Episode 1074 - Mike Sweeney

Episode 1074 • Released November 25, 2019 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Marc:Lock the gates!

00:00:09Marc:All right, let's do this.

00:00:11Marc:How are you?

00:00:11Marc:What the fuckers?

00:00:12Marc:What the fuck buddies?

00:00:14Marc:What the fuck tuckians?

00:00:16Marc:How's it going?

00:00:18Marc:This is it.

00:00:18Marc:I know this is a slow week for many people in terms of work.

00:00:23Marc:I think people are kind of shut down.

00:00:24Marc:They're shut off.

00:00:25Marc:They're getting ready to go.

00:00:26Marc:They're preparing mentally to sort of land in the chaos that they come from.

00:00:33Marc:To sort of go back, go back into it.

00:00:37Marc:Go back into the vortex.

00:00:39Marc:Put on your psychic helmets to enter the world of your childhood.

00:00:45Marc:Or maybe not.

00:00:46Marc:Maybe you're like, no, you know what?

00:00:47Marc:Not doing that.

00:00:48Marc:Just going to have Thanksgiving by myself or with my family.

00:00:51Marc:My family, the one I'm trying to, my family, the corrective.

00:00:57Marc:The family that corrects it.

00:01:00Marc:The thing that I made to stop the madness.

00:01:04Marc:I made these children to stop what you did.

00:01:08Marc:Look at me, I'm yelling at nothing.

00:01:10Marc:These kids will never see that.

00:01:13Marc:You did this and these kids, right kids?

00:01:17Marc:Right?

00:01:19Marc:Daddy's okay, right?

00:01:21Marc:See, I'm not going to be the same kind of person.

00:01:24Marc:What are you laughing at?

00:01:25Marc:I'm not going to be the same kind of person you were.

00:01:28Marc:I'm fixing it.

00:01:30Marc:This is the tone of a person fixing something.

00:01:36Marc:Ah, fuck.

00:01:37Marc:I can't get this on right.

00:01:39Marc:That's the tone of patience and correction.

00:01:43Marc:God damn it.

00:01:45Marc:Why won't this fit?

00:01:48Marc:Oh, fuck, I'm going to go back to the store.

00:01:52Marc:God damn it.

00:01:54Marc:Maybe I should take a picture with my phone.

00:01:58Marc:Smile.

00:01:59Marc:I want to show your grandmother that I'm fixing you.

00:02:04Marc:How's everybody doing?

00:02:06Marc:Look, I don't know where that came from.

00:02:07Marc:I do know that I am going back.

00:02:10Marc:I'm going to the source.

00:02:13Marc:I'm going.

00:02:13Marc:But it's not it's not a geographical location.

00:02:16Marc:It's a psycho geographical location.

00:02:18Marc:It's where my mother lives in my brain.

00:02:21Marc:I'm going to see her.

00:02:23Marc:And, you know, that is the scene of the crime that went on for a while.

00:02:29Marc:Minor emotional crimes in the big picture, but I'm okay.

00:02:33Marc:So that's what I'm doing.

00:02:35Marc:And I do this.

00:02:35Marc:I have done it.

00:02:36Marc:There was a couple years I didn't do it, but now we've tightened up the crew down there.

00:02:40Marc:Just family.

00:02:42Marc:No stragglers with annoying political dispositions.

00:02:48Marc:Yeah, it's okay.

00:02:49Marc:It's all right.

00:02:50Marc:Don't go if they're going to bother you.

00:02:52Marc:Keep it at home.

00:02:53Marc:It's not that big a deal.

00:02:55Marc:But I'll let you know how it goes down there.

00:02:57Marc:I'll do my dispatch.

00:02:59Marc:We do do a new show every Thanksgiving, and I will do it.

00:03:02Marc:Also, today on the show, this fucking thing blew my mind.

00:03:07Marc:I've known this guy for years.

00:03:09Marc:I mean, years.

00:03:11Marc:Probably almost 30 years since we were doing comedy in New York.

00:03:16Marc:Mike Sweeney, writer and has been the head writer for Conan O'Brien going back to the mid 90s.

00:03:21Marc:And he also now he hosts the he co-hosts the podcast Inside Conan, an important Hollywood podcast, along with Jesse Gaskell.

00:03:32Marc:But I thought, yeah, I didn't know Mike Sweeney.

00:03:35Marc:There's so much we don't know about people that you make assumptions about and you just sort of like, that's that guy.

00:03:39Marc:I know that guy.

00:03:41Marc:But you don't know fucking anybody, do you really?

00:03:45Marc:People are fucking incomprehensible.

00:03:48Marc:To quote Sidney Pollack again from the movie Michael Clayton.

00:03:53Marc:I should look up the screenwriter of that thing.

00:03:56Marc:I could do it now.

00:03:58Marc:Am I going to do it?

00:03:59Marc:No.

00:04:00Marc:But you don't know.

00:04:00Marc:You don't know people.

00:04:03Marc:And I did not know Mike Sweeney, man.

00:04:05Marc:I mean, we started talking and almost immediately I'm like, what?

00:04:09Marc:What are you talking about?

00:04:11Marc:That is fucking crazy that I did that throughout the entire conversation.

00:04:19Marc:So that's happening today.

00:04:22Marc:It's Tony Gilroy.

00:04:25Marc:Tony Gilroy wrote and directed Michael Clayton, one of the greatest grown-up movies of the last 20 years, and his brother Dan wrote Nightcrawler, I believe, and directed that.

00:04:37Marc:Why am I still speculating?

00:04:38Marc:I just looked it up.

00:04:41Marc:I just wanted to give Tony Gilroy the credit he deserves for people are fucking incomprehensible.

00:04:46Marc:So, all right, here's what's going on.

00:04:48Marc:Found out on Saturday that...

00:04:50Marc:I won the Best Actor in the Hijón International Film Festival in Spain.

00:04:56Marc:I know I complained about what I thought was not a great reaction to my comedy and that the communication barrier, the language disconnect was hard for me and I didn't know how everything landed, but I'll tell you how it landed.

00:05:12Marc:Best Actor.

00:05:13Marc:That's pretty great.

00:05:15Marc:I am honored and I appreciate the Best Actor nod.

00:05:20Marc:from the judges at the Hihon Film Fest.

00:05:25Marc:And I know that as soon as I put that on my resume, things are going to take off for me.

00:05:32Marc:They're already taken off.

00:05:34Marc:I got nowhere else to go.

00:05:35Marc:You know, I read the entire Jerry Wexler autobiography on my trip to get into the brains and mind and heart of Jerry Wexler, who I will be playing in the upcoming Aretha Franklin biopic, though it is a slice of life movie.

00:05:49Marc:It's not a full.

00:05:51Marc:I don't know what I can say about it, but I'm playing Jerry Wexler.

00:05:53Marc:They found out I found out Dave Cross.

00:05:57Marc:A guy who I used to, like, you know, I used to crash at his apartment when he was crashing at his girlfriend's house back in the day, Somerville, Mass., Bill Wilson's Museum of Sadness.

00:06:07Marc:Rest in peace, Bill Wilson.

00:06:09Marc:But he's playing Jerry Wexler in a Nat Geo miniseries thing.

00:06:15Marc:Me and Cross are playing temperamental, compulsive Jewish record producer.

00:06:22Marc:And I think we're the only two that can do it.

00:06:25Marc:Perhaps me and Cross will get together after all this is behind us and do dueling Wexlers right here.

00:06:33Marc:But I did read the book.

00:06:36Marc:I actually got an email from the writer, the guy who helped Jerry write the book, David Ritz.

00:06:40Marc:He also wrote a book on Morris Day and on Aretha Franklin.

00:06:45Marc:But I got on the phone with him for a while, talked about Wexler.

00:06:48Marc:I got some interviews on my phone so I can hear how he talks, so I can get it right.

00:06:55Marc:I don't want to do it an injustice.

00:07:01Marc:Because it's a big opportunity for me.

00:07:05Marc:And, you know, this is a guy that comes from another generation from New York.

00:07:13Marc:He's of a generation of Jews that talk like this.

00:07:18Marc:But he's also a yeller.

00:07:20Marc:He's not going to take any shit, this guy.

00:07:23Marc:All right?

00:07:24Marc:That'd be $5,000.

00:07:28Marc:$5,000.

00:07:29Marc:I'll work it out.

00:07:32Marc:I'm in it.

00:07:33Marc:But the great thing about reading Wexler's autobiography was just how it's like right up my alley because it filled in all of these gaps in my music knowledge.

00:07:43Marc:It's kind of a great book.

00:07:45Marc:I think it's called Rhythm and Blues.

00:07:47Marc:by david uh ritz i'm excited about it so that that's that i i got i told you about the best actor thing we had a great time me and the director lady had a nice time i got an email which i think was sort of resonated with me look i understand the depth of ireland i understand the darkness of ireland the beauty of ireland the lush history of ireland just the feelings of poetic and

00:08:12Marc:Yeah, just like I'm enamored with it on all levels.

00:08:15Marc:I find it to be a very deep place.

00:08:17Marc:And I find that I make room for the darkness of Ireland because that's part of the beauty.

00:08:20Marc:But it's weird how we romanticize.

00:08:22Marc:And I think people, I guess this is some sort of blindsidedness of entitlement, of being able to sort of romanticize, take vacations, to sort of maybe have a bit of a blind eye to what's really happening in the country you're visiting because you don't want to fuck your vacation up.

00:08:42Marc:You know, you want to enjoy the the the club med or whatever.

00:08:46Marc:I don't know what that's like, but you want to enjoy the nice little beach town, you know, right next to the city that's burning because people are fighting for their lives.

00:08:57Marc:You know, is that your problem?

00:08:58Marc:I mean, I think it's a big problem with our country in general.

00:09:01Marc:It's like the world is on fire.

00:09:03Marc:But look, can I just enjoy this pie?

00:09:04Marc:Thank you.

00:09:06Marc:I got this email, and it's lengthy, but I think it's important to balance out and also to raise awareness to it.

00:09:13Marc:I have two, what do you call it, teachable moments through emails.

00:09:18Marc:Irishman comments on your Irish comments.

00:09:21Marc:Hiya, Mark.

00:09:22Marc:John here from Dublin, originally from Kilkenny.

00:09:25Marc:Ever played Cat Laughs?

00:09:26Marc:Yes, I've done that twice.

00:09:27Marc:Not a great time.

00:09:28Marc:Anyway, I just wanted to say that I found your take on Ireland really refreshing.

00:09:33Marc:Most Americans go straight to telling you about their genealogy, saying that they're 80 percent Irish or something.

00:09:39Marc:I always feel really removed from people who say that stuff because it's like they've been sold some sort of holiday package that's coded in an Americanized idea of Irishness, like it's a fetish or something.

00:09:50Marc:I enjoyed the way you described the people as embedded with the environment, and also your observation on how existential the people are.

00:09:56Marc:I also really enjoyed how you looked into what turf is.

00:10:00Marc:All in all, it just seems that out of the millions of Americans who've doted on Ireland for years and years, your interest really seems to come from a place of genuine enchantment, which is lovely and really refreshing.

00:10:11Marc:But I guess when I hear Americans talk about how nice it is here, my stomach always sinks a bit because Irish fetishization is kind of damaging in that it greatly distracts from the other side of what's going on in this country.

00:10:22Marc:It's a complicated island.

00:10:24Marc:Yes, it's extremely rich with scenery and culture, which I cherish.

00:10:28Marc:But a lot of that has come at a serious cost.

00:10:31Marc:It's important to me that we highlight Ireland as a place that is also deeply traumatized.

00:10:36Marc:Our nation was established under a type of corporate Catholicism that absolutely obliterated the country's mental health all the way up until the early 2000s.

00:10:45Marc:Our current leaders are bulldozing our cultural quarters with hotel chains, and there's an increasing number of 10,000 homeless people on this island.

00:10:53Marc:Families are living out of hotel rooms, emergency accommodations, and we have a thing here called direct provision, which is essentially a prison for refugees.

00:11:00Marc:I know it's possible that I sound like a conspiracy nut to you, but this stuff is common knowledge here in Ireland.

00:11:06Marc:It's on the news and in the papers every day.

00:11:08Marc:These subjects are part of the fiber to which our modern culture is reaching to and basing our art on.

00:11:15Marc:I'm not asking you to wallow in despair.

00:11:17Marc:I'm not trying to kill your idea of the place.

00:11:19Marc:Ireland is beautiful and special and worth the bad weather.

00:11:22Marc:If anything, I'd like to enrich your fascination of the country by encouraging you and your listeners to look deeper than the scenery and how nice we all are.

00:11:31Marc:We're nice for a reason.

00:11:35Marc:Love your podcast, John.

00:11:36Marc:I don't have to say his last name.

00:11:38Marc:P.S.

00:11:38Marc:It's pronounced Donegal.

00:11:41Marc:Donegal.

00:11:43Marc:Goal.

00:11:43Marc:Donegal.

00:11:45Marc:Thank you, John.

00:11:45Marc:I don't think you're a conspiracy theorist.

00:11:48Marc:I appreciate the lesson.

00:11:49Marc:It's a nice balance.

00:11:50Marc:And yes, it did sort of strike...

00:11:53Marc:a thing in me where i realized like we all romanticize we all you know certainly through a certain amount of entitlement turned a blind eye either from apathy or uh ignorance or just uh selfishness and i appreciate the information and i thank you i will be sensitive to this now so this is another uh teachable moment it's gonna hurt a little bit literally it's gonna your brain up

00:12:19Marc:Q-tip eardrum incident.

