Episode 1305 - Ana Gasteyer
Guest:Lock the gates!
Marc:All right, let's do this.
Marc:How are you?
Marc:What the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fuck Knicks?
Marc:What's happening?
Marc:Anna Gasteyer is here today.
Marc:I think I should mention that now.
Marc:She's a former SNL cast member.
Marc:She's also from Mean Girls, Curb Your Enthusiasm, Broadway shows like Wicked and Funny Girl.
Marc:She's now on the NBC series American Auto.
Marc:And I had a nice chat with her.
Marc:She got me laughing really hard.
Marc:Some good stories, good stories about stage performing, about Will Ferrell.
Marc:It was it was a nice chat.
Marc:So last week I broadcast from my hotel room in Soho.
Marc:Many people were upset that I did not tell you the hotel.
Marc:I didn't want to do that while I was still in it.
Marc:Not that I don't trust you, but you know what I'm saying.
Marc:But the hotel I was so ecstatic about and so complimentary of was the Crosby Street Hotel on Crosby Street, just below Prince.
Marc:And that room I had was just stunning.
Marc:And there are moments like that.
Marc:Like, I don't always appreciate why people have rooms they don't go into necessarily.
Marc:But there's an aesthetic thing.
Marc:You know, that was a sweet.
Marc:And I did sit in all the chairs in there in both rooms.
Marc:But I think part of the thing is I have a either it's a practical mindset or just an ignorant mindset that the general aesthetic.
Marc:of your living space all inclusive is something that makes your heart feel good it's something that makes your mind feel good it's something that you like to rest your eyes on it's something that makes you feel connected to your environment and that's one of the small pleasures in life even if you have a small place this idea you know i i've got to get out of this mindset that everything's just to be eaten everything's just to be moved through everything it's just let's just get to the next moment
Marc:Let's just finish up.
Marc:Let's finish up here.
Marc:I've got to take some time to appreciate the stuff.
Marc:And sometimes when you're in a space where everything just comes together, I get this way in art galleries as well, or large gallery spaces like the Whitney or the Tate in London, where the space or the sense of space or the way it's set up or thought out is one of the great kind of uplifting things about being alive is appreciating space.
Marc:And I guess that just got reinvigorated.
Marc:And I like my house and I like my space.
Marc:I don't like it when it's dirty.
Marc:And I have cats and there's a mess all the time.
Marc:I don't like it when it smells bad.
Marc:But generally speaking...
Marc:It's it's very comfortable to me.
Marc:And it's also something I engage with when I don't want to think about anything else, which is why I'm thinking about, you know, buying some more shelves, put more records up.
Marc:I have this mixed kind of I go back and forth between I got to get out of here.
Marc:Time to start packing.
Marc:Let's go abandon ship.
Marc:Get off the burning vehicle.
Marc:Get out.
Marc:Get out.
Marc:Pull your ripcord.
Marc:Box it up.
Marc:Put it somewhere.
Marc:It doesn't matter anymore.
Marc:You can't bring any of this shit with you, man.
Marc:Fuck all of it.
Marc:Let somebody come take it away.
Marc:Between that and I wonder if I should get a vase, another vase.
Marc:There's nothing wrong with having a couple of nice vases.
Marc:Get rid of it all.
Marc:Burn it down.
Marc:Give it away out front.
Marc:I wonder if these window treatments are exactly the way I like them.
Marc:Should I get a, some more wall art?
Marc:Just fucking, you know, run, man, run, run far, run hard.
Marc:I had a good time in New York.
Marc:As I told you, I enjoyed my hotel.
Marc:I did a lot of, uh, promotional product for the bad guys movie.
Marc:Got to hang out, got to hang out with Sam Rockwell and, um,
Marc:I'm not even sure if I'm pronouncing her.
Marc:Zezi.
Marc:Is it Zezi Bates?
Marc:She's great.
Marc:They're all great.
Marc:It was nice to see everybody.
Marc:And then I was I flew home on Thursday night because I had to go to San Diego the next day and I was going to fly home that Friday morning and just like get home, get my car and go.
Marc:But I thought, no, fuck it, dude.
Marc:Just take that plane out.
Marc:Take that last flight out at 930, left at 1020.
Marc:So I get back at like two in the morning.
Marc:I get home.
Marc:And I, of course, had decided for some reason when we took off at 1040 New York time that I would just knock back a coffee, not just a coffee, airplane coffee, and watch a couple movies.
Marc:The movie idea was fine.
Marc:Coffee idea, not great.
Marc:But I did watch The French Dispatch.
Marc:And I think arguably, maybe not even not even arguably for me, that might be Wes Anderson's best movie.
Marc:I think it might be his masterpiece.
Marc:And I wasn't even going to watch it.
Marc:And I've seen all of them.
Marc:I think I've seen all of the Wes Anderson movies, except for the Zazu one, except for the aquatic one.
Marc:I'll get on it.
Marc:No spoilers.
Marc:But I just thought, you know, the structure of the French dispatch, the the way he paid homage to all these different styles, European television, you know, European hipster movies, magazine, right?
Marc:All of it.
Marc:Period pieces.
Marc:Stories.
Marc:It all worked.
Marc:It all came together.
Marc:It was stunning, meticulous, as always, but just really a fucking masterpiece.
Marc:That's my review of The French Dispatch, and everybody was awesome in it.
Marc:Jeffrey Wright, wow.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:What a fucking performance.
Marc:Benicio was good.
Marc:That girl was good.
Marc:I don't know her name.
Marc:I know her from another movie.
Marc:Is she French?
Marc:That's where my movie reviewing skills kind of taper off when I don't know cast members' names.
Marc:I also watched Spencer, which, to be honest with you, is a poetic meditation.
Marc:on the condition of Lady Di's life at a particular point in time when things were starting to break apart a bit.
Marc:Not unlike that guy's other movie, Jackie.
Marc:It was about grief, struggle, trauma, isolation.
Marc:I thought it was great, and I thought she was great in it.
Marc:Kristen Stewart, Tour de Force.
Marc:So anyways, I watch those two movies.
Marc:I get home at 2.30 in the morning, and I'm like, I'm going to go to bed now.
Marc:But my cat's very excited.
Marc:And fucking Smushy, Sammy, Sammy Red, just kept jumping on the bed, jumping on my head, fucking around with things, kept waking me up.
Marc:It's just so...
Marc:Awful when I can't sleep when you've had a history of cocaine use in your life.
Marc:And even though it's 22 years behind me, when you can't get to sleep and the sun's about to poke through your fucking curtains, it triggering, man, very triggering.
Marc:But I kept it together, put some earplugs in, slept on and off maybe two, three hours total.
Marc:Not great.
Marc:Had to get up.
Marc:Stock up the fridge and then drive to San Diego, which in my experience is a fucking shit show.
Marc:Every time I've gone there, my GPS says two hours and a half maybe.
Marc:And I'm on the road for over four hours.
Marc:Esther Pavitsky comes over.
Marc:She's opening for me.
Marc:We get in the car.
Marc:Thank God she was, you know, I wasn't going crazy because I had experienced before we got on the road at two and we had a sound check at six and we just made it.
Marc:Couldn't even check into the hotel.
Marc:And I was exhausted because I'm on three hour sleep.
Marc:So now I'm punchy and weird and loopy going into these two shows.
Marc:And I haven't done the hour, you know, in months, not since New York.
Marc:And Esther was great.
Marc:Great opener for me.
Marc:Just low key killed, did well, set a tone that didn't, you know, make everything crazy.
Marc:And it was just smooth.
Marc:And I was able to kind of lean into it, lay back a bit and unfold the bits and pieces that I had put together before.
Marc:And they were almost all new for me because I hadn't done it in a few months.
Marc:And for some reason, the venue has a pretty solid hour limit or a curfew in a way for both shows because they have to close the place down by a certain time.
Marc:So I had to do just an hour each show, which is a great exercise for me because you let me I'll ramble on for an hour and a half.
Marc:Hour 45, even if I'm not doing well.
Marc:But the hour kind of got me locked into like, well, this is the job now.
Marc:Put the special together, man.
Marc:Put it together.
Marc:It looks like we're going to close a deal for a special.
Marc:I'll tell you where.
Marc:When that's done, and I don't know when it's going to film, but all my tour dates are wtfpod.com slash tour.
Marc:Got a couple of chunks.
Marc:I'll try to bring Esther with me as much as possible.
Marc:Kevin Christie will be with me up in San Francisco and Napa.
Marc:And again,
Marc:Those COVID rules at the Palace of Fine Arts in San Francisco are everyone needs to be vaxxed and boosted to get in.
Marc:And I didn't know this and I hope it doesn't inconvenience everybody in terms of like having to have the booster.
Marc:But that's what Maz Jirani told me.
Marc:He just he was just there last weekend and he said, heads up.
Marc:So I'm giving you the heads up.
Marc:But again, thank you, San Diego.
Marc:And the drive back was not terrible.
Marc:Two hours.
Marc:It was nicer.
Marc:I was still kind of tired.
Marc:All right, here we go.
Marc:Anna Gasteyer is here, and I didn't know what to expect, but I got some deep laughs in the middle of this thing, and she's great to talk to, and I really enjoyed it.
Marc:She's now on the NBC series American Auto, which has new episodes Tuesday nights, all right?
Marc:I'm going to talk to her right now.
Marc:Here we go.
Marc:.
Marc:Phil Gasteyer in Corrales, New Mexico?
Guest:Yep.
Guest:Former two-time mayor.
Marc:But they've been there for a while and he's a mayor twice.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Is that a hobby for him being a mayor?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I grew up in... My parents are Midwestern people who came to the big city to work in big government in D.C.
Guest:So I grew up in D.C.
Marc:In the big government.
Marc:The big one.
Guest:And the big one.
Guest:Yeah, so he went from- The one that's failing now.
Marc:Right, yeah, the one that's barely hanging on.
Marc:The crumbling one.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:What did he do in big government?
Guest:He did a few things.
Guest:He started out as, he worked in Senator Al Ullman from Oregon's office.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He worked in campaign, and then he worked on the lobbying side because he was a lawyer.
Guest:So he worked, of course, you could say lobby back then.
Guest:Nobody would be like, Adam McKay's mob wouldn't come after you.
Marc:Right.
Marc:It wasn't associated with horrible things.
