Episode 1010 - Christina Hendricks

Episode 1010 • Released April 15, 2019 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Marc:all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fuck nicks what's happening it's mark maron this is wtf my podcast i'm back i'm back in my house i'm back in the uh temporary studio upstairs down the

00:00:26Marc:With not quite a severe case of jet lag, but it's happening.

00:00:31Marc:It's about to happen.

00:00:32Marc:I think it's about to happen.

00:00:33Marc:I think part of me thinks that we should be sleeping right now when I'm recording this in the middle of the afternoon.

00:00:39Marc:Part of me is asleep.

00:00:40Marc:I don't even fucking know if this is a dream or not, to be honest with you.

00:00:43Marc:That's where I'm at.

00:00:44Marc:It seems to be happening a lot lately on either side of this journey.

00:00:47Marc:I think I checked in with you when I got to London and I wasn't sure whether I was dreaming.

00:00:53Marc:But I know I was in Dublin yesterday morning and I know I'm in Los Angeles right now.

00:00:58Marc:Oh, by the way, to continue the narrative for some of you asking the question before I forget, I did not eat the pastries.

00:01:05Marc:I did not eat them.

00:01:07Marc:I got them out of the room.

00:01:08Marc:If you don't know what I'm talking about, catch up.

00:01:11Marc:Today, Christina Hendricks is on the show.

00:01:15Marc:You might know her from a lot of things.

00:01:17Marc:Mad Men was a big thing.

00:01:19Marc:But she's on that show, that series, Good Girls.

00:01:23Marc:It just got picked up for a third season.

00:01:25Marc:And new episodes air Sunday nights at 10, 9 central on NBC.

00:01:30Marc:She's going to talk to me for a while.

00:01:32Marc:Oh, I remember what I was going to say.

00:01:35Marc:For those of you who were like, enough with the tour dates.

00:01:38Marc:uh go fuck yourself is that too harsh i apologize i know there's kids in the car sorry you guys sorry mommy didn't see that coming i um look it's the only way i mean i've got to tell you no one listens to anything consistently nobody checks their twitter consistently things get lost in the feed i just posted a a fucking video on uh instagram which i don't like doing and my phone's fucked up so it's got a buzz to it but it's it's the only way to promote

00:02:06Marc:I don't have some sort of strange kind of natural cultural momentum where right when I announce something, it sells out because somehow or another people just breathe in the information.

00:02:19Marc:I have to make an effort.

00:02:20Marc:And there's some dates that added that I added that a lot of people don't know.

00:02:24Marc:So I got to say it a few times.

00:02:25Marc:I don't know who I'm yelling at exactly, but it might be you.

00:02:29Marc:So up on the site at WTF pod dot com slash tour.

00:02:34Marc:These are the theater dates.

00:02:36Marc:All right.

00:02:36Marc:There's some club dates coming up.

00:02:38Marc:Like I'm in San Diego this weekend.

00:02:41Marc:I don't know if it sold out.

00:02:42Marc:I should know, but I don't.

00:02:44Marc:Thursday, Friday, Saturday at the American Comedy Club.

00:02:47Marc:So here are the theater dates coming up.

00:02:49Marc:Portland, Dallas.

00:02:50Marc:That's Portland, Oregon, Dallas, Texas, not Dallas, Maine.

00:02:54Marc:Austin, Houston, Vancouver, Seattle, Chicago, Detroit, Minneapolis, Philadelphia, Washington, DC, Boston, Nashville, Atlanta, San Francisco, and I will be adding a Toronto date.

00:03:08Marc:Now, the club dates coming up are Vermont sold out, St.

00:03:12Marc:Louis, San Diego this weekend, Madison sold out.

00:03:17Marc:But all I'm doing is if any of these seem possible to you or things that you might want to do, go to WTFPod.com slash tour and investigate if you can come.

00:03:30Marc:I'm not doing this for me.

