Episode 1285 - Jennifer Hudson
Guest:Lock the gates!
Marc:All right, let's do this.
Marc:How are you?
Marc:What the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fuck next?
Marc:What's happening?
Marc:I'm Mark Maron.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Yes, I have a cold.
Marc:How's it going?
Marc:Yes, you're right.
Marc:I do sound different.
Marc:It happens.
Marc:But to be honest with you, has not happened in a couple of years since before the pandemic.
Marc:It has not happened.
Marc:I've not had a illness like this, a cold.
Marc:I thought I had COVID 900 times, but never like nothing that locked, that kind of got hold of me.
Marc:I got like an old school cold, old timey cold right now.
Marc:But I mean, I had to figure out whether it was COVID or not, of course, at the beginning, but it...
Marc:Things synced up.
Marc:Things worked out.
Marc:And I got to be honest with you, I'm a little nostalgic for the days when you'd get a cold and you didn't have to wonder whether or not you had a disease, a plague that if you brought out into the world could kill immunocompromised people or old people or unvaccinated people.
Marc:That last category, I don't know.
Marc:That's a little harsh, but please understand it was framed as a joke.
Marc:But yeah, I got a fucking cold.
Marc:Old school.
Marc:Head stuffy.
Marc:Scratchy voice.
Marc:Throat hurt.
Marc:Sweating in the night.
Marc:It's been going around.
Marc:Jennifer Hudson's on the show today.
Marc:You know Jennifer Hudson.
Marc:I mean, she was in the movie Respect With Me.
Marc:She won an Oscar for Dreamgirls.
Marc:She's done a lot of amazing Grammy Award winning records.
Marc:And she's a Weight Watchers spokesperson.
Marc:And I'm not belittling that.
Marc:We talk about it.
Marc:We talk about the Weight Watchers.
Guest:I told her I miss the old-timey Weight Watchers.
Guest:Straight up points, man.
Guest:I still have my points calculator because I know a lot of you are like, Mark, but you never had a weight problem.
Guest:Fine, but I have an eating disorder, which...
Marc:And one of the symptoms is thinking I have a weight problem and managing my weight, controlling my food intake was important to me and still is.
Marc:And the way I learned how to do it was on the old timey Weight Watchers.
Marc:Yeah, the points, the point calculator.
Marc:But she's here and it's exciting.
Marc:Here's some other stuff.
Marc:I got more stuff to tell you.
Marc:If you want your WTF merch delivered before Christmas, this Wednesday, December 8th is the last day to guarantee shipping by the 24th.
Marc:Go to PodSwag.com slash WTF or click on the merch tab at WTFPod.com.
Marc:Also at WTFPod.com, you can click on the tour page and get links for all of my shows on the This May Be the Last Time tour next year.
Marc:There's a lot of dates, and there's going to be more coming.
Marc:And also, let me remind you, for fuck's sake, make sure you're at the right ticket outlet.
Marc:Just go to the links at wtfpod.com slash tour.
Marc:I get all these DMs from people like...
Marc:$300 for tickets?
Marc:It's like, no, that's a scalper site.
Marc:And they've gotten very clever about drawing you to them.
Marc:You think you're at the right place and you're not.
Marc:Do yourself a favor.
Marc:Just go to wtfpod.com slash tour.
Marc:Use those links so you don't get into that like, oh, there's no tickets left that aren't $900.
Marc:I don't charge that much.
Marc:I'm a cheap date, man, in comparison to some of my peers.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:A couple other things.
Marc:Our friends at the Paris Theater in New York City, who were very nice to host us for a live WTF last month, they're doing a screening of the French Connection in 35mm this Thursday, December 9th.
Marc:They were inspired to do this based on our talk with Jason Bailey about New York City movies.
Marc:So if you like that and you're in New York, go watch one of the greatest New York City movies on the big screen.
Marc:And finally, people...
Marc:There's a nationwide fundraiser to help raise money for the comedy community.
Marc:The pandemic knocked a lot of performers off the tracks, and Comedy Gives Back was set up to provide a safety net of medical treatment, financial assistance, and more.
Marc:This Thursday, December 9th, comedy clubs and venues all across the country are participating in the Comedy Gives Back Laughing for Good initiative.
Marc:And you can help, too.
Marc:No matter how big or small, you can make a donation by texting laugh to 707070.
Marc:Got it?
Marc:And go to Comedy Gives Back to learn more.
Marc:All right?
Marc:So that's that.
Marc:So I got this cold.
Marc:Yeah, I might have given some people the cold.
Marc:But here's what happens.
Marc:So Wednesday, I get a COVID test, like the good kind, the PCR test.
Marc:because I got to do an event Wednesday night.
Marc:I was moderating a panel, a four-year consideration panel.
Guest:Then the next day, I woke up with a cold, and I tested myself again at home with the antigen test, and I was negative again.
Guest:So it's definitely just an old-timey cold, but I had to go through some stuff, and I might have given someone a cold moderating that.
Marc:And I'm sorry, but I felt it was important to be there.
Marc:Because to be honest with you, even watching that pilot again,
Marc:At the event, Reservation Dogs is is one of the few truly groundbreaking shows that, you know, I you know, I remember seeing in my lifetime.
Marc:Seriously.
Marc:I mean, that whole world and that the total lack of representation of.
Marc:That indigenous people have in any real kind of humane and human way is is very real.
Marc:And this is the first time almost any of us have seen it handled so beautifully with humor and sadness and pathos.
Marc:But it's just it is groundbreaking because it gives people.
Marc:you know, indigenous people, a voice that just never existed before this in mainstream culture, in pop culture.
Marc:And I just can't, it just moves me to fucking tears.
Marc:Every time I see it, I watch that fucking pilot episode again and I only saw the last 10 minutes and I was choked up just because
Marc:of how beautiful it is that there's this whole world of humanity in our own country that has been marginalized and attempted annihilation through genocide at one point in our history and now has at least this one show that is a beautiful and honest representation of that way of life.
Marc:And it just moves me.
Marc:And I was thrilled to be part of the panel.
Marc:And it was good to see and meet some of those actors.
Marc:Good to see Sterling again.
Marc:But needless to say, because I've already said it, I got a cold.
Marc:That's where we were going with this.
Marc:So I've been fighting it for a couple of days.
Marc:But then I fucking go and, you know, I...
Marc:Am I the asshole?
Marc:I guess I'm the asshole.
Marc:I don't want to cancel my comedy spots.
Marc:I was straight with people.
Marc:I'm like, I got that cold.
Marc:And everyone was like, well, you had it.
Marc:I had it.
Marc:Chris Spencer.
Marc:I had it.
Marc:I'm like, all right.
Marc:So it's been going around.
Marc:But I didn't want to cancel my spots because people go.
Marc:People go to see me, even though it's just a 15 minute spot at the comedy store.
Marc:People are like, I was only in town for a night and I went to the store and you canceled.
Marc:And I don't know why does that bother me?
Marc:It bothers me.
Marc:So I go.
Marc:And I had last night, or the night before last, Saturday night, I had two amazing sets where I did a lot of riffing because I was kind of in a funk.
Marc:Not really in a funk, but...
Marc:I've been having some issues lately, and my buddy, Dean Delray, fucking called me out publicly.
Marc:You'll hear it.
Marc:He called me out, and it was emotional, and I'll explain it to you in a second.
Marc:Do you even want to know?
Marc:I've been a little fucking, you know, a little edgy, angry, talking shit.
Marc:pushing buttons.
Marc:I can feel the tone of my stand-up shifting in places.
Marc:I was just pushing everybody away.
Marc:And so I talked to Dean the other day, and it's on the Dark Fonzie, which will be on tomorrow, and I kind of broke down.
Marc:He was like, dude, you sound like you used to sound when you started WTF.
Marc:And I'm like, fuck, man.
Marc:And I've known this was going on.
Marc:I knew I was getting snappy.
Marc:I knew I was talking shit.
Marc:You know, I knew I was starting to feel like, you know, vindicated and righteous about shit I was saying about people.
Marc:That's totally unnecessary.
Marc:Kind of snapping out at people feeling, you know, justified in that anger.
Marc:And the truth be told, like, you know, it was concerning me.
Marc:I knew I had to pull back and I haven't been hung up on this, but it's just a reality.
Marc:You know, you know.
Marc:The unfolding of grief is long and weird.
Marc:My dad's sick and my mom's getting older.
Marc:And, you know, this is just life.
Marc:But I don't talk to many people about it.
Marc:You know, and I got, you know, I went and saw my therapist a couple of times, but like...
Marc:I can't underestimate the impact of the last year, the tragedy of the last year for all of us.
Marc:But I just, you know, I do feel myself closing down.
Marc:I do feel my heart closing up.
Marc:And I can't make an argument for opening it sometimes.
Marc:And that's crazy because that means like all the good stuff that you get when you open your heart to people or just open it to receive things, all that stuff.
Marc:You shut that out, then all you get is anger and either you shove that inside yourself or you fucking push it out into the world.
Marc:Now, obviously, comedy is a fine place for me to push out anger into the world.
Marc:But even that, there's some jokes I'm doing where I'm doing them in the tone of them and the subject matter.