Guest:I mean, it was probably, but anyway, for whatever, it would seem like a justify.
Marc:It wasn't associated with using the government as a money laundering operation.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:So first he worked for, it's two nefarious things.
Guest:If you mentioned them sort of in a row, one was the, I really think it might've been the corn syrup manufacturers.
Marc:Oh really?
Marc:Cause they did what they lied about something.
Guest:Well, no, I mean, just in terms of nutritional hindsight, the conversation is that the farm subsidies were influenced by the idea that we needed to find different uses for corn.
Marc:Oh, right, right.
Guest:And so we came up with corn syrup.
Marc:Corn syrup and then gas, ethanol.
Guest:Right, and high fructose corn syrup, which we then dumped into- Everything.
Guest:Everything, and now we're just a bunch of- Diabetic.
Guest:Diabetic fatzos.
Guest:And then he worked for savings and loans, and then the savings and loans imploded-
Guest:yeah that was a big deal i remember reading about it in the newspaper yeah it was a big deal um but my parent you know he's a very he's a very kind of moral ethical democrat yeah they're lefty yeah and they're both they're together they're still together they've been married 62 years wow yeah they're very happily married i've been super lucky that way and they're just hanging out in corrales
Guest:And so, yeah, so they moved... We owned... The point I would say about my dad and the savings and the loans, we owned the movie.
Guest:And my parents are... They're mildly into pop culture, but nothing like other people.
Guest:We owned the movie It's a Wonderful Life, growing up.
Guest:Not because of the magical tale of... Yeah.
Guest:Wistful recognition of...
Guest:things you might have not appreciated, but because it's the best representation of savings and loans in American cinema, because of that scene when the building and loan goes under, when the stock market crashes, and then George has to explain that he can't give the money back because the money's in so-and-so's house, and that's how a building and loan works.
Guest:So my dad loved that because it represented the best of the sort of savings and loan as a micro-lending institution, basically.
Marc:So he watched it regularly.
Guest:So we would watch it every year.
Guest:Yeah, mostly for that scene.
Guest:Anyway, so the savings and loans fell on their face, and it was a real bummer, if you believed in the good part of them.
Guest:And so my dad was general counsel for the U.S.
Guest:Savings and Loan League, and he sort of saw the writing on the wall that savings and loans were going to be a thing of yore, and retired at 59.
Guest:And my mom had already moved out to Corrales.
Guest:She was an art teacher, but she's an artist.
Guest:She's a ceramic artist, really full-time.
Marc:Does she have a studio over there?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:And a million kilns.
Marc:Really?
Guest:Yeah, a lot of mosaics.
Marc:Oh, she does tiles, too?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:No, she does that from the stuff that is broken.
Guest:No, no, she's an incredible watercolor artist, so a lot of her work... I like pots.
Guest:She does sculpture, but she does pots, and she does bowls.
Guest:I like pots.
Guest:Yeah, I'll send you some Mariana Gasteyer.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Is she famous?
Guest:I mean, to me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it was pretty cool, because she took a sabbatical and had been teaching for 25 years or something.
Guest:They had driven through Albuquerque and stayed with...
Guest:distant cousins right and had made this comment like to themselves in the early 20s like oh we want to retire in albuquerque i have no idea why wild um i kind of want to go back there yeah so my mom then was like i'm gonna go do art in albuquerque i i don't know why it's beautiful sky there it's very inspirational you know a lot of art comes from there especially those earthy arts
Guest:A lot of the earthy arts come from there.
Guest:The earnest arts.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Ladies and gentlemen, the earnest arts.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it is really an American melting pot, multi-culti vibe there, which I really like.
Guest:There's such a sort of distinctive relationship with Native American roots, with the Latino culture, with the Hispanic American culture.
Guest:It's really cool.
Marc:So they've been out there that long.
Marc:But you never really grew up there, but you've been going there forever.
Yeah.
Guest:I've been going there since I was an adult.
Guest:They moved there right after I finished college.
Guest:So their whole third act has been there.
Guest:So my dad served on, he was the planning and zoning commissioner, which is a big deal in a small town because it's all these things, these variances of who lets people build things, can you do it?
Marc:And it's a manageable job in a town that size.
Guest:Yeah, they're about 8,500, and he has the legal background so he could read the fine print and understand what he's talking about, and he loved it.
Guest:And then he was on the city council, and they asked him to run for mayor, and then he was a two-time mayor.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then he did one more term at council after.
Guest:And now he's in two book clubs.
Marc:That's it.
Marc:I just remember like I had two friends down there and their parents were like old hippies and weirdos.
Marc:And at those houses, I kind of this vague memory, these hippie houses down there.
Guest:You would like my mom's house.
Marc:It's very specific.
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, I mean, it's terrifying.
Guest:I'll say this into the microphone, knowing my father's listening.
Guest:It's terrifying thinking of two people in their early 80s with a wobbly brick floor and adobe walls.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, they got one of those good ones.
Guest:They're one wipe out away each, you know.
Marc:But it holds up there.
Marc:It's not, there's no earthquakes yet.
Marc:And there's like no massive.
Guest:I don't know if they're going to hold up.
Guest:Like, there's no, when I try to explain it to people, and I'm glad you understand it, they don't have a driveway.
Guest:Right.
Guest:They have like.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:If one of them needs a walker, you can't roll a bag from the car to the front door.
Guest:And they converted their garage into my mom's studio.
Guest:So even if you want to go through, it's like a landmine of pottery and clay and dust and kilns.
Marc:Well, I guess that's when they'll make the renovations, when the walkers come.
Marc:Then they'll finally put the driveway.
Guest:They put in grab bars.
Guest:My dad's like, we've got grab bars.
Marc:It's fine.
Marc:That's hilarious.
Guest:And they did get a big TV.
Guest:We talked them into a big TV because they do big ass.
Guest:Not as big as LA, but it was like 55 inches.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:They were pretty excited.
Marc:They're pretty daunting TVs.
Marc:They are.
Marc:It was a big adjustment for me even to get my first big one.
Marc:You're like, holy shit.
Guest:But you know those smart ones, especially for the olds, they're great.
Guest:Because you just click to the home and you find the thing.
Guest:My parents are pretty ahead of it in terms of knowing what is Netflix and what is Hulu.
Marc:My dad's still there.
Marc:He's still in New Mexico.
Marc:He lives up by the mountain.
Guest:Oh my God.
Guest:Is he a hippie too?
Marc:No, he's a sort of a retired in shame surgeon who's like slowly losing it.
Guest:Happens.
Marc:Yeah, it does.
Marc:But your parents sound like they got it together.
Guest:Well, they have each other.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, he's got a wife, but like, I don't know.
Marc:It's like when it's scary.
Marc:Old, old, old is scary.
Guest:I know.
Guest:We could talk about this for hours.
Guest:I mean, it's kind of all I talk about.
Guest:It is?
Guest:Well, just because I'm at a point in my life where, you know, I have a child that just left for college.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I have parents that I live really far away from.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I hate that I live really far from them.
Guest:And I was raised, we were raised, so I think it was like such an American way to like grow up and leave where you grew up.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know, like the dream is that your children will leave.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But you grew up in D.C.
Marc:So you live in New York now or around there?
Guest:I live in New York.
Marc:In Brooklyn.
Marc:And they're there.
Marc:But like, what are you obsessing about age?
Marc:Because I'm not freaking out too bad.
Guest:I'm not obsessing about my own age, but I am wanting, I'm looking around and I'm seeing, I mean, so many of my friends are in situations with parents that have crisis that they're suddenly dealing with that they don't know how to deal with and navigate.
Guest:And I think the only answer is, well, my husband's family did it so obnoxiously effectively.
Guest:Really?
Guest:with uh with his folks yeah like his dad just like took it upon he had a bunch of pre-death meetings he's very organized um pre-death there was a binder there was like a death binder really and my husband and his sister would go there down he grew up in dc too yeah go down month i mean once a month or something right all the paper he's literally his obit is written wow his headstone is carved i don't even know if i have a plot
Guest:I don't.
Marc:I don't either.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I don't know where my dad's is either.
Guest:Everything's super organized.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But here's the thing, and this is my pitch for myself and for you.
Guest:He moved into a place.
Marc:The old man.
Marc:His old man.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:At 85.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:By the way.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But he downsized from a seven bedroom house to a, you know, thousand square foot apartment with white carpeting.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Carpeting.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Of the aforementioned wipeouts.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's why they have it.
Guest:But I keep telling my parents and they don't care is what was so beautiful about it is in the planning of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Got to go through the house, break down the house, get rid of everything.
Yeah.
Guest:With him in the absence of grief.
Guest:So you could look at these collections of like, well, that was a fun time.
Guest:We don't need all these books, whatever.
Guest:We don't need the Bierstein collection anymore.
Guest:And he was like, okay.
Guest:No, I mean, he felt that.
Guest:He was like, I did that part, and I'm now ready to move on.
Guest:There were wedding presents.
Guest:He's divorced.
Guest:We were like, things from their wedding.
Guest:He's like, I'm not going to throw a party for 40 anymore.
Guest:I'm not going to do that.
Marc:I'm 85 years old.
Marc:I look at my stuff like that now.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What am I doing with these books still?
Guest:I know.
Guest:He has the largest collection of books in North America on the Spanish Civil War.
Marc:Do you take those to the apartment?
Guest:It's just those and a teeny little bedroll.
Right.
Guest:And a hot plate.
Guest:And he's happy.
Guest:Why wouldn't he be?
Guest:No, I think he gave him to his alma mater.
Guest:It's devastating.
Guest:But I have watched him thrive in the most beautiful way because what I watch, and then my parents, again, don't believe me about this because they don't want my mom so averse to the idea of moving somewhere organized around her age.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But what I see in him is that the absence of stress.
Guest:I see him not worrying about...
Guest:the plumbing the plumbing and oh that tree is hanging really low I should call someone to have them bring should I do you think it's like all of the like oh you know I've got to do something because it gets so icy on the steps every year blah blah blah whatever it is you know I think that's probably why a lot of older people hurt themselves
Marc:Because they don't do those things, and eventually the reason they have to move is they've broken everything because they fell down.
Guest:That's what I'm saying.
Guest:I know.
Guest:I told my mom, I'm like, you're not going to move, you're not going to do anything, and then you're going to have a fall, and then that's it.