00:03:32Marc:I'm doing it for everybody who tweets at me or sends me an email after I've announced this shit a hundred times saying like, Hey man, I had no idea you were going to be here.

00:03:44Marc:It's for the, it's for them.

00:03:45Marc:All right.

00:03:47Marc:All right.

00:03:48Marc:So I love fucking Ireland, man.

00:03:50Marc:I fucking love Ireland.

00:03:53Marc:fucking ireland i love it that's three different ways to use the word fucking in a uh compliment about ireland if that was part of the quiz can you use fucking in three different sentences uh complimenting ireland i did that i did that next question next question i uh okay i didn't tell you the story about my first day in ireland when i arrived there

00:04:18Marc:I think I've talked to you since the show, haven't I?

00:04:21Marc:What did I say?

00:04:21Marc:My name?

00:04:23Marc:Maybe I haven't.

00:04:24Marc:So I haven't talked to you since the show?

00:04:26Marc:Huh.

00:04:28Marc:It was fucking great.

00:04:29Marc:At Vicar Street, it was great.

00:04:31Marc:There's something about Ireland that I still love.

00:04:34Marc:I love the Irish people.

00:04:36Marc:And I'm not even being sarcastic.

00:04:39Marc:There's some sort of kindred, beautiful, you know, multi-generational, centuries-old heartache to Ireland.

00:04:49Marc:I mean, the Irish have been let down and left hung out to dry and sort of...

00:04:56Marc:misgoverned by several different institutions over the many years they've been around.

00:05:03Marc:And there's just a weight to it.

00:05:06Marc:There's a darkness, but it's beautiful.

00:05:08Marc:The darkness is there's a counterbalance, man.

00:05:11Marc:I went to Glendalough, me and Jimmy,

00:05:14Marc:rented a car, and we drove.

00:05:18Marc:It's great, man.

00:05:19Marc:If you've got old friends that you haven't seen in a while, just make sure you see them, all right?

00:05:24Marc:Jimmy and I, we don't see each other enough.

00:05:25Marc:It was coincidental that he was in Ireland, and it was just great.

00:05:30Marc:You know, we see each other, each other, maybe once a year, once every two years.

00:05:35Marc:And he's just one of those friends that you drop right into it.

00:05:38Marc:Not a lot of distance between us, who we are.

00:05:43Marc:And it's like no time has passed.

00:05:46Marc:There's a consistency to that.

00:05:48Marc:Thank God for it.

00:05:49Marc:But so he rented a car and we just drove up.

00:05:52Marc:He drove because I wasn't going to deal with that wrong side.

00:05:54Marc:And I don't want to make a moral judgment.

00:05:56Marc:The other side of the street thing, because I just I don't know.

00:06:00Marc:I don't think I was in the had the vigilance necessary.

00:06:02Marc:But we drove about an hour outside of Dublin to Glendalough.

00:06:06Marc:And it was beautiful, man.

00:06:07Marc:There's a graveyard there.

00:06:09Marc:There's an old building.

00:06:10Marc:I didn't get the history.

00:06:12Marc:I didn't, I wasn't in, I was just talking to Jim, spending some time with my friends.

00:06:16Marc:It was a beautiful day, which I hear is rare.

00:06:18Marc:And we took a big long walk and there were sheep and hills and a bog, a bog.

00:06:25Marc:There's a bog.

00:06:26Marc:See, that's the thing is Ireland is by far one of the most beautiful places you can ever go.

00:06:33Marc:Yet there's this darkness to the people.

00:06:36Marc:There's this counterbalance.

00:06:38Marc:It's like walk outside.

00:06:40Marc:Almost everywhere is stunning in an old-timey, beautiful, rustic way.

00:06:46Marc:Even the modern cities have elements of that.

00:06:49Marc:But yet there's this brooding.

00:06:52Marc:It comes up from the bog.

00:06:55Marc:I can't do an Irish accent.

