Episode 1565 - Blair Socci

Episode 1565 • Released August 15, 2024 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Marc:all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fuck nicks what the fuck canadians what's happening i'm mark maron this is my podcast welcome to it a couple of things there's i guess a couple of some things were brought to my attention

00:00:25Marc:about the last show when I did a sort of a ramble on the pride of being a childless cat lady man and sort of a kind of a rallying cry to all people that choose not to have kids and why that's okay and why it's not a detriment to those individuals or to their patriotism necessarily.

00:00:49Marc:And I just kind of talked about that, childless people who live with it and want it that way.

00:00:54Marc:But I got a couple of emails that kind of brought it to my attention that not everybody who doesn't have children didn't want them.

00:01:02Marc:And I hear you.

00:01:04Marc:I have that in my family.

00:01:05Marc:My brother and his wife back in the day couldn't have their own kids.

00:01:10Marc:They chose to adopt.

00:01:11Marc:But I know that's another form of childlessness.

00:01:16Marc:And I want to acknowledge that.

00:01:19Marc:And I apologize leaving you out.

00:01:22Marc:But I do know that you get lumped in with the sort of aggressive attack by the right on childless people.

00:01:30Marc:And your anger should be even deeper than those of us who choose not to have them for whatever reason we fucking want to.

00:01:39Marc:So shout out to you.

00:01:41Marc:And my heart goes out to you.

00:01:44Marc:And I'm sure you take beautiful care of your animals and also have a lot of love for the kids in your family, extended family.

00:01:54Marc:Another thing, just in terms of people who listen to my show and how interesting they are, really, you know, because I ramble on here a bit.

00:02:05Marc:And I think a couple episodes ago I was yammering on.

00:02:10Marc:This is the great age of the yammering.

00:02:12Marc:This is the age of the yammering.

00:02:14Marc:And I think I've called it that before.

00:02:16Marc:The age of impending fascism and nonstop yammering, primarily by white guys with microphones.

00:02:24Marc:On all levels, there's no end to it.

00:02:26Marc:See, this scrolling business that I've got myself involved in, sometimes good, sometimes bad, but it does really kind of like punch through the fact that there's a lot of dudes with microphones talking about fucking nothing.

00:02:43Marc:If I see another group of two to five guys sitting around a table with microphones discussing things like, you know, when was the last time you shit your pants?

00:02:51Marc:Or what's the worst situation you farted in?

00:02:55Marc:Or did your sister ever date someone you hated?

00:02:59Marc:What did you do about that?

00:03:01Marc:It's sort of like an infinite loop of mediocre afternoon radio talk.

00:03:06Marc:But that's the world we live in.

00:03:08Marc:And then, of course, there's politics.

00:03:10Marc:But my fans or my people, my listeners, many are very thoughtful.

00:03:16Marc:Many are very sensitive.

00:03:17Marc:Many are angry.

00:03:18Marc:Many are creative.

00:03:19Marc:It's a pretty broad spectrum of a lot of different types of sensitivities.

00:03:27Marc:I wouldn't put them all on the...

00:03:30Marc:the dramatic cluster of personality disorders.

00:03:34Marc:But, you know, many are.

00:03:36Marc:But some of them are functioning people, most of you.

00:03:38Marc:I'm just making a joke.

00:03:40Marc:But the point being is I rambled on a bit about seagulls the other day, kind of innocently, because there's one that seems to be just outside of my window up here on the 17th floor of this building I'm in.

00:03:51Marc:A couple of them I see quite often, you know, kind of circling the Canadian flag on the building next door.

00:03:57Marc:And I can't even remember exactly what I was talking about, but I do remember singing Bad Company Siegel.

00:04:04Marc:But it was about a story about this seagull and then a seagull I saw with a chicken wing in his mouth back when I was actually tripping on mushrooms with my roommate Lance in college.

00:04:13Marc:And, you know, it was really something, it was just, it was nothing really.

00:04:17Marc:It was just something that was happening in my periphery and I needed to talk about something.

00:04:22Marc:But I got an email, you know, about some guy, Liam.

00:04:28Marc:He writes, two quick points about goals.

00:04:32Marc:So this is how this landed with this guy.

00:04:33Marc:First, I'm reading it.

00:04:36Marc:The two gulls you were reflecting on, Vancouver, Boston, might have been two entirely different species.

00:04:41Marc:Maybe the former was a glaucose winged gull.

00:04:45Marc:Did it have gray rather than black wingtips?

00:04:48Marc:Don't know, Liam.

00:04:49Marc:while the latter was an American herringle, black wingtips with white mirrors.

00:04:54Marc:Don't know, didn't notice any rear views.

00:04:57Marc:Folks call these and all sorts of other species, quote unquote, seagulls, but there's a lot of fascinating diversity out there.

00:05:03Marc:Keep an eye out for little details and you might be surprised.

00:05:08Marc:Now, maybe this will inspire me to be a little more kind of focused and in-depth with my bird watching, but I don't think so.

00:05:18Marc:I'm okay with just looking at birds.

00:05:21Marc:I sit on my porch and I look at birds.

00:05:23Marc:I enjoy birds, and I know there's a lot of biodiversity in the bird world, so much.

00:05:28Marc:And I've got a book on my porch with all the different birds.

00:05:30Marc:I've looked it up a couple of times, some birds a couple of times.

00:05:33Marc:I got the app for the bird songs, which works pretty well.

00:05:36Marc:But I mean, once you get the three or four that are around your house, you've kind of, you've done it.

00:05:41Marc:Those are the ones.

00:05:42Marc:And I can't even tell you which ones are which.

00:05:43Marc:And I'm not even sure, Liam, that I'm going to

00:05:45Marc:Really, you know, I got to get binoculars to do the seagull research, but I appreciate that somehow or another me rambling about seagulls, you know, made you, you know, you took it upon yourself to teach me a little something and I'll take it.

00:05:59Marc:I'll take it because it was not a reaction that I thought I'd get about the birds.

00:06:05Marc:And I thank you for listening.

00:06:07Marc:But then there was a second part of the email.

00:06:08Marc:He goes, second, I'm not surprised to hear you thought differently of the Boston bird scarfing a chicken wing.

00:06:14Marc:But my colleagues and I have done some research on the history of goal culling and conservation.

00:06:19Marc:And I'll offer this as a warning.

00:06:21Marc:People seem to project their fears about humanity onto goals, especially but not limited to their own vices and anxieties about urban decay.

00:06:30Marc:No, that's a big thought.

00:06:31Marc:It's a big idea.

00:06:33Marc:Anthropomorphism in general is something we all do.

00:06:36Marc:All lovers of animals.

00:06:38Marc:We will create fairly big and in-depth personalities to our animals, but maybe you're right.

00:06:46Marc:Maybe you're right.

00:06:47Marc:Maybe that bird was just eating garbage.

00:06:50Marc:I guess my point was there was something apocalyptic about a leftover chicken wing in a bird's mouth.

00:06:58Marc:Sure.

00:06:59Marc:Sure.

00:06:59Marc:Maybe I read into it.

00:07:01Marc:But again, Liam, thank you.

00:07:04Marc:Thank you for your email.

00:07:06Marc:I appreciate it.

00:07:08Marc:And then I do.

00:07:09Marc:And I learned something and I'm thinking about things.

00:07:11Marc:But this was another email I got.

00:07:13Marc:Someone responding to my latest conversation with Moon Zappa and Beth Stelling.

00:07:18Marc:And this person said, I also appreciate your recent shout outs to the social work profession.

00:07:24Marc:In social work school, we were taught that one way to think about where people are is through a biopsychosocial model.

00:07:33Marc:Wow.

00:07:34Marc:Where?

00:07:35Marc:Bio is whatever brain chemistry is in your DNA.

00:07:39Marc:Psycho is how you were raised.

00:07:42Marc:And social is the broader community, how people treat your group, racism, et cetera.

00:07:47Marc:Thought you might find that useful.

00:07:49Marc:I do, goddammit.

00:07:51Marc:I do find it useful.

00:07:53Marc:All these things are just kind of percolating in my brain.

00:07:56Marc:I'm sorry about the phones in the other room.

00:07:58Marc:I'm not going to go turn off the ringer.

00:08:01Marc:Then today I'm talking to somebody who said they knew somebody with histrionic personality disorder.

00:08:07Marc:And I'm like, what is that?

00:08:09Marc:What is that?

00:08:11Marc:Is this a new one?

00:08:13Marc:And then I learned something about the dramatic cluster of personality disorders, which I referenced earlier.

00:08:18Marc:There's an A cluster, a B cluster, and a C cluster.

00:08:22Marc:The A cluster, odd or eccentric disorders, paranoid personality disorder, schizoid personality disorder, schizotypal personality disorder.

00:08:30Marc:There's cluster B, emotional or erratic disorders, antisocial personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, histrionic personality disorder.

00:08:39Marc:which is pervasive pattern of attention-seeking behavior, including excessive emotions, an impressionistic style of speech, inappropriate seduction, exhibitionism, and egocentrism.

00:08:50Marc:Then there's narcissistic personality disorder on that B cluster.

00:08:53Marc:And then cluster C, you have avoidant personality disorder, dependent personality disorder, obsessive-compulsive personality disorder.

00:09:00Marc:And these kind of things just blow my mind that all this stuff is categorized.

00:09:05Marc:There are diagnoses, there are profiles.

00:09:08Marc:But when I look at almost all of these, I would say all of these, these are, you know, many people I've known in comedy.

00:09:16Marc:including myself on some level, but obviously everybody has traits of this or that, but whether you are pathological, that's up to a doctor to decide.

00:09:24Marc:But, uh, so like my brain full of a lot of stuff, a lot of interesting stuff, know a little bit more about goals.

00:09:30Marc:We'll know a little bit more about social work.

00:09:33Marc:And now like I, you know, I'm going to be mildly down the rabbit hole of the cluster of, uh,

00:09:40Marc:of emotional disorders because we all want answers.

00:09:46Marc:We all want answers, folks.

00:09:49Marc:The dramatic cluster of personality disorders.

00:09:53Marc:Today on the show, I talked to Blair Saki.

00:09:56Marc:She's very funny.

00:09:58Marc:She's a comedian with a brand new comedy special that just came out.

00:10:01Marc:Blair Saki live at the big dog.

00:10:04Marc:I don't know.

00:10:05Marc:She's one of these people.

00:10:06Marc:uh that i i kind of saw around and then i saw uh uh some clips of her and it's a rare thing man to to see a truly unique comedian with a with a very specific point of view specific voice specific delivery it it doesn't it doesn't happen that often they're out there but they are i would say underappreciated because when you're sort of dealing in a world where

00:10:31Marc:where the major streaming services put most of their effort and money behind mildly charismatic, efficiently talented, mediocre people and hacks, it becomes a problem.

00:10:47Marc:And it's always been this way.

00:10:50Marc:Look, I'm not going to sit here and complain like some old man.

00:10:54Marc:about the state of comedy or the state of the art or what I think about other comics.

00:10:58Marc:You know, I'm pretty vocal about that.

00:11:00Marc:And I've talked shit about other comics before.

00:11:03Marc:And I guess because, I don't know, I got this weird DM from some guy.

00:11:06Marc:He's like, how does it feel to have better jokes than almost any other comedian but not be successful because you come across as arrogant and condescending?

00:11:17Marc:Yeah, I guess that might be because I'm better.

00:11:20Yeah.

00:11:20Marc:But thank you for the note, and I'm glad to find a compliment in the middle of that trolling garbage.

00:11:27Marc:But it is sort of an interesting idea that when somebody truly unique kind of really surfaces and becomes very popular, it's kind of an amazing thing because they're straddling something.

00:11:39Marc:I had this...

00:11:41Marc:weird turn in thought today about the success of, you know, the sort of kind of pseudo edgelord, you know, anti-woke, you know, I might get canceled hat culture of comedy and just the sort of like gratuitous, you know, shock-driven filth comedy, which I've done in my life.

00:11:59Marc:I'm not...

00:12:01Marc:I'm not judging that part of it, but the first part may be, is that ultimately, on some level, certainly since Dice became huge, this has always been a strong kind of tribe of comedy.

00:12:18Marc:And it's always been popular with certain people.

00:12:20Marc:And other comedy is popular with other people.

00:12:23Marc:But there is a strata.

00:12:25Marc:There is a line of truly gifted comics and truly talented people.

00:12:30Marc:And they run the gamut of points of view and everything else.

00:12:32Marc:I think that what's happening now, just by virtue of technology and the ability to build massive audiences based on relatively little talent, is that it's all much bigger.

00:12:45Marc:And I just believe that when you lower the bar without any real balance, it's challenged in a deep way.

00:12:55Marc:And genius gets marginalized.

00:12:57Marc:And I always think it's been that way.

00:12:59Marc:High bar work in a low bar world is always relatively underappreciated, unless it's the Olympics.

00:13:07Yeah.

00:13:07Marc:But, uh, that's just the way it is, you know, but there is this culture of judging people's success by the number of followers, the number of hits, and certainly by money, which, you know, oddly has never really been any, those have never been any of my goals.

00:13:22Marc:You certainly want to find an audience, but, uh,

00:13:26Marc:If I really wanted to make money in terms of what I do creatively, I would have picked a fucking different profession.

00:13:36Marc:But it picked me.

00:13:37Marc:It picked me.

00:13:39Marc:Someone hipped me to the fact that...

00:13:43Marc:St.

00:13:44Marc:Vincent was playing here night before last in Vancouver.

00:13:47Marc:And I went cause I had interviewed her and I've seen her around a bit and I had her email address and I wrote to her, Annie, are you playing?

00:13:55Marc:Does this still your email?

00:13:57Marc:Can I come?

00:13:58Marc:And she, uh, she put me on the list and it was spectacular.

00:14:01Marc:What a great fucking performer.

00:14:03Marc:And she's another one.

00:14:04Marc:She's a person that takes a lot of risks, changes up her sound, explores, does interesting shit with music, and is a fucking awesome performer.

00:14:15Marc:If you have an opportunity to go see St.

00:14:17Marc:Vincent on this tour, do it.

00:14:20Marc:Even if you're not sure about her or don't know about her or only know one record, just go.

00:14:26Marc:It's a fucking great show.

00:14:28Marc:I stayed for the whole show.

00:14:31Marc:You know me.

00:14:32Marc:How often do I stay for the whole show?