Guest:That's why so many people are eventually, that's the last thing that happens.
Marc:It also sounds like this guy's got a pretty good mindset around the death thing.
Guest:He's so insanely practical.
Guest:He's like, you know.
Marc:We should be practical about it because it's inevitable.
Marc:You should be able to wrap your brain around it, but it's hard.
Guest:It's very hard.
Marc:It's the worst.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I mean.
Guest:No, it's impossible.
Guest:It's impossible.
Guest:But he's very much like, aggravatingly like, well, you quit smoking, you put a rubber band around your wrist and you snap it every time that you have a craving.
Guest:What's the problem?
Marc:The problem is you don't know me.
Yeah.
Marc:And that's not going to do it.
Guest:What about the crying?
Guest:What do I do about the crying?
Marc:And what do I replace it with?
Guest:What else can I shove in my mouth?
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:That is the big question.
Guest:That really is the question.
Guest:What else can I shove in my mouth?
Marc:I just went to New York for two days and I'm like, I feel disgusting.
Marc:From eating?
Marc:Well, yeah, because I was managing the weight and I was like, I wanted to lose a few.
Marc:I like to be at a certain weight and I finally got there.
Marc:But as soon as I got to New York for like two days, it was like I'd never eaten before.
Marc:The Bacchanal, yeah.
Marc:It was just like, I couldn't stop.
Marc:I know.
Guest:I always compare myself, I always thought I was female and hormonal, but it's like a bear breaking into a camper.
Marc:Yeah, it was crazy.
Guest:Just a violent- And it felt so good.
Yeah!
Yeah!
Yeah!
Guest:Ripping shit out of the cabinets like, I don't care.
Marc:Yeah, just eat it.
Guest:Eat it.
Marc:And I feel the shame while it's going in.
Marc:Like, I'm not, I'm enjoying it for maybe a second.
Marc:It's simultaneous.
Marc:Yeah, it's ruined by shame.
Marc:I'm like, this is amazingly, I'm terrible.
Guest:But so I always have the logic in a place like New York that I would be like, well, I'm walking it off.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You didn't work.
Marc:It didn't work.
Marc:No.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But you're not really.
Marc:I mean, I exercise.
Marc:I know what is going to lose weight.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know, the the the six blocks.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:With the two slices of pizza.
Marc:Not going to do it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But weren't they good?
Guest:They were good.
Marc:They were good.
Marc:Where do you get pizza?
Guest:Well, I live in Pizza Central.
Marc:Do you though?
Marc:But like Joe's, do you go to Joe's anymore?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's funny.
Guest:It's so funny that you said that because I had a, what was I?
Guest:I was doing something in the city.
Guest:Oh, I had a gig.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Singing?
Guest:Singing.
Guest:I wrote a Christmas album that I- I know.
Marc:Listen to some of it.
Guest:Sugar and booze.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:So, speaking of putting things in your mouth.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, I did shows this Christmas, and my 13-year-old, who is literally growing an inch and a half every day, he's almost 5'11", and he's 13.
Guest:He just keeps growing.
Guest:He's a little beanpole.
Guest:And he was so hungry, and my husband was like, I'm taking him to Joe's.
Marc:On Carmine 6.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Old school.
Marc:Oh, the best.
Guest:NYU, yeah.
Marc:Was music always a thing?
Guest:I'm such a weird...
Guest:Well, it's starting to make more sense.
Guest:I started as a musician, no doubt.
Marc:When was this?
Guest:I mean, the thing that I- When you were a kid?
Guest:The thing I do well first was to sing.
Marc:When you were like what, high school?
Guest:Yeah, middle school.
Marc:Do you have brothers and sisters?
Guest:I do have an older brother.
Marc:But he's not in show business.
Guest:No, he's a professor.
Marc:Of what?
Guest:Sociology.
Marc:Oh, nice.
Marc:It's a good balance.
Marc:Oh, sociology is a good one.
Marc:It's like no math.
Guest:He teaches at MSU, so he has like all of the basketball players.
Marc:Interesting.
Guest:He's awesome.
Guest:I love him.
Marc:I like the whole idea.
Marc:I just got a letter from a sociologist who said that he was using bits and pieces of my podcast.
Guest:I believe it.
Marc:In his classes, and he wanted to know if I had time.
Marc:Maybe I'd talk to him about something.
Marc:I don't remember.
Marc:I've got to look it up.
Guest:You should do that.
Guest:That would be nice.
Marc:Is it?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's in agricultural sociology, so he teaches at MSU, which is a farm school, really.
Guest:Agricultural sociology?
Guest:Because his thing was he went to the Peace Corps, and he lived in West Africa for a long time.
Guest:Then he lived in the Middle East, and his work is with basically water access in communities.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:So as a result, when he went into the study of sociology, it had to do with how groups align themselves around farming and water.
Marc:That's interesting, I guess.
Guest:I mean, I'm making a very general.
Guest:It's more specific than that.
Marc:I'm sure it could be more specific, but I'm kind of grasping it.
Guest:They're really helping the world.
Guest:He and my sister-in-law.
Guest:She's a law professor.
Marc:They're taking care of it?
Guest:She is.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She's basically changing.
Guest:Literally, her research is changing the conversation about jury selection and as race impacted by race in the death penalty.
Yeah.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:They're amazing.
Guest:So I just make fart noises and ask if this is a good sound on my kazoo.
Guest:I keep it light.
Marc:But your heart's in the right place.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:Is it?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:It's very selfish.
Marc:That's it, though, isn't it?
Marc:But you think, you want to think that you're doing things.
Marc:I've been doing a joke on stage about just the, we all know that the climate is, we know it.
Marc:And none of us are taking any sort of real position here.
Guest:Isn't that the don't look up premise?
Marc:Well, kind of.
Marc:But in the back of your head, you're sort of like, well, that Swedish teenager thing.
Marc:She has it under control.
Marc:She'll get it.
Marc:She'll do it.
Marc:Greta's got it.
Guest:That Parkland kid will deal with the guns.
Marc:There's nothing I can do that she's not doing.
Guest:That's how I feel about the gun kid.
Marc:I don't want to get in her way.
Guest:No, no.
Guest:She's busy.
Guest:She's got stuff to do.
Guest:I mean, the worst part for comedians, too, is like, I guess I'll host your benefit.
Yeah.
Guest:And then you're like, really?
Guest:That's how you're going to contribute.
Guest:And I have friends that are like, and then you bitch about that, by the way.
Guest:You agree to do it, and then you're like, fuck, I have to do this benefit.
Marc:They're going to be eating.
Guest:So awful.
Guest:And I have had the thought, God, I wish I was so rich I could just write this check.
Marc:Yeah, I don't know.
Marc:I do give to charity.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I have specific ones I give to.
Marc:And one of them is the... Are they all feline?
Marc:One of them is.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:One of them is the Carolina Tiger Rescue.
Marc:You bet.
Marc:They rescue big cats and they just take care of them.
Marc:I think that's awesome.
Marc:From roadside attractions or idiots who buy tigers.
Guest:Because you can just buy... I bet there are so many of those people in this country.
Guest:I swear to God.
Guest:You know, because before the red state, blue state thing really happened.
Marc:They don't think ahead.
Marc:It's cute now.
Guest:There's tons of that.
Guest:There's tons of snakes like that, too.
Guest:Because before it was actually people who were storming the Capitol and not.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Before we were Democrats.
Guest:People who own tigers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:We used to watch that show Doomsday Preppers because it was awesome.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it was incredible.
Guest:We had like a running tally of the number of people on Doomsday Preppers who sustained their habit through exotic animal breeding.
Guest:It was an amazing percentage of those people who had a basement full of iguanas.
Marc:Do you know what I think about that?
Guest:For the aftertimes.
Guest:Right, but have you ever thought like, who the fuck wants to live?
Marc:These people are like, we've got to survive.
Marc:It's like, I don't want to be around.
Marc:I don't want to be part of the post-apocalyptic thing.
Guest:Well, this is the problem with The Walking Dead.
Guest:It really illustrated a lot of that to us.
Marc:You mean we're never going to be able to avoid it because we're going to come back as zombies?
Guest:No.
Guest:Meaning it just, I mean, you know, it took me an embarrassing number of episodes before I was like, oh, it's the people.
Guest:That's who we have to be afraid of.
Guest:Our neighbors.
Guest:I was on tour with Sugar and Booze with my Christmas record.
Marc:Would you bring a combo?
Marc:You bring a little orchestra?
Marc:How many people?
Guest:I do five on the road and we're at eight in New York and LA.
Marc:What's that like?
Guest:So I can have a proper horn section.
Guest:I have a really big singing voice, meaning I don't know if it's good or bad, but it's big.
Marc:Would you consider it cabaret?
Guest:Not sugar and booze.
Guest:I mean, it's throwback-y.
Marc:Yeah, right.
Guest:But the thing I like about the Christmas thing is it sort of answered a problem that I was trying to solve.
Guest:So to go back to answer your question.
Guest:About music.
Guest:About music.
Guest:The first thing I did that I knew I could do that other people couldn't do well was sing.
Guest:And not in a way of, like, I thought, oh, I'm so special or anything like that.
Guest:It was just, like, I would imagine if, like, you're an athlete or something.
Marc:Yeah, you got a knack for it.
Marc:You're a natural.
Guest:Somebody's, like, hey, you got... And I remember the moments of, like, teachers and things, like, in class.
Guest:You got it, kid.
Guest:Yeah, just being, like, give her the solo, you know?
Guest:And registering, like, oh, that's weird.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so, anyway, I loved it, and I did it more and more and more.
Guest:And I acted, too, and stuff in high school, but...
Guest:I didn't, it's weird.
Guest:My parents are very, they're very cool.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I was not, I did not grow up in a world where you could like, I didn't think that I could go do that for a living.
Marc:Be an entertainer?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Certainly not that level, especially those words, like then reconciling.
Guest:Everything you did had to be a little bit smart.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And a little bit academic.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And my parents were like, opera buffs, they're cool or not.
Guest:Opera buffs.
Guest:Big opera buffs.
Guest:So real hoity-toities?
Guest:Yeah, so like my first professional job was in the children's chorus of La Boheme at Washington Opera.
Guest:And then I played the child ghost in Macbeth, Verity's Macbeth, at the Washington Opera.
Marc:And I was in like 19th.
