Episode 1041 - Juston McKinney
Marc:All right, let's do this.
Marc:How are you?
Marc:What the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fucking ears?
Marc:What the fuck sticks?
Marc:What the fuckadelics?
Marc:What the fucking fucks?
Marc:Oh, that kind of drove that into a ditch, didn't I?
Marc:That didn't work out, did it?
Marc:Huh?
Marc:No, it did not.
Marc:Today on the show, Justin McKinney.
Marc:He's a comic that started a little bit after me in Boston.
Marc:He's got a new comedy special, Justin McKinney, Parentally Challenged.
Marc:It's available on Amazon Prime and iTunes.
Marc:You can go to JustinMcKinney.com.
Marc:But I remember this guy because years ago, he used to be a cop.
Marc:And years ago, he was with my first agent, Showbiz Talk.
Marc:And he, you know, he had a couple of deals and he did some stuff and he was a cop.
Marc:And she had another guy who was a transit cop.
Marc:There was a couple of cops around doing comedy.
Marc:But his story, I didn't know it, but I'd run into him up in New Hampshire when I played up there and we talked for a while.
Marc:And I thought it would be interesting.
Marc:And it is.
Marc:So he's on the show.
Marc:Also wanted to tell you people in San Francisco.
Marc:Sword of Trust, the movie that I've been talking ad nauseam about because I'm in it and I think it's funny.
Marc:Look, I do a lot of things, people, and I think you know me by now.
Marc:There are times where I won't plug myself.
Marc:You know why?
Marc:Because I forget.
Marc:There's a theater there.
Marc:In the Castro, called the Roxy.
Marc:No, it's not in the Castro.
Marc:That's the Castro Theater.
Marc:The Roxy is just, I believe, let's see, let's play this game.
Marc:Does Mark have memories of San Francisco?
Marc:I believe the Roxy is somewhere on 16th and Valencia in the Mission-ish.
Marc:That's what I'm thinking.
Marc:Can I get someone to check that, please?
Marc:I'll wait.
Marc:Oh, I guess I got to check.
Marc:Hold on a second.
Marc:Yep.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Marc:And Valencia.
Marc:Yep.
Marc:Six.
Marc:I did it.
Marc:My memory worked.
Marc:Oh, my God.
Marc:Play the music.
Marc:Play the music.
Marc:Memory's not so great.
Marc:So that's on the 4th and 8th.
Marc:August 4th and 8th at the Roxy Theater.
Marc:There's only two screenings, and it's a nice little theater, and I'm just giving you the heads up to go.
Marc:Getting a lot of good feedback for the movie.
Marc:I'm proud of the movie.
Marc:I think it's funny, and it's not just me that's funny.
Marc:The whole fucking thing is funny.
Marc:And eventually I'll stop talking about it in this little phase of my life where everybody's excited and there's fancy reviews in The New Yorker, in The New York Times, Washington Post, Chicago Trib, Variety, just everybody raving about this thing.
Marc:A month from now, I'll just feel like none of it ever happened.
Marc:But for the time being, I would go see it.
Marc:Glow, the third season of Glow, which I'm on.
Marc:I play a role on that show.
Marc:Glow drops August 9th.
Marc:And you know what else happens August 9th?
Marc:I am 20 years sober.
Marc:Am I gloating?
Marc:Maybe a little.
Marc:Am I humble about it?
Marc:Not really.
Marc:20 fucking years.
Marc:Yeah, I did it.
Marc:But it's not done, day at a time.
Marc:And I do, in all honesty, I do get a lot of email from people who are struggling with this stuff.
Marc:It is possible, and life does get better.
Marc:Look, I'm dealing with the end of the world fine.
Marc:I don't have to drink over it.
Marc:I can eat over it.
Marc:I can jerk off over it.
Marc:I'll jerk off all over the end of the world.
Marc:All over it.
Marc:Yeah, that's how I win.
Marc:But I don't have to drink over it.
Marc:Okay?
Marc:You got to do what you got to do.
Marc:Intentional cognitive dissonance.
Marc:Some people call it belief.
Marc:Yet it's very difficult.
Marc:It's very difficult to know what's going on.
Marc:Hey, it's awfully hot.
Marc:You know, I can barely breathe out here.
Marc:That's all right.
Marc:Things are okay.
Marc:Just go to the gym.
Marc:The intentional cognitive dissonance.
Marc:There's something rich about that area of thought.
Marc:where you're aware of the horror, but yet you still have to have a life.
Marc:So tonight I'm going to be in Raleigh, North Carolina.
Marc:Theoretically, I'm here, but I'm not really because this is like a day or two before.
Marc:It's just the way this is going right now.
Marc:But I can't tell you I'm excited because I'm renting a car in North Carolina and I got a thing for pottery.
Marc:I think some of you know that.
Marc:I just do.
Marc:I don't know what it is.
Marc:Maybe it's an old hippie thing.
Marc:Maybe it's an authenticity thing.
Marc:Maybe it's just the sort of fundamentals of craftsmanship and the individuality of the process and the sort of ancient art of it all.
Marc:But I like nice pottery or just practical pottery.
Marc:I just like pots that are thrown by hand or mashed and made any way.
Marc:I just like ceramics.
Marc:And somebody hit me to...
Marc:This area in North Carolina called Seagrove.
Marc:I know nothing about it, but they were just sort of like, you got to go to Seagrove for pottery.
Marc:I did a little research.
Marc:It seems like a good deal of the handmade pottery coming out of the United States comes out of this area.
Marc:I don't know why I didn't do that kind of research.
Marc:I don't know if it's the clay is good there or what.
Marc:But I'm going to take a trip out there because I've got this dream, folks.
Marc:I've got a pottery dream.
Marc:I've got a pottery vision.
Marc:I've got this large cabinet in my house that has a glass front to it.
Marc:It's an old craftsman built in.
Marc:And I think at one time it might have been used for China or fancy stuff.
Marc:But in my vision, it's filled with all kinds of uniquely individual pieces of hand thrown pottery, cups, large bowls, maybe a stack of plates, maybe a pitcher or two.
Marc:that theoretically I would collect over a lifetime.
Marc:But I don't know if that, I think it's a little late for that because I haven't been collecting pottery for a lifetime, but I'm going to buy a lifetime's worth of pottery in Seagrove, North Carolina.
Marc:That's my plan.
Marc:I don't even know what they have there, but in my dream, I'm going to go from place to place, maybe 97 places, 92, maybe six, 12 places.
Marc:19 and i might go to a 20th but i think i've got enough i played that out but i figure i can get a lifetime's worth of pottery and even make up a big lie about my experience accumulating it over a lifetime from one trip to seagrove so if you're a potter in seagrove let me know and i'll come by and check your shit out
Marc:because i'm going to do that i think i'm probably going to do it tomorrow friday i don't know i don't know i've got some i got some touching emails here i got one uh subject line two of us hey mark i just wanted to reach out to you with a story about my dad hopefully you have time to read this i'll try to make it short don't worry this isn't entirely random it involves you too he passed last winter and today would have been his birthday
Marc:A long time ago, in an administration far, far away, I started listening to WTF around episode 400-something.
Marc:I enjoy the way you often approach interviews as a fan and try to figure out where the fuck people come from.
Marc:Around this time, my father was getting older, and as a complication of diabetes, his vision started disappearing due to cataracts.
Marc:Since the healthcare in this country was and still is pretty what-the-fuck, it took over a year to get him in for the most routine surgery in America so he could see again.
Marc:During that time, he was getting pretty bummed out, not being able to drive, work, or anything, so I recommended this cool podcast I was listening to.
Marc:He didn't know what a podcast was, but he did recognize your name.
Marc:He'd always liked you as a comic.
Marc:I got him set up, and he had enough peripheral vision to navigate the app and go on neighborhood walks.
Marc:He really bit in, Mark.
Marc:Within a week, he had subscribed and was chewing through the back catalog, telling me stories from episodes I had missed,
Marc:and spending the day walking around with you in his head.
Marc:His mood was massively improved by getting to engage with you and your guests.
Marc:It was a perfect thing for him in that moment, and I got to share something I was really excited about and experience it together with him.
Marc:Through the years, we geeked out about big celebrities like Obama and Julia Louis-Dreyfus, and we would replay some of it.
Marc:And he would replay some of the showcase songs on repeat.
Marc:When I went through his phone one last time this winter, I saw he had also still been listening.
Marc:He got to hear your interview with Sir Paul, who was one of his favorite people in the universe.
Marc:Anyway, I miss my dad, but I thought it might brighten the world a little bit to remember a time when we all made each other happy.
Marc:Thanks, Mark.
Marc:Justin.
Marc:Thank you, Justin.
Marc:Thank you for sharing that.
Marc:Because it's important.
Marc:These are important things.
Marc:You know?
Marc:Try to... And this is coming from me.
Marc:And those of you who have been listening a long time.
Marc:If you're old and your parents are still alive and they're really old and you're holding on to something...
Marc:If it's not that bad, you know, get over it and try to, you know, appreciate the time they have left.
Marc:That's all.
Marc:This one's funny, a little dark, but I think I think Donald would appreciate it.
Marc:Subject line, I didn't think you would ever come around.
Marc:God, it makes me so mad what Donald is right about this sort of shit.
Marc:Still, glad you did come around.
Marc:If I was still alive, I'd love to be on the show.
Marc:Cheers, the ghost of Walter Becker.
Marc:Is that wrong?
Marc:Come on.
Marc:I think it's pretty funny.
Marc:Okay, look.
Marc:Let's get on with it.
Marc:I'll be in Raleigh tonight.
Marc:Go to WTFPod.com slash tour.
Marc:There's a lot of dates coming up.
Marc:Austin, Houston, Dallas, Detroit, San Francisco, D.C., Atlanta, Minneapolis, Chicago, Nashville, Philadelphia.
Marc:A lot of stuff coming up.
Marc:And I didn't even mention some.
Marc:Look.
Marc:Look.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So Justin McKinney, as I said before, I knew him as a comic.
Marc:He started a little bit after me, the generation after me in Boston.
Marc:He was a cop.
Marc:And it's, you know, it's it's a unique story.
Marc:And and, you know, I ran into him in New Hampshire.
Marc:I did a gig there a couple of years ago and we.
Marc:decided we would do this, and he was here, and we did it.
Marc:He's got a new comedy special called Justin McKinney Parentally Challenged.
Marc:You can get it on Amazon Prime, iTunes.
Marc:You can go to his website at justinmckinney.com.
Marc:And this is me talking to New Hampshire's own Justin McKinney.
Marc:So, Justin, I noticed that you spell your name peculiarly.
Marc:What is that name, Justin, with an O?
Marc:I just noticed that today when I went to Google search it.
Marc:You just noticed that.
Marc:I put in Justin like a regular spelling.
Marc:Normal, yeah.
Marc:And then it comes out, Justone.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's been a curse, and I've talked about it on stage because it's such a curse, especially now with social media.
Marc:Well, I'm Mark with a C. I know, I know.
Guest:But at least if you say, and part of what I talk about is if you say Mark with a C, you know where the C goes, right?
Guest:It goes at the end of your name.
Guest:Sure, you go Justin with an O. They don't know where it is, so people go J-O-S-T-I-N.
Guest:Like, no one knows where the O is supposed to go.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So I really have to say Justin, J-U-S-T-O-N.
Guest:I have to spell the whole name out.
Marc:What is the history of the Justin with an O?
Marc:Where does that come from?
Guest:All honesty, I asked my dad about, I don't know, 20 years ago, 25 years ago, because it's a huge pain in my ass.
Guest:And he told me, this is a true story, he goes, because you were born just on time.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:I swear to God, that's what he tells me.
Guest:My dad is like trying to be the funny guy.
Guest:And I literally, so on stage, I'll talk about it.
Guest:I'll go, it could have been just in time.
Guest:It's the same dumb joke.
Guest:Like he got the joke wrong.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he did that to me.
Guest:And it's been a nightmare.
Guest:I'm not even lying.
Guest:Like if I say to people, oh, follow me on Instagram.
Guest:If I don't tell you how to spell my name and you search Justin with an I, like on Instagram, the Instagram search will not find me.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So it's not like someone's going to be like, you know what?
Guest:I really got to find that guy.
Guest:Let me try again.
Guest:People aren't going to try twice.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So it's become a little bit.
Guest:I really believe social media.
Guest:I would have 50% more followers if my name was spelled with an I. And we couldn't have foreseen these problems.