00:14:36Marc:So Blair Saki.

00:14:37Marc:I love this comedian.

00:14:39Marc:She's very funny.

00:14:41Marc:She's a unique thing, unique style, a unique delivery, a unique way of joke writing, a unique way of talking.

00:14:52Marc:It's just she's a unique person.

00:14:55Marc:And I will always celebrate the unique people versus the sort of...

00:15:01Marc:The never-ending parade of mildly charismatic, efficiently talented, mediocre acts.

00:15:12Marc:Yeah.

00:15:14Marc:Maybe they speak to most of the country.

00:15:16Marc:And maybe that's why I have my audience and they have theirs.

00:15:22Marc:And mine's just the right size for me.

00:15:26Marc:Just the right size.

00:15:28Marc:So Blair's new special is called Live from the Big Dog.

00:15:32Marc:It's available now at veeps.com.

00:15:35Marc:And this is me talking to Blair for really the first time.

00:15:42Marc:Do you like Black Sabbath?

00:15:50Guest:Um, I can't say I'm super versed.

00:15:53Marc:Oh, okay.

00:15:54Marc:Yeah.

00:15:54Marc:It's not a trick question.

00:15:55Marc:It's not a game changer.

00:15:57Marc:It's not a deal breaker.

00:15:58Guest:Oh, no.

00:15:59Guest:I have a commitment to 100% candor.

00:16:03Marc:Oh, yeah?

00:16:03Guest:Yeah.

00:16:04Marc:Is this a new commitment?

00:16:05Marc:No.

00:16:06Marc:But it's a conscious choice?

00:16:09Guest:Yes.

00:16:10Marc:So you're just going to be honest no matter what?

00:16:14Guest:Well, I guess I would be like, I can't answer that, or I don't know the answer.

00:16:22Marc:That's good.

00:16:23Guest:Yeah, I've never heard of that.

00:16:26Marc:Right.

00:16:26Marc:So instead of going like, uh-huh, or just say like, I don't know.

00:16:31Guest:Yeah, because I'm like, oh, that's, that's real connection, you know?

00:16:35Guest:Yeah.

00:16:37Guest:I'm also really, I'm also painfully literal.

00:16:40Guest:Yeah.

00:16:41Guest:Where like, because I say what I mean.

00:16:45Guest:Yeah.

00:16:45Guest:That I assume everyone else is doing that.

00:16:48Marc:Right.

00:16:49Guest:And my therapist is always like, no.

00:16:51Guest:Yeah.

00:16:51Guest:That's not.

00:16:53Marc:That's not how people interact.

00:16:54Marc:They kind of politely say what they need to say to get through that immediate moment.

00:17:00Guest:Yeah.

00:17:01Marc:And then they walk away and judge.

00:17:03Guest:Yeah, but not honesty.

00:17:05Guest:Like, you know, those other people that will say like it will be harsh or acerbic.

00:17:13Guest:And they're like, I'm just being honest.

00:17:15Guest:I don't do that either.

00:17:16Marc:I learned a lesson about that.

00:17:18Guest:I think a lot of comedians.

00:17:20Marc:Are like that?

00:17:21Marc:Yeah.

00:17:21Marc:Because we assume that we can all take it, yet we're all the most sensitive idiots in the world.

00:17:26Marc:And we pretend like we can take it.

00:17:28Marc:And then it just festers.

00:17:30Marc:And you walk away going, fuck that guy.

00:17:31Guest:Yeah.

00:17:33Guest:Yeah, totally.

00:17:34Guest:Because absolutely.

00:17:35Guest:Because you're like, oh, I'm being honest with concern for how you will take it.

00:17:40Marc:Yeah.

00:17:40Guest:Not like I'm going to drop a freaking bazooka on you.

00:17:44Marc:Right.

00:17:44Marc:That's what some guy told me years ago in the rooms.

00:17:48Marc:Yes.

00:17:49Marc:He was like, because I was so proud of myself.

00:17:51Marc:I was like sober a minute.

00:17:53Marc:And I just told, I was like, I think I was married at the time.

00:17:57Marc:And I just told that woman some horrible truth.

00:18:00Marc:Sure.

00:18:01Yeah.

00:18:01Marc:Cause I thought like, this is what you do when you're sober and it was not what to do.

00:18:06Marc:Right.

00:18:06Marc:And this guy says to me, don't, you can't use honesty as a weapon.

00:18:10Marc:Sure.

00:18:10Marc:And I'm like, Oh fuck.

00:18:12Marc:Now I'm going to remember that for the rest of my life.

00:18:15Guest:Yeah.

00:18:15Guest:Well, I think sometimes you have to swing that way to find, to get to the middle.

00:18:20Marc:Yeah.

00:18:20Marc:Always.

00:18:21Guest:Yeah.

00:18:22Marc:So like, I didn't, I think I've been pronouncing your name wrong.

00:18:24Guest:Oh, that's fine.

00:18:25Guest:You know, nothing offends me less.

00:18:29Guest:I rarely even correct people.

00:18:31Guest:I'm like, it's interpretive, whatever you want.

00:18:33Marc:But you say it's sake?

00:18:34Guest:Sake, sure.

00:18:35Guest:My grandpa decided that.

00:18:38Marc:Oh, really?

00:18:38Marc:Yeah.

00:18:38Marc:But was it Sochi?

00:18:40Guest:Yes.

00:18:41Marc:But he said sake.

00:18:42Guest:Yeah.

00:18:43Marc:Italian guy?

00:18:44Guest:Yes.

00:18:45Guest:And also apparently the rumor is that there was Italian racism, which is hard to believe, but you know.

00:18:54Marc:If there's a race, there's racism.

00:18:58Guest:yeah well i like when he come or like my my great-grandfather actually like my dad's whole side is from back east he's 100 percent italian yeah and like my great-grandfather had uh fruit stands in the bronx and like actually um got his throat slashed um because he like refused to pay like the time he lived um

00:19:25Guest:Um, which is even crazier.

00:19:27Marc:With the scar?

00:19:28Guest:Yeah, they like made him, it was called the Black Hand back then.

00:19:31Marc:Right, before it was even the mafia.

00:19:33Guest:Yes, and they made him go, and then they made him go back to Italy for two years.

00:19:37Marc:What, just like Godfather 2?

00:19:38Guest:I know, I know, yeah.

00:19:40Marc:And he could have been at the fruit stand where the Godfather was shot.

00:19:43Guest:Yeah.

00:19:44Guest:yeah so that was a wild thing so he changed his name like i think he worked for like xerox or something my grandpa yeah and he changed his name to dan stewart from so okay wait so he goes back to italy after they cut his throat oh no this isn't him this is um a different oh this you're talking about your great-grandfather yeah the one with the fruit stand yeah he goes back to italy yeah never to return

00:20:12Guest:No, they returned.

00:20:13Marc:They came back.

00:20:14Guest:That was my grandma's father.

00:20:15Marc:Okay, so, but like this is part of the family mythology.

00:20:20Guest:Yeah.

00:20:20Marc:Got his throat cut by the black hand because he wouldn't give them shakedown money.

00:20:24Guest:Yeah.

00:20:25Marc:And got sent back to where the black hand comes from.

00:20:29Guest:Yeah.

00:20:30Marc:That's crazy.

00:20:31Guest:I know.

00:20:31Marc:And then he came back.

00:20:33Guest:Came back.

00:20:34Marc:Oh, my God.

00:20:34Guest:Tough.

00:20:35Guest:Tough guy.

00:20:36Marc:Yeah.

00:20:36Marc:After you get your throat cut and then have to go home.

00:20:38Guest:Yeah.

00:20:39Guest:I think I'd be like, I'm good here.

00:20:41Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:20:42Guest:Oh, the pasta is good here.

00:20:43Guest:No need.

00:20:44Marc:It's good enough.

00:20:45Marc:Yeah.

00:20:45Marc:But why do you think he went back?

00:20:50Guest:to new york no no they made him go back to italy the black hand yeah that was his yeah punishment yeah they made they forced exile and i i don't even have soup that much information about this the way that i know about this is one handwritten account from my great aunt yes who just died at 99 years old so like we don't have that much info

00:21:13Marc:But that's a pretty good story.

00:21:14Marc:It doesn't seem like one of those ones that you'd make up, especially they sent him home part.

00:21:19Marc:Right.

00:21:19Marc:Because you never hear that part.

00:21:20Guest:Yeah, he was only there for two years.

00:21:22Marc:In Italy?

00:21:23Guest:Yeah, like the exile.

00:21:24Marc:So that was his punishment to go and I wonder what he did over there.

00:21:29Marc:You have no idea.

00:21:30Guest:No, I have like barely information.

00:21:32Marc:And then your mom was from the Bronx?

00:21:35Guest:No, no, this is my dad's side.

00:21:37Guest:My mom is from Palos Verdes.

00:21:41Yeah.

00:21:41Marc:So what was the Xerox story?

00:21:44Marc:That was your grandfather?

00:21:45Guest:Oh, that was my grandpa.

00:21:46Guest:My dad's dad.

00:21:47Marc:Yeah.

00:21:47Marc:He lost the Sochi.

00:21:48Guest:Yeah.

00:21:49Guest:So like apparently just like from that era, like, you know, I guess if you were Italian, you sounded uneducated or something.

00:21:56Guest:So he changed his name to like an American name, which is so hard to believe now, you know?

00:22:01Marc:Stuart.

00:22:02Marc:Yeah.

00:22:02Marc:Well, I guess it must have been a time when that first wave of immigrants came in, like with all of them.

00:22:08Marc:You know, Irish had a rough go at it.

00:22:10Marc:The Italians.

00:22:11Marc:But they got tough.

00:22:12Marc:And the Jews just figured out a way to work the system.

00:22:16Guest:Yeah.

00:22:17Totally.

00:22:18Marc:But there were some tough Jews.

00:22:19Marc:You know, there were Jewish boxers, Jewish mobsters, all that stuff.

00:22:22Guest:I would argue you're all tough.

00:22:24Yeah.

00:22:25Guest:Getting through all that.

00:22:30Guest:I would argue you're a resilient people.

00:22:32Marc:Seems like it.

00:22:33Marc:Yeah.

00:22:34Marc:Yeah.

00:22:35Marc:There's an old Lenny Bruce bit about, I don't remember how it goes, but, you know, the pharaoh is like, bring in the Jew.

00:22:41Marc:He's charming.

00:22:42Marc:Sure.

00:22:43Marc:Yeah.

00:22:43Marc:But, yeah, I guess it was rough for everybody.

00:22:45Marc:But so how does your dad get from there to here?

00:22:48Marc:Your grandfather was at Xerox in New York?

00:22:51Guest:I don't know.

00:22:52Guest:Honestly, I don't even know if it was Xerox.

00:22:55Guest:It was like one of those companies.

00:22:57Guest:I'm pretty sure it was Xerox, but I'm not sure.

00:23:00Guest:And he got transferred, my dad's senior year of high school, to Tustin.

00:23:07Guest:And so they all moved out.

00:23:09Marc:Where's that?

00:23:09Guest:From New Jersey.

00:23:10Guest:Tustin in Orange County.

00:23:12Marc:Jersey.

00:23:13Guest:Yeah.

00:23:14Marc:They were in Jersey.

00:23:14Marc:Yeah, they're in Jersey.

00:23:15Marc:Yeah, I'm Jersey.

00:23:17Guest:Where in Jersey?

00:23:17Marc:I was born in Jersey.

00:23:19Guest:Oh, really?

00:23:19Marc:My people are from Jersey.

00:23:21Marc:I like to say I'm genetically Jersey.

00:23:23Guest:Yeah.

00:23:24Marc:Yeah.

00:23:24Marc:Where?

00:23:24Marc:Pompton Lakes, Bergen County.

00:23:27Marc:Where were your people?

00:23:29Guest:I don't really know.

00:23:29Marc:You don't have any people in Jersey anymore?

00:23:32Guest:No.

00:23:33Guest:My dad grew up in Maplewood, I believe.

00:23:36Marc:Yeah.

00:23:36Marc:I have no idea where that is.

00:23:37Guest:Yeah.

00:23:37Guest:I don't know anything about it.

00:23:39Marc:So he comes out here to Tustin.

00:23:40Marc:Where's that?

00:23:41Guest:Orange County.

00:23:41Marc:It's Orange County.

00:23:42Marc:You already said that.

00:23:43Marc:But I have no sense of Orange County.

00:23:45Guest:Yeah.

00:23:45Guest:Oh, I guess it would be like northeast Orange County.

00:23:48Marc:Okay.

00:23:49Guest:Yeah.

00:23:49Marc:But that's like a big shift.

00:23:51Guest:Yes.

00:23:52Marc:And then when does Saki come back?

00:23:55Marc:Oh.

00:23:56Marc:When do they reown?

00:23:58Guest:Oh, well, he was always Saki.

00:23:59Guest:It was just like my dad used that in business.

00:24:01Guest:Or my grandpa used that in business.

00:24:04Guest:I was like his business name.

00:24:04Guest:Like the family didn't adopt their name.

00:24:07Marc:Oh, so he never legally changed it?

00:24:08Guest:No, no, no, nothing.

00:24:09Marc:Did you know these Italian grandparents?

00:24:10Guest:No.

00:24:10Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:24:11Guest:I knew my grandparents.

00:24:12Guest:I didn't know any of my great-grandparents.

00:24:13Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:24:14Marc:He does.

00:24:15Marc:Just pictures.

00:24:16Guest:Yeah.

00:24:19Marc:That's them, huh?

00:24:20Marc:Yeah.

00:24:20Marc:Wow, look at that jacket.

00:24:21Marc:Yeah.

00:24:22Guest:That kind of stuff.

00:24:23Guest:Uh-huh.

00:24:23Marc:But so is real Italian shit?

00:24:25Guest:Yeah.

00:24:26Guest:Like, my dad—well, my mom is—because, you know, I don't look Italian at all.

00:24:31Guest:But my dad has, like, dark skin and is, like, full Italian and—

00:24:34Marc:I think you might look a little Italian.

00:24:36Guest:Oh, really?

00:24:37Marc:Yeah, I think so.

00:24:37Marc:Oh, thank you.

00:24:38Guest:And your mom's just... Scandinavian, 100%.

00:24:41Guest:Yeah.

00:24:41Marc:California.

00:24:42Guest:Yeah, Swedish.

00:24:43Guest:Yeah.