00:12:21Marc:Hey, Mark, wanted to start off by saying WTF has really helped me be more open about my mental issues with friends and family alike and given me so much more confidence in daily life through that, especially my anxiety.

00:12:32Marc:Hearing you talk about your struggles with strangers in an oddly charming way.

00:12:35Marc:and your genuine interest in the conversation is very inspiring but on to the email you had mentioned cleaning your ears with a q-tip which is something i do compulsively but it made me think of a crazy story i met a man in fred's texas bar in fort worth who was completely deaf in one ear because one day he was cleaning his ear with a q-tip and he stumbled and fell into the wall of his tiny closet sized bathroom and he punctured his eardrum with the q-tip but

00:13:00Marc:Bleeding and in a lot of pain, he had to call an ambulance because he couldn't stand with the inner ear imbalance.

00:13:06Marc:He warned me of the dangers, and now I think of him every time I clean my ears.

00:13:11Marc:Be careful, you're Canadian fan.

00:13:13Marc:Jesse.

00:13:14Marc:So...

00:13:16Marc:Now you too will be thinking of this man that Jesse met in Fred's Texas bar in Fort Worth, Texas.

00:13:25Marc:I like that detail like that.

00:13:28Marc:You know, like the thrust here that the guy burst his fucking eardrum.

00:13:33Marc:with a fucking Q-tip incident.

00:13:35Marc:But it's important the sort of texture of the story, you know, the details.

00:13:39Marc:But he was a guy he met in Fred's Texas bar in Fort Worth.

00:13:43Marc:So if that takes you to a place, like anything in this paragraph other than, what the fuck?

00:13:50Marc:He fell on it and hit his, not to Q-tip into his head?

00:13:56Marc:But like, where's Fred's bar in Fort Worth?

00:13:58Marc:That sounds like an interesting place.

00:14:00Marc:where the guy met a deaf guy, and he got this story.

00:14:04Marc:How'd that happen, man?

00:14:06Marc:What?

00:14:09Marc:How'd you lose your hearing?

00:14:10Marc:Can you say again?

00:14:11Marc:I can't hear you in that ear.

00:14:15Marc:Yeah, what happened?

00:14:18Marc:Oh, man.

00:14:20Marc:Oh, man.

00:14:21Marc:Are you sitting down?

00:14:22Marc:Because I can't see either.

00:14:25Marc:I added that part.

00:14:26Marc:Are you sitting down because...

00:14:29Marc:Well, I can't see either.

00:14:30Marc:You know, you see I'm blind.

00:14:32Marc:I had a horrible accident when I was putting eye drops in.

00:14:37Marc:You know, I fell in my small bathroom into the mirror and I jammed the visine into my eye and lost an eye.

00:14:47Marc:And then I couldn't see clearly out of the other one.

00:14:50Marc:So I wanted to clear that one.

00:14:51Marc:It just happened twice.

00:14:52Marc:And I haven't even told you this.

00:14:55Marc:The Q-tip story yet.

00:14:57Marc:I'm starting to think I should stop drinking because it's probably not the size of my bathroom.

00:15:02Marc:Am I right?

00:15:03Marc:Hey, folks, look, let's get on with it.

00:15:09Marc:My guest today is Mike Sweeney, head writer for Conan O'Brien going back to the mid-90s.

00:15:16Marc:I have a history with that show.

00:15:18Marc:I have a history with Mike.

00:15:19Marc:I have a history with the previous head writer.

00:15:22Marc:He co-hosts the podcast Inside Conan, an important Hollywood podcast along with Jesse Gaskell.

00:15:30Marc:And it was one of the most mind-blowing stories of a life that I've heard.

00:15:35Marc:This is me talking to Mike Sweeney.

00:15:48Guest:How do you know Ty Siegel?

00:15:51Guest:My son turned me on to him.

00:15:53Marc:Wait, how old are your kids?

00:15:54Guest:22 and 25.

00:15:56Guest:Get the fuck out of here.

00:15:57Guest:But when he was like 13, they would DJ.

00:16:02Guest:Whenever we would drive, they'd put together...

00:16:04Guest:Yeah.

00:16:04Guest:A playlist.

00:16:05Guest:Yeah.

00:16:05Guest:And he played Melted for me.

00:16:08Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:16:09Guest:Which is a great album.

00:16:10Guest:Sure.

00:16:10Guest:But it was one song from there.

00:16:12Guest:And so he's like, who's this?

00:16:14Guest:Who's this?

00:16:15Guest:Yeah.

00:16:15Guest:And I kept hitting him.

00:16:17Guest:Big Ty Siegel guy, huh?

00:16:19Marc:Yeah.

00:16:19Marc:Yeah, he was.

00:16:20Marc:He is.

00:16:21Marc:I just got Michael Cronin's new record.

00:16:23Marc:I'm giving it a spin.

00:16:24Marc:Good.

00:16:25Marc:They're very different.

00:16:25Marc:They're friends.

00:16:26Marc:Yes, they're pals.

00:16:27Marc:They play together a lot.

00:16:28Marc:They work together at times.

00:16:28Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:16:29Marc:A very different sound.

00:16:30Marc:Yes.

00:16:31Marc:I think Ty Siegel puts out a record like every two months.

00:16:34Guest:I can't keep up with him.

00:16:35Guest:I'm like a teenage girl where I like one guy.

00:16:38Guest:Yeah.

00:16:38Guest:And I'm just like, that's my...

00:16:39Guest:But forget it.

00:16:41Guest:Did you buy all of them?

00:16:43Guest:Well, yeah, I bought them online.

00:16:45Guest:But no, I like the last two or three albums.

00:16:48Guest:Forget it.

00:16:48Guest:So your kids are 22?

00:16:50Guest:And 25, yeah.

00:16:51Marc:Oh, you just have two?

00:16:52Marc:Two boys.

00:16:53Marc:Oh, I thought you had like seven kids.

00:16:54Guest:No.

00:16:55Guest:I mean, I'll make up five.

00:16:57Guest:Five children I don't talk about.

00:16:59Guest:Two boys?

00:17:00Guest:Two boys, yeah.

00:17:01Guest:Same wife?

00:17:02Guest:Same wife, 28 years.

00:17:05Guest:It's been 28 years?

00:17:06Guest:That's insanity, yes.

00:17:08Guest:I feel like I must have met her once.

00:17:10Guest:Possibly.

00:17:10Guest:Back in the day.

00:17:12Guest:You know, I loved her.

00:17:13Guest:She went to, like, we started dating, and she went to comedy clubs three times.

00:17:18Guest:Three?

00:17:19Guest:That was it?

00:17:19Guest:The third time, she's like, she goes, you know what?

00:17:21Guest:I'm good.

00:17:22Guest:And I was like, aye, you are something special.

00:17:25Guest:Cause I don't, I think I get it.

00:17:29Marc:Cause I, I guess I met you.

00:17:31Marc:I mean, I moved to New York basically in 89.

00:17:35Marc:And how long did you live in New York?

00:17:37Marc:Well, I moved down there.

00:17:38Marc:I was in, I was in New York 89 and I was going back and forth from New York to Boston.

00:17:44Marc:Right.

00:17:45Marc:I had to work for a living.

00:17:46Marc:But I couldn't get on a catch.

00:17:47Marc:So I was in New York from 89 to 93.

00:17:49Marc:Right.

00:17:49Marc:And then back again from 95 to 2002.

00:17:54Marc:I met you in Boston.

00:17:55Marc:You did?

00:17:56Marc:I did.

00:17:57Guest:And I don't... It was... I came up from New York to work at Nick's for the weekend.

00:18:03Guest:Oh, right.

00:18:04Guest:And, you know, they had a Nick's downtown and then one out in...

00:18:07Guest:Yeah.

00:18:08Guest:All the horrible.

00:18:09Guest:Marvelous Marvin.

00:18:10Guest:Marvin Hagler was from.

00:18:12Guest:It was in Brockton.

00:18:13Guest:There was a Nixon Brockton.

00:18:15Guest:Yes.

00:18:16Guest:So I. That was a short lived Knicks.

00:18:19Guest:Well, I think I closed.

00:18:21Guest:Like if this is who you're sending here.

00:18:24Marc:Was I working with you?

00:18:25Guest:We they had a they had an old townhouse.

00:18:29Guest:Right.

00:18:29Marc:Right.

00:18:29Guest:I think Paul Revere lived or something.

00:18:31Guest:Right downtown.

00:18:32Guest:Yeah.

00:18:32Guest:I stayed there one night and you were staying in another bedroom.

00:18:36Guest:No.

00:18:36Guest:Yes.

00:18:37Guest:Oh, my God.

00:18:38Guest:What year was that?

00:18:40Guest:I don't know.

00:18:40Guest:88 or 89, maybe?

00:18:42Guest:Right.

00:18:43Guest:And we talked just for a few minutes.

00:18:45Guest:And, you know, I don't think I'd ever stayed in a comedy condo.

00:18:49Guest:I'd always heard about them.

00:18:50Guest:Right.

00:18:51Guest:And I was like, what's the etiquette?

00:18:53Guest:And am I supposed to be...

00:18:54Guest:Do drugs and drink.

00:18:56Guest:What do I do, man?

00:18:58Guest:Did we do drugs and drink?

00:19:00Guest:No, we didn't at all.

00:19:01Guest:I think you were very philosophical.

00:19:03Guest:You were talking about a book you were reading or something.

00:19:06Guest:I was like, oh, okay.

00:19:08Guest:This man is on quite a life journey.

00:19:10Guest:I was like, okay.

00:19:17Marc:That was it.

00:19:17Marc:We just talked for a few minutes.

00:19:18Marc:How did that weekend go for you in Brockton?

00:19:20Guest:Oh, man.

00:19:21Guest:I was with Joe Rogan.

00:19:23Guest:Right.

00:19:23Guest:Yes.

00:19:24Guest:And he drove me out there in like a... Because he lived there.

00:19:27Guest:...souped up Camaro.

00:19:28Guest:Like 87.

00:19:28Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:19:30Guest:Wow.

00:19:30Guest:And I'd never met him before, but he was just... Had hair.

00:19:34Guest:He had hair then.

00:19:35Guest:A little bit of hair.

00:19:35Guest:Yeah, he had hair.

00:19:36Guest:Yeah.

00:19:37Guest:And bigger muscles than now, probably.

00:19:40Marc:No, he's pretty big.

00:19:41Marc:But he's probably still just coming out of the kickboxing thing.

00:19:44Guest:He was just coming out of that.

00:19:46Guest:Yeah.

00:19:47Guest:And...

00:19:48Guest:What I learned that weekend was Boston Comics really liked to talk about other Boston Comics.

00:19:56Marc:I don't like to say.

00:19:57Guest:Well, he was preemptively like, oh, this guy doesn't, you know, he's not into me, but, you know, I could kick his ass.

00:20:05Guest:And we went to Brockton and he killed there.

00:20:08Guest:Yeah.

00:20:09Guest:He did great.

00:20:09Guest:And then I did the other club and then I came back to New York.

00:20:12Marc:The next downtown?

00:20:13Marc:Yes.

00:20:14Marc:Yeah.

00:20:15Marc:I mean, look, yeah, it was all right, right?

00:20:17Marc:It was a specific type of audience.

00:20:19Marc:But did you do, like, where did you come from?

00:20:21Guest:I like the overly broad question.

00:20:25Guest:I grew up in New Jersey.

00:20:26Guest:Really?

00:20:27Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:20:27Guest:What part of Jersey?

00:20:28Guest:On the New York border, Montvale, small town I went to.

00:20:33Guest:Bill Maher went to my high school, Pasquette Hills High School, and Tom Papa.

00:20:38Guest:Oh, really?

00:20:39Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:20:40Marc:Are you the same age as Papa or a little older?

00:20:42Guest:No, good God.

00:20:43Guest:I think I'm much older than Papa.

00:20:45Marc:Really?

00:20:45Guest:And Bill Maher was, I think, two years ahead of me.

00:20:48Marc:That's all?

00:20:49Guest:Yeah.

00:20:50Guest:How old are you?

00:20:51Guest:I'm 62.

00:20:52Guest:Are you really?

00:20:52Guest:Yeah.

00:20:53Guest:Holy shit.

00:20:54Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:20:55Guest:Well, I didn't start comedy until I was 28.

00:20:57Guest:I'm 56.

00:20:58Guest:I thought we were the same.

00:20:59Guest:Sure.

00:21:00Guest:No, you're like older.

00:21:01Guest:I'm much older.

00:21:02Guest:You're a legit boomer.

00:21:03Guest:I'm a serious boomer.

00:21:05Guest:Five people said, okay, boomer to me today.

00:21:10Marc:Oh, yeah, today?

00:21:11Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:21:11Marc:I caught the tail end of the boomer to the point where I have no identity.

00:21:14Marc:My generation has no identity.

00:21:16Marc:Right.

00:21:16Marc:63 is just, what are you?

00:21:18Marc:Well, we just picked up the garbage that they left.

00:21:20Marc:Right, right.

00:21:21Marc:But people don't ask you that, do they?

00:21:23Marc:No.

00:21:23Marc:How old I am or whether I'm a boomer.

00:21:25Guest:What you consider yourself.

00:21:27Marc:I consider myself, it's sort of nebulous.

00:21:30Marc:Right.

00:21:30Marc:Because by the time I got to high school, everything that had already happened to music.

00:21:34Marc:Right.

00:21:35Marc:And my sophomore, junior year, new wave happened.

00:21:38Marc:Right.

00:21:39Marc:And then I think disco was happening.

00:21:42Marc:Right.

00:21:42Marc:So it was nothing you could latch on to, except for the Zeppelin stuff that had happened years ago.

