really just one notch away from like, oh, look at all of us.
Marc:We're lost here.
Marc:We're sad, tragic animals that really just we did the best we could, but it wasn't enough.
Marc:And it got away from us.
Marc:And we're all in this very sad and tragic place trying to coexist on this planet that is just hurling through space without a hope in the fucking world.
Marc:It's one notch.
Marc:And what happens is I'm just sitting there and this woman wants to sit down and she's huge.
Marc:And you know when you see somebody who is huge or physically challenged somehow and you know they're conscious of it and you know that it's always just under the surface of how they feel about themselves and how they fit in and how awkward that is.
Marc:And she wants to sit down and she's like starting to back in next to me.
Marc:back herself into the seat next to me and she's like excuse me and i and and how can it not be awkward and and she just you know plops down on the seat and everyone's got to move over and she just had this look of like you know like i hate it too and don't fucking judge me and i just fucking i just can't you know and i just i just looked at her i said there's no problem
Marc:It's OK.
Marc:It's no problem.
Marc:And she she had this weird moment of like, you know, gratitude and relief and her being just sort of relaxed for a second.
Marc:And it was that simple.
Marc:To make somebody, you know, feel like they were OK or feel like that it wasn't a problem for just a second, you know, that just courtesy.
Marc:And it made me feel better, too.
Marc:And it was easy because, you know, my first reaction or the one that could have happened is like, oh, fuck.
Marc:All right.
Marc:All right.
Marc:But no, like it's really no problem.
Marc:It's OK.
Marc:On the other hand, don't get on the fucking car singing like we were expecting a show.
Marc:Could you not do that?
Marc:I mean, I understand times are tough, but I don't need the pressure.
Marc:And your interpretation of that old spiritual is fine.
Marc:But I just it's like I'm just trying to get from place A to place B and not feel like an asshole and not lose my fucking mind to have you singing in
Marc:And I feel guilt.
Marc:And don't sit next to me if you wear too much perfume or you stink.
Marc:You know what?
Marc:I'm taking away from the moment.
Marc:It's all okay.
Marc:It's fine.
Marc:It's really okay.
Guest 7:Don't worry about it.
What the fuck?
WGF!
What the fuck?
WGF!
Marc:all right well this is exciting my guest uh in studio by the way the air america studios on the off hours where we are illegitimately taping our podcast and i appreciate you coming down eugene sure i appreciate you uh you know going through the uh the barricade of codes and secret doors to find your way to this studio under under the radar eugene merman as many you know is a uh
Marc:a raconteur, an entrepreneur, and a stand-up comedian, and a showman, a general P.T.
Marc:Barnum of all that is absurd and cutting edge.
Guest 5:His new CD is called... It's called God is a 12-Year-Old Boy with Asperger's.
Marc:And his book is called... The Will to Whatevs.
Marc:And he's also I have a Eugene Merman bag and I did his Eugene Merman.
Marc:What was it?
Marc:The Eugene Merman Palooza Comedy Festival.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:The Eugene Merman Comedy Festival.
Marc:And I got to be honest with you.
Marc:The swag was high end, man.
Marc:Those those headphones.
Guest 5:Yeah.
Marc:What were they called?
Marc:Skullcandy.
Marc:Skullcandy Full Metal Jacket Headphones.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Those are good.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You can use them for your Blackberry microphone, and also you can use them as earphones, regular earphones.
Guest 4:They would be thrilled to know you were talking about them.
Guest 4:Yeah, I sent them an email and said, could I have a bunch of free headphones to give to comedians so that they talk about them on the air?
Guest 4:And they were like, absolutely.
Absolutely.
Marc:And I can support this product.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Will you tell them that I said that?
Guest 4:I absolutely will, and no one else responded.
Marc:Really?
Guest 4:But they did.
Marc:Are you still in contact with them?
Marc:Do you have a friend over there?
Guest 4:No.
Guest 4:Why are we talking about a headphone company?
Guest 4:But I met them at South by Southwest.
Guest 4:They were like, if you ever need headphones, let me know.
Marc:See, that's the difference between Eugene and myself.
Marc:Eugene saw an opportunity in a chance meeting at South by Southwest with a headphone manufacturer.
Marc:I would have said, like, well, what makes them so fucking good?
Guest 4:They gave me some, so I knew already they were pretty good.
Marc:Oh, I would have said something like, so this is what you do with your life?
Marc:You make headphones?
Guest 4:And she would have said, no, I promote headphones.
Guest 4:I have no idea how they're built.
Marc:And I would have said, so you're like a publicist for a headphone company?
Guest 4:And she would have said, yes.
Guest 4:She said it's called marketing, but yes.
Guest 3:And I would have said, that's what you do with your life?
Guest 3:Is that satisfying?
Guest 4:She would say maybe.
Marc:So, Huge, you're headed over to do the taping of the John Oliver stand-up special series that I did last night.
Marc:You're heading over there now.
Marc:I thought you were supposed to be there.
Marc:I had to be there at like 2.15.
Marc:They let you, what, are you special?
Guest 4:I'm assuming they're not making everyone show up at the same time, but yes, I'll be late.
Marc:Oh, okay.
Guest 4:Well, I don't want to be super late.
Guest 4:I'll just be, no, no, I'm supposed to be there at three something.
Marc:Well, don't you have to, I would think that you would have to get there earlier than most people.
Guest 4:Because I have all these contraptions.
Guest 4:No, what I, instead I'm just simply late to a podcast because the printer, because one of the three printers in the home wasn't working.
Guest 4:Oh, really?
Guest 4:But we got it all set.
Guest 4:So I printed some killer bits that I can hold up for America.
Marc:It's so funny that you know me well enough to know that the shots I take at you are coming and that when I have the slightly condescending tone about your need to have many different objects.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:At least you're not doing a Dimitri Martin.
Marc:He used to walk into the comedy cellar with like a skateboard, a guitar, an easel.
Marc:And you, you know, you do pictures.
Guest 4:I just have some pictures.
Guest 4:I don't have an easel.
Marc:Are you going to be showing pictures on a screen tonight?
Guest 4:No, I'm just going to hold them up.
Guest 4:I'm DIY.
Guest 4:I don't want to use electricity.
Guest 5:And that's why people love you, man.
Guest 5:What am I talking about?
Guest 4:Yeah, I'm going to hold up little pieces of paper with hilarious social commentary on them.
Marc:I like them.
Marc:I've grown to like you a great deal.
Marc:Thank you very much.
Marc:I mean, it took a little time.
Guest 4:Am I the person who is slightly successful, but you don't have anger towards?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Well, I mean, I can find the anger towards that.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:But I tend to realize now that some people need the relief that you offer them.
Marc:And then some people need the relief that I offer them.
Marc:And that's how I look at our job.
Marc:We're much like doctors.
Guest 4:Right.
Marc:Do you feel that ever?
Marc:Do you feel like I'm doing a service?
Yes.
Guest 4:I feel so is what you are is you're helping people cope with just the sheer blackness of life.
Guest 4:Right.
Guest 4:And the sort of despondency of divorce and just and then I make people go like, it's true.
Guest 4:Banks are really weird.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you're probably attracting a much more well-adjusted young person, whereas I attract people like I've had it.