00:06:58Marc:Maybe I can.

00:06:59Marc:What are you doing in Ireland?

00:07:02Marc:That's what the customs guy said to me.

00:07:05Marc:When I got there, the customs guy.

00:07:08Marc:What are you doing in Ireland?

00:07:10Marc:I'm performing at Vicar Street.

00:07:13Marc:Looks at my passport.

00:07:14Marc:I've never heard of you.

00:07:17Marc:That's fine.

00:07:18Marc:Bonk.

00:07:19Marc:Stamps the passport.

00:07:21Marc:That was it.

00:07:22Marc:Welcome.

00:07:23Marc:Welcome to Ireland.

00:07:24Marc:But there is this.

00:07:25Marc:There's something about my heart that connects to the people there.

00:07:29Marc:They're not going to.

00:07:30Marc:It's just they'll take you down a notch just innately because they live there.

00:07:36Marc:And they have forever, and it's part of their perception, their life, the lives of their grandparents.

00:07:42Marc:Though it's very progressive there now, but there's still that element.

00:07:46Marc:Don't look for compliments in Ireland.

00:07:48Marc:Where's that T-shirt?

00:07:50Marc:Huh?

00:07:51Marc:But Glendalough was beautiful.

00:07:53Marc:Had amazing food in Ireland.

00:07:56Marc:I just don't understand on some level how there is that.

00:08:00Marc:I guess it is the balance.

00:08:01Marc:I guess if it wasn't so beautiful and it wasn't so...

00:08:05Marc:Sort of comforting and grounding and just that if it wasn't that they'd be an incredibly existentially dark people.

00:08:13Marc:But there's just a balance has something to do with the bogs, the bogs against the stunning green, the bog people.

00:08:24Marc:They found mummies perfectly preserved in the bogs.

00:08:30Marc:The darkness is in the bogs of the spirit of the heart, the bogs of the mind, the spiritual bogs of the heart.

00:08:38Marc:Had some amazing food.

00:08:40Marc:I ate at a place called The Winding Stair, which was genius.

00:08:46Marc:I ate at a place called The Pig's Ear in Dublin, which was fucking amazing.

00:08:51Marc:I ate at a place called Eli's Wine Bar, which was great.

00:08:55Marc:The fucking produce, the fish, the meat, everything about the stuff there was just great.

00:09:02Marc:Yeah, I had great food in England, too.

00:09:03Marc:I think times have changed.

00:09:05Marc:They've come around.

00:09:06Marc:They realize, like, we're sitting on a gold mine of really clean food here, and we should use it to our advantage and send a few of our guys out and let them learn how to cook in an amazing way and then come back and then honor the cuisine of our forefathers in an updated, beautiful way.

00:09:27Marc:They do it.

00:09:28Marc:I didn't eat the pastries.

00:09:31Marc:Oh, so the show at Vicar Street went great.

00:09:34Marc:I had a woman open for me, Emma Doran, and she was great.

00:09:40Marc:And the people at Vicar Street were great.

00:09:42Marc:The crowd was great.

00:09:45Marc:I just, I feel, I just felt totally, like, comfortable.

00:09:50Marc:Like, I was barely, like, I was barely doing stand-up comedy, Mark.

00:09:58Marc:Oh, pow!

00:10:00Pow!

00:10:01Marc:I'm drinking tea.

00:10:02Marc:I'm drinking this high-end Assam tea.

00:10:08Marc:Harare golden tips or something.

00:10:11Marc:Spent some bread on it.

00:10:13Marc:Maybe that's why I'm loopy.

00:10:16Marc:Okay, it's almost time to wake up for me.

00:10:18Marc:This dream has been interesting.

00:10:20Marc:Like in this dream, what happens next is I talk to Christina Hendricks.

00:10:26Marc:Isn't that weird?

00:10:27Marc:I know it's going to happen in my dream.

00:10:29Marc:I know it is.

