Episode 1497 - Tammy Pescatelli
Guest:Lock the gates!
Marc:Alright, let's do this.
Marc:How are you, what the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck, buddies?
Marc:What the fuck, Nicks?
Marc:How's it going?
Marc:How are you?
Marc:I'm Mark Maron.
Marc:This is my podcast, WTF.
Marc:Welcome to it.
Marc:As we enter into the other holiday season, we're out of the celebration of lights and into the celebration of Christ.
Marc:Either way, people get time off.
Marc:Today on the show, Tammy Pescatelli, a comedian that's been around for a while.
Marc:We have never really hung out or talked.
Marc:We seem to have missed each other over the years.
Marc:But I did just do Comics to Come Home with her in Boston.
Marc:And it's interesting because I had my...
Marc:experience of that i know how i felt about what happened there that night i didn't know really i had no outside perspective but uh her take on what happened with me that night was different and i appreciated it she's very funny you may know her from uh last comic standing showtime's funny women of a certain age and she has two hour-long comedy specials on prime video it was interesting that way i think we talk about it a bit
Marc:her perspective on trying to please multiple generations of audience members and how tricky that can be just in terms of having the knowledge of what is happening.
Marc:But I'm glad we did it.
Marc:I asked her to do it when we were at Comics Come Home, and I actually thought she was upset with me because of a way back kind of controversy around Amy Schumer.
Marc:But it turned out she really wasn't, but it also...
Marc:kind of brought up a conversation that I don't know if it's been had not recently or had here in terms of her kind of clearing some of that out about, you know, kind of what went down around, you know, the controversy, you know, around joke stealing and then around her having a misunderstood joke and being piled on and somewhat canceled.
Marc:I didn't anticipate any of it because I didn't know any of it.
Marc:But we did kind of get into it.
Marc:Folks, I'll be in Los Angeles at the Elysian Theater this Friday, December 22nd.
Marc:I'm at Dynasty Typewriter on Thursday, December 28th.
Marc:And I'm at Largo on Tuesday, January 9th.
Marc:Then I'm in San Diego at the Observatory North Park on Saturday, January 27th for two shows.
Marc:Those will be with Taylor Williamson.
Marc:Then San Francisco at the Castro Theater on Saturday, February 3rd.
Marc:Portland, Maine at the State Theater on Thursday, March 7th.
Marc:Medford, Massachusetts outside of Boston at the Chevalier Theater on Friday, March 8th.
Marc:Providence, Rhode Island at the Strand Theater on Saturday.
Marc:March 9th, Tarrytown, New York at the Tarrytown Music Hall on Sunday, March 10th, Atlanta, Georgia.
Marc:I'm at the Buckhead Theater on Friday, March 22nd.
Marc:And I'll be in Austin, Texas at the Paramount Theater on Thursday, April 18th as part of the Moon Tower Comedy Festival.
Marc:More dates will be forthcoming.
Marc:Go to WTFPod.com slash tour for tickets.
Marc:Will you?
Marc:Will you do that?
Marc:So the other day, Saturday...
Marc:I told Doug Benson that I would do his Benson interruption.
Marc:Now, I don't know if you know about the Benson interruption.
Marc:It's a live event.
Marc:I don't believe he records them.
Marc:And it's basically like comics as the robots in MST.
Marc:What is it?
Marc:3000?
Marc:MST.
Marc:Whatever.
Marc:Mystery Science Theater.
Marc:Is it 3000?
Marc:It doesn't matter.
Marc:So what happens is you sit there with an audience and four comics sit in the front row with microphones and comment during the film, making jokes and whatnot.
Marc:And it was me and Doug and Paget Brewster, Ian Carmel and Josh Molina.
Marc:Now, when we got there, Doug sort of left it on the audience to bring in DVDs or suggest movies.
Marc:Fine.
Marc:I didn't know what I was getting into.
Marc:I got into some traffic on the way down.
Marc:I was pissy by the time I got there.
Marc:Look, right when I get someplace, I'm having a good time.
Marc:I pretty much am.
Marc:It's converging on the event, converging on the travel, converging on the plane.
Marc:But once I arrive somewhere, I'm like, I'm happy to be here.
Marc:But it's getting through the convergence.
Marc:I don't know about you, but that these sort of moving towards it, getting there, thinking about getting there, thinking about being there, you know, getting your head together and then the travel, man, not great.
Marc:But once I'm there, no matter how many obstacles I've created in my mind or in reality, I'm happy to hang out with people.
Marc:I need to do that more often.
Marc:So anyway, we vote on a movie.
Marc:The options were a couple of Christmas movies and then a Mel Gibson movie, which we didn't think would be appropriate for Hanukkah.
Marc:But anyway, so we opted against the Mel Gibson movie and somebody brought the movie Roar.
Marc:I didn't know about this fucking movie.
Marc:It was one of the more impactful movies I'd ever seen in my life for not good reasons necessarily, but...
Marc:But I could not take my eyes off it.
Marc:And I knew nothing about it.
Marc:It seems like it should be a phenomenon or there should be more conversation around it.
Marc:Maybe there has been.
Marc:I found a documentary on the movie.
Marc:Melanie Griffith was involved.
Marc:I'd like to do an episode with Melanie Griffith only talking about Roar.
Marc:Now, I don't know if you know this or anything about it, but this guy, Noel Marshall,
Marc:a producer, a movie producer, who was married to Tippi Hedren.
Marc:And that means he was Melanie Griffith's stepdad.
Marc:And he had a few kids of his own.
Marc:Now, Noel and Tippi were into the animal conservation movements.
Marc:They took a trip to Africa and realized what was going on down there.
Marc:And they became very involved with saving the large cats and the animals in Africa to the point where they started amassing large cats at their, I believe, Beverly Hills home and raising them in the family.
Marc:Like, I'm talking about big lions.
Yeah.
Marc:So this kind of mission became an obsession, and Noel decided he was going to write and make a film with Tippy and a couple of his kids and Melanie about some sort of research scientist out in Africa somewhere in a cabin.
Marc:Or a house filled with lions and tigers and panthers.
Marc:And there were elephants.
Marc:And it was crazy.
Marc:I can't explain it to you.
Marc:So he shoots this movie.
Marc:It takes 10 years to shoot.
Marc:They start shooting in the mid-70s.
Marc:So they built this place out in the desert with a moat and everything else.
Marc:And about, I think, almost 100 large cats.
Marc:Maybe a little less, but I can't even describe to you.
Marc:the insanity of this movie.
Marc:And I, and I didn't know anything about it.
Marc:That's what really struck me.
Marc:There was this 10 year process where they're out there in the desert with, with not trained cats.
Marc:They had the cats that they had amassed and then they brought in other cats.
Marc:And in any given shot, there was at least 30 fucking large cats.
Marc:Like lions, tigers, panthers, cheetahs.
Marc:I don't know what the fuck they were, but it was all about this guy who's out there trying to save the cats.
Marc:Then he has his family fly in, who's his real family.
Marc:And then it just becomes this, this terrifyingly anxious person.
Marc:movie where you know this guy is the the idea is look we can live with the large cats but you know you're really on their terms and noel marshall had decided that he's the alpha cat and he's just sort of manhandling these large cats as best he can and and and trying to corral them and then the family comes out and everyone's running away from anywhere from five to forty fucking lions and tigers no safety uh regulations no precautions taken and
Marc:It was just barely controlled chaos and sometimes complete chaos with the animals.
Marc:The story was really about this scientist or researcher who's trying to save the animals from poachers who were coming.
Marc:And then he had to go get his family at the airport.
Marc:And that turned out to be they took a bus.
Marc:And but ultimately, you know that I don't want to spoil it for you, but the plot doesn't even fucking matter.
Marc:It's just like hours and hours of footage.
Marc:of these actors or this family in the midst of wild lions in a house, like 30, 40 in the house, knocking shit over.
Marc:They're running from them.
Marc:And apparently none of the animals got harmed except for a few after there was a flood and they escaped and they had to be put down.
Marc:It was horrible.
Marc:But all the care in the world went into protecting the animals.
Marc:But apparently every other day someone was taken over to Palmdale Hospital.
Marc:They were out in the desert here in L.A.,
Marc:The DP, it was his first job.
Marc:He's from Holland.
Marc:He sets up a shot in a trench covered by some mesh.
Marc:Saw him moving under there, ripped off the mesh, and just took off half this guy's scalp.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He was out for two weeks and came back.
Marc:And then he went on to, I think, direct twister fucking insane.
Marc:Everybody was freaked out that the guy, Noel, he got mauled.
Marc:You know, you see it in one of the frames where he's like, you know, there's all these lines around, they're going at each other.
Marc:He's acting like he's got a minimum of control.
Marc:And one of them just fucking drags them out of frame by the, by the thigh and apparently punctured them gangrenous weeks out.
Marc:And that's when the floods happen.
Marc:It's insane.
Yeah.
Marc:Could not stop watching it.
Marc:Obviously, it was tremendous fodder for jokes.
Marc:Melanie Griffith was 18.
Marc:You see her get mauled by a lion.
Marc:Her face got scratched.
Marc:Apparently, she needed plastic surgery.
Marc:There's a doc about it on Amazon Prime.
Marc:It's a short one, like 40 minutes.
Marc:But I don't know if this guy Marshall was bipolar or what, but he needed to finish this movie because he thought it was going to make a bunch of money.
Marc:Didn't even get released, except in Europe.
Marc:And then here they pulled it out of the in 2015 or something.
Marc:It was finished by 81, but they couldn't get it released.
Marc:It's not.
Marc:Look, here's the weird thing about it.
Marc:You know, there are some movies that you you like because they're bad.
Marc:But man, I can't even tell you.
Marc:I can't even tell you.
Marc:It may be a bad movie, but the footage is something you'll never see again.
Marc:It's like it's a family who is doing what is trying to be part of their dad's crazy ass vision.
Marc:And everyone's put at horrendous risk to be hedred, shattered her ankle, fallen off an elephant.
Marc:I can't.
Marc:If you can find it, just go watch it.
Marc:It's a terrible movie that you cannot stop watching because it's filled with wild cats, tigers, lions, and humans pretending that it's okay.