Marc:You know, I've just fucking had it.
Guest 4:You attract the people who are too kind to become, you know, suicide bombers.
Marc:Right.
Guest 4:Yet pretty upset at the system.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I don't mind those people.
Marc:No.
Marc:They make me bake goods.
Guest 4:Exactly.
Guest 4:I've been with you when someone's like, here's some cookies.
Guest 4:Thank you for everything you've done.
Marc:I think that's great.
Marc:I do, too.
Marc:I enjoy the cookies.
Marc:Now, we've had this ongoing thing now that's happening, and there's part of me that wants to continue it out of spite, and there's part of me that wants to talk about it openly as a real issue.
Marc:I have gotten a couple emails addressing the fact that I refer to my Jewishness too frequently.
Marc:Now, I have been a guy that really fought with the idea of ever talking about being a Jew on stage, OK, because I didn't know how to do it.
Marc:That wouldn't be like, I'm a Jew.
Marc:I sit down.
Marc:Look, I'm eating something that Jews eat.
Marc:Hey, look at your Jews do this.
Marc:We're all smart.
Marc:And you people are dummies.
Marc:And I never did that until I found a way to talk about being a Jew, but not really, you know, necessarily.
Guest 4:Why are people upset by that?
Marc:Because they think it's redundant that, you know, why do I have to keep saying I'm a Jew?
Marc:And they literally get annoyed by it.
Guest 4:Are they Jewish or no?
Marc:I'm assuming no.
Marc:Judging by the emails, it's like, look, I like Mark, but enough with the Jew shit.
Marc:So, you know, I'm not sure how to take that.
Marc:Now, what's interesting to me is you and I traveled on the road.
Marc:We did 11 gigs.
Marc:It was me.
Marc:You and Andy Kinler.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And I will tell that story in a moment.
Marc:But you do not come from a middle class Jewish background where you have generations of of Jews.
Marc:You have the whole the move from Eastern Europe to to.
Guest 4:I don't have that or I do.
Marc:Well, you don't have it in the sense that, you know, you're not like like I'm like third or fourth generation.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You know, we still hear the stories about, you know, your grandfather used to carry things on his back for no money and feed people with.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But but you your family was in Russia and you came over recently.
Guest 4:Right.
Guest 4:Right.
Guest 4:Yes.
Guest 4:No, those people in my family were killed by Hitler.
Guest 4:So I don't have them.
Guest 4:I don't know if that's better or worse.
Marc:So I guess then let me rephrase that.
Marc:My family, I guess, was smarter than your family in leaving Eastern Europe before the shit went down, whereas you guys went ahead and took the hit.
Guest 4:Well, I mean, I don't know.
Guest 4:I'm sure that if people knew what was coming, they would have totally bailed.
Guest 4:I think it was really that it was a blitzkrieg.
Marc:in many ways all right my apologies uh um the but what's the question why are we such awesome jews yeah well the question is is that uh it what's interesting about the difference is that you don't come to the table with all this baggage of of yeah oy vey and the immigrants and the yiddish and right you know your father had to your grandfather broke his back in order to make your life easier and
Guest 4:Well, yeah, but I think it's because I come from a place where it was like my mom was the one Jew that got into like university her year because like – In Russia.
Guest 4:Yeah, in Russia because there's like – because they legitimately don't like Jews in a very real way where like you're prevented from working in places.
Guest 4:Like she worked for a guy who like – as she says, quote, like took in Jews.
Guest 4:Like it was just like a computer or like an engineer.
Marc:And this was in the 70s.
Guest 4:Yeah, exactly.
Guest 4:So he was a guy who took in Jews in Russia in the 70s.
Guest 4:So it's not like you couldn't have a job.
Guest 4:You just had to find a guy that was like, I don't mind the Jews.
Guest 4:A lot of them taste great.
Guest 4:Sweet, soft skin.
Guest 4:Well, do you remember Russia?
Guest 4:No.
Guest 4:You know, all I literally, and this is true, remember is the smell of blackcurrant.
Guest 4:Really?
Guest 4:Yeah, because smells, I guess, are very powerful.
Guest 4:And we apparently had blackcurrant bushes in our dacha in Russia.
Guest 4:And I actually thought there were blackcurrant trees because I was so tiny that I just assumed there were trees.
Guest 4:Well, I was like, blackcurrant just, it's bushes.
Marc:And how old were you when you left?
Guest 4:I was four.
Guest 4:That's amazing.
Guest 4:And I was 82 when I arrived.
Guest 4:Wow.
Guest 4:So much life lived.
Marc:Black current bushes is what you remember about Russia.
Guest 4:And the ironclad fist of communism.
Guest 4:That and constantly people redistributing all my toys.
Guest 4:That's all I can recall.
Marc:Have you gone back?
Marc:You did, right?
Guest 4:No, but I really want to.
Guest 4:In fact, if anyone listening is very wealthy, can I have somewhere between $300,000 and $600,000 to make a movie of going back for the first time?
Marc:And also, you can donate to WhatTheFuck at WTFPod.com, and I'll try to add a button for Eugene Merman's movie project.
Guest 4:I have to figure out how to do that.
Guest 4:Maybe I should just have a donation button where you could fund my trip.
Marc:What's the idea for the movie?
Guest 4:It's just that I go back and cry and do a show.
Guest 4:I go back to Russia, maybe do a show.
Guest 4:That's funny because I've watched some Russians stand up on TV and not on TV here, but like on the Internet.
Guest 4:And it is just so like weird and goofy and not at all what I do.
Marc:Could you please, if you could, Eugene, indulge me, could you do could you say, hey, I'm really enjoying this Diet Coke in Russian?
Guest 4:That's very easy to do.
Guest 4:That's awesome.
Marc:And did someone tell me you're playing a Russian mobster on something?
Guest 4:I am.
Guest 4:On Delocated, I play a Russian mobster slash stand-up comedian.
Guest 4:So I'm trying to kill John Glazer, but really I want to do comedy.
Marc:So when these things happen, because you were on Flight of the Conchords as well.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Did you do some more of those?
Guest 4:I mean, I did a bunch of the episodes, but I'm not in it a ton, but I'm in like half of it.
Marc:And now you're in this show.
Marc:So you are, what did people just call you up and go, hey, we need you to do a thing with the thing.
Guest 4:That is exactly what happens.
Guest 4:And also in both shows I play, in Concords I'm Eugene, and then in Delocated I'm Yevgeny, which is Russian for Eugene.
Marc:Eugene sounds better.
Guest 4:Well, you know, that's my name.
Guest 4:But Evgeny is... Evgeny is sort of my formal Russian name, but really my Russian name is Zhenya.
Guest 4:Zhenya?
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 5:What does that mean?
Guest 5:Fuckmaster.
Guest 4:Weird.
Guest 4:The literal translation of Shania is fuck master.
Guest 5:It's so odd.
Guest 5:Your parents were very funny.
Marc:I know.
Marc:They had high hopes for you.
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Guest 4:They were like, one day he will come to America and fuck people and tell jokes.
Marc:And then you got here and said, who's this shoemaker guy who's doing the love master thing?
Marc:Because I'm the fuck master.
Guest 4:Yeah, I stole his essence.