Guest:No, he couldn't have.
Guest:He couldn't have.
Guest:And you know what the worst part is?
Marc:It's not like they didn't give you enough obstacles to deal with.
Marc:Now the name bites you in the ass.
Guest:My dad texts me, but he'll spell it with an I. It drives me nuts.
Marc:Because of the spell check.
Guest:I don't know if it's because of the spell check.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Of course.
Guest:All right.
Guest:What do you think he's doing?
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:It just annoys me.
Marc:No, of course it's a spell check.
Marc:It's hard on texting when you want to correct spell check.
Marc:It's a pain in the ass.
Marc:Who uses the word ducking that much?
Marc:Right.
Marc:When you put fucking in-
Marc:It's always going to correct deducting, but it's like that.
Marc:Just put fucking... I think you can program your phone to use the words that you want, can't you?
Guest:To learn it.
Guest:I think so, but I don't know how to do that either.
Marc:So I'm trying to figure out when... You're not my generation of Boston.
Marc:You're like the one after me, right?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I started with Bill Burr and Patrice O'Neill, Gary Goleman.
Guest:Those guys were all kind of down there, mid-90s.
Marc:Okay, yeah, because I was there in 88.
Marc:I started working.
Marc:I came in second in the riot in 88.
Marc:And you started working 90 what?
Guest:It was like the mid 90s.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah, 90s.
Guest:I mean, the first time I ever went on stage was- I forget how old I am.
Guest:I'm just old.
Marc:I'm like an old guy now.
Marc:The weird thing about Boston, and I think it's a little different than when I started there, is that there is a, like, I don't know, it's not the word indigenous, but there is a regional comedy network business where guys who, they never leave there.
Marc:And it's always been that way.
Marc:Now, I'm not putting you in that category or saying that you chose to be that category, but it is a real thing that there was.
Marc:I think it's really the only place like that where where you could go when I started and you could make a living doing comedy at one nighters.
Marc:For life, it used to be.
Marc:So there were guys like, you know, that's how I started.
Marc:But I think it's the only part of the country where that really is the case.
Marc:You can live in Boston.
Marc:And at the time, there was like, God knows, maybe 100, 150 one-nighters where you could go out and work as a comic.
Guest:Yeah, I think it's really hard to make a living now just doing the Boston scene.
Guest:A lot of guys have second jobs.
Guest:Really?
Guest:A lot of the headlines that are headlining the one-nighters and stuff, a lot of them have second jobs.
Guest:I've been lucky to do, I do theaters up in the Portsmouth Music Hall where I saw you at night in Portsmouth last.
Guest:That's one that I do.
Guest:So I try to do some of those which make it work for me up there.
Guest:where I don't need another job, but it's tough to do.
Guest:It's not like it used to be.
Guest:We joke that the middle money back in the day was more than headliner money now.
Marc:But there wasn't even middles when I was coming up in Boston.
Marc:It was a two-man show.
Marc:You'd go out with a guy that you'd have to drive usually, or meet there, do a half hour, they'd do 45, and you're out.
Marc:George McDonald will juggle angrily, and you're gone.
Marc:George McDonald.
Guest:Oh, my gosh.
Marc:I used to love when he'd take out those balls, because you knew he didn't want to take out those balls.
Guest:I didn't even know he did the balls.
Marc:He does.
Marc:He used to.
Marc:When he had to do 45, he'd do about 35 of material, and then he'd take that little bag out with the balls.
Marc:And it wasn't even that spectacular juggling.
Marc:But it was just sort of like, I got to close with the, here come the balls.
Yeah.
Guest:i've got a george mcdonald story oh really um nice guy one of the greatest guys a great guy i was when i had just started my dad and i and i didn't know we might have got into all this but my dad was a homeless alcoholic for yeah we're gonna get into that yeah he was you know was the town you know i'd drunk right he was that he was the drunk guy what town uh portsmouth new hampshire all right living on the streets so you've been there so you're still there you stayed there
Guest:I was, well, yeah.
Guest:So one night I'm just starting to do standup.
Guest:I'd only been in two or three years and there was a show in Portsmouth at this place.
Guest:I was in the middle spot and George was headlined.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No balls?
Guest:I don't remember balls.
Guest:I don't, but maybe this is why I didn't remember balls.
Guest:So I do my 20 minutes, whatever I did.
Guest:And I knew everybody in the room.
Guest:I knew everybody came, you know, cause I'm from there.
Guest:And the show went okay.
Guest:I get off stage.
Guest:While George is on, my dad, who weighs 140 pounds, long gray hair, gray beard, really skinny, walks up on stage and tries to grab the mic out of George McDonald's hands.
Guest:Shit-faced.
Guest:Shit-faced.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Goes to grab the mic.
Guest:The bouncers come up and grab my dad and drag him off.
Guest:And George McDonald just looks right over and just says, looks like Santa went on a binge this year.
Guest:huge laugh bigger than any laugh i got yeah and i lit and that was but that was me starting stand-up did you tell them it was your dad they all knew it was my dad oh because because they knew me they knew it was my dad like that was but when you say george mcdonald it's like that's your memory i immediately that's immediately what i think of and that line he came up with was great and i yeah you know i had to laugh but i used to get annoyed you know that you know with my dad that would annoy me i'd always worry about that happening since i was a kid that embarrassment
Marc:highly annoying it's george mcdalen used to host the open mic when i was in college at stitches it was called comedy hell and he was the guy that a lot of us first started doing open mics with because he hosted one and it was just it was just a nightmare of a show he was great and always nice and supportive but rand it was small audiences and it was he called it comedy hell and he would play it up that was the first place i was on stage stitches
Marc:The original one in the Paradise?
Guest:No, the one near Fenway.
Marc:Ugh, that place was terrible.
Marc:That one near Fenway, that used to be another place before that that was cursed.
Marc:That little block right there across from Father's 2, it used to be a fucking horrible bar no one went into called The Ark.
Marc:And you just walk by it.
Marc:I lived there.
Marc:I was in college here for four years.
Marc:I never set foot in the fucking place.
Marc:Like, who goes in there?
Marc:And then it becomes Stitches.
Marc:Oh, man.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And you had to walk all the way in the back.
Marc:And there was that back room.
Marc:It seemed like it would be nice.
Marc:But I'm telling you, there was something about that location.
Marc:So Portsmouth.
Marc:I feel like there was a gig up there when I was coming up that maybe Robin Horton booked.
Marc:What was the gig in Portsmouth?
Marc:I know there was a gig there.
Guest:I think you're thinking of, man, I just had it in my head, the one in Portsmouth.
Guest:Oh, the speakeasy.
Marc:Yeah, that's it.
Guest:It was a roller skating rink.
Marc:That's it.
Marc:They used to have a one-nighter there?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I actually saw Joe Rogan there was opening for Vinny Favorito.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:Way back in the day.
Marc:That's it.
Marc:That was it.
Guest:The speakeasy.
Guest:The speakeasy.
Guest:Was it called that?
Guest:I don't remember.
Guest:It was a roller skating rink.
Guest:Yeah, but that is such- And then they did comedy, I think, on the off nights, maybe.
Marc:In the bar.
Marc:area yeah yeah yeah i mean those were the gigs they like you're saying that like it shouldn't even shock me and it doesn't oh yeah it was a roller skating rink that's the point that's it and the weird thing is i don't remember it being a roller skating rink but i remember there was a gig up there it's fucked up but that was how we did it back then so you start in boss so now okay let's get into the
Marc:Because I don't know Portsmouth.
Marc:Is it Portsmouth?
Guest:Portsmouth.
Marc:Portsmouth.
Marc:Yep.
Marc:It's spelled Portsmouth, though, isn't it?
Guest:Yes, it is.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So I know New Hampshire, and I know it from driving up there, and it's pretty.
Marc:But I remember, I'm pretty sure, there were a couple of cops.
Marc:You and Joe DiResta, right?
Marc:John.
Marc:John DiResta.
Guest:John DiResta, yes.
Marc:Was a Boston cop.
Guest:He was a NYPD transit cop.
Marc:Oh, he was a New York transit cop.
Guest:Yes.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And he got a deal with my old agent, Ruthann Secunda.
Guest:Who was my old agent.
Marc:She was the one.
Marc:She was the one that would get you the first deal and then that was it.
Guest:She changed my life and ruined my life at the same time.
Marc:So you were a cop.
Marc:So you're growing up in Portsmouth.
Marc:What's the situation?
Marc:How many siblings do you have?
Guest:Three brothers.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Older?
Guest:One younger, two older.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And my dad.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And my mom passed away when I was six.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And when I was living in Portsmouth, I was going to elementary school there.
Marc:So wait, now your brothers are older?
Guest:Two older, one younger.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So there's four of you and your mom passed away?
Guest:Mom passed away.
Marc:What happened?
Guest:Brain aneurysm.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Just out of nowhere.
Marc:Do you remember?
Guest:Yeah, because I was with her.
Guest:She was volunteering at a school fair.
Guest:It was when they have the balloons, the tables, all the games.
Guest:Oh, my God, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, and she just collapsed and started holding her head and was screaming, and yeah, I was right there.
Guest:Yeah, they put her in the ambulance.
Guest:Two months ago, I went back to that elementary school.
Guest:I hadn't been back.
Guest:Well, I hadn't been back since I left.
Guest:I was there through fifth grade, but I hadn't been back since I've been an adult.
Guest:The weirdest thing is I go to see my mom's grave, and from the grave site, the school's right there.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:The school's right there.
Guest:I just pulled into the school and I just walked, hasn't changed.
Guest:I just looked in the window like, and like, that's the spot, you know?
Guest:And I haven't since I've, my whole life is the first time I've gone back.
Marc:And it's right.
Marc:It's in town though.
Guest:It's right in town.
Guest:It's, it's just off town a little bit, but it's just the, you know, the lobby area.
Guest:I just, it was, the doors were locked.
Guest:I just went in and I kind of looked in and like, that was the area the tables were.
Guest:That's where she fell.
Guest:And I don't know what drew me to that.
Guest:I went to see her grave and I just saw the school and I'm like, oh, let me take a ride over.
Guest:So yeah.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:That's, that's so, it's sad.
Yeah.
Guest:yeah yeah it was it was you know and uh my dad you know was left with you know the four kids you know i mean what did he do that generally he had a uh telephone answering service yeah at the time which was you know before pagers and cell phones you know the old switchboard kind sure sure so like if a doc was on call or something yeah yep yep after hours yep he ran that and he was big into he was buying real estate you know he was in portsmouth
Guest:Yeah, he owned a bunch of, at one time, he owned a bunch of properties.
Guest:I mean, if he could have held it together, it would have been worth a lot of money.
Marc:What happened to the properties?
Guest:He just lost them all through not managing it, not paying taxes.
Guest:I mean, he lost the house I lived in.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:So it just went, you know.
Marc:All right, so you guys are doing okay for a while.
Guest:Well, my aunt moves in.
Guest:My mom's sister ends up with my dad.
Guest:They ended up in a relationship.
Yeah.
Guest:from the get-go or just like she stepped in to help the kids stepped in to help and and you know and she definitely kept things together right the glue you know to make sure we have power yeah you know like you know electricity and water and all that stuff um and they ended up in a relationship yeah and how old were you when you knew that was happening um i was probably like eight eight nine years old natural or was it weird or
Guest:It was definitely weird.
Guest:I mean, I was aware that I was living a little bit different than my friends, you know?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:It wasn't the same.
Marc:Did they get married?
Guest:They never got married.
Marc:But it just sort of happened.
Guest:It just happened, and my dad drank, and she drank, and the fighting.
Marc:Drinking was always part of it.
Guest:Drinking was something, and I used to joke that having two alcoholics is like having two dogs.
Guest:They keep each other company.
Guest:Right.
Guest:A lot of times they were fighting, so-
Marc:They're actually given away together when you go pick them up at the shelter.
Marc:Yeah, if you're going to take the man, you got to take his wife.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because they belong together.
Guest:That's right.
Guest:You want two of them.
Guest:Yeah, you got to have two in the house.
Guest:Trust me, you're going to want two of them.
Guest:No good.
Marc:No good because it'll drain the whole family.
Guest:Two, they beat the shit out of each other and it works out.
Guest:Yeah, they distracted.
Guest:You'll thank us.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So, okay, so that's going on right away.
Marc:Your dad was always a boozy.
Guest:I remember it from the time I can remember, yes.