Marc:un-fucking-real this woman who i uh have known of and met a couple of times over the years but never had a conversation with is very funny i was happy to see her at the comics come home show in boston and um i asked her to come tammy pescatelli is here you can get all her upcoming tour dates at pescatelli.com this is me just talking to tammy
Marc:You're curious about what?
Marc:Just the neighborhood?
Guest:Well, the evolution of, like, I love craftsman houses.
Marc:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And you don't see them too far out of, like, this.
Guest:I never saw them in Glendale.
Guest:And then you go down.
Guest:Look across the street.
Guest:That looks like it.
Guest:I mean, I've got to read.
Marc:That's a weird house.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Right over here, though, there's a couple of, like, classic big craftsmen.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Marc:This one is a craftsman, but it's a little odd.
Marc:It's a little odd shaped, like it's a barn shape or something.
Marc:Like it's a different kind, but there's all these different craftsmen.
Marc:Do you live here still?
Guest:No, I left when I got pregnant because my agent dropped me because he said my career was over.
Guest:I mean, that's literally- When was that?
Guest:2008.
Marc:See, you could have been ahead of the curve on the pregnant special.
Guest:I know.
Guest:I hid everything.
Guest:Isn't that so funny?
Guest:I was pregnant on stage until the night before I gave birth because like a kid doesn't come with a wallet.
Guest:There's no maternity leave.
Guest:Like, you know what I mean?
Guest:There's no one's given me.
Guest:And I just didn't know I was, I was apparently, you know,
Guest:There was nobody to talk to.
Guest:That was the thing.
Guest:Like, I talked to a lot of these young girls.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they also saw me work till the end.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But when people go, oh, there's a lot of female comedians with kids.
Guest:Who?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Roseanne.
Guest:I don't have Roseanne money.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I don't have Joan Rivers money.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:I'm a monologist.
Guest:I'm not a television star.
Guest:I'm nothing, but all I have are these jokes.
Guest:These jokes are not going to allow me to, you know, if I would have thought, I'll tell you what, Kevin Nealon told me that it cost $30,000 to send his kid.
Guest:We were doing the talk together.
Marc:He had kid late too, right?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I think their kid is – I don't know if they have two now.
Guest:I can't remember.
Guest:But their baby was like two years older than my son.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I said, yeah, I don't know what I'm going to do.
Guest:I'm like five months pregnant and I'm hiding it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because thank God I was so L.A.
Guest:emaciated.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And –
Guest:You know, he goes, well, you know, preschool is like $30,000.
Guest:And I was like, yeah, I'm out.
Guest:I'm out.
Guest:I'll go live in the Midwest.
Guest:I'll catch a flight.
Guest:And there's just not... I can't do it.
Marc:That's weird.
Marc:How many... Are there... If I think about the comedians that do have kids, Laurie Kilmartin has a kid.
Marc:Bonnie has... She's got a kid.
Guest:Bonnie... Well, that was... Thank goodness.
Guest:Bonnie... But here's what...
Guest:So Bonnie had their daughter, Reina, who's friends with, like, I think my son should start like a club for kids of comics.
Marc:Geraldo's kids doing comedy?
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, we're just messed up.
Guest:It's different things.
Guest:That's all.
Guest:God bless.
Guest:That's got to be awesome.
Guest:I can't, I got to see him or help him or take him somewhere with me and he'll have a way better career.
Guest:All my openers are huge now.
Marc:Like, who'd you have open for you?
Marc:Nate.
Marc:Yeah, me too.
Guest:Of course.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, you show many people, Amy, let's see, Pete Davidson.
Guest:I apparently what you need to do is come open for me and then you can eclipse me completely.
Guest:That's what happens.
Marc:And we have to somehow frame it as like, well, you know, I influence them.
Marc:Like, you know, there's nothing you can do.
Marc:Like, Nate opened for me at Carnegie Hall.
Marc:And I knew I saw him first at the Grand Rapids Comedy Festival, you know, when he was still just he had just moved out of New York, I think.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And I just knew, like, you know, what is it?
Marc:Who is this guy?
Marc:He was just doing 10 minute sets on a new faces thing.
Marc:And I became obsessed with him.
Marc:And then he opened for me at Carnegie Hall and arguably had a better set than me.
Guest:See, it was so funny.
Guest:I love that you just say Carnegie Hall.
Guest:Like, isn't that, is there a time?
Guest:It was a big deal.
Guest:It is a big deal.
Marc:And, you know, it wasn't, like, and I wasn't even.
Guest:Who books that gig?
Marc:It was Louis Ferranda, of all people.
Guest:Stop!
Guest:I love Louis Ferranda.
Guest:Did he really book you?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:After decades of hating him for icing me at Catch a Rising Star in New York, he becomes the booker at the New York Comedy Festival and they offer me Carnegie Hall and my hour was not together.
Marc:It was not solid.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:But I could not do it.
Marc:So I ended up kind of rambling for two hours.
Marc:Nate does a tight 20 in front of me.
Marc:Kills.
Marc:But most of the people, I did what I do.
Marc:And it was an honor to do it, but I wish I was a little tighter.
Guest:Hard on myself.
Guest:Here's the thing.
Guest:You are hard on yourself because I just watched you literally out of...
Guest:You know, when we were at the TD Garden, which is so bizarre anyway.
Marc:And I'm like, I got to follow Bobby.
Guest:And Bobby, who crushed... But he crushed and hit everything that you're not... For him, it was an amazing set.
Guest:But as a comic, everything you don't want to follow is what Bobby did.
Marc:And it was so... I'm telling the story on stage now.
Marc:Because...
Marc:Well, here's the angle, is that, like, you know, we know people, and we've been doing this a long time, and we know arena acts.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:And there's some part of you that's sort of like, well, I guess that is the pinnacle of success, is to be in arena act.
Marc:So I do the whole story about, you know, following Bobby, and I know what he was going to do, and I don't know why they stuck me between Burr and Bobby.
Marc:It could have just went Bobby to Burr, but Burr didn't want to follow Bobby.
Marc:And I've been...
Marc:And I've been in that shit before.
Marc:I know Bobby.
Marc:I knew exactly what he was going to do.
Guest:He's a killer.
Guest:I love him.
Guest:It was all killers.
Guest:It was fine.
Marc:But I just knew it was going to be just, I'm going to be walking into a pool of filth.
Marc:And I don't mind that.
Marc:Again, no judgment, but I knew what I was up against.
Marc:And so I talk about it on stage saying I had a good set, but I did learn something that night.
Marc:I don't like doing arenas.
Guest:Well, let me tell you from my perspective.
Guest:First of all, I'll give you the compliment and then I'll give you the funny part.
Guest:The compliment was that you literally crushed it.
Guest:You took it, you put them on pause, and then you brought them to you.
Guest:That's the only way to do it.
Guest:It was amazing.
Guest:You addressed it.
Guest:You came up with a... I can't remember.
Guest:And then you paused it and brought it to you.
Guest:And it was amazing how you handled it.
Guest:And I have to say, like...
Guest:The success level, we talked about this a little bit, obviously, that you're at, a lot of people don't stay funny at that success level.
Guest:I'm not trying to be, you know, I'm not blowing smoke.
Guest:I'm just telling you the truth.
Guest:We've seen a million comics get to a certain level, and they're not still working on their craft.
Guest:You're still, like, strong, and it's new, and you're hitting it.
Guest:The funny part was, as we're watching Bobby Crush,
Guest:I'm seeing it come over you.
Guest:There's something that comics, it's so hard to explain, and I hate to sound so inside this thing.
Guest:No, that's fine.
Guest:But comics, you can just see, and it doesn't matter.
Guest:I mean, you could have been the one who invented the knock-knock joke.
Guest:The guy who invented the knock-knock joke literally probably sat in the back when somebody was doing that going, I can't believe it.
Guest:Like you could just see the demeanor because we have to have a certain umbrage, a certain confidence in order to do this anyway.
Guest:And you really got to work yourself up to be in front of 30,000 people.
Guest:Your ego has to be at a certain like someone.
Marc:You got to be fortified.
Marc:You got to, you know, you got, you know, you can't buckle.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And like, I know what you saw, you know, because I right when Leary that day told me the order and I said, I'm no diva.
Marc:And I said, why do I got to follow Bobby?
Guest:Right.
Guest:Of course.
Guest:But what are you going to do?
Guest:I mean, like, I can't follow.
Guest:Like, I couldn't have done it.
Marc:I went up to Burr and I said, why can't you just follow Bobby?
Guest:I don't want to follow Bobby.
Marc:But I don't know if they did that on purpose.
Marc:But the odd thing was.
Marc:You know, I had in my head because I started in Boston.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And I was a kid, you know, doing comedy in my early 20s in Boston.
Marc:I remember there was one night at Knicks, the original Knicks downtown when it was there was only one Knicks and it was all the Boston guys.
Marc:And I had to do a guest spot after Leary.
Marc:Like this is like Leary in 1989, 1990.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:OK.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And it's Nick's and it's his home turf.
Marc:And he goes up there and he just levels the place.
Marc:I'll never forget this.
Marc:And they bring me up to do my 10 minutes.
Marc:And I tried consciously to sort of jump on Larry's energy.
Marc:And I tanked so hard that I'll never forget it.
Marc:So there was some sort of full circle for this, you know, going up at the garden on Larry's show and just owning my own pace and doing it in, you know, having the confidence to do it and do what you said, turn it into my show.
Guest:Yeah, it was master class.
Guest:It was really, really good.
Marc:Well, thanks.
Marc:But it was sort of like satisfying because it was sort of like I finally, you know, I can let that bomb go.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's the truth.
Guest:It's so weird when those things happen.
Guest:Like I...
Guest:I used to, look, I came from the road.
Guest:When I got to L.A., I came from the road.
Guest:I started as an open miker, an emcee.
Guest:Where?
Guest:I worked Funny Bones Cleveland.
Guest:I worked Funny Bones as a house emcee.
Guest:Cleveland was the improv.
Guest:Then I worked to feature act.