Marc:Yeah, but you know that Dan Cook accused Steve Byrne of stealing his essence?
Marc:And it's a really often... Oh, I think I did hear that.
Marc:Isn't that interesting to hear somebody accuse somebody of stealing their essence?
Guest 4:That's like something that would be very reasonable if it was a comic book, because that happens in comic books.
Guest 4:But it happens so much less in comedy.
Marc:I think I'd rather see Dan Cook as a comic book character.
Guest 4:Is Steve Burt, is he, you know, the truth is I don't know.
Marc:You're asking me, did he steal Dan Cook's essence?
Guest 4:Yeah, well, did he cast a spell?
Guest 4:No, is he at all similar?
Guest 4:Like, I don't even know if they're similar.
Marc:It's just kind of a weird thing, the essence thing.
Marc:I think the end of your movie when you go to Russia should be you coming upon a large thicket of black currant bushes and crying.
Marc:Yeah, sure.
Marc:And saying, this is what I remember.
Guest 4:Yes, I'd be like, this.
Guest 4:Maybe I'll go to that house.
Marc:And drop to your knees.
Guest 4:Maybe I could even blow the blackcurrant bushes.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest 4:I mean, depending on what direction we want to take the movie in.
Marc:Well, I think just spending time finding the blackcurrant bush's cock would be very interesting.
Marc:And that movie alone.
Marc:Yeah, and deciding.
Guest 4:What was its cock?
Guest 4:What was its sweet blackcurrant?
Marc:See, I can do the abstract thing with you.
Guest 4:I know, and I can emote.
Marc:This is really great.
Marc:I knew this would work out.
Marc:Now I will tell a story about traveling with Eugene Merman, and you can correct me if I'm wrong, and Andy Kindler, who I will hopefully have on this show soon.
Marc:Andy Kindler puts together this tour.
Marc:It's the Stand Uppity Tour.
Marc:It's with Marc Maron, Eugene Merman, and Andy Kindler.
Marc:Now, I don't know if you know Andy Kindler, but Andy Kindler is... I spent 11-hour stints in a car with Andy Kindler, and traveling with Andy Kindler...
Marc:for those of you haters out there, is like traveling with the Jewish people, with the history of the Jewish people.
Marc:And Eugene, so here, should I do the full-on impressions and everything?
Marc:Yeah, yeah, definitely.
Marc:Okay, so Andy's just kind of Jewish.
Marc:And Eugene's this kind of Jew.
Marc:Ba-ba-ba-ba.
Marc:Ba-ba-ba-ba-ba.
Marc:Ba-ba-ba.
Marc:And I'm this kind of Jew.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So that's what's traveling in this small rental car.
Marc:And I just have to be honest with you.
Marc:Our first day when Eugene met, me and Andy, in Cincinnati.
Marc:And if the people in Cincinnati did not have...
Marc:A clear idea of what a Jew was.
Marc:By our third visit to the Waffle House in Cincinnati, they had an idea.
Marc:They thought, well, they're apparently, you know, charming initially become very irritating upon ordering, Andy.
Marc:So here's what happened.
Marc:So the first night we're there.
Marc:Uh, huge is in a slight panic because he needs a screen to project his act on.
Marc:So we're like, what do you mean a screen?
Marc:He's like, I just need to go to a target and get a shower curtain.
Marc:So, uh, right.
Marc:Am I right?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest 4:So what you're leaving out is not only do I have to project our act, my act, I have to project also a movie that that's from our sponsors.
Guest 4:Like I, we're contractual.
Guest 4:We all have to do it.
Marc:Who is our sponsor?
Guest 4:23-6, we used their money to travel.
Guest 4:They went out of business after they helped us travel around.
Marc:Well, thank God we took this trip.
Marc:So we've got to go to Target.
Marc:It's like hours before showtime.
Marc:So I go to the desk at the Target, the concierge, or just the woman there.
Marc:And I'm like, where's the Target?
Marc:She's like, I have directions.
Marc:print it up because people apparently ask for the target so she gives us written directions to the target we get in the car it's like 12 minutes away it's like three exits down the highway i've got a gps we've got a gps in the car that i brought my old gps and he's got a new cell phone that he doesn't or an iphone that he doesn't know how to work that has a gps on it and eugene's holding typed out directions we are on the highway no less than maybe eight minutes and we're lost i you know i got into one of those conversations with andy
Marc:You know, it's probably something about like who burned more bridges, me or you.
Marc:And he's like, and I'm like, and Eugene's like, I think we missed it.
Marc:And so we're on the highway.
Marc:And we're like, did we miss it?
Marc:And there's construction.
Marc:I'm like, what the fuck?
Marc:And Eugene's like, why don't you just put Target into your GPS?
Marc:So I didn't know I could do that.
Marc:So I put Target in, but the Target that comes up on the GPS is like 45 minutes away.
Guest 4:Because your GPS was from the 20s.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:So now I've got the GPS from the 20s.
Marc:And I'm like, well, where the fuck do we get off?
Marc:And Andy's like, should I use my iPhone?
Marc:I can put the iPhone in.
Marc:The iPhone does this, right?
Marc:Shouldn't that GPS work on the iPhone?
Marc:Shouldn't it work?
Marc:Should I call him?
Marc:Maybe I'll call Target.
Marc:Maybe I should just call Target.
Marc:And then... I don't...
Marc:All right, so anyway, so I panic, and I'm like, fuck it, let's get off here.
Marc:So we get off, and within minutes, we're in the woods.
Marc:We're driving through Appalachia.
Marc:People, men with beards are walking out of cabins, curious about the machine we're driving.
Marc:I've got the GPS set on the English woman voice because it makes I feel it's passive aggressive and I like engaging with it.
Marc:And it's literally telling me because we're now heading towards a target that is God knows where.
Marc:And it's like 10 left now.
Marc:And in retrospect, they should really have an old Jewish voice on the GPS.
Marc:It goes, I think you missed it.
Marc:I think.
Marc:Wait.
Marc:All right.
Marc:We'll see what happens.
Marc:So I'm getting irritated.
Marc:And I'm like, what the fuck, man?
Marc:This is ridiculous.
Marc:We've got to be at the show.
Marc:And Andy's like, take it easy, Mark.
Marc:And Eugene's like, oh, no.
Marc:And this is going on for like a half an hour.
Marc:And we're driving through the mountains, through a single highway.
Marc:There's no other roads.
Marc:And all of a sudden, out of nowhere, after about 15 minutes of nothing, the GPS goes, turn right now.
Marc:And I turn right onto a dirt road, and there's a lake in front of me.
Marc:Water.
Marc:And then without missing a beat, the GPS goes, board ferry.
Guest 4:It was the funniest thing because we had been lost at that point for like an hour.
Guest 4:And all of a sudden it was like – and they were fighting and then all of a sudden Bored Ferry.
Marc:Bored Ferry.
Marc:It was funny to us all.
Marc:It was hilarious.
Marc:And then we ended up going to some other place to get the – No, we found a target.
Marc:Wasn't it a Lowe's or something?
Guest 4:No, Lowe's wouldn't have that.
Guest 4:We'd have to get a washing machine.
Marc:But – so huge.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What's happening now in the big career?