Guest:I believe that losing his wife, she was 29 years old, having the four kids, I mean, I believe that didn't help, right?
Guest:That probably, so he- Was this a Catholic situation?
Marc:No.
Marc:They just kept coming, the kids.
Guest:Yeah, it was just, they did, you know, in, I don't know this, but I had heard that, you know, uh, birth control might've been what caused me, you know, the dose that's one of the side effects is blood.
Guest:And I think back then it was like the dose.
Guest:And I think maybe, I think, I mean, I remember hearing that at one point.
Guest:So I think they wanted, I think four was enough.
Marc:I think it was smoking and birth control pills.
Marc:Like, you know, did she smoke?
Guest:I think she did.
Marc:Yeah, I think she did.
Marc:We could research this, but there's no time.
Guest:No.
Marc:But I mean, that sort of sticks in my head that if he smoked on certain birth control at that time.
Marc:Well, either way, it's sad.
Marc:So your dad, he's broken up about it, and the drinking got worse right away.
Marc:It was always kind of there.
Yeah.
Guest:It was there.
Guest:It's like, you know, I could remember, you know, every night, you know, he'd sit and sip out of a little shot glass in the dark, like kind of by himself.
Guest:One of those guys.
Guest:Listened to the police scanner, very paranoid.
Guest:Really?
Guest:You know, listened to the police scanner.
Guest:For what?
Guest:That they were coming to get him?
Guest:He would get in trouble a lot.
Guest:Yeah, my dad had a history.
Marc:But wasn't he... When did the business start to... When did it all start to fall apart?
Marc:I mean...
Marc:I mean, you were six and things were okay, right?
Guest:Yeah, but I think there was drinking then too, from what I'd heard.
Guest:I think it was still there, but yes, things definitely started to go off the rails after that.
Guest:The business was, I don't know how well the business did.
Guest:After fifth grade, we moved right over the bridge into Kittery, Maine, right after elementary school.
Guest:So I'd just move over there.
Guest:So I would have been sixth or seventh grade.
Guest:He got mad at the bank for not giving him a loan or something.
Guest:So he went down there in the middle of the day and threw a brick through the front window of the bank.
Guest:so it's like that kind of stuff like through my childhood there's always worried that what was he going to do to embarrass me like there was that I lived with a lot like I didn't want my anyone at school or friends to know and true story my friend Alan lived across the street from the bank and he called me up and like saw it happen he goes is your dad home and I'm like he goes I think I just saw him throw a brick through the bank in his underwear and I literally and the joke part of me it goes to yeah he said he had some errands to do you know what I mean you said he had some errands to run but he was but then
Guest:The cops would come to the house.
Guest:They would look for them.
Guest:One time they had to raise the drawbridge because it was over the river so that he wouldn't escape.
Guest:So there was a lot of that growing up.
Marc:So he would sit and drink alone listening to the police scanner to see if they were coming to get him.
Guest:I believe so.
Guest:And he would go up.
Guest:If he thought he heard his name, he would go out in the back up in the woods.
Guest:I remember that happening.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And let me just say he he's been sober for 11 years now.
Guest:I gave him his chip, his 10 year chip.
Guest:I just want to say that now.
Guest:So, yeah, you know, I mean, he's so, you know, anyone's listening, going, you know, I mean, you can say it's possible to recover.
Guest:I mean, he was we thought he was going to die on the streets.
Guest:There's no doubt about it.
Guest:So after I got out of high school, he lost the house and all that and left my aunt.
Guest:I mean, I think he did he ever do jail time?
Guest:Oh, he went to jail a lot.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like just like a lot of overnights, protective custody and that kind of stuff.
Guest:Like, you know, oh, you drinking and driving.
Guest:He was arrested for drunk driving at eight in the morning while on his way to court for drunk driving.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Like that's, I mean, that kind of stuff.
Marc:I just, I was just hiking this morning and I was coming down the mountain.
Marc:This is eight o'clock in the morning and I saw two dudes.
Marc:One of them had a big thing of water.
Marc:The other one had a six pack and they were hiking up the mountain at eight in the morning.
Marc:And I thought like, well, you know, at least they're not driving.
Marc:Right.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Yes.
Guest:If you're going to morning drink, make a day, take a hike.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, my dad's lucky he didn't kill anybody.
Guest:And that was a huge fear as a kid.
Guest:We're talking drinking.
Guest:I mean, he would have a screwdriver in the cup holder, like in drive.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I mean, you know, back then, they were drinking and driving.
Guest:They would actually drink and drive.
Guest:Right.
Guest:They weren't even, not they were just drunk, they're drinking while they're driving.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:So that was just-
Marc:So when you graduate high school, then the relationship with your aunt falls apart and what?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Once all the kids grew up, he lost the house.
Guest:He didn't pay the taxes.
Guest:It was boarded up for a while.
Guest:It was literally a bunch of derelicts or homeless people all living in there.
Guest:With him?
Guest:Like doing drugs and drinking.
Guest:Was he there too?
Guest:He was still there.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:And there was a fire like in one of the bedrooms and they just took, we had this pool that was in the back that hadn't been open for years.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they would scoop water up with buckets and put the fire out themselves.
Guest:Never called the fire department.
Marc:And your dad was still living there.
Guest:He was still there at the time.
Guest:This is when he was going definitely downhill, on his way to homelessness.
Marc:This is when he was... So, but this is a small town, like you said, right?
Marc:So, you know, he's notorious.
Guest:I mean, you know, the guy... They love him and everybody loves him.
Guest:Really?
Guest:All the town all loves him.
Guest:You know, people would bump into me, your dad's the best.
Guest:You know, your dad's... And in the back of my head, there's a little part of me going, yeah, you know, I...
Guest:I love my dad, and my dad is my biggest fan in the world.
Guest:Now?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And I think he always was a fan, but it's a disease.
Guest:And I try to look at what he, the four kids and being left with that, and that kind of triggered it, and then this all goes.
Marc:Did everybody turn out all right?
Marc:I mean, how many-
Guest:Yeah, I think we're doing good, yeah.
Guest:I think we're doing good, yeah.
Guest:And you never got the bug?
Guest:No, and I drink socially.
Marc:Did you go the other way?
Marc:Did you go the control freak path?
Guest:I went the other way in the sense I became a cop.
Guest:You know?
Guest:I mean, he didn't like cops.
Guest:And part of the reason that made me such a good cop was because I treated, in my interview, I got hired at 19, by the way.
Guest:To be a cop.
Guest:The youngest cop I think they'd ever hired up there.
Guest:And I was really mature.
Marc:In the interview, I remember- Well, you gotta be when you're living in chaos.
Marc:You gotta go pick your dad up at the fucking jail.
Guest:I had to, it was, I remember saying to them that, you know, I treat everybody like you're my dad.
Guest:And my whole family, by the way, have all run-ins with cops.
Guest:But anyway, like you're my dad and you don't like cops, I want to change your mind.
Guest:Like that was really how I went about it.
Guest:I never had that big badge, the power, never had that.
Guest:I was always de-escalating.
Guest:Now, mind you, it was in rural Maine.
Guest:There were two of us for 500 square miles.
Guest:So you had no backup.
Guest:so when you have no backup you learn to de-escalate you know you didn't you know but also i'd imagine that yeah most of those calls are domestic issues right yeah a lot of domestic issues and you know my dad would fight with the police like he we saw him get pepper sprayed i mean right in our living room i mean this kind of stuff so when i could remember going to domestics thinking this guy's going to attack me yeah and then very few people attack you it's very rare like i thought that was the norm at least one of them's grateful you showed up right
Marc:Yeah, like, you know, to de-escalate.
Marc:They probably wanted to de-escalate, I would think, a lot of times.
Guest:A lot of times, yeah.
Marc:But what's the impulse?
Marc:I mean, do you remember when you decided to be a cop?
Marc:I do.
Marc:What drove that?
Guest:Well, I definitely, Chips was like my favorite, one of my favorite shows growing up, Chips.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And I had such an ethical mind that I used to not like paunch because he used to flirt.
Guest:And I used to think that was like, ah, you know, he's a cop, you know, I like John was like the professional.
Guest:So I really was like John, right?
Guest:Right.
Guest:And by the way, when I would watch Chips, like I would be watching an episode of Chips and the real cops would show up at my house.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:I'm not even lying to you.
Guest:And they would come in.
Guest:I remember one time the dog was loose.
Guest:And so the neighbors called the police about our dog being loose.
Guest:So I let the cop in.
Guest:And I'll never forget this cop was the nicest.
Guest:He was so nice to me.
Guest:He's talking to me.
Guest:I'm asking him about stuff on his belt.
Guest:I mean, this to me was like, oh, a policeman.
Guest:He was so nice.
Guest:My dad comes barreling down the stairs going, get the fuck.
Guest:fuck out of the house.
Guest:This cop like had to backpedal and like, all right.
Guest:And he shut the door and he's like, get your dog.
Guest:You got to get your dog in.
Guest:And it was, and I just saw that.
Guest:And I, as a little kid, I ended up, I thought to myself, my dad's wrong here.
Guest:Like, I mean, who's, what's going on here?
Guest:Like who's right and who's wrong?
Guest:And I didn't get it.
Guest:So that was my dad's, um, that's what drove me to be the, the, the kind of cop that I was because it was just, I didn't understand it.
Guest:Like I really looked so, so what made me become a cop?
Guest:So I was going to be a private investigator in high school.
Guest:And I, and I asked my, uh,
Guest:a guidance counselor to set up a job shadow with a private investigator.
Guest:And they couldn't find one.
Guest:So they go, but we found this police officer.
Guest:It was a Kittery police officer.
Guest:Officer Toulouse was his name.
Guest:And you want to go shadow with him, do a ride-along.
Guest:And I go, you know what, I'll do it because you set it up, I'll go do it.
Guest:But I did not think that I was really going to become a cop.
Guest:And when I left that night, that guy's crew, watching this guy, he was really professional, great, just out there talking about how, you know, if anything happens, like he's the, you know, he's the one who's going to show up.
Guest:And I looked at him like they save the day, like cops are good.
Guest:I've always looked at it through my eyes that way.
Guest:And when I got out of there, just that whole idea of serving and being out there and helping people and he was going on calls and he's watching them.
Guest:I just watched that and goes, you know what?
Guest:I think I want to do that.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that was kind of, that was it.
Guest:So I went to college and-
Marc:Where are your brothers, where are they in all this?
Marc:Are you all sitting around watching TV?
Marc:I mean, did they get out of the house because they were older or what?
Guest:Yeah, well, the two that were older had kind of left, and the younger one was still there, and things really went downhill.
Guest:So my aunt brought in two of her kids, too.
Guest:So there were really six kids, two cousins, four of them.
Guest:Were they bad seeds or were they all right?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Everyone was kind of all right, but two of my brothers have been, and they're great now, but two of my brothers have been arrested for resistant arrest.
Guest:They fight with the cops.
Guest:They like to fight cops, which I never understood this.
Guest:What do you mean?
Guest:They grew up with it.
Guest:Learned behavior.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:There you go.
Guest:There you go.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But my aunt, I remember one day comes home, and I'm probably in high school.
Guest:She goes, oh, my God, I kicked that cop right in the nuts.
Guest:And I remember thinking it was like, I mean, this is these stories like we're all they've all, you know, my brother.
Marc:The cops were the enemy.
Guest:The cops are the enemy.
Guest:And it was just and that was how I grew up.
Guest:And then, you know, so I, in my own little way, tried to try to change that, you know.
Marc:But it's interesting because of the nature of it being relatively small town and everybody knows each other.
Marc:You know, the cops didn't beat the shit out of your dad.
Marc:No, they had to, you know, and they were sort of like, this is this is the local, you know, drunk lunatic.
Guest:They would have to pepper spray him.
Guest:Like I said, you know, and, you know, I could remember, you know, one of the bumping into a cop.
Guest:A lot of times I would bump into that when I became a cop.
Guest:too like i would get calls over the radio we have a warrant of arrest it's for your dad like that's or i'd bump into a guy i got your dad for drunk driving he couldn't even get out of the car you want to come they feel bad that um they had to arrest him but they had you know they had to arrest him and then you'd be get on the way to the end go like all right i'm coming
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, sometimes, yeah.
Guest:Sometimes I would get him.
Guest:And when there was a warrant, I had another guy, you know, another deputy go over and, you know, get him.
Guest:I just, I would get, I get annoyed.