Guest:I mean, I stayed in the condos I did for eight years before I ever moved to L.A.
Marc:Wait, so wait, where'd you grow up?
Guest:I grew up East Cleveland.
Marc:So when did you start doing comedy?
Guest:1994 was my official real year of comedy.
Marc:Did you know Bastille?
Guest:Frankie?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:I know Frankie Bastille.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, well, he passed away, right?
Guest:Yes.
Marc:And his girlfriend, Karen?
Guest:I knew everybody back then because comedy in Cleveland was so tight.
Guest:And it was really funny.
Guest:You had to prove yourself.
Guest:That's why, like, I had a real hard time when I first moved to L.A.
Guest:until I realized they couldn't take anything from me.
Guest:Like, I'm already a comic.
Guest:What are you going to do, not give me a show?
Marc:Well, that's the only way to come here.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You know, I came out here after college.
Marc:It almost killed me.
Marc:I had to go back to Boston.
Marc:I came out here when I was a kid, 22.
Marc:I got a job as a doorman at the store.
Marc:Got fucked up on drugs and left inside a year.
Marc:Went back to Boston and started.
Guest:And you got yourself back on your feet.
Guest:I had to literally go.
Marc:The first time.
Guest:Yeah, we all.
Guest:I mean, trust me.
Guest:So you grew up there?
Guest:I grew up there.
Guest:I started comedy.
Marc:Didn't you do other things?
Marc:No, not really.
Guest:Did you come from a big Italian family?
Guest:I came from a big Italian family.
Guest:How big?
Guest:Pretty extended big.
Guest:Not the immediate family.
Marc:So is there a dug-in Italian thing in Cleveland?
No.
Guest:Yeah, there was a little Italy where my grandparents lived.
Marc:Yeah, and they were like off the boat Italians?
Guest:They were off the boat.
Guest:And my mother and father were both first generation.
Guest:My mother was sick a lot.
Guest:Sicilian, full on.
Guest:And I would have to go stay with my grandparents.
Guest:So I became a little bit more...
Guest:uh you know less mitigation as they would say that and more italian and doing all those things that's the first thing i went to therapy for when i finally got sag insurance yeah i finally went to therapy to deprogram treat the italianism to get that out of my brain because it's a constant level of disrespect and what and looking around at what other people have and not focus it like it's a miserable culture
Guest:There's no mirth.
Guest:We're not jovial bon vivant.
Guest:We're just miserable people who are worried about what you're going to eat at the next meal and who's talking about you.
Marc:Not a lot of funny?
Guest:No, only at funerals.
Guest:That's the only time I ever really... And mocking funny, like on physical appearances and things like that, which thank God because now you can't heckle me.
Guest:That's it.
Guest:That's why you can't troll me.
Guest:I've been trolled since I was eight.
Marc:There's no...
Marc:Sebastian's a Midwestern Italian.
Guest:Chicago.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because it's close to where you come from, kind of.
Guest:Five hours.
Marc:Right.
Guest:But I mean, culturally.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah, definitely.
Guest:Same kind of thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:We had a little, there was a, now it's all gone.
Guest:It's sad because those, well, those people, the off the boat people are passed and the kids don't want to, and they tried to Americanize, but you know, they couldn't.
Marc:I know.
Marc:And there's no mob anymore, really.
Marc:It's,
Marc:Well, I don't know.
Guest:I don't even know what you speak.
Guest:I mean, let me just say that.
Marc:Not what he used to be.
Marc:That's all I'm saying.
Guest:My grandfather ended up in Cleveland because he went in to help fill in for Hoffa when Hoffa disappeared.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:So I don't, I'm not saying, I don't know.
Guest:Union guy.
Guest:We just had a lot of stuff you couldn't return back to stores.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Don't you learn quick on you couldn't take that back to Kmart.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But no, it wasn't.
Guest:So, but it was pretty normal.
Guest:I lived in a normal town.
Guest:I lived in, but I just had that constant, younger brothers, a lot of older cousins, all boys.
Guest:I was always like, you know, I mean, I was, I was in the smart classes, but I was captain of the cheerleaders, but I was more of a tomboy.
Guest:Like that's why comedy worked for me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I just never, I wasn't going to grow up and get married.
Guest:It just wasn't, that's what culturally the girls did.
Guest:You know, I went to school for fashion design and then I did an open mic based on a bet.
Marc:Where, Knicks?
Guest:No, I did that at, I was visiting, my folks had moved to Davenport, Iowa.
Guest:There was a place called the Funny Bone.
Guest:And I was in college and I was just hanging out for the summer with them.
Guest:Yeah, Iowa.
Guest:And my dad worked.
Guest:He was originally like a semi-professional football player and stuff.
Guest:But then he started working for an insurance company and blah, blah.
Guest:And I loved comedy.
Guest:I just did it.
Guest:It's so bizarre.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You used to watch it?
Guest:I used to watch it, consume it, hide it.
Guest:But I didn't know that women, it's so bizarre, I can't explain it to you.
Guest:It was literally like the day when the young girl says to the vampire in the movie, what are you?
Guest:Like it opened up, I saw a female comic come through the comedy club.
Marc:Do you remember?
Guest:I don't want to say her name because I don't know if she's still doing it.
Guest:And she's the reason I did it because I went home and said, oh, I think I'm as good as that.
Marc:Well, that's what we all do.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And my brother's in typical, no, you're not.
Guest:Let's all bet you.
Guest:And I was like, okay, I'll do it on open mic.
Guest:And then they hired me to do a radio station sidekick.
Marc:How was the open mic?
Guest:It was pretty good because I just talked about all this.
Guest:Everybody has a few of those stories.
Guest:Right?
Guest:Funny stories that you tell at parties.
Guest:That's why everybody thinks that they're funny.
Guest:The difference is a comic takes those stories and cultivates them and then fine-tunes them because strangers might not find you funny.
Guest:So I had this one thing.
Guest:Remember, this is the 90s, right?
Marc:What year?
Marc:94?
Guest:No, 94 is when I quit.
Guest:93 is my first open mic, right?
Guest:Okay, yeah.
Guest:I'm literally, you know, I'm a young girl.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm big breasted.
Guest:I have big nose, big eyes.
Guest:But, you know, and people, guys were really, you know, this is way before any of this stuff now.
Guest:And I'd be at a nightclub and people are those real.
Guest:And I used to say, don't you think if I'd had that kind of money, I'd have had my nose fixed first.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like and beat it out of me to not, I guess, to kind of soften that ridiculousness.
Guest:Right.
Yeah.
Guest:And so I just started on that line and told a couple of those silly stories and built it out and, and was dumb enough to not, you know, there's something beautiful when you don't have overhead.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh yeah.
Marc:Well, you don't give a fuck and yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like I'm not look right now.
Guest:That's my biggest problem is trying to figure out where I fit in.
Guest:I don't know that I'm doing comedy.
Guest:I'm not sure I'm in show business.
Marc:You know, who the hell like it's a weird thing now with show business.
Marc:You know, how do you like there's I was watching that thing you did with the women of a certain age thing.
Marc:But like that thing you did about, you know, there's too many generations still alive.
Marc:And I don't know if I ever looked at it like that, but it is kind of true.
Marc:What is the expectation?
Marc:If you didn't cultivate an audience that grows old with you, right?
Marc:Like most of my audience is around my age, maybe within a decade or two.
Marc:And there's some party that thinks like, what do I got all these old people for?
Marc:And you're like, because you're old.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And you should be grateful because, you know, a lot of the guys that we know, they got a bunch of kids on board and then they got old and those kids go have a life.
Marc:And then, you know, where are they?
Marc:They're not in the audience anymore.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, COVID scared me because I was like, it's going to kill my demographic.
Guest:I have nothing left.
Guest:We better get rid of this.
Guest:I'm like, it's really coming at me.
Guest:Look, I made a conscious decision years ago.
Guest:I used to only talk about being Italian.
Guest:I remember like I always – you were part of the alt thing.
Guest:I was always embarrassed to go down to like Largo and all those places because, you know, I came from –
Guest:Luna lounge in New York, but you were out here during the, I was out here during like, I'm talking about like the early 2000s.
Marc:To be honest with you though, it's a weird thing with me being associated with that because yeah, I was that, but I was just a, you know, a club comic that, that couldn't get over because I thought a certain way.
Marc:You know, I could, I started in clubs and the alternative thing for me was just a place to blow off steam.
Marc:And then I just had the time, right.
Marc:But to this day, when I do those kinds of spaces, I'm like, who the fuck are these people?
Marc:Are there any normal people here?
Marc:That's hysterical.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That's hysterical because from my perspective, like I just couldn't, there was no time for me to ever relax.
Guest:Everybody has like, first of all, I was making a living.
Guest:So every time you had to go out before, before last, I mean, I didn't do anything.
Guest:I did the tonight show in 2003.
Marc:You did it once.
Guest:I've done it about five times now, but at the first time, the first time I was ever on TV was 2003.
Guest:On Jay?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I even won a contest that was supposed to put you on some kind of something on Comedy Central and they just never gave it to me.
Guest:It was just like bizarre.
Guest:I never, I really, I'm writing a book called Death by Paper Cuts because I can't, I've had a million things that are just like near misses and
Marc:Well, that's, I mean, that's like me too.
Marc:I mean, and the one thing that stuck was something that I did out of desperation in my garage.
Guest:That's so amazing.
Marc:But like, you know, before that, it was like I was just looking down, you know, the barrel at a life of, you know, B rooms and, you know, unknown headliner status.
Guest:Well, that's, I literally sometimes see like people, some people know me and they come and I have a decent following.
Guest:And then there's always the people they drag along that are just like, huh?
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And I have never really – they did this study on this one show that almost took off on NBC for me.
Guest:And my demographic – You know how they figure out what's your cue.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And I sell half my tickets to men.
Guest:So I guess I've never done enough like, hey, ladies, you know.
Guest:But –
Guest:Everything I've done, I've been I'm the pop up VCR.
Guest:Like I was a female comic, but I didn't want to be a female comic.
Guest:I just wanted to be a comic.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Then I talked about being Italian because that's all I knew.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I wasn't married.