00:10:30Marc:How do I keep losing the copy for this show?

00:10:35Marc:Come on.

00:10:36Marc:How does it keep getting under there?

00:10:37Marc:So Christina is in a new series.

00:10:40Marc:It's not that new.

00:10:40Marc:It's been around for what?

00:10:42Marc:Two seasons.

00:10:43Marc:Good Girls.

00:10:45Marc:It's on NBC.

00:10:46Marc:Sunday nights at 10, 9 central.

00:10:48Marc:And there's new episodes up.

00:10:50Marc:So this is me talking to Christina Hendricks.

00:10:58Marc:So what have you been running around doing the thing?

00:11:03Guest:Yeah, I've been doing a little bit of the thing.

00:11:05Marc:Yeah?

00:11:05Marc:Were you out today?

00:11:07Guest:I'm out today.

00:11:07Guest:I've got a couple things today.

00:11:09Guest:Went to New York last week.

00:11:10Guest:Really?

00:11:10Guest:Yeah.

00:11:11Marc:Did you live in New York ever?

00:11:13No.

00:11:13Guest:I lived there when I was 19.

00:11:16Guest:I moved there and I lived there for almost three years.

00:11:19Guest:And now I kind of go back and forth because my husband's show shoots there.

00:11:22Marc:Which show?

00:11:23Guest:Madam Secretary.

00:11:25Marc:Oh, but you weren't you didn't.

00:11:26Marc:So where do you come from?

00:11:28Guest:Grew up in Idaho.

00:11:30Marc:Idaho?

00:11:31Guest:And Virginia and Oregon.

00:11:33Guest:You're like, wait, back it up.

00:11:34Guest:No one says Idaho and gets away with it.

00:11:36Guest:Well, kind of.

00:11:37Marc:I mean, I have such a weird kind of mixed, probably bad instinct about Idaho.

00:11:45Guest:What is your instinct?

00:11:46Marc:Well, that there's some like horrible white people in Idaho in terms of, well, literally, I think there are some like white nationalist movements stationed up there.

00:11:55Marc:And there's also but there's also the large TM community I know is in Idaho.

00:11:59Marc:But I also know it's beautiful.

00:12:01Marc:But I know that it's it attracts off the grid whack jobs.

00:12:04Guest:It is absolutely beautiful.

00:12:06Guest:It's a very large state.

00:12:08Guest:Yeah.

00:12:08Guest:So you're going to get a lot of different things.

00:12:10Guest:Yeah.

00:12:10Guest:The white supremacist situation you're talking about.

00:12:12Guest:Yeah.

00:12:13Guest:I know up north in Idaho for a long time there was a thing going on.

00:12:17Guest:I commented it.

00:12:18Guest:This is a funny story.

00:12:20Guest:Yeah.

00:12:20Guest:Years and years ago I did a few episodes of VR.

00:12:23Guest:Yeah.

00:12:24Guest:And in my interview when I just went to meet them and hang out.

00:12:27Guest:Yeah.

00:12:28Guest:They asked me where I was from.

00:12:29Guest:And I said, I'm from Idaho.

00:12:32Guest:I said, the Mormon part, not the white supremacist part.

00:12:36Guest:And they changed and they used the line on ER.

00:12:39Guest:They kind of like stole it.

00:12:40Guest:But they said, I can't remember what they said, but it wasn't the Mormon part.

00:12:46Guest:It was the something part, not the white supremacist.

00:12:48Guest:And they got so many letters.

00:12:50Marc:Oh, really?

00:12:51Guest:At ER.

00:12:52Guest:Yeah.

00:12:52Marc:From regular Idahoans?

00:12:53Guest:Yeah, that were like very, very defensive about this.

00:12:56Guest:So I don't have the facts, guys.

00:12:59Marc:Yeah, but you got a feeling.

00:13:01Guest:But the rumor is that I have no facts.

00:13:05Marc:There's some bad news in northern Idaho.