00:24:43Guest:California.

00:24:44Guest:Grew up in California.

00:24:45Marc:How'd they get here?

00:24:46Marc:I don't really know.

00:24:48Marc:I don't know.

00:24:49Guest:I don't know shit about that.

00:24:50Marc:Agriculture?

00:24:51Marc:Farming?

00:24:52Marc:Big business?

00:24:54Guest:No.

00:24:57Guest:Yeah.

00:24:58Guest:They're like...

00:24:59Guest:I think they were just like in the furniture business.

00:25:02Marc:All right.

00:25:03Marc:Had a store?

00:25:04Guest:Yeah.

00:25:05Marc:Oh, furniture store.

00:25:06Guest:Yeah.

00:25:06Marc:Did you go to it?

00:25:07Guest:No.

00:25:08Marc:You didn't know about it?

00:25:09Guest:No.

00:25:10Marc:You didn't know your grandparents on that side?

00:25:11Guest:I did, but like not in their business or anything.

00:25:15Marc:They're already done?

00:25:16Yeah.

00:25:20Marc:Just stories of what it was like.

00:25:22Guest:Yeah.

00:25:23Marc:When they had the couches.

00:25:24Guest:Uh-huh.

00:25:25Marc:So like Orange County.

00:25:26Marc:Now, I don't get a sense of what that means.

00:25:29Marc:So what did your dad do out there?

00:25:31Guest:Oh, my dad does real estate.

00:25:33Marc:Oh.

00:25:33Guest:Yeah.

00:25:34Marc:In Orange County.

00:25:35Marc:Uh-huh.

00:25:36Marc:Like big time?

00:25:36Uh-huh.

00:25:37Guest:um commercial yeah like he's a he develops things no he doesn't develop no um just like sells it yeah sells the uh the strip malls uh office spaces i think more like commercial or like industrial or industrial yeah place to park the trucks i guess so

00:25:57Guest:Yeah.

00:25:58Marc:I got a great place for you to park the trucks.

00:26:01Marc:It's got a warehouse on it.

00:26:03Guest:Yeah, but, like, my dad came out here.

00:26:05Guest:Like, he didn't grow up with money and, like, just is, like, an ass kicker.

00:26:10Guest:Just, like, started from nothing.

00:26:13Marc:Badass Italian guy?

00:26:14Guest:Totally.

00:26:14Marc:Yeah.

00:26:15Marc:Tough guy?

00:26:16Guest:I wouldn't say he's a tough guy, but, like, he's a determined person, you know?

00:26:21Marc:Yeah.

00:26:22Guest:Like, I think we all got our, like...

00:26:24Guest:work ethic yeah from there how many in the family i have two other brothers and then me oh my god yeah so that's that's that's how you got tough i guess like i don't feel tough in any i think i'm like a really really gentle soul soft soul yeah but like um i guess like

00:26:47Guest:My whole life was about being an athlete, so I guess that part was kind of tough.

00:26:52Marc:Were your brothers athletes?

00:26:53Guest:Yes.

00:26:54Guest:It was my very all-sports-focused family.

00:26:58Marc:Really?

00:26:58Guest:Yeah.

00:26:59Marc:What sport?

00:27:01Guest:Well, my brothers and dad were all basketball and then like I played a bunch of sports But then kind of ended up focusing like hardcore and volleyball my whole life your volleyball chalk Was that shocking to you

00:27:24Marc:No, I mean, I don't think so.

00:27:25Marc:Like, I don't like I'm not even sure how I got hip to you, really.

00:27:29Marc:We've met before.

00:27:30Guest:We met once just recently in Austin.

00:27:36Marc:No, right.

00:27:36Marc:Rosebud.

00:27:37Marc:I remember that.

00:27:38Guest:Rosebud's my best friend.

00:27:39Marc:Yeah, she's great.

00:27:40Guest:Yeah.

00:27:41Marc:And but that was the only time.

00:27:42Guest:Yeah.

00:27:43Marc:But then, like, I don't know.

00:27:44Marc:You just appeared somehow.

00:27:46Marc:Like, I don't know.

00:27:47Marc:Like, it was recently.

00:27:48Marc:Yeah.

00:27:49Marc:Because I'm, like, old.

00:27:49Marc:I don't know what you kids are up to.

00:27:51Marc:Right.

00:27:52Marc:And I'm not sure where I saw you.

00:27:54Marc:But I was like, oh, my God.

00:27:56Marc:Yeah.

00:27:56Marc:What is this person?

00:27:57Marc:She's fucking funny.

00:27:58Guest:Oh, that's so nice.

00:27:59Guest:Thank you so much.

00:28:01Guest:I mean, that is just, like, thrilling to hear from you.

00:28:05Marc:Well, was it?

00:28:06Marc:Oh, that's good.

00:28:07Guest:Yeah.

00:28:08Marc:Well, I just want to keep, you know, somehow in the loop.

00:28:12Guest:Yeah.

00:28:12Marc:Yeah.

00:28:12Marc:Because I was talking to my producer, because I don't even know what generation you would be of.

00:28:19Marc:Rosebuds, basically?

00:28:21Guest:I'll just vaguely say I'm in my 30s.

00:28:24Marc:Okay.

00:28:25Guest:Oh, but Rosebud and I started together.

00:28:26Guest:I've been doing it about 11 years.

00:28:29Marc:So you're like, you know, you're refined.

00:28:32Marc:Oh, thank you.

00:28:32Marc:You've got chops.

00:28:34Marc:Thank you.

00:28:34Marc:You know what you're doing.

00:28:35Marc:Yeah.

00:28:36Marc:But like I get kind of out of the loop.

00:28:38Marc:And then I realized like when I started this podcast, it was 2009.

00:28:41Marc:It's a long time ago.

00:28:44Marc:So I was talking to people of that generation who weren't older than you really.

00:28:49Marc:Right.

00:28:49Marc:But now that I'm an old guy, now it's sort of like, what are these kids doing?

00:28:53Yeah.

00:28:53Guest:I mean, I think that's just how it goes with comedy because if you stay in it a long time, like, you know, I'm seeing people like that I've never heard of come up, you know.

00:29:03Marc:There's so many.

00:29:04Guest:Yeah, and I think that it just goes on like that forever.

00:29:06Marc:But now it seems like they're almost virally reproducing comics.

00:29:11Guest:Yes, I know.

00:29:12Guest:It's extremely saturated.

00:29:13Marc:And it's like, well, it's saturated on social media, but I don't know what's going on out there in the world, but I know that I don't know people and I'm okay with that.

00:29:22Guest:Yeah.

00:29:23Guest:I mean, I, um, really don't like social media and didn't put any effort into it.

00:29:31Guest:And only recently, like this year started posting clips.

00:29:35Guest:Yeah.

00:29:35Guest:Um, because like, I was always like, you know, I'm going to be true to myself and do what the craft.

00:29:42Guest:Yeah.

00:29:42Guest:And I was like, I'm so, I'm so organic.

00:29:46Guest:Yeah.

00:29:46Guest:I'm so true to the form.

00:29:48Guest:I'm not getting mixed up in this clip game.

00:29:50Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:29:51Guest:And I was like, and if I just do what feels right to me, then the right people are going to find me.

00:29:57Guest:Yes.

00:29:58Guest:And to some extent, that was true.

00:30:00Guest:But then again, when it come time to me selling tickets, I need to have a following.

00:30:06Marc:Yeah.

00:30:06Marc:So you're just jocking it up as a volleyball player?

00:30:09Guest:Yeah.

00:30:10Guest:Oh, my gosh.

00:30:11Marc:But were you like a stud?

00:30:12Marc:Were you good?

00:30:13Marc:Yes.

00:30:14Marc:Like winning prizes?

00:30:15Yes.

00:30:16Guest:Yeah, like every prize.

00:30:18Marc:Really?

00:30:18Guest:Yeah.

00:30:18Guest:And it was like, I just came out.

00:30:21Marc:In that high school?

00:30:22Guest:Yeah.

00:30:23Marc:Okay.

00:30:23Guest:And college.

00:30:25Guest:And I did like the, like I trained with the US National Team Pipeline, like where you'd have to like try out.

00:30:33Guest:And then like I'd go to Colorado Springs Training Center for the summer.

00:30:37Marc:You were in, all in.

00:30:39Marc:You were going to the Olympics?

00:30:40Guest:I mean, I was in their training program.

00:30:44Guest:I never clearly made it to the national team.

00:30:46Guest:I'm also really small.

00:30:48Marc:But was that the goal?

00:30:50Guest:Yeah, like whatever I'm doing, I really am into it.

00:30:54Guest:And I was like, oh yeah, I want to be a professional athlete even though I sniff five sticks on a good day.

00:30:59Guest:I mean, I did about as much as I could with my height in that sport.

00:31:05Marc:So, all right.

00:31:06Marc:So, like, is there a position?

00:31:08Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:31:08Guest:Like, I was an outside hitter.

00:31:10Guest:This is real inside language.

00:31:13Marc:Teach me about volleyball.

00:31:17Marc:I know.

00:31:17Marc:Maybe that's the one that I'll lock into.

00:31:19Marc:Like, I'm not a sports person, but like, man, after I talk to Blair, I can't get enough of this volleyball.

00:31:24Marc:How come there's not more on TV?

00:31:26Guest:Yeah.

00:31:26Guest:Yeah, if you took up volleyball, that would be such a turn I would love.

00:31:31Marc:Just me talking volleyball at the opening of every podcast?

00:31:34Guest:Yeah, I mean, I haven't played volleyball literally since I quit.

00:31:37Marc:Oh, heartbreak.

00:31:39Guest:No, the opposite.

00:31:40Guest:I just never thought about it again.

00:31:42Marc:But this is the funny thing.

00:31:44Marc:My brother was kind of a pro tennis player.

00:31:46Marc:He was going for it his whole life.

00:31:51Marc:And he just did not have...

00:31:53Marc:whatever the genetic you know talent right that is necessary to get over the hump yeah and he had it like you know kind of suck that up and sure but you know then he taught and he did it yeah but him you know half awake could beat almost anybody sure because he's so good like if you're like if you're on the beach and someone's like you want to play a little volleyball would you just fucking devastate everybody

00:32:17Guest:I mean, maybe, but I haven't done it in years.

00:32:19Guest:So who knows if my, like, I used to be able to, I had like a crazy vertical and like I did all sorts of insane like plyometrics training.

00:32:29Guest:Plyometrics?

00:32:30Guest:Yeah.

00:32:31Guest:What is that?

00:32:34Marc:It's, I think I'm going to change my life after this.

00:32:36Guest:It's like jumping in quickness training and like explosive muscles training.

00:32:42Marc:Like you just, you crouch and then you're like.

00:32:45Yeah.

00:32:48Marc:And people are like, holy shit, good one.

00:32:51Guest:This conversation happening with you is so funny to me.

00:32:57Guest:But yeah, I haven't played in years and I don't really have an interest in it or anything.

00:33:03Guest:It was like a lot of athletes that I knew in all the sports, because I played at UCLA and people quit and everything, they had these huge identity crises.

00:33:13Guest:But I didn't at all.

00:33:15Marc:So you got to college, you played volleyball.

00:33:17Guest:Yeah.

00:33:18Marc:And then when does it crap out?

00:33:19Marc:When are you sort of like, fuck it?

00:33:21Guest:I got a knee surgery.

00:33:24Marc:Injured.

00:33:25Guest:I lost my spot and I like quit.

00:33:27Guest:I'd never like sat the bench.

00:33:28Marc:You couldn't do the explosive jumps anymore.

00:33:32Marc:You're playing that tricks game was fucked.

00:33:34Guest:This is so funny.

00:33:37Guest:Yeah, I couldn't do it.

00:33:38Guest:And I was like, you know, like.

00:33:41Marc:Were you out there with your brace?

00:33:43Marc:Was it wrapped?

00:33:44Guest:No, it was like I could have easily come back.

00:33:46Guest:Like I recovered beautifully, you know.

00:33:48Guest:I was just done.

00:33:50Guest:And it just felt great.

00:33:52Guest:And like it was so funny because, I mean, it had been so hardcore in my life since I was like 10 years old.

00:33:58Guest:And there was like surfing, tennis.

00:34:00Guest:I mean, just everything.

00:34:01Marc:You can surf?

00:34:02Guest:yeah i surfed um i did contests for a while when i was like a kid um you can do you can get into the the tunnel no not now i can't do shit i don't i don't surf at all yeah now everyone's like do you still serve because it was like a big part of my growing up and my brothers are big surfers and like our family trips we would drive down the coast of baja and do like surf trips that was like our our family is that where the big waves are

00:34:32Guest:I mean, there were waves.

00:34:34Guest:Yeah.

00:34:34Marc:Did you talk like a surf person?

00:34:36Guest:I don't think so, because I was always a big reader.

00:34:38Guest:But then also, wherever I am, people always go, where's your accent from?

00:34:42Guest:And I'm like, I didn't know I had an accent.

00:34:45Marc:No, I think you have a way of talking.

00:34:46Marc:Oh, okay.

00:34:47Marc:I don't think you have an accent.

00:34:48Marc:Yeah, because... Do you come from the land of Yale?

00:34:52Guest:Do I?

00:34:54Marc:Where do they talk like this?

00:34:56Guest:Oh, I know.

00:34:56Guest:Well, you know, I'm a maniac on stage.

00:34:59Yeah.

00:34:59Marc:But you're a different kind of maniac.

00:35:03Marc:I think it's like the volleyball jumping.

00:35:09Marc:It's like you're not like manic, but you're calculatingly explosive.

00:35:15Marc:Yeah.

00:35:15Guest:oh wow thank you does that make sense yes yeah um like people you got a good build thank you people will always be like what so like where did that character come from and i'm like it's not a character it's like my id you know it's just slightly amplified me

00:35:35Guest:It's, like, the crazy part of me.

00:35:38Marc:Yeah.

00:35:38Guest:You know, which feels good because, like, I can be pretty introverted and, like, I feel like a pretty gentle person.

00:35:46Guest:So, like, I think it started, like, my legs shook on stage for the first eight months that I did comedy.

00:35:52Guest:And so I think that's sort of, like, where it came from.

00:35:55Marc:From your leg shaking?

00:35:57Marc:You're, like, my id's in my legs?

00:35:59Marc:I've got to get it out?

00:36:00Guest:I was just, like, no, like, I think I thought, like...