Guest:I didn't have kids.
Guest:I couldn't date.
Guest:I was going in clubs Tuesday through Sunday.
Guest:I was just trying not to get murdered by serial killers on Route 80.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I literally didn't have anything.
Guest:So then I stopped talking about being Italian and then the Italian thing hit.
Guest:So I'm pregnant.
Guest:I don't want to be seen as a mother.
Guest:I just have made bad choices the entire time.
Marc:You can't control cosmic timing.
Marc:It's not bad choices because at the time you were pregnant, you would have had to have fought for it and figured out a way to do it.
Marc:And there wasn't the outlets.
Marc:To do a pregnant special.
Marc:And if you weren't going to get support from a network, what the fuck were you going to do?
Guest:No, it was horrible.
Guest:And then, you know, look, he didn't choose this.
Guest:Like, I have enough.
Guest:I spent enough time in therapy and enough.
Guest:My son didn't choose show business.
Guest:I did.
Guest:Now, that's how I provide.
Guest:You know, my husband had had, you know, you know, my husband from the store a little bit, probably.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But like he had a stroke and we didn't.
Guest:So I have to take care of us.
Guest:So I have to be gone a lot.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But you know what?
Guest:I mean, that's it's an airport.
Guest:Everybody's got different different roles.
Marc:So what happens?
Marc:So you do the open mic and then what happens?
Marc:I mean, but yeah, I remember Luca a little bit, but he I think I kind of missed him at the store.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Luca Polanka, because he was there because like I was away and then I was back and, you know, people come and go.
Marc:And there's some people I just missed.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:How's he doing?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:He's doing great now.
Guest:It's good.
Guest:The right thing for me is that he gets it.
Guest:He's a great dad.
Guest:It's awesome.
Guest:Look, we live in western Pennsylvania.
Guest:It makes sense for our family because my kid is 15.
Guest:I just announced to everybody I'm leaving in three years.
Guest:When you go to college, mommy's out of here too.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Where are you going to go?
Guest:Probably like I'll probably just go like South Jersey, Bucks County, just because I'm going to listen with the boss of Florentine, Joey Diaz, I'm going to move right in that neighborhood because I'm going to have to work, Mark, probably until I forget my material.
Guest:There's just going to be a day where I stop working because I've forgotten.
Guest:And I won't have what beautiful Rodney had his wife with the earpiece at the end to repeat my material to me.
Guest:Is that what he did?
Guest:Yeah, it was so lovely.
Guest:One of the best gifts I was ever given is Dom.
Guest:I love Rodney.
Guest:I love Rodney.
Guest:And it's weird how I'm morphing into him because I feel like I'm so disrespected all the time.
Marc:Well, I think stylistically you can see that you love Rodney.
Marc:I love him too.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:You know, that's like one of the best compliments.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:i ever got there's a pace to it you know oh that's awesome um well what happened i also sell aluminum siding on the side as well um we were doing a show at the store whatever both of us and you and rodney no uh dom yeah dom i just talked to him yesterday did you talk to him i haven't talked to him since i've been out here this week i've i called him though he didn't call me back he called you back i see how it is yeah he just calls every once in a while and sings beetle songs
Guest:Oh, like the Yoko Ono phone at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame?
Guest:Maybe.
Guest:Did you ever see that?
Guest:The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Another Cleveland reference.
Guest:There's a white phone that has no numbers on it.
Guest:And it's just got like a VIP rope around it.
Guest:And it says, if this phone rings, answer it and talk to Yoko Ono about world peace.
Marc:It's so stupid.
Marc:No one answers that phone.
Guest:No one answers the phone.
Marc:So what happens with Rodney?
Guest:So I go home after our sets and I'm all the way on the side of the valley, which is far for people like it's a half hour or whatever.
Guest:And he calls me and says, come back.
Guest:Down goes, come back.
Guest:Come to Greenblatt's.
Guest:And I'm like, no, he goes, please just come back.
Guest:Come back.
Guest:I'm like, no, he's like, I'm drunk and I need a ride.
Guest:He's not drunk.
Guest:He doesn't need Rodney.
Guest:Rodney's doing a set.
Guest:I get to watch Rodney, and then we get to stay up, and Dom and I and Rodney and Dom's ex-fiancee, Sophie, sit there and eat until 6 o'clock in the morning, and I hear Rodney stories, and I sit there, you know, like a puppy dog.
Guest:It was such a great story that I couldn't tell a human being that I was with when I grew up because no one would believe you.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Marc:You just sit and listen to Rodney for hours?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I'm also with Dom.
Guest:Let's not forget who Dom was.
Guest:He's mediating.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah, sure.
Guest:The fact that I'm just this kid from a neighborhood who watched these specials on HBO.
Guest:And what I was saying to you is I just didn't know that women could do it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Women, when I was coming up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:weren't relatable to being a young girl like that.
Guest:They were talking about their husbands and their facelifts.
Guest:You know, which is probably where I should be right now.
Guest:I do talk about my husband.
Guest:I just need a facelift.
Marc:You just told me that one of your first jokes was basically a facelift joke.
Guest:Yeah, right?
Guest:Yeah, that's right.
Guest:Plastic surgery.
Guest:I need to do it.
Marc:Well, that must have been amazing.
Marc:I never got to really...
Marc:spend time with that guy.
Marc:He's one of the guys that I, you know, I saw him at the store once and it was a very odd night.
Marc:And it's a very bizarre thing with Rodney because I think for years he really didn't get the respect he deserved in a way.
Marc:You know, because I remember I was out in Aspen and they did one of those kind of roasts or a tribute to Rodney and they couldn't even get, you know, the five people on the dais didn't even seem to really know him that well.
Marc:And he was just one of those guys that didn't have that many friends.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You know, he was really kind of a loner and a depressive guy.
Marc:You talk to Richard Lewis about Rodney.
Marc:He knows a lot of Rodney.
Marc:And, you know, Rodney always used to talk about the heaviness.
Marc:Like he was a real depresso.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, you know, you have to fight that because this is not a meritocracy.
Guest:And, you know, I mean, look, I'm hitting 30 years next year.
Guest:I'm still the underdog.
Guest:I have a list of credits down my arm, but it doesn't matter.
Guest:Like, you know what I mean?
Guest:Right.
Marc:But the journey was like it's a real comic journey and you're out there doing it.
Marc:So after you do the open mics, what happens?
Guest:I get hired by – it was sponsored by a radio station.
Guest:They hire me to do the radio.
Marc:In Iowa?
Guest:In Illinois because it's the Quad Cities.
Marc:So it's a regional radio station?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And you're the – I'm the sidekick.
Guest:The laughing lady?
Guest:Yeah, right.
Guest:And then they ask me to do the news and I'm like I'm out.
Guest:I've done enough open mics.
Guest:I move back to Cleveland and then I start there.
Marc:How long did you do radio?
Guest:About a year and a half, two years.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Morning show?
Guest:Morning show.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:Started right there.
Guest:Everybody hated me.
Guest:It was horrible.
Marc:Six in the morning till 10.
Guest:Horrible, sleeping on.
Guest:But the only thing that was great is they still had jock lounges.
Guest:It was really WKRP.
Guest:It really was.
Guest:Yeah, of course.
Guest:And I felt horrible because all those people had went to broadcasting school and worked their way up from overnights and weekends.
Marc:But then you got to deal with the ego of the guy who drives the show.
Yeah.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Are you kidding me?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's a funny thing about regional radio at that time is these guys really thought they were bigger than anybody.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Because they had power, because people would bring them food in the morning.
Marc:You know, sponsors, you'd get to a radio station, there'd be like two boxes of donuts, a turkey dinner, and people hanging around.
Guest:I'm going to send you a picture.
Guest:Somehow we got to do the cover of some radio magazine.
Guest:I'm young.
Guest:When they do the live remotes and stuff, they're going to want the young girl.
Guest:Let's be honest.
Guest:The live remotes at 6 in the morning, right?
Guest:So I got a bunch of those live remotes or on weekends at the car dealerships.
Guest:Or the one time they sent me out to the haunted house and they really slaughtered a pig and I left and got in trouble.
Guest:It was like my live turkey thing from WKRP.
Guest:But they didn't tell me that they were doing the cover.
Guest:The guy that was my partner didn't tell me because he didn't want me on it.
Guest:So you'll see.
Guest:I'll send you the picture of the cover of this radio magazine.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They're all in their shirts, WPXR, and I'm in literally regular clothes.
Guest:I actually look like I'm in a Prince video because I have a pirate shirt and a vest, but whatever.
Marc:So is that guy still doing radio?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I really don't know.
Marc:So you quit radio, and then what happens?
Guest:I moved back to Cleveland.
Guest:They told me I could be the house emcee at the improv there.
Marc:But what's Nick's place?
Guest:That's Hilarity's.
Guest:And I'm also working at Hilarity's, too, because you didn't have to choose.
Guest:I'm young.
Guest:But the guy, Mitch Kutash, who owns the improv there, also was a partner in all of the Funny Bones.
Guest:With Stroop?
Guest:No, Stroop was a barback.
Guest:We started at the same time.
Marc:Isn't that his place now?
Marc:He has Columbus.
Marc:Yeah, just Columbus.
Marc:That's a good club.
Marc:It was.
Guest:They're all really nice clubs because they know how to do comedy.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And so, yeah, I just start.
Guest:I'm an open miker.
Guest:And then I become a house emcee.
Guest:And then I go as the emcee.
Marc:So you're hosting shows and people, big guys are coming through.
Guest:Big guys are coming through.
Guest:And thank goodness, then I'm trying to pick people's brains.
Guest:So when the time comes, guys like John Panett and Dom Irera took me on the road.
Guest:Eddie Brill took me a couple places.
Guest:There were people who were nice to me and took me places.
Guest:So that was good.
Guest:Then each step helped me a little bit more.
Marc:And you just build in the act until you can feature people.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then staying in the condos.
Guest:And that was rough.
Guest:That was the whole catalyst that I just started that podcast because of the Vince Champ.
Guest:Which one?
Guest:I just started one.
Guest:I don't even want to say it because people, you know, it's called The Cop and the Comedian.