Marc:It's like they make me kind of feel like I want to cry.
Marc:But I think they're hilarious.
Marc:That's the problem.
Marc:You know, it's like that same thing I talked about before, that my resentment of human beings is relative and equal to my empathy for them.
Marc:And look, you know, people are garbage and the world is ending.
Marc:Happy holidays.
Marc:Those are the cards I'm having made.
Marc:But it's true.
Marc:I've got to figure out a way through or back or something.
Marc:And I think just talking about it with Dean was okay and talking about it here now is okay.
Marc:But it's like one of these simple things, especially if you're in the fucking recovery racket.
Marc:It's like I'm not going to meetings regularly.
Marc:I'm not talking to other alcoholics as much as I used to.
Marc:And I'm stubborn about that.
Marc:I'm like, look, man, I'm fucking 22 years into this fucking thing.
Marc:How much do I need?
Marc:That's the tone.
Marc:That's the tone.
Marc:I'm all right, man.
Marc:I'm fucking fine.
Marc:What's your problem?
Marc:Do you have a problem with me?
Marc:Is there a problem with me?
Marc:That's the weird thing is like that tone, you know, in general and bullying to that tone is like a cry for help of some kind.
Marc:But my issue is like, you know, I'll push people away to see if I can get them back.
Marc:But I only let him back so far.
Marc:I'm sort of emotionally crippled and, you know, kind of accepting and receiving the love properly.
Marc:So it's like, it's kind of a tough place to be.
Marc:And you know, it's now like, when is this going to happen?
Marc:When am I going to do it?
Marc:When am I going to fucking, it's not even a matter of manning up or doing the work or whatever.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I feel it right under the surface.
Marc:You know, when your heart's clenched up, it's always been that way, but I've been like harboring a lot of like resentments and I don't need to be, I'm good.
Marc:And I've been very judgmental and critical of people and like talking shit.
Marc:And I don't need to.
Marc:It's not necessary.
Marc:Kind of feels good though.
Marc:Talking shit's one of my hobbies.
Marc:Not a great hobby.
Marc:Okay, you guys, here we go.
Marc:Jennifer Hudson.
Marc:Jennifer Hudson.
Marc:played Aretha Franklin in Respect.
Marc:I worked with her in that movie.
Marc:That movie is now available to buy or rent on digital platforms, and it's also available on DVD and Blu-ray.
Marc:And I was finally able to get her over here to talk.
Marc:And this is me talking to Jennifer Hudson.
Jennifer Hudson
Marc:You knew I played guitar.
Marc:We used to sit around in the studio.
Marc:Remember when everyone was playing?
Marc:Well, you know, you were so in it.
Guest:And everybody was a musician.
Marc:Everyone was hanging around playing.
Guest:Yeah, but to see all of these, because I want a guitar.
Guest:How many you got?
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:I try to get them for free.
Marc:You can get them for free.
Marc:Just make some calls.
Marc:For real?
Marc:Yeah, you're Jennifer Hudson.
Marc:You just say Jennifer Hudson wants a guitar.
Guest:I need a purple one, a matte purple guitar.
Marc:Yeah, Jennifer Hudson wants a Prince guitar.
Marc:Yep.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:That's exactly what I want.
Marc:She wants a Prince guitar with the symbol.
Marc:You want the symbol?
Guest:I want the symbol.
Guest:Well, I could have my own symbol, but it should be purple to represent Prince.
Marc:Yes, I'm sure you can get a guitar.
Marc:I'm absolutely positive.
Marc:You just decide the brand.
Guest:What should I go for?
Guest:Because you're a pro.
Marc:Well, I mean, I play.
Marc:I mean, you know, the big ones are Fender and Gibson, but there's a lot of little places that'll make you a special guitar.
Marc:Really?
Marc:Sure, but they'll take care of you.
Guest:You know, I mean, maybe that's my Christmas gift to myself.
Marc:Have you do you play?
Guest:No, you know what?
Guest:I collect instruments in my house.
Guest:I have a harp.
Marc:I have a full harp like a big harp.
Guest:Yes, I have horns.
Marc:Like what kind of organ?
Marc:Like a church?
Marc:Oh, that's good.
Marc:So you play with it?
Marc:No.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:because i like to have things in there that that's um that represents what i do yeah i mean so i have other people come in and play the instruments like all the musicians okay bring this to life you know yeah so you'll just have people over and go like who can play the harp yeah well nobody really can so i always have to like hire i only know one harp player
Guest:Really?
Marc:Joanna Newsome.
Marc:Look her up.
Marc:Joanna Newsome is a very sort of creative and out there harp player.
Marc:She plays the big harp.
Guest:Okay.
Marc:Many records.
Marc:Many records.
Marc:I think Drag City records.
Marc:She has records too.
Guest:A lot of records.
Marc:Okay, I want to hear this.
Marc:And it's like all harp.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:And she's married to Andy Samberg, you know, the funny guy from SNL who did the music videos, Andy Samberg.
Marc:He's on Brooklyn Nine-Nine.
Guest:I know faces.
Guest:I don't know names.
Guest:I'm sorry.
Marc:So, okay, you got a harp.
Marc:You got the organ.
Guest:I have the harp organ.
Guest:I have horns.
Guest:I have drums.
Guest:I mean, it's set up, you know, for rehearsals and musicians, and then some of them are on display.
Guest:What I do not have yet is a guitar.
Marc:You can get a couple of guitars.
Guest:So I want to get a purple one.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Why don't you just get one of Prince's?
Guest:That would be it.
Guest:You think I could?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Come on.
Marc:You're Jennifer Hudson.
Guest:Where am I getting from now?
Marc:Find out who's got Prince's guitar.
Marc:Well, they might be very expensive.
Guest:They have to be.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I just assume that someone will just give it to you.
Marc:If you talk about it.
Guest:I'll try it because if you say I can, I can.
Marc:I know that a company will give you one.
Marc:I don't know that you'll be able to get Prince's guitar.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Will they expect me to be able to play?
Marc:No, no, no, no.
Marc:They'll just be happy to have one.
Marc:You know how it works.
Marc:Take a picture.
Guest:Look, I got a guitar.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:It'll go on display in my house with all the other instruments that I do not play.
Guest:The only thing I can play on a bit is the piano.
Marc:Is it a studio with all this stuff?
Guest:You know what it is?
Guest:No.
Guest:It's the Aretha Franklin Vocal Studio Throne Room.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Dedicated to her.
Guest:In your house.
Guest:I'm going to show you some pictures of it one day.
Guest:In your house.
Guest:In my house.
Guest:Is there a plaque that says it?
Guest:Actually, it's a marquee at the top.
Guest:It doesn't say Aretha.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I have this huge mural.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That I had painted on the wall.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it's dedicated to her.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then I have a lot of the keepsakes from the film, like the props and stuff when we were on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it makes up the room.
Guest:And then that's why I got the organ when we were on set doing one of the church things.
Guest:You know, the instruments were live.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And I fell in love with the organ.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And so with every project, I keep a keepsake.
Guest:And so I was like, I'm going to get a B. Hammond 3 organ.
Marc:Yeah, you got to have one.
Guest:For my keepsake.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Did you get that one or you just got a new one?
Guest:No, not that one.
Guest:I had my MD pick me out one.
Marc:An old one or a new one?
Guest:It's, I think it's old, but it's really, it's like brand new.
Guest:Oh my God, like they rebuilt everything.
Guest:And so all the musicians who come in my house are like, this is the best organ ever.
Guest:And they love it.
Marc:That's great.
Guest:And we do all the rehearsals in there and I record in there and everything.
Marc:It's weird because all that music that we were playing on, all those instruments, it's a style that you like.
Marc:Right?
Marc:Old style.
Marc:I love it.
Marc:Right?
Marc:With just the old grooves.
Guest:It's so good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's a different vibe, a different feel.
Marc:You did a whole record, was it like that?
Guest:Not yet.
Marc:Not yet?
Guest:That now I'm inspired to, you know, the project playing Aretha and like research and her music and her approach and recording has inspired me to want to approach my music and my recording process that way.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So now like, that's what I want to do.
Guest:I want to record in my house with live musicians.
Guest:Do it live.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh my God.
Guest:That's what my dream is.
Marc:What was it?
Marc:How did you, I mean, how does it work usually?
Marc:Cause I don't do it, but like, you know, when I look at a record,
Marc:There's 90 people on the record, producers.
Guest:And half of them, we never meet.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Never see them.
Guest:Like half the time when I'm singing a song, like a couple of times I've done duets.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:When I started singing a duet, I was singing with one person.
Guest:And then by the time it was done, I'm like, oh, who is that on the record?
Guest:You know?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And you're just by yourself most of the time.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Isn't that sad?
Guest:Never even.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I and I'm the type of person I like to vibe out.
Guest:I like people.
Guest:I like to be in contact and let it breathe in a live way.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So, yeah, that's so funny.
Guest:I don't.
Guest:And the way we record today feels extremely technical.
Guest:And it's so like, oh, my God, it's draining.
Guest:It like sucks.