00:13:07Guest:And people are, you know, protective of it because it is a beautiful place to live.

00:13:11Guest:And there are amazing places like Boise.

00:13:13Guest:And it is, you know, I lived right on the Snake River Canyon.

00:13:16Guest:Oh, wow.

00:13:16Guest:Pretty gorgeous.

00:13:17Marc:So why there?

00:13:19Yeah.

00:13:19Guest:My dad was in forestry.

00:13:21Marc:What does that mean?

00:13:23Marc:Is there a title?

00:13:25Marc:Forest scientist?

00:13:26Marc:Forestry?

00:13:27Guest:He was in forest planning.

00:13:29Marc:Oh.

00:13:30Guest:So by the end of his career, when we were in D.C., he would...

00:13:34Guest:It was international forest planning.

00:13:36Guest:So meet with people from other countries, best way that they had found to preserve things, sharing ideas with other countries, working together to, you know, make it as good as possible.

00:13:48Marc:As good as possible and maybe not burn down that kind of stuff.

00:13:51Marc:Engineering.

00:13:52Guest:Yeah, discussing all that stuff.

00:13:54Guest:Peer cutting is controversial, but, you know, going through, like, just, you know, whatever, someone's got an idea that's working.

00:14:01Marc:He's a forest specialist.

00:14:02Guest:Yeah.

00:14:02Marc:And he worked for the government?

00:14:06Guest:Yeah, U.S.

00:14:07Guest:Forest Service.

00:14:07Marc:That seems exciting somehow.

00:14:09Guest:He loved it.

00:14:10Guest:He absolutely loved it.

00:14:11Guest:Very passionate about it.

00:14:12Marc:Seems like a great job.

00:14:13Marc:What are you doing?

00:14:14Marc:Going outside?

00:14:15Guest:Yeah.

00:14:16Guest:I mean, at the end, he didn't get to go outside.

00:14:17Guest:He was in an office.

00:14:18Guest:But he did start out as a forest ranger.

00:14:20Marc:Oh, with the hat?

00:14:21Guest:With the hat.

00:14:23Guest:Sometimes he would dress as Smokey the Bear like on when we had like school.

00:14:27Guest:Look at my shirt.

00:14:29Guest:Like, oh my God, you're wearing Smokey the Bear.

00:14:31Guest:I mean, that is actually really coincidental.

00:14:33Guest:I'll say.

00:14:34Guest:Yeah.

00:14:34Marc:Yeah.

00:14:35Marc:Your dad was Smokey the Bear and I'm wearing a shirt.

00:14:37Guest:He would come in the suit.

00:14:38Guest:I remember once he came to our school, we were having like a school fair.

00:14:41Marc:Yeah.

00:14:42Guest:And these crappy little kids came up behind him because you're in a bear suit you can't see and tried to light him on fire.

00:14:50Marc:Oh, that would be ironic.

00:14:52Marc:Yeah.

00:14:53Guest:Jerky kids.

00:14:54Marc:Yeah, it's pretty jerky, but I mean, but it's pretty specific.

00:14:58Guest:Yeah.

00:14:58Marc:Let's see if we can burn smoky.

00:14:59Guest:Yeah.

00:15:00Marc:Yeah.

00:15:01Marc:Clever in some horrible way.

00:15:02Guest:Yeah, in some horrible way.

00:15:03Marc:But did you, so were you like a camping family?

00:15:06Marc:How many people in your family?

00:15:07Guest:Camping family, my brother and I and my parents.

00:15:10Marc:Tents.

00:15:11Guest:Tense, militant camping, whether you like it or not camping.

00:15:16Marc:Oh, so it was like that.

00:15:17Marc:Some families have the skiing thing where it's like, come on, we're all going.

00:15:20Marc:But you were like, get ready.

00:15:22Marc:It's like 5.30 in the morning.

00:15:23Guest:5.30 in the morning, rain or shine.