Guest:My best friend is a cop.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we just started talking about how, like, she started being a cop, like, when I started comedy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:There's two male-driven industries.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like, whoa.
Guest:Whoa.
Guest:How we would choose something that was so innately hard before we even started is amazing.
Marc:What about Vince Champ?
Guest:I had to stay in a condo with him.
Guest:He was, you remember, you know.
Marc:He was a murderer.
Guest:A serial rapist.
Marc:Oh, yeah, that's right.
Marc:Serial rapist.
Marc:And we were a star search.
Marc:He what?
Guest:He won Star Search, though.
Guest:I didn't realize that.
Guest:Yes, that was the whole point.
Marc:That's how he got traction.
Marc:Because I remember I kind of opened for him or hosted for him in Albuquerque when I was starting out.
Marc:And, yeah, I mean, it's a horrendous story.
Guest:There's no power in it.
Guest:I mean, so I'm literally – these condo – what people don't understand is the condo system –
Guest:It sounds like comedy condo.
Guest:Dangerous.
Guest:You're picturing something.
Guest:It's literally like a flop house that no one's in charge of.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And sometimes it's so funny when a club opens and they get the condo and you go and you're like, this is pretty nice.
Marc:And then inside of a year and a half, you go back and you're like, what the fuck happened to this place?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, I used to work with Hedberg a lot.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:After the first time, let's say this.
Guest:After the first time, I never brought any clothes into the condo because my suitcase would always get stolen by the random people that he would bring in.
Guest:He was just such a big hearted guy, but there'd always be someone on the couch.
Marc:A big hearted drug addict.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Like there would always be.
Guest:And I like how many times am I going to get my entire suitcase stolen?
Guest:Like you have to grow up at some point.
Marc:By drug addicts that he dragged in off the street.
Guest:So, like, literally.
Guest:But these places would just be open.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:And for a woman, there's no safety in it.
Marc:I mean, for dudes, it was kind of part of the rite of passage.
Marc:But I imagine for a woman, it would be terrifying.
Guest:And a lot of the guys really looked out for me because I made a decision not to date any comics, at least until I got to Los Angeles.
Guest:Because, look, if I slept with one, there'd be no way to refute it with the other.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Right.
Guest:And...
Guest:Tuesday through Sunday, we were on the road.
Guest:So I didn't always go home.
Guest:I was staying in a condo.
Guest:Vince shows up.
Guest:It's a Monday.
Guest:I don't know him, but I know of him because I was well aware that he had won Star Search.
Guest:And he said, I'm staying here tonight.
Guest:And I was just a guest staying because I was going to go on.
Guest:I was in Omaha and I was going to go on to Des Moines.
Guest:I said, oh, hey, nice to meet you.
Guest:Didn't give me much.
Guest:I said, I'm going to go work out.
Guest:He said, I'm taking a nap.
Guest:I said, one more time.
Guest:I said, I'm going to a movie.
Guest:Because remember when they used to have free movies?
Marc:Deals at the movie theater.
Guest:So I would see everything possible for free because I didn't have any money.
Marc:Deals at the gym, deals at the movie theater, place you could eat.
Guest:Everything.
Guest:I used to eat on a dollar at Taco Bell for a dollar.
Guest:And then he said, I have a show.
Guest:Because he was doing the knack of the college circuit.
Marc:Right.
Marc:This is something I could never get into.
Guest:I never saw him again.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:I get up the next morning and I leave.
Guest:About a month and a half, two months later, I'm doing a show in Kansas City where the guy who offered to pay me in Coke instead of cash.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And I'm like, I'm such a rube.
Marc:I heard about that guy in Kansas City.
Guest:Yeah, I'm a rube.
Guest:I go, no, I like Pepsi.
Guest:I need my $150.
Guest:And he says to me, there's cops here to see you.
Guest:And I think he's joking because it was Sopranos time and everything was like, you know, whoppity whoppity.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:It's real cops and they take me down and interrogate me because they're like putting together that he has – Vince has had this timeline of raping women in all these gigs.
Guest:But they think –
Guest:I'm his girlfriend.
Guest:And that's how they lead off the thing.
Guest:They're like, your boyfriend is a rapist.
Guest:Now, I'm dating a guy in Cleveland who I know is something's janky about him, but I think he's cheating on me, which he was.
Guest:But they go, it's so not funny, but it's so three's company.
Guest:They're like, your boyfriend is a rapist, you know, like real hardcore.
Guest:And I'm like...
Guest:Oh, my God, he is.
Guest:I'm like, I knew something was wrong.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then they had to put it together.
Guest:They thought just because I was staying in a condo with him in a random city.
Marc:Really?
Guest:That I was his girlfriend.
Marc:Well, didn't they catch him because one of his victims heard him on the radio and recognized the voice?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think that there was all these things kind of all came.
Guest:There was a confluence of...
Guest:Early internet and like a really smart detective in Wisconsin putting it all together.
Guest:Because remember, the states didn't talk.
Guest:So I really gave them no information, but I had to, I did give them information.
Guest:They figured out how to track him better because the condos, that was untraceable.
Guest:It wasn't like a credit card at a hotel or something else.
Guest:They were able, and he had raped a girl the night that he stayed in the, that slept in the room next to me.
Marc:Because he was doing that.
Guest:He was playing a college in Lincoln, Nebraska, which was 30, 40 minutes away from Omaha.
Guest:And it was a game changer for me.
Guest:Like, I think that's the innocence dropped away.
Guest:I couldn't talk to people about it.
Guest:I was afraid to tell my parents because I was afraid they'd make me come home.
Marc:How old were you?
Guest:27.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:I think at that time, you know.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But and you can't complain about it, but it was just a real, you know.
Marc:And then you didn't stay in a condo after that.
Guest:I had to, but I had weapons.
Guest:I mean, I was a vigilante.
Guest:I was literally Bernard Goetz sitting in my room waiting for somebody to... But most comics, listen, we're quirky.
Guest:We're not criminal.
Marc:No, no, I know.
Marc:Yeah, we don't fit in.
Marc:That's why we do it.
Marc:And, you know, at certain... There's always weirdness at a condo.
Marc:And there were stories behind condos.
Marc:But, you know, most comics, because they're, you know, kind of weird...
Marc:You know, the life is the life.
Marc:So most comics just look at those condoms.
Marc:It's like fucking party zone.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And, you know, there was always those stories like don't eat anything in the fridge.
Guest:Oh, for sure.
Guest:Listen, don't eat anything in the fridge.
Guest:Don't ever use the shampoo or conditioner for sure.
Marc:Because apparently there was this like serial guy.
Marc:It used to be attributed to John Fox or somebody that would just jerk off into any possible jar of something.
Guest:Now, John Fox was a comic that was notoriously like a womanizer or gross, whatever.
Guest:But I worked with him for two weeks straight in Houston, Texas.
Guest:He was on his absolute best behavior.
Marc:He was just a weirdo.
Guest:He's a nice guy.
Guest:I ended up going to see him when he was in hospice before he died.
Guest:Like it was very, you know.
Marc:He got prostate cancer, right?
Guest:Yeah, it was sad.
Marc:Because I remember him.
Marc:He was this notorious fucking road guy.
Marc:Like the stories around John Fox, there were a couple of them that they were interchangeable stories.
Marc:You know, if it was like John Fox or Teddy Bergeron or whoever.
Guest:Oh, God, that's great.
Marc:Or Frankie, you know, Bastille, because I knew Frankie, you know, and Frankie was always kind of one step ahead of the law.
Marc:I met Frankie in Boston when I was there.
Marc:After I'd come back from here and he had just moved there because I didn't know why, but he didn't want his name in the paper.
Marc:He didn't want his name on the marquee because he was he was running from child support and the IRS.
Marc:Hysterical.
Marc:So this is outlaw who didn't want any publicity, but he still did comedy.
Marc:He's a guy who got maybe it was him I'm thinking of.
Marc:He got nailed on the radio for child support.
Guest:Yes, I think you're right.
Guest:I think you're right because they figured out where he was and served him.
Guest:Right, exactly.
Guest:That's the whole onus of this whole podcast is this crime and comedy.
Guest:Do you know the lunatic that just murdered Drew Carey's ex-fiance, this Gareth Pursehouse?
Guest:What?
Guest:Thought he was an open mic comic and had tried to get on at the store a bunch of times.
Marc:When did that happen?
Guest:He threw her off a balcony in 2020.
Marc:What the fuck?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Amy Hardwick, he just, I think he's getting sentenced this week, but they just convicted him.
Guest:But like people think that just because you're a lunatic doesn't mean you can be a comic.
Guest:Like comedy is an art, you know?
Marc:Well, it did attract a lot of people.
Marc:And back in the day, you know, when the only way you could get on stage was doing an open mic at a club and that there was a community of how it worked.
Marc:You know, you come up to the club or you hit the store, you get lunatics in there all the time.
Marc:And sometimes you're like, you know, you're not sure the degree of the lunacy.
Marc:And sometimes they become successful.
Guest:And you're like, I thought that guy was a nut.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:There was that guy at the store that used to run around every Sunday, Robert William Apervia.
Marc:He used to show up every night and do the last spot back in the day when I was a doorman there.
Marc:And he'd like do Carson monologues.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he literally was the first time I ever saw a tinfoil hat.
Guest:He was doing it way before it got popular.
Marc:But he was a harmless guy.
Guest:Nicest guy in the world.
Guest:I used to fight people over him.
Guest:Guys like that, it was neat for me to come to L.A.
Guest:When I finally came to L.A., barely get into split week headlining and I moved to L.A.
Guest:because then I'm finally like, okay, I think I can do that.
Guest:2001?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then I'm already in at the improv because they know that I'm... So I moved.
Guest:I was able to do that.
Marc:You got referred.
Marc:People knew you.
Guest:Well, they knew me because of all the improv work I had been doing around the country.
Guest:And I didn't just jump up here.
Guest:I kept coming for like months at a time.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Pilot season and shit.
Guest:Pilot season that no one would ever send me out on.
Guest:But, you know, look, it was easier...