00:21:46Marc:Yes.

00:21:46Marc:It all had already happened.

00:21:47Guest:No, until New Wave and punk came in.

00:21:51Guest:That was a scary time.

00:21:53Guest:Yeah, it was like, who are we?

00:21:55Marc:I'm not wearing those shoes.

00:21:56Marc:Yeah, and I thought the 80s for music was... Kind of bad?

00:22:00Marc:Personally, I thought it was bad.

00:22:01Marc:Yeah, no, I think so.

00:22:03Marc:I can't remember, because once I was in college...

00:22:06Guest:Yeah.

00:22:07Guest:Where'd you go to college?

00:22:08Marc:Boston University.

00:22:09Guest:Oh, okay.

00:22:09Guest:That explains, okay.

00:22:11Marc:81.

00:22:11Guest:That explains how you ended up in Boston.

00:22:13Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:22:14Marc:Okay, got it.

00:22:14Marc:But yours, so 28.

00:22:16Marc:So you had another plan?

00:22:17Marc:Were you one of those lawyers?

00:22:19Guest:I was one of the lawyers.

00:22:20Marc:You were, weren't you?

00:22:21Marc:Yeah, I was a trial lawyer for three years.

00:22:24Marc:Holy shit.

00:22:24Marc:Hold on a minute.

00:22:26Marc:Yeah.

00:22:26Marc:So Sweeney, now how many kids did you grow up?

00:22:29Marc:How many kids in the family?

00:22:30Marc:I thought you asked me how many kids I had again.

00:22:31Marc:Not you.

00:22:33Guest:Three.

00:22:33Guest:I had two older sisters.

00:22:34Guest:I was the baby.

00:22:35Guest:Oh, okay.

00:22:36Guest:And I also grew up in a kind of, my mother was, you know, had mental issues.

00:22:44Guest:And so it was pretty, it was pretty crazy.

00:22:46Guest:Like I ended up living at home until I was 26.

00:22:49Guest:Because of your mom?

00:22:50Guest:To help her out?

00:22:51Guest:uh yeah but also yeah she she was like really into mind control so uh yeah can you elaborate um she she she was uh in the 60s i didn't i didn't learn this till much later yeah she's still around no oh that's why we can speak for you yes of course yeah

00:23:11Guest:She was diagnosed with multiple personality disorder.

00:23:15Guest:Really?

00:23:15Guest:Which we didn't know.

00:23:17Guest:I didn't learn that until much later.

00:23:20Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:23:20Marc:Was your dad around?

00:23:21Guest:I just thought she was a bad impressionist.

00:23:24Guest:My dad was around, but he was like kind of a milquetoasty kind of...

00:23:30Guest:alcoholic who you know she he was in over his head with her so he checked out and then she would you know she'd get really violent and stuff like it was so kind of a wild childhood but it was it was kind of cinematic like we i think we told ourselves over in a kind of in a movie because it was like

00:23:53Guest:You know, like I, it was crazy.

00:23:56Guest:Like I put furniture against the door at night.

00:23:59Guest:Really?

00:23:59Guest:Because I know like if she was in a certain phase, she'd be coming up in the middle, like two in the morning with like a butcher knife.

00:24:08Guest:What?

00:24:09Guest:Yeah, no, is that crazy?

00:24:10Guest:Like we'd have to lock ourselves in the bathroom upstairs.

00:24:14Marc:But theatrically or did she actually hit you?

00:24:16Guest:Yes, yes, you had to move quickly.

00:24:20Guest:You had to get out of the way.

00:24:23Guest:It was crazy.

00:24:24Marc:That's fucking terrible.

00:24:25Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:24:26Marc:Or were your sisters old enough to at least look out for you?

00:24:30Guest:No, it was every man.

00:24:33Guest:It was kind of like we'd all rat each other out to her to gain favor, just even if it meant five minutes.

00:24:40Guest:So that was the mind control element?

00:24:42Guest:Well, I hear Kim.

00:24:44Guest:You know, just, you know, stayed up late last night and just mentioning it apropos.

00:24:51Guest:Just the next time you're grabbing a knife, you might want to head her way first.

00:24:56Guest:That's crazy.

00:24:57Guest:But when she wasn't crazy, she was very warm.

00:25:01Marc:But that's really.

00:25:02Guest:It was crazy schizophrenic.

00:25:04Guest:But that's really the diagnosis, not bipolar, straight up multiple personalities.

00:25:09Guest:Now they call it disassociative, I think, personality disorder, which is much more boring.

00:25:13Marc:Who diagnosed that in retrospect?

00:25:15Marc:How do you diagnose that retroactively?

00:25:17Guest:I found out years later that she went to a psychiatrist.

00:25:21Guest:In the 60s when we were little.

00:25:25Guest:But no one ever shared that info with us.

00:25:28Guest:She wasn't on medicine?

00:25:30Guest:No.

00:25:30Guest:She had a condition where she would never admit that she did anything wrong.

00:25:36Guest:So there'd be two days of chasing us around, and then she'd be like, push your father out of the house.

00:25:48Guest:She'd make us kick him out of the house all the time.

00:25:50Guest:How do you kick your father out of the house?

00:25:52Guest:You'd grab him and say, get out of here.

00:25:54Guest:Because if you didn't get him out, she'd turn on us.

00:25:57Guest:So we were highly motivated.

00:25:59Guest:And then we'd have to wire the doors shut.

00:26:01Guest:What?

00:26:02Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:26:02Guest:And then he'd sleep in the car.

00:26:04Guest:Come on.

00:26:05Guest:Yeah.

00:26:06Guest:And he had a big job.

00:26:07Guest:He like ran.

00:26:09Guest:He ran his director of research for a pharmaceutical company and he was mayor of our town.

00:26:16Guest:This is crazy.

00:26:17Guest:Yeah.

00:26:18Guest:Yeah.

00:26:18Guest:And are you telling me the truth?

00:26:20Guest:Yeah.

00:26:21Guest:Yeah.

00:26:21Marc:Oh, my God.

00:26:22Guest:One night he was sleeping in the car.

00:26:24Guest:I think I was 12.

00:26:25Guest:And my sisters were away at college.

00:26:28Guest:So from 12 to 13, I was alone with her at the height of the... That was like a bad year.

00:26:36Guest:And he was like drunk, sitting out in the station wagon in the driveway.

00:26:40Guest:And so she was like, we have to get him to...

00:26:42Guest:hospital her whole thing was brainwashing us that he was the cause of she acted up because of my the way my father acted if he was more of a man yeah she'd be fine oh my god we just you know we were brainwashed because we were afraid of her so anyway that he's he's drunk in the station wagon she goes we have to get him to the hospital he's alcoholic yeah and she said um

00:27:07Guest:I have a plan.

00:27:09Guest:Let's make a little lasso, a noose.

00:27:13Guest:You sneak in the back seat and put the noose over his head and pull it so he can't escape.

00:27:19Guest:And then I'll get in the driver's seat and drive him to the emergency room.

00:27:23Guest:And you're 13.

00:27:24Guest:I was 12.

00:27:25Guest:And so I'm like, I think we should maybe test this out on a dummy.

00:27:31Guest:Let's give this a week.

00:27:33Guest:I think we're rushing this.

00:27:35Guest:But, you know, she's like, just do it.

00:27:36Guest:Just do it.

00:27:37Guest:So I'm like, okay.

00:27:38Guest:So, you know, we're really sneaking out in our own driveway.

00:27:43Guest:And it's like, okay, on three.

00:27:44Guest:And I jumped in.

00:27:45Guest:And I mean, I deliberately didn't get the lasso around his neck.

00:27:49Guest:And then he escaped.

00:27:51Guest:He did?

00:27:51Guest:Well, yeah.

00:27:52Guest:I mean, I couldn't.

00:27:52Guest:And so then, of course, she locked me out of the house for...

00:27:56Guest:for not lassoing.

00:27:57Guest:And where'd your dad go when he escaped?

00:27:59Guest:He started staying in like flop houses over like the Nannywood Hotel pizzeria in Rockland County.

00:28:06Guest:Really?

00:28:06Guest:Yeah, yeah, he was a mess.

00:28:08Guest:And then it got crazier because then he got serious emphysema and he couldn't work anymore.

00:28:17Guest:And my mother took him back in the house, but he shared my bedroom with me.

00:28:22Guest:But because she had turned us against him, I didn't I shared a room with him.

00:28:27Guest:I had to change his oxygen tanks and everything for two years.

00:28:30Guest:I never and I didn't talk to him once.

00:28:33Guest:What?

00:28:33Guest:Yeah, because she and then when he and then when he died, my sisters and I and I was 19 and my sisters were like in their early 20s.

00:28:40Guest:We all thought.

00:28:41Guest:I mean, we knew underneath, oh, she's, you know, insane.

00:28:46Guest:But part of us thought when he died, everything would be great.

00:28:50Guest:And then six months after he died, she turned it all on us and we were all the problems.

00:28:58Yeah.

00:28:58Guest:But she had a crazy amnesia.

00:29:00Guest:Like she would spend a night of chasing us with knives and she'd do like crystal knock, like knock all the windows out of the house with a pitchfork and crazy stuff.

00:29:10Guest:And the next day you'd tell her what she did and she'd go, I don't know what you're talking about.

00:29:17Marc:She would- Oh my God.

00:29:18Marc:So you stayed there- She would gaslight.

00:29:21Marc:To your 26?

00:29:22Yes.

00:29:22Marc:But how are you so reasonable and chipper?

00:29:27Guest:Because I'm not there anymore.

00:29:28Guest:It's all gravy.

00:29:31Guest:What do you mean?

00:29:32Guest:I'm like, zee.

00:29:34Guest:So I remember seeing the movie Carrie and Piper Laurie's grabbing knives.

00:29:39Guest:And I'm just like, come on, when is this?

00:29:41Guest:When does this get scary?

00:29:45Marc:When does the scary stuff happen?

00:29:47Marc:I mean, you were genuinely terrified all the time.

00:29:49Marc:Your dad was in the room with you for two years.

00:29:51Marc:You didn't talk to him.

00:29:52Marc:You were just there wheezing?

00:29:53Guest:He was wheezing on oxygen.

00:29:55Guest:I changed his tanks.

00:29:56Guest:You never talked to him?

00:29:57Guest:Well, he didn't try to talk to... It was so bizarre.

00:30:00Guest:Was he drinking still?

00:30:01Guest:No, he wasn't drinking.

00:30:03Guest:And he couldn't.

00:30:05Guest:He had like 10% of his lung capacity.

00:30:07Guest:He was just on oxygen.

00:30:09Marc:Oh, my God.

00:30:09Guest:This is so grim.

00:30:10Guest:It was fantastic.

00:30:13Guest:You know what?

00:30:13Guest:I never told anyone any of this because it was like, you don't talk about what happens.

00:30:18Guest:And, you know, this is happening.

00:30:19Guest:Your mom said that?

00:30:20Guest:Oh, she's like, this happened.

00:30:21Guest:Believe me.

00:30:21Guest:Trust me.

00:30:22Guest:There's stuff going on behind every door on the street.

00:30:25Guest:I'm like, all right.

00:30:26Guest:Okay.

00:30:27Guest:Did she have a job?

00:30:28Guest:No.

00:30:29Guest:No, no, no.

00:30:30Marc:So when your dad is out of work and like he's dying, were you just... He got disability.

00:30:36Guest:So... How'd your sisters turn out?

00:30:40Guest:No, they're great.

00:30:40Guest:They're good.

00:30:41Guest:You know, we became really tight because we went through it.

00:30:44Guest:So...

00:30:45Guest:Are they married and kids?

00:30:46Guest:They're married with kids.

00:30:48Guest:They all turned out really well.

00:30:52Guest:And we're tight.

00:30:53Guest:And I think it's because we went through this craziness.

00:30:57Marc:Right.

00:30:57Marc:But you must have had some sort of fortitude because you seem pretty well adjusted.

00:31:01Marc:You always have.

00:31:02Marc:Right.

00:31:02Marc:But I mean, that's not saying much.

00:31:04Marc:I mean, in a sense, anybody can.

00:31:06Marc:But was there psychological trauma that you had to overcome or process?

00:31:13Marc:Yeah.

00:31:13Guest:Well, when she was... She was also very loving and she was a good audience.

00:31:20Guest:Really?

00:31:21Guest:I tried to crack her up when she was normal.

00:31:23Guest:Yeah.

00:31:24Guest:And when she was fine, when she wasn't having an episode...

00:31:28Guest:I think she's very nurturing.

00:31:31Guest:And so there was some some counterbalance to it.

00:31:35Guest:And I just when things were going crazy, like she'd literally go down in the basement and bang on a piano at two in the morning and you'd hear the music come through the heating ducts and you knew.

00:31:47Guest:Is it trouble?

00:31:49Guest:It was like Phantom of the Opera.

00:31:50Guest:Like you knew she was coming up in around 20.

00:31:52Guest:And that's when I'd be like, shit, get the desk against the door.

00:31:56Guest:And she'd be like, the door would be open and I'd be pushing and she'd be like, right, right with the knife.

00:32:02Guest:Really?

00:32:02Guest:Yes.

00:32:03Guest:Do you think she would stab you?

00:32:04Guest:Yeah.

00:32:05Guest:Listen, I came home once from a sleepover at a friend's house.

00:32:09Guest:I go up to my bathroom and I open the door.

00:32:12Guest:It's like 10 a.m.

00:32:12Guest:at my father's lying in a pool of blood because she stabbed him and she punctured his lung.

00:32:18Guest:And I'm just like, oh, fuck.