00:15:25Marc:Hike.

00:15:26Guest:I still kind of, when my alarm goes off and it's dark outside, which, you know.

00:15:30Guest:Package.

00:15:31Guest:We have to go to work sometimes so early and it's still dark out.

00:15:34Guest:I still get the convulsions.

00:15:35Guest:I have to pack up the VW van with the tuna sandwiches and have Danish.

00:15:40Guest:Where are my boots?

00:15:41Guest:Yeah, still traumatized.

00:15:44Guest:I'm like, I'm in the middle seat.

00:15:45Guest:I get the middle seat.

00:15:47Marc:Yeah, that panic of packing that shit, right?

00:15:50Guest:Awful.

00:15:50Marc:Do you have your shovel?

00:15:51Marc:What?

00:15:52Guest:Yeah.

00:15:53Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:15:53Guest:We weren't allowed to stop for food or anything like that because it was too expensive, so we would pack a cooler...

00:16:00Guest:And because I was the younger kid, it went like in between the front seat.

00:16:04Guest:Anyone who knows the Volkswagen Vans, like it goes in the middle one.

00:16:07Guest:So I was the middle kid.

00:16:08Guest:So I never had a really a place for my feet.

00:16:10Marc:So I had to like the torture.

00:16:11Guest:Yeah.

00:16:12Guest:And we had no radio.

00:16:13Guest:So we had to I like would sing drive my parents crazy.

00:16:17Marc:Well, maybe that was the beginning of everything.

00:16:19Guest:It was the beginning of something.

00:16:23Marc:Was it the van that had the pop-up top?

00:16:26Marc:No.

00:16:26Guest:I think that's the Vanagon, possibly.

00:16:29Guest:This was the classic VW bus, the good old hippie bus that you imagine in your head.

00:16:34Marc:And you all swept in that or you had tents?

00:16:36Guest:We had tents.

00:16:37Guest:Oh, good.

00:16:38Guest:If the conditions were really bad or if there were bears or something, we would go and sleep in the van.

00:16:44Guest:But no, we had tents.

00:16:46Guest:We'd all sleep in the big tent as a Hendricks family.

00:16:48Marc:Wow.

00:16:49Marc:A lot of togetherness.

00:16:51Guest:Yeah.

00:16:51Marc:Were there bears?

00:16:52Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:16:53Guest:Oftentimes bears.

00:16:54Marc:Yeah, I've not had any bear experience.

00:16:57Marc:I've had skunk, possum, coyote.

00:16:59Guest:And that's just here at your house in L.A.

00:17:01Guest:Yeah, exactly.

00:17:03Guest:You don't have to go camping for that.

00:17:04Marc:Nope, right here.

00:17:05Guest:Those dodgy deer that wander around L.A.

00:17:07Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:17:09Marc:Sometimes I go on the mountain here and you see them.

00:17:11Marc:They're mule deer, I think.

00:17:12Marc:I'm not sure what they are.

00:17:13Guest:They don't look healthy.

00:17:15Guest:They look like downtown deer.

00:17:18Marc:I know.

00:17:18Marc:And you barely ever see them.

00:17:20Marc:I know.

00:17:20Guest:And you're like, oh.

00:17:21Marc:What's the matter?

00:17:22Guest:Are you lost?

00:17:23Guest:Yeah.

00:17:23Guest:Why are you so?

00:17:24Guest:It looks like they're kind of strung out.

00:17:25Marc:Yeah.

00:17:26Marc:It's like when you see coyotes during the day, you're like, that's not good.

00:17:29Guest:That can't be good.

00:17:29Marc:That guy looks shitty.

00:17:30Guest:Yeah.

00:17:30Guest:He'll do anything.

00:17:31Marc:Exactly.

00:17:32Marc:That desperate guy.

00:17:34Marc:So, okay.

00:17:35Marc:So you do Idaho and then you do DC and then where else?