Guest:Acting seemed easier than comedy because comedy back then, you had to have two VCRs and create a tape, and then you had to split a Bible.
Guest:They had a comedy Bible.
Guest:It's not like now the internet where you send a clip.
Guest:You had to figure out where the place were and mail the whole thing.
Marc:It was a mess.
Marc:There's a clip of you on YouTube of your Tonight Show that it's backwards.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, well, that's because they keep pulling it down.
Guest:They keep pulling it down.
Guest:I'm like, I need to put this up here.
Guest:I have to remind myself sometimes.
Guest:So you did that on purpose?
Guest:Do you really want to know why I put it up there?
Guest:Because my son was fascinated with Spider-Man.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Fascinated.
Guest:Right.
Guest:He's 15 now, right?
Guest:So we're talking about pre-Tom Holland.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it's the Tobey Maguire Spider-Man.
Marc:Yeah, the first one.
Guest:And he's...
Guest:He's acting up.
Guest:He's probably about four years old.
Guest:I'm like, you better knock it off.
Guest:And he's like, because he's climbing the walls, literally getting between the door jams and climbing.
Guest:But he'd do it at other people's houses.
Guest:And I'm like, you know, I'm going to call Spider-Man.
Guest:And he totally doubles down on me.
Guest:He goes, you don't know Spider-Man.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I go, really?
Guest:I go, look at this.
Guest:And I play the Tonight Show because Toby was the guest.
Guest:I go, I'm going to call Peter Parker right now.
Guest:And I just totally blew his mind.
Guest:And then he was like telling all his friends, my mom knows Spider-Man.
Guest:So that was the whole point of me really putting it up there is to just make sure that he behaved.
Marc:So you did it on purpose backwards so they wouldn't be able to tag it.
Guest:Yeah, so they don't pull it down.
Guest:Right now, I can't even – I've been putting up some clips from this.
Guest:I did a half-hour special on Comedy Central years ago.
Guest:And I go to put it up and I got tagged.
Guest:That's why I called Dom because Paramount is saying it's Dom Irera.
Guest:I'm like, this is me.
Guest:Like, it's not.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I go, are all Italians the same?
Marc:Well, you were on the same episode?
Guest:No, nothing.
Guest:Not even anything.
Guest:I'll show you the emails.
Guest:For some reason, they've just tagged me as Dom Irera.
Guest:So I guess I'm morphing into an old man in my age.
Marc:No.
Marc:So what happens when you come out here the first time to live?
Guest:I started the improv.
Guest:I'm trying to go out on the road and do stuff.
Marc:As a headliner.
Guest:As a headliner.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I'm hanging out at Rick Messina's house, a comedy manager.
Guest:That's a boys club.
Guest:Boys club watching football.
Guest:But I was one of the only girls that was allowed there because I love football.
Marc:It's a weird group of girls that kind of hung out.
Marc:Chris Garofalo was with him then, right?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I didn't see Jeanine there a lot of Sundays.
Guest:I just wanted to watch football.
Marc:It was kind of a crazy crew.
Marc:Like that original Messina Baker Miller roster was pretty big.
Marc:And he was like, he always had those massive parties.
Marc:So it was like Norm and people who was it like hanging out?
Guest:Rocky Lepore.
Guest:Just regular, just regular.
Guest:Drew would be there.
Guest:We're just watching football Sundays.
Guest:I wasn't there at the crazy parties or anything.
Guest:And we're sitting there watching a game, and he gets a phone call.
Guest:And then he comes back, and he goes to me, you got to go.
Guest:Now, I've been around enough guys.
Guest:Listen, I've heard more locker room talk than most women could handle.
Guest:They probably have nervous breakdowns.
Guest:I figured something's, you know, whatever.
Guest:I mean, I also lived in a stripper colony, which saved my life.
Guest:I didn't know those existed.
Guest:A stripper colony?
Guest:I would love to do a show about that because these—
Guest:Probably.
Guest:They were all in different stages, me and this young attorney.
Guest:And then the other six apartments were occupied by strippers in various stages of their careers.
Guest:This is in the Valley?
Guest:No, at this time, by the time I lived with them, it was over in Beverly, right by the studios over there.
Guest:But they, by far, behind the dime.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And...
Guest:There was a Magda who used to... You know the old people that you never want to see naked?
Guest:They're the ones who always want to be naked.
Guest:She would have her tits out to go get the mail.
Guest:Like, oh, sorry, I didn't know anybody was here.
Guest:And she'd go strip in Henderson.
Guest:There was the one who...
Guest:I'm like moving in, carrying my boxes and she shows up.
Guest:She's gorgeous.
Guest:Looks like Pamela Anderson.
Guest:And she's not paying attention to me at all.
Guest:She gets dropped off by this limo.
Guest:I'm struggling.
Guest:She won't even hold the door.
Guest:I'm like this in my brain.
Guest:I'm like this bitch.
Guest:And all of a sudden her boyfriend shows up and she like, I don't, I have to put this together later, but this guy shows up who I find out is her boyfriend and she's, she goes, Oh, I'm helping her move.
Guest:And she walks in and she puts her suitcase in my house and
Guest:And she goes, I'm going to go with him for a little bit if that's okay.
Guest:And I'm like, yeah, but okay.
Guest:I mean, I'd seen enough crazy girlfriends show up that I knew how to cover.
Guest:She comes back later.
Guest:She opens up.
Guest:It's all cash.
Guest:Like she had just come back from Dubai with some shake, but she didn't want her boyfriend to know.
Guest:So she was that one.
Guest:There was another one that was like the environmental stripper.
Guest:She used to ride to work.
Guest:And remember those old electric, they look like golf carts.
Guest:But she had like giant G breasts, like Morgana, the kissing bandit.
Guest:And she would get out and collect trash along the way.
Guest:I go, you're going to fall over.
Guest:Like no one's going to be able...
Guest:One collected animals.
Guest:She was gorgeous, but guys would run out like they had fleas because she had flying birds.
Guest:But those women were off on Mondays, comics and strippers, right?
Guest:Right.
Guest:And they kind of softened me and taught me how to – I didn't know how to flirt.
Guest:I'd been with all boys.
Guest:I had to really have a shell on the road and stuff.
Guest:So I never – I had no softness.
Guest:I had no awareness.
Guest:Like a lot of women in comedy – a lot of women in show business are talented.
Guest:And then some of them also know how to –
Guest:make people, you know, they make men feel like they're on the precipice of a blowjob.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they get, I mean, that's the truth, right?
Guest:Let's be honest.
Marc:Well, it's better to stay on the precipice than, you know, do the blowjob.
Guest:That's the trick?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:It's just the precipice of a blowjob.
Guest:It's not the full on, right?
Guest:And I was always like, yeah, get the fuck out of here.
Guest:Like, you know what I mean?
Yeah.
Guest:They softened me, but I don't even know what I was telling you.
Guest:Rick told me to go down.
Guest:He goes, you got to go.
Guest:And he wanted me to go.
Guest:Mitzi had called.
Guest:She needed a woman for Night of a Thousand Guidos.
Guest:So remember those nights?
Guest:So I went down to audition that night.
Guest:Joey was the host, Joey Diaz.
Guest:She didn't show up.
Marc:What year is this?
Guest:2001 yeah and it was like four months i was in here and uh then the next week she showed up she passed me and then she was she was like my my sweetheart like she really looked out for me yeah she and i'm like i'm a student of this game i love this game yeah there's a whole
Guest:I love the old guard.
Guest:I love that.
Guest:Yeah, me too.
Guest:And I make everybody tell me stories, and I would just sit, and we would sit in the film room at the store, and I'd make her play all those things.
Guest:Yeah, and I loved it, too, because the store is Ciros.
Marc:Totally.
Marc:And now, have you been over there lately?
Guest:I'm going tonight.
Marc:Oh, tonight I'm doing a smaller show.
Marc:I was there last night, but Peter, who's running it,
Marc:It's great because when you walk into that, the doorway of the main room, right when you walk into the glass doors in the front, in the main room, there's a wall of Ciro's pictures.
Guest:I love it.
Guest:I can't wait to see it.
Guest:I think I did see it in the main room.
Guest:You know, it was, that was my home.
Guest:I remember it was such a family.
Guest:Like we even went there the night of September 11th and just all sat there and it became attainable.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I lived in Cresto.
Marc:You know, I lived when I was a doorman.
Guest:Yeah, I used to see you all the time.
Marc:You did?
Guest:At the store.
Guest:But, you know, I'm not one who puts myself in front of people.
Guest:Like, we'd be on the same line.
Marc:Like 2002 when I came back.
Guest:Yeah, two, three, four.
Marc:When Tommy was there.
Guest:Yeah, Tommy.
Guest:We have the same birthday.
Guest:And he used to go, we're birthday buddies.
Guest:I'm like, don't tell anybody that.
Guest:Don't tell anybody.
Marc:I didn't realize that you had that relationship with the store at that time because that was like the darkest time, really.
Guest:Which is why I never get called for any of the other stuff.
Guest:If you look at the Joe video when he and Carlos got into it, I'm kind of standing right there trying to stop it.
Guest:It was all...
Guest:It was hard—we were really a family back then because there was nothing— Who were the people at that time?
Guest:You and Diaz and— So it's me and Joey and Rogan and Brett Ernst and Sebastian and Caparulo and Ahmed and Maz Jobrani and Bobby Lee.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, and we just—you know, it was really—I'm trying to think—
Guest:Of course, Argus is always there, who I loved to talk to Argus.
Guest:And Holtzman, of course, on the weekends.
Guest:Yeah, they're all around.
Marc:I mean, they're always— Well, I mean, the Rogan crew's gone.
Marc:Do you do his show?
Guest:I haven't been down there.
Guest:No.
Marc:All right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, I would, but I love those guys.
Marc:That would give you some juice?
Guest:Yeah, probably.
Marc:Why doesn't he put you on?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:Call somebody, Mark.
Guest:Because why would it make sense?
Guest:Why should this career get easier for me at this point in my life?
Marc:But he loves talking about the store and stuff.
Marc:It just feels like, you know, if...
Marc:You know, this show will introduce you to a lot of people.