Marc:Big, it's a big room, right?
Guest:The Kennedy Center Opera House.
Marc:Oh, it's the Kennedy Center.
Guest:It's an opera house, yeah.
Marc:It's amazing.
Guest:It was massive.
Marc:It's so exciting when you're a kid and you're at the stage.
Marc:I still think about it.
Marc:I was just in San Diego at a little theater last night.
Marc:That moment that one enters a stage is so wild.
Guest:It's incredible.
Guest:I know.
Guest:I did Wicked, the show.
Marc:Did you do it when it was being put together?
Guest:I did Wicked in Chicago.
Marc:Okay, right.
Marc:At the beginning.
Guest:It was the beginning.
Guest:It was the third company.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:So I auditioned for Elphaba, the beginning beginning.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it was right after 9-11.
Guest:And I was still about to do Saturday night, my sixth season.
Guest:And I was pregnant and I hadn't told anybody.
Guest:So it was like not a great time to be preparing a giant belting number.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Also, to be totally frank, I didn't know how to navigate that kind of singing yet.
Guest:Musical?
Guest:Musical.
Guest:Because I'd just been doing comedy singing at that point.
Guest:It was a sit-down production in Chicago.
Guest:So Chicago had never had its own original production in the Broadway world of a musical.
Guest:They since have had Hamilton and a couple other, but that's it.
Guest:So usually just tour shows coming through and leaving.
Guest:So it was really cool because it was a proper production.
Guest:And we did it for a very long time.
Guest:And then I went and did it on Broadway.
Guest:Broadway.
Guest:Anyway, I had done one million performances.
Guest:And all you think about when you are singing like that every day is sleep.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because it's the only thing.
Guest:It's just the most instrumental piece of getting your voice where it needs to be in the morning.
Guest:And healthy.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So at one point, the doctor gave me Ambien.
Yeah.
Guest:Which I can't believe is legal.
Guest:I literally can't.
Guest:There's no time at which you bring up Ambien with anyone that they don't have the most horrifying story you've ever heard.
Guest:Like right up there.
Marc:Going shopping naked.
Guest:Yeah, literally somebody said, oh, my business manager murdered her husband on Ambien.
Guest:Literally, just people drop that kind of thing as though it's casually.
Guest:And you're like, why?
Guest:How is this legal?
Guest:I don't understand.
Guest:The COVID vaccine took that long to clear, and everyone still takes Ambien.
Guest:Anyway, I took Ambien, and it does knock you out.
Guest:Shopping naked.
Guest:Eight hours of sleep, whatever.
Guest:And I started to drop...
Guest:out like my brain was losing lines they would come back yeah but i ran on stage my 955th performance and the thing about wicked is like so she cut she's she's an outsider when she first enters and it's all these kids at shiz university and they're on the other side of stage and they're all staring at me and i it was like an hour it was just an hour where i was i fell down into the well with
Guest:Really?
Guest:Baby Jessica.
Guest:Yeah, I was down.
Guest:I couldn't.
Guest:It was slow motion, like when you can feel your neural pathways going like... It was like that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I remember staring at them and them looking at me like enough of a... You know, the beat passes.
Guest:And then the adrenaline, the sweat, the cortisol, the hot flush.
Yeah.
Guest:Thank God I was green.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then another beat.
Guest:And then the registering beat when they look at you and they're like, what the fuck is going on?
Guest:And then I said the line.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then felt the relief.
Guest:They replied.
Guest:And then I couldn't remember the next line.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Same thing.
Guest:Oh, no.
Guest:I did it, ultimately.
Guest:But it was one of those... It's hard to explain.
Marc:Did anyone have to sort of do that weird thing where they feed you the... Maybe you should...
Marc:No.
Marc:Oh, good.
Guest:They couldn't have because they were people who weren't, you know, because you go to that place in your mind where you're like, how do I justify this in character, which is also so weird about theater.
Guest:I was on stage once with an actor, a famous actor who had a stroke.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Is that a secret?
Guest:It's not a secret.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:It was Tony Roberts, actually.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was a play.
Guest:Is he still around?
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:He was fantastic, but it was the most incredible thing to watch the experience of people continuing to behave...
Guest:like assholes in character, like behind the fake fourth wall.
Marc:Did he go down?
Guest:No, he entered and he spoke like a broken, it sounded like a record going backwards, but he still was delivering lines.
Guest:in in comedic cadence and the audience was laughing it was gibberish gibberish and he got like three or four lines out where the audience was like that was a rhythmic joke yeah do you know what i mean like he was like how does that and then it started to go to like and well then we also and then john glover who was on stage with me went hustling over in character that's the other part you're just like and we all maintain character like that's when you look back you're like theater's insane
Guest:It's like a bunch of people dressed up in like period costume and hats and a man having a stroke.
Guest:And all of you are like, well, I think we have a little problem here.
Guest:I'll just see you to your quarters.
Guest:You know, like whatever, trying to like help one another.
Guest:And then meanwhile, and then the curtain goes down.
Marc:What did Glover do?
Guest:He went and took his arm.
Guest:That's what it registered for me.
Guest:It was like, oh, his blocking is off.
Guest:But he was acting.
Guest:He was such a pro that he was acting through his stroke.
Guest:It was insane.
Guest:And then the curtain came down, and then it was like, is there a doctor in the house kind of thing.
Guest:And then absolutely everybody fulfilled their, like, showed why they were cast.
Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like the, you know, like the ingenue started crying right away.
Guest:And like the old diva.
Guest:It was this play called The Royal Family, which was written about the Barrymores.
Guest:It was a parody that Kaufman wrote.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:The old diva was like, I'm feeling a little peaked.
Guest:You know, it was just there.
Guest:Everybody was having like their moment.
Guest:It was amazing.
Guest:That was the show backstage.
Marc:It was incredible.
Guest:And then he was back on stage within like a week and a half.
Marc:Oh, so it wasn't a big one.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:It was good.
Guest:It was good.
Marc:It's so funny because when you think back on it, the stakes are not that high.
Marc:Like in a sense.
Guest:That's what I'm saying.
Marc:You can just be like, can we stop the show?
Marc:Sorry, guys.
Marc:Yeah, like the half a house of old people.
Guest:I forgot my lines.
Yeah.
Guest:why not i know it was only 350 bucks oh well that's a bit much yeah i guess that would mean yeah you got to struggle here's my other weird showbiz story that this isn't even like but we i did this i did a musical another musical on broadway this uh show of uh the three penny opera which everyone's done in college and high school so everybody i don't even know it i like i had to ask tony kushner the other day to explain to me what brechtian was
Guest:Well, it's a bummer.
Guest:It's really, in my opinion, should just be studied and not done.
Guest:But that's a very... Now I'm going to get canceled.
Marc:Yeah, by Tony Kushner.
Guest:Those Brecht people are going to come for my ass.
Marc:The Brechtians are brutal.
Guest:No, they're... It used to be a little...
Guest:yeah yeah you're never going to be able to do off off broadway again or college production yeah ever i will be asked to leave we're going to ask you to leave i'm going to have to ask you to leave anyway so we did this break the end we did this production and it was like you know it just was a misfire like they were trying to be sort of edgy on broadway which is always a tricky thing because people are paying so much that's always the one they do though isn't it three penny opera always yeah because everybody did it in college and that's and there's music in that right
Guest:Yeah, it's Kurt Weill.
Guest:It's like the peak snob factor.
Marc:Mack the Knife is in it.
Marc:Mack the Knife, yeah.
Guest:And it's brilliant.
Guest:Again, though, I think I would rather read it or listen to it.
Marc:Yeah, or study it.
Marc:Or study it, yeah.
Marc:This is why this man was important a long time ago.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I'm sure, as your good friend Tony Kushner explained, the breaking of the wall and sort of all of the aggression.
Guest:So much of it was about things that we're worried about now, right?
Guest:It was about...
Marc:Fascism.
Guest:Fascism, yeah.
Guest:But the director was not really interested on that side of it.
Guest:He didn't really want to focus on that.
Guest:And so...
Guest:It was just a very sort of aggressively fancy downtown, uptown production, which kind of was a misfire.
Guest:They were like drag queens and whatever things that people are like, that's quote unquote edgy.
Guest:And that's fine.
Guest:Whatever.
Guest:He was trying his own vision.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:But they did this thing with I have a giant voice, as I mentioned.
Guest:It's just loud.
Guest:And they amplified everybody in this kind of caustic way.
Marc:Is that part of the art?
Guest:It's part of the art.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:And it was kind of abrasive.
Guest:And Ben Brantley said something kind of like Onagaster sings with the sound of a thousand trumpets.
Guest:It's like something not sure if it was a compliment.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's what critics do.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think that's good.
Guest:Is that good?
Guest:Trumpets are... People like trumpets.
Guest:Yeah, a lot of trumpets.
Guest:They do announce stuff.
Guest:So...
Guest:It's just like debilitating conundrum.
Marc:No, I think it is good.
Marc:How could that be bad?
Guest:Except for my dad, who was like, you are loud.
Guest:So anyway, the week we were about to close, and it definitely was one of those shows that just didn't, for me, was not a happy, fun experience.
Guest:The closing notice goes up, and people are crying and stuff, and the whole time I'm like...
Guest:Yes!
Guest:Like by myself in my room.
Guest:And, you know, whatever.
Guest:It was fine.
Guest:I'm grateful it's on my resume.
Guest:I learned a lot about music.
Guest:And the vocal was actually amazing.
Guest:But the sound system went down.
Guest:Like four performances before the end.
Guest:And this is going to make you feel really smart.
Guest:The sound system went down.
Guest:And there was a long wait.
Guest:It was like 12 minutes with the curtain.
Guest:And then finally the announcement came up saying, ladies and gentlemen, the sound system has gone down.
Guest:We would, we will have to, you can stay and see the show without amplification.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Which in the year, whatever that was, is sort of unheard of.
Guest:Everything on Broadway is hyper mic'd.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Everybody's like fed through the mixer.
Guest:And they're like, they said, they were like, you'll have the opportunity to hear a song, hear these songs without, without amplification.
Guest:Right.
Guest:The way they were written.
Guest:Yeah, and Studio 54, which is a former opera house, it was kind of amazing.
Guest:And the audience went crazy.
Guest:They had like 12 people left and got their money back.
Guest:They were like, you can have your money back if you want.