00:36:03Guest:naturally that I had to be like forceful or something because I was afraid or like, or yeah, you're yelling at the fear.

00:36:12Guest:Maybe.

00:36:12Guest:Yeah.

00:36:13Marc:Yeah.

00:36:13Marc:Something like that.

00:36:14Marc:Well, that's what happens if you, if you do it right, you figure out who you are up there or else you just kind of blah through it.

00:36:22Guest:Yeah.

00:36:22Guest:And I also think like, I felt like I could be what I wish I could sometimes be in my real life.

00:36:28Marc:Yeah.

00:36:29Guest:More powerful.

00:36:30Marc:Like a fuck you person.

00:36:33Guest:Yeah.

00:36:33Marc:I wish I was more fuck you-ish.

00:36:37Guest:Yeah, because I'm just not like that at all.

00:36:39Guest:And so it feels kind of nice.

00:36:41Marc:Well, that's interesting that you're aware of that, that like, you know, it's organically you, but you know, it's sort of like having a black belt.

00:36:48Marc:Like, I can't use this in real life.

00:36:53Marc:Because I would have no friends, and it would be difficult at coffee shops.

00:36:57Marc:But I'd be memorable, but maybe not allowed back in.

00:37:01Guest:Yeah, and I don't have that desire to, like, operate from that place in my regular life, but it just feels fun on stage.

00:37:09Marc:No, it's the right place for it.

00:37:10Marc:Yeah.

00:37:10Marc:Yeah, because I think it speaks to everybody's id on some level, right?

00:37:14Marc:Yeah.

00:37:14Marc:That's sort of what you're activating.

00:37:16Marc:Yeah.

00:37:17Marc:But all right, so you're at UCLA.

00:37:18Marc:You fucked up your knee.

00:37:19Marc:You can't jump anymore.

00:37:21Marc:The volleyball dream...

00:37:27Marc:The volleyball dream is dead, and you're just there, and you're like, well, what do I do with all these shorts?

00:37:34Guest:I fucking hated those shorts.

00:37:36Guest:To this day, I can't even—I'm stunned.

00:37:39Guest:I'm like, what perv decided that this was the uniform for girls' volleyball?

00:37:46Guest:Like, no other sports have those.

00:37:48Guest:Like, everyone else just gets regular shorts.

00:37:50Marc:Yeah.

00:37:51Marc:And you guys are like, they're, what are they?

00:37:52Marc:These skin tight little.

00:37:53Guest:Skin tight.

00:37:54Guest:Like when I was in college, the ones we had to wear had a half inch inseam.

00:37:59Marc:Oh, what is that?

00:38:01Guest:Did great for getting people in the stands, but besides that, I just found it humiliating.

00:38:06Marc:Always?

00:38:07Guest:Yeah.

00:38:08Marc:Like, I'm trying to think, what does a half-inching scene mean?

00:38:10Guest:It means it's, like, that much, like, past... Oh, right above your... That's how short they are.

00:38:16Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:38:17Marc:You know?

00:38:18Marc:Oh, yeah, yeah, I can't picture it.

00:38:19Marc:I gotta get into this volleyball thing.

00:38:24Guest:Yeah, you should check it out.

00:38:26Marc:You should be one of those guys going to all the games.

00:38:29Marc:There's that guy again.

00:38:31Guest:Sometimes like comic dude comics will be like, hey, we should go to a UCLA volleyball game.

00:38:37Marc:Really?

00:38:38Guest:I'm like, are you really into volleyball?

00:38:41Marc:No, but for you, that'd be like triggering.

00:38:47Marc:Your legs would start shaking again.

00:38:49Marc:Your knee would hurt.

00:38:50Guest:My legs didn't start shaking volleyball.

00:38:52Guest:They only shook on stage.

00:38:54Marc:So what did you end up like studying at UCLA?

00:38:57Guest:I did English.

00:38:59Marc:Oh, really?

00:39:00Guest:I was always like a huge book nerd growing up.

00:39:03Marc:So English, how did that work there?

00:39:05Marc:Because I did English too.

00:39:06Marc:And how did it work there?

00:39:08Marc:Did you have to like have a focus of some kind?

00:39:11Guest:No, I didn't.

00:39:12Guest:I didn't have to do that.

00:39:14Guest:I mean, I had amazing...

00:39:16Guest:professors that were like one of my professors was Mona Simpson, uh, incredible author.

00:39:23Guest:Like she was my creative writing teacher.

00:39:25Marc:So you were writing?

00:39:25Guest:I mean a little bit.

00:39:27Guest:Like I'd always wanted to be a writer, but I don't know if I had that much confidence.

00:39:32Marc:Did you write some poetry?

00:39:34Guest:I've done that.

00:39:35Guest:Definitely.

00:39:36Guest:You know, I have a real just sense sensitive soul.

00:39:39Marc:Have you looked at that lately?

00:39:41Guest:No.

00:39:45Marc:I think you should bring some of your poems on stage and just read them as your id.

00:39:50Guest:You know what I've always done, though?

00:39:51Guest:I have journaled since I was a little kid.

00:39:55Guest:And so I have journals from like every year of my life.

00:39:58Marc:It's interesting how you write in a journal, right?

00:40:01Marc:Yeah.

00:40:01Marc:Because it's so direct.

00:40:03Marc:Because you're not trying to do anything other than, you know, get it down.

00:40:07Marc:Yeah.

00:40:07Marc:I didn't journal my whole life, but I journaled.

00:40:09Marc:I started journaling after my second divorce when I was really shattered.

00:40:14Marc:Yeah.

00:40:14Marc:And I just, every day I did it and I have them and no one can ever see them.

00:40:20Guest:I talk about this all the time.

00:40:22Guest:I've told my friends, like, if anything happens to me, you break in there and burn the millions of journals I have.

00:40:29Marc:Yeah.

00:40:30Marc:Because there's like, because you want to at least be honest with yourself.

00:40:34Marc:Yeah.

00:40:34Marc:So you put it out there.

00:40:36Marc:So you get it out of you.

00:40:37Guest:Yeah.

00:40:37Marc:And there it is.

00:40:38Guest:Yeah.

00:40:39Marc:One time, dude.

00:40:40Marc:And I eventually...

00:40:46Marc:I was in that period where I was like heartbroken.

00:40:50Marc:I was writing all this shit.

00:40:51Marc:And I was like, you know, journaling about like, you know, I'm just like, I'm going to fuck her out of my heart.

00:40:56Marc:You know, just like this.

00:40:58Marc:That's poetic.

00:41:01Marc:You know, like that kind of and just like all the details of stuff.

00:41:05Marc:And one time I was working up in Palo Alto at Roosters.

00:41:10Guest:Yes.

00:41:11Marc:Been there.

00:41:11Marc:Yeah.

00:41:11Guest:Oh, yeah, I'm going there this summer.

00:41:12Guest:Yay.

00:41:13Marc:And I was working with a couple of comics.

00:41:15Marc:It doesn't matter.

00:41:16Marc:It was Jacob Searoff and his then wife and their kids, right?

00:41:23Marc:And, you know, I went over to their hotel and hung out, like, after a show or before a show, and I left my fucking journal there.

00:41:30Marc:that i was writing and my heart is like i know and to this day like i ran when i realized and i'm like oh no the comics have it that's good comics and i was like i ran back but did i leave this book there and they gave it to me i'm like oh no they read the stuff and to this day i don't know

00:41:48Marc:But it's okay.

00:41:49Guest:I wonder, you know what?

00:41:50Marc:But there's nothing bad in there other than my vulnerability.

00:41:53Guest:Oh, I think, like, mine is so humiliating.

00:41:56Guest:Like, I write prayers in there.

00:41:58Guest:I mean, just, like, I would not want anyone to see anything.

00:42:02Guest:The first page of every journal that I have, and I showed it to my parents before.

00:42:07Guest:Yeah.

00:42:07Guest:It says, do not read.

00:42:10Guest:If you read this, like, hex will be put on your entire bloodline in perpetuity.

00:42:17Guest:Yeah.

00:42:17Marc:And you still do that?

00:42:18Guest:Every journal.

00:42:19Guest:If lost, my phone number.

00:42:20Marc:Do you ever lose one?

00:42:23Guest:It starts with a threat.

00:42:24Guest:No, I don't lose it because I rarely bring it out of my house.

00:42:28Marc:I tried to read some of that stuff and it was just so painful and weird.

00:42:32Guest:Yeah.

00:42:32Marc:And I don't know what to do with it.

00:42:35Guest:Yeah, I was on a tour with Jessel Nicol last year, and I'd always be writing in my journal, and I would put my arm around it, and he'd be like, I'm not reading your stupid diary.

00:42:50Guest:He's like, I don't care about your dumb diary.

00:42:55Guest:You can quit acting like you're hiding it from me.

00:42:59Marc:He's actually, it turns out to be a pretty sweet guy.

00:43:02Guest:He's so sweet.

00:43:03Marc:Yeah.

00:43:04Guest:I love him.

00:43:05Marc:And like, you know, like if he read it, he'd probably give you some lighthearted jabs, but he wouldn't.

00:43:10Marc:hold it against you.

00:43:11Guest:Yeah, it's so funny because his persona is so intimidating.

00:43:17Guest:I was so scared of him for no reason.

00:43:20Guest:Only for just seeing him on stage.

00:43:23Guest:But he's so nice and he's so also supportive of female comics.

00:43:28Guest:But in a low-key way where he never mentions it.

00:43:31Marc:You know what I mean?

00:43:32Marc:Well, he uses you guys.

00:43:33Marc:Yeah.

00:43:35Marc:And he's like...

00:43:37Marc:I think like he's one of those guys that got successful and got sweeter.

00:43:40Guest:Oh, really?

00:43:42Marc:Yeah.

00:43:42Guest:Yeah.

00:43:43Marc:Because I remember when I first interviewed him, he was like pretty fuck you-ish.

00:43:46Marc:Not to me.

00:43:47Guest:He likes you a lot.

00:43:48Guest:He's told me that many times.

00:43:49Marc:Oh, I love him.

00:43:50Marc:Yeah.

00:43:51Marc:Yeah.

00:43:52Marc:Now we get our hair cut at the same place.

00:43:54Guest:Yes, we've talked about that.

00:43:57Marc:Because I'm like, I need to change it up.

00:43:58Marc:I got some money.

00:43:59Marc:I want to get a really good haircut.

00:44:01Marc:Who would possibly be the person to talk to?

00:44:03Marc:I'm like, Jasmine.

00:44:04Guest:Yeah.

00:44:05Marc:Yeah.

00:44:06Marc:But yeah, I mean, like early on before he was big, you know, he had a little more of an anger thing.

00:44:13Marc:But now he's like this, like he's just a decent guy, sweet guy.

00:44:16Guest:Yeah.

00:44:16Guest:I mean, I never knew him then.

00:44:19Marc:Well, he wasn't a bad guy, but like it was harder to get past the character.

00:44:24Marc:Totally.

00:44:24Guest:You know what I mean?

00:44:25Marc:Yeah.

00:44:25Marc:Well, that's nice you went out with him.

00:44:27Marc:But yeah, the journal thing, I don't do it anymore.

00:44:29Guest:Oh, really?

00:44:30Marc:No, I don't.

00:44:31Guest:Well, I'm just like, I have all this, I need to empty it out.

00:44:35Guest:I'm like, I'm not, who am I going to, I'm not going to dump this on anyone, you know?

00:44:39Marc:Yeah.

00:44:39Guest:It's such a habit to me.

00:44:40Guest:I do it every day.

00:44:41Marc:What are the prayers?

00:44:44Guest:I pray to God.

00:44:45Marc:Yeah.

00:44:45Guest:Whatever God is, I'm not sure.

00:44:47Marc:Yeah.

00:44:48Marc:But you do it.

00:44:48Guest:Divine loving intelligence.

00:44:50Guest:Yeah.

00:44:51Guest:Yeah.

00:44:51Guest:I pray.

00:44:52Guest:I like to pray.

00:44:53Guest:Yeah.

00:44:53Marc:Yeah, I've done it before to the big nothing.

00:44:56Marc:I like to throw my fears into the big hole.

00:45:01Guest:Yeah, I think that's good.

00:45:03Guest:Got to put them somewhere, right?

00:45:05Marc:Yeah, someone told me that, like, you know, whether you believe or not, people have been praying since the beginning of time.

00:45:10Marc:So somehow it's etched into the kind of universal neural pathway.

00:45:16Guest:Yeah.

00:45:16Marc:So whether you believe or not, the act of doing it is still proactive.

00:45:22Marc:Yeah.

00:45:23Guest:Yeah, and reverent, and it's sort of— Humble, too.

00:45:26Guest:Humble, yeah, because you're getting outside of yourself.

00:45:30Marc:Right.

00:45:30Guest:You know?

00:45:31Marc:Yeah.

00:45:32Marc:So you get the English degree, and so you're all set.

00:45:38Guest:and you know like my family has like is uh really like immigrant mentality like everything about even though they're not immigrants yeah but like uh just like work ethic is everything you know all this stuff and um like i had always been like you know i want to be like an artist and um my dad would be like well yeah everyone wants that

00:46:05Guest:I'd like to be a painter, get a job, you know?

00:46:09Guest:And so there was definitely not any encouragement like you can be any go for your insane dream or anything.

00:46:20Guest:But I had always wanted to be in my mind a writer.

00:46:24Guest:Like I had never thought I think when I was like a little kid, I wanted to be an actor.

00:46:30Guest:I was like the youngest child.

00:46:32Guest:Yeah.

00:46:33Guest:Look at me.

00:46:33Guest:And I would try out for plays at school and like get the part.

00:46:40Guest:But I wouldn't be able to do it because my sports schedule was too insane.

00:46:43Guest:So I never got to do even at like 10 years old.

00:46:46Guest:I was like had shit every fucking day.

00:46:48Marc:So they like that part of the work ethic.

00:46:50Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:46:50Guest:They loved it.

00:46:51Marc:Yeah.

00:46:51Marc:They're like, this is going to give her a good sense of.

00:46:55Guest:Also, I mean, like I did have like just what you were talking about, like freaky, just like genetic talent.

00:47:02Marc:Yeah.

00:47:03Guest:Like sports wise.

00:47:03Marc:Yeah.

00:47:04Guest:Just like out the gate.

00:47:06Marc:Yeah.