00:32:20Guest:I just want to have it.

00:32:21Guest:But, you know, you're just used to it.

00:32:22Guest:It's just like, ah, this is going to mess up Saturday.

00:32:26Marc:So you had to call the ambulance?

00:32:28Guest:I didn't call the ambulance, but yeah, he had to go to the hospital.

00:32:32Guest:And we didn't, I never told anyone any of this until I told a girlfriend when I was like 23 in New York City.

00:32:40Guest:And I thought I was going to get struck by lightning.

00:32:41Guest:Like it was that ingrained that you couldn't talk about.

00:32:44Marc:Oh, really?

00:32:44Marc:Yeah.

00:32:45Marc:And what did the girlfriend do?

00:32:47Marc:She broke up with me.

00:32:49Guest:Did she really?

00:32:50Guest:No, no, no.

00:32:51Guest:And then I was like, I've got a powerful tool to get laid with this sob story.

00:32:56Marc:But I don't know.

00:32:57Marc:So but OK, so were the times that she was OK?

00:33:01Marc:Did they outbalance the other stuff?

00:33:05Marc:No, it got worse and worse.

00:33:06Guest:It got worse and worse.

00:33:07Guest:And then were you the only one left in the house?

00:33:10Guest:Yes.

00:33:11Guest:Yes.

00:33:11Guest:My sisters.

00:33:13Guest:I was so angry in my 20s.

00:33:15Guest:And she also, I wanted to do comedy and I, you know, I was graduating from college and she was like, no, you have to go to law school.

00:33:26Guest:And, you know, her mojo was so powerful that I filled out law school.

00:33:32Guest:Where'd you go to undergrad?

00:33:33Guest:Rutgers and Newark.

00:33:34Guest:I commuted.

00:33:35Marc:Oh, Rutgers has a campus in Newark?

00:33:37Guest:Yes.

00:33:38Guest:Oh, my dad went to Rutgers.

00:33:39Marc:Oh, he did?

00:33:40Marc:Oh, okay.

00:33:41Guest:No, Rutgers-Newark is like, it's a parking deck in one building.

00:33:45Guest:Right.

00:33:45Guest:And it was a 35-mile each-way commute, but I was staying home with her.

00:33:50Guest:She's like, you can't go away to school.

00:33:53Guest:You got to stay here.

00:33:54Guest:There's too much to do here.

00:33:55Marc:Oh, my God.

00:33:56Marc:This is like Norman Bates.

00:33:58Guest:It was a little Norman Bates-y, but-

00:34:00Guest:Um, I got really good commuting, uh, at, uh, I commuted with a guy and I got really good at, you know, the toll baskets.

00:34:08Marc:Yeah.

00:34:09Guest:I got really good at, um, hook shotting the quarter in from the passenger seat.

00:34:14Marc:Right.

00:34:15Guest:So that was my big memory of commuting to records and to work.

00:34:19Guest:And I can, uh, but, um, what'd you get?

00:34:21Guest:What'd you study?

00:34:22Guest:Did you do well?

00:34:22Guest:You're a smart guy.

00:34:23Guest:Uh, the first two years I was kind of like, uh, and then I, I buckled down and then, uh,

00:34:28Guest:So she kind of filled out the applications for law school.

00:34:31Guest:And then I got in to Fordham in New York City in Lincoln Center.

00:34:35Guest:So I went there and then commuted there on a bus, which is really even worse.

00:34:40Marc:And you're just staying with her and she's yelling at you.

00:34:41Marc:The whole time.

00:34:42Guest:Yeah.

00:34:42Guest:She's yelling at you through your 20s.

00:34:44Guest:Yeah.

00:34:44Guest:The night before I took the bar exam.

00:34:46Guest:Yeah.

00:34:48Guest:She was getting mad because I was studying for the bar exam.

00:34:52Guest:It was the next morning.

00:34:53Guest:And she was mad I wasn't paying attention to her.

00:34:55Guest:So she grabbed a knife and came at me.

00:34:57Guest:And I was just like, motherfucker.

00:34:59Guest:I just grabbed her and threw her against the refrigerator.

00:35:02Guest:And she looked like, oh, my God.

00:35:05Guest:And she ran into her bedroom and called the police and said I was trying to murder her.

00:35:10Guest:Yeah.

00:35:10Guest:Did the police go?

00:35:11Guest:Yeah.

00:35:11Guest:Six police cars came roaring up our street.

00:35:16Guest:I don't think like it's the first call they got about a murder probably, you know, in 40 years.

00:35:21Guest:So they were all pretty jazzed to meet me.

00:35:26Guest:And I'm just like.

00:35:27Guest:I'm a bad procrastinator, and I had whole subjects I was planning to learn that night.

00:35:34Guest:The test was next morning at 8 a.m.

00:35:36Guest:The bar exam.

00:35:37Guest:In Manhattan, and I was out in the bar exam.

00:35:40Guest:It's a two-day test.

00:35:42Guest:And I'm just like, ugh.

00:35:46Guest:So I go outside.

00:35:47Guest:I'm like, don't make any moves.

00:35:49Guest:And I'm just like.

00:35:50Guest:oh, I've got to get rid of these guys.

00:35:52Guest:I've got to talk my way out of this, get them out of here, and get back to studying.

00:35:57Guest:So that was the goal for that night.

00:35:59Guest:What did you say to them?

00:36:01Guest:She's crazy?

00:36:02Guest:Yeah.

00:36:03Guest:I was like, guys, please, by all means, go in and talk to her.

00:36:08Guest:She's in the door on the left.

00:36:12Guest:Yeah, but so, yes, they kind of got the lay of the land.

00:36:15Guest:Yeah.

00:36:15Guest:And then they were on their way.

00:36:16Guest:And then I went back to study torts in time for the test.

00:36:20Marc:And did you pass a bar?

00:36:22Guest:I did.

00:36:23Guest:I did.

00:36:24Guest:And then I... And this whole time, I was like, I wanted to be trying stand-up comedy.

00:36:30Guest:But I was also...

00:36:33Guest:Like when I was in law school, I was just like, well, I've got to just do this thing.

00:36:38Guest:What?

00:36:38Guest:To law school?

00:36:39Guest:Yeah, and I was miserable.

00:36:41Guest:But you practiced law for a while.

00:36:43Guest:So then I got a job as a personal injury defense attorney, which was- With like a- It was an insurance company.

00:36:50Marc:Oh, okay.

00:36:51Marc:But I loved it.

00:36:51Marc:Not a group of, like you weren't on billboards with the guys, were you?

00:36:55Guest:No.

00:36:55Marc:Were you hurt in an accident?

00:36:57Guest:They were the other side.

00:36:58Guest:And I was 25 and I had my eyes opened to how people make up lawsuits.

00:37:03Guest:Like they'd use, like some lawyers would get disbarred because they'd use fake x-rays for a client.

00:37:11Marc:Oh, so you worked for the insurance company.

00:37:13Guest:The insurance company, yeah.

00:37:14Marc:And then somebody would present, would put together the case and give it to you.

00:37:18Guest:Exactly.

00:37:19Guest:Well, a lot of times I'd come in in the morning and they'd go, oh, they put a file on my desk and they go, they're picking a jury for this.

00:37:28Guest:You have to pick a jury.

00:37:30Guest:And you can learn the case on the subway.

00:37:32Guest:So on the subway down, I'd be like learning the file and you have to go in.

00:37:36Guest:And they just let me do like federal trials.

00:37:40Guest:I had no idea what I was doing.

00:37:41Guest:And big, big like insurance fraud cases and stuff.

00:37:45Marc:Just you?

00:37:46Guest:Yes.

00:37:47Guest:It was insane.

00:37:48Guest:It was insane.

00:37:48Marc:And once you start practicing, what's your mom doing alone at the house?

00:37:54Guest:Well, once I started practicing, I was like, I moved out.

00:37:58Guest:So I moved into a legal sublet in New York City.

00:38:01Marc:Who's taking care of her?

00:38:02Guest:No one took care of her for years and years.

00:38:05Guest:She became a hoarder.

00:38:08Guest:And...

00:38:09Guest:It did have a happy ending.

00:38:13Guest:It really did.

00:38:13Guest:She died in 2012, and three years before that, she really hurt her back, and she called my sisters.

00:38:21Guest:Oh, and the three of us, I'd invite her to my wedding.

00:38:23Guest:My sister signed.

00:38:26Guest:None of our kids were allowed to see her.

00:38:28Guest:It was painful.

00:38:30Marc:Wasn't it painful?

00:38:30Guest:Yeah, I was worried I'd get a call that, oh, she died in a pile of her garbage and she had been there a month and raccoons were playing with her entrails.

00:38:44Guest:And I was like, oh, that's going to suck when that happens.

00:38:47Guest:That's just going to be an open wound.

00:38:49Guest:So then what happened when she heard her back and my sisters went over there and she had to go to the emergency room and they brought her to the emergency room.

00:38:55Guest:And for the first time ever, they're just like, ah, you might want to...

00:39:00Guest:When you're done with the back, give her a little, I don't know if you have tests for the old brain.

00:39:05Guest:And they talked to her and they're like, oh, they admitted her for 48 hours, psychiatric evaluation.

00:39:12Guest:And they said she had a very rare condition where it's this thing where the person never can comprehend that there's anything wrong with them.

00:39:20Guest:And plus she was paranoid and all sorts of crazy stuff.

00:39:25Guest:So they put her on medicine and she had to go into a nursing home.

00:39:29Guest:But it was a nice one.

00:39:32Guest:And just because her back was injured.

00:39:35Guest:But this medicine worked.

00:39:37Guest:And she was great.

00:39:39Guest:She was like the good mother all the time.

00:39:42Guest:Wow.

00:39:43Guest:And so...

00:39:45Guest:Yeah.

00:39:45Guest:For how many years?

00:39:47Guest:Like three years.

00:39:49Guest:But I started calling her and I'd hang up and just sit there stunned for 20 minutes.

00:39:55Guest:And I never thought that would happen.

00:40:00Marc:Did she remember your childhood and everything?

00:40:03Marc:No.

00:40:05Marc:No.

00:40:05Marc:So you were talking to a relatively new person, but she knew you were there.

00:40:08Guest:Oh, I mean-

00:40:10Guest:She'd have memory of things, but she didn't have a memory of anything going on while it was happening.

00:40:15Guest:I'm telling you, she'd have this total amnesia.

00:40:18Marc:But like when she talked to you, she knew who you were.

00:40:20Marc:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:40:21Guest:Oh, yes, yes, yes.

00:40:22Guest:Yes, yes.

00:40:23Guest:No, when I was... And then when I was doing stand-up, she was like...

00:40:27Guest:What are you doing stand-up for?

00:40:28Guest:You're always a writer.

00:40:30Guest:You should be a writer.

00:40:31Guest:You're no good at it.

00:40:33Guest:What are you doing that for?

00:40:34Guest:Really?

00:40:34Guest:And so then I end up becoming a writer eventually on the Conan show.

00:40:39Guest:And then she's like, oh, what are you writing for?

00:40:42Guest:Stand-up.

00:40:43Guest:What did she think you should be writing for?

00:40:47Guest:I don't know.

00:40:48Guest:But that's how supportive she was.

00:40:51Marc:But it's so funny that you honored her wishes both times.

00:40:55Marc:That's a good point.

00:40:56Marc:I mean, she told you to go to law school.

00:40:59Marc:You went.

00:40:59Marc:I did.

00:41:00Marc:And you practiced this weird law.

00:41:02Marc:Yes.

00:41:03Marc:And you were doing stand-up at the same time.

00:41:05Marc:Once you moved into the city, you started doing it?

00:41:06Guest:The second I moved into the city, I started doing open mics.

00:41:09Guest:Yeah.

00:41:10Guest:So some days I'd be like...

00:41:13Guest:preparing for cross-examination yeah and then running to a club called good times to do an open mic a good times where was that uh those third avenue and 31st street i don't remember that place no it was it was gone oh by the time you showed up really people like randy credico hung out there sure randy credico now he's famous yes i love it for the roger stone oh my god

00:41:37Marc:Randy Credico.

00:41:38Marc:I used to see him in Boston.

00:41:39Marc:He worked at Air America.

00:41:41Marc:He'd do one political joke and he goes, what do you want, impressions?

00:41:45Guest:And then do Popeye.

00:41:46Guest:Popeye selling drugs in Washington Square Park.

00:41:49Guest:And then he'd go back to, all right, here's the postmaster general of the Sandinista government.

00:41:54Guest:And no one laughs.

00:41:54Guest:Oh, here's Popeye orgasming.

00:41:58Guest:Okay.

00:42:00Marc:I always loved him.

00:42:00Guest:When I met him, he was going out with Joey Heatherton.

00:42:03Guest:Do you remember?

00:42:03Guest:Oh, man.

00:42:04Marc:Yeah, he was.

00:42:05Marc:And now he's like the key witness.

00:42:07Marc:Roger Stone trial.

00:42:08Marc:What was the other impressions he did?

00:42:10Marc:He did Tully Savalas.

00:42:12Guest:Okay, yeah.

00:42:14Guest:He would do Tully Savalas for the Players Club shows, entertainment.

00:42:18Guest:Yeah, right.

00:42:18Guest:Tully, isn't that the same thing?

00:42:20Guest:Oh, I lapped it up.

00:42:23Guest:And Otto and George.

00:42:25Guest:Otto and George were at good times.

00:42:26Guest:Oh, really?

00:42:27Guest:Yeah.

00:42:27Marc:Did you ever work with him?

00:42:29Marc:Sure.

00:42:29Marc:I worked with him once, but I interviewed him.