Marc:You can't serve your dad a warrant.
Guest:I mean, I could, but it was like, I just felt, I went over with the guy.
Guest:I just let him take him.
Guest:You know, it was like, because it just, I was, you know, it was, I was aggravated with him at that time.
Guest:And, and, you know, I couldn't be a cop.
Marc:Understandably.
Marc:You don't have to feel bad about that.
Yeah.
Guest:In the town of Kittery, where I now was living and went to high school, I knew I couldn't be a cop there because I would be dealing with them every day.
Guest:So I got hired at the sheriff's office, which patrols the York County, but the Kittery isn't one of their towns because I patrolled the small towns that didn't have their own PD.
Marc:What did your dad say when you said you were going to be a cop?
Guest:I mean, it was funny.
Guest:He didn't go to my graduation at the police academy.
Guest:He's like, are there going to be cops there?
Guest:I mean, it was just, he is a funny guy.
Guest:And I got a lot of humor out of him because he is a funny guy.
Guest:So when they hired me at the county, you have to go before county commissioners, the chief had told me that one of the commissioners brought up the fact that
Guest:that you know his dad is, you know, this guy.
Guest:Almost like that was going to keep me from getting hired.
Guest:So I found out about that after getting hired.
Guest:So that kind of stuff, it's like, all right, so imagine here I am a cop, like he's kind of getting in the way of that, and here I am going to be this really good cop.
Guest:Like, you know, I'd be an asset.
Guest:And that almost stopped me from doing that.
Guest:And then when I become a stand-up, the whole George McDonald story we talked about, right, he's doing that.
Guest:So there was aggravating.
Guest:As much as I loved my dad, and he'd see me and be like, Josh, turn here.
Guest:But, you know, it was the annoyance of that.
Guest:It was definitely aggravating.
Marc:But so when you become a cop, how long before he becomes this homeless drunk?
Yeah.
Guest:It was pretty immediate because I was 19 and it was, you know, I could remember getting a call.
Guest:One night he was walking over the bridge from Kittery into Portsmouth and he got shot with a pellet gun.
Guest:Someone drove by and shot him with a pellet gun.
Guest:And I remember saying to my partner at the time, I'm like, the only drive-by shooting ever in Maine and it's my dad.
Guest:It's my dad.
Guest:And it's a pellet gun.
Guest:And to this day, you know who my dad thinks did it?
Guest:Who?
Guest:The mob.
Guest:They're using pellet guns.
Guest:He thinks he was tied up with the mob.
Guest:He still thinks it was some guy in the mafia, he's telling me.
Guest:Because he was doing the real estate deals and all that stuff and there was some shady characters and he did siding, aluminum siding back in the day.
Marc:So it's sort of like the way you're framing it, it's sort of like Mayberry as dark as Mayberry could get.
Marc:Do you know what I mean?
Marc:It's pellet guns and town drunks and police scanners.
Marc:There's still an element to it where it's like, it's a sad story, but it's not a horror story.
Guest:No, and it ended well.
Guest:Thank God.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:It did.
Guest:So looking back now, we can laugh.
Guest:And I got to tell you, just a month ago, we're at my brother's house for a party.
Guest:and me and my brothers all get around, and we're just talking stories about growing up and about how we had big rats in the house.
Guest:You did?
Guest:Yeah, my dad would say, well, the good thing is if you have rats, that means you've got no mice.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Like, that was his logic.
Guest:So we're going back and forth with all these stories, and my dad, right, laughing the whole time.
Guest:He's such a great soul.
Guest:He really is.
Guest:He's just laughing at the whole thing, and we're all laughing at it.
Guest:We all love him.
Guest:And then he just goes, he goes, look, let me just say this.
Guest:And we just stop and look at him.
Guest:What's he going to say, right?
Guest:And he literally says,
Guest:it wasn't as bad as it was.
Guest:And we just bust out laughing.
Guest:And I go, that should be a title of my book.
Guest:It's like, it wasn't as bad as it was.
Guest:And it was like, that's his, and he makes us laugh.
Guest:And he does.
Guest:And he really is.
Guest:And now, I mean, the wall in his house is all me, like articles.
Guest:And I mean, it's like, he looks like a stalker.
Marc:So when, okay, so you're being the cop, your dad's in and out of, I mean, if he's 11 years sober, I mean, it's pretty long run.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, it was a long run.
Guest:We thought he would die on the streets.
Guest:We can't believe it.
Marc:But what is the process of that?
Marc:So you're a cop and your dad's this homeless drunk and there's nothing you can do.
Marc:You can't get him into a shelter.
Marc:You just have what you can't.
Marc:There's nothing you can do.
Marc:It just was the way it was.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I think it's like, you know, he for a while and I'm not he lived in my brother's closet, like walk in closet for a couple of years.
Marc:But he was a couple of years for a couple of years.
Marc:Did your brother know?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:That would have been great if he didn't.
Guest:Oh yeah, he knew.
Guest:Yeah, he just got a little mattress pad in there and he literally was living there for a while.
Guest:So we always offer it to them to take him in.
Guest:But at the end of the day, he had to get to that point where I want help.
Guest:When he went into rehab once and fell off the wagon and then he got back in.
Marc:But everybody would serve him, you know, in town like they knew him.
Marc:Oh, yeah.
Marc:Was he begging for money and everything?
Guest:He wasn't a beggar.
Guest:Nope, he wasn't a beggar.
Guest:But everybody loved him.
Guest:Everybody liked him.
Guest:But I could remember in the newspaper, like this is the kind of stuff that, you know, as his kid that you'd see.
Guest:There was an article in the paper one day.
Guest:There was a line of fans waiting for Jimmy Buffett tickets.
Guest:And they called, you know, Parrot Heads, I think.
Guest:Right, Jimmy Buffett fans?
Guest:parrot heads and there's my dad with his you know homeless bag he's you know he's been on the newspaper he's you know cover the paper about homeless stories yeah he's got this bag on his back like this and the article said something like the headline was something like parrot heads get tips from a pro like on how to like camp outside like you know i mean they basically were calling my dad homeless in the local paper right like that kind of stuff i would you know what i mean it's like you know
Marc:Town drunk.
Guest:Classic.
Guest:Yeah, and I remember when my sister-in-law was in town.
Guest:We were out drinking in Portsmouth one night.
Guest:It was about 12.30, 1 in the morning, and there's my dad sitting on a bench.
Guest:No shirt, just his pants on, a gallon of milk, and like a scarf.
Guest:And he's just like this.
Guest:He's like, Justin!
Guest:And he comes, you know, happy drunk.
Guest:Hey, Justin!
Guest:Wise ass.
Guest:He'd always say this little wise ass thing to me.
Guest:And my sister-in-law literally goes, who's that?
Guest:And my wife was like, that's Justin's father.
Guest:I mean, he was that guy that you would see just out.
Guest:I mean, he lived in the pay toilet at the parking garage.
Guest:You probably parked in that garage.
Marc:Oh, my God.
Guest:He lived in the pay toilet.
Marc:When I played the speakeasy?
Guest:No, no, that's the other end of town.
Guest:The Portsmouth Music Hall.
Guest:It's right around the corner from the Portsmouth Music Hall.
Guest:He lived in the garage.
Guest:He lived in the pay toilet of that garage.
Marc:But I mean, is there some element of heartbreak to all of it?
Marc:I mean, I guess he was a town drunk and he was a happy drunk and he was a character, but I mean, it must have been sad as hell for, you know.
Marc:Or do you just get over that and you just sort of accept it?
Guest:You know, look, I mean, I've gone to see therapists, you know, in 2010 or 11, I went to see the first one.
Guest:I mean, there's definitely stuff underneath with what's going on in my life that I know is there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But, you know, that's why I became a comedian, right?
Guest:It's humor.
Guest:We deal with it with humor.
Guest:We laugh at it.
Guest:When did you decide to do that?
Guest:I had been a cop for a few years and it was just something I just wanted to try.
Marc:Now, what happened to your aunt?
Guest:She's still around, but they just kind of, you know, they broke it off.
Marc:Did she get sober?
Guest:She, yeah, she's older now, so it's like, yeah, I don't think she's drinking anymore, now that you mention that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, I don't think she's drinking anymore either.
Marc:Is the family still close to some degree?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, we're close.
Guest:They don't talk.
Marc:Oh, your old man.
Guest:Yeah, they don't talk.
Guest:But I just saw her and probably talked to her for five minutes, which is the most I've talked to her in about five years, actually, just a couple weeks ago.
Marc:But everyone's, you know, like your old man's got a relationship with your kids and your brother's kids.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:My dad now is like, I mean, you know, my kids who are now nine and 11 years old don't know him any different.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He shows up their birthday every birthday with balloons.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:And my dad, when my dad was first in rehab for the first time, Yeah.
Guest:He had an index card, and he said to me, I went and visited him at rehab, and he wanted to know my date of birth and my phone number.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he had me and all my brothers, and he wrote it all on an index card.
Guest:I mean, you talk about the birthday.
Guest:Right.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And my dad, in this funny way, people will ask, oh, how old are your kids now?
Guest:And he'll say, oh, it's hard to keep track.
Guest:It changes every year.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:That's his line.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But so now my kids, he shows up and he's got the balloons.
Guest:And he used to be a karate, black belt in karate, my dad.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So he teaches my kids now karate lessons.
Guest:He'll come over and like, yeah.
Guest:No kidding.
Guest:How old is he?
Guest:He's 77 now.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Good shape.
Guest:He walks every day.
Guest:He'll still credit the fact that he walks.
Guest:He's always walked.
Guest:Even when he was drunk, he was walking.
Guest:Well, he was homeless.
Guest:Walking.
Guest:He was homeless.
Guest:But he made sure he got his walk-in.
Guest:And he, you know, one night he was hit by a, he was going to the bathroom on the side of the road.
Guest:He was hit by a snowplow.
Guest:What?
Guest:Like that, he ended up in the hospital.
Guest:Like, yeah, that was part of what got him sober was he almost died.
Guest:He punctured a lung.
Guest:He got hit by a snowplow.
Guest:Yeah, he got hit by a snowplow.
Guest:He was actually, and I'm not making this up, he was going to, he was taking a dump on the side of the road and a snowplow came and knocked him over an embankment.
Guest:And I, what?
Guest:No, I, and I. You can't take it.
Guest:No, he's, and he even says, no, he didn't actually get hurt.
Guest:That time he didn't get hurt that bad because I said to him, I go, were you all right?
Guest:He goes, yeah, I was wearing my puffy coat or something he said.
Guest:Right.
Guest:But he fell, he got hit by another, hit a guardrail punctured.
Guest:He was walking around with a punctured lung.
Marc:for like a day and a half and the doctor said if you didn't get in here today you'd be dead and uh so that's that was the first time i think and um you know and yeah we thought he was gonna die it was it's amazing do you think like do you think that like you're being a cop and you're trying to resolve this obviously it's antithetic it's like it is the literally the opposite of your father
Marc:Right.
Marc:I mean, I mean, obviously he didn't look at you as the enemy, but, you know, and he had a relationship with the cops, no matter how much it was.
Marc:It almost in my mind, it plays out like this comedy that it was just the way the dynamic was.
Marc:And they knew him and he knew them.
Marc:And this is the way it's going to be.
Marc:You see this stuff on like cop shows like that guy.
Marc:It's this guy again.
Marc:So you become this thing that completely separates you and defines you as your own person, you know, and is completely the opposite of your father.
Marc:And somehow or another, that didn't quite help you process, you know, whatever it is that you were trying to process.
Marc:And then at some point you decide, well, comedy, like, you know, like, is it possible?
Marc:Do you ever think of it in those terms?
Marc:Like, yeah.
Guest:Well, I got to tell you, I could remember, and I don't know if I've ever said this or if my dad remembers, I could remember my dad watching The Tonight Show one night when I was a kid.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I remember him making a comment as to, I could have done this or something like that.
Guest:I could have done this.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I remember it being like, you know, like, like be in show business, like be like, you know, I think Carson was doing his monologue, I think.
Guest:And I think that's, and I don't know if he remembers that, but I always remembered that.
Guest:And here I am thinking, well, you might have, but look at, you know, you're drinking, like, you know what I mean?
Guest:Whatever you, and there was always a side of me that, you know, back in junior high was the first time I thought I might wanted to be a standup.
Guest:So I just didn't know how to do it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It's just, how do you make a living doing that?
Guest:But I remember that that's the first time I had the thought.