Marc:at least the life out of me i like it when it's live and i can respond to the musicians on the spot and yeah and feel it as we go versus doing something planned i like to surprise myself right i mean yeah or experience something that i don't even know where it's right so but so the only time that you really get to do that is in actual live yes performances yes not you know like even when you know i tell the story all the time about when we were on the set uh of of respect and it was that christmas party
Marc:And you just stopped by and they had that little combo there.
Guest:Oh, right.
Marc:They had the little combo from town singing Christmas songs.
Marc:And everybody's like, is Jennifer going to go?
Marc:And everyone's like, oh, is she going to sing it?
Marc:And you're like, I don't know if I feel like it.
Marc:But in five minutes you were up there.
Marc:And do you remember what you sang?
Guest:Now Behold the Lamb.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I love that song so much.
Guest:Grew up in church singing it.
Marc:You're not even singing it.
Marc:You're just talking about it.
Marc:I'm starting to choke up.
Guest:It's such a beautiful song.
Guest:I know.
Marc:But when you did it like live like that, because I've been in the studio with you doing the repeats and the pieces and no whole songs.
Marc:And it was just you with musicians live in a cafeteria doing that song.
Marc:And it was amazing.
Marc:It was just amazing.
Marc:It just locked right in.
Guest:It's like it breathes life.
Guest:And to me, that's my favorite thing to do, just be around live music, live musicians.
Guest:And then it's in a moment.
Guest:There's nothing planned.
Marc:That's church, though, but that's church.
Marc:So what was that song called?
Guest:now behold the lamb precious lamb of god precious lamb of god yes and that what is that a church song it's a gospel song kirk franklin i want to say kirk franklin and the family yeah um that song is from them and it is tamla man is the vocal one of the vocalists on the song i can't remember the other is it it's not a christmas song it's just a gospel song or is it a christmas it services both oh yeah you can sing it every sunday if you want and it comes out christmas as you see right yeah it's a song you grew up with
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I used to sing the the it's a male and a female on the record.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I used to sing that verse that I probably sang that day.
Guest:Well, actually, I think I sang both of the verses.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But in a song like that, you got to get up and get in.
Guest:You should have got your song, Mark.
Guest:I know.
Guest:It's such a good one.
Marc:I only have a few songs like that and have nothing to do with God.
Marc:there's a few songs i love but they're not god songs you know there's a david bowie song a lou reed song you know a couple other ones i just played live with some people uh for the second time in my life really the guitar yeah put a band together and sang in front of people it's very exciting and i never do it though like i'm a comic so i actually i don't get that scared doing comedy i don't imagine you get scared singing
Guest:Right.
Marc:But so to actually strap a guitar and go out on a stage, I'm like terrified and nervous and excited.
Marc:And you get all raw and weird.
Guest:It was good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Did you enjoy the feeling?
Guest:Will you do it again?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I want to do it again.
Marc:I want to get better at it.
Marc:Because, you know, I imagine when you first started singing, you get choked up.
Marc:I get choked up.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So like I'm tight.
Marc:You know, I'm on top.
Marc:You know, I'm thinking too much.
Marc:I mean, when did you start, though?
Marc:When did you start that?
Guest:Well, I didn't start singing with my eyes open until I was 19 years old.
Marc:What does that even mean?
Guest:I was I was I had stage fright and I will and I didn't you know I started singing in church when you were a kid when I was a kid so you just stand up there with your eyes closed yeah or I would beg for a solo and then when it came time to sing be completely terrified to do it still do I may not even have shown up for church because I'm like why did I do that to myself because the nurse got the best of me oh really so but you do it
Guest:eventually but did you like so you were hard on yourself you beat yourself up about it yeah to me and I still have like a stage fright yeah and now it hits me in the wings of the stage right before I go out I'm freaking out like do I know the words oh my god what if I miss the cue oh my god like I just recently sang Ness and Dorman um and in New York yeah
Guest:for an audience.
Guest:Andre Bucelli was there and I was like, oh my God, I can't go out there and sing this.
Guest:I don't even know what I'm saying.
Guest:What am I gonna do?
Guest:This is me freaking out right before it came time for me to walk out on the stage.
Marc:Yeah, what venue was that?
Guest:Oh God, it was at the, like, was it Central Park?
Guest:It was a huge park gathered in New York.
Guest:And what was the piece?
Guest:It's an opera?
Marc:Italian.
Marc:And you were singing in Italian?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And in that moment, I talked myself out of things.
Guest:I said, girl, you don't know what you're saying.
Guest:You can't compensate for this.
Guest:What if you miss a word?
Guest:It ain't like you can make up something.
Guest:Like that is what goes through my mind before I walk out on the stage.
Guest:And I was freaking myself out.
Guest:And then, but soon as I walk on the stage, it's like, oh, this is home.
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:It's home.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it just goes away.
Marc:That's why it took years for me to get that.
Marc:What is that?
Marc:Well, I think eventually, I think like you said, you know, you didn't sing with your eyes open to your night.
Marc:What happens is most of your life as a performer, depending on what kind of person you are, you spend pretending like you're not afraid.
Marc:And then one day you're not afraid because you live up there.
Marc:Do you know what I mean?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Like that's where you are.
Marc:That's who you are.
Marc:It's a scary thing.
Guest:No, because I had gave the song to Bocelli and everything.
Guest:I was like, let him just sing the song.
Guest:I don't know what I thought I was thinking.
Guest:I should go home.
Marc:What did you have to do, train in the Italian?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I did it during the pandemic.
Guest:I learned the song during the pandemic.
Guest:At least you had time, huh?
Guest:Yeah, and that's why I chose to do it then because I haven't sang classical music since I was in high school.
Guest:And back then, you had all the time in the world, you know?
Guest:So during the pandemic, I was like, this is the perfect amount of time for me to be able to invest my time and my energy in really learning the song.
Guest:It took me two months to learn the song.
Guest:So that's how I was able to talk myself into the performance.
Guest:I said, trust your teachings.
Guest:You did the work.
Guest:But see, when I think, I mess up something.
Marc:So I was like, don't think about it.
Guest:Just let it go into autopilot.
Marc:You got it.
Guest:Jennifer, don't think.
Marc:It was all in there.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So when you do it in Italian, do you make sure you understand the Italian or it doesn't matter?
Marc:You should.
Marc:In some parts, yes.
Guest:But again, it took two months to learn a song.
Guest:So it's like I got to get what I can get in the amount of time that I can get it and go with it as best as I can.
Guest:And then I'll focus on that later.
Guest:I'll gather it as I go.
Guest:But I am the kind of person that works down to the last second.
Marc:And how did it land?
Marc:Good?
Guest:It landed well.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's so funny.
Guest:And once I got off the stage, I was like, yeah, I have no idea.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I may have looked calm and it may have looked easy on the stage, but in my mind, what was happening and going on?
Guest:Oh, my God.
Marc:Freaking out.
Marc:I hate that.
Marc:The actor David Harbour was so funny.
Marc:I talked to him.
Marc:He does a lot of stage.
Marc:He's in Stranger Things.
Marc:He's a good actor.
Marc:But he said when he's talking about that stage fright, he's got to do a play.
Marc:He's about to go on to do a whole play.
Marc:And he's on stage the entire time for the play.
Marc:And he's in the wings waiting to go on.
Marc:And he has that moment where he's like, somebody get me a script!
Guest:It's the same feeling.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:But we have to psych ourselves out.
Marc:I guess.
Marc:I don't miss that.
Marc:I haven't felt that in a while.
Marc:I mean, I guess with the music I did, but I didn't have a lot.
Marc:It's different when you have a lot at stake.
Marc:If you're in a high profile thing, that makes it even worse.
Marc:No one's going to give a shit if I miss a lyric at the 200 seats in Hollywood.
Marc:Right.
Marc:So you're just out here doing this, doing press and stuff now?
Guest:I've been doing so many things at this point.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:But yes, I am.
Marc:I missed that thing last night.
Marc:Sorry.
Marc:How was that fun?
Guest:It was really nice.
Guest:I enjoyed it.
Guest:Smokey Robinson.
Guest:Smokey Robinson.
Guest:I got to sit and talk to him.
Guest:And we did an interview together about Ms.
Guest:Franklin, which was so cool because they go way back.
Guest:He said she was his longest friend.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Their family friend too, right?
Guest:She was seven when they first met and she was five.
Yeah.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:He's like some of the best songs.
Marc:Smokey Robinson.
Marc:I was thinking about him yesterday, like Tracks of My Tears.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Marc:Tears of a Clown.
Marc:Those two are my favorite.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:Well, one of mine, which I didn't realize he wrote until last night.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:The way you do the things you do by the temptations.
Guest:My mother used to sing that to us all the time.
Guest:And I was like, wait, you wrote that?
Guest:My mother used to sing that to me, you know?
Guest:And, of course, My Girl.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah.
Guest:Songs like that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's golden to me to be able to talk to him.
Marc:Was it the first time you talked to him?
Guest:No, it wasn't my first time.
Marc:Have you sung with him?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:We talked about that, which apparently it was eight years ago or six years ago at the White House where we sang together.
Guest:And I was telling him then, like, I was freaking out.