00:42:32Marc:You did?

00:42:32Marc:No, I interviewed him.

00:42:33Marc:I had them on a live show because I went and found Otto and George and had them on the live show because I had a woman who had made a robot.

00:42:40Marc:that talked, that did stand-up.

00:42:41Marc:So I'm like, I figured this would be an interesting pairing.

00:42:44Marc:The woman who made the robot and programmed it to do stand-up and Otto and his puppet.

00:42:49Marc:And it was sort of interesting.

00:42:51Marc:It may have been a high-minded idea, but I think it came off.

00:42:55Marc:But who else was around then?

00:42:56Marc:So you started in 1980- It was like early 86.

00:43:00Guest:Right.

00:43:02Guest:And then I quit my law job on August 1st, 1986.

00:43:06Guest:I remember that date.

00:43:07Guest:I had no money saved, but I had an illegal sublet.

00:43:10Guest:My rent was really low.

00:43:13Marc:So your mother- Yeah.

00:43:15Marc:Lived to 2012?

00:43:17Marc:Yes.

00:43:17Marc:So she actually was able to see you on TV and to make the judgment about your stand-up.

00:43:21Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:43:22Marc:I mean, she didn't come see you do stand-up, did she?

00:43:25Guest:She did come once, and I think I canceled or something.

00:43:29Marc:Because I remember there was that time, so 86, so you quit your job and now you're doing stand-up.

00:43:32Marc:Because you were great stand-up.

00:43:34Marc:I thought you were very funny.

00:43:36Marc:Oh, thanks.

00:43:37Marc:I always enjoyed watching you.

00:43:39Marc:You were one of those guys, you had your bits, but you were always hilarious crowd work.

00:43:44Marc:I like talking to the audience.

00:43:45Marc:Yeah, so the improvisational trip was always exciting to watch.

00:43:50Guest:Well, that was more interesting to me.

00:43:52Guest:I mean, I like writing jokes and having them work, but I...

00:43:55Guest:I think I was just lazy about writing.

00:43:58Guest:Really?

00:43:59Guest:Yeah.

00:43:59Guest:Like I'd be like, I'm going to write today.

00:44:01Guest:I'm going to write today.

00:44:02Guest:And then it's like eight o'clock and I had like four sets and it's like, OK, I'm going to kind of just jerk around with the crowd.

00:44:09Marc:All right.

00:44:10Marc:So but once the 86.

00:44:11Marc:So like how does that that part of the career unfold?

00:44:13Marc:I mean, you do because we all did those shows.

00:44:16Marc:Sure.

00:44:16Marc:The Caroline's Comedy Hour.

00:44:18Marc:Right.

00:44:18Marc:But that's like 89.

00:44:19Marc:So by then you're doing it.

00:44:20Marc:It's not that much later.

00:44:21Marc:It's like three years.

00:44:23Marc:I mean, we all did those shows when we were like two or three years in, right?

00:44:26Marc:And Evening at the Improv.

00:44:27Guest:Yeah.

00:44:27Marc:Yes, I'd come out here to do Evening at the Improv.

00:44:29Marc:89, 89 through 92.

00:44:30Marc:Exactly.

00:44:31Marc:And we're like, but you really think about it.

00:44:33Marc:The A-list.

00:44:34Marc:Yeah, but like the A-list, right.

00:44:36Marc:Comedy Central.

00:44:37Marc:You did that?

00:44:37Guest:Yeah.

00:44:38Marc:Who'd you open for?

00:44:39Marc:They used to put the big guy first, and then you'd follow that guy.

00:44:43Marc:Yes.

00:44:44Marc:Yes.

00:44:44Marc:Mine was Amazing Jonathan.

00:44:46Marc:They had to clean up blood and a severed arm before I went out.

00:44:53Marc:We'll bring you up in a minute.

00:44:55Marc:Was Richard Lewis hosting?

00:44:56Marc:No, it was Sandra Bernhardt.

00:44:57Marc:Sandra Bernhardt.

00:44:58Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:44:58Marc:I had Richard, drunk Richard.

00:45:00Marc:You know, I can't remember who it was.

00:45:02Guest:You can't remember who did it?

00:45:03Marc:They put the big guy first.

00:45:04Guest:Yeah.

00:45:05Marc:It was weird.

00:45:06Guest:It was fine, though.

00:45:06Guest:It was fine.

00:45:08Guest:It's a nice set.

00:45:09Guest:But wasn't the Amazing Jonathan like a magic comedy?

00:45:12Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:45:13Marc:No, but it was all weirdo.

00:45:15Marc:Right.

00:45:15Marc:His closing bit was he cut his arm off.

00:45:18Marc:Oh.

00:45:19Marc:That's why there was blood everywhere.

00:45:20Marc:Oh.

00:45:20Marc:He cut his arm off.

00:45:22Marc:I thought that was your way of saying he killed.

00:45:24Marc:No, he did kill.

00:45:25Guest:No, I couldn't hear.

00:45:25Marc:He cut his arm off.

00:45:26Marc:How's that going to lose?

00:45:27Marc:It looked real.

00:45:29Marc:And now Marc Maron.

00:45:29Marc:And did they bring you up immediately?

00:45:32Marc:I don't know.

00:45:32Marc:I was in a borrowed jacket.

00:45:33Marc:I got the thing the day before I taped it and I was staying at some publicist's house who I was fucking.

00:45:38Marc:She lent me her roommate's jacket.

00:45:41Guest:I always love when hosts are like someone destroys and they're a total chicken.

00:45:47Guest:They're just like, I'm just going to bring up the next act.

00:45:49Guest:It's like, oh, thanks a lot.

00:45:51Guest:Do your job.

00:45:52Guest:Thank you.

00:45:53Guest:Quenze the palate, you fuck.

00:45:54Guest:Maybe 30 seconds.

00:45:56Marc:Oh, my God.

00:45:57Marc:Hey, let's keep it going.

00:45:58Marc:No, let's not.

00:45:59Marc:No.

00:46:01Marc:Make them forget that.

00:46:04Marc:I don't think it was that terrible.

00:46:05Marc:I feel like I watched it pretty recently.

00:46:07Marc:I'm sure it was great.

00:46:08Marc:But in your mind, it sounds like a scary situation.

00:46:13Marc:But look, I've watched my Evening at the Improvs from 89, 91.

00:46:16Marc:Yeah.

00:46:18Marc:And the Carolines.

00:46:20Marc:I couldn't watch them for years, but I really do.

00:46:23Marc:I get this idea for some reason that I wasn't me.

00:46:26Marc:But I was me.

00:46:27Marc:I can see me in there.

00:46:28Marc:Yeah, of course.

00:46:29Marc:I was slower and more deliberate and maybe more nervous.

00:46:31Marc:Oh, do you feel like you were slower back then?

00:46:33Marc:Well, I was trying to do jokes.

00:46:35Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:46:35Marc:You know what I mean?

00:46:36Marc:Right.

00:46:36Marc:I remember you corrected me on a joke and it was so embarrassing.

00:46:39Marc:What?

00:46:39Marc:What are you talking about?

00:46:40Marc:Two times.

00:46:41Marc:Wait, what?

00:46:41Marc:I was really dumb.

00:46:43Marc:It was one joke.

00:46:44Marc:I corrected you on a joke?

00:46:46Marc:Yeah, thank God.

00:46:47Marc:Well, I...

00:46:48Marc:It was like, cause I always thought you were so smart.

00:46:50Marc:Yeah.

00:46:51Marc:I used to do this big closer.

00:46:53Marc:Yeah.

00:46:54Marc:And it's so embarrassing, dude.

00:46:56Marc:It was like, uh, you know, the second coming world tour, you know, uh, uh, uh, uh, the King of beers brings you the King of Kings.

00:47:03Marc:Oh yeah.

00:47:04Marc:I remember that.

00:47:05Marc:Yeah.

00:47:05Marc:And for some reason I was saying a 52 state tour and you're like, are there two extra States?

00:47:11Marc:And I'm like, do I have that wrong?

00:47:12Marc:Uh,

00:47:12Marc:It's 50 states.

00:47:13Marc:You're right.

00:47:14Guest:And then the other one was- It's nice of you to say I'm smart, but knowing there are only 50 states, I don't know if that sets me apart from a lot of people.

00:47:23Guest:I don't know why I got it in my mind.

00:47:25Guest:Are you sure it was me?

00:47:25Marc:Yeah, I don't know why I got it in my mind.

00:47:27Marc:I kept just thinking for some reason Hawaii and Alaska were 51 and 52.

00:47:31Marc:I would have kept adding states.

00:47:34Marc:It gets better and better.

00:47:35Marc:I just made it up.

00:47:37Marc:But yeah, that was a big moment.

00:47:40Marc:So-

00:47:40Marc:A big moment.

00:47:42Marc:So you're doing, but you're pretty serious about stand-up and you're doing the real shows.

00:47:46Guest:You're going to Atlantic City, you're doing Boston.

00:47:48Guest:That happened eventually.

00:47:49Guest:I got on the comic strip and then I, it's like, it started getting into Catch Rise and Star and all, you know, the clubs you mentioned in New York City.

00:47:56Guest:Were they most, were you host, you thought of as a host?

00:47:58Guest:A host in sets, but I kind of started doing a lot of hosting.

00:48:03Guest:Yeah.

00:48:04Guest:And then I'd start doing one-nighters.

00:48:06Guest:Right.

00:48:06Guest:In Jersey and all that.

00:48:07Guest:Oh yeah.

00:48:08Guest:Which I loved because- Roger Paul gigs?

00:48:10Marc:Roger Paul gigs yes yes and you go to Tony Camacho do the Rascals Tony Camacho the Rascals yes Rascals by the Shore yeah the TV show did you do the Rascals yes yeah I did that too yeah yeah yeah that was a bad one that was a rough one because I watched that one and it was like right after I got back from LA and I was all fucking beat up from drugs and out of my mind yeah and I was sort of what I couldn't believe yeah watching it and I noticed this I just watched the first cut of my special for them I'd shot last week yeah

00:48:40Marc:At that time in like 88 or whenever I did that, it was a day notice to go to Jersey and tape that fucking show.

00:48:48Marc:I was in New York.

00:48:50Marc:I don't think I was sober yet.

00:48:52Marc:But I had these habits that were comic habits.

00:48:57Marc:You know, like repeating something.

00:48:58Marc:How many couples out there?

00:48:59Marc:Couples.

00:48:59Marc:How many couples we got?

00:49:00Marc:These weird...

00:49:01Marc:kind of standard tools of road act.

00:49:06Marc:Shorthand.

00:49:07Marc:Yeah, but it was all in there, that weird repetition.

00:49:09Marc:There are these things I didn't realize I have.

00:49:12Marc:I watched one last night.

00:49:13Marc:I do this weird impression on my show.

00:49:15Marc:I'm like, I'll do an impression now of where Jewish creativity comes from.

00:49:20Marc:And then I repeat it like, okay, impression of Jewish creativity.

00:49:23Marc:Right, right, right.

00:49:24Marc:And I'm like, where did those come from?

00:49:26Marc:That is old school.

00:49:27Marc:Right.

00:49:27Marc:That's very old school.

00:49:28Marc:Isn't it weird?

00:49:29Marc:Yeah.

00:49:30Marc:Like, I didn't like my jokes, but all that shit was intact.

00:49:32Marc:Right.

00:49:33Marc:Presentation was solid.

00:49:34Guest:Yeah.

00:49:35Guest:You had... Weird.

00:49:36Guest:It's very funny.

00:49:37Guest:So you did all that stuff.

00:49:39Guest:I did all that stuff.

00:49:41Guest:And, yeah, and then I just...

00:49:44Guest:Yeah, I'd do those one-nighters and some colleges.

00:49:48Guest:And I would take anything for money because it was my sole source income.

00:49:51Guest:So, you know, I'd do bachelor parties.

00:49:54Guest:You did?

00:49:54Guest:Yeah.

00:49:56Marc:But you weren't afraid of that because it kind of engaged your primary skill set, which was crowd work, right?

00:50:01Marc:Right.

00:50:02Guest:But I also thought...

00:50:03Guest:It was a macho thing.

00:50:06Guest:Were you like that?

00:50:07Guest:You had something to prove?

00:50:08Guest:I have to take any gig I'm offered.

00:50:11Marc:And I have to do well.

00:50:12Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:50:16Marc:I guess it's macho, but it's also like paying your dues.

00:50:19Marc:Right, I told all that stuff.

00:50:20Marc:I should be able to do this.

00:50:21Marc:anywhere anytime exactly yeah if i'm really if this is my my really my calling yeah and like any all the best guys did this shit you gotta get through this i hated it like i'd go do it it was so scary i was so full of anxiety do what like what any of these shitty gigs yeah because my act was so specific it was not like a party show right yeah i'm not the guy you want to bar mitzvah hey about to get married

00:50:45Marc:Here's Mark Merrick.

00:50:46Marc:Yeah, no.

00:50:47Marc:And I knew that.

00:50:48Marc:There was nothing I could do to change that.

00:50:50Marc:Right.

00:50:50Marc:But I'd still go do these fucking things.

00:50:52Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:50:52Marc:Well, it's learning.

00:50:53Guest:It's like dating.

00:50:54Marc:I don't know how I got through it.

00:50:57Marc:I look back on it and I'm like, I don't know how the kid I was back then got through that shit.

00:51:00Marc:Right.

00:51:01Marc:Any of that, living in Boston, doing all those one-nighters.

00:51:03Marc:I did one-nighters for years up there.

00:51:05Guest:Yeah.

00:51:06Guest:The one-nighters broke.