00:47:06Marc:But also, you know how to lose, right?

00:47:08Yeah.

00:47:09Guest:i will say what has helped me so much as an athlete like uh growing up like in comedy whereas like sometimes my friends are like comedians like well they'll be like fuck that guy he got this and i didn't and i that never crosses my mind i'm like oh i wasn't good enough

00:47:33Marc:Really?

00:47:33Guest:Yeah.

00:47:34Marc:I'm not sure that's better, but I like the story.

00:47:36Guest:No, it's not.

00:47:37Guest:You know, it's... I have to work harder.

00:47:39Guest:Totally.

00:47:40Guest:Yeah.

00:47:41Marc:I guess that's good, if you put it that way.

00:47:43Guest:Or, like, I still have... One of the things I do, like, about myself is that, like, I have an ability to be genuinely happy for it.

00:47:53Guest:Like, I'm really good at being happy for people.

00:47:56Guest:I can still be sad for myself at the same time.

00:47:58Marc:That's good.

00:47:58Guest:But, like, that comes naturally to me, thank God.

00:48:02Marc:That's good.

00:48:02Marc:So your insecurity is not malignant.

00:48:07Guest:I would say that I like internalize it instead of externalize it.

00:48:10Marc:Right.

00:48:10Marc:You don't.

00:48:11Marc:Yeah.

00:48:12Marc:Yeah.

00:48:13Marc:I don't know anything about that, but I appreciate it.

00:48:17Guest:I mean, look, I still have the self, the pressure I put on myself is...

00:48:23Marc:Right.

00:48:24Marc:But you keep it in and then you explode on stage.

00:48:26Marc:You don't you know, you don't be like, fuck that guy or like, why'd they get that?

00:48:30Marc:Yeah.

00:48:30Guest:Or also, I've never understood that because I'm like, they didn't book themselves.

00:48:34Guest:Someone chose them.

00:48:35Guest:It's not their fault.

00:48:36Marc:And also like that, like who's choosing anything anymore?

00:48:39Marc:Like it seems like show business is contracting.

00:48:42Guest:Sure.

00:48:43Marc:to the point where if you don't carve your own way, then you, you know, there's no one giving away shots anymore.

00:48:50Guest:Yeah.

00:48:50Guest:I mean, the industry seems to be just in total free fall where they're just, it's changing every second.

00:48:56Guest:And I, even with like this clip culture that we're talking about, it's like in, on one hand, I'm really happy for those people who are just these comedians that are just like excellent at marketing.

00:49:09Guest:You know what I mean?

00:49:10Guest:Because I'm like, good for them.

00:49:11Guest:Like for,

00:49:12Guest:carving out a career for themselves that five, ten years ago would have not been possible for their level.

00:49:19Guest:I mean, some of the talent.

00:49:23Guest:You know what I'm saying?

00:49:24Marc:So I see how you do it.

00:49:27Marc:You present a logical and seemingly objective argument for why shitty comics get successful, but you're happy for them.

00:49:38Guest:No, no.

00:49:39Guest:I would only say half of them are shitty.

00:49:41Guest:Half of them are incredible comics who also have the...

00:49:46Marc:uh the depths of the energy inside that i get what you're saying it's like you know if you believe in in in the process or the craft or you're in it for you know personally creative reasons and not just to you know you know pull a crowd for crowd work you know it's different yeah you know like if you believe in sort of like you know going through the paces of finding yourself as a comic that still has to mean something

00:50:11Guest:Yeah, totally.

00:50:12Guest:But I mean, also, I cannot fault anyone who found a way to build their own audience.

00:50:19Marc:I know, because it's impossible.

00:50:20Guest:Yeah, to me, I'm like, that's amazing, and I'll give them their flowers.

00:50:24Guest:God bless them.

00:50:25Marc:Sure, sure.

00:50:25Marc:I mean, you'd rather not have, like...

00:50:29Marc:Yeah, sometimes because clubs are clubs and they just want to sell tickets, you know, you'll get people in there that aren't really even doing comedy per se.

00:50:38Marc:Yeah, 100%.

00:50:38Marc:But they brought the crowds in, so whatever.

00:50:41Guest:Yeah.

00:50:42Marc:But yeah, I mean, I understand that.

00:50:44Marc:And I think...

00:50:45Marc:and I try to tell people that all the time, you know, these fucking people that, you know, think it's easy for anybody, especially around this Nepo baby thing.

00:50:52Marc:It's like, dude, 99% of people come from regular backgrounds.

00:50:58Marc:Nobody, no family wants their kid to do this.

00:51:01Guest:Not at all.

00:51:02Marc:And it's like, you know, it just comes from this weird singular focus and, and personal persistence that anybody breaks through it all, even for a minute.

00:51:10Marc:Totally.

00:51:11Marc:So,

00:51:12Marc:Did you do the writing?

00:51:13Marc:You're going to be a writer?

00:51:15Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:51:16Guest:I did business for a couple of years just because I needed a job.

00:51:22Marc:What do you mean?

00:51:22Marc:After college?

00:51:23Marc:Yeah.

00:51:23Marc:Well, you did business.

00:51:25Guest:I did business.

00:51:26Guest:I did real estate.

00:51:29Guest:Wow.

00:51:30Marc:In Santa Barbara?

00:51:31Guest:No.

00:51:32Guest:In Orange County.

00:51:33Guest:Yeah.

00:51:34Marc:Oh wait, where's Santa Barbara?

00:51:35Guest:Santa Barbara's about an hour and a half north of LA or two hours or something.

00:51:40Marc:It's north?

00:51:41Guest:Yeah.

00:51:41Marc:What's down the other way?

00:51:42Marc:Oh, San Clemente.

00:51:43Marc:Santa Barbara's up there and then Orange County's closer to here?

00:51:46Guest:San Clemente is Orange County.

00:51:48Marc:Okay.

00:51:48Guest:That's like basically right where I grew up.

00:51:50Marc:Okay.

00:51:50Marc:Oh yeah, right.

00:51:51Marc:That's right.

00:51:52Marc:So Santa Barbara's the other way.

00:51:53Marc:Yeah.

00:51:54Marc:And San Clemente, yeah, is towards San Diego.

00:51:56Guest:Yeah, basically like where I grew up is equidistant, like halfway point between LA and San Diego.

00:52:02Marc:What a fucking dumb drive that is.

00:52:05Marc:Jesus Christ.

00:52:06Marc:Everybody's like, you know, like, yeah, you can get down there an hour and a half.

00:52:09Marc:In what world?

00:52:10Marc:There's never there's no way to get to San Diego under four hours unless you walk or take the train.

00:52:17Guest:I don't know you that well, but I feel like I know you and I can just I feel like in my soul that you like hate San Diego.

00:52:26Marc:Once I'm down there, I'm all right.

00:52:28Marc:But usually it takes me a day to just come down from the aggravation of not understanding how it could take so long to get there.

00:52:34Marc:Yeah.

00:52:34Marc:And I was going to take the train last time.

00:52:36Marc:And then the train got fucked up because the mud slide just took the goddamn tracks out.

00:52:42Marc:I'm like, God damn it.

00:52:44Marc:When do I even leave to get there and not be aggravated?

00:52:47Marc:Yeah.

00:52:49Marc:Right?

00:52:49Guest:Yeah.

00:52:51Marc:But I don't mind San Diego.

00:52:52Marc:I played at a really weird place there, and I did well.

00:52:56Marc:The last time I was there, I had a broken foot, and I didn't know it was broken.

00:52:59Marc:Oh.

00:52:59Marc:Do you know that North Park Observatory Theater?

00:53:03Guest:I don't think so.

00:53:04Marc:It's a weird place.

00:53:05Marc:It almost looks like a circus somehow.

00:53:07Guest:Oh.

00:53:07Marc:But I played there.

00:53:08Marc:I went down there.

00:53:08Marc:I hurt my foot at the gym, and I'm like, ah, it's probably just a sprain.

00:53:11Marc:And then I'm like, I went down there.

00:53:13Marc:I did two shows on a broken foot.

00:53:15Guest:Oh, my gosh.

00:53:15Marc:But, yeah, man.

00:53:17Marc:Show must go on.

00:53:19Marc:I'm glad you're wobbling around on my heel.

00:53:21Guest:Wait, how'd you break it at the gym?

00:53:22Marc:I'm just, like, dumb.

00:53:24Marc:Like, I was doing step-ups, and I came down, and my foot, you know, went under me.

00:53:29Marc:Sure.

00:53:29Marc:Because of, like, because Hoka sneakers are, like, wearing fucking high heels.

00:53:34Guest:Like moon boots.

00:53:36Marc:I have them.

00:53:37Marc:I mean, yeah, you can run in them, but you can't lift weights.

00:53:39Marc:It's so stupid when you realize, like, these are, like, three-inch heels.

00:53:45Guest:Yeah, they are, like, moon boot, like, launching pads.

00:53:47Marc:Yeah.

00:53:48Guest:Comfortable, though.

00:53:49Marc:They're comfortable, but flat shoes from here on out.

00:53:52Marc:I had to ride out that broken foot, hobbling around with that fucking boot for three months.

00:53:56Marc:But anyway, so that's where you grew up, there, and you're selling real estate.

00:54:00Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:54:01Guest:And, like, I had to be in the office at 6 a.m.

00:54:04Guest:I was, like, the only female broker, and I had to be in the office at 6 a.m.

00:54:10Guest:every day.

00:54:11Guest:And it was, like, really that culture of, like...

00:54:14Guest:whoever is in the the office for as many hours as possible you know yeah and all i was doing was like cold calling and i was just like look i was like i'm gonna die under these fluorescent lights there has to be more yeah and i was like i'm gonna wait till i get like a good check and see if that changes anything yeah i got the first one i was like nope i feel nothing um and

00:54:38Guest:And then I was like, well, what would I do if I could do anything?

00:54:42Guest:And I was like, oh, I want to be a novelist.

00:54:44Guest:Because that's really all I cared about was books besides.

00:54:49Guest:And then I applied to some MFA programs.

00:54:54Guest:And I applied to the four easiest ones I could find.

00:54:58Guest:And then one no way school in New York.

00:55:02Guest:No prayer.

00:55:03Guest:And then I got rejected from the four easy schools.

00:55:08Guest:The new school in New York.

00:55:09Marc:The new school?

00:55:10Guest:Yeah, so then I moved there, and that's how I got to New York.

00:55:12Marc:Holy shit.

00:55:13Marc:So that's where it all happened?

00:55:15Marc:I know the new school.

00:55:16Guest:Yeah, I wanted to be a novelist.

00:55:19Marc:That's a good school.

00:55:20Guest:Yeah, I mean, it was incredible.

00:55:22Guest:We got the authors that they brought in, and people that were in my tiny classes are now really big novels.

00:55:31Guest:Yeah, real writers?

00:55:32Guest:Yeah, it was really great.

00:55:34Guest:And then, of course, I started comedy in the middle of that time.

00:55:37Guest:just out of nowhere.

00:55:39Guest:Like I, I didn't see my first comedy show till I was 25.

00:55:42Marc:That's wild.

00:55:43Guest:Yeah.

00:55:44Guest:Like I didn't grow up seeing any comedy.

00:55:45Guest:I didn't watch comedy.

00:55:46Guest:Like I had no reference for comedy.

00:55:49I know.

00:55:50Marc:Here's a, here's what I learned at the new school.

00:55:52Marc:Like I decided like in my thirties, I'm like, you know, I could probably understand philosophy now.

00:55:58Marc:So I took a philosophy class at the new school and,

00:56:02Marc:And I didn't understand any of it.

00:56:04Marc:It was all based on logic.

00:56:05Marc:And it was just like, it was not, I thought we were going to talk about stuff.

00:56:09Marc:Right.

00:56:09Marc:And it was just like math.

00:56:11Marc:And I was like bummed out and I was being a smart ass and cracking jokes like I was in high school.

00:56:16Marc:And then one, one day that teacher was in the elevator with me and he says, why'd you take my class?

00:56:23Marc:And I said, because I wanted to expand my mind and learn about philosophy.

00:56:31Marc:He goes, he says, well, you can expand your mind two ways.

00:56:35Marc:Either you can put new stuff in there or you can heat up what's already in there so it expands.

00:56:43Marc:I'm like, yeah, that's more my speed.

00:56:48Yeah.

00:56:48Guest:You're like, we're still doing riddles even in the elevator.

00:56:52Guest:It's so funny that you say that about philosophy because when I was in college, I was like, oh, I'm going to major in philosophy.

00:57:01Guest:My dad was like, you know, what the hell?

00:57:04Guest:But I took like the first course and I was like, oh, this is...

00:57:09Marc:debate with no answer my personal hell yeah i was like this is lit i was like this is that not at all what i thought it was going to be yeah so but did you did you do you did debate no oh i hate debate oh i i just it gets for me eventually you know even if i knew how to debate i would get to the point where i'd be like go fuck yourself

00:57:35Guest:I just hate, like, probably because I'm so, like, sensitive.

00:57:40Guest:I just, like, hate arguing for the sake of arguing.

00:57:43Guest:Like, it just feels stressful.

00:57:47Guest:Because debate to me is not, like, in my mind anyways, what debate is.

00:57:51Guest:It's, like, not having a casual conversation.

00:57:54Guest:It's, like, someone really wanting to change your point of view on something.

00:58:00Marc:Through argument.

00:58:01Guest:Yes.

00:58:02Yes.

00:58:02Marc:Yeah, I don't find that I get into those kind of arguments anymore.

00:58:05Marc:But when I do, I'm surprised that I do have some core beliefs.

00:58:10Marc:So every once in a while, an argument is sort of like, yeah, I have a few beliefs.

00:58:14Marc:And now we can put them away.

00:58:15Marc:I stand for something.

00:58:16Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:58:17Marc:I have a point of view on that.

00:58:19Marc:Right.

00:58:19Marc:But so you're at the new school.

00:58:20Marc:And why do you go to a comedy show?

00:58:22Marc:How does that happen?

00:58:23Guest:Well, I had been dating a guy who had just started comedy from my hometown before I moved to New York.

00:58:31Guest:And he showed me comedy.

00:58:33Marc:So you went with him or you didn't?

00:58:35Guest:No, no.

00:58:36Guest:I got into grad school, of course.

00:58:38Guest:I never thought I'd be moving to New York.

00:58:40Guest:Moved there and then like, you know.