Marc:Why?
Marc:Who'd you like?
Marc:Like, what was it that made you?
Guest:Well, Carlin and Eddie Murphy were like the big ones.
Guest:That was a little older, more like in high school.
Guest:Like Rodney Dangerfield.
Guest:But I could just remember thinking funny things.
Guest:Like if I would hear something on the monologue, I remember thinking, oh, I had that thought.
Guest:Like that's when I thought I had a mind for it.
Marc:So how do you quit being a cop?
Guest:While I was still a cop, I went down and did stitches when I did an open mic.
Guest:That was, oh yeah, that first time.
Guest:Yep, and I drove down and just tried it, and then I just went back and tried it again.
Marc:Were your jokes about being a cop?
Guest:They weren't at that point.
Guest:First time I went down, I didn't tell anybody.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just me, I didn't want, if I bombed, I didn't want, that might have been it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it actually went surprisingly well.
Guest:So when I went back, I signed up again to do it like four, five, six months later.
Marc:Who was hosting?
Marc:Do you remember who was hosting?
Guest:I think it was Vinny Favorito.
Guest:Yeah, Vinny Favorito.
Guest:And so the second time I went back, I told everybody because I thought it went pretty well.
Marc:He was probably nervous you were a cop.
Guest:I don't know if he knew.
Guest:I don't know if he knew.
Guest:But he should have been, right?
Guest:Is he still around?
Guest:He's back in the Boston area.
Guest:Yeah, back in the Boston area.
Guest:So the second time I go back, I tell like 40 people come down.
Guest:They come down and try, right?
Guest:I went up.
Guest:I had the suit coat on.
Guest:I'll never forget.
Guest:I had a sport coat on and I left the tag on because I was going to try to work it into my act.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I left the price taggy thing that you're supposed to take off on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So, I get up there, I start in, and it's not going well.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So, I start dropping F-bombs.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Every fifth word is an F-bomb.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm sweating.
Guest:I'm bombing, okay?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I know 40 people are there.
Guest:I'm bombing, okay?
Guest:Vinny, it's a crutch to use the F-word, right?
Guest:So, I'm throwing it out everywhere.
Guest:Vinny comes up, grabs the mic, and he says, hey, Justin.
Guest:He's like, next time, why don't you try throwing a few fucks in there?
Guest:Maybe that'll get him, right?
Guest:Huge laugh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I hadn't even, I'm still on stage.
Guest:And he goes, what's with the, what's with it?
Guest:He points out my little tag on the coat.
Guest:He goes, what's with the, what's with the coat there?
Guest:Right.
Guest:So, and then, so I try to like spin it.
Guest:He's got a giggles jacket on.
Guest:Remember they had the giggles, the Knicks jackets, the giggles jackets.
Guest:And I go, oh, what's this coat?
Guest:Giggles.
Guest:And he just goes, yeah, it's a place where I get paid to tell jokes.
Guest:Another big laugh.
Guest:I walked off.
Guest:That was it.
Guest:That was my second time.
Guest:And I almost, Mark felt, I can't go out like that.
Guest:And I think that's what motivated me to go back.
Guest:Oh, so here I am in the back of the room and I know other comedians have a very similar story because I've since found this.
Guest:So in the back of the room, a guy goes on next who I saw the last time I was there does the exact same jokes he did.
Guest:And I was like, you can do that.
Guest:I did a whole new set my second time.
Guest:I didn't know that I could repeat material.
Guest:So I was like, you can do that.
Guest:So that was it.
Guest:And now that I knew that I could do that,
Marc:yeah work on it let me just go do the best of the first three yeah you know mix it with if i had anything funny in the second three yeah you know what i mean sure and that's how it kind of started i guess that is a big moment where you realize like you can just work on these jokes you're not getting paid you know there's nothing you know you're just trying to figure out how to get laughs so that's how it starts so when did you when so when did you stop being a cop and when did you start doing the material about being a cop
Guest:Right around the mid 90s, I had gone down to, I moved down to Peabody Mass.
Guest:I don't know if you know Peabody.
Guest:I do.
Guest:I do.
Guest:I know someone who's from Peabody.
Guest:Gary Goldman's from Peabody.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Gary Goldman.
Guest:So I moved to Peabody because my uncle had a place there and I was part time still as a cop.
Guest:I would go up and do shifts.
Guest:I would drive up.
Guest:There was only about an hour and a half drive.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So I stayed on as a cop in case the comedy thing didn't kind of work, I could go back.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Without having to go to the academy again, I still had my certification.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So at that time, I started to work in stuff about material, about being a cop.
Guest:I was getting on almost every night of the week, you know, as much as I could get on.
Guest:Nick's and there was the comedy, I think the Comedy Palace was around then or a couple other ones.
Guest:So I was just hammering away and it started to feel good after about a year or so.
Guest:And the move that got me to New York was this comedian, a good friend of mine, Al Ducharme.
Marc:I know Al.
Marc:I've done road gigs with Al.
Marc:He was very funny.
Marc:I've seen him a couple of times, not too long ago.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He was very funny.
Guest:Great guy.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:He did a lot of gigs with Al Ducharme.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He's been doing it for a long time.
Guest:So he said to me that there was a guy in New York City named Kerry Hoffman who has Stand Up New York.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And he's a manager and he's looking for people.
Guest:Why don't you send him a tape?
Yeah.
Guest:So I sent him a tape and he called me.
Guest:He goes, hey, I want you to come down to New York.
Guest:I want to talk about managing you.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that opened up the New York door.
Guest:At the same time, I started to do NACAs.
Guest:The college, yeah.
Guest:The college stuff, right?
Marc:Yep.
Guest:So I went down to do a NACA.
Guest:My college agent- A convention.
Guest:Yeah, a NACA convention, yep.
Marc:Yeah, so if they like you, you could get a year's worth of work out of that shit, right?
Guest:Yep, you do 20 minutes and if the college is like you, you can get 100 schools right there.
Guest:They can sign you up.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So I had a really good set at this NACA.
Guest:So it made my agent mention me to her friend at Don Buchwald down in New York, Kristen Miller, I believe is her name.
Guest:And so Kristen Miller reaches out to me and says, hey, I want to come out and see you in New York.
Guest:Where are you working?
Guest:And I go, well, I don't live in New York.
Guest:I'm up in Boston.
Guest:I'm not working anyway.
Guest:He goes, I'll get you a spot at the comic strip.
Guest:So I go, okay.
Guest:So she comes to see me at the comic strip.
Guest:So Lucien was there.
Guest:Hello, Justin.
Guest:And I didn't even know him until after I got off the stage.
Guest:So I knew nothing about the place.
Guest:I knew nothing about how hard it is to get on these places, how hard it is to break in.
Guest:I do my set for her, and I get off stage, and Lucien tells me that if I move down there, I can start putting him for spots.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:But it helped because I had someone from the industry
Guest:Yeah, get you in the spot.
Guest:Getting me the spot.
Guest:So then I had a meeting with Kerry Hoffman where he's like, you can start working this club, Stand Up New York, and he wanted to manage me, and I said I didn't know yet, I'm still sorting things out, so I got in at that club, and then this is all before I moved down there.
Marc:What's this, mid-90s?
Guest:Yeah, this is like 96, 97, like 97 now.
Marc:So you move.
Guest:So I move, yeah.
Guest:And that was the beginning.
Guest:And I lived in Astoria, Queens, and that's where I met you for the first time.
Marc:Because I was living there?
Guest:I first met you walking down the street.
Marc:On like 30th Avenue or something?
Guest:One of those, we walk in one day and I met you.
Guest:Not a happy time.
Guest:Well, you were nice to me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You're friendly.
Guest:That's a good story.
Guest:You were friendly.
Guest:Well, I mean, you were, you know, but I just remember you were like one of the guys that were there and, you know, Louis and you and Dave Attell and you guys were like New York.
Guest:In my mind, you guys were like the cool New York guys.
Marc:Right.
Guest:You know?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And so how does it, like, how does it transpire?
Marc:Because, like, I guess, like, Ruthann, I mean, my thing with Ruthann that it happened in, like, you know, I didn't get...
Marc:Well, I mean, I had a few deals here and there, but she was still in the racket of getting guys big deals because she got John DiResta, the other cop.
Marc:She got him his big deal.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:So when she wanted to come see me.
Guest:Now, she wanted to come and see me.
Guest:I think it was a guy named Josh Pollack.
Guest:Does that ring a bell?
Marc:Yeah, I was her assistant.
Guest:Okay.
Marc:He's an actual agent now.
Marc:I think he still is.
Guest:So he had seen me and said, you got to come see this guy.
Guest:So she comes down to see me.
Guest:And at this point, Ruth Ann's coming to see me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I had all the New York managers taking me out to lunch, wanting to manage me.
Marc:What, Katz?
Guest:Katz.
Marc:Hoffman.
Guest:Yes, but- Dorfman.
Guest:Yes, but no, but also Becky.
Guest:Becky.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Dave Becky, Rose Garden.
Guest:Rory, yeah.
Guest:Bruce Hills.
Marc:Yeah, from Montreal.
Guest:Was he managing people?
Guest:He was managing people.
Guest:And I'll never forget it because people say, hey, have you done Montreal?
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I'm like, no, I had lunch with Bruce Hills.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And I was going to be in Montreal every year for the rest of my life.
Guest:And then I didn't end up going with him.
Guest:Ever?
Guest:I didn't end up going with, I've never done Montreal.
Guest:I still haven't.
Guest:I did Aspen and all that, but I've never gotten, I've never done Montreal.
Guest:And I don't know if that had something to do with it or not, but I didn't.
Guest:You can still get in there.
Guest:I know, but I haven't tried in years.
Guest:So what Ruthann told me was, why do you want a manager?
Guest:I'm gonna get you a deal.
Guest:You want to give away 10, 15% for nothing?
Guest:And at the time, sounds pretty good.
Guest:I'm like, yeah, it's a good point.
Guest:Why do I need a manager?
Guest:In hindsight, I wish I would have gone with a manager because then once the deals don't happen, they fall through.
Guest:You go back to the managers.
Guest:Hey, remember you liked me three years ago?
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:So what happened?
Marc:So like what?
Marc:You listen to Ruthann and she gets you what?
Marc:A deal?
Guest:Yep.
Guest:I was meeting with a bunch.
Guest:It's like a bidding war.
Guest:Oh, big deal.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I was meeting with CBS, Warner Brothers.
Guest:It ended up coming, Overbrook, Will Smith's company.
Guest:I think those were the three that were- It was a cop show?
Guest:Yeah, it was about me back where I used to work.
Guest:It was just about my life.
Marc:The Dark Mayberry show.
Guest:It wasn't dark though.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:Because it wasn't really dark.
Guest:This guy, Ephraim Seger, ended up, I picked showrunners.
Guest:I met with all the showrunners.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:Co-wrote it with them.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Wrote the pilot.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:We ended up going with Warner Brothers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:The studio.
Guest:And you know there's a lot of those politics where apparently, from what I had heard, the head of, Warner Brothers just got a new head of, the guy became the head of Warner Brothers.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Different guy.
Guest:And Les, at CBS, they don't get along.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And from Wyatt Hurl, the last thing they want to do is make one of his shows.
Guest:You know, this guy comes in to the Warner Brothers.
Guest:We're going to make one of his shows right away.
Guest:So there was a little bit of a political thing.
Marc:So you got the deal with Warner Brothers.
Marc:And then all of a sudden they change guards.
Marc:And Moonves doesn't want to have anything to do with that guy.
Marc:So you got stuck.
Marc:It's always something.
Guest:That was a rumor.
Guest:It's always something.
Guest:So nothing happened.
Marc:But they didn't end well for Moonves.
Marc:So, you know.
Guest:No, I know.
Guest:Where's that guy now?
Guest:No.
Guest:And I met him.
Guest:Fine somewhere.
Guest:I'm sure he's got money.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:But all right.
Marc:So the first deal goes nowhere.
Marc:You shoot a pilot.
Guest:We didn't shoot the pilot.
Guest:Only wrote the pilot.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I've been there twice, three times.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So then, okay.
Marc:So you got no manager, but you got like half a million in the bank.
Marc:More.
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:It was 370, the first one.
Marc:I wasn't looking for numbers, but it's a lot of money for doing nothing.
Guest:But the reason I'm going to tell you because I know a lot of people at the time were probably like, oh, this guy getting the deals a little jealous or bitter or whatever, upset with me.