00:51:09Guest:A few of them where I'm just like,

00:51:11Guest:just comics who i didn't think were great were like the headliner and sure and i'm just and then i just said i'm just gonna stay in new york city and then i just stayed in new york city and that's why in order to stay in new york city i started taking bachelor part like yeah or you know you didn't go do like road work like headlining you're

00:51:34Marc:You didn't make it to a headliner.

00:51:36Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:51:37Guest:No, no, I never.

00:51:39Guest:Sometimes, sometimes, but not a ton of it.

00:51:43Guest:Colleges, I did a fair amount of colleges.

00:51:45Marc:Oh, yeah?

00:51:46Guest:Yeah, I did a lot of colleges.

00:51:48Guest:You did NACA?

00:51:49Guest:I did NACA.

00:51:51Guest:Who was your manager?

00:51:54Guest:The Abrahamsons.

00:51:56Marc:The Abrahamsons?

00:51:57Marc:Yes.

00:51:57Guest:No.

00:51:58Guest:Oh.

00:51:58Guest:I have no idea who that is.

00:52:00Guest:Yes.

00:52:00Marc:I thought you knew everybody.

00:52:01Guest:They are a couple and they both talked like this, the husband and the wife.

00:52:06Guest:Yeah.

00:52:07Guest:So I didn't know whether they were siblings or a married couple.

00:52:11Guest:Who else did they manage?

00:52:13Guest:They were really into ventriloquists.

00:52:16Guest:What?

00:52:17Guest:Yes, for every summer, their big vacation was going to a ventriloquist convention in Kansas.

00:52:23Guest:Come on.

00:52:24Guest:They'd come back.

00:52:25Guest:They'd go, Mike Sweeney.

00:52:26Guest:They'd call me Mike Sweeney.

00:52:27Guest:Mike Sweeney, we saw over 400 vents last week.

00:52:29Guest:It was fantastic.

00:52:30Guest:Ventriloquists?

00:52:32Guest:Who even knew there were 400?

00:52:34Guest:They saw them, and we'll be back next year.

00:52:36Guest:We already booked for next year.

00:52:39Guest:And how did you get so lucky to get them?

00:52:42Guest:Yeah.

00:52:43Guest:Listen, it's amazing.

00:52:45Guest:I lucked out somehow.

00:52:46Marc:And when did we, like, when was, I'm trying to think, like, because I remember we were all in, you had a pretty big part in C.K.

00:52:55Marc:'s Caesar salad movie.

00:52:57Marc:Oh, right, yes.

00:52:57Marc:Because I did the music for it, and I remember,

00:52:59Marc:Oh, I didn't know that.

00:53:00Marc:Well, I had to play over that scene where you have that meltdown on stage.

00:53:04Marc:Right, right.

00:53:05Marc:You know, as the emcee.

00:53:07Marc:Right.

00:53:07Marc:With your eye makeup on, and it was just weird.

00:53:10Marc:And Jeff Ross had my guitar, but he couldn't play.

00:53:13Marc:So I had to do the soundtrack to watch the band and line it up.

00:53:19Marc:Oh, wow.

00:53:20Marc:Yeah, it was like, what was that, 89?

00:53:22Marc:Maybe, 89, yeah.

00:53:23Guest:Right?

00:53:23Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:53:25Guest:And I think Sarah was in it.

00:53:26Guest:Sarah Silverman.

00:53:27Marc:Sarah was in it.

00:53:28Marc:Mark Shapiro was in it.

00:53:29Marc:Yeah, Rick Shapiro.

00:53:30Marc:We were all, everyone was in it.

00:53:31Marc:Todd Berry was in it.

00:53:32Marc:Todd Berry.

00:53:33Marc:DiPaolo was in it.

00:53:33Marc:Yes.

00:53:34Marc:I think, was Chuck Squire in it?

00:53:36Marc:Or he was in the next one?

00:53:37Marc:Maybe.

00:53:37Marc:He starred in the next one.

00:53:39Marc:Right.

00:53:40Marc:Ice Cream?

00:53:41Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:53:42Marc:Laura Keitlinger was a, there was a short that Laura was in.

00:53:46Marc:Right.

00:53:46Marc:That was weird.

00:53:48Marc:I love Laura.

00:53:48Marc:Yeah.

00:53:49Marc:Oh yeah, me too.

00:53:50Marc:But I remember that time.

00:53:51Marc:In Churksklar.

00:53:52Marc:Yeah, I remember that.

00:53:53Marc:It was so funny because you did this.

00:53:55Marc:I remember, I feel like I was there when they shot that because you had this meltdown on stage, right?

00:54:00Marc:Right, right.

00:54:01Marc:Yeah.

00:54:01Guest:It's just kind of ad-libbing a song.

00:54:03Marc:Right.

00:54:03Marc:Yeah.

00:54:04Guest:That was wild.

00:54:05Guest:I've never seen that.

00:54:06Marc:Really?

00:54:06Guest:Yeah.

00:54:09Marc:I wonder if it's around.

00:54:11Marc:I don't know.

00:54:11Marc:I feel like I could have it on DVD somewhere.

00:54:14Marc:But anyways, you were part of that whole crew.

00:54:18Marc:We were all part of this crew.

00:54:19Marc:You, me, Sarah, Todd.

00:54:21Guest:Todd.

00:54:22Guest:I remember when Todd moved from Florida.

00:54:24Guest:Right, right.

00:54:25Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:54:26Guest:He was like, hey, man.

00:54:27Guest:Jeff Ross, Jeff Lipschultz.

00:54:29Guest:He was Jeff Lipschultz.

00:54:30Guest:Yeah.

00:54:31Guest:Yeah.

00:54:31Guest:And when I started in 86, the Yastu started, it was Jon Stewart, Chris Rock, Colin Quinn, Ray Romano.

00:54:40Guest:Yeah.

00:54:40Guest:And those guys all just did great right out of the gate.

00:54:45Marc:Right.

00:54:45Guest:It's like, God, God damn it.

00:54:47Guest:Like Romano just, I think I brought him up.

00:54:49Guest:like one of the first times he ever did stand where at that comedy a place called comedy you grand yeah done it which was a great club and he just you know he basically was the ray is today yeah uh just did great right wow they all yeah everyone seemed to make it yeah that stork guy made a pretty good living stewart did really well was he lebowitz ever he was for a minute right yeah yeah for for not long for a few months

00:55:14Guest:yeah and then there was the downtown scene but like when do you but I stopped doing stand up right when the downtown scene started no but I mean you were at the Boston and you were at the cellar yes Boston and the cellar a lot you mean the alternative on 95 but like that's right did you take was your first writing job with Caroline's yes because Louis hired you um no or John hired you no it was Joe Falzaron well he ran the thing but who was the head writer over there

00:55:43Marc:Wasn't Jon Stewart the head writer once?

00:55:46Guest:It was Jon Stewart the first time.

00:55:47Guest:And then Louis and I were writing for Rich Jenny when he was the host.

00:55:55Guest:Right.

00:55:55Guest:And Louis, like he and Rich Jenny.

00:55:59Guest:No go.

00:56:00Guest:And so Louis would just like not even pitch.

00:56:04Guest:It was kind of hilarious.

00:56:06Guest:He didn't even try.

00:56:07Marc:Really?

00:56:07Marc:To pitch Rich because Rich didn't like him?

00:56:09Guest:No, they just didn't quite get each other.

00:56:13Marc:Oh, so Rich was just going to do his road material to open.

00:56:16Marc:Basically.

00:56:16Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:56:19Guest:And Louis was just running it out, and then he left to work on Conan.

00:56:25Marc:Right.

00:56:25Marc:That was like 93.

00:56:27Marc:93.

00:56:29Marc:So your first job, when you get a writer's job, you're like, I'm done?

00:56:33Marc:No, I did that.

00:56:35Marc:With stand-up?

00:56:36Guest:Oh, no, no, no.

00:56:38Guest:I was doing that just because it was extra money and I was still doing stand up.

00:56:42Marc:Yeah.

00:56:42Guest:And I was doing some warm up like for weird shows like the Maury Povich show.

00:56:47Marc:Oh, really?

00:56:47Marc:Yeah.

00:56:48Marc:You did the warm up.

00:56:48Marc:You really did anything.

00:56:50Marc:Well, yeah, because it was in the morning.

00:56:52Marc:But even the paying your dues thing, that doesn't that's not the warm up is not part of it.

00:56:57Marc:That's not that's a job you do if it doesn't work out.

00:56:59Guest:Yeah, exactly.

00:57:00Guest:Well, as it turns out, but at the time, I was like, this is pretty, it's easy money in the middle of the day.

00:57:07Marc:It's a union gig too, right?

00:57:09Guest:Oh yeah, it was.

00:57:10Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:57:11Guest:But I also did, I was getting married and I was broke and we had no money for a honeymoon.

00:57:16Guest:So I, I took warmup for a kid for where in the world is Carmen San Diego?

00:57:21Guest:I don't even know what that is.

00:57:22Guest:It was a kid's show on PBS and, and it was sixth graders, sixth graders.

00:57:27Guest:And then I did like some off handed joke about a teacher looking like John Gotti.

00:57:34Marc:Yeah.

00:57:34Guest:They fired me the next day.

00:57:35Guest:That was it.

00:57:36Guest:And I was like, what's wrong?

00:57:37Guest:And they said, Mike, you called a man a mafioso.

00:57:42Guest:Yeah.

00:57:42Marc:And that was too controversial.

00:57:43Marc:Too controversial.

00:57:44Marc:Sixth grade warm up for PBS.

00:57:46Marc:Yeah.

00:57:47Marc:Yeah.

00:57:47Marc:So, OK.

00:57:48Marc:So then what leads to you stopping?

00:57:51Guest:Oh, well, I, well, then I was also, I wrote for Laura Keitlinger's show on Comedy Central.

00:57:58Guest:When you were hosting, Jonathan Groff was writing, I think, for your show.

00:58:02Marc:Yeah, I pulled Groff in.

00:58:03Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:58:03Marc:Oh, so, like, I pulled, it's so funny, because I pulled Groff in, because they, like, they weren't going to give me any bits.

00:58:08Marc:I was in the last episode.

00:58:09Marc:the last version of Short Attention Span Theater.

00:58:11Marc:And I started with Groff in Boston.

00:58:14Marc:And I pulled him in.

00:58:16Marc:I gave him his first writing job.

00:58:18Marc:That was his first writing job.

00:58:19Marc:And so you were writing for Stand Up Stand Up?

00:58:21Marc:Yes.

00:58:22Marc:Really?

00:58:23Marc:Yes.

00:58:24Marc:And so we were hanging out there.

00:58:26Marc:At HBO Downtown.

00:58:27Marc:HBO Downtown, yeah.

00:58:28Marc:23rd Street.

00:58:29Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:58:32Guest:Were you the only writer?

00:58:33Guest:Yes.

00:58:34Marc:I think that's what taught you guys how to head write a little bit.

00:58:37Marc:uh it was it was a really good experience because like we would be able to produce we did some bits you know some desk piece type of stuff and it's true and we'd have to produce it yeah yeah you'd have to they're like this is the prop guy this is the costume person nancy geller nina rosenstein

00:58:54Guest:Nina Rosenstein.

00:58:56Guest:She's still there.

00:58:58Guest:Is she?

00:58:58Guest:She's the big shot.

00:59:00Guest:Really?

00:59:00Guest:At HBO.

00:59:01Guest:I have no idea.

00:59:02Guest:No idea.

00:59:04Guest:You know how some comics are like, oh, well, he's running that production company.

00:59:09Guest:And I was like, I don't understand the business side of these things.

00:59:14Guest:Yeah, me new.

00:59:14Guest:I still don't.

00:59:15Marc:I really don't.

00:59:17Marc:I remember meeting with some of those people, being dragged into meetings, pitch meetings, ruining them.

00:59:22Marc:Bridget Potter.

00:59:23Marc:Bridget Potter, I remember her, yes.

00:59:25Marc:Yeah, she brought me into Neumeier, or what was that guy's name?

00:59:29Marc:Oldmeier.

00:59:30Marc:Oldmeier.

00:59:31Marc:Yeah, I pitched to Oldmeier and destroyed the pitch in seconds.

00:59:35Marc:Wow.

00:59:35Marc:In seconds.

00:59:37Marc:Did you know, or were you just like- It was a talk show idea, and they were like, well, what kind of issues do you want to talk about?

00:59:41Marc:I'm like, you know, current stuff, AIDS, abortion.

00:59:45Marc:It was like-

00:59:45Marc:Next.

00:59:46Marc:I'm a fucking idiot.

00:59:47Marc:Yeah.

00:59:47Marc:Wow.

00:59:48Marc:I just watched Olmeyer's face drop.

00:59:50Marc:Did he just shut down?

00:59:51Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:59:51Marc:Done.

00:59:52Marc:Done.

00:59:52Marc:Bridget walked me out.

00:59:53Marc:I'm like, how'd that go?

00:59:54Guest:She's like, should I have left out abortion and just concentrated on AIDS?

00:59:59Guest:You know, there are many sides of AIDS.

01:00:02Guest:Fucking ridiculous.

01:00:03Marc:Give me one more shot.

01:00:04Marc:So, okay, so then when do you quit and why do you quit the stand-up?

01:00:08Guest:Well, it wasn't intentional.

01:00:10Guest:Then I got hired.

01:00:12Guest:Louis left Conan, and he was doing the warm-up there for a couple months.

01:00:18Guest:94, 95?

01:00:19Guest:Yeah, late 94.

01:00:22Guest:And he recommended me to do the warm-up.