00:17:37Marc:uh well born in tennessee then brief briefly in in georgia uh elementary school in portland oregon oh that's nice then to idaho then to fairfax virginia portland like but that portland that's a lot of moving around yeah so you're like one of those weird kids who like would show up at school and they'd be like oh who's this

00:17:58Guest:Yeah, you were the kid with the weird fashion because it was cool in the last place, but when you got to Idaho and I was wearing the checkered van hat with the checkered van shoes and the fluorescent socks with the lace socks over it, they were like, we don't do that here.

00:18:14Marc:Yeah, where's your farm outfit?

00:18:15Guest:yeah they were like we don't do that here you're like the only one adjust oh no yeah first day of school you're like i'll show them and they use different like words than you know like i remember when i first moved to idaho i i've told this to other people no one's heard of this at all they called someone a beak a beak like a bird beak like if someone was a nerd or not cool they were like what a beak

00:18:38Marc:Pretty innocuous.

00:18:39Marc:Not horrible.

00:18:40Guest:I still don't know what it means.

00:18:41Marc:Well, that's probably better off.

00:18:43Marc:I mean, if you're using a slang that no one really can identify.

00:18:46Guest:Everyone knew in Twin Falls.

00:18:48Marc:I know.

00:18:48Marc:Fuck them.

00:18:51Marc:But you went there after Portland?

00:18:53Guest:I went there after Portland.

00:18:54Marc:Do you have a family in Tennessee?

00:18:56Marc:I like Tennessee.

00:18:57Yeah.

00:18:57Guest:I moved when I was about two months old, and I don't know it, but I have a fabulous uncle there who keeps trying to get me.

00:19:05Marc:You won't go?

00:19:06Guest:Well, he's invited me so many times, and just because of work, I haven't been able to, but I would like to go back and spend some time.

00:19:12Marc:What part?

00:19:13Guest:Outside of Knoxville.

00:19:14Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:19:14Guest:I was born in Knoxville.

00:19:17Marc:Again, I need to spend more time in Idaho.

00:19:19Marc:Maybe I'll change my attitude about it.

00:19:22Guest:It might.

00:19:22Marc:I go to the South.

00:19:24Marc:For years, I was like, the South.

00:19:25Marc:And now I'm like, it's the most beautiful place.

00:19:28Marc:Nice people.

00:19:29Marc:I don't know what they're really thinking, but they're nice right to your face.

00:19:32Guest:There are tons of nice people in Twin Falls, Idaho.

00:19:36Guest:And it is a lovely place.

00:19:38Marc:You're acting like I keep writing this like, no, Idaho.

00:19:41Guest:You're like, I don't believe in that for a second.

00:19:44Guest:Well, I feel very, very close to it because it's where I started doing theater as a child.

00:19:49Guest:And I was in something called Junior Musical Playhouse Jump Company.

00:19:52Marc:So you go there age like in third grade or fourth grade?

00:19:55Guest:I was in the middle of third grade.

00:19:57Marc:OK.

00:19:58Marc:And so that most of your formative years.

00:20:01Guest:Yeah.

00:20:02Marc:So you started doing like it plays as a kid.

00:20:04Guest:Yeah.

00:20:05Guest:My mom wanted us to do something that would help us make friends that wasn't just at school because of the cliques of school.

00:20:12Marc:Yeah.

00:20:13Marc:The horrible girls.

00:20:14Guest:Yeah.

00:20:14Guest:And my mom had always done theater in high school and college.

00:20:19Guest:And I think it's something she would have really liked to have pursued.

00:20:22Guest:And she did a few community plays when she was our mom.

00:20:26Marc:Right.

00:20:27Marc:Yeah.

00:20:27Guest:Oh, that's fun.

00:20:28Marc:So you go see your mom in the film?

00:20:29Guest:Yeah, I remember.

00:20:29Guest:I was really young, but I remember her.