Marc:Usually it was a 200, 250 deal is what you got for those development deals if you weren't a hot property.
Guest:Well, I ended up losing it all.
Guest:So that's why I don't mind having the number because it has a sad ending.
Marc:But wait, so you out here, you get the deal and you stay out here after the shit goes south.
Marc:And what do you do?
Marc:You're doing standup.
Guest:I was still in New York.
Guest:Oh, you never moved out here.
Guest:I didn't move to LA.
Guest:I hadn't moved to LA yet.
Guest:The first deal goes nowhere.
Guest:That's when Ruthann gets the idea.
Guest:Pair me up with John DiResta.
Guest:Oh, so that's the second deal.
Marc:Now, had his show gone south yet, or this is his first shot?
Guest:He had a show on UPN that went south, yes.
Marc:So he was going to be the new Gleason, and that didn't happen.
Guest:It didn't, yeah, UPN.
Guest:A lot of billboards.
Guest:Yep, a lot of stuff.
Marc:He must have shot a few.
Marc:What, did they do 12 or something?
Guest:Oh, I think he might have got a season.
Marc:Uh-huh.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:20 episodes.
Marc:So now he's down and out.
Marc:You're both Ruthann clients.
Marc:You're both cops.
Marc:So of course, Ruthann.
Marc:You know where the thing is, Ruthann, I ran into her recently.
Marc:I was at WME and she came to see me do something.
Marc:She had been at ICM.
Marc:And it was weird because we went out to lunch and I knew it had to be about something.
Marc:We caught up, but I really hadn't seen her.
Marc:I didn't know what she was up to.
Marc:And she talked me into, you know, going with ICM.
Marc:And I was at WME, but I was a little, you know, I wasn't happy.
Marc:And that was what she, she talked me into going with ICM, which I did.
Marc:I'm with one of the big guys over there.
Marc:And then she quit.
Marc:Oh, well, she's not doing it anymore?
Marc:I don't know what she's doing.
Marc:She, I think she went into the other side development.
Marc:I don't know, but I was the last thing she did.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:She pulls me away.
Marc:She got me twice.
Marc:Fucking Ruthann.
Guest:30 years apart.
Guest:I mean, I'm very fond of her.
Guest:I have such fond memories because she changed my life at that time.
Marc:No, no.
Guest:She believed in me.
Guest:And she was going to bat for me.
Marc:She changed everyone's life.
Guest:But there was one thing that she did, too, that I wish she hadn't done.
Guest:What?
Guest:Which would be the third year.
Guest:We'll get to that if you want me to go back to the second year with Durester.
Marc:Yeah, what happened with that?
Guest:So we-
Guest:John and I, now we have this show, I moved down from Maine to become a cop.
Guest:I'm the, you know, you know the kind of cop I am.
Guest:I'm the good cop.
Guest:I want to change the world.
Guest:I want to change everyone's opinion of law enforcement, you know, one person at a time.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:John is the bitter, you know, doesn't even want the job, wants to get hurt on the job so he can collect pension, just get out of, doesn't want to eat in public, doesn't want the public to see him.
Guest:It's an odd couple, right?
Marc:But he's not an immoral cop.
Marc:He's just a guy that wants out.
Guest:He's not immoral.
Guest:He wants out.
Guest:Yeah, he wants out.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:So, we have to pick a showrunner, and we ended up picking Alan Kirschenbaum.
Marc:Oh, yeah, I know Alan.
Guest:Yeah, Alan.
Marc:He did that Anthony Clark show.
Marc:He passed away.
Marc:He did.
Marc:Who was his dad?
Guest:Freddie Roman.
Guest:Freddie Roman's son, right.
Marc:Freddie Roman's son.
Guest:He killed himself, right?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Nice guy, though.
Guest:A nice guy, and-
Guest:We write it, we pick Alan, we all write it together, the three of us.
Guest:We co-write it.
Guest:And CBS says, you know, the people at, because this deal was right with CBS, the quote, I'll never forget it because you don't forget these things.
Guest:They're like, you know, this is our favorite show this year.
Guest:We just want to let you know this is our favorite show.
Guest:And I didn't get that the first year.
Guest:Like I never heard that.
Guest:Just go, we just want you to know this.
Guest:So I'm thinking, article in Variety.
Guest:On paper.
Guest:This could be it.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:You hadn't shot anything yet.
Guest:Hadn't shot anything yet.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Okay?
Guest:So we're just waiting for Les to read it.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:Because I haven't got to Les yet.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:In the trades, we see that Alan Kirshenbaum sells a show to CBS called Yes, Dear.
Guest:It was the same year.
Guest:Same year that he was doing it.
Guest:We didn't know he was doing another show with CBS at the time.
Guest:John and I were both like-
Guest:That's probably not good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's probably not good.
Guest:So we get a call, you know, hey, yeah, you know the show I'm doing, but you know what?
Guest:If anything happens with this show, if it doesn't make it, doesn't cast, we want to make yours.
Guest:They held us longer.
Guest:They held us a little bit longer just in case to give them time to see what happens with Yistir.
Guest:This is how close this one got to getting made.
Guest:Long story short, Yistir stays on.
Guest:The rest is history.
Guest:Our show, nothing ever happens with our show.
Guest:Show business is the worst.
Guest:But I got a story that you mentioned Alan Kershaw.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that pilot called The Finest sat in my brother's, I was in LA, so my brother had boxes for me that he was keeping in his old house.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Calls me up.
Guest:This is in 2012.
Guest:He says, hey, I got some old boxes here.
Guest:He says, do you want to come over and get rid of this stuff?
Guest:Um, you know, cause I, you know, I don't want to, I'm moving, I'm selling the house or whatever.
Guest:So he drops the boxes off.
Guest:I open up the box and right there's the pilot, the finest that we wrote, right?
Marc:With Kirshenbaum.
Guest:With Kirshenbaum.
Guest:I read it.
Guest:I'm just sitting there in my driveway.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Just reading it.
Guest:And I'm like, man, that's a pretty good, still holds up.
Guest:It's a pretty good show, right?
Guest:It's just, you know, I put it down the next day.
Guest:John DiRestra, I haven't talked to in five years.
Guest:I have not talked to John in five years before this.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Calls me up because did you hear Alan Kirshenbaum just killed himself?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It was the next day.
Guest:I hadn't thought or seen that pilot in 12 years.
Guest:I had just read it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was so, but yeah, so sad.
Guest:Weird.
Guest:So sad.
Guest:And he was 51.
Marc:I know.
Guest:And I'm like, yeah.
Guest:So.
Marc:I don't know what happened there.
Marc:He was 51 and he had all the money in the world.
Guest:I know.
Guest:That just goes to show.
Guest:So.
Marc:So, okay.
Marc:So you're two down.
Guest:I'm two down.
Marc:Ugh.
Marc:But you made money on that second one too.
Marc:Yep.
Marc:So you saved some money.
Guest:I had some money in the bank.
Guest:Are you married at the point yet?
Guest:Nope.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But still with my girlfriend who's now a wife.
Marc:Right.
Guest:She's my wife.
Guest:So I'm at Dangerfields.
Marc:So you never went to LA.
Marc:You're still in New York.
Marc:You're at Dangerfields.
Guest:I'm still in New York.
Guest:I'm in Dangerfields.
Guest:There's a guy there that's a waiter.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's a part-time stockbroker.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:1999.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Okay?
Guest:Tells me, he goes, hey, man, I do this on the side.
Guest:Stock market's going nuts.
Guest:I don't know if you remember 99, if you were in it or at all.
Guest:Stock market's going nuts.
Guest:He goes, why don't you give- I didn't have any money in that.
Guest:Give me some money.
Guest:You know what?
Guest:I wish I didn't.
Guest:Because this is where the story goes from-
Guest:The best thing that happened to me were those deals, and it was the worst.
Guest:In hindsight, I wish I never got the deals.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So I see this guy, I give him 10 grand.
Guest:He doubles it in like two weeks, right?
Guest:Then I give him 50 grand.
Guest:He doubles that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I give him more.
Guest:He doubles that.
Guest:He's like, on paper, Mark-
Guest:I am like, I'll never forget the quote he said to me.
Guest:He goes, I'm going to have you at a million dollars by the end of the year, right?
Guest:I'm going to have a million dollars by the end, right?
Marc:This is the waiter.
Guest:This is the waiter.
Guest:Cut to the market crashes, right?
Guest:The big crash of 2000.
Guest:It was 2000.
Guest:Big crash of 2000.
Guest:I didn't realize that I'd kept like 100 grand in cash.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:100 grand was in mutual funds, but didn't realize those were in tech funds.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So that was all gone.
Guest:I didn't realize that when you sell a stock in less than a year, you have to pay the government capital gains on that 50%.
Guest:So every time he was doubling my money, taking out double, I owed the IRS.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I had to take all the money I had, the 100 grand that was my safety net.
Guest:Let's be smart.
Guest:Let's not do anything stupid.
Guest:I had to give all that to the government.
Guest:So I ended up with $10,000 after all of that.
Guest:And I couldn't even look at it.
Guest:I was in such depression.
Guest:And when I tell you I bought a leather jacket, and I'm not lying, I bought a leather jacket...
Guest:And I was just looking to buy a new car at a Honda Civic.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Tree fell on it.
Guest:So I had a big dent in the front and I pulled into the shopping center and what was the supermarket in Astoria, Queens off the main drag there?
Guest:What was that called?
Guest:Vons?
Guest:No.
Guest:That's LA.
Marc:No.
Marc:Pathmark.
Marc:Yeah, Pathmark.
Marc:Pathmark.
Marc:That sounds right.
Guest:I pull into Pathmark.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I don't know.
Guest:I think they're Mexican or Hispanic.
Guest:I don't know what.
Guest:But they come up to me and they're like, fix your car, fix your car.
Guest:And I go, I don't.
Guest:They stuck a drill right into the side of my car.
Guest:And they just right there.
Guest:They had the putty and everything.
Guest:And they just stuck a drill in it.
Guest:They popped it down.
Guest:Pulling it out.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They painted it and I sprayed it.
Guest:It didn't even match or anything.
Guest:I threw them a few bucks.
Guest:And I'm like, I got to get a new car.
Guest:But it was like right when it crashed.
Guest:So I stayed.
Guest:I kept that car for another two years.
Guest:I had my leather jacket.
Guest:That was it.
Guest:And I had 10 grand that literally went into like a retirement thing.
Guest:And that's still, that 10 grand I still have.
Marc:But what did you, I mean, what's the lesson there?
Marc:Maybe, you know, look, stockbrokers are dubious, but the waiter stockbroker, maybe not the best idea.
Guest:Mark, I'm embarrassed to tell the story.
Guest:So this guy, who I hadn't heard from in a few years, all of a sudden out of the blue, calls me up.
Guest:He goes, hey, I'm going to say his first name.
Guest:I'm going to say his last name.
Guest:He goes, hey, Dan here.
Guest:I'm like, hey, what's up, Dan?
Guest:And I'm in like deep depression.
Guest:He's like, got a lot of big things happening.
Guest:I got some stuff I want to tell you about.
Guest:And I'm like, what?
Guest:He's like, there's some companies I really think are going to move.
Guest:I'm like, Dan.
Guest:I have no money.
Guest:I go, I have it wiped out.
Guest:He goes, you know, he goes, that was a tough stretch for a lot of people.
Guest:He goes, I moved back in with my grandmother.
Guest:I swear to God.
Guest:He goes, I'm living with my grandmother now.
Guest:And I'm like, so, and he called and showed up a couple of times and I'm like, and I would joke, you know, I said, this is a joke.
Guest:I said, he went from being my stockbroker to my broke stalker.
Guest:Like he just kept showing, I'm like, what are you, I go, I got nothing left.
Guest:I go, this guy, meeting him.
Guest:Like ruin my, you know, I didn't buy property.
Guest:I lived in a two and a half family in Astoria, Queens.
Guest:The one that I, I could have bought that.
Guest:Like I could have bought that for cash.
Guest:It's worth like 1.5 million now.
Guest:So just if I would have bought property, but I didn't.
Guest:So when you talk about, you know, you know, I, oh, I got this windfall.
Guest:I was lucky to get it.
Guest:But when you, I had, my accountant says, there's people jumping out of buildings that didn't have as bad of a case as you have of losing money like that.
Guest:I still to this day write off,
Guest:I think three grand every year off my losses for the rest of my life.