Guest:Like, oh, my God, I'm sitting here giving Smokey Robinson.
Guest:Like, you know?
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Because I don't take those things lightly.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:How has the feedback on the movie been?
Guest:It's been amazing.
Guest:When you're playing a legend icon that's treasured like Aretha Franklin, it's scary to step into those, just in that whole lane.
Guest:And people can be really picky, but...
Guest:I've been really blown away by how well it's been received because, yes, it's exciting to get the role.
Guest:But then it's like it's one of those freaking out moments.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:What did I do?
Guest:How is it going to be in my career?
Guest:Like, are they going to receive it?
Guest:All of those things is going through my mind.
Guest:But it's been overwhelmingly beautiful.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I think a lot of people didn't know anything about her.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And, you know, even like maybe the true fans or whatever.
Marc:And I don't think even as much as the darkness that they got into in the movie and even in knowing there's more even, I just don't think people had any idea of that woman's journey and trauma that she went to.
Guest:That is so true.
Guest:Because even for myself, I didn't fully know.
Marc:Yeah, I didn't know anything.
Marc:I mean, until I read the biography, and I read the biography of Wexhoyer.
Marc:So I learned all this stuff, and it was like David Ritz, the David Ritz book.
Marc:And it's like heavy, man.
Marc:It's heavy.
Marc:And like when I first when I talk about you in the movie and you look at that old stuff, the old footage of Aretha, which you studied, is you start to realize that that woman early on in her public presentation of herself was full on PTSD.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:Wow.
Marc:Like, you know, that that weird flat affect, you know, that before she sort of came into herself was she was just shut down.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And I just like I mean, it was it was hard to understand at first.
Marc:And I started to realize like that until she got away from Ted.
Marc:She was like, you know, like PTSD, like Stockholm syndrome almost.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That's the thing.
Guest:Like after portraying her and obviously being able to have a chance to be around her and get to know her, it made it make more sense of why she was the way she was.
Guest:You know, it's like, well, because at times when I would be around Ms.
Guest:Franklin, I'm like, well, how's she feeling?
Guest:Does she know?
Guest:Like, hello, do you like me?
Guest:You know, you never knew where you stood with her.
Guest:And she wasn't a very expressive person when she said what she said.
Guest:She said what she said.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Every she was kind of like it now.
Guest:And I think about it, it seems like.
Guest:I almost feel like a shell shock in a way.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Which is understandable.
Guest:When you look at the conditions and the situations and from her perspective, it makes so much more sense now.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, for sure.
Marc:Her talent was so specific and so kind of undeniable that it's going to come out no matter what.
Marc:But, you know, whatever the vessel that she's in or however she's handling her shit, you know, is all relative to what she came from.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:You know, and it all makes sense in relation to that.
Marc:I mean, the way that Forrest Whitaker portrayed that man, it was like menacing.
Marc:Right.
Marc:When you were sitting with working with that guy, when you because I didn't I didn't get to do any scenes with him, but you're doing it.
Marc:No, no, no.
Marc:But like just it must have been heavy.
Guest:Oh my God, I'm just imagining doing a scene with both of you would have been like, whoa, this is amazing.
Guest:But to work with Forrest and to see his approach and the way he channeled CL.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Without words at times, but still...
Guest:Giving you the essence of every bit of what... Yeah, yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:CL was... I couldn't imagine a better... Just the weight of it, man.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It was so good.
Marc:That whole thing was so good.
Marc:So you still live in Chicago?
Marc:I do.
Marc:Like in it?
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Born and raised.
Guest:I flew here from Chicago.
Marc:Are you in the city or outside of the city?
Guest:Well, I'm in Burrage now.
Guest:Yes, nice.
Guest:I am originally from the city, south side Inglewood area, born and raised.
Guest:Nice.
Marc:Yeah, I have no sense, you know, like I only know the, I love Chicago.
Marc:I mean, I go there and I've grown to like it, you know, because I've worked there at times and I've been there several times over the last few years.
Marc:It's a real city that has its own identity.
Marc:There's only a few of those really that are their own thing.
Marc:But there's a whole, I've only talked to a few people that have grown up there and there's a whole mythology, a dark mythology to Chicago.
Marc:But I mean, that was a big, thriving, nice neighborhood at some point, right?
Marc:When you were growing up?
Guest:Yeah, I mean.
Marc:Or was it rough?
Guest:For us, I don't know if I ever really knew the difference.
Guest:I was very sheltered and stayed in with my mother.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's why I ended up being the way that I am now, singing and all of that.
Marc:She protected you?
Guest:We were in church every day of the week.
Marc:Yes, sir.
Marc:Just for safety?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what?
Guest:I guess that was a part of it because my mother used to say idle hands is the devil's workshop.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And then my grandmother's brother was a pastor of the church.
Marc:Oh, in town.
Marc:How far over in the house front was it?
Guest:Back then I was younger.
Guest:We lived on 63rd and the church was on 45th and Greenwood.
Guest:And it's a family church.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:And what does that mean?
Guest:Well, it's made up of family.
Guest:So, like, I'm very family oriented.
Marc:Sure, sure.
Marc:So it's neighborhood church.
Guest:Neighborhood.
Guest:Small?
Guest:Family church.
Guest:Small, but it wasn't a storefront.
Guest:It was like a legit traditional church.
Marc:Baptist?
Guest:Baptist, yep.
Guest:And my grandmother was a soloist of the church, and she was sickly by the time, you know, I was born.
Guest:So I used to stay in the house with her all the time.
Guest:Now, my brother and my sister got out, so they could probably tell you about the streets a whole lot more than me.
Guest:Like, people didn't even know they had a little sister until you heard me singing.
Guest:They're like, who is that in there singing?
Marc:Right.
Guest:We didn't even know you guys had a sister.
Marc:So was it that your mom was like, I have to protect this one?
Guest:She did that with all of us.
Guest:I was just more obedient than the others.
Guest:You have one older brother, one older sister?
Guest:Yes, I'm the baby.
Guest:So my sister, Julia, and my brother who passed, his name was Jason.
Guest:You know, everybody's their own individual, so they did their thing.
Guest:And then I was the baby that's like, okay, what Julia and Jason did that I shouldn't do?
Guest:Okay, I won't do that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But, yeah, we grew up in the church all day.
Guest:My mother was a church secretary.
Guest:My grandmother was a soloist.
Marc:But you went to school, too, though.
Guest:Yes, I went to school.
Guest:And then, yeah, I like to be creative.
Guest:But, yeah, we grew up in the hood, Southside, Inglewood area.
Marc:But did it feel dangerous?
Marc:I mean, in your mind...
Guest:no no no because we didn't know we were poor right or uh you know and where was the old man my father yeah well my father was a bus driver so he traveled a lot he used to drive greyhound but were they together no yeah so he wasn't around not sometimes yeah when he chose to be yeah he was around and you had a did you have a relationship with him no did you ever seek one out
Guest:When I turned 16, I was determined to meet all of my because he had a lot of children, siblings.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:So when I got old enough to do that, I wanted to go search for them.
Marc:So you wanted to know your half brothers and sisters.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:That was the intention.
Guest:My father had 27 children.
Guest:Stop it.
Guest:And I'm like the one the youngest that we know of.
Guest:27 children yes 11 girls 16 boys how many women i don't know baby i don't know and yes his name was sam sam hudson no i think i would be jennifer simpson oh that's right okay i'm so grateful i'm jennifer hudson yeah i think i would be a whole nother person
Marc:He probably would be.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Marc:If you took his name?
Marc:If... If you were part of that crew?
Guest:I think I would be a... I probably wouldn't be sitting here.
Marc:So you're lucky he was gone, in a way.
Marc:I think so.
Marc:So did you find all these people, all these siblings?
No.
Guest:Quite a few.
Guest:Well, once I became Jennifer Hudson to the world, some of my siblings went to my father's mother's house to meet her.
Guest:And the neighbors started like, y'all know who your sister is, right?
Guest:And they're like, Jennifer Hudson is your sister.
Marc:How'd that go?
Yeah.
Marc:What did they start coming around for?
Guest:You know how those things go.
Guest:And then I have a, my sister, she'll be so happy to know, like, oh my God, you mentioned me.
Guest:Dinah is one of my oldest sisters.
Guest:I got to meet her throughout our childhood growing up.
Guest:There's a half-sister?
Guest:Yes, this is one of my half.
Guest:My whole siblings, all our names start with a J. Julia, Jason, Jennifer.
Guest:Okay.
Okay.
Guest:Those are my mother and my father kids.
Guest:And then my half siblings.
Guest:I have tons of half siblings.
Guest:I have a brother named Lunny, a sister named Dinah.
Marc:And you like Dinah.
Guest:Sam.
Marc:Dinah you have a relationship with.
Marc:Some of them you do.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, okay.
Guest:Their family.
Marc:I mean, your older sister.
Guest:My oldest.
Marc:She's in Chicago.
Guest:She's in Chicago.
Guest:And she's a bus driver.
Marc:Really?
Guest:And hilarious.
Marc:Like in the city?
Guest:Crazy.
Guest:You didn't meet her?