01:00:27Guest:And I had submitted there twice.

01:00:30Guest:A package?

01:00:30Guest:They bought an idea of mine when the show started for a remote.

01:00:35Guest:And then I tried out for a monologue.

01:00:38Guest:So you're trying to write.

01:00:40Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:00:41Guest:But I was still doing stand-up at like seven nights a week.

01:00:44Guest:A lot of sets every night.

01:00:48Guest:So I started doing the warm-up there.

01:00:49Guest:And then a few months in, they were like, do you want to submit again?

01:00:53Guest:And I was like, okay.

01:00:56Guest:But I...

01:00:58Guest:I was so nervous I wouldn't get hired as a writer and still have to go there to do the warm-up.

01:01:02Guest:I'd be humiliated.

01:01:04Guest:I would not want to go there every day if I didn't get hired.

01:01:07Guest:It would be embarrassing.

01:01:10Guest:So they took pity on me.

01:01:11Guest:And Jonathan Groff, who you mentioned and I, were both hired and started the same day.

01:01:15Guest:Oh, so he was hired as the head writer?

01:01:18Guest:No, we were both hired as writers, but he was so phenomenal, he became the head writer in nine months.

01:01:23Marc:Why am I not remembering who the original head writer was?

01:01:26Guest:Original head writer is Smigel.

01:01:28Marc:Robert Smigel.

01:01:29Guest:And then Marsh McCall took over when Smigel left in 94.

01:01:35Guest:Marsh McCall.

01:01:36Guest:And he really wanted to move back to California, L.A., and do sitcoms.

01:01:43Guest:I'm having a hard time remembering him.

01:01:45Marc:So he was the guy that left for John to step in.

01:01:49Marc:Exactly.

01:01:50Guest:And then John was the head writer for five years, and he was phenomenal.

01:01:52Marc:And that's when you were just on the staff.

01:01:56Guest:I was on the staff for five years.

01:01:58Marc:And so you and John get hired at the same time.

01:01:59Marc:Who's the other writers at that on 94 show?

01:02:03Guest:Michael Gordon.

01:02:05Guest:I think Dino came back for a little bit.

01:02:07Guest:And Mike Stoynoff.

01:02:09Guest:Kylie, Brian Kylie, who you know.

01:02:10Marc:Who I started with in Boston.

01:02:12Marc:I started open mics with Brian Kylie when I was in college in 1984.

01:02:15Marc:Oh, wow.

01:02:16Marc:Yeah.

01:02:18Marc:And he looked the same.

01:02:19Marc:He hasn't changed at all.

01:02:22Marc:All of her body strength.

01:02:23Marc:He lived in Todd Berry's closet for over a decade.

01:02:26Guest:That is such a Boston comic thing about not wanting to leave Boston.

01:02:31Marc:Right.

01:02:31Marc:So he kept his wife and his family in his house in Boston.

01:02:34Marc:And he like had a back room in Todd Berry's small ass apartment.

01:02:38Marc:Because he worked on the Conan show five days a week.

01:02:41Guest:And he, yes, he had like Conan would do an imitation of him like quietly reading a book.

01:02:47Guest:Yeah.

01:02:47Guest:On Todd Berry's toilet in the back room trying not to wake Todd up.

01:02:53Marc:And you'd never see Kylie.

01:02:55Marc:I never saw him at Todd's.

01:02:56Marc:I'd go over to Todd's sometimes.

01:02:58Marc:I'm like, is Brian still up here?

01:02:59Marc:Oh, my God.

01:02:59Marc:That's hilarious.

01:03:00Guest:It was just the weirdest thing.

01:03:01Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:03:01Guest:He's up and he's in the back.

01:03:02Marc:Yeah.

01:03:03Marc:And Brian Rich.

01:03:04Guest:Brian Rich.

01:03:05Guest:It was a really funny, funny, funny writer.

01:03:07Marc:So you're just writing.

01:03:09Marc:You're writing what?

01:03:11Marc:Sketches, monologues, produced pieces?

01:03:12Guest:And producing them.

01:03:13Guest:And you know what?

01:03:14Guest:I loved it.

01:03:15Guest:I really loved writing stuff and shooting it and editing it.

01:03:19Guest:But it would, and because it was a daily show, we were there to like midnight every night.

01:03:24Guest:So I was like, I can't do, like after two weeks, I was like, I can't do stand-up anymore.

01:03:29Guest:And it, that worked, and then when I became the head writer, we were there, I mean, I was there until midnight every night.

01:03:37Marc:But also, I guess on the other side of it is that you're married.

01:03:42Marc:Right.

01:03:42Marc:When did you start having the kids?

01:03:45Guest:When I started looking for writing jobs.

01:03:48Guest:I mean, you know, I was like, I'm making... Before I was married, I was making a good living as a comedian.

01:03:53Guest:Yeah.

01:03:54Guest:But it was like, I need more money.

01:03:55Guest:And that's when I started looking for writing and the warm-up gigs.

01:04:00Guest:So the kids came along in 94 and 97.

01:04:03Guest:Yeah.

01:04:03Guest:Oh, so then it was, that means business.

01:04:07Guest:You got family to support.

01:04:08Guest:Right, and then the Conan job was so, it just, the time has just flown by.

01:04:16Marc:But you had a good time at the beginning?

01:04:18Marc:Oh yeah, it was fantastic.

01:04:19Marc:And you get full health coverage, your family's taken care of, Writers Guild.

01:04:23Guest:I buried the lead.

01:04:24Guest:Incredible health benefits.

01:04:28Guest:You know, you can't beat it, Mark.

01:04:30Guest:Yeah, no, all that stuff.

01:04:31Guest:WGA is good.

01:04:31Guest:You know what?

01:04:32Guest:It was, I'm making light of it.

01:04:34Guest:And that was, because I haven't thought about this in so long.

01:04:38Guest:It was like, prior to that, I kept a book of every penny I made.

01:04:43Guest:And I had to make my weekly nut, you know.

01:04:45Guest:And all of a sudden, yeah, I was getting this paycheck.

01:04:49Guest:And you're right, it was...

01:04:51Guest:It's crazy.

01:04:52Guest:It was transformative.

01:04:53Guest:Of course.

01:04:53Guest:It's like, oh my God.

01:04:54Guest:And then you get doctors for everybody, kids.

01:04:57Guest:Kids, whatever you want.

01:04:58Marc:Yeah, go see a doctor.

01:04:59Marc:I hope you get acne just so I can send you to a doctor.

01:05:02Guest:Yeah.

01:05:02Marc:That's how great the benefits are.

01:05:04Marc:It's true.

01:05:05Marc:Yeah.

01:05:05Marc:Is your wife, what does she do for anything?

01:05:08Guest:My wife, we moved to L.A.

01:05:12Guest:with The Tonight Show.

01:05:13Marc:Right.

01:05:13Guest:But did your wife, did she work in New York?

01:05:16Guest:Well, she was working in corporate communications.

01:05:19Guest:But when we met, we both had quit.

01:05:21Guest:I quit being a lawyer.

01:05:22Guest:She quit her day job to write fiction.

01:05:27Guest:Hmm.

01:05:27Guest:And I thought she was really talented.

01:05:30Guest:And I'd go, come on, come on.

01:05:31Guest:And she was lazier than me.

01:05:33Guest:She wasn't lazy.

01:05:34Guest:She was scared.

01:05:35Guest:And she put it off.

01:05:36Guest:And she was working as a telephone operator at the Waldorf.

01:05:39Guest:But she gave up.

01:05:41Guest:And then we got married.

01:05:41Guest:She never really tried writing.

01:05:44Guest:Got married, had kids, moved to LA.

01:05:46Guest:And I think being dislodged from New York City and Brooklyn,

01:05:50Guest:And that, you know, New York is so right.

01:05:53Guest:There's so many writers.

01:05:54Guest:Sure.

01:05:54Guest:I think when she came out here, she felt freed up.

01:05:57Guest:Yeah.

01:05:58Guest:She went and got her MFA when she was 50.

01:06:00Guest:Oh, wow.

01:06:00Guest:And her last short story, her teacher, Brett Johnson, who is a great teacher.

01:06:06Guest:Yeah.

01:06:06Guest:Because I think it's the start of a novel.

01:06:08Guest:She wrote a novel.

01:06:09Guest:Yeah.

01:06:11Guest:And it's an international bestseller.

01:06:13Guest:Really?

01:06:14Guest:Yeah, it's translated in 26 languages.

01:06:16Guest:What's it called?

01:06:16Guest:It's called The Nest.

01:06:18Guest:Wow.

01:06:18Guest:Like they sold the movie rights before it came out.

01:06:21Guest:I mean, it was... That's her first novel?

01:06:23Guest:Her first novel.

01:06:24Guest:That's great.

01:06:25Guest:Yes.

01:06:26Guest:And she went on a book tour.

01:06:27Guest:She went on it.

01:06:27Guest:And I went with her to Berlin.

01:06:30Guest:Wow.

01:06:30Guest:Like they had an actor, a German actor read her book out loud in German.

01:06:35Guest:Like it's it was a crazy best.

01:06:38Guest:It was a giant bestseller.

01:06:39Guest:She write another one.

01:06:40Guest:She's working on one now.

01:06:42Marc:That's a great story.

01:06:43Marc:Yeah, it's great.

01:06:45Marc:I'm glad something good came out of The Tonight Show experience.

01:06:48Marc:Exactly, exactly.

01:06:51Marc:The Tonight Show, yeah.

01:06:53Marc:Well, so, okay, well, let's talk about that, because you're there through all of this.

01:06:57Marc:In your relationship with Conan, you get along good with him, obviously.

01:07:01Guest:Yeah, we're like an old- You understand him.

01:07:03Guest:We're an old gay couple, I'd say.

01:07:05Marc:And so- I mean that in the best way possible.

01:07:08Marc:No, I understand it.

01:07:09Marc:I took it as a good thing.

01:07:11Marc:Sexual everything.

01:07:11Marc:Well, that's good.

01:07:13Marc:Mix it up, you know what I mean?

01:07:15Marc:Never a dull moment.

01:07:16Marc:Good for you, living life to its fullest.

01:07:19Marc:But, you know, when that whole thing happened where it's sort of this weird contractual obligation that all of a sudden, like, Jay's doing fine, but he's leaving because it's in Conan's contract that he gets the Tonight Show now, and that was a Gavin Pallone exclusive.

01:07:37Guest:You know what?

01:07:38Guest:I don't know who came up with that, but I agree with you.

01:07:41Guest:I can't think of anything more antithetical non-show business than to announce, you know, in five years, well, you know, so-and-so will be taking the mantle.

01:07:51Guest:Like, do these show businesses surprise?

01:07:55Guest:Like, if you made a good movie— Yeah, but what kind of deal is that?

01:07:58Guest:And the fact that they abided by it.

01:08:01Guest:Well, but then—

01:08:03Guest:I remember I remember getting called in to after a show one night in New York and I was like, Jay's going to he's not leaving.

01:08:11Guest:He's doing a show from 10 to 11 every night.

01:08:14Guest:We all knew that was not good.

01:08:17Guest:You know, it was just he was going to be your lead in.

01:08:19Guest:yeah kind of yeah but it was doing the tonight show at from 10 to 11 and and you know i remember we came out to look they were building a new studio for us and we came out and it was the footprint of it and yeah it's like oh this is too big yeah just because you were talking about before like small rooms well that the old that's better for comedy how much did that old studio 198 people

01:08:43Marc:Right.

01:08:43Marc:Yeah.

01:08:44Marc:Well, yeah, it was almost like, let's get this guy Conan into an environment and a situation that is so far out of his wheelhouse.

01:08:52Marc:Right.

01:08:53Marc:Yeah.

01:08:53Marc:You turned over the reins to, who was it, Seth?

01:08:56Marc:Who took the show?

01:08:58Guest:No, it was Jimmy Fallon.

01:08:59Marc:Oh, right, Fallon.

01:09:00Marc:Yeah.

01:09:01Marc:And then you all come out here.

01:09:02Marc:He moved everybody.

01:09:03Marc:Well, we moved out here to do the Tonight Show.

01:09:06Marc:Right, you and Paula and Frank and all the writers and Kylie.

01:09:11Guest:The whole, almost the entire production.

01:09:13Marc:Everybody.

01:09:13Guest:Yeah.

01:09:14Marc:Moved out for the NBC.

01:09:15Marc:Yep.

01:09:16Marc:And it's just right from the get, right, you know, I have to assume that, like, by week two, you're like, oh, no.

01:09:22Guest:No, we didn't think that after week two.

01:09:28Guest:I mean, there were, I think, nervous jitters about starting a new thing.

01:09:33Marc:Yeah.

01:09:33Guest:But I just.

01:09:35Marc:Everyone was gangbusting.

01:09:36Marc:Like, we're doing it.

01:09:37Marc:Yeah.

01:09:38Marc:Tonight show now.

01:09:39Guest:Yeah.

01:09:39Guest:But there was second guessing.

01:09:40Marc:Sure.

01:09:41Guest:There was second guessing comedy bits and stuff where.

01:09:43Guest:Yeah.

01:09:43Guest:Oh, you know, that's too long.

01:09:46Guest:And, you know, for for 1130.

01:09:48Guest:Right.

01:09:49Marc:Well, yeah, the 1130.

01:09:50Guest:A little overthink that way.

01:09:52Guest:But but I always felt like, well, we'll just this will all kind of straighten out.

01:09:57Marc:Yeah.

01:09:58Marc:Actually.

01:09:58Guest:Right.

01:09:58Guest:Given the given time.

01:10:00Marc:Yeah.