Marc:For that.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It's like I got, I wish my development deal was, you know what?
Guest:We can't give you much money, but every year you can write 3000 off your taxes for life.
Guest:I would have been like, sign me up.
Marc:So that's pretty brutal, man.
Marc:And I mean, are you doing comedy through all this?
Guest:I am, but it was tough.
Guest:It was depressing.
Guest:You know, I got Jay Leno and I did Leno for the first time in 2002, which was my goal when I had set out.
Guest:If I could do The Tonight Show, that was the one thing.
Guest:My dad, you know, we used to watch it.
Guest:If I could do The Tonight Show.
Guest:I was so depressed when I did it.
Guest:Like, I can't even watch me.
Guest:Did you do all right?
Guest:I thought it was okay.
Guest:They had me back.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it wasn't good.
Guest:I wasn't myself.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I watched myself.
Guest:I was like, there was this gloom, doom and gloom underneath me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:When I watch it.
Guest:Like, I could see it.
Guest:And this should have been the happiest moment of my life.
Guest:And I like, and it just literally, I just wasn't even myself.
Guest:I'm like, who is that guy?
Guest:I would love to do that material again.
Guest:No, it was a tough when I, so I moved to LA in 2001.
Guest:That's when you came?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:2001, I came after I had lost.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:So I'm walking around in LA.
Guest:Oh my God.
Guest:And that's a, the sun was out and I was not.
Guest:That's not the time to come.
Guest:No.
Marc:You come when you get the deal and then you kind of delude yourself and I think it's all turned around, but you lost everything and you're like, I'm going to go there.
Guest:Yes, I know.
Marc:That's like the most depressing situation I can imagine.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So you're here, you're broke, you're just doing a Tonight Show, you've had three deals, you're well-trodden territory, and what are you doing?
Guest:Well, I had two deals.
Guest:The third one was the one I was going to talk about Ruthann.
Guest:Will Smith's company offered me a deal.
Guest:This was in 2000.
Guest:This was in 2000.
Guest:That's part of why I gave the guy almost all my money because I knew I had another one coming from Will Smith's company.
Guest:Right.
Guest:The last minute she says, you know what?
Guest:I don't think we should take it.
Guest:It's 250 grand.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I don't think we should take it.
Guest:I'm like, really?
Guest:Yeah, they haven't had a show on yet.
Guest:They haven't gotten a show on the air.
Guest:I think it's a bad year.
Guest:Let's wait a year.
Guest:So I never got that one.
Guest:So that was there.
Guest:I never took it.
Guest:Because I was thinking, all right, let me get this.
Guest:I'll buy a house with that money.
Guest:I'll have this money in the stock market.
Guest:So that never happened.
Marc:Everything was going your way, man.
Guest:So in 2000, 2001 now, when I moved there, 9-11, 2001.
Guest:When you moved to LA.
Guest:Yes, I moved to LA in January of 2001.
Guest:And then 9-11.
Guest:And then it changed.
Guest:Well, it just changed.
Guest:I had put up my one-man show at the HBO Workspace.
Guest:Do you remember that?
Marc:Sure, I did one-man shows there.
Marc:I've had desperate attempts at, please help me.
Marc:Yeah, I should have called all my shows there.
Marc:I think I did two one-man shows there, subtitled, please help me.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So what happened?
Guest:I put that up.
Guest:I think it was September 17th, 2001.
Guest:It was a week after 9-11.
Marc:That's right.
Marc:My book came out around 9-11.
Marc:My first book, yeah.
Marc:It was not a good... It's a sad day for everybody.
Guest:It was a sad day.
Guest:And I mean, it was weird.
Guest:I got Aspen that year.
Guest:I took the one-man train.
Guest:That was the year in Aspen.
Guest:Nobody's buying.
Guest:But reality TV had just come, right?
Guest:Survivor, Big Brother.
Guest:So that was the change.
Guest:Fear factor.
Guest:All of that.
Guest:So it just changed.
Guest:So now by 02...
Guest:Your writing's on the wall.
Guest:No money.
Guest:I blew it.
Guest:I was all set up to do what I came to do.
Guest:It was a gift, and I blew it.
Guest:So that's what I had to live with for years.
Marc:I don't think that, but you don't really feel like you blew it.
Marc:I mean, the show business part you didn't blow.
Marc:That's just the nature of show business.
Marc:I mean, giving a waiter 200 grand, not a great idea, but I mean, show business is show business.
Marc:Mark.
Marc:You know?
Guest:No, giving a weight or 200 grand was not smart.
Guest:You know I had a trademark?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Do you know Lucky Brand Dungarees?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I had the trademark Lucky Anywhere, and I sold it to Lucky Brand Dungarees for $4,000.
Marc:Lucky Anywhere?
Guest:Lucky Anywhere.
Guest:It was just a trademark I had.
Guest:They bought it from me.
Marc:What made you register a trademark?
Guest:I was going to do clothes.
Guest:I had this clothing line.
Guest:When was this?
Guest:This was in mid to late 90s, same time I was doing stand-up.
Guest:I had a clothing line.
Guest:I bought the trademark to suck it up.
Guest:It was like a sports line.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Bill Parcells wore it, Curt Schilling with a bloody sock, like had my hat on before he pitched with a bloody sock.
Guest:Did you make money at that?
Guest:No.
Guest:No, I didn't make money because I'm a horrible businessman, obviously.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:That's the waiter doing my stock stuff.
Guest:And the four grand that Lucky gave me for that trademark, I found out later from a patent attorney, he goes...
Guest:You only got four grand?
Guest:He's like, who handled that case?
Guest:My buddy was a defense attorney.
Marc:Was he a waiter?
Guest:No, it was a defense attorney.
Guest:He just tried to keep me out of jail.
Guest:I'm like, you know, he does OUIs, you know, DWI.
Guest:And he handled that.
Guest:So that like literally, so that's what you talk about bad decisions.
Marc:Why were you going to go to jail?
Guest:No, I'm just saying as a defense attorney, he's worried.
Guest:He just is trying to get people off.
Guest:It wasn't his area.
Guest:It wasn't his area.
Guest:And, you know, having a waiter do my stocks and a defense attorney handle my patent trademark thing.
Guest:So I've got, you know what I mean?
Guest:So those mistakes, that's what haunts me a little bit.
Marc:So, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I'm here, Mark.
Guest:Thanks for having me.
Guest:But wait.
Marc:So wait.
Marc:Tell me about the day you decided to leave LA.
Marc:Oh.
Marc:Wait.
Marc:Were you working out here?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Right, because you were on The Tonight Show.
Guest:You do the improv.
Guest:Yeah, I was doing it.
Guest:I passed the Funny Bone and the improvs to headline.
Guest:I was headlining all those all over the country.
Guest:Oh, that's good.
Guest:So you're working.
Guest:I went and did the audition, but it was the thing where now I've got to go out of town all the time.
Marc:You are a road comic.
Guest:I'm a road comic to try to make money now to buy a house.
Marc:Do you have kids yet?
Guest:No.
Guest:No kids.
Guest:So the real estate market here is going up.
Guest:I'm trying to make the money so I could get a down payment on a house.
Guest:By around 2005, I had done the Leno in 04 again.
Guest:I went back in 04.
Guest:So by 05-
Guest:We go look at places.
Guest:It's two bedrooms are $500,000, right?
Guest:Here.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My wife doesn't like it here.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She's kind of miserable.
Guest:What does she do?
Guest:She was working at a staffing agency up in the valley, like in Woodland Hills.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And she just wanted to be back home.
Guest:We got married in 04.
Guest:So in 04, at the wedding, I saw the writing.
Guest:All the friends were like, when are you guys coming back?
Guest:We can't wait till you come back.
Guest:Everyone was saying that.
Guest:And I'm like, uh-oh, this isn't going to be good.
Marc:When's Justin going to grow up?
Guest:Yeah, when's he going to give up?
Guest:Right, when's he going to give up on this comedy thing?
Marc:That's funny, the fine line between grow up and give up.
Marc:That's a funny, I never really thought of that.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:When is he going to grow up and when do we even give up?
Guest:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's interesting.
Marc:So, okay, when did you give up?
Marc:I mean, grow up.
Guest:So, by this time, it was like 05, 06.
Guest:We were looking at property.
Guest:It was so expensive here that we finally went back in 06 and bought a house.
Guest:And you know what the irony, the sad, sick irony was?
Marc:Another sad.
Guest:sad sick irony yes the the i know it's horrible the the the house i bought in new hampshire yeah was the same price that i could have bought the one i lived in in astoria queens yeah but you got it was it i know i i'm awful i so i i went i didn't go to therapist until i was in 2010 11 i'm actually doing better now mark than i was just even two months but were you just yeah
Guest:I am.
Marc:But were you just a cauldron of resentment and self-pity?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So your wife wants to go back.
Marc:You realize you can't talk her out of it with anything on paper.
Marc:You say, I guess I can do the road gigs from there.
Marc:It doesn't matter where I am because I'm on the road all the time, right?
Marc:That was her defense, sure.
Guest:It's like, if you're going to be gone all the time, I want to be there.
Guest:And it kind of made sense.
Guest:But in my mind, I'm thinking, well, then I'm never out of the game.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I moved back in 06.
Guest:And I got to tell you, the first three or four years were good.
Guest:And the fact I had a lot of stuff that I parlayed.
Guest:I got a half hour Comedy Central special while living there.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I got a one hour.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I did the blue collar tour next gen.
Guest:I was chosen for that.
Guest:And I had a deal with Comedy Central.
Guest:Who else was on that?
Guest:That was Bill Engvall hosted it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then it was Reno Collier.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:John Caparulo.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Jamie Kaler and myself.
Guest:What's Caparulo up to?
Guest:I used to see him all the time.
Guest:You know, I was just in Vegas and he's got a residency there, I guess.
Guest:Oh, he does?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Actually, I did a Showtime special with him with Rob Gronkowski like a year and a half ago.
Guest:He was on that.
Guest:He was picked to do that.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I just saw him.
Marc:Oh, so he's out there doing it.
Marc:A year and a half ago, yeah.
Marc:You never know what guys are up to, but there's so much to do.
Marc:All right, so you get that.
Marc:So it's a good few years, and you're living in New Hampshire.
Marc:You have a kid.
Guest:Yeah, first kid in 07.
Guest:Right away, we got back 06, 07, first kid.
Marc:Your dad got sober.
Marc:Things are different there.
Guest:Hadn't been sober yet because that was 07.
Guest:So it's been, yeah, just shortly after that.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:Like 09 or something.
Guest:So that's good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So I got the wife, got the kids.
Guest:You know, I had a few.
Guest:Oh, I shot a show.
Guest:About a volunteer fire department that Dennis Leary Apostle saw.
Guest:Serpico?
Guest:Serpico, the same time- He did my show, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, so the same time that was on, we sold this one to IFC.
Guest:So that was all done from New Hampshire.
Guest:So part of what I'm trying to do is stay in the game and stay relevant back there, right?
Guest:So the last few years, I've been out here pitching with different people and trying to sell shows.
Guest:I mean, I've got something now that I'm working on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:trying to stay relevant out here has been the challenge but that uh it didn't end up getting picked up but it's like i wrote that pilot so i've had some stuff happen but the as every year goes by it feels like you're further and further away that's why to be getting old i'm getting old and that's why i mean to do we all are dude to do your podcast is great for me i'm being completely honest it's relevant i because i'm looking at the i'm like if i was out here i'd be doing these podcasts and i'd be you know you know everybody's scrambling dude everyone's scrambling yeah
Marc:But, I mean, you're still doing a lot of comedy.
Marc:You still do all right up there?
Marc:You turn over an hour every year?
Marc:What's your process?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's the process that stresses me out is the whole, in order to make decent money, you got to do the theaters.
Guest:Right.
Guest:In order to do the theaters, you got to turn over the material.
Guest:You can't do the same stuff.
Guest:That whole thing, someone will come see you twice, but if it's the same stuff, they're not going to see you a third time.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So that's been the battle.
Guest:So the battle is there's not places to get on and work during the week.
Guest:There's no scene.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I got an open mic I do every Tuesday.
Guest:I try to do seven, eight minutes, hope that two or three of those minutes make it into the weekend.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And then I just try to build my year that way.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it doesn't feel sustainable.
Guest:Right.
Guest:It does not feel sustainable.
Guest:I just did the Rochester Opera House a few months ago, and the show couldn't have gone better from my end.