Marc:Where can people get the Eugene Merman catalog?
Guest 4:Well, they can get it on the internet.
Guest 4:I mean, they can get it at Amazon.
Guest 4:They can get it in stores.
Guest 4:Books, my book they can get at Barnes & Noble.
Marc:Do you have a website that people could enjoy?
Guest 4:Oh, yeah, EugeneMerman.com.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Well, that's important.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 4:One thing that I'm going to do that I realized in my career as I was thinking, like, I don't know what I'm doing.
Guest 4:And I went, oh, yeah, I'm going to go to Copenhagen for the UN Climate Change Conference.
Marc:Really?
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 4:I'm going to go there for grist.org.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 4:And cover it for them.
Guest 4:I'm going to be like a comedy correspondent.
Marc:You're very good at that.
Marc:I appreciate the work you did during the campaigns.
Marc:Thank you.
Marc:Oh, that's right.
Marc:Were you ever able to use that suit we bought?
Marc:Not yet.
Marc:We were in, where were we?
Marc:Fargo?
Guest 4:We were in Fargo.
Marc:And we went to an army surplus store.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 4:And I bought a giant camouflage suit that's like leaves, like fake or whatever.
Marc:It has moss on it.
Marc:It's like this outfit that makes you look like a black currant bush.
Guest 4:Yes, and I still haven't done anything with it, but I have it, and periodically I think about it.
Marc:Sometimes you have to buy something, and then... Because when I saw it, I'm like, this is at least 10 minutes for you.
Guest 4:That's what I thought, too, but not yet.
Marc:How can you not use that yet?
Marc:I just picture you sitting in a hotel room like you do occasionally.
Guest 4:I picture the same thing.
Marc:Saying, I don't think anyone can see me.
Marc:Do you want to write it now?
Marc:What are some of the jokes you think you're making?
Guest 4:I don't know.
Guest 4:You know, it'd be like, I'll fix Iraq.
Guest 4:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest 4:That could be one way.
Guest 4:And then another could be like, I'm invisible.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 4:So who knows?
Guest 4:A lot of it would, I'd have to.
Marc:I think we just saw, we just got a window into Eugene's process.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Marc:You buy the thing and then you just put it on and you see what comes out.
Guest 4:Yeah, that is part of it.
Marc:What's some of the great things that have happened to you in relation to the work you've done?
Guest 4:Well, this week, the Village Voice said that I was the best comedian.
Guest 4:Yeah, in New York.
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah, for this year.
Marc:That used to be a pretty popular magazine.
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah, too bad they didn't say it in 1965 when that would have significantly helped me.
Marc:No, I was proud of you.
Marc:But that was nice.
Marc:It was nice.
Marc:You've come a long way from when you were only playing for a few people.
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah.
Guest 4:Now I play for a few people, but those people are like, wow, he's totally playing for us.
Marc:He's good.
Marc:Yeah, we love him.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He's our Buddha.
Marc:I can't remember like years ago.
Marc:Didn't you do a story about Aerosmith or something?
Marc:Like at Luna about listening to Aerosmith?
Guest 4:It's very possible.
Guest 4:I grew up on Aerosmith.
Guest 4:They were my first concert.
Guest 4:The first concert I went to was Guns N' Roses opening for Aerosmith.
Marc:Really?
Guest 4:Yeah.
Marc:How did that affect you?
Guest 4:Made me super rock and roll.
Marc:Were you pretty rock and roll?
Guest 4:No.
Guest 4:I mean, I was a nerd.
Guest 4:I was super awkward, nerdy weirdo who liked heavy metal.
Guest 4:I mean, and hard rock.
Guest 4:I wasn't I mean, I was of the time.
Marc:But like when you were a kid, did you not fit in?
Guest 4:I would say it did not fit in.
Guest 4:But I was always weirdly – I don't know if infamous or – like people would pull over like cars in my hometown and be like, there goes Eugene.
Guest 4:Like I don't know what to even make of it.
Guest 4:It was beyond popularity or unpopularity.
Guest 4:It was just the weirdest thing.
Guest 4:Are you serious?
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah, absolutely.
Guest 4:Like, I was just talking about it with a friend of mine.
Guest 4:It was the odd, and it's still, yeah, so that used to happen, yeah.
Marc:You just have, like, that weird force of nature presence.
Guest 4:I guess, as a child.
Guest 4:I mean, it's not like people were like, one day he'll be pretty funny.
Guest 4:They were just like, what a weird, like, it wasn't, and I wasn't even, it's not like I was goth or something.
Guest 4:I think there was no, like, particular category.
Guest 3:Who would say this, grownups?
Guest 4:No, that would be awesome.
Guest 4:If I was like, why is that guy who works?
Guest 3:There's Mr. Johnson.
Guest 4:Yeah.
Guest 4:There goes Eugene.
Guest 4:No, it was like kids, but sometimes they wouldn't always be from the town, but they generally be from our town.
Guest 4:And they would be often like a little older where it'd be like, how do they, like, why would you even know me?
Guest 4:Like, how could you possibly know me?
Guest 4:I don't even, I still don't know what to make of it.
Guest 4:You'd have to ask one of those kids.
Guest 4:And they would tell you.
Guest 3:But it was never prefaced with anything like, weirdo.
Guest 3:It was just.
Guest 4:It was just.
Guest 4:Yeah, it was.
Guest 4:I mean.
Guest 4:It was just, there goes Eugene.
Guest 4:Yeah, I mean, and it happened.
Guest 4:I don't know.
Guest 4:Like, I can't tell.
Guest 4:It's hard to remember now.
Guest 4:I mean, in my head, it used to happen all the time.
Guest 4:But maybe it was only like 20 times.
Guest 4:But that's still a large number of times for people to pull over a car and yell your name.
Guest 4:And be like, who is that?
Guest 4:And you're a kid.
Guest 4:It's not like I'm on TV.
Guest 4:You know.
Guest 4:So yeah, but I – so I was a super weirdo.
Guest 4:Not super weirdo, but whatever.
Guest 4:I was that sort of thing and then my – in 11th grade, I ran for senior class president.
Guest 4:And I sort of went from being very popular to sort of popular because it was such a ridiculous thing.
Guest 4:But my friend thought of a slogan for me and my slogan was, it's not just a change.
Guest 4:It's a mutation.
Yeah.
Guest 4:And I put up weird posters all over the school with, like, Nordic Ruins shit that I wrote on it.
Guest 4:Like, it was really... Did you win?
Guest 4:No.
Guest 4:I lost by, like, 20 points.
Guest 4:20 points, 20 votes.
Guest 4:I ran for senior class president in 11th grade.
Guest 4:It was, like, the end of 11th, you know.
Marc:Oh, for next year.
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah, just like Obama ran.
Guest 4:Yeah, just like that.
Guest 4:Yeah, yeah.
Guest 4:I was, at the time, the Obama of my school, and I lost, except for he had always been super charismatic.
Marc:Now, here, I had an interesting email recently about, because I talked about high school and about, like, I was never a nerd.
Marc:I was sort of a free agent.
Marc:Like, I could interact with both camps, jocks and what we would call nerds.
Marc:But someone made this interesting point about how, like, the jocks and the nerds were both very exclusionary.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Right.