01:10:00Guest:But then there was no time.

01:10:03Marc:And was it like what was it like in the bunker?

01:10:05Guest:It was just in January, this call came about they wanted Jay to take over, or Jay do the half hour, second half hour, and Conan does a half hour.

01:10:18Guest:And then they wanted to start at midnight for a while, and then Conan's like, oh, that was it.

01:10:23Guest:I'm sorry, I had it totally backwards.

01:10:24Guest:It was Jay first.

01:10:25Marc:From 11 to 12, yeah.

01:10:26Guest:Yeah, for a half an hour, and he was just like, oh.

01:10:28Guest:Which it's just more dividing everything by half.

01:10:34Guest:It just was getting crazier and crazier.

01:10:37Marc:It was just like they wanted Jay just to, we're just going to Jay do the monologue.

01:10:40Marc:Right, right, right.

01:10:41Marc:And you finish the show.

01:10:42Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:10:43Guest:It was all.

01:10:44Guest:Well, just trick the people.

01:10:45Guest:It was all.

01:10:47Guest:It was just ratcheting up in terms of.

01:10:49Guest:Crazy plans by NBC.

01:10:52Marc:Right, but was there chaos and sadness and anger?

01:10:55Guest:People were really upset and angry.

01:10:57Guest:Part of me, I enjoy chaos.

01:11:00Guest:Really?

01:11:01Guest:Well, you were brought up with it.

01:11:02Guest:Right, right, right.

01:11:02Guest:So I was kind of like, oh, this is interesting.

01:11:06Guest:I was comfortable.

01:11:07Guest:And the last two weeks, we loved going after NBC.

01:11:12Guest:So we had a great time the last two weeks.

01:11:16Guest:That was great.

01:11:17Guest:So we kind of left on a high, actually.

01:11:19Marc:Now, when the show ended, were you guys set up again or no?

01:11:24Marc:No.

01:11:24Marc:No one knew what was going to happen?

01:11:26Marc:Well, it was like- He was going to pay you for the year, right?

01:11:28Guest:Right.

01:11:29Guest:Yeah.

01:11:29Guest:Oh, that's the other reason I wasn't that upset.

01:11:32Guest:Yeah.

01:11:33Guest:And no, it was just, he was like, oh, let's go-

01:11:36Guest:Let's go on tour.

01:11:37Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:11:38Guest:I forget who... Just a week or two.

01:11:41Guest:Rally the troops.

01:11:42Guest:Exactly.

01:11:43Marc:Yeah.

01:11:43Guest:So we put together a show, and during that, TBS.

01:11:47Guest:He got hired by TBS.

01:11:49Marc:And brought everybody back.

01:11:50Marc:And we all... Yeah, we were back on...

01:11:52Marc:Great studio over there.

01:11:53Marc:But now that sort of arced into this half hour thing and now a podcast.

01:11:57Marc:But so you've stuck through all this and now like, you know, because the TBS show seemed fun and they were really, it was a great situation over there and it felt great and the set was great and everybody was good.

01:12:08Marc:But, you know, now it's evolved into this half hour sort of thing.

01:12:12Marc:But it's like getting support.

01:12:13Marc:You know, he's got a podcast.

01:12:15Marc:Now you're doing a podcast as well.

01:12:17Guest:Yeah, it's totally parasitic.

01:12:20Guest:It's about the Conan show.

01:12:21Marc:But it's within the family.

01:12:23Marc:Like, I mean, that's what there's a network.

01:12:25Marc:It's emasculating on my part.

01:12:26Marc:The Conan's great.

01:12:27Marc:No, I'm kidding.

01:12:29Marc:But no, but I mean, you know, it's sort of like it's a diversity of media.

01:12:33Guest:It is a bit of a bit of any.

01:12:34Guest:Yeah, he did a stand up tour last year and I went on that.

01:12:38Marc:You did.

01:12:38Marc:And what do you do on those?

01:12:39Marc:You just sort of punch shit up and write shit.

01:12:41Guest:No, it was all his own.

01:12:44Guest:It was kind of fun because he'd never done actual going out on tours of stand-up.

01:12:50Guest:I missed this.

01:12:50Guest:It wasn't a musical thing?

01:12:52Guest:No, no.

01:12:53Guest:It was just straight 25 minutes and then there were other comics.

01:12:57Guest:Oh, really?

01:12:58Guest:Oh, I see.

01:12:58Guest:So he had a few comics.

01:13:00Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:13:01Guest:But he'd go on first.

01:13:02Guest:Yeah.

01:13:03Guest:He just worked up stuff.

01:13:06Guest:Did he do a good job?

01:13:07Guest:He did a great job.

01:13:08Guest:Yeah.

01:13:08Guest:Yeah, he did a great job.

01:13:09Guest:But, oh, going back to the half hour thing.

01:13:12Guest:Like, I head wrote until 2015.

01:13:18Guest:How many years total?

01:13:19Guest:15 years.

01:13:20Marc:You're the head writer.

01:13:21Guest:Which is insane.

01:13:21Guest:That was crazy.

01:13:24Guest:Yeah.

01:13:24Guest:Because it's the stress.

01:13:26Guest:So you're not the head writer anymore?

01:13:27Guest:Now he's doing travel shows.

01:13:29Guest:So I'm kind of running those, which is a total.

01:13:31Marc:Finland.

01:13:32Marc:Exactly.

01:13:34Marc:Into Cuba or whatever?

01:13:35Guest:Right, Cuba.

01:13:36Guest:We've been to like 13 places.

01:13:37Guest:Like we went to Greenland the week after Trump said he's going to buy Greenland.

01:13:41Marc:Right, I remember.

01:13:42Marc:So that's a thing you schedule in?

01:13:44Marc:Yeah, three a year.

01:13:46Guest:Three a year.

01:13:48Guest:Yeah, and then I work on other stuff going on at the show.

01:13:52Guest:Really?

01:13:52Guest:But I, yeah.

01:13:54Guest:I mean, I kind of stepped down because my wife's book was coming out, and I thought I wanted to like, she was going on tour and everything, and I wanted to hang out with her.

01:14:02Guest:And also just work a little less, you know.

01:14:06Guest:Sure.

01:14:07Marc:So kind of ease up a little bit.

01:14:11Guest:A little bit, yeah.

01:14:12Guest:I don't have the date.

01:14:12Marc:Have some more time.

01:14:13Guest:I don't have the date.

01:14:14Guest:That's why I'm here.

01:14:14Guest:Yeah.

01:14:15Guest:You have nothing to do.

01:14:16Guest:Yeah, and they won't notice I'm missing until like Tuesday.

01:14:19Guest:That's what I'll show up.

01:14:21Guest:No, we actually just finished editing Conan in Ghana.

01:14:23Marc:Oh, really?

01:14:24Guest:Yeah, we went to Ghana in June.

01:14:25Guest:How was that?

01:14:26Guest:It was great.

01:14:26Marc:Is he just doing this because he wants to see the world?

01:14:28Guest:Yes, it's a total food dog.

01:14:31Guest:All of these things like, oh, where do you know?

01:14:33Guest:And I just like look up luxury brochures.

01:14:37Guest:No, but Ghana invited us.

01:14:39Guest:uh, and, um, it's a PR thing.

01:14:43Marc:You know, come to Ghana.

01:14:44Guest:It was this year because Ghana's, it's the year of return, which is the 400th anniversary of the slave trade.

01:14:50Guest:Oh, wow.

01:14:50Guest:And they invited Conan to help commemorate it.

01:14:54Guest:Wow.

01:14:55Guest:Listen, I, why they invited Conan to, I don't know, but, but it ended up being great because we brought Sam Richardson with us from Veep.

01:15:03Guest:Uh-huh.

01:15:03Guest:Uh, because his mother's gone, Nan.

01:15:06Guest:Oh, okay.

01:15:06Guest:And, uh, he's great and very funny.

01:15:08Guest:And, uh,

01:15:08Guest:You know, we just come up with all these segments and we have a local fixer, but then we also have this serious segment about slavery.

01:15:17Guest:So that's the weird difference in these travel shows is many of them have serious segments in them.

01:15:24Marc:And you're happy still?

01:15:27Marc:Yeah.

01:15:28Guest:And Conan's okay?

01:15:29Guest:He's great.

01:15:30Marc:Okay.

01:15:30Guest:He's, you know, he's, it's- How old's he now?

01:15:33Guest:And all the, like, it's a great writing staff and we laugh all day in Conan.

01:15:38Guest:Kylie and- Kylie, Kilmartin, Laurie Kilmartin is- Great.

01:15:42Guest:And a lot of our writers are great comedians.

01:15:44Guest:She's great, yeah.

01:15:45Guest:Brian Kiley.

01:15:46Guest:Kylie, yeah.

01:15:46Guest:Andre Dubichet, I don't know if you know him.

01:15:47Guest:Yeah, I haven't seen him in a while, but yeah.

01:15:49Guest:Todd Levin, Dan Cronin.

01:15:50Guest:Yeah, Dan, I haven't seen him do stand-up in a while.

01:15:53Guest:Levi McDougal, Jose Arroyo, and our new headwriters, Matt O'Brien.

01:15:57Guest:No relationship to Conan.

01:15:59Guest:Huh.

01:15:59Guest:Yeah.

01:16:00Marc:And you just kind of stepped aside.

01:16:03Marc:Yeah.

01:16:04Marc:I did.

01:16:04Marc:Yeah.

01:16:05Marc:Yeah.

01:16:05Marc:But you have no desire.

01:16:06Marc:Like, you're not going to go into some other writing world.

01:16:10Marc:You're just going to take it easy.

01:16:11Guest:No, I'm incredibly lazy.

01:16:12Guest:I've always been lazy.

01:16:13Guest:And this is perfect.

01:16:15Guest:I mean, I'm working on these travel shows.

01:16:17Marc:And, you know.

01:16:18Marc:And your wife's a big writer now.

01:16:19Marc:Yeah.

01:16:20Marc:And your kids are vinyl collectors.

01:16:21Marc:They're vinyl collectors.

01:16:22Guest:Are they...

01:16:23Guest:Are they working?

01:16:24Guest:One works.

01:16:25Guest:He lives in Bushwick.

01:16:27Guest:Oh, he's back east.

01:16:28Guest:And he's PA-ing on a lot of shows.

01:16:30Guest:Yeah.

01:16:31Guest:And he's doing great.

01:16:33Guest:Oh, good.

01:16:33Guest:Yeah, he's in demand.

01:16:34Guest:He's always working.

01:16:36Guest:He's in demand as a PA?

01:16:38Guest:He is.

01:16:38Marc:Well, that's good.

01:16:39Marc:Freelance.

01:16:40Guest:Oh, okay.

01:16:41Guest:And then our other son's here in L.A., and he's in a rock band.

01:16:45Guest:A good rock band?

01:16:46Guest:I love them.

01:16:47Guest:They're called...

01:16:49Guest:Rodeo clown, our clown, but they have a whole backstory.

01:16:52Guest:They were three guys on a field trip who were kidnapped by a doctor, an evil doctor who kind of lobotomized them and makes them sing his music.

01:17:03Guest:Interesting.

01:17:04Guest:Do they have a following?

01:17:05Guest:They do have a following, but when they book gigs, they write emails as the doctor.

01:17:12Guest:They're like, well, the boys are kind of busy right now.

01:17:15Guest:Oh, wow.

01:17:16Guest:And they have merch with the doctor's copyright on it.

01:17:19Guest:Oh, what a trip.

01:17:20Guest:So it's a whole little fantasy world.

01:17:22Guest:It's a little fantasy world.

01:17:22Guest:And what's he play?

01:17:24Guest:He's really into synths.

01:17:26Guest:Oh, so he's a keyboard guy?

01:17:27Guest:Keyboard guy.

01:17:28Guest:He plays guitar.

01:17:29Guest:Oh.

01:17:30Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:17:30Marc:Well, that's great.

01:17:31Marc:Yeah.

01:17:32Marc:Mike, it's great talking to you.

01:17:33Guest:Well, it's great talking to you.

01:17:34Marc:You survived.

01:17:36Marc:I did.

01:17:37Marc:I'm still barely hanging on.

01:17:39Marc:Yeah, but I mean, the childhood thing is completely surprising and exciting.

01:17:42Marc:Oh, yeah.

01:17:43Marc:It's one of those things where, you know, you would think the story would be somewhere, you know, sort of fully trauma based.

01:17:51Marc:Right.

01:17:51Marc:You seem to be pretty chipper about the whole thing in retrospect.

01:17:53Marc:Oh, yeah.

01:17:54Guest:Well, she's dead.

01:17:55Yeah.

01:17:55Guest:Fuck yeah, man.

01:17:57Guest:I'm chipper.

01:18:00Marc:Finally, you're released.

01:18:01Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:18:03Marc:You honored her wishes, which I thought was nice of you as an abused son.

01:18:06Marc:Yes, exactly.

01:18:07Marc:Exactly, exactly.

01:18:09Marc:It was good talking to you.

01:18:09Marc:Okay, great.

01:18:15Marc:Right?

01:18:16Marc:What?

01:18:17Marc:How does that guy sound so well adjusted?

01:18:20Marc:Mike Sweeney, the podcast is called Inside Conan, an important Hollywood podcast.

01:18:25Marc:He hosts that with Jesse Gaskell.

01:18:28Marc:I haven't plugged in this fucking Stratocaster in a couple of weeks, and it just really moved me.

01:18:35Marc:It sounded gritty.

01:18:37Marc:Dirty.

01:18:39Marc:Here, I'll play it for you.

01:18:43.

01:19:50Marc:Boomer lives!