Guest:Anyway, it ended up being, first of all, just a mind-blowingly...
Guest:Fantastic performance because it was stripped so much of the artifice of fake sound.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:We had to like stand off stage and like do crash boxes and crowd noises and because all the sound effects were out.
Guest:That's great.
Guest:And then even things like...
Guest:You know, the announcements for you come for the stage, like it's your entrance from the stage manager.
Guest:Like if you're up on the third floor, we all had to be really present.
Guest:And it ended up being so accidentally Brechtian where everybody was so aware of the architecture of the theater of it.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That it was like the one of the best nights in the theater.
Marc:Wow.
Guest:It was wild.
Marc:That's great.
Marc:Why wasn't Ben Brantley at that one?
Guest:Well, and he would have found that I also sing like a trumpeter without amplification.
Marc:Not a thousand though, just 500.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:So going back to the music, so when you graduated what, college?
Guest:So I went to Northwestern as a voice major.
Guest:I got in as a singer.
Marc:Were you doing comedy too?
Guest:So I got in as a voice major.
Guest:It was earnest, the most earnest bunch of humans you've ever met in your life.
Marc:I can't imagine.
Guest:It was stultifying.
Guest:And there was a moment where there was a man who came in to teach overtones in an ethnomusicology class.
Guest:It's not funny.
Guest:I don't know why.
Marc:I don't even know what it means.
Guest:Anyway, an overtone is a thing that's when you hit one note and another note resonates above it.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:So this man had studied overtones in Tibet and he just started- Chanting?
Guest:Like out of nowhere.
Guest:And he didn't have like a discursive style.
Guest:So he just would in the middle of the speech.
Guest:And I became unglued and I was asked to leave the lecture.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's when I realized I shouldn't be a music major.
Guest:These are not my people.
Marc:You could stop laughing.
Guest:I could not stop laughing.
Guest:I had like a church laughing attack.
Guest:Because this guy was like...
Guest:in the middle of it was the funniest thing i'd ever seen in my life so i was in school in chicago and obviously improv is big there i started i joined the improv group and i was like aha i just found my people yeah and so um i ended up just getting a regular old theater degree and a bossy a bossy friend told me to move to la yeah and then kathy griffin told me to do the groundlings and
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My life is a series of bossy responses.
Guest:Yeah, people yelling at you.
Guest:She literally was like, why aren't you doing the Groundlings?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:So I did it.
Guest:We met at an audition.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And we just spent the day together.
Guest:I really liked her.
Guest:And so she was like, go do the Groundlings.
Guest:And so I did the Groundlings.
Marc:Did she go all the way through the Groundlings?
Guest:Yeah, she was Groundlings forever.
Guest:Talked there forever.
Guest:And then I would sing, like I would sing in bits and stuff, but I didn't really, you know, I didn't think I was a singer anymore.
Guest:I smoked a pack a half a day and all that.
Marc:But you were having fun.
Marc:I was having a great time.
Marc:I've never been to a groundling show.
Guest:What?
Marc:I know.
Guest:Why?
Guest:Are you too cool?
Marc:No, I just don't go out much.
Marc:But they sound hilarious and amazing.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:I have such a fondness for that place.
Guest:And I have a fondness for it because it is not cool.
Guest:It has never been cool.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And because I was going to do the Second City and I went and there were like two women in the company.
Guest:They seemed kind of overshouted.
Guest:Remember, it was the 90s, early 90s when I graduated college, 89.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the Groundlings was just like wigs and glasses at a good time.
Guest:Like when I first went to a show, there was Jennifer Coolidge, Lisa Kudrow, Mindy Sterling, Heather Morgan, like these hilarious.
Marc:Heather Morgan.
Marc:I wonder what she's up to.
Guest:Hilarious women.
Guest:And I thought, oh, I want to do this thing.
Marc:Kathy Griffin.
Guest:Just big, loud, funny girls.
Guest:Karen Mariama.
Guest:And so I did it.
Guest:And I remember the Northwestern crew, like the improv people.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They were like, we don't really want to do the groundlings.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's not my thing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so, you know, they were like too cool.
Guest:And then, so I did.
Marc:Well, that whole Chicago improv scene is rooted in a certain hipness, right?
Marc:Oh, my God.
Marc:That whole, what, Del Close and all that shit.
Guest:It's so cool.
Guest:It's also, and I thought I tried.
Guest:I tried desperately, but it didn't, you know.
Marc:Did your time doing Herald's?
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:And so I, again, I did two levels of the groundlings and then I did like the people who are teaching there have to come vote on you to move you up.
Guest:And again, Kathy Griffin, she called me up and she was like, I don't understand.
Guest:Why are you wearing wigs and glasses?
Guest:It's the groundlings.
Marc:Why aren't you?
Guest:Yeah, because I thought I was being cool.
Guest:She was like, do it or don't.
Guest:And I remember being so grateful for that.
Guest:I was like, if it's not cool, like fucking lean in.
Guest:It's fun.
Guest:Who cares?
Guest:It's fine.
Guest:It's loud and uncool.
Guest:So I did that.
Guest:And that was it?
Marc:The big breakthrough?
Guest:That was it.
Guest:And then I moved to, then I got SNL.
Marc:Because that's what Lauren says.
Marc:How do you feel about wigs?
Marc:Like he's asked men that.
Marc:I've known two men I've interviewed.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Where he's asked them about wigs.
Guest:It's funny because he has really strong opinions about wigs.
Guest:Like his eye for wig detail is excellent.
Guest:It is.
Guest:And funnily enough, like there's...
Guest:I love SNL.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My favorite thing about SNL, like I look back on it, is there's so much righteous indignation there in costume.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So there's always somebody like crying in a polar bear outfit or like, you know what I mean?
Guest:There's so much like ridiculous.
Guest:And I remember Will, when we did these middle school music teachers that sang together and Will Ferrell, we wrote with Paul Appel.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we decided very early on in the writing that he had a bald pate and a full wig.
Guest:I mean, a full beard and mustache.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But that he was fully bald, but with full frontal facial hair.
Guest:And Lorne, Lorne didn't like it.
Guest:Like he just had an opinion about it.
Guest:And I just remember the furious moment where Will's like, I'm going to take a stand.
Guest:I'm going to take a stand.
Guest:But like with the spirit gum and it's like, his mother kind of stuck, you know, and like storming the castle dressed as like a middle school music teacher.
Marc:In a Baldwin?
Guest:In a Baldwin.
Guest:It was so funny.
Marc:Did he win?
Guest:We won.
Guest:Yeah, we won.
Guest:We took a stand.
Marc:So what was your process of getting SNL?
Marc:It was just like they were casting and- Will recommended me.
Guest:I didn't know him.
Guest:He was like ahead of me at the ground.
Guest:Yeah, but we had done a Thursday show maybe together or something.
Guest:How is he so fucking funny?
Guest:He's so fucking funny.
Marc:I can't, I don't even know.
Guest:He's the funniest, funniest, funniest person ever.
Marc:And then- And he's so on purpose with it.
Marc:Like he can turn it on and off so quickly.
Guest:100%.
Guest:And also just-
Guest:a guru he was then and he continues to be of he's not spent a whole lot of time sweating his process like sweating his I mean he was one of the first and it paid out so beautifully for him at the show he's so comfortable selling he's so comfortable failing he's really comfortable that sounds like so process he's gotta be great failing he's so comfortable failing
Guest:But he, you know, this is a story I've told before, and it's really not mine to tell, but I just find that it's so... But I like that you've done it many times.
Marc:Well, I mean, I've... Do you preface it that way every time?
Guest:I don't think I've said it in... The Tony Roberts story on this, I have not said on a podcast, meaning I tell them at dinner parties.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:It's nice that you have friends.
Guest:But I, I try.
Guest:The thing, I think about this a lot as a parent and I probably fail at it.
Guest:And as a person, as I try to learn to wear more wigs and glasses, kind of lean on to that side of things that's important.
Guest:Because I did come from Smarty Pants Town.
Guest:So even I catch my like I had an interview on NPR this week and I catch myself like trying to sound intelligent.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:You're doing the thing.
Guest:Just like that.
Guest:It was such a my childhood was one of real academics and intellectual.
Guest:So I always have this pressure, but I'm not really like that.
Guest:So it's this combination.
Guest:It's.
Marc:But creative people, right?
Marc:I mean, you did come from supportive, creative people.
Marc:Yeah, creative people.
Marc:Your mom does the pots and the paintings.
Guest:The pots and the... Yeah, that's true.
Guest:My dad's super funny in real life.
Guest:But anyway, this is a really interesting thing to me about Will, and this sort of explains everything to me.
Guest:Kay Farrell, his mom, one time told me that in middle school, Will had qualified for the Gifted and Talented After School Enrichment Program, and she signed him up.
Guest:Those are kids, Gifted and Talented.
Guest:And the scheduling came in and she was looking and they suddenly realized that there had been a bump where Will had proactively signed himself up for square dancing.
Guest:yeah for like and he was really actively bummed that he would have to go to this gifted and talented thing after school instead of square dancing and so because she is the awesome human that she is she was like it's up to you you decide and she was like and he chose square and that to me sums up why will is the most amazing because he's like what why would i go to do this these math games when i could be square dancing man
Guest:So I always try to think about that.
Guest:We spend a lot of time in our lives not doing the fun.
Marc:Yeah, we do.
Marc:I can't identify it all the time.
Guest:No, it's really hard.
Marc:Now that I'm old and I've saved some money, I'm sort of like, well, now I'm just going to... Yeah.
Marc:What?
Guest:Air fry.
Guest:You're going to use your air fryer.
Marc:I like to cook.
Marc:I do because I have an eating disorder.
Marc:So I like to spend the entire day cooking like I run a restaurant.
Marc:Just think...
Marc:Just things that I can eat all week without feeling bad about them.
Guest:I like that.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That's healthy.
Guest:You have a good, mindful relationship with food.
Marc:I do not.
Marc:I do not.
Guest:But cooking is very mindful.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But I just need things like, what if I just need to compulsively stuff my face?
Guest:Oh, I see.
Guest:So you're like, how many Brussels can I eat without vomiting?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Something like that.
Marc:I'm very into this red cabbage slaw right now.
Guest:Yum.
Guest:Last night I took an active huge bite of my second dinner because I'd flown on the plane to that dinner.