00:58:41Marc:But he showed you like comics and stuff?

00:58:43Guest:Yeah, he introduced me to comedy.

00:58:45Guest:Actually, one of the first shows he took me to was yours with...

00:58:50Guest:Eddie Pepitone in... Who I'm obsessed with, Eddie Pepitone.

00:58:56Marc:Yeah.

00:58:56Guest:Like, he makes me laugh so hard.

00:58:58Marc:He's great.

00:58:58Guest:And then Maria Bamford.

00:58:59Marc:Oh, wow.

00:59:00Marc:Yeah.

00:59:00Marc:It was the three of us?

00:59:01Guest:It was the three of you guys at the Ice House.

00:59:04Marc:Wow.

00:59:04Guest:Yeah, like...

00:59:06Guest:I don't know, probably 12 years ago or something.

00:59:08Marc:That's crazy.

00:59:09Guest:Yeah.

00:59:09Guest:And I was like, and I was just like, I was like, this is incredible.

00:59:13Guest:So I like quickly became such a fan, but like it never, ever, ever crossed my mind.

00:59:18Guest:I was like, I'm a writer.

00:59:19Guest:You know, I would never want to like.

00:59:21Marc:Yeah.

00:59:22Marc:Yeah.

00:59:22Guest:Yeah.

00:59:23Marc:And so, but, but that's a, that's a pretty powerful trio.

00:59:26Guest:It was.

00:59:27Guest:I was like mystified.

00:59:28Marc:Totally.

00:59:29Marc:Like that is totally like off the grid.

00:59:32Yeah.

00:59:32Marc:of three comics perfect lineup yeah all three so different but also like all three like not like not standard no comics yeah was it like I'm trying to think what that show would it be was I headlining I think so because like I probably was able to you know put my show together yeah and I had them on there yeah and then I just struggled no you did not struggle um funny you even say that because my boyfriend at the time got mad at me for laughing too much laughing

01:00:02Marc:The new comic?

01:00:05Guest:Yeah, and I was like, I think if you don't like your loved one's greatest expression of joy, there could be a problem.

01:00:17Marc:And then he said, fuck that guy.

01:00:20Marc:Fuck them.

01:00:20Guest:No, he loved you guys.

01:00:21Guest:He just probably didn't like me.

01:00:24Marc:I love those two.

01:00:27Marc:I mean, those two are the outliers.

01:00:29Marc:They're the best.

01:00:31Marc:Maria's the best.

01:00:32Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:00:32Marc:I mean, like... Eddie just shot a special, I think.

01:00:35Marc:I know.

01:00:35Guest:And, like, I saw his last one.

01:00:37Guest:Like, I made sure I blocked out and I went live, like, his special that was shot at Dynasty Tech Fighter.

01:00:45Guest:Yeah, yeah.

01:00:45Guest:And I was like, that was one of the hardest times I've ever laughed.

01:00:48Guest:Because, you know, when you're, like, around comedy for so long, like, even when you're watching it, you're like, oh, that's a good joke, but you're not actually laughing.

01:00:57Marc:Yeah, yeah, no, yeah.

01:00:57Marc:You know?

01:00:58Guest:And I was just like...

01:00:59Guest:Because he's just so wild.

01:01:02Marc:I love it.

01:01:04Marc:But he's also like, he's sort of like you in that, you know, offstage, he's like so sweet.

01:01:09Marc:So sweet.

01:01:10Marc:And kind of self, you know, not deprecating, like he's self-aware, but he's just so sweet.

01:01:18Marc:But he gets up there!

01:01:20Marc:And then all of a sudden we're here.

01:01:22Guest:Yeah.

01:01:23Guest:You know, like, I've actually, since I have got past at the store, like, probably a year ago.

01:01:30Guest:But, like, I'll see you there all the time.

01:01:33Guest:But, like, I would never say hello to you because I'm too shy.

01:01:36Guest:And Eddie is the one person ever in my life that I ever asked for a picture with.

01:01:43Guest:Yeah.

01:01:44Yeah.

01:01:44Guest:I'm like, that's the one person I've ever asked for a picture with.

01:01:50Guest:I was just, yeah, because I'm too shy to talk to.

01:01:54Marc:Not now.

01:01:55Marc:Now you're going to be like, hey, Mark.

01:01:58Guest:Yeah, now I'm going to be thrilled.

01:02:00Guest:I saw you there last, or I didn't see you there last night, but I saw your name on the marquee.

01:02:04Guest:We were there at the same time, but I never saw you.

01:02:06Marc:Oh, yeah, I just ducked into the main room and got out, I guess.

01:02:09Marc:I didn't hang.

01:02:10Guest:Yeah.

01:02:11Marc:Yeah, it was pretty good last night.

01:02:12Guest:Yeah.

01:02:12Marc:Were you playing there?

01:02:13Guest:Yeah.

01:02:14Marc:Where?

01:02:15Marc:Or?

01:02:15Guest:Original room, yeah.

01:02:17Guest:It was great.

01:02:17Marc:Was it?

01:02:18Guest:Yeah.

01:02:18Marc:That's good.

01:02:19Marc:Yeah, I love it.

01:02:21Marc:So where do you go to New York?

01:02:22Marc:Who drags you to the show?

01:02:23Marc:You just went by yourself?

01:02:24Guest:Oh, so I started writing for Splitsider interviewing comedians because like... What was that guy's name?

01:02:31Marc:Dylan?

01:02:33Marc:Was he there?

01:02:33Guest:No.

01:02:34Guest:You know, it's funny.

01:02:35Guest:I never even met the people that I was... I was writing for them like for free.

01:02:39Guest:Oh, okay.

01:02:40Guest:And I was like... And I just become a...

01:02:43Guest:fan of comedy and i always joke around comedians now like i wasn't writing any think pieces or writing anything uh about anyone like yeah i was just interviewing people yeah and i'd be like one intro paragraph and then interview them but i was just like just uh be mindful of the blogs because like i'm thinking this is someone who literally discovered comedy six months before

01:03:05Guest:i was writing about it i'm like you know i wasn't writing reviewing anyone or anything what were you doing i was just interviewing people oh yeah for split cider yeah can i tell you something yeah i interviewed you

01:03:24Guest:When I was interning at W Magazine.

01:03:28Marc:Yeah.

01:03:29Guest:The high fashion.

01:03:30Marc:Okay.

01:03:30Guest:And your show was just about to come out.

01:03:32Guest:Marin?

01:03:33Guest:Yeah.

01:03:33Guest:And I begged my supervisor if I could interview you.

01:03:38Guest:And it was like five minutes with like Marc Marin.

01:03:40Guest:And I was like, oh, so exciting.

01:03:42Marc:Yeah.

01:03:43Marc:How was it?

01:03:44Guest:It was great.

01:03:45Guest:It was a thrill for me.

01:03:46Marc:What we did on the phone?

01:03:47Guest:Yeah.

01:03:47Yeah.

01:03:47Marc:Well, that's exciting.

01:03:49Guest:Yeah.

01:03:50Guest:My manager was like, are you going to tell him you interviewed him?

01:03:53Guest:I was like, I don't know.

01:03:53Guest:I don't want to sound dorky.

01:03:55Marc:No, I whenever I hear stories like that, like, you know, any sort of thing like, yeah, you're not going to remember this.

01:04:03Marc:I'm like, oh, God, here we go.

01:04:04Marc:What did I?

01:04:05Guest:No, but I interviewed so many comics before I started comedy.

01:04:09Guest:Like, I interviewed Anthony, and I didn't tell him until, like, the last week of tour.

01:04:14Guest:And he's like, you're so weird.

01:04:16Guest:Why are you just telling me that now?

01:04:20Marc:That's a very interesting—what did you learn from that?

01:04:24Marc:I mean, so were your questions coming from—

01:04:28Marc:uh, a sort of curiosity to do it.

01:04:31Guest:No, no.

01:04:32Guest:Well, at least not consciously.

01:04:34Guest:Like I had no awareness and like, no, uh, I had no desire to start comedy.

01:04:41Guest:And then like the, I, uh, pitched an article about Michael Che.

01:04:46Guest:It was, he just did one week guest writing for SNL.

01:04:50Guest:Yeah.

01:04:50Guest:And another like W thing when I was an intern and I was his first piece of press ever.

01:04:56Guest:Oh, wow.

01:04:57Guest:And that interview, I asked questions that like in hindsight was clearly someone wanting to start because I was like, and what was the exact day that you started?

01:05:07Guest:Like, and what did, you know, like these questions that were crazy.

01:05:12Yeah.

01:05:12Marc:Have you talked to him since?

01:05:14Guest:Yeah.

01:05:15Guest:Yeah.

01:05:16Guest:I mean, not recently, like anytime I go back to New York or whatever, but like he's, he's always just so sweet.

01:05:24Marc:So when did you do it?

01:05:26Guest:Well, so like two, basically like two days later after that interview, it came to me in the shower and I had broken up with that guy and I was like pretty heartbroken and I was like, Oh, nothing can hurt me now.

01:05:36Guest:You know, I might as well.

01:05:38Guest:Like after the thought came to me and then I just started like immediately.

01:05:41Marc:Where at?

01:05:41Guest:Um, I took a class.

01:05:44Marc:With?

01:05:45Guest:At Gotham Comedy Club.

01:05:46Marc:With who?

01:05:47Guest:I believe his name was Jim.

01:05:50Guest:Huh.

01:05:50Guest:But, um, of course you don't learn anything in those classes.

01:05:53Guest:The only.

01:05:53Marc:But you get to go on.

01:05:54Guest:Well, you get to go on.

01:05:55Guest:The main benefit is with people who have never done it before.

01:05:59Guest:Right.

01:06:00Guest:So that's the whole thing.

01:06:01Marc:You get a kind of a safe start.

01:06:03Guest:Yeah.

01:06:03Guest:Like they don't teach you anything.

01:06:05Guest:They can't teach you how to like be funny or write a joke.

01:06:08Guest:Um, but yeah.

01:06:09Guest:And then I just started doing.

01:06:10Marc:Jim Mandrinos.

01:06:11Yeah.

01:06:11Yes!

01:06:12Guest:Oh my God, I can't believe you remembered that.

01:06:14Guest:Do you know him still?

01:06:16Marc:I mean, I know him still as much as I know anybody from the past, but I knew he taught.

01:06:23Guest:Whoa, you have a laser memory.

01:06:26Marc:Well, I mean, he's been around a while.

01:06:28Marc:I mean, yeah, Jim Mandrino, sure.

01:06:29Guest:But yeah, and then I just got obsessed and, like, I had, like, every temp job.

01:06:34Guest:I had every temp job while going to grad school, while, like, just doing three open mics at night.

01:06:41Marc:What was the open mic scene?

01:06:42Marc:Like, were you going to Brooklyn and, like—

01:06:44Guest:Brooklyn and Manhattan.

01:06:46Guest:And it was so good.

01:06:47Guest:Like, and it would be like, oh, I would be like, you know, really making sure I was working on my writing before each thing because there were so many good comics at the, at the mic.

01:06:58Marc:Yeah.

01:06:58Guest:Yeah.

01:06:59Marc:Who was around?

01:07:00Guest:who was around well rosebud obviously um sydney marie reggie conquest um like some of these people like julio torres uh he was just amazing off the bat yeah uh joe para dan lakata wow so like you had a pretty good crew of people that were doing work yeah it was it was good and then when did you just start working

01:07:28Guest:Well, I just randomly got on a TV show, like an MTV show, like two years in.

01:07:34Marc:Which one?

01:07:35Marc:That's like the way it was in the old days.

01:07:37Guest:Yeah.

01:07:37Guest:It was like I called the casting director, was at a party, and I didn't even know she was a casting director.

01:07:45Guest:And then she just messaged me.

01:07:46Guest:She was like, you want to audition for this?

01:07:47Guest:And I left my computer coding job that I lied to get.

01:07:52Guest:Yeah.

01:07:53Guest:in the middle of the day to go audition they're like it takes three hours because they're so far behind i'm like i'm probably gonna get fired from this job for going to this audition yeah uh then i found out like i got it and it was like a female prank show that was nicole it was nicole buyer yeah um mateo lane yeah megan gailey jade catapretta

01:08:19Guest:and um me and it was like a prank show like under the girl code thing yeah and so it sort of started being like I didn't like I was doing comedy but like not in a way that I I thought I was like doing some fun New York yeah like I didn't think it was gonna be my career right at all so how long that show run

01:08:37Guest:One season.

01:08:39Guest:One and done.

01:08:41Guest:Back to the temp jobs.

01:08:43Guest:Real fast.

01:08:44Marc:Did you lose the computer job?

01:08:46Guest:Yeah.

01:08:49Guest:I got another one after, though.

01:08:51Marc:Yeah.

01:08:52Marc:But did that kind of put some wind in your sails?

01:08:55Guest:Yeah.

01:08:55Guest:Oh, totally.

01:08:56Guest:Like, I mean, just even from the start with comedy, the first time I was like, oh, this is it.

01:09:03Guest:I was like, oh, this is what I've been searching for my whole life.

01:09:06Guest:Like, I just felt it immediately because, you know, I was like thinking I was going to be a novelist.

01:09:11Guest:I was like, oh, this is a little different than 14 hours alone in a room.

01:09:15Marc:Oh, yeah.

01:09:15Marc:Trying to write pages and pages where you can write three things and then go try it and be like, that's a good day.

01:09:21Guest:Yeah.

01:09:22Marc:One of them works good.

01:09:23Guest:A lot of my friends in my grad school program, they just published the novel that they started working on.

01:09:30Marc:Just now.

01:09:31Guest:Yeah.

01:09:31Guest:And it was about the same time that it took me to do an hour special.

01:09:36Marc:Yeah.

01:09:36Marc:Two of my best friends are novelists.

01:09:38Marc:It's a rough road.

01:09:39Guest:Yeah.

01:09:39Marc:But I could never do that.

01:09:41Marc:Jesus Christ.

01:09:41Guest:I think you could.

01:09:43Marc:Not a novel.

01:09:43Marc:I mean, I'm pretty good at writing and talking about me.

01:09:47Marc:Yeah.

01:09:49Marc:And the idea of writing a novel, I don't know.

01:09:52Marc:Writing books, it's like it just hangs over you.

01:09:57Marc:I know.

01:09:58Marc:Unless it's the most important thing in the world to you, it's a fucking nightmare.