Marc:Maybe I did.
Guest:If you did, you would not forget her.
Marc:I don't know if she was down there.
Guest:Was she down there?
Guest:You were definitely not.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:I don't know.
Guest:She did not come to the show.
Marc:Maybe maybe at the premiere at the premiere.
Guest:She was definitely.
Marc:Maybe I met her for a second.
Guest:You didn't meet her.
Guest:If you had a you would be like, oh, you would have told me I met your sister Julia.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And I always tell people, let me apologize in advance for what she may say or do.
Marc:Why?
Marc:She's a character.
Guest:She's a character.
Guest:You would love her.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She drives a bus.
Guest:Oh, she drives a school bus.
Marc:A school bus.
Guest:Our father was a bus driver, so she's a bus driver.
Marc:That's interesting, isn't it?
Guest:It is very interesting.
Marc:Because she didn't have a relationship with him either, did she?
Guest:No.
Marc:But she knew he was a bus driver.
Guest:I guess what's in your blood is in your blood.
Marc:Maybe it's your... It's hard to understand.
Marc:It's hard to understand why we do what we do sometimes.
Marc:I can't imagine that driving a bus is in your blood.
Yeah.
Guest:And maybe it's the traveling.
Marc:And she's good at it too, honey.
Marc:Well, I mean, maybe it's a way of having a relationship you didn't have with the person.
Guest:Maybe.
Guest:Connecting in a way.
Marc:In a subconscious way.
Guest:I can take that.
Guest:Now, I can only drive up one street.
Guest:I only really drive up one street.
Marc:You can't drive.
Guest:But I never really wanted to drive.
Guest:I do.
Guest:I'm grateful that my mother made me get a license because I didn't want one.
Marc:You don't like to drive?
Guest:I mean, I will when I have to, and I have a son, so now I have to drive him around and stuff like that.
Guest:How old's that kid?
Guest:He's 12.
Marc:Wow.
Guest:Seventh grade.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:And he has a little girlfriend.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:No, he'll kill me.
Guest:Let me show you.
Marc:So when you started singing, like, it was mostly in church, and then when did you start opening your eyes?
Marc:What job was that?
Guest:You know what?
Marc:What?
What?
Guest:That reality of performing did not hit me until I think I was about the time, almost when I was on Idol.
Guest:I was like, wait, what is this performing stuff?
Guest:Can I just sing the song?
Guest:Because my grandmother was a singer.
Guest:She used to just teach me, you stand flat foot and sing.
Guest:And that's that.
Guest:So to walk into a world of entertainment, I'm like, what is this?
Marc:What was that first journey through?
Guest:Oh, the Disney Wonder Cruise ship.
Guest:What is that?
Guest:I was one to seven cats on a Disney Wonder Cruise ship.
Guest:How old were you then?
Guest:I was 22 when I was on the ship.
Marc:So that wasn't the first job.
Guest:No, the first job.
Guest:Okay, let me take you back.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:In high school, I used to sing for everything.
Guest:And that's when I started to get like gigs.
Marc:Like musicals in high school and get band gigs?
Guest:Well, our thing was like Walter.
Guest:We grew up together.
Guest:And so he was determined for the world to hear me sing.
Guest:So by the time we got in high school, he was determined for the world to hear me sing.
Guest:So we would go and do all type of talent shows.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was like guaranteed that I will win and we will collect everybody's money.
Guest:Like you could get in talent shows for like a thousand dollars or two thousand.
Guest:That's a lot of money to a kid.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you knew you had the gift and Walter knew you had the gift and you could knock it out.
Guest:And that was our hustle as a kid.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And so I will win like it was unanimous, like all the shows to the point when I went to college and they had it was I went to Kennedy King College after leaving Lancaster University.
Guest:But that's another story.
Guest:And they had a talent show.
Marc:Oh, that was the second college you went to?
Guest:Yes, because I was a homebody of Mama's Baby.
Guest:You freaked out.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Marc:So the freshman year, you just kind of got depressed.
Guest:It's giving me anxiety just thinking about it because I, oh, my God, I was like, wait, go away.
Guest:And I was like, I want to go away with my cousins.
Guest:And when I could see when they got in the car and left me on the curb, I was like, where are they going?
Guest:No, I didn't mean I wasn't serious.
Guest:And I lasted one semester.
Guest:I had lost my voice for the climate of the air that I couldn't even speak.
Guest:Where was it?
Guest:Langston University.
Guest:Where's that?
Guest:In Oklahoma.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:And it was too dry by homecoming.
Guest:Yeah, it was too dry.
Guest:And so now to this day, I keep humidifiers around.
Guest:Yeah, I couldn't even speak.
Guest:And I was like, OK, nothing can risk my voice.
Guest:So I came back to Chicago, went to Kennedy King College.
Marc:That's so funny, though, because it's so it's such anxiety.
Marc:You just didn't want to be there.
Marc:So your throat shut.
Guest:You know what?
Guest:You are probably right.
Marc:You know, you just closed down.
Marc:You're just like you didn't want to admit it.
Marc:So you got sick.
Guest:It was so traumatic.
Guest:Every time I think about it, I was like, why are they getting in this car?
Guest:Y'all leaving?
Guest:And they had drove me there.
Guest:And the first time I went to visit there, I flew.
Guest:So I was like, oh, I can go away.
Guest:And they drove me to school.
Guest:My mom, my brother, and my sister.
Guest:And left me there.
Guest:Why would they do that?
Marc:Yeah, I felt that.
Marc:That feeling of homesickness is horrible because you just feel like you're not able to take care of yourself in a way somehow.
Marc:You don't feel comfortable.
Guest:Oh my God.
Marc:Yeah, that they're just not in the next room or available, too far away.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:And then I'm like, why would they do this to me?
Guest:But it wasn't until I left home that things started to happen for me.
Guest:You know?
Marc:Right.
Guest:So when Disney came about.
Marc:So after you went back to King's College.
Guest:When I went to Kenny King College, which was literally right down the street from my house.
Guest:Like I could walk.
Guest:It was literally my house is on 70th and Yale.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Kenny King was on 69th and Yale.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:I was not going far.
Marc:And what were you studying?
Guest:Well, I was just taking regular general courses and music is always about music.
Guest:But my first week at school or so, I took music.
Guest:My teacher was Rufus E. Hill.
Guest:I miss him dearly.
Guest:And, you know, when you go in a music class, they make all the students get up and sing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I get up, sing Happy Birthday National Anthem.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:Silent Night.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So each student got up and sang.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then when I got up to sing, by the time I was done, the teacher was like, wait a minute.
Guest:Hold on.
Guest:And he called one of his friends.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Which was named Ife.
Guest:She's a huge, like, theater star.
Guest:Ife.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Can't think of her last name, but those who know that world would know her.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And she, he had her there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he was like, you need to come hear this girl sing.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he had her come in and I sang.
Guest:And then she was before I knew it, they start to give me all type of auditions.
Guest:They was like, OK, we want to send you to this theater.
Guest:And I was 19 at the time.
Guest:And I went and I auditioned at Marriott Lincoln Shia Theater.
Guest:That was my first real professional job.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was in Lincoln Shia, which is like 45 minutes to an hour outside of Chicago.
Guest:And I went in and I sang and it was like, OK, you got the job.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:What job it was, I didn't know.
Guest:Same thing happened with Disney.
Guest:Walter, he found the audition in the newspaper.
Marc:From Disney.
Guest:For Disney.
Guest:All we saw was Disney is looking for singers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was the reason why I agreed to do it because it was two days after my birthday.
Guest:I had a new dress and I had no way to wear it.
Guest:And I was like, fine, I'll do it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I go to the audition in Chicago, not even knowing what I'm really auditioning for.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I sing, I think I sang like I Will Always Over Your Song by Whitney Houston.
Guest:And they was like, ma'am, you're hired.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:And they was like, do you like to travel?
Guest:I was like, sure, I love to travel.
Guest:And this and that.
Guest:They were going to send me to Japan.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, my God, I would have died.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Thankfully.
Guest:And I was just, yes, yes, yes.
Guest:And didn't know what I was agreeing to.
Guest:And that's when I ended up on a Disney Wonder Cruise ship.
Guest:And thank God, Port Canaveral, Florida.
Guest:And that's when everything started to happen.
Marc:So wait, so how long are you on the boat for?
Guest:Well, I did a six-month contract.
Marc:um so you're on a boat for six months yes six months yeah and and and i was calliope the hit muse and hercules the musical and are you good on boats i think so but ask me what i do again though i can't i get seasick and like you know i i mean i'm paranoid that be out way out on the ocean
Guest:No, I loved it.
Guest:And my ship was in the bow, like right under the captain.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:That was your room?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was main cast, so I got to have my own cabin.
Guest:Most people had to share a cabin.
Guest:And it was a great, great experience.
Marc:Are you considered an employee of the boat?
Marc:Did you guys have to learn how to...
Guest:Yes, the wet drills.
Guest:Oh, my God, which is a nightmare because I cannot swim.
Guest:And I still had to be a deputy leader.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they told us we had a wet drill.