Guest:And then I had another dinner after I landed because it landed.
Marc:I wasn't hungry at all.
Guest:Charlie, my husband, was meeting us at our hotel.
Marc:You're eating the second dinner not hungry.
Guest:Not at all.
Guest:Not remotely hungry.
Guest:And he brought Shake Shack, so it's already like not a healthy second dinner.
Guest:And I took, I took, I turned to my husband and my son and I was like, I just took a bite and I had the unconscious thought, I feel so sick.
Guest:I hope I can get this down.
Guest:So why am I still eating?
Guest:Like it was so, like I actually had the thought like, oh, my stomach feels distended and uncomfortable against my pants.
Marc:But I got to get this down.
Guest:But if I do this right, I can get the rest of this burger in.
Guest:So it starts by identifying.
Guest:It starts by identifying.
Marc:I did that the other day.
Marc:I was in, you know, and it was the second night.
Marc:I'm flying back from New York, and I was in the first class, you know, the flagship Admirals Club.
Marc:But I could eat in the restaurant.
Guest:They gave you the dinner before.
Guest:I've only done it once, but boy, did I tuck in.
Marc:Yeah.
Yeah.
Marc:So I ate that whole fucking dinner, and then I got on the plane.
Guest:And they had a dinner.
Guest:Ha ha!
Guest:But do you do coffee?
Guest:What are your other things?
Marc:Yeah, a lot of coffee.
Guest:Do you drink?
Marc:No.
Guest:Don't drink.
Marc:Sober a long time.
Guest:So you got to find other things.
Guest:What's to put in the mouth with coffee?
Marc:Coffee, so much to the point where I tip over into a paralysis.
Marc:Like I'll drink so much coffee where I go into a mild seizure where I'm exhausted.
Guest:What about the mushroom coffee?
Marc:No.
Guest:I switched to that and it made a difference.
Marc:Really?
Guest:After three.
Marc:Yeah, I do tea.
Marc:You want to know why?
Marc:I do a little tea.
Guest:Because, so when I was shooting American Auto last summer, I- I watched it.
Marc:I was mentioned on one of the shows.
Marc:Someone was listening.
Guest:You were.
Guest:They're like, Maren's on a rant.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Barinholtz said it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he pulled his AirPod out.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It was really funny.
Marc:I thought that was nice.
Marc:Good reference for those of us.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Who know.
Guest:In the cast world.
Marc:So this is a mushroom tea?
Marc:So-
Marc:It's supposed to be good for you, right?
Guest:I made a promise to myself.
Guest:Okay, so what happened with COVID is you can't just walk up to the craft services table during COVID and take a big coffee cup and fill it with Swedish fish.
Guest:You can't.
Guest:You have to ask.
Guest:That's terrible.
Guest:So you would have to say to the guy behind, could I have two Starbucks grande cups of Swedish fish, please?
Guest:Because I hear we're going long.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that I decided I was going to try to address my relationship to sugar on campus at work.
Marc:Right.
Marc:The COVID was the window of opportunity.
Guest:COVID, I was like, since I have to ask for the double grande.
Marc:The shame.
Guest:The shame.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:I'm going to see if I can get through long shooting days without a sugar hit.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so I switched to, I asked the catering guy, or the craft services guy, I was like, there's this mushroom coffee.
Guest:It doesn't taste like mushrooms.
Guest:It tastes like coffee.
Guest:It's like adaptogens.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:And it gives you a little bit of brain happy.
Guest:It does?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It makes you super alert.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:Like those lion's mane.
Guest:Try it.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:You might like it.
Marc:So when you're in SNL, like for some reason when I was looking at all the characters, because you did a lot of funny ones, and I don't know that I've never- I hope so.
Marc:I never-
Guest:The unfunny ones are not something you want to talk about.
Marc:No, but you were like, you were like a real, you were big over there.
Marc:You were not like marginalized.
Marc:You were like big.
Guest:I had a good time.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:For six seasons?
Marc:Mm-hmm.
Marc:That's a lot.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But like, I don't know that I've asked people this.
Marc:Like when you, and I don't know if it's from improv skill or what, how do you do impressions?
Marc:Like do you focus on- Oh, well, I'm not like an, I mean, again- But even when you do other people though, is it the idea you have to find the thing?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Look, I mean, if you're gonna talk to Daryl Hammond or or Jimmy Fallon, those guys are they have their have their savants.
Marc:Right.
Marc:No, really special.
Guest:Yeah, they're mimics.
Guest:They have a thing.
Guest:I mean, Daryl, especially like.
Marc:Well, there's a price to pay for that.
Guest:Absolutely.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But when you would write with him.
Marc:With Daryl.
Guest:one would write with him i i would hear him use syntax and vocabulary i had never heard him use conversationally as another character he channeled like a whole other person right literally yeah it's a really wild skill and and jimmy too jimmy has an ear for like and so does steve higgins i mean there's a few people i know but um from that world i i mean the rest of us i would say the groundling style people molly shannon me i mean i want to speak for everybody but will
Guest:I feel like we would find our way into what the character was or the bit.
Guest:And, and you know, like I only did, I only did impressions in the 11th hour from my audition.
Guest:Cause I heard that I had to have impressions and the people write to them.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So a lot of it just comes down to like, what do you, who do you look like?
Guest:And what are the things, this is like the most erudite asshole thing that I did.
Guest:But for my impressions, I did, um, well I did Martha Stewart because I found her really fascinating.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Um, and I still do.
Guest:I kind of worship her.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Have you met her?
Guest:Oh, yeah, many times.
Guest:But she's... I mean, I wouldn't say we've had cocktails today, but I would love to.
Marc:There's certain people like her that do so much stuff and are so influential and have all these odd talents, but you sense there's something in there that's sort of like a little...
Marc:a little off and a little scary.
Guest:You would have to be, you're talking about void filling, like people who, I don't know if you feel this way, but like, so I hit, you know, I got SNL, I did my six years, and then there really is this moment where you're like,
Guest:The people who then move on to the next stratospheric level in their ears are like, wow, you're hungry because I am tired.
Guest:This is good.
Guest:Some people recognize me.
Guest:Sometimes I get a good table at a restaurant.
Marc:No, I get it.
Marc:I get it.
Marc:I'm not that ambitious, but I clearly need to be busy.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But you've got a family and you've got kids and you have things you like to do, right?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I also have a bifurcated career, so I actually have been really busy.
Marc:No, I know I could see that.
Guest:No, no, I'm not saying that defensively, but what I mean is that people from TV maybe will say, like, where have you been?
Guest:You're like, well, I did five Broadway shows, and I wrote two albums, and I toured with the band, so I'm always sort of, like, doing something, but there are, like, five mountains that I'm trying to climb concurrently, you know?
Marc:But what are you judging against, though, when you say someone leaves SNL and moves on to, like, movie stardom?
Guest:Well, I just think when I left...
Guest:SNL in particular in the 90s, it was just like, yeah, exactly.
Guest:Explosive, you know, careers.
Guest:Like the movie star.
Guest:The standard bearer was like Sandler.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Guest:At that time.
Marc:Were you on with him?
Guest:No, right after him.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:But, you know, the guy would have, like, for years, he did three $20 million movies a year.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You know, huge movies.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That everyone would see in a movie theater.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Whether or not you liked them.
Guest:So, I mean, the idea... You had to go.
Guest:It wasn't a matter of like... I mean, by the way, I don't even know if it's like... I'm not... Who knows how... What his drive mentality was.
Guest:I just like...
Marc:Yeah, I don't know either, but I ask myself that all the time, too, because I'm working at whatever my bifurcated career is.
Marc:I do when I have opportunities.
Marc:Stand up and podcasting.
Marc:But I am in a position to not have to do things.
Guest:Right.
Marc:And I'm just one of those people that's sort of like, well, that's great.
Marc:You know, like I don't have to do it, but there are certain things I want to do.
Marc:But I still always wonder about people that keep doing it when they're not doing anything new with it.
Marc:It's like, why do you just keep doing it?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I mean, there's very specific people in my head and there's a certain amount of resentment behind it.
Guest:So I can't wait to hear you talking about when we sit on the porch.
Guest:No, it's just porch time.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:All right.
Marc:But you know what I mean?
Marc:You're just sort of like taking up space.
Marc:How much money do you need?
Guest:I know.
Guest:You know, I do know, especially when you get into lifestyle branding.
Guest:I don't know what that's about.
Guest:I mean, I would very much love to see a Marc Maron line at Walmart.
Guest:I'm not going to lie.
Marc:I wish I could do that, but I'm not going to invent anything.
Marc:I'm not going to hire a team to create.
Marc:What am I going to create?
Guest:But they don't invent anything either.
Guest:That's what's sort of amazing, the number of people out there that are like, oh, my jewelry line and my makeup line and my thingy line and my hair product.
Guest:There's nothing new.
Guest:They're not reinventing the wheel.
Marc:They just put their name on it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:What the hell could I put my name on it?
Guest:Well, let's start with cooking utensils.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Marin at home.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:Maybe there's a few.
Marc:How do you use the same spoon for everything?
Guest:We could do that.
Guest:We could do a multi-purpose and then we do a fun little video on TikTok with you all.
Marc:I've done TikTok.
Guest:15 seconds.
Guest:Have you done it?
Guest:I have people trying to help me to do it, but yes, I'm on TikTok.
Marc:Are we supposed to do it?
Guest:Is there a point where you're like, I'm a grown up and I don't want to do any of it anymore, but my numbers are still so fucking in the middle that I want to be on.
Marc:But what are you TikToking for?
Marc:The American auto show?
Marc:American Cars.
Marc:American Auto.
Marc:That's an old guy thing.
Marc:Cars Tonight.
Guest:Cars Tonight.
Guest:American Auto, the honest, it comes really more from my own.
Guest:Well, no, that's not true.
Guest:I mean, because I wrote a movie with Dratch this year and produced it.
Guest:So I think anytime that you make something that you.
Marc:You're doing something.
Marc:I think what I was reacting to is that you were clearly judging yourself against these super hyper ambitious people that have humongous profiles.
Marc:But people like us, we chip away.
Marc:We're busy.
Marc:We do things.
Marc:Totally.
Marc:You know, we have audiences.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:You know, we enjoy all different things.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But we do not get appreciated at the same level of those people.
Guest:Well.