Marc:That because I always assume like, you know, the jocks were just dicks.
Marc:But this guy made a point in me saying, like, don't underestimate the dickishness of nerds, which was basically his argument that they were insulated as well.
Marc:And also bullies.
Marc:There were nerd bullies.
Marc:And I don't really have a reference for that.
Marc:But did you ever find that?
Guest 4:I mean I think that that's true.
Guest 4:I think for me – I mean I was vaguely a nerd but more just because of my cast.
Guest 4:But really I also had terrible grades.
Guest 4:Like I was in lower level classes.
Guest 4:Not the lowest.
Guest 4:But I also was in special ed.
Guest 4:So I was like –
Guest 4:I was in very low level classes in special ed.
Marc:You were in special aid?
Guest 4:I was, yeah, but only for six years.
Marc:Oh, that's good.
Guest 4:So it wasn't like it was from sixth to twelfth grade.
Marc:Now, what did the teachers say about you?
Guest 4:Oh, my God.
Guest 4:Here's a funny story about what the teachers said about me.
Guest 4:My friend Alina just told me recently that in third grade, our teacher told her to not be friends with me because I was a loser.
Guest 4:And then his proof showed her my standardized test scores.
Guest 4:So how much of a loser must I have been for a teacher to intervene and go like, that kid's trouble.
Guest 4:He's never going to be nothing.
Guest 4:It's so crazy.
Guest 4:And then another highlight was that in eighth grade, I got a negative eight on something.
Guest 4:So that's pretty good.
Marc:What did you do?
Marc:Erase questions?
Yeah.
Guest 4:I handed in my homework late after not fixing it.
Guest 4:Whatever I did when he finished the calculations, I got less than zero points.
Guest 4:Less than if I didn't hand it in.
Marc:That doesn't even seem possible.
Guest 4:Math teachers.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:They kicked me out of a private school once and they wrote my parents a letter saying, we recommend a boarding school or military school for Mark.
Marc:Mark has the wrong kind of leadership qualities.
Marc:The wrong guy.
Marc:He's Hitler.
Marc:Be careful.
Marc:This guy's going to take people right over the cliff.
Guest 4:That's great that you do have leadership qualities, but they're the wrong kind.
Guest 4:You're like an evil sorcerer.
Guest 4:Yeah, exactly.
Guest 4:Come with me.
Guest 4:I will lead you to nowhere.
Marc:So we'll break a leg tonight and have a good time.
Marc:And I really appreciate you coming by.
Marc:Maybe we can do it again.
Guest 5:Yeah, this was extremely fun.
Guest 5:I will gladly come back.
Guest 5:All right.
Guest 5:Eugene Merman.
Guest 5:Eugene Merman dot com.
Guest 5:Talk to you later.
Guest 5:Mark Maron.
Guest 5:Mark Maron dot com.
Guest 5:Eugene Merman.
Guest 5:Bye.
Marc:So I get an email from Evan.
Marc:Hey, Mark, looks like Burger King's already on to your dad's idea.
Marc:New locations will feature LCD screens showing content.
Marc:Huh.
Marc:Well, I'm looking at the article.
Marc:Burger King gets edgy.
Marc:Futuristic makeover.
Marc:Edgy Burger King 2020 design tip of the day.
Marc:And here's a picture with the new Burger King with TV monitors.
Marc:And I, you know what?
Marc:We got to call my dad and tell him about this because it looks like they stole his idea.
Marc:Can we get him on the phone?
Guest 8:I'm Marin.
Marc:Are you Marin?
Marc:It's Mark Marin.
Marc:Is this Dr. Barry Marin?
Guest 8:How you doing, man?
Marc:I'm all right.
Marc:You?
Guest 8:I'm doing great.
Marc:What are you doing?
Guest 8:I'm sitting here in Victoria Clinic seeing patients as usual.
Marc:Oh, you have a patient in there right now?
Guest 8:Nope.
Marc:Oh.
Guest 8:This is a loose clinic.
Guest 8:It's just medical legal stuff.
Marc:What does that mean?
Guest 8:I was doing it once a twice a week, then I moved it up to... I do steal my patients here on Saturday, all those ones that need to be seen.
Marc:What does a loose clinic mean?
Guest 8:It means it's all bullshit.
Marc:It's all bullshit?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest 8:A lawyer has a client who hurt this or that in a car accident, and they send them over here for...
Guest 8:for evaluation and treatment, and I'm the guy that defines whether it is a real deal or a no deal.
Marc:But you play straight, though, right?
Marc:You tell the truth.
Marc:Yes, I do.
Marc:All right, look, Dad, I was going over our last conversation about this idea with the video cameras in the fast food places.
Guest 8:Oh, okay.
Marc:And it looks like Burger King's already doing it.
Guest 8:Oh, really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Someone sent me an article, and there's a big picture, and it's like this whole revised Burger King with all these, you know, a new, hipper look.
Marc:And they have video screens, and bun-like seating is part of the appeal designed to attract the king's most loyal customers, it says, young men.
Marc:So they've got these little areas where they have video screens.
Marc:So I don't know, you know, what do we do about that?
Marc:Do you think they stole it?
Guest 8:I got no patent.
Guest 8:I didn't have any patents written up on it.
Guest 8:I think they did something.
Guest 8:Somebody came up with it, but they're not doing those.
Guest 8:What are they going to put on these screens?
Guest 8:Where is the nearest one?
Marc:Hold on, hold on.
Marc:I'll tell you.
Marc:They're going to put nutritional information in the comedy of Marc Maron.
Marc:It says right here in the article.
Marc:It's the weirdest coincidence.
Marc:I just can't imagine that this is coincidence.
Marc:Can you?
Guest 8:No, they stole it.
Guest 8:That's right.
Guest 8:You know, I think it's a great idea.
Guest 8:I think you could do it.
Guest 8:All it would take, you know, if it got arranged, all it would take is one CD for the whole world every month.
Marc:One CD for the whole world.
Guest 8:I mean, all the places that have this program would get a mailed out CD to put in to their...
Guest 8:drives for customers to look at it.
Guest 8:So it'll be a new educational process every month, and you would sell it on the concept that it is going to all these places, and you would get a passive income of an annuity of a lot of money every month.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So do we work with this existing model at Burger King, or do you want to get into a legal battle with them?
Marc:I don't know how to handle it.
Guest 8:I think if you just set it up and just do it like we said, the Heller Burger King.
Guest 8:I don't think anybody's doing what I've suggested.
Guest 8:They wouldn't do it because they would be afraid to compete with their own inadequacies.
Marc:All right, so where does that leave our plan?
Marc:I mean, let's say we go to Wendy's and McDonald's and it's still the same idea.
Marc:Do we do maybe bus stops?
Marc:What do you think?
Guest 8:Yeah, bus stops will be good.
Guest 8:That's great.
Guest 8:You can put it in waiting rooms at the airports.
Guest 8:You can put it in the bus terminals.
Guest 8:Bathrooms.
Marc:Men's rooms.
Guest 8:Yeah, that's right, man.
Guest 8:Have it so you can watch.
Guest 8:If you take a leak often enough, you can really get to see a lot of shit.
Marc:So people with prostate problems are going to be very well informed.