Guest:If you did not pass the wet drill, you couldn't get on the ship.
Marc:But you can't swim.
No.
Guest:I thought the wet drill meant they was going to sprinkle us with some water.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Like with some sprinkles, some hoses or something.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, that's not what happened.
Guest:They put us on this like really high dock.
Guest:And then we were in Castaway Cay and we had to jump into the water.
Guest:And they're like, it's sharks out there.
Guest:In the ocean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's sharks out there.
Guest:I can't swim.
Guest:So everybody, I was the last one to jump.
Guest:And then we had to flip the life raft over.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I was, but I use it as my test.
Guest:I said, Jennifer, if you can get through this, then you're cut out to go audition for something like American Idol.
Guest:But if you can't, girl, go home and sit down.
Guest:So I had to do it.
Guest:Luckily, they treated me like the victim.
Marc:Right.
Guest:Because they was like, we don't care if you can't dance.
Guest:We don't care if you can't swim.
Guest:As long as you get up there and sing like that, you got the job.
Marc:So if you hadn't gotten that boat over, no American Idol.
Guest:That was my test.
Guest:I like to, you know, challenge myself.
Guest:So no, I would have had to go home like Jim to go home.
Marc:So what was it?
Marc:But what was that theater gig, though, before we move on?
Guest:Big River.
Marc:Oh, OK.
Guest:I was Alice's daughter and I sang the song How Blessed We Are.
Marc:Oh, OK.
Guest:And that was my first professional job.
Guest:And I thought I was really doing something because I was 19.
Guest:I was making like $425 a week.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:It was the life.
Marc:So after Disney, American Idol, it's so weird how many people just assume in the back of their head that you won American Idol.
Guest:No, seventh place.
Marc:I mean, you really didn't win.
Guest:No, seventh place, season three.
Guest:And I was a wild card pick.
Guest:They had sent me home before that.
Guest:But Randy Jackson picked me.
Guest:They had a wild card thing so you could bring somebody back out of all the people that were eliminated.
Guest:And luckily, I was his wild card pick.
Guest:And from there, I placed seventh place and was eliminated again.
Marc:It's wild.
Marc:So now that I imagine that not unlike the Disney audition or any audition that you did before you were known, like you'd get in the room and people be like, what the fuck is happening?
Marc:Right.
Marc:So how was that audition?
Guest:Well, at the initial audition, it was the same reaction.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:But as it went on, it dwindles down.
Guest:And I mean, I don't care who you are, how good you are.
Guest:You know, there's always somebody else.
Guest:That's great, too.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I would tell myself, well, Jennifer.
Right.
Guest:You in a top 12 and 30 of a whole bunch of number one.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that helped put it into perspective.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I felt like, you know, I feel as though nothing is Jess and it was a good teacher and lesson.
Guest:And it's more to it, too, you know, in the TV talent shows because it's a TV show first.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I guess also like that must have been a pretty quick education.
Marc:And I mean, it's very weird.
Marc:And I always notice it when I work, you know, that when you're backstage, that's really the life we live.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:That, you know, you're just sitting there.
Marc:There's people sitting around.
Marc:There's some food.
Marc:There's a guy holding a rope, you know.
Marc:And that's like, that's our job.
Marc:And then we go out there and do the thing.
Marc:But that, you know, getting to know, like being part of that show must have gave you a very crash course in the pace and nature of that type of show business.
Guest:It was a great teacher.
Guest:It was like a good boot camp.
Guest:And I saw so many people starting out in the initial auditions and not being able to...
Guest:follow through because they didn't understand freaked out what it was what it entailed what all you had to do what it took what was that in your head oh my god like we never got to sleep you know it was like okay we would have to sit through whatever the day it was the itinerary whatever they had us to do and then after that
Guest:You would think it would be time to go to bed.
Guest:No, you need to work on your song for tomorrow.
Guest:You need to write a song.
Guest:You need to have choreography.
Guest:You need to.
Guest:And people are like, wait, what?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because they don't want to see the person holding the rope behind the stage.
Guest:They just want to see the lights and the glimmer and the glitz.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:And a lot of people don't have that mindset.
Guest:But guess what taught me that?
Guest:Disney.
Guest:You see what I'm saying?
Guest:And so to see those that didn't have that worth ethic or that mindset to know, like, and I'm like, OK, what we need to do.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, it showed those who were willing to work for it versus those who just wanted to stand in the lights.
Marc:And I think that's what, I mean, even the lifeboat thing, and even Liesl tells a story about how the repetition of doing the work, the emotional work, and singing on respect, and that she had thought that you were done, but she needed one more take, and you just did it.
Marc:And you can just kind of lock in and do the work that I think your work ethic and being able to continue giving
Marc:is something that's carried you through and stays with you, right?
Guest:Thank you, definitely.
Marc:But does it, do you find that, because I think when people think about American Idol, and I don't watch it, but I think when people think about it, and I have nothing against it, it's all very moving.
Marc:But I think that there's a lot of one trick ponies out there.
Marc:There's a lot of people that got a trick and they do the trick.
Marc:But that's all that they got.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And I think that there's an assumption around people who make it in talent shows that that's a lot of that's most of it.
Marc:And then every once in a while, this amazing talent comes through.
Marc:But it seems to me that you don't ever really fake it.
Marc:And it doesn't seem like you're capable of doing that.
Marc:So how do you, do you ever get totally exhausted?
Marc:I mean, like when you were doing Respect, were there times where you like, because I remember when we were shooting the stuff in the church, you needed a minute.
Marc:So you got to, I mean, you do feel it.
Guest:Oh, I ain't got no choice but to feel it.
Guest:But that's what gets, that's what I, I mean, that's when my job is to feel it.
Marc:And that, yeah, but it's also, I guess you must, it must be natural to you because in a sense how, like, cause you come out of winning seventh on American Idol.
Marc:And how does it, how does the dream girl sing happen?
Guest:You know what?
Guest:That happened two years after Idol.
Marc:So what were you doing in the interim?
Guest:Recording?
Guest:Yes, I was.
Guest:I moved back to Florida with my Disney director who became my manager.
Marc:You moved to Florida?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:You were living in Florida?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:My son, Florida is a huge part of my life, actually.
Guest:Yes, because that's what we were.
Guest:That's where the boat was.
Guest:That's where the ship is.
Guest:That is where Disney traditions is.
Guest:We trained in Toronto, Canada.
Marc:Wait, Disney traditions.
Marc:That's like the.
Guest:That's the training grounds to teach you the Disney etiquette scene.
Marc:It's almost like Scientology.
Guest:I'm still a Disney product.
Guest:Most people don't know that unless you're on the television, like the Disney channel, the Disney shows.
Guest:But Disney is what helped give me my start.
Guest:It's interesting.
Guest:So, yeah, I was on it because literally, literally.
Guest:First of all, imagine crying, been on this ship for six months like I miss home.
Guest:And then the day I finally got off the ship, the next day I flew to Atlanta, Georgia and auditioned for American Idol.
Marc:So you were dug in with Disney.
Marc:There was part of you that must have, did you think like, this is the life?
Guest:No.
Guest:No.
Guest:No.
Marc:But you were in.
Guest:I love doing things for the experience.
Guest:And even down to Idol, I said, I'm going to do it for the experience.
Marc:But tell me about this Disney thing.
Marc:That's where you met the guy, the father of your kid?
Guest:no no oh god no my son wasn't born to say i thought won my oscar so that was about another 10 years later so when but so the manager guy yes the my um disney director became my manager because he was just such an advocate for my talent and he used to pull me aside like this is a rare talent to even come through the ships you know the reaction of the people who would come every now and then he's a great guy
Guest:Ed Whitlow.
Guest:Ed Whitlow.
Guest:He was my manager for a while.
Guest:And him and his friend gave me a production deal.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:And I started recording.
Marc:In Florida.
Guest:In Florida.
Marc:After you got done with that first idol.
Guest:After I was off of Idol.
Guest:And everybody was like, where did Jennifer Hudson go?
Guest:You know?
Guest:And that's when they were writing.
Florida.
Guest:Actually, Orlando, Florida.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Everybody was writing articles like, where's Jennifer Hudson?
Guest:Because they were saying Jennifer Hudson for Effie White.
Guest:And I'm like, who is Effie White?
Guest:Now, I knew the music from Dreamgirls, but I didn't know the story or the character names.
Guest:So I'm like, what is everybody talking about?
Guest:But no one could find me.
Guest:But I'm the kind, as long as I'm doing what I love.
Marc:That manager wasn't good at that point.
Guest:Because he came from a whole other world.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So luckily, my cousin, Marita Hudson, who's a plebiscist that I work with a lot, and she's quite known, they were able to track me down through her.
Marc:She's a flirt.
Guest:And they contacted her because her name is Marita Hudson.
Guest:And I'm Jennifer Hudson.
Guest:And she was like, oh, yeah, that's my cousin.
Guest:And that's how the whole Dreamgirls thing came about.
Marc:See, because the reason I bring that up is that, you know, for you to figure out, you know, how to infuse the music and an established musical with the emotions and acting chops to kind of like, seemingly without a lot of training, you just naturally have to show up for everything.