Marc:I'm sorry.
Guest:I'm going to do a lifestyle brand.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:What should my thing be?
Marc:Something maybe musical.
Marc:Maybe you should do a line of harmonicas.
Marc:No, children's musical instruments.
Marc:That's not bad.
Marc:Xylophones.
Guest:It's funny because in my show, my sidekick, band leader, plays a glockenspiel that I bought him on Amazon.
Marc:Right.
Marc:That kind of stuff.
Guest:It's Amazon's choice.
Marc:I think kid stuff is good.
Marc:You like that stuff?
Guest:I do, actually.
Guest:I've never seen that.
Guest:Are you sponsored by Bronner's?
Marc:Not at all.
Marc:But we have a relationship with Bronner's, and we help them with a book pitch, and they sent me.
Marc:I have, like, literally 100 bottles of that.
Marc:That's nice.
Marc:I do.
Guest:I love that peppermint.
Marc:I think I have a lavender one, too.
Guest:That's a pick-me-up right there.
Marc:Yeah, sure.
Marc:Peppermint's good for a minute.
Marc:I know, it's true.
Marc:I'm not going to carry it through.
Marc:Until you sag again.
Marc:All right, so your relationship with Lauren was always good?
Guest:Yeah, I would say.
Marc:You had fun, and you have nothing but warm memories.
Yeah.
Guest:I don't have, like, it was very professional, is what I would say.
Marc:And you were professional, so it was fine.
Marc:You didn't go there looking for parenting.
Marc:You went there to do the thing.
Guest:I was there at a time when women, when I first came to Saturday Night Live, women were so, it was so presumed that you were going to crash and burn and be destroyed and shoot up and eaten up by the stars.
Guest:by the show that I had nowhere to go but hope.
Guest:So I got there, and my first season was Sherry Oteri, me, and Molly Shannon, and the three writers were Laurie Nasso, Cindy Caponera, and Paula Pell.
Guest:And that was it.
Marc:And we were so overrun by bro-hams that... The way people talk about it, it almost seems like it is a conscious competition that those dudes are out to crush.
Guest:It's a very aggro, like, hetero... I mean, it's changed a little, but it's a very hetero, sportsy kind of mentality, you know?
Guest:Totally.
Guest:I mean, and, you know, he's from a school of thought that's like the art of war and...
Guest:Who, Lauren?
Guest:Lauren.
Guest:I mean, it's an older management style that was very popular at the time you started the show.
Guest:Out of competition breeds excellence.
Guest:And he's not totally wrong, but I had people come up to me.
Guest:I remember a comedian came up to me on the street when I got cast and was like, I'm so sorry you got cast.
Guest:You're so good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like the assumption.
Guest:So I would not have... My point is... A lot of women have crashed and burned on there.
Marc:That was the assumption.
Marc:Despite their amazing talent.
Guest:I was right after like Janine Garofalo and Keitlinger and like really talented women had come through.
Guest:I know there were like chapters at the very beginning and obviously Nora Dunn and Jan Hooks were incredible, but mostly women were sort of not the star, you know?
Guest:So we... I just didn't... I was like, well...
Guest:I'm going to try this.
Guest:And I'm a very, I was a good student and I'm not, I didn't, I don't know, I wasn't going to be a problem for more.
Guest:Like I wasn't that, I'm not that rebellious.
Marc:Yeah, but you were funny too.
Marc:So that was good.
Marc:That counts for something.
Guest:Hopefully.
Guest:I mean, I wrote a lot.
Guest:I had a lot of support from early on writing.
Guest:I wrote with amazing people.
Guest:I wrote with, you know, McKay.
Guest:And when Tina came, I wrote with Tina.
Guest:And I wrote with Stephen Craig.
Guest:I wrote with Paula Pell all the time.
Guest:All the girls did.
Guest:She's a fucking genius.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So there's good people there, you know, and you collaborate and you find your carve your path.
Marc:Now, did you find that when you got out, was there like a time of like depression or like you like the one thing I wish that I the sadness?
Guest:No, because I was the first person to have a baby.
Guest:That was the other thing.
Guest:So I had a baby and I left to have my baby.
Guest:And a little bit there had been like a gauntlet thrown out.
Guest:Like, let's see how this goes.
Guest:If you have a baby and come to work.
Guest:And Lauren was very nice about it.
Guest:He was like, we'll write for you.
Guest:You don't have to write.
Guest:But I also knew that the nature of the show was not to do that.
Guest:I was like, I can't stand... I felt good about my work when I left.
Guest:I felt like I wasn't... I left with plenty of good work in the bank.
Guest:And it wasn't like diminishing returns, which can happen, I think.
Guest:And...
Guest:I didn't know what to expect out of parenting.
Guest:And so I was just like, I just didn't want to try to prove that I could do the show and be a mom at the same time.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Which is fine.
Guest:Now I wish, though, that I had hung around because a really kind of incredible season for women happened then.
Guest:I mean, I don't mean season like television season.
Guest:I mean spiritual season was coming in because Amy Poehler's first year was my last year.
Guest:So then it turned into this like...
Guest:Amy was there.
Guest:Maya was there.
Guest:Tina was there.
Guest:Rachel was there.
Guest:Kristen Wiig came in.
Guest:It was just like a cool, again, representation matters.
Guest:So there was like at a point of like six or seven women.
Guest:It was a lot compared to the three little paltry chickens in the corner.
Guest:So in retrospect, I wish that that might have been nice to be a part of.
Guest:But also I have to say psychologically, back to Will Ferrell and square dancing,
Guest:That's my one regret, is I don't think I learned how to have fun there.
Guest:I was so afraid of not failing.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That's what it was.
Guest:So that's why I did theater, actually.
Guest:Because my thing was, the best you do at SNL, because it's kind of rough if your brain works around failure at all.
Guest:The creative part's amazing.
Guest:But the best you could do on Saturday was to not totally fail.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Like, to pull it off.
Marc:Right, right.
Guest:if you pulled it off well there's like because of the converging on the liveness yeah all of it it's last minute and things whatever um and so theater was kind of like a um what's the word i'm looking for a savior salve salvation yeah a salve
Marc:A salve.
Marc:Because you could do the show and you could do it again.
Guest:For OCD, but then that goes too far that way.
Guest:So it gets very like, I can do this, I can fix it, I can do this, I can fix it, I can do this, I can fix it.
Guest:And then after years of that, I started to go insane.
Guest:It was so regimented.
Guest:So then I really was like, I had my son and then I was just sort of desperate to get back to half hour television, which I actually think is the happy medium.
Guest:because you are living inside one character who you get to know and you understand their nuances there's new stuff and it's fast yeah it's not like turgidly slow with a long fucking process right for comedians yeah it's painful yeah because charlie my husband would always make fun of me because i i love theater and i love theater people yeah but there is this like there there's this it's earnest yeah oh yeah rehearsal is and it's a community you know and it's like yeah
Guest:It's long, long.
Guest:And I would come every time I've started a play, I've come home and I've been like, oh, everybody hates me.
Guest:And Charlie's like, what do you mean?
Guest:Are they laughing at your jokes?
Guest:And I'll say, no, they're not.
Guest:He's like, right, because they're doing their job and you're doing bits while you're doing your job.
Guest:And he's right.
Guest:Like comedians are always doing two things at the same time.
Marc:But that's the fun.
Guest:That's the fun.
Guest:I know.
Guest:So half hour television is a nice place in between and writing and making stuff.
Marc:And the music's a nice way to blow off steam and release that you have so much control over.
Marc:It's great.
Marc:If you can sing, it feels great.
Guest:Yeah, it's fun.
Marc:But this new show, American Auto.
Guest:American Auto.
Marc:It's sort of a nice approach to that odd fish out of water corporate person.
Marc:It's like there's something very funny about that character.
Guest:Oh, thanks.
Marc:And also the setup of it.
Marc:To actually have that much power and just to be thrown on to a major corporation.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Well, and don't you know people... Thank you for saying that.
Guest:I mean, I think... And also, it is.
Guest:It comes from... There really is a school of management that's like, my job isn't to know how to make cars.
Guest:It's how to sell cars.
Guest:You know, like, that's where her attitude is.
Guest:She's from big pharma.
Guest:She's got big swagger.
Marc:But it's so funny because it's like, you know, in any other discussion about that person, it'd be a villain.
Marc:Just a horrible fucking...
Marc:So, like, the fact that you've got to bring, you know, charm and humor and kind of this kind of goofiness to someone who's like, no, I was a big pharma and, you know, I was successful.
Marc:Well, yeah, it's kind of an interesting take on something we usually associate with just horrible people.
Guest:That's really interesting.
Guest:No one's said that yet.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:Well, it's funny because I think I'm thinking about workplace comedies.
Guest:I'm thinking about, like, Michael Scott.
Guest:And I'm thinking about how he's a terrible person.
Guest:Michael Scott's a terrible, terrible person.
Guest:But again, because it's Carell and because it's...
Guest:Dudes, I don't know.
Guest:I feel like guys have been afforded that a lot.
Marc:But even the original Office, when you watch Gervais do whatever the fuck that was that he was doing.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Horrible.
Marc:Yeah, I know.
Marc:But beyond cringe into this other zone.
Guest:I know.
Guest:So likable.
Guest:Because you find yourself.
Marc:You feel bad for him.
Marc:You feel bad for him.
Marc:That one episode where he does that dance.
Guest:yeah it's over and not knowing all the all the fun this but i think justin spitzer who wrote who writes american auto the creator i think he does this really well writing situations wherein people are like fompering and bullshitting what they don't know yeah and it's so common at in in workplace in the workplace because you can talk in the jargon there's people that just do that talk i can't even tell you how many
Marc:It's unbelievable.
Guest:Because Rachel and I wrote a movie, and so I had to do a lot more sort of as a producer grown-up stuff where I would talk to actual- Which movie?
Guest:We wrote this Christmas movie called A Clusterfunk Christmas that we did last year.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was a parody of those Hallmark cheesy Hallmark movies.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Anyway, super fun.
Guest:A lot of sweaters?
Guest:A lot of sweaters.
Guest:A lot of sweaters.
Guest:A lot of Henleys, too.
Guest:A lot of men's Henleys.
Guest:Anyway, it was amazing.
Guest:We would get letters from emails about things that would be 100% jargon where I would not understand.