01:10:04Guest:Yeah, and just the amount of focus you have to have is... And then just to write.

01:10:09Guest:Yeah.

01:10:09Marc:I don't like it.

01:10:10Guest:Yeah.

01:10:11Yeah.

01:10:12Marc:You know, I like thinking about stuff and working it out on stage and then, you know, hammering away at it.

01:10:17Marc:I write a newsletter every week and I put my heart into it.

01:10:21Guest:Oh, you do?

01:10:21Guest:I got to subscribe.

01:10:22Marc:Yeah, I've been doing it for years.

01:10:24Marc:There's hundreds of them.

01:10:25Guest:Oh.

01:10:25Marc:It's just like every Sunday I sit down.

01:10:27Marc:It's almost like a weekly journal in a way with some thoughts.

01:10:30Marc:And, you know, it's so funny because I don't know how many people read it.

01:10:33Marc:Right.

01:10:33Marc:But do you know Mike Kaplan?

01:10:34Marc:Yeah.

01:10:35Marc:The comic?

01:10:35Guest:Uh-huh.

01:10:36Yeah.

01:10:36Marc:He's a big fan of it.

01:10:38Guest:He's so sweet.

01:10:38Marc:Sweetest guy.

01:10:39Marc:Yeah.

01:10:39Marc:And every week I write it and he'll like, he'll email me and take out little pieces of it.

01:10:44Marc:Like, this is good.

01:10:45Marc:Right.

01:10:45Marc:This is real nice.

01:10:46Marc:Yeah.

01:10:47Marc:Almost like, you know, he's like editing for the good stuff.

01:10:50Marc:Yeah.

01:10:50Marc:And now because he's been doing it so long, I'm thinking like, I gotta think of something Michael.

01:10:56Guest:You're writing for your audience.

01:10:57Marc:I'm writing for my audience of one.

01:10:59Marc:Mike Kaplan.

01:11:01Marc:Mike Kaplan.

01:11:03Guest:That probably makes him super happy.

01:11:06Marc:Well, it's weird because, you know, getting feedback from that kind of writing doesn't happen that often.

01:11:10Marc:And it's just prose or little poetic things I'm thinking.

01:11:14Marc:Yeah.

01:11:14Marc:But it is sort of encouraging.

01:11:16Marc:And I do find, like, if he doesn't write me, I'm like, oh, man.

01:11:20Marc:Oh, God, this week.

01:11:22Marc:Didn't fucking get a nugget.

01:11:24Marc:No nuggets this week for Mike.

01:11:26Guest:Guess this week wasn't a hit, Mike.

01:11:29Marc:So so then you just kind of plowing away in New York and you got other opportunities and stuff.

01:11:34Guest:Yeah.

01:11:35Guest:And like I kept slowly like getting, you know, I got the new faces and I got the.

01:11:41Marc:Oh, in one of the last ones, probably.

01:11:44Guest:This was what I got it like 2017, I think.

01:11:48Marc:Eight minutes, room full of industry.

01:11:50Guest:Six minutes.

01:11:51Marc:Six?

01:11:51Guest:Yeah.

01:11:54Guest:Wow.

01:11:55Guest:And, yeah.

01:11:56Marc:And you popped?

01:11:58Guest:No, not from that, really.

01:11:59Guest:Like, I mean, my year, it was, I think they've kind of changed it a little bit where they go back to people without a bunch of credits.

01:12:07Guest:But, like, my year was, like, Sam Jay, Taylor Tomlinson, Rami, like, everyone in my class.

01:12:13Guest:Everyone had already been on TV many times.

01:12:16Marc:Well, it wasn't the same.

01:12:18Marc:They really couldn't pull off what they used to with social media now.

01:12:23Marc:But before, it was like before there was that.

01:12:26Guest:Yeah.

01:12:26Marc:I mean, these were people they had to go find that no one had seen before.

01:12:30Guest:Right.

01:12:30Marc:So the idea was like, you know, someone would come throw money at you.

01:12:33Guest:Yeah.

01:12:34Marc:But now it's just sort of like, well, they're kind of new faces.

01:12:37Guest:Yeah.

01:12:37Marc:I one time did that.

01:12:38Marc:I think I did the Remember These Guys show.

01:12:42Yeah.

01:12:47Marc:You might have missed these guys.

01:12:51How did that go?

01:12:52Marc:I got a deal out of it.

01:12:53Marc:Hell yeah.

01:12:55Marc:In 2001.

01:12:55Guest:Oh, that's incredible.

01:12:56Marc:It was like me and Ron White.

01:12:59Guest:Whoa.

01:12:59Marc:And I think Jeremy Hotz.

01:13:02Marc:Definitely, you know, guys who had been around.

01:13:05Marc:But it kind of gave me a little boost.

01:13:07Guest:Yeah, when I started in 2013 and I listened to podcasts, and I remember you guys always talking about, yeah, and remember all the new faces would get a deal, and I don't think anyone's gotten a deal from, besides getting Saturday Night Live, but that's not these development deals.

01:13:24Marc:No, the development deal days are long gone.

01:13:27Guest:Yeah.

01:13:27Marc:Yeah, they were good, though.

01:13:28Marc:A lot of people made a lot of money for almost doing something.

01:13:31Guest:Yeah, totally.

01:13:32Marc:Yeah.

01:13:33Guest:Sounds great.

01:13:34Marc:So when did you, you know, did you do the Tonight Show and stuff?

01:13:39Guest:I did Corden.

01:13:46Marc:How was that?

01:13:46Marc:The pretend conversation guy.

01:13:50Marc:I'm going to put you on a couch with somebody, but I'm only going to talk to you separately, and I'll interject a lot.

01:13:56Marc:It's the illusion of conversation.

01:13:58Yeah.

01:13:59Guest:It was really great.

01:14:01Guest:And you know, what's crazy about it is I kind of just forgot.

01:14:05Guest:Like I accidentally used one minute of my set saying hello to Reggie Watts saying hello to James Gordon.

01:14:13Marc:Oh, she did stand up.

01:14:14Marc:Oh yeah.

01:14:14Marc:Oh, that's different.

01:14:16Marc:No, I just do panel.

01:14:17Marc:It was just like, it was hard to score.

01:14:20Guest:Yeah.

01:14:20Marc:I like to do, I like to do panel.

01:14:22Guest:Yeah, well, I mean, sounds great.

01:14:25Marc:But even when I was not famous at all, I fought to do panel on Conan.

01:14:30Marc:Right.

01:14:30Marc:Because I did stand-up on Conan a couple of times early on.

01:14:33Guest:Yeah.

01:14:33Marc:And then I was like, I always liked watching Richard Lewis or Jay Leno.

01:14:38Marc:The guys you sat down and did sit-down stand-up.

01:14:40Marc:I'm like, why can't I do that?

01:14:42Marc:Totally.

01:14:42Marc:And he let me do it.

01:14:44Marc:And apparently it caused him a lot of trouble.

01:14:45Marc:Because he let me do it and we had this rapport.

01:14:48Marc:Yeah.

01:14:49Marc:All the comics were like, why can't I sit down like Maren?

01:14:51Guest:Yeah.

01:14:51Marc:And he's like, because that's Maren's thing.

01:14:53Guest:Right.

01:14:53Marc:I'm like, thank God.

01:14:54Marc:Yeah.

01:14:55Marc:You know how much it built my career?

01:14:58Marc:Zero.

01:14:58Guest:I know.

01:15:01Guest:I think that's all late night now.

01:15:03Marc:But this was in the 90s.

01:15:04Marc:And I always used to think, like, I got to quit changing my haircut.

01:15:10Marc:I got to decide on a look.

01:15:11Marc:It's not landing.

01:15:12Yeah.

01:15:13Guest:I always I always wanted to do Conan so badly, but I never because I was like, oh, I'm kooky.

01:15:19Guest:Like that's that's going to be that will be the direction.

01:15:22Marc:Well, that was always good because he like I come out there like, oh, here we go.

01:15:25Marc:How is he going to alienate the people?

01:15:28Guest:Yeah.

01:15:29Marc:90% of the time, my first joke would just go.

01:15:32Guest:Oh, really?

01:15:33Marc:And be like, oh, well, what happened?

01:15:34Marc:You know, I'm like, all right, I'll dig out.

01:15:38Marc:I can dig out of this hole.

01:15:40Marc:Oh, my God.

01:15:42Marc:So you just did Corden?

01:15:43Guest:I did Corden.

01:15:44Marc:You should be on The Tonight Show.

01:15:45Guest:I want to be on The Tonight Show.

01:15:47Marc:What's the problem?

01:15:47Guest:Yeah, I don't know.

01:15:48Guest:Can you call him up?

01:15:50Marc:Yeah.

01:15:50Yeah.

01:15:50Marc:I don't know him like that.

01:15:55Marc:But it seems like a crazy oversight.

01:15:58Marc:What about Colbert?

01:15:59Guest:Yeah.

01:16:00Guest:I mean, I'd love to do Colbert.

01:16:02Marc:You're ready.

01:16:03Guest:Yeah.

01:16:04Guest:I'm ready for another late night set.

01:16:06Guest:Yeah.

01:16:06Guest:I could send one tomorrow.

01:16:09Marc:So, okay, so you do, do you do writing jobs and do you do other stuff?

01:16:13Guest:Well, I do a good amount of voiceover.

01:16:16Guest:I haven't had a writing job.

01:16:20Guest:I would love one.

01:16:21Guest:I've been pitching my own shows for a while.

01:16:23Marc:So the voiceovers, do you use this voice and then the other one?

01:16:26Guest:Yeah.

01:16:29Guest:I call that Mark.

01:16:33Marc:Which one do you want?

01:16:36Guest:That's what they say.

01:16:37Guest:Sometimes they go like, they'll be like, oh, we want you to do your WWE voice.

01:16:44Marc:Yeah.

01:16:44Guest:And then other times, like I'll be playing, like the last job I did, I was playing an eight-year-old boy.

01:16:49Guest:So it just changes all the time.

01:16:52Marc:Oh, yeah?

01:16:53Guest:Yeah.

01:16:53Marc:And I watched a special.

01:16:55Guest:Oh, thank you.

01:16:56Guest:That's so nice of you.

01:16:57Marc:What'd you call it?

01:16:58Guest:Live from the Big Dog.

01:16:59Marc:Yeah.

01:17:00Marc:Live from the Big Dog.

01:17:02Marc:Now, how was that put together?

01:17:03Guest:Well, that was part of Veep's Live Nation's new streamer.

01:17:08Guest:They're like first class.

01:17:09Marc:Yeah, I know Bart.

01:17:10Marc:Yeah.

01:17:10Guest:Yeah, Bart is just a dream.

01:17:12Guest:I love him so much.

01:17:13Marc:That guy's been in every job ever.

01:17:16Marc:There are guys in comedy that have been on that side of it where you're like, oh, you're working here now?

01:17:21Guest:Totally.

01:17:21Marc:For 30 years.

01:17:22Guest:Yeah.

01:17:23Guest:But he's like one of these people where you're like, you are so lovely to work with.

01:17:27Marc:He's a sweet guy.

01:17:28Guest:Like he loves comedy.

01:17:29Marc:Yeah, one of the few sweet guys.

01:17:30Marc:Totally.

01:17:30Marc:Yeah.

01:17:31Guest:He's so nice.

01:17:33Guest:And I wanted to do my first special in L.A.

01:17:37Guest:So like I could have my friends and family come because a lot of my friends are like, I would never want that.

01:17:43Guest:I would never.

01:17:44Guest:And I'm like, no, I want it.

01:17:45Marc:Yeah.

01:17:46Guest:Because it feels like homey and fun to me.

01:17:48Marc:So they were in the room?

01:17:49Guest:Yes.

01:17:50Marc:Like who?

01:17:50Marc:Your brothers?

01:17:51Guest:My brothers and my parents, which is like their first time seeing me do comedy.

01:17:58Marc:What?

01:17:58Guest:Yeah.

01:17:59Marc:How'd they react?

01:18:03Guest:They really liked it.

01:18:04Guest:Like my dad cried because he was so proud.

01:18:08Guest:Yeah, that really meant a lot to me because they did not, they have not loved my choice in career.

01:18:17Marc:Yeah.

01:18:18Marc:It's always something that moment where they're like, oh, she can do it.

01:18:22Guest:Yeah.

01:18:23Guest:I mean, like, I still don't think that's what they want, but they were like, oh, she is doing it.

01:18:28Guest:And she's successful.

01:18:29Guest:Yeah.

01:18:29Guest:And it went and it went well.

01:18:31Marc:They got to appreciate the work ethic.

01:18:33Marc:Like this work ethic is crazy.

01:18:35Marc:Yeah.

01:18:35Marc:Because you're your own boss.

01:18:37Guest:Totally.

01:18:38Marc:Yeah.

01:18:38Marc:So you just grinded it out in New York for how many years?

01:18:41Guest:I left after five and a half years.

01:18:43Guest:Like I moved to LA in 2018.

01:18:47Guest:Yeah.

01:18:48Marc:Yeah.

01:18:49Marc:And you did the special what?

01:18:51Marc:Just recently?

01:18:52Guest:Yeah.

01:18:53Marc:And then you decided on like 42 minutes?

01:18:57Guest:Oh, it's 43.

01:18:58Guest:But funny story about that.

01:19:01Guest:I forgot six minutes of jokes.

01:19:04Marc:What?

01:19:05Guest:Yeah, I probably shouldn't be saying that.

01:19:07Marc:What do you think people are going to be like, nah, that was what was missing.

01:19:11Marc:Those six, you want to do them?

01:19:14Guest:No, but it was so like, and I didn't even think about the extra emotional factor of my parents being there.

01:19:22Marc:Oh, yeah.

01:19:22Marc:What do you mean you didn't think of it?

01:19:23Guest:I didn't think about it.

01:19:24Marc:That's why people are like, what are you doing?

01:19:26Guest:I didn't think about it like or anything.

01:19:29Guest:And I didn't.

01:19:30Guest:I got it.

01:19:30Guest:I had put my timer.

01:19:32Guest:I put my phone recording backstage and I got off stage and it said 43 minutes.

01:19:38Guest:And I was like so confused because I got off stage and I was thrilled.

01:19:41Guest:I was like, I was like, I was so like.

01:19:43Marc:What were you planning on doing?

01:19:45Guest:Uh, it was like 49 was what I shopped.