Guest:I love that you say that.
Guest:No, I've never had singing lessons or acting.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:For...
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because you just are, you know, your heart's out front, you know, because you can't.
Marc:I think the point I was trying to make is you don't know how to fake it, really.
Guest:I like to be it.
Guest:I always say I don't act, I react.
Guest:I can't act at all, to be honest.
Guest:But.
Guest:No one can tell you how you feel in a situation.
Guest:So it's like, okay, well, yes, I may be here in someone else's path, but it's me who's experiencing it.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Just react.
Marc:And that's acting.
Guest:Is that acting?
Marc:That's the nature of it.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:But see, the thing for me, I grew up as a music fan.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I always dreamt of being at the Grammys and performing in stages like that.
Guest:So when the Oscar, that whole thing came up for Dreamgirls, it was Jamie Foxx, actually.
Guest:He was the one on set.
Guest:He's like...
Guest:she gonna win an Oscar for this and he's like but the craziest thing is she has no clue what's going on and I didn't I had no idea so once I got to the Oscars I forget watching it that was my first time imagine your first time watching the Oscars you're there and you're nominated that's what it was for me like huh what's this
Marc:That's probably the best way for it to happen.
Marc:Because then at least you don't get cynical, you don't get all jaded, you don't get trained to do a thing.
Marc:You certainly weren't doing what you're doing now for this movie.
Marc:You were just sort of like, what?
Guest:Right.
Guest:But that's that's what's cool about this time around is because I now have a sense of like what everything means and what it is and all of that, because back then I didn't have a clue.
Guest:All I wanted to do was get my lines right and make Bill Condon proud because he gave me this opportunity.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So it's like, OK, sir, I want to make you proud because you you you gave me this opportunity.
Marc:And now when you look at your career in terms of like after that, after the acting and, you know, the the Oscar and American Idol and then sort of moving on to other movies and TV projects and stuff.
Marc:Did you feel that your music was, you know, out front as much as you wanted it to be?
Marc:Like, were you concerned?
Marc:Did you did you feel like I need to hit record?
Marc:You know what?
Marc:You know what?
Guest:i still need a hit record i have i have i have and i'm telling you but it's technically effies and yeah you know me although i'm grateful for it yeah and i have spotlight yeah but the thing is when you win an oscar and especially with the start that i had um you're catapulted to a whole nother space yeah and it's like you may not be there and experiencing ready for it right i was headlining yeah a tour yeah
Guest:And I said I had a $19 mic stand in the song.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Like I didn't have the catalog to support it, but everybody was there to see me.
Guest:And it's like, oh, can I live this again?
Guest:Because now I have more of a sense.
Guest:And I'm obviously far more experienced to draw from.
Guest:Because I'm like, I don't even know what this is.
Marc:Well, at that time, yeah.
Marc:It's weird when there's a lot of momentum and the spotlight.
Marc:And there's people that are like, that doesn't make some money.
Marc:Exactly.
Guest:Exactly.
Marc:So then you're like, okay, I want to make the money.
Marc:And then you realize, like, well, I mean, but that's just natural.
Marc:And it doesn't seem like, it seems like everyone still loves you.
Marc:Like, if you were going to go out and do a whole new set.
Guest:Right.
Marc:You know, with a few Aretha tunes.
Guest:I'm grateful I still get to do that.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And, like, you were running around doing The Voice for a while.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:I did The Voice USA and Voice UK.
Marc:Back and forth.
Guest:Oh, my God, yes.
Guest:Ooh, the jet lag.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:But I, yeah.
Yeah.
Marc:And the Weight Watchers thing?
Guest:Weight Watchers.
Marc:That was a long time you did that.
Guest:That, well, I started a week after I had my son, so that was 12 years ago.
Guest:And I was preparing for the film Winnie that I did.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I needed to lose weight for that character.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so I was like, well, I might as well make money doing it.
Guest:And then I saw all the weight loss campaigns.
Guest:I love Weight Watchers.
Guest:I love it too.
Marc:I liked it back in the day though.
Marc:I like the points.
Marc:I don't know what the fuck it is now.
Marc:oh my god you know you're funny but you hey you said what you said then i'm gonna let you say it now because like i just like because uh you know i'm just a little nuts with weight and like and i got about 20 over 15 over and i went to i was like i was the asshole at the meetings the skinny guy the skinny guy i'm like yeah i lost two this week and just like you know sad mad obese people like what do you get out of here but it was
Marc:working for me and i i like the control element i like counting the points i like figuring out how many zero point foods can i eat today if i if i can find 51 point foods you know like i i did i loved it i am a comic i had a lot a lot of time during the day so if i could just chart out my food you're gonna re-inspire me oh i still have the old books with the little you know the little yeah the what do you call it to figure out the fiber versus the right the little slide rule thing that's in that show
Guest:Wow.
Guest:I remember when I was doing Weight Watchers, I would have like Weight Watchers people just popping out of nowhere.
Guest:And I'd be like, OK, it would be everybody.
Guest:But I was I loved the experience and it ended up being bigger than the film that I did.
Marc:Really?
Yeah.
Marc:Which one was that?
Guest:I played Winnie Mandela.
Marc:Oh, that's right.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:In South Africa.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Marc:The Weight Watchers was bigger than the Weight Watchers.
Guest:And Weight Watchers, honey, came over and took all of that over.
Marc:Yeah, but you did a lot of movies.
Marc:Like, you know, I don't need to talk about cats.
Marc:I don't know how you feel about cats.
Guest:You know what?
Guest:I'm proud of everything I do.
Marc:No, I thought it was cute.
Marc:I didn't watch the whole movie, but it seems like there were bits and pieces that were ridiculous.
Marc:And it seems like to my mind that whoever conceived of it, it's a misconception, but it must have made sense.
Marc:Why wouldn't it?
Marc:But I guess it was just a thing.
Marc:It's like maybe when there's just costumes, people sort of know what's going on.
Marc:But when you make humans look like real cats, it's too weird.
Guest:I think it was sick as cats.
Guest:I still try to wrap my brain around it.
Guest:I think it was just too much for everybody to take in all at once.
Guest:You had the special effects.
Guest:Then, like you said, humans as cats.
Guest:Then saturated with the arts.
Guest:It's a lot.
Guest:Because even for us as actors, we was like, okay, wait, what are we doing?
Marc:How are we doing this?
Marc:And there was no way you could know.
Marc:It's almost like in the same way...
Marc:that you were talking about recording early on where you're just by yourself and then it goes away and then it becomes part of this huge thing.
Marc:I imagine that a lot of cats, you're like, you have no idea how that's going to look.
Marc:And then all of a sudden, you're dancing around with a tail.
Guest:Well, actually, did I have a tail when we were shooting?
Marc:I don't remember.
Guest:You know, so it was like a lot of it was imaginative and using your imagination, but that is where my cats came from.
Guest:And the best gift I have from it, I have Macavity and Grizabella because I was Grizabella in cats.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And Macavie, who's the villain.
Guest:So I have a Spinks cat for Macavity and a Tabby cat for Grizabella.
Marc:Yeah, that's what I got.
Marc:That's the orange cat, Tabby.
Guest:You didn't even know the name of your cat.
Guest:But yeah, so that's where my cats came from.
Guest:Yeah, but I was, I couldn't believe it.
Guest:I was like, wait, I get to be Grizabella and sing Memory?
Guest:It was an interesting experience.
Guest:And I just loved doing things for the experience.
Guest:And those tears were real tears.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's what I'm like, do you know the emotion that went in that?
Guest:And then what my heart goes out to is the dancers.
Guest:They put in so much work.
Guest:They really, truly did.
Guest:And it's like, I just wish they could have gotten more credit for the work.
Marc:I think it's weird.
Marc:With TikTok and everything, I think dancers are having their time right now.
Marc:You're right.
Marc:I've never seen more dancing in my life.
Marc:I didn't think about it like that.
Marc:I turn on my phone, I'm like, is everyone dancing?
Marc:No.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:It's like all these people that wanted to be dancers, I always thought, how many jobs are there for dancers?
Marc:Are you going to go to Vegas?
Marc:Are you going to be a rock cat?
Marc:How many dancer jobs are there?
Marc:But now with TikTok, it's like everyone's dancing, I guess.
Marc:Yeah, I guess you're right.
Marc:But I don't think they're making a lot of money.
Marc:I definitely follow a couple of dancers because I think when things are terrible...
Marc:Like back in the day, like in the depression and stuff, that's when musicals were very popular.
Marc:That there's something about watching people dance that lifts the spirit.
Guest:Interesting.
Marc:Well, yeah.
Marc:So now you won a Grammy for the Color Purple soundtrack?
Guest:I won for my first album.
Marc:Right.
Guest:And Color Purple soundtrack.
Guest:And I also have an honorary Grammy as well.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Does that mean I have three or two?
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:What's an honorary one?
Guest:Well, when they invite you and they say, we want to honor you and give you a Grammy.
Guest:So I feel like that's just as prestigious, no?
Marc:Sure, of course.
Marc:And more so.
Marc:It's like, yeah, that's for everything.
Guest:Yeah, kind of, sort of.