Marc:But it seems like if Joe and you can sit around and tell comedy store stories, that would probably help you out.
Guest:He helped me at a time that was most important because I had gotten caught up in a controversy that was just my big mouth.
Guest:What was that?
Guest:So I think you even had a comment on it.
Guest:Like when Amy was coming up.
Marc:I think you were mad at me, weren't you?
Guest:I was mad at you.
Guest:I was mad at me.
Guest:I was mad at me because I know that I should... For a while, it felt like, and I'm just going to tell you my position on it, that every time I would turn around and see... And Amy Schumer had been an opening act for me and a bunch of people.
Guest:It seemed like the material was familiar.
Guest:I also am not such a hard line to think that...
Guest:I'm a genius or I'm having something that is only mine.
Guest:We are third generation comic.
Marc:No, exactly.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I know that things sit, there are things that come out of my brain fully formed and functional that I have to call six comics before and go, have you, I'm going to start now calling you just so you know, because I'm going to, I want to know that it, I don't, plus I don't know if I was drinking.
Guest:I don't know if I heard it when I was 12.
Marc:The nature of my act though, I, all I call is like Stan Hope.
Marc:And because I, you know, I do long form and sometimes they're weird.
Marc:And I'm like, anybody,
Marc:You heard this?
Guest:Well, now I started writing it post this whole thing.
Guest:It had to really happen to me.
Guest:It had to really, really, really, really happen.
Guest:And I just write all my jokes as if we're all old friends and I just haven't seen you for a long time.
Guest:And I think that's what changed it for me.
Guest:It was a good point.
Guest:So there had been some situations.
Guest:I had just...
Guest:To be fair, I was on edge over comics materials because what did I tell you?
Guest:I love this game.
Guest:Mitzi put that in my head.
Guest:I'm a keeper of the flame of stand-up.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:There was a company that was online...
Guest:That was taken comics jokes and writing them in what they called greeting cards.
Guest:Now we're talking about 2016 charging a membership to people at like two or three bucks that you could download greeting cards.
Guest:And they would have millions of quotes on there.
Guest:And if it was a, you know, if it was a Henry David Thoreau quote, they would quote him.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But as a comic, they wouldn't quote you.
Guest:So if you're going to put a comic's quote up and you're charging money, you're either going to pay me or you're going to quote me for your millions of people.
Guest:So I had taken $10,000 out of my own money because I had reached out to them and said, this is so-and-so's quote.
Guest:This is so-and-so's joke.
Guest:This is my joke.
Guest:And I had...
Guest:I had forced them.
Guest:They said, forget you.
Guest:Prove it.
Guest:So then I had hired an attorney and forced them to – they actually ended up closing down because they would owe too many people.
Guest:So I'm really – You set a precedent.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I'm also very adamant over whose material is whose now.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:You know when you're on that thing.
Guest:So Wendy Liebman had said she went on.
Guest:Well, she had went on Twitter and said something about the joke.
Guest:And we had all been talking about this behind the scenes a little bit about Amy about that.
Guest:This is familiar.
Guest:And I had reached out and the first time and said, hey, it was a call and I got a huge apology.
Guest:And I go, it's not a big deal.
Guest:We all do it.
Guest:Then tried – saw another thing.
Guest:I sent an email.
Guest:The email came back.
Guest:To Amy.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Then I can't reach anybody.
Guest:Then I got blocked.
Guest:And then I was like, okay, then maybe this isn't – because I just assume you get that big – maybe someone's writing and lifting and you don't know that.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Or maybe it's sitting – because the material is so old.
Guest:You know when our act is – it's from the time that you're opening for me.
Marc:And also like when I got into the fray of that, it was just the fact that was –
Marc:My point of view on it was, from what I could tell, a lot of the jokes were not that specific.
Guest:Correct.
Marc:And the fact is, is that, you know, Schumer, as a funny person, is real.
Guest:She really is funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I'll say that, listen, I think she probably hates me and she's entitled to feel that way.
Guest:I ended up losing my agent, my manager, Giggs, because... You fought the fight?
Yeah.
Guest:Well, no, I think I was fourth on.
Guest:I was the easiest target.
Guest:I was up against, you know, U2's publicist.
Guest:Like she has a huge machine and you know that that like that was the early.
Marc:So she you thought that she, you know, counteracted the group of women that were accusing her.
Guest:Well, what happened really was is Wendy said something and Kathleen said, then another guy said something and then Kathleen said something.
Guest:Then I said, hey, we love you.
Guest:We want you to do well.
Guest:Just do it with your own material.
Guest:This is a tweet, right?
Guest:No one hears it.
Guest:They read it.
Guest:I'm an idiot because I should know that they read it in the crazy voice in their head.
Guest:And they take it as jealousy, which I had to abdicate.
Guest:I just told you, I'm not a girl.
Guest:Jealousy is for, like, chick.
Guest:Like, I am a comic.
Guest:I never tried to be a female comic.
Guest:I was trying to be a comic.
Guest:Like, toxic masculinity, I bring it.
Guest:It doesn't hit, right, you know?
Guest:But what I did that was wrong, Mark, was I tried to make a joke.
Guest:I said...
Guest:Before me too, before everybody gets crazy.
Guest:I said, at least Cosby knocked his victims out before he raped them, which was a hysterical joke.
Guest:It's hysterical.
Guest:But then Cosby goes to sue me because he's not convicted yet.
Guest:Uh, everybody, they, they label me as dangerous.
Guest:Lena Dunham is coming out against me, calling me dangerous and their women are protesting my show saying I'm horrible for women.
Guest:Uh, theaters canceled me cause they were afraid of the protest.
Guest:I mean, I literally lost every, and the worst part was, is someone, cause you know, I had no idea.
Guest:Someone published.
Guest:And then I kept quiet because I could have.
Guest:Everybody wanted me on.
Guest:Everybody wanted me.
Guest:I didn't say anything.
Marc:Oh, to do the shows.
Guest:Yeah, I didn't say anything until, well, they put my kid's number or my kid's school address.
Marc:They doxed your kid?
Guest:Well, he was five or six years old.
Guest:They put his school address online.
Guest:And then some, you know, TMZ hires whoever's local.
Guest:Some reporter from TMZ, I get a call from the school going, hey, someone's here to pick up your kid.
Guest:And I'm like, what?
Guest:So they know that I'm going to come down.
Guest:They know that I'm going to come down.
Guest:And then they try to make you say it.
Guest:And I say, hey, I'm sorry I got involved.
Guest:And then I ended up saying it at the time it was Opie and Jim.
Guest:I should have just kept my mouth shut and was in the back of the room with everybody else.
Guest:And then that was switched to comedian apologizes.
Guest:So it really upset me.
Guest:Because it wasn't personal.
Guest:Maybe you get now how these are my tools.
Guest:Like this is, you know.
Marc:But most of it was around the joke.
Marc:It was.
Marc:The Cosby joke.
Guest:Well, I got canceled for a lot of that.
Guest:And then, yeah, they all came against me.
Guest:The women did.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:And then it just started in earnest with three or four female comics.
Guest:Who had set the precedent for the...
Guest:Other doors.
Marc:All the meatheads ran with it, too.
Guest:Well, here's what's horrible is that it went from three female comics accuser to just me, to Pescatelli, then to me apologizing.
Guest:And then I only knew what we knew.
Guest:Then it became then there's videos with hours and hours of stuff that I was not aware of.
Guest:No, yes.
Marc:They totally went after her.
Marc:The whole kind of like, you know, sort of end cell nerd world.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:The hate nerds went after her big time because women don't have it easy in any way.
Marc:No.
Marc:None of you.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And like when I it was weird because I had Amy on years ago and I had a joke.
Marc:I watched her special.
Marc:It was I don't remember which one of mine it was.
Marc:And they came out around the same time.
Marc:And we had a similar action.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:In the special.
Marc:It was like walking with cum on you.
Marc:It was very specific.
Marc:But but I told her I said, you know, I didn't see you.
Marc:Of course.
Marc:And then whatever.
Marc:And she said to me, she said, yeah, but they'll blame me for it.
Guest:Oh, interesting.
Marc:And they did.
Guest:Well, Greg Warren and I, a very funny comic, came up parallel.
Guest:We had something very similar.
Guest:You could never do these jokes now, but it's a true story.
Guest:He used to pretend to be deaf.
Guest:He used to pretend to be slow.
Guest:They weren't the same, but they were the same characters.
Guest:The problem lied in, and a friend of mine who is an Academy Award winning script writer said, there are thousands of books on dinosaurs.
Guest:Nothing new has been discovered really in the past 200 years.
Guest:But when you go to the library –
Guest:Those books, there's not a sentence that is exactly the same.
Guest:The sentence structure with just a word change.
Guest:That's where you create problems.
Guest:And when things are kind of the same, look, it is what it is.
Marc:This all happened after Last Comic Standing?
Guest:2016, yeah.
Marc:Oh, so this is like you're well into a career, and this was this—
Guest:thing that kind of hobbled you crushed me crushed me I lost everything I literally had to go back and call the clubs and and give my avails and start thank God I had that structure though to be able to go back you know nobody touched me I lost a development deal I lost everything it was really crazy because you become what I had worked so hard to not complain and be a diva and a bitch
Guest:then got attributed to me and it was unfortunate not just for me because look i put myself in that situation i learned a lot like now literally sure to take it my kid you can pretty much take anything i got i'll just write something else but um i just learned a lot i think that's why a lot of these kids do crowd work because then it doesn't get up on the internet you know also i don't post anything that i haven't already done huh
Marc:Well, that's interesting, the crowd work thing.
Marc:Well, I also think that now there's a generation of kids that have no point of view, no necessary talent, but can tell a joke.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And do a crowd work.
Guest:But they don't care.
Guest:Nobody wants to do a special with me.
Guest:And I don't even know if a special would change anything right now.
Marc:So you think you still got stink on you from that thing?
Guest:I think what it did is it pushed me way down into the smaller font.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Like, you know?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think it really – yeah, I think it – I mean, look, I know that it did.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because it pitted – and it was really the opposite of what I'd ever wanted –
Guest:Because I always loved to see women do well.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know, right.