Guest:I would have to decipher it like a code.
Marc:All they're doing is they're sending out dispatches to displace blame if the shit hits the fan.
Guest:Absolutely right.
Marc:That's the entire equation of that bullshit.
Marc:Absolutely right.
Marc:We sent them an email kind of discussing that.
Guest:Totally.
Marc:It's not on us.
Guest:No, we covered it.
Marc:Yeah, we sent them an incomprehensible bunch of bullshit.
Guest:We're going to circle back and we'll touch base around that later.
Guest:Yeah, it's amazing.
Guest:We're not going to kick this down the road.
Guest:We told them we're in the paint with you.
Guest:What?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Insane.
Guest:It is.
Guest:Anyway.
Marc:But you like doing it.
Guest:I like ensemble stuff.
Guest:I like working with other people.
Guest:I like the energy of lots of... It's funny, too, because this show and the show I did right before this had... Which one was that?
Guest:It was a show called People of Earth.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was about abduction survivors.
Guest:It was a support group.
Guest:So we had these epic scenes with all 10 of us.
Guest:I ran the support group.
Guest:And it was... In both situations, the showrunner's like, I know these days are really long in the conference room.
Guest:I'm always like, but that's all like, to me, that's my favorite part.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because we do bits.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:We fuck around.
Guest:You get to know the, and you don't have that like all day with one other actor going to the chairs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, so it's like 10 other, but you never, no one ever fights.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's nice.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I like the energy.
Marc:You feel like you're part of a group.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, good.
Marc:I'm glad you're, I'm glad you're happy and working and you, and you still seem to be in touch with and friends with a lot of the people from the old days.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:That's nice.
Guest:I try to be.
Marc:Well, I know a lot of people you talk to.
Marc:It really was heartbreaking to me.
Marc:It took me about a thousand episodes of the show to realize that people really don't hang out with each other after the movie's over.
Marc:And then when I did some acting, you don't talk to those people, really.
Guest:I feel like you really get one a show, maybe.
Marc:Yeah, who you're really friends with.
Guest:Yeah, I would say SNL's different.
Marc:Well, you feel like you've been through something traumatic, too.
Guest:you have you've there's trauma bonding for sure yeah um there's also just like mutant mutant bonding yeah like i you know and and to his immense sort of probably accidental credit i mean lorne is very loyal and he the that he stayed at the same place all this time so he considers everybody who comes through this like he has this tribal and for years you can rail against it in therapy whatever like yeah you're you're in the fucking mafia like you you're not allowed out so yeah so
Guest:um once you kind of surrender to that idea it's actually kind of great um because the resources are extraordinary like it's it's literally one of those therapy things like what you can go eat over at 30 rock and stuff no meaning like i mean it took me a long time i guess i should just speak for myself i don't know what anyone else feels there because everybody's so unique but realizing like i went through my phase of like i don't want anything to do with the show i don't want to talk about the show i don't want to why people always want to talk about the show yeah
Guest:Why does anyone want to interview about the show?
Guest:And then eventually you'd be like, oh, well, but if I need help, I don't know, directing my first music video, oh, I'm going to call Yorma Tacconi.
Guest:Oh, yeah, he'll do it and we'll do an amazing music video that we know organically the skill set is so fast and so like...
Guest:Oh, I got my neighbor's baby.
Guest:We use my neighbor's baby.
Guest:Like the sort of like crazy speed with which we get it done.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And the sort of elation of making something quickly, ridiculous and fun.
Guest:And definitely like writing the movie with Rachel, you know, just like the immediacy with which you're like the sense of the shorthand.
Marc:Did you know Hal Wilner?
Marc:Oh, very well.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, horrible.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Like everybody, like I didn't know him, but he seemed like an amazing music person.
Yeah.
Guest:He was just an amazing everything person.
Guest:Just like a, again, all those people who walk through that space in this own sense.
Guest:Also, it's just full of, frankly, anomalous, truly anomalous weirdos that Lauren's given a home and made space for.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:That's nice.
Marc:Nice way to look at it.
Guest:And their skill set is utterly anachronistic.
Guest:Like, there's no point.
Guest:If you go to SNL, you see a lot of the cameramen.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They come from live TV.
Guest:There's pictures of them with old Norelco cameras.
Guest:They all shoot the Macy's parade and the Super Bowl.
Marc:I interviewed Lauren, and really, at the end of the day, he's a guy that produces a television show, and he works.
Marc:That's his job, and that's how he sees himself.
Marc:It's like, I'm here.
Marc:This is my building.
Marc:This is my office, and I've worked here for a million years.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Like he's like he, like outside of being a billionaire and a genius, he sees himself on a practical level as a utilitarian kind of, I'm a TV producer.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's a very, that show has grounded his life too.
Guest:You know, his routine and all that.
Guest:He's a very routine person.
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But it's wandering those halls forever.
Yeah.
Marc:And it made me look at him totally differently.
Marc:It made me look at, I used to think he was like, oh, this all powerful thing.
Marc:It was like, no, he's just this guy.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's wandering these halls for 40, 50 years, however long it's been.
Marc:Almost 50.
Marc:It's amazing.
Marc:But I get it.
Marc:So like once you're in, you can have, you have relationships with all these different people.
Guest:Yeah, it's just the amazing, I mean, not that you're friends with everybody, but there is, I'm actually the first time I met Sandler, I had just left the show and we sat down.
Guest:I don't even know him that well.
Guest:I know I'm surprised it came up twice in one conversation, but we were at the opening of some Broadway show and he sat down like down the row and we just looked at each other and he was like, I know, I know, I know.
Guest:You have this instant with anyone there.
Guest:Bobby Moynihan, I think I embraced him on the street.
Guest:Kate McKinnon turned around the first time I ever met her, also in a theater, and she turned around to me and she was like, do you ever not know what to write?
Guest:So the immediacy of all of that, not that you stay great friends with them, I happen to be very close to
Guest:A bunch of of my female cohorts, because there was an active recognition at a certain point that we were so our experience was so insanely unique.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Especially the women who followed me that we share we share kind of almost a support group.
Guest:But who's in that group?
Guest:That's a lot of the Betty White gag.
Guest:That's Rachel and Polar and Tina and Paula and Emily Spivey and the Wine Country Girls.
Guest:And that kind of just emerged out of like...
Guest:Again, because of all, Lauren would have all of these reunions and sort of the shared like Maya.
Marc:It's nice.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It's like this.
Marc:It's like it's almost like like a school.
Marc:Like that's exactly what it's like.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Or an army troop.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:People have those.
Marc:I don't know that I've really quite heard it put that way, but I like it.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So what are you going to do now?
Marc:Where do you go?
Guest:What, after American Auto or life?
Marc:Life.
Marc:You're in L.A.
Marc:for what?
Marc:You're going to the Super Bowl?
Marc:We're going to the Super Bowl.
Marc:For NBC?
Marc:Yes, my overlords invited us.
Guest:It's awesome.
Guest:The swag is making me laugh so hard.
Marc:Do you like football?
Guest:Not really.
Guest:I do have an enthusiasm for the Super Bowl of each thing in life.
Guest:And I feel like Charlie and my husband and I have been lucky to get to do...
Guest:Because of the Three Penny Opera, I presented at the Tonys.
Guest:I feel like we got to go to the SNL 40th.
Guest:He's an advertiser.
Guest:Cannes has this advertising explosion every year.
Guest:Oh, you go to Cannes?
Guest:We've gone to Cannes for the Montreal Comedy Festival.
Guest:I love these things that are like the creme de la creme of the thing.
Marc:And you can just be there and eat some stuff.
Guest:And they're all the same.
Guest:They have the hospitality suite, a bunch of parties, and the specific crowd that does it every year fascinates me.
Guest:So it was so funny arriving NBC.
Guest:They invited us out, and we're being arranged for through all of the other advertisers and stuff that are going.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I think most people are in L.A.
Guest:already.
Guest:Anyway, so they happen to bestow upon us the swag bag for the advertisers.
Guest:And it's like these douchey wraparound glasses.
Guest:Like a backpack cooler, a Yeti cooler.
Guest:I mean, it just makes me laugh because each thing is its own little world.
Guest:We saw a bunch of guys in the hospitality suite with their Yeti backpack coolers, like heading out to golf.
Guest:I'm like, I don't understand what's happening.
Guest:It's another world, man.
Guest:I love it.
Guest:So I wish I could show you randomly.
Guest:What?
Guest:It's also one of the things I love about American Auto.
Guest:I have my NBC Universal ID.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And there was a mix-up.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they ended up using one of my, like, corporate pictures that were the stills from my office as my character.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:So it's like this insane corporate portrait of my character on my real ID.
Guest:So I look like Joanne from, you know, Human Resources.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:That's great.
Marc:I'll give you some swag.
Marc:Oh, yeah, what's my swag?
Marc:What's the Marin swag?
Marc:Swag.
Marc:It's a hand-thrown mug by a guy named Brian Jones.
Marc:Really?
Marc:That all the guests get.
Guest:That's beautiful.
Guest:I didn't realize the ceramic arts were such a piece of your story.
Marc:Yeah, and there's little pictures of the original crew of cats in my face.
Marc:I'll show you.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:And I'll tell you who I was thinking about.
Guest:What's your relationship to Brian Jones?
Marc:He was a fan and he offered to make mugs.
Marc:And originally it was just for guests.
Marc:And occasionally he'll do a run of them for sale and they disappear within seconds.
Guest:I'm sure.
Marc:But he just wanted to do something with the show.
Marc:That's really cool.
Marc:So he created it.
Marc:I love it.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Well, have fun.
Marc:Get out?
Marc:No.
Marc:It's nice talking to you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Thanks for having me.
Marc:That was on a gas tire.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Great talk, right?
Marc:The show American Auto is on NBC.
Marc:Look for it on your NBC affiliate.
Marc:Do you still say that?
Marc:Look for it on your thing.
Marc:Stream it.
Marc:Do whatever you got to do.
Marc:All right?
Marc:It's on Tuesday nights.
Marc:It's also streaming on Peacock.
Marc:Now I'm going to do a long guitar thing.
Marc:I kind of got into it.
Marc:I got into it.
Marc:It's crunchy.
guitar solo
guitar solo
guitar solo
Marc:Boomer lives.
Marc:Monkey in La Fonda.
Marc:Cat angels everywhere.