Guest:So it's like, technically, I have three Grammys.
Marc:Yeah, sure.
Marc:So a couple of questions that like, because when we were talking about Aretha, now you knew her.
Marc:Like how much time you spent with her?
Guest:Well, we spent a lot of, not a lot of time, but I would see her on and off because somehow I got to tribute this woman, I don't know how many times in my career.
Guest:She would always say she would want me to do it.
Guest:She loved you.
Guest:Yeah, I guess so.
Guest:But at the time I didn't know it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like I'm like, she likes me.
Guest:And then also leading up to her last days, like because we've been in talks about me playing her since I won the Oscar for Dreamgirls.
Guest:That was our first meeting was 15 years ago in New York.
Guest:And a fun fact that I don't talk about much.
Guest:When I was eliminated from America Idol, she did a show in Merrillville, Indiana, and she allowed me to open up for that show.
Guest:Oh, wow.
Guest:And normally they said she would only have comedians.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:But she said that I could open up for her.
Guest:So that was the first time I got to meet her.
Marc:that that shows a a fairly sort of like grounded ego to you know what i mean that you know what i mean to for uh for somebody to have a singer you know one of the great singers have a great singer because like that even that scene in the movie with dinah washington in the bar right that that would be the situation but you know but she was gracious enough she was she was so then i got to i got to meet her that day
Guest:Then I got to watch her perform and I got to open up for her.
Guest:So that was our first meeting.
Guest:And then it's such a huge time span.
Guest:So every time I talk about it, it's like, OK, where do I start?
Guest:Then after that, I thought I won the Oscar for Dreamgirls.
Guest:We met in New York.
Guest:I just was in Detroit recently and her people were there and I went to her childhood church and her security guard was like, I was there when you met her.
Guest:It was at the Ritz Carlton Hotel.
Guest:And I was like, you were there because things like that seem like was I dreaming.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So he verified where it was.
Guest:And that's when we had our first meeting about me playing her.
Guest:And then so we would keep in touch from there.
Guest:And then through my career.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:It's so many performances of me paying tribute to her.
Guest:So in the back of my mind, I was always thinking about it as my audition.
Marc:And she check in?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:She would check in.
Guest:So then it wasn't until like eight years after that when I was on Broadway where she called me.
Guest:I was off that day and she's like, I've made my decision and it is you who I want to play me.
Guest:And I was like, yes, ma'am.
Guest:And she said, don't tell us all.
Guest:I said, no, ma'am, I won't say a thing.
Guest:And then the next day she went and told it to the press herself.
Guest:But she didn't.
Guest:She said, I didn't.
Guest:The young lady knows who she is, but I'm not going to give you her name at this time.
Guest:And then eight years later, here we are with the film.
Guest:So I talked to her.
Guest:We would speak weekly.
Guest:I would hear from her.
Guest:Sometimes she would call.
Guest:Sometimes she would get me and Walter mixed up and be texting him instead of me.
Guest:She would be there.
Guest:And she was always so present.
Guest:She knew everything that was going on with my son.
Guest:And I'm like, you know that.
Guest:She would say a lot of things that I didn't realize she was speaking from her life experiences until we were filming.
Guest:And I'm like, no, she was really...
Guest:speaking from her own experiences you know sure in the midst of us preparing to get together to teach me about her to play her you know what i mean yeah and i lastly spoke to her literally i feel like i was one of the last people to talk to her before she passed she called me august 8th i want to say and that call
Guest:I didn't realize it was the last call.
Guest:And right after that, because we were in conversation and I was sending her pictures of my son and I never heard back.
Guest:And then the next day there's like, she's in hospice and no longer comes.
Guest:I was like, I just talked to her.
Guest:Like literally she sang on that call.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:What'd she sing?
Guest:She sang an Isley Brothers song.
Guest:I can't remember the name of it.
Guest:And she's like, now, Jennifer, that's the Isley Brothers.
Guest:I said, yes, ma'am, I know.
Guest:And then she told me what she had eaten, which is as if she could taste it in that call.
Guest:So that was the last time I got to hear from her.
Marc:When looking back on the process of making the movie and then also your relationship with her, now, when you're working with that, when you've got to step into this and you know the whole story of her and you've got your own tragedy,
Marc:And trauma.
Marc:Terrible.
Marc:I mean, I can't even imagine how you move through life carrying that with your mom and your brother and your nephew.
Marc:Were you able in any way to process any of that in approaching Aretha's trauma?
Marc:I mean, in a conscious way or no?
Guest:It's just there.
Marc:It's just there.
Guest:It's there.
Marc:You don't need to get in there.
Guest:And to me, that is the thing, the reason of why she said Jennifer played me.
Guest:It wasn't until the scene when Aretha Mother comes to her and I'm in that scene.
Guest:And it hit me in that moment.
Guest:I said, she saw so much more in me that I guess we related in that I didn't realize was there.
Marc:You think after the tragedy that she connected deeper?
Guest:Maybe.
Guest:Because we did have a conversation long before the tragedy.
Guest:But I don't think I would have been able or ready to be able to tell her story in such an honest, vulnerable way with as much depth without my own life experiences.
Guest:And that's everything.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Like had we filmed the movie when we first had the conversation,
Guest:I don't think I would have been ready, you know, but having life happen, life experiences happen.
Guest:I have to say I could relate to her and people keep asking like, okay, you,
Guest:How did you channel the trauma so much?
Guest:And it's like we all have trauma, no matter if it's the same trauma or not.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So it's like it's so at least for me, it still needs to come from real places.
Guest:Everything I do is from the heart.
Guest:And this is why I keep telling everybody it's from the heart.
Guest:And I don't think it would be fair to her.
Guest:to tell her tragedies or her triumphs of her story, especially being so attached to her, if I didn't come from the same place.
Marc:Sure.
Marc:And what was your process of processing all that grief and horror?
Marc:I mean, was it church?
Marc:Did you talk to people?
Marc:How did you do it?
Guest:Or faith.
Guest:And that's another way where we parallel, you know, is her faith that got her through.
Guest:And it is mine that gets me through.
Guest:And I feel I always say the greatest gift my mother and my grandmother gave us was giving us to Christ.
Guest:You know, so it prepares you in a way.
Guest:And my mother used to say, God never allows anything to sneak up on his children.
Guest:You know, so having those teachings and that foundation.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I think that's what carried her through and is what carries me through.
Guest:And that's another thing that I feel she saw that I didn't necessarily think about or even have time to think about in relation to her until, you know, in those moments.
Marc:But you never had a crisis of faith like she did, right?
Guest:No, not really.
Marc:That's an interesting thing about that movie is that when you come up like she did and the complicated relationship with her father in that when you feel like your faith is left, that's a very specific thing that I don't think everybody can relate to, but when you have it,
Marc:And it's challenged.
Marc:Like, how do you even go on living?
Guest:Right.
Guest:Well, I always say you have no choice but to go on.
Guest:And being a person who has suffered tragedy, it just shows.
Guest:Like, people can't relate until it is you.
Guest:And I'm here to tell you, it could be anybody at any given time.
Guest:And it's like, one minute, I was a child with a mother.
Guest:And in the blink of an eye, and I was an aunt, and in the blink of an eye, I was a mother with a child without a mother.
Guest:What?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Even when my son says...
Guest:TT sometimes I say huh because in a flash of a second one moment I was I was TT and the next second I was a mother and it is like Wait, what?
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah, but I know that We have no choice but to go on yeah, and to me that's the power of
Guest:In Ms.
Guest:Franklin's story is because too often we think things don't happen to people like that.
Guest:So when it has and you see them still prevail, it's a testimony and a testament to say, well, you can still make it too.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Well, thank you.
Marc:I mean, you know, because I lost someone I loved over the pandemic.
Marc:And, you know, it is it does something to the way you see life.
Guest:Oh, yes.
Marc:You know, it definitely grounds you in something where you realize like this can happen.
Marc:And it does every day to.
Marc:so many people.
Guest:It really does.
Marc:Whether it's tragedy or not.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And we don't live in a culture that really processes, you know, death or tragedy.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Everybody just wants to keep moving on.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You have to, but you also have to be like, okay.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You have to find your way.
Guest:Right.
Marc:Get your heart straight.
Marc:to do you know it's no right or wrong way no of course you know and it's a process that doesn't always go away or again you know it never does but you know you can't like the Jews which I am one of say you know may their memory be a blessing right yes that's it yes yeah yep nice talking to you you too
Marc:There you go.
Marc:Jennifer Hudson.
Marc:Respect the movie.
Marc:Now available to buy or rent on digital platforms and it's also available on DVD and Blu-ray.
Marc:Now I'll play my Stratocaster for you.
Marc:... ... ...
Yeah.
Guest:guitar solo
Guest:guitar solo
Guest:guitar solo
Guest:Boomer lives.
Guest:Monkey.
Guest:La Fonda.
Guest:Cat angels everywhere.
Guest:Yeah, I got a cold.
Guest:Yeah, I got a cold.
Guest:It's just a cold.
Guest:It's not COVID.
Guest:It's just a cold.
Guest:You're not going to get it from listening.