Marc:I love to see women do well.
Marc:But it morphed into a different thing.
Marc:It sounds like most of it, like outside of the Amy thing, whoever was accusing Amy, whether they pulled away or not, that once you did that one joke, then it got the momentum.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And they like having no clue.
Marc:It wasn't even about the Schumer thing.
Guest:No.
Guest:And then for her, too, by the way, like, I can't speak to it.
Guest:I sound like a big narcissist only talk, but that's all I know.
Guest:But for her, too, it went further than it should have been.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:I think for her, that's a horrible thing for it.
Marc:So here you are.
Marc:You have this amazing arc.
Guest:But she's got money and I don't.
Marc:Right.
Okay.
Marc:But you got the success from last comic standing.
Marc:You got the visibility.
Marc:You're doing well.
Marc:And this thing just kind of like, you know, takes your legs out from under you.
Marc:2016.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So now it's like a full on rebuilding arc.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then, you know, when you get death threats and all you're trying to do is tell jokes.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That's weird.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's weird.
Guest:Like.
Marc:And everybody can get at you now.
Marc:You're just accessible because of the nature of the way social media works and the way that the internet works.
Marc:It's like if somebody wants to get to you, they can.
Guest:By the way, that's why I had for a very short amount of time I had a show on WeTV prior to this, 2011.
Guest:The reality show with the husband.
Guest:It was so cute.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just because it's my family.
Guest:It was cute.
Guest:It was a hybrid.
Marc:It was called Comedy Mom.
Guest:What was it called?
Guest:I don't even know my own show.
Guest:One, Stand Up Mother.
Marc:Yeah, Stand Up Mother.
Guest:It was a hybrid reality.
Guest:We reenacted stuff.
Guest:It was really cute.
Guest:But it was about being a wife, a mother, and a comedian, leaving LA, living in a small town around this crazy family.
Guest:But I really lived in a small town.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I had enough...
Guest:fame or notoriety or juice to have a show right for people to know but not enough to live in a house that had security and gated commuting sure so one day i'm literally doing whatever i'm doing around the house and the doorbell rings and it's this neighbor well-meaning neighbor but she shows up with these people and go hey i just ran into these people at the gas station they said hey do you know tammy pescatelli she lives around here and i was like come on let's meet her yeah and i
Guest:At the time, my kid was like three.
Guest:I'm like, yeah, this can't do this.
Guest:I can't expose him to all the whack jobs in the world.
Guest:I can just know exactly where I live.
Marc:If you buy your house in your name, it's on record.
Guest:Forever.
Marc:It's terrifying.
Guest:It is terrifying.
Guest:And the other thing is people print how much money they think you make.
Guest:No one ever counts your bills.
Marc:No, it's all speculation.
Guest:No one ever counts any of that.
Guest:So there's always, you know, it just became a really weird thing where I constantly,
Guest:Funny is my life, but it had to become secondary to making sure my kid is, you know, I had a long conversation with Pauly when I was pregnant.
Guest:And he was telling me, oh, it's great.
Guest:I'll bring the little guy up and we'll look at the holes like Sam used to tell me and we'll watch you on stage.
Guest:And I was like, yeah, no, we're leaving.
Guest:That's exactly why.
Guest:I love you.
Guest:My kid calls him Uncle Pauly, but we're leaving.
Marc:Yeah, of course.
Marc:Well, I mean, but you're working now.
Guest:Yeah, always.
Guest:I never, that's, look, once you're funny and you've put that base in and I put, it doesn't, now, is it to 175?
Guest:Is it 400 people?
Guest:What had happened was that was the year that I was really going to switch into small theaters.
Guest:2020 was the year that I was getting it all back.
Guest:And then COVID.
Guest:COVID.
Guest:Small theaters.
Guest:Maybe this year I did a couple movies and a little thing, and maybe this will be the year that we go back and move it a little bit.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, like, are you making the rounds with the podcast and stuff?
Guest:No, this is really my first time doing it because I don't, you know, Mark, you brought it up.
Guest:I would never have brought it up to you.
Guest:What?
Guest:You said, come on, let's do the podcast.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right?
Guest:I would never have said, hey, let me come do your podcast.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I just,
Guest:I don't know how to... I'm not an extreme marketer.
Guest:Do you know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah, me neither.
Guest:I'm literally that comic at the back of the table.
Marc:But this is a weird thing for me because, you know, me and Joe are in different worlds.
Marc:And I wouldn't say that we get along.
Marc:I've taken shots at him here and there for whatever reasons I have.
Marc:But, you know, as a comedian, you know, I think that your story and your past with him, I think that if you did his show in terms of his connection with a certain audience, that it would be a good thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, here's the thing.
Guest:I was scheduled to do his show.
Guest:They were still in L.A.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Just by happenstance the week after all this went down.
Guest:We had a conversation that it probably wasn't good timing because I wasn't going to try to capitulate on someone's pain.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You want to.
Guest:That's not that was really not the narrative was taken way far out of context.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I know what I said, and I own what I said.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:But he did talk me through it because he had went through the exact same thing with Carlos.
Guest:The Carlos, yeah.
Guest:So he was very helpful.
Guest:It was so painful that I ended up calling Steve Renazzisi.
Guest:Do you know who Steve Renazzisi is?
Guest:Sure, of course.
Guest:Remember him?
Guest:He was part of my group at the store.
Guest:But I talked to Steve.
Guest:Steve had lied about 9-11.
Guest:I know.
Guest:So that's how bad it was.
Guest:I was like, how did you survive that controversy?
Marc:Wow.
Marc:Well, I mean, it's different because he had lied about 9-11.
Marc:Yeah, I get it.
Marc:And in that, you know, your controversy is around a joke.
Marc:I mean, he's still the guy that claimed to be in the building.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, that's true.
Guest:I don't know.
Marc:But I understand the discomfort of and yeah, it's something we're all afraid of for one reason or another that, you know, that somehow or another something's just going to get viral and taken out of context and you're going to be fucked.
Guest:And.
Guest:I guess the thing for me is I always worked hard to be respected on my merits or lack thereof, whatever it is.
Guest:And to get kicked out, you don't want to be kicked out of our community.
Guest:Like, it's very hard.
Guest:Coming up as a woman at that time, there were 20 of us.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:20.
Marc:But do you feel like the comics have pushed you out?
Guest:No, no, but I also think that it was a mental thing, too, because don't forget, I'm not in L.A.
Guest:where I can stop.
Guest:It became bigger in my head because, again, I'm still neurotic.
Guest:I'm still whatever it is.
Marc:Well, it is big because it's not in reality.
Marc:It's all happening on Twitter.
Marc:It's all happening.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And, like, you're just living your life, and you're just, you know, at the store or whatever.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And this is all, and you have no control over this wildfire.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So it's different.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I just never wanted to be seen as like a hate.
Guest:Look, it is what it is.
Guest:You know, it's all part of it.
Guest:I think all those things help you to grow.
Guest:If you get through it.
Guest:If you get through it.
Guest:And I think, you know, who knows?
Guest:That's why I worry about so many.
Guest:Social media is such the devil.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It's kind of taking a hit.
Marc:It seems like Twitter is kind of.
Marc:on its last legs and, but you know, it's just the culture we live in.
Guest:Well, it's a whole generation that doesn't know how to exist without it.
Guest:I was pretty proud of my kid.
Guest:You saw him there.
Guest:He posted one picture from that night on his social media, just him and Pete Davidson.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Cause you know, that's, and, uh, and like he goes, I deleted my account and I go, you did?
Guest:And he goes, yeah, I just don't want people to talk to me because of you.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Thanks.
Yeah.
Guest:I'm like, that's what you're supposed to do.
Guest:What's wrong?
Marc:Well, I'm glad that you're still at it.
Marc:I'm glad we talked.
Guest:I love this.
Guest:You have to let me take you to dinner next time in town, and let's just talk and talk about Mitzi.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Nice to see you.
Guest:It's so good to see you.
Marc:Thanks for doing it.
Marc:There you go.
Marc:Wow, that was good.
Marc:Tammy's tour, her 2024 tour dates are up at pescatelli.com.
Marc:Hang out for a minute.
Marc:On Thursday's show, I talk with Blitz Bazawouli, director of the new musical The Color Purple.
Marc:Back in October of 2021, I talked to one of the stars of that movie, Taraji P. Henson.
Marc:I love her.
Guest:We are built to be strong.
Guest:A wall and a building is built to be strong.
Marc:Also, sometimes strength is just defensiveness.
Marc:Strength.
Guest:Strength is just being vulnerable.
Guest:Strength is being your truth, being honest enough to say, this doesn't feel good.
Guest:I don't feel good.
Guest:You don't make me feel good.
Guest:What you said triggered me.
Guest:But if you're always standing with your guards up and strong, strong, strong,
Marc:that's gonna break you're gonna break down eventually that's how nervous breakdowns happen because you hit a wall with the coping mechanism yeah or you just sort of like you know you give up yeah yeah you get tired of holding trying to be strong you're not a building you're not the empire state building yeah but that's also the thing you said earlier in relation to something else that like i'm 58 i just turned 58 and i like i give a lot less fucks
Guest:Let me tell you, they're all behind me now.
Marc:All the fucks?
Guest:All of them.
Guest:All the fucks I had are behind me now.
Marc:Well, congratulations.
Guest:Yeah, I can't help you.
Guest:I literally would say, no.
Guest:No explanation.
Guest:No, I can't do it.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I don't want to.
Guest:Feels good, right?
Guest:It feels great.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Marc:That's episode 1269 with Taraji P. Henson.
Marc:And you can listen to that right now for free in whatever podcast app you're using.
Marc:If you want every episode of WTF ad free plus bonus episodes twice a week, sign up for WTF plus by going to the link in the episode description or go to WTF pod.com and click on WTF plus.
Marc:Here's some guitar, some aggravated blues playing.
guitar solo
Guest:guitar solo
guitar solo
guitar solo
Marc:Boomer lives.
Marc:Monkey and La Fonda.
Marc:Cat angels everywhere.