Guest 8:That's right.
Guest 8:Okay.
Guest 8:But don't forget your dad had prostate cancer, so you want to make sure.
Marc:Are you my dad?
Marc:Do you talk about your person?
Marc:Did you just mention yourself in the third person like you were somebody else?
Guest 8:Yeah, we just remember that you're vulnerable for prostate cancer.
Marc:Oh, great.
Marc:Let me add that to the list.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Masturbation, does that help or hinder?
Marc:It's a plus.
Marc:Oh, thank God.
Marc:You know, if that's true, I don't think I'm going to get it.
Marc:I think I'm going to beat this thing.
Guest 8:That's a pun.
Guest 8:You're going to beat it.
Guest 8:You're going to beat it to prevent it.
Guest 8:That's great.
Marc:You should make a bumper sticker.
Marc:That's the new business.
Marc:I think that's a much more reasonable idea than the video places at fast food places running things that they won't want to run in their place.
Marc:What was it?
Marc:You got to beat it to... Beat it to beat it.
Marc:Beat it to beat it.
Marc:Okay, and then just put, like, you know, prostate cancer, and then we'll put your name, Dr. Marin, and then you get, okay.
Marc:Beat it to beat it.
Guest 8:Beat it to beat it.
Guest 8:Prostate cancer, beat it to beat it.
Guest 8:And you have somebody stroking it, you know, on the bumper sticker.
Guest 8:That'd go over big, especially in California.
Marc:Yeah, why especially in California?
Guest 8:If they get that status mentality, that'll work.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Well, I'll make note of that, especially in California.
Marc:So we'll focus that on that.
Marc:But clearly, you are the winner.
Marc:I mean, you're sitting in the loose clinic in Victoria doing legal examinations.
Marc:So they can't take anything away from you, Pop.
Marc:You're your own man.
Guest 8:That's right.
Guest 8:I testified yesterday.
Guest 8:I was tempted to ask the system.
Guest 8:I said,
Guest 8:How can you people, as educated barristers, using the extension of the original Old English philosophy of law, how can you sit there and chase ambulances and make a profit out of it when 99% of the people that you represent as a plaintiff attorney don't need you to begin with?
Guest 8:They only need you to make money, and their complaints cannot be proven to be valid.
Guest 8:What kind of heinous farce is that?
Guest 8:that allows this to happen.
Guest 8:How come the courts allow such a thing?
Guest 8:I was going to say that.
Guest 8:I was waiting for an opening to say that, but I never had it.
Marc:Yeah, you kept it to yourself?
Guest 8:Yeah, I kept it to myself.
Marc:Huh.
Marc:Well, that's good.
Marc:Heinous farce.
Marc:I like that.
Marc:I think that's going to be the name of my next CD.
Guest 8:So... Yeah.
Marc:Oh, you got a patient?
Marc:Hey, real quick.
Marc:Swine flu vaccine.
Marc:Yay or nay?
Guest 8:Nay.
Marc:Why?
Guest 8:Because it's got squalene in it.
Guest 8:S-Q-U-A-L-E-N-E.
Guest 8:Okay.
Guest 8:Squalene sensitizes people who are susceptible to autoimmune diseases.
Guest 8:That's all the bad ones.
Guest 8:Multiple sclerosis.
Guest 7:Oh, yeah?
Guest 8:Sort of colitis, rheumatoid arthritis.
Guest 8:In other words, if you take your vitamin D, 5,000 units a day, you should not need to get a flu shot.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Okay, I'm on it.
Marc:So what, you got a patient there?
Marc:No, no, I'm all right.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Hold on.
Oh, that's the one.
Uh-oh.
Guest 8:I read it.
Marc:He just said, I have a good-looking son.
Marc:What did you say?
Guest 8:Beautiful girl here.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Guest 8:Yeah, one of the nurses' daughters came in to see her.
Marc:Well, that's good that you're not sexually inappropriate.
Marc:You just pawn her off on me.
Marc:I think that's pretty good.
Marc:That's restraint.
Guest 8:No, I can't.
Guest 8:I get hit on a lot.
Guest 8:I don't do that.
Guest 8:It's almost illegal to screw around patients.
Guest 8:You can't do that.
Marc:Almost illegal?
Marc:I think that that seems like a slippery slope there.
Marc:Almost illegal?
Guest 8:People do it, but it's wrong.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Well, I'm proud of you.
Marc:I've never done that.
Marc:Good.
Marc:Oh, well, that's good.
Marc:That's good for you.
Marc:You get a gold star today.
Marc:And, you know, just keep the heinous farce thing to yourself.
Marc:Keep that between us.
Marc:All right, I love you.
Marc:I'll see you next weekend.
Guest 8:You're going to be around?
Guest 8:Yeah, let us know.
Guest 8:We'll go after dinner again.
Guest 8:You like that restaurant?
Marc:Yeah, Mexican food's good.
Marc:Let's go gamble.
Marc:I want to start that addiction.
Guest 8:No, you don't want to do that.
Marc:Okay, you're right.
Marc:Scratch that.
Guest 8:Yeah, scratch that.
Marc:Okay, we'll do something else.
Guest 8:Okay, all right.
Guest 8:Did you record all this?
Marc:Yeah, it's all on tape and we won't use anything that implicates you.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:I love you.
Marc:Bye.
Marc:Bye.
Marc:All right, folks, I know we're back in New York, so I know many of you have been waiting for the return of Matthew.
Guest 6:You don't have to say it like that, Mark.
Guest 6:Many have been waiting, I'd like to think, genuinely.
Marc:Yes.
Guest 6:Just respect them.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Well, listen, I got an email.
Marc:Oh.
Marc:About you.
Guest 6:Uh-oh.
Marc:And it says, what the fuck?
Marc:Pass your man card up to the front.
Marc:That list is like a bad marriage encounter group session.
Marc:That list you read about me when you wrote it.
Guest 6:I've forgotten that.
Guest 6:What was that?
Marc:Wait.
Marc:All I need was to smell incense and hear new age music in the background.
Marc:You sound like a 30-ish housewife who traded her career for hubby and kids and now is pissed off.
Marc:But Matthew still is very, very funny.
Marc:That's from Nan.
Marc:I suppose that was a snip fit.
Marc:Dude, what have you been doing?
Marc:What have I been doing?
Guest 6:Yeah.
Guest 6:It's good to see you.
Guest 6:It's good to see you, too.
Guest 6:It was good not seeing you, and now it's good seeing you.
Marc:Well, that's the thing.
Marc:I had this moment where I wondered when I got back, is it going to be good to see Matthew?
Marc:And given what we've been through, I was on the fence about it either way.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Because I find that, yes, I want to see him, but it's going to be difficult because you're going to be distanced and fucking weird.
Marc:Me?
Marc:I'm distanced and fucking weird?
Marc:A little bit.
Guest 6:No.
No.
Marc:No, it's me.
Marc:Yeah, it's definitely you.
Marc:But so what we did is that I went to see by myself or with my friend Stosh.
Marc:I went to see where the wild things are.
Marc:Well, so I wanted to do a movie segment with Matthew because Matthew is a movie guy.
Marc:And I'm a lot of things guy.
Marc:But yeah, movies, one of them.