01:19:51Marc:Right.

01:19:51Guest:And then I was like, what jokes did I forget?

01:19:54Marc:Yeah.

01:19:54Marc:You know?

01:19:55Marc:Was it one chunk?

01:19:56Guest:No, it was like little, well, one, yeah, one main chunk.

01:20:00Guest:And then like a few other things that like, I only slowly realized like over time what it was like, besides the chunk of what the few other ones were.

01:20:09Guest:Yeah.

01:20:10Marc:I do that all the time.

01:20:11Guest:You do?

01:20:12Guest:Like, have you done that on a special?

01:20:14Marc:Yeah.

01:20:14Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:20:15Marc:Yeah.

01:20:16Marc:But, like, I still have this, like, hour mentality.

01:20:19Guest:Right.

01:20:20Marc:And nobody wants them anymore.

01:20:22Guest:Well, you know, I think it's just whatever you want to do.

01:20:26Marc:No, they definitely don't want you.

01:20:29Marc:I appreciate your idea, but they're like, you know, I'm like, can we do 73?

01:20:37Marc:Yeah.

01:20:38Marc:It's a little long.

01:20:40Marc:Like, what are you talking?

01:20:42Marc:They don't realize that they're the ones responsible for creating this attention span that they've decided people don't have.

01:20:48Marc:Right.

01:20:48Marc:Like, I mean, look, you may not get everybody, but there are still people in the world that are going to sit through till the end of the thing.

01:20:55Guest:Yeah.

01:20:56Guest:Yeah.

01:20:57Marc:Yeah.

01:20:57Guest:Yeah.

01:20:57Guest:I don't know.

01:20:58Guest:I mean, I respect it.

01:21:00Guest:Like I, I like when anyone makes a hard choice on anything, you know?

01:21:04Marc:Yeah.

01:21:04Guest:So.

01:21:05Marc:Yeah.

01:21:05Marc:I just like, I just plow away and then like shave it out, you know, like, but you're always, I'm always going to lose stuff.

01:21:11Guest:Yeah.

01:21:12Marc:And like some things are lost forever.

01:21:14Marc:Right.

01:21:15Marc:But I don't know how like what I mean, I'm always generating on stage, you know, like that's where it all happens.

01:21:22Marc:Like there's nothing on paper to indicate that I write jokes.

01:21:25Guest:I'm so amazed by you because I'm the exact opposite.

01:21:29Marc:No, but it shows because, you know, like I don't because I don't know that I think it's a way that I.

01:21:37Marc:You know, protect myself from I don't know if it's failure, but like sometimes if I have a joke that's structured like a joke and I and I have them, they happen.

01:21:46Marc:But like, I'm sort of like, all right, well, that was easy.

01:21:49Marc:You know, I get like, I know that works.

01:21:53Marc:I get what you're saying.

01:21:54Marc:And I use them at the beginning.

01:21:56Guest:Yeah.

01:21:56Marc:To sort of get in.

01:21:58Marc:But then I like expand and try.

01:22:00Marc:Every long form thing has jokes in it.

01:22:02Marc:But I don't like knowing.

01:22:04Marc:Like I like knowing there's gaps for them to grow.

01:22:07Guest:Yeah.

01:22:07Marc:Do you know what I mean?

01:22:08Guest:Yeah.

01:22:08Guest:And I can only do that when I have a.

01:22:12Guest:very clear skeleton of the joke already in existence but that's probably because i too fearful like i would love to go on stage to trust myself enough to just organically come up with stuff

01:22:27Marc:Yeah, but you trust yourself enough to sort of like, you know that you're building towards something and it's not, it's not just like a turn of phrase.

01:22:35Marc:I mean, you trust yourself enough to, you know, go at Triscuits for a fairly operatic bit of business that repeats.

01:22:42Marc:So like, I couldn't imagine like, you know, like, you know, knowing like, I'm going to do it again.

01:22:47Marc:Yeah.

01:22:48Guest:So that's... Yeah, but like, you know, like I don't do crowd work because I'm like, I don't even... I only do it if I have to.

01:22:56Guest:I'm like, I don't even like talking to strangers in regular life.

01:23:01Guest:Yeah.

01:23:01Marc:Right.

01:23:02Marc:Especially these weirdos that come to see you.

01:23:03Guest:No, I like you guys very much.

01:23:06Guest:You've been listening.

01:23:07Guest:Thank you so much.

01:23:08Marc:No, they love you.

01:23:08Marc:They love you.

01:23:09Marc:But I just, so I only do crowd work.

01:23:10Marc:I think it's like a skill you should have.

01:23:12Marc:Yeah.

01:23:13Guest:But I mean, that takes confidence, the crowd work.

01:23:16Marc:Well, kind of.

01:23:17Marc:But I think, like, you know, you do it kind of, you know, when you're saying, like, with the pervs.

01:23:24Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:23:25Marc:Yeah, but that's not exchange.

01:23:27Marc:But, like, you could... I'm sure you could do it.

01:23:29Guest:Yeah, I mean, I'll do it, like...

01:23:32Guest:That's not the meat of my set.

01:23:34Guest:It's just throwaway stuff.

01:23:36Guest:But I do envy that freeness.

01:23:38Guest:But because I was a writer first, there are certain linguistic phrases and wording that I'm really attached to that I find interesting.

01:23:49Guest:And I have every joke's divided by year, month, everything typed out on my computer.

01:23:57Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:23:57Guest:Oh, really?

01:23:58Guest:All my friends always used to, like, make fun of me.

01:24:00Guest:They'd be like, oh, you bring your book report, Blair?

01:24:03Marc:Yeah.

01:24:03Guest:And I'd be like, well, have you ever thought about writing a joke, even one joke?

01:24:07Marc:You know?

01:24:08Marc:No, you can tell that, you know, you have a very specific way of phrasing because you have a very deliberate pace.

01:24:13Guest:Oh, thank you.

01:24:14Marc:Do you know what I mean?

01:24:15Guest:Yeah.

01:24:16Marc:You know, me, like, I feel like, you know, anytime I'm about to go on stage, I'm like, I don't know if this is going to...

01:24:22Guest:You know, it's crazy to think that you still feel that way because one thing that I... It's not nerves.

01:24:27Guest:It's just sort of like... No, I know exactly what you mean.

01:24:30Guest:And I still to this day, like I'm, you know, 11 years in, like I to think, you know, you've been doing it way longer than me.

01:24:37Guest:Like I still never know how I...

01:24:40Guest:to start a set.

01:24:42Guest:I'm always like, what am I going to open with?

01:24:45Guest:The opening will plague me, I think, till death.

01:24:49Marc:What happens to me is I have the one opening.

01:24:51Marc:I'm like, I know this.

01:24:52Marc:If this doesn't work, then it's going to be work.

01:24:56Marc:Right.

01:24:57Marc:So like I generally come up with one of those.

01:24:59Guest:That's how I feel.

01:25:00Guest:Yeah.

01:25:00Guest:I'm like, I need something that gives me the confidence right off the bat.

01:25:04Marc:Yes.

01:25:05Marc:And then if that one goes, you're like, okay.

01:25:07Guest:Yeah.

01:25:08Marc:Yeah.

01:25:08Marc:No, I mean, I know I'm going to be okay out there, but sometimes the worst thing I can hear, you know, if I'm about to go on stage is for a comic to come, the one before me or two before me to come in and go like, oh, they're great.

01:25:19Guest:I'm like, God damn it.

01:25:22Marc:I'm going to ruin it.

01:25:23Yeah.

01:25:25Guest:Are there people you hate to follow or you don't want to or maybe you don't want to say?

01:25:29Marc:No, it's not a matter of following.

01:25:32Marc:It's a matter of like at some point, you know, I realized and it took me a long time to realize that that like, look, man, you know, part of the job is, you know, you're going to have to get them around to where you are.

01:25:43Marc:So if somebody just blasted the place open.

01:25:46Marc:With either crowd work or insane energy.

01:25:49Marc:Right.

01:25:50Marc:Like, I'm not going to start there just because they've done that.

01:25:52Marc:Yeah.

01:25:53Marc:So I've got to, like, you know, realize that, you know, I do what I do.

01:25:58Marc:Yeah.

01:25:59Marc:And, you know, I've got to bring them to me.

01:26:01Marc:So if they're blasted open, the bringing them to me thing is not...

01:26:07Marc:always going to be easy yeah it's not gonna be satisfying right especially on short sets yeah if you're doing an hour hour plus for your people like you got a lot of wiggle room yeah but if you're just working out right you know and they're just there for a night of comedy and you got to go out there and it's just been you know they're exhausted yeah it's just sort of like okay yeah i know how to do it but it's not always satisfying

01:26:31Guest:Right.

01:26:32Guest:I was thinking, remember, because I think you dropped in on a show and maybe they give you more time or not.

01:26:37Guest:But in Moon Tower, they gave us, it was six minute sets.

01:26:41Guest:And we were all like, how do you even do a six minute set?

01:26:45Guest:You know, like for a late night set, you like plan it and you like really whittle something down with like a lot of intention.

01:26:52Guest:But we were all like, it's like scary to do a six minute set.

01:26:55Marc:Yeah, it's like a TV set because you got to edit.

01:26:56Guest:You got to go so fast.

01:26:58Marc:Or you got to just cut shit out.

01:26:59Guest:Yeah, or, like, you don't have, like, time to, like, let anything.

01:27:03Guest:It's, like, opening joke.

01:27:05Guest:End, you know?

01:27:06Marc:Yeah.

01:27:07Marc:Where was that set?

01:27:08Marc:I remember they put me on a show.

01:27:09Guest:It was at Anton's in Moon Tower that I met when I was with Rosebud where we met.

01:27:15Marc:Well, that was the music night?

01:27:17Guest:Yeah, I think so.

01:27:18Marc:Yeah, that was different.

01:27:19Marc:No, I'd play guitar and stuff.

01:27:20Guest:Oh, no, no.

01:27:21Guest:That was different.

01:27:21Guest:This was like a showcase.

01:27:24Marc:Oh.

01:27:24Guest:Or maybe I'll just finish.

01:27:25Guest:I don't think so.

01:27:26Marc:I don't know.

01:27:27Marc:Yeah, I think she gave me like, you know, 12 or something.

01:27:30Marc:Oh, okay.

01:27:30Guest:So you got more time than everyone else.

01:27:32Marc:Yeah.

01:27:33Guest:Yeah.

01:27:34Guest:Of course.

01:27:35Guest:I'm on your side.

01:27:36Marc:I didn't even know if I was going to get sets.

01:27:38Guest:No, no.

01:27:39Guest:I'm just saying like when we were like, oh, six minutes.

01:27:42Guest:We were all like, how do you even do six minutes?

01:27:44Marc:Well, you used to have to do it for TV spots.

01:27:46Guest:Yeah.

01:27:46Marc:And it was always sort of like it was this whole other skill set.

01:27:49Guest:Right.

01:27:50Marc:And it used to be five.

01:27:52Guest:Yeah.

01:27:52Marc:For like Letterman, it was like five.

01:27:54Guest:Yeah.

01:27:54Marc:And I'm like, what do you even do in five minutes?

01:27:57Guest:Yeah.

01:27:57Guest:And a short set, it's like you need a plan.

01:27:59Marc:Yeah.

01:28:00Marc:You got to take everything out of context.

01:28:02Guest:Yeah.

01:28:02Marc:And just find the ones that hit.

01:28:05Guest:Right.

01:28:06Marc:With less build.

01:28:07Guest:Yeah.

01:28:08Marc:Yeah.

01:28:09Marc:Yeah.

01:28:09Marc:Well, you're doing great.

01:28:10Guest:Thank you.

01:28:11Marc:And it's good talking to you.

01:28:12Guest:It's great talking to you.

01:28:14Guest:This is so much fun.

01:28:15Marc:Thanks for doing it.

01:28:16Marc:Thanks for doing it.

01:28:17Guest:Thank you.

01:28:23Marc:There you go.

01:28:24Marc:Great talk.

01:28:26Marc:Her new special, Blair's new special, Live from the Big Dog, is available now at veeps.com.

01:28:31Marc:Hang out for a minute, folks.

01:28:35Marc:Hey, just thought I'd let you know that Full Marin listeners can now enjoy an infamous live WTF recorded back in 2010 in New York City featuring some of my favorite filthy comics, including Amy Schumer, Dave Attell, and Bobby Kelly.

01:28:49Marc:You know what Dr. Steve said, though?

01:28:51Marc:He said that if you jerk off a lot, your primary sexual partner is yourself.

01:28:56Marc:And that in order to be intimate with somebody else, you have to stop doing that so you can acknowledge somebody else is there, which I think you're doing.

01:29:03Marc:I'm proud of you.

01:29:03Guest:Dr. Steve's a fucking dickhead.

01:29:05Guest:Yeah, he sounds like a jerk-off, dude, really.

01:29:07Guest:This is what it is, is that... You can't jerk off and have really... You know what happens is that you... I agree with that.

01:29:13Marc:Yeah, because you're a smart man.

01:29:14Marc:These guys are animals.

01:29:15Guest:You actually get... What happens is that you're home a lot, and she walks around naked.

01:29:19Marc:Don't rationalize it.

01:29:20Guest:She walks around naked.

01:29:21Guest:She's in the shower naked.

01:29:22Guest:We see each other.

01:29:23Guest:You get desensitized... To her?

01:29:25Guest:...to seeing her.

01:29:25Guest:So I actually told my wife to stop...

01:29:28Guest:I don't want you coming in the bathroom.

01:29:29Guest:I don't want to take showers.

01:29:31Guest:Let's just fucking save it because I see you naked.

01:29:34Guest:You see me naked all the time.

01:29:36Guest:You get desensitized to that.

01:29:38Marc:You don't get desensitized from watching Bukkake movies for six hours a fucking day?

01:29:42Guest:There's a million of them.

01:29:43Guest:They're all different.

01:29:44Guest:There's thousands.

01:29:46Guest:If you've seen one Bukkake movie, yes, I would.

01:29:48Marc:The Blue Show is now available for full Marin subscribers.

01:29:52Marc:To sign up, go to the link in the episode description or go to WTFpod.com and click on WTF+.

01:30:00Marc:And a reminder before we go, this podcast is hosted by ACAST.

01:30:05Marc:Enjoy some of my classic guitar work now.

01:30:09Music

01:30:45Thank you.

01:31:14Thank you.