Guest:And after it, I looked bummed out, I guess.
Guest:And the guy opens for me, my good friend Jeff, was like, what's wrong, Wayne?
Guest:You look bummed out.
Guest:And I literally, I said to him, I go...
Guest:what am I going to do next year?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like I finally got this stuff to where it needed to be, where it was all working.
Guest:And now it's like, I've got to, I can't do, you know, a new, I come up with a new closer.
Guest:I mean, it's, you know, the work that goes into it.
Marc:No, I know, but why?
Marc:Just because of that one gig or you just played it out?
Guest:Can't you tour it?
Guest:I do these same theaters every year.
Guest:Same time of year.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So as I do one, now I'm already building for the next time I come back around in next March and do that venue again.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm hoping to have.
Guest:And it's not all new.
Guest:You know what?
Guest:I'm starting to do something now where I'm going to start doing old stuff like at the end.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just because I can't do it.
Guest:I can't.
Marc:Yeah, you need about a year and a half, really.
Marc:You can't turn it over in less than a year.
Guest:It's hard.
Guest:And you feel bad.
Guest:People come out, and it's not ready.
Guest:It's the worst feeling.
Guest:It's not ready.
Guest:It's half-baked.
Guest:I hate that feeling.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So that's kind of the struggle and what stresses me out now is I can't sustain this.
Guest:What am I going to do?
Guest:So that's it.
Marc:Yeah?
Marc:But you're okay?
Marc:Family's good?
Yeah.
Guest:Kids are like, yeah, kids and wife.
Guest:And it's like the family's great.
Guest:She works.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:She has to work.
Guest:I mean, that's, you know.
Guest:But it's okay.
Guest:Health insurance.
Guest:Yeah, it's okay.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, she'd like to not work, but so would I. It's nice up there though, right?
Guest:Yeah, it's nice and it's a great place to have a family.
Guest:And it's, you know, it's...
Guest:Once my kids were born, I even stopped doing Vegas because it was the seven nights.
Guest:I don't really do.
Guest:I'm home 90% of the time now.
Guest:I'm trying not to do so many Wednesday to Sundays because you leave on the Wednesday, you're back on the Monday.
Guest:My kids are at that age where it's- You don't want to miss it.
Guest:I don't want to miss it.
Marc:But that's where you can generate the new shit though.
Guest:Yep.
Guest:That's the problem.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So that's the battle.
Guest:It's like, you're on, you miss this.
Guest:Every week there's something at school you miss.
Guest:Oh, it's a play.
Guest:It's a, you know, it's a this.
Marc:Gotta make your choice.
Guest:Yeah, it's a this presentation or the science fair or we're gonna see, you know what I mean?
Guest:And it's like, it's just.
Marc:But like you're saying about all these guys, you know, like, cause I recently talked to Bill Janowitz from Buffalo Tom, the band.
Marc:And I don't like it.
Marc:You know, I've sort of like changed my my thinking on that.
Marc:I don't know what my skill set really is.
Marc:And I sort of lucked out with some persistence and good cosmic timing.
Marc:But it seems like, you know, if you can live with it, there there is a way to find another life, you know, that either supplement or do.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Have you thought about applying your skill set to something else alongside of the comedy?
Marc:Or is that just too much of a fucking ego buster?
Guest:It is a little bit.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, there is some of that, right?
Guest:It's like, what do we want to do?
Guest:Like, even selling merch.
Guest:Like, I hate... I sold onesies, like, years ago, a couple weeks.
Guest:I'm like, what am I doing?
Marc:I can't do it.
Guest:I can't do it.
Guest:I don't want to stand there.
Marc:I used to.
Marc:Just boxes of shit.
Marc:You're traveling with three boxes of shirts.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:And stickers.
Marc:But that's... Right after the last set, you run out there.
Marc:Hey!
Yeah.
Guest:And then they feel awkward if they don't buy and they walk by you.
Guest:But that's... When you say supplemental income, that could make a difference.
Guest:That's... Oh, no.
Marc:You know what the best thing is?
Marc:Posters are good because they're easy.
Marc:They're easy to travel with.
Marc:You sign them.
Marc:20 bucks.
Guest:I'm afraid nobody would want one.
Guest:Just standing there.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Poster.
Guest:Poster.
Guest:Anybody?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But so have I thought of anything else?
Guest:I've thought of...
Guest:doing things in the speaking realm, you know, in that realm a little bit, you know.
Guest:So who knows if that'll happen.
Marc:Yeah, I mean, because it seems like, I mean, I tried to do some of that.
Marc:Yeah, I don't know if I'm the best candidate for it, but, you know, speak about, like, you know, how, you know, my journey, you know, but it's hard to be...
Marc:It's, you know, it's, it's hard to, you know, on both sides of it where, you know, I'm going to go up and tell them, you know, some sort of success story, but it was not planned, man.
Marc:It was not going, you know, there's no, I can't give you an A plus B equals your success.
Marc:No.
Marc:It's a fucking crapshoot.
Guest:Right.
Marc:And it's a shitty business.
Marc:And, you know, who the fuck knows what's going to happen?
Guest:In the back of your head.
Guest:That's what you're thinking.
Guest:You almost feel like.
Marc:I'll say it.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I'll say it.
Marc:It's like, you know, you guys can- Everyone can do podcasts, but don't bank on it.
Guest:Good luck.
Guest:Thank you.
Guest:What am I going to say?
Guest:Yeah, you feel a little bit like a fraud, right?
Marc:I won't do it, which is why I'm not getting the speaking engagements.
Marc:I can't do the fraud thing that well.
Marc:I try to be honest about it.
Guest:Well, with me, I was doing a drug and alcohol and motivational thing.
Guest:And part of while I'm doing that, I'm like-
Guest:I blew it.
Guest:I blew my, you know what I mean?
Guest:I don't feel like I should be here.
Guest:That was a little bit what I had.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Going on, yeah.
Guest:The underneath of it.
Marc:So you're working.
Marc:You're solvent.
Guest:I am.
Marc:You're above water.
Marc:Your dad's sober.
Marc:You got a good relationship with your family, your wife.
Marc:Yeah, but something's still stuck in there, huh?
Guest:I was about to say, you know what, Mark?
Guest:I never looked at it that way.
Guest:You should be grateful, you fuck.
Guest:I'm better.
Guest:I'm better today than I was.
Guest:I started, and I know you've talked about this, a meditation on your podcast.
Guest:Yeah, I haven't done it.
Guest:Have you done it?
Guest:You do it?
Guest:Not only have I done it, I can't recommend it more.
Guest:And I think you were talking with Letterman.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you were asking whether you should do it.
Guest:For me, where I was-
Guest:I wasn't sleeping.
Guest:Every hour on the hour, I was waking up.
Guest:I'm stressed.
Guest:Beating the shit out of yourself?
Guest:Beating the shit out of myself.
Guest:It's the stress.
Guest:All this stuff I'm telling you, you got to come up with this.
Guest:I can't do it.
Guest:I can't sustain it.
Guest:All of this stuff was just really killing me.
Guest:And I bumped into my buddy, this Boston comedian, Dan Crone.
Guest:I don't know if you know him.
Marc:I know him.
Marc:Yeah, he opened for me.
Guest:Oh, Dan Crone.
Guest:He's a great guy.
Guest:So he saw me one night and I think I looked like I had been hit by a truck or beat up.
Guest:I hadn't slept.
Guest:I told him and he said to me, he goes, you got to try TM.
Guest:And I go, and I've heard of it because Stern had talked about it for years.
Guest:And I'm like, oh, the meditation, Transcendental Meditation.
Guest:He goes, yeah.
Guest:He goes, changed my life.
Guest:He goes, it's 960 bucks.
Guest:He goes, I would have paid 10 times the money.
Guest:So for someone you know to say, you would pay 10 times the money.
Guest:He goes, I did it for insomnia.
Guest:It's helped my sleeping creatively.
Guest:So I went and did it just not even six weeks ago.
Guest:Six weeks ago, I went and did it.
Guest:I did the course four days in a row, 90 minutes a day over four days.
Guest:And I do it 20 minutes right when I wake up, 20 minutes in the afternoon.
Guest:Mark, I haven't needed a nap.
Guest:What it does is your brain gets in this state of rest where it does not get when you're sleeping.
Guest:Because your brain when you're sleeping is all firing on all cylinders.
Guest:So when you learn how to just shut it down completely, it's like charging your battery.
Guest:It's like a recharge.
Guest:So my energy, my mood, like everything, people, friends, family, my wife, all have noticed a difference in me.
Guest:Since I started doing this.
Guest:So for me, it just was the right thing.
Guest:And look, you don't get anything for it if you tell someone.
Guest:It's not like, hey, mention my name, they'll throw me $100.
Guest:Too bad.
Marc:You're selling me.
Guest:Well, I'm telling you, for me, it's just I won't live without it.
Marc:There's a lot of way to go with it.
Marc:You don't have to do TM, but there's a lot of ways to approach meditation, but it's just getting into that place.
Guest:The thing that TM is, which I didn't understand, it's nothing to do with your breathing.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Every app I have is breathing.
Guest:I've been meditating for years with the breathing.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:TM, you don't- He says angrily, the fucking breathing.
Marc:Enough with the breathing.
Guest:That's not right.
Guest:working enough breathing it's done nothing for me Mark so what this is is you it's your mind you think of this mantra in your mind and your breathing almost stops you know everything in your body metabolically goes way way way way down and eventually the mantra disappears and you have nothing and then a thought comes up that stress getting released and that's the thought and now you come back up to the circle top of the circle with the mantra you go back and you just keep doing that and you get better and better at getting to the spot where you're like oh my god this is it it feels amazing
Marc:So where the thoughts don't come.
Guest:Where there's no thought and there's no mantra and your brain is just shut down.
Guest:And you think it is so hard to do?
Guest:Do you think, oh, I can just shut my brain off.
Marc:You can't do it.
Marc:No, I know.
Marc:Well, fortunately for me, as I get older, I'm forgetting almost everything.
Marc:So I hope it's not Alzheimer's, but it's a little easier to quiet my brain down because it doesn't seem to give a shit about a lot of this stuff that I used to.
Marc:What are you doing in town?
Marc:Did you do anything but this?
No.
Guest:I actually was on my way out here for this other meeting, this other show.
Guest:And it actually fell apart.
Guest:It's turned into a conference call.
Guest:Yeah, it's turned into a conference call now.
Marc:You flew out for a meeting and now it's a conference call?
Marc:God damn, I don't fucking miss that thing.
Marc:Like when you come in from New York for auditions and shit.
Guest:I know, I know, I know.
Guest:But I'm happy to do it.
Guest:Trust me.
Marc:But do you meditate?
Guest:Oh, I meditate.
Guest:That's just it.
Guest:See, I'm a different person, Mark.
Guest:If I did this two months ago, I would be like, oh, it sucks.
Marc:Well, it's good to see you.
Guest:Thank you so much, man.
Marc:I'm glad that mentally you're doing okay.
Marc:You're doing better.
Marc:I'm happy that your dad's sober.
Marc:That's a hell of a story.
Guest:Yeah, it is.
Guest:And I always thought, Mark, that you always think you want your parents to be proud of you, but I think what I really wanted was to be proud of my dad.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And I think that's what I've realized in life, and it's like I couldn't be prouder of him.
Guest:Oh, man.
Guest:That's great.
Guest:Got a happy ending.
Marc:All right.
Marc:Thanks, man.
Guest:Thanks, Mark.
Marc:Wild story, right?
Marc:Right?
Marc:I remember when, like, those outros coming out of an interview where I'm clearly back where we started.
Marc:I was so worried about the transition, and I wanted to fool you guys like it was seamless, like the guy just left.
Marc:And at some point, I'm like, they're not.
Marc:It doesn't matter.
Marc:Justin McKinney, the new special Parentally Challenged on Amazon Prime, iTunes.
Marc:You can go to JustinMcKinney.com.
Marc:Great story, though, right?
Marc:You know what this is?
Marc:That's the sound of my mustache coming back.
Marc:I'm rubbing the beginning of a mustache on the mic.
Marc:It's coming back, people.
Marc:It's coming back.
Marc:The stache is coming back.
Marc:Sort of trust.com.
Marc:And, uh,
Marc:wtfpod.com slash tour and now i'm going to play at first two chords and then i'm going to add a chord and then maybe one other chord and it's going to have an echo on it and then i'm going to stop playing guitar
Guest:Boomer lives!