Marc:Yeah, but you come from a different camp than I do.
Marc:Go ahead, Mark.
Marc:Pigeonhole me.
Marc:Go for it.
Guest 6:Make it easier to understand me.
Marc:You're a film snob.
Marc:You're hyper-educated in film.
Guest 6:Is there a comma between hyper and educated?
Marc:No, it's a dash.
Marc:And you will sit and tolerate movies that are relatively unbearable to most people.
Guest 6:And by most people, you mean you.
Guest 6:In the name of art.
Guest 6:Right?
Guest 6:No, in the name of trying to feel one with the universe, everything that you strive for, in the name of wanting to feel relief, in the name of wanting to feel connected.
Marc:Okay, okay.
Marc:No, I'm not begrudging you because I've been there.
Guest 6:I'm sorry, I thought you were begrudging me.
Marc:No, I've been the guy that's sort of like, even though this movie is difficult, I really appreciate it.
Marc:I'm a guy like the movie Safe by Todd Haynes.
Marc:That's one of my all-time favorite movies.
Marc:Okay, so we understand each other.
Marc:I understand you.
Marc:Given that, do you?
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Given that I knew that about you and I saw where the wild things are.
Marc:I'm like, I want to see this again with Matthew because I think this thing is genius.
Marc:I think it's a real art film.
Marc:I think it's deep.
Marc:I think he handled the material in a way that no one could have imagined.
Marc:It's metaphoric.
Marc:It's symbolic.
Marc:It is beautiful to look at.
Marc:I'm a big fan of Spike Jonze.
Marc:I'm really curious to see what Matthew has to say about this.
Marc:Thank you, Mark.
Marc:Let me just say.
Marc:Brendan saw it as well.
Marc:Okay, so we go to the movies, and what I feel about it is that it's a unique film.
Marc:It's a masterpiece.
Marc:And you fell asleep.
Marc:The second time.
Marc:I was there the second time.
Guest 6:I leaned over to say, can I have some of that popcorn?
What?
Guest 6:Oh, I'm sorry.
Guest 6:I'm sorry, dude.
Guest 6:I'm sorry.
Guest 6:And you don't have to apologize to me.
Guest 6:Feel free to nap.
Guest 6:It was kind of boring.
Marc:No, it wasn't.
Marc:Sure, Mark, you fell asleep.
Marc:That was the second time I saw it.
Marc:And yet it didn't stand up to them?
Marc:I've been going through a lot lately.
Marc:Have you?
Marc:I can't tell.
Marc:I've been having some trouble.
Marc:What?
Marc:You?
Marc:So you said it was boring.
Marc:Now, I don't understand where you get off in saying that movie is boring.
Marc:Being someone who is tolerant of films that take time to process, that you were able to dismiss the work that was there.
Guest 6:Look, I've seen right now at the MoMA is playing Satan's Tango, which is a seven hour movie.
Guest 6:And I swear to you, after three and a half hours of that movie, I was clamoring for more.
Guest 6:There's an intermission and they showed the second half the next day.
Guest 6:I was ready to go.
Guest 6:Just because a movie is long doesn't make it boring.
Guest 6:This movie, while it had a lot of good things in it and I really wanted to like it and I appreciate its sort of attempt.
Guest 6:I think it fell prey to a little bit of preciousness and a little bit of, you know, like I get a little bit of resentment.
Guest 6:It's a children's book.
Guest 6:It is.
Guest 6:Yeah.
Guest 6:The book is a children's book.
Guest 6:And this is a movie by adults trying to sell back to you your own childhood.
Guest 6:That's bullshit.
Guest 6:All right.
Marc:This is why I'm going to say, this is my, here's my.
Marc:Brendan nodded.
Marc:Yeah, I nodded at Mark saying that's bullshit.
Marc:Oh, okay.
Marc:This was my impressions.
Marc:And I didn't even know who the voices were until you told me and ruined the movie for me.
Guest 6:I didn't know anything about- Wait, that ruined the movie?
Guest 6:So now the movie's ruined?
Guest 6:No.
Marc:I just knew.
Marc:It's a bad movie.
Marc:I was aware of it.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:The first time I saw it, all I was bringing to the table was that I like Spike Jonze for a couple of reasons.
Guest 6:Mustaches on the Beastie Boys.
Marc:No, I have no idea about that.
Marc:I didn't know he did that.
Marc:Fonzie dancing.
Marc:No, I didn't know that either.
Marc:Those are all awesome.
Marc:But I knew he worked with the jackass guys.
Marc:But adaptation.
Marc:That movie I like.
Marc:There's a sequence and adaptation of a car accident that I thought was the most visceral.
Marc:disturbing few minutes of cinema that I'd seen in a long time.
Marc:I feel that Spike Jonze has an incredible feel for a camera and making what you're watching alive in a very deep way.
Marc:Like the entire frame is just resonating with a sort of like frenetic electricity.
Marc:And the opening of...
Marc:Where the Wild Things Are, where you just see that kid chasing that dog, and then the freeze frame, I was like, I am so fucking in.
Marc:And then how he very quickly, within about 15 minutes, set the scene that establishes the- I hate all that shorthand emotional cliff notes.
Marc:The home life-
Marc:I don't think that's what it was.
Marc:I think that he was figuring out a way to lay down in a reality frame the dynamics that the kid was living with.
Marc:The kid was a bright, angry kid, a very emotional kid, an isolated kid who lived in a divorced home with a loving mother who was obviously under her own stress.
Marc:And then for I don't want to be a complete spoiler, but I don't think there is a way to spoil it.
Marc:He has an episode.
Marc:storms out of the house and then enters this world of the wild things, which we are all familiar with as we are adults who have, I'm sure, read this book at some point.
Marc:And the first experience I had when he entered that world with the wild things is that all you see is moving shapes and then you hear the voices of adults having a conversation
Marc:That is fragmented and unclear.
Marc:And then you enter this almost archetypal, symbolic world of these animal figures.
Marc:They become mythic creatures that we all are familiar with in our childhood.
Marc:But what they began to symbolize in the film...
Marc:was, to me, they began to symbolize all adult voices from the perspective of a seven-year-old, and also all the voices that he hears in his own heart and his own mind and the feelings that he experiences.
Marc:So the fact that there was no real story in the movie, that was just a lyrical movement.
Marc:Sure, well, that doesn't bother me.
Marc:Through grown-up feelings and conflicting with child feelings and seeking resolution through these animals and these mythic creatures, to me was unbelievable.
Marc:It was poetry.
Marc:Even seeing it a second time, despite the fact that I fell asleep, it brought me in deeper that the representations of these things were the way he visualized his own feelings and also received the feelings of adults themselves.
Guest 6:It's like a paint-by-numbers emotional sort of Freudian mythical kind of – I don't know.
Guest 6:It just – it seems cheap and it seems reductive and it seems shallow.
Guest 6:To you.
Marc:But see, I think that you're mistaken the simplicity that you're attributing to it as something that you think has been done again and again.
Marc:But I personally have never seen it.
Marc:No, not done again and again.
Marc:I've never seen it.
Marc:I don't know what you would – how anyone could say it's a hackneyed Freudian mythological – Well, each of the creatures is some sort of element that he has to come to grips with from inside himself.