00:20:31Guest:I think she had to kiss someone on stage, and she was in a costume, and it was kind of blowing my mind.

00:20:35Guest:Oh, right.

00:20:36Guest:I was like, this is not my mother.

00:20:37Guest:What is she doing?

00:20:38Marc:And that's what ended your parents' marriage.

00:20:40Guest:Yeah, it was that play.

00:20:42Guest:No, I'm sure it started before then.

00:20:44Marc:Oh, they didn't make it?

00:20:46Guest:They didn't make it.

00:20:47Guest:No, they didn't make it.

00:20:49Guest:I'm sure it was more the camping than the play.

00:20:53Yeah.

00:20:53Guest:To be honest.

00:20:55Guest:They would both agree, by the way.

00:20:57Marc:I want a city.

00:20:58Guest:She was like, I never want to camp again.

00:21:03Guest:So yeah, so I felt very fond of that place because I was very happy there.

00:21:09Marc:Yeah, and when did you start doing the shows?

00:21:13Guest:I mean, I must have been nine years old or something.

00:21:17Guest:There was an audition to be in The Best Christmas Pageant Ever.

00:21:22Guest:Yeah.

00:21:22Guest:Do you know that book?

00:21:23Marc:I don't.

00:21:24Marc:I'm sorry I don't.

00:21:26Marc:I wish I did.

00:21:26Guest:The people who know it go, oh.

00:21:28Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:21:29Marc:Okay, wait.

00:21:29Guest:So it's about this.

00:21:32Guest:Do you know the book, The Best Christmas Pageant Ever?

00:21:34Marc:Oh.

00:21:35Marc:I know you.

00:21:35Guest:Yeah, you did that.

00:21:37Guest:It's a favorite.

00:21:38Guest:So they were doing that as a play.

00:21:40Guest:Yeah.

00:21:41Guest:And I don't know why we had to sing.

00:21:43Guest:They may just sing Christmas carols.

00:21:46Guest:Maybe I didn't sing on that one, but the second one we were doing Bye Bye Birdie.

00:21:51Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:21:51Guest:And I went in and I must have been 10 years old or something, and I sang You Are My Sunshine.

00:21:56Marc:Oh.

00:21:56Guest:And I got the part.

00:21:59Marc:Oh, good for you.

00:22:00Marc:I was in the chorus.

00:22:02Guest:Yeah.

00:22:02Marc:How big of a casting call was that?

00:22:03Marc:Who'd you knock out of the running?

00:22:05Marc:How many?

00:22:05Marc:Like 10 kids?

00:22:06Guest:Well, it's really funny.

00:22:07Guest:The girl, I wanted the part of Ursula, which is the quirky best friend.

00:22:13Guest:And Tana Studebaker got it.

00:22:16Guest:She was four years older than me, five years older than me, and I admired her so much.

00:22:20Guest:She was so beautiful and talented and cool.

00:22:23Guest:She wore, like, Birkenstocks and MC Hammer pants before, like, anyone was doing that.

00:22:27Marc:Was there a lot of people doing that?

00:22:28Guest:And you know what?

00:22:28Guest:She's coming to visit me next week.

00:22:30Marc:Get out of here.

00:22:31Guest:From Twin Falls.

00:22:32Marc:Someone you knew when you were nine?

00:22:33Guest:Yeah, that I admired my whole life.

00:22:36Guest:And we've remained friends.

00:22:37Guest:We sort of had a reconnection, and she's coming with her daughter to visit me next week.

00:22:40Marc:That's crazy.

00:22:41Marc:Full circle.

00:22:42Marc:And what business did she end up in?

00:22:45Guest:Um, she does teaching.

00:22:47Guest:She actually very, um, coincidentally, she now teaches jump company.

00:22:53Guest:She helps direct some of their variety shows and does choreography and, and direction for them.

00:23:00Guest:And, um, she's been a teacher in many different ways in twin falls, but she's