Guest 1:No, that's not true.
Guest 1:Yeah, total bullshit.
Guest 1:And he's actually – What?
Guest 1:This girl is his sister.
Guest 1:The guy is him.
Guest 1:That's wrong.
Guest 1:No, there's more than that.
Guest 1:He's even said that.
Guest 1:Oh, come on.
Guest 1:That's not true.
Guest 1:Okay.
Guest 1:Spike Jones has said there's no, this guy is the lion, this guy is the scarecrow, this guy is the tin man.
Guest 1:It's that these things are, you know, Mark had it on the nose that it's everything inside of him and everything of things that represent the outside world to him, the way kids do that.
Guest 6:Right, but it's in a maudlin, sentimental, and at the same time too intellectual sort of way.
Marc:Yeah, but see, the thing is, is that you don't.
Guest 6:The music was great.
Marc:No, but you're contextualizing it as an intellectual.
Marc:No, I'm not.
Marc:Yes, you are.
Marc:No, I'm not.
Marc:And you're minimizing it in a way that the context you're judging it by seems to be arrogance.
Marc:And I think that what you're missing... Wait, I'm judging it what?
Marc:Let's go to that eight-hour movie that you like so much.
Marc:Satan's Tango.
Marc:It's playing at the moment this week.
Marc:So you can tell your friends that you don't like the wild things.
Guest 6:You know, I worked on this movie, actually, and I really appreciate what Spike Jonze wanted to do with this movie and his sort of take on life.
Guest 6:Were you the bull character?
Guest 6:No, I actually did a couple of days.
Marc:He was one of the characters they cut out because it was too confusing and pedantic.
Marc:What were you saying?
Marc:Go ahead.
Guest 4:No, you finish.
Guest 6:There were some couple great images.
Guest 6:Him on the sea, that was great.
Guest 6:But what did you do on the movie?
Guest 6:Because we waited to see your name in the credits.
Guest 6:Yeah.
Guest 6:I only did a couple days of, you know, they had to do a lot of recasting.
Guest 6:My friend Tom Noonan was originally played the big chicken guy.
Guest 6:And he had me come in and do some ADR booming.
Guest 6:I was just in there with him.
Guest 6:Lauren Ambrose on a couple of days and James Gandolfini.
Guest 6:You talked to Gandolfini?
Guest 6:Oh yeah.
Guest 6:He was awesome.
Guest 6:It was, it was the best being in the room with him.
Marc:I mean, I didn't know it was him.
Marc:I really didn't know it was him the first time I saw him.
Guest 6:he made a real effort to not do like Tony Soprano.
Guest 6:And, and, and I even heard Spike Jones come up to him and say, you know, there's a little Tony Soprano.
Guest 6:Can you do a little less, a little less Tony?
Guest 6:And he goes, Oh yeah, sure, sure.
Guest 6:Uh,
Guest 6:No, no, he was good.
Guest 6:He was really great.
Guest 6:And in fact, since there's no actors in the room, they're just playing playback and he's trying to do voices.
Guest 6:He would look at me and do his lines to me.
Guest 6:So as an actor, I was just like, this is fucking awesome.
Guest 6:And there's some ones where he's getting mad.
Guest 6:And I'm like, Tony Soprano is going to fucking shoot me.
Guest 6:he was looking right at me and I'm just like going like please don't hurt me sir and then there's another part where they're doing the rumpus and he has to run around and he's like he's like sort of shadow boxing me he's like hey listen I'm gonna do this thing you know don't tell me if it's okay I'm gonna do this thing like do whatever you want man yeah yeah and he he starts jabbing me in the balls like douche douche like with his like fake punches and he's trying to punch me and he's like ducking around I'm trying to chase him with the mic to get his voice yeah
Guest 6:that was the best part of that movie to me is, is chasing around James Gandolfini around an ADR studio.
Guest 6:That's a pretty good part to me too.
Guest 1:Yeah.
Guest 6:Yeah.
Guest 6:But you guys never saw that part.
Guest 6:So I can't even talk to you about that.
Guest 1:But, but the, but the truth is, it sounds like he, by doing that shadow boxing and that he was, it was too simplistic.
Guest 1:He should, it was, he really wasn't getting at the core of what human emotion.
Guest 6:Well, I can tell you what, uh, Spike Jones, awesome, nice guy.
Guest 6:Doesn't know the first thing about working with actors from, from what I could observe.
Marc:Well, in closing here, I found that the movie is something that you can develop a personal relationship with and will resonate with your own adult emotions and your childish emotions.
Marc:And there's a lot of space to work with there.
Guest 6:If you can't really remember what your own childhood was like and you'd like to sort of recapture some sort of feeling that's been numbed over the years.
Marc:I didn't have that experience at all.
Marc:I mean, it didn't make me think of my childhood.
Marc:It didn't even come into my mind.
Marc:Well, maybe you blacked it out.
Marc:Maybe that was the part while you were sleeping?
Marc:No, I know exactly what my childhood was, but I didn't feel imposed upon by this movie to address that.
Marc:Well, I envy you.
Marc:Well, you should.
Marc:Brendan?
Marc:Finally, I do.
Guest 1:I'm sorry.
Guest 1:I'm looking up Ozu films on here.
Guest 1:I've got to get my Netflix queue lined up.
Guest 1:Well, I think this was... How about Carl Dreyer?
Marc:Are you into Carl Dreyer?
Marc:Yeah, I saw the Joan of Arc movie.
Marc:That was terrific.
Marc:That's a good one.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Gertrude?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:No?
Marc:No, the Joan of Arc movie.
Guest 6:Look, you know, when I like a movie, I like it to either be totally stupid...
Guest 6:and blockbuster-y, or actually intelligent and deep and something that can really change my life.
Guest 6:I'll cry in an episode of Star Trek.
Guest 6:I'll be moved by cheesy things.
Guest 6:This one straddled that fence in a way that I wanted to like, but it just couldn't push me over the edge.
Guest 6:If that make me an awful human being, so be it.
Marc:It's up to the listeners at this point.
Marc:I think we know exactly where you stand in this movie.
Marc:It couldn't be clearer.
Marc:And I certainly apologize.
Marc:I kind of liked it, though.
Marc:I liked it.
Marc:It was good.
Marc:What?
Marc:It was a good movie.
Marc:I like this movie.
Marc:I think that if you took any of this personally, I apologize.
Marc:Me?
Guest 6:No, I don't take this personally.
Marc:All right, so this has been, I guess what we'll call this is a movie segment, but I think we need to really take a break and have a group hug.
Guest 6:Let's sleep in a real pile.
Marc:Well, that's our show.
Marc:Matthew, Brendan, and myself just spent a couple hours in a real pile.
Marc:And I think we feel better because of it.
Marc:I want to thank Eugene Merman.
Marc:That was a pleasure talking to him.
Marc:And, of course, my father.
Marc:And, of course, Brendan McDonald on the board making this all work.
Marc:If you want to engage in anything what-the-fuck related, go to WTFPod.com.
Marc:There's merch.
Marc:There's a link to our Twitter, our email, the podcast.
Marc:Enjoy!
Marc:And I want to thank you people for listening.
Marc:I'll talk to you next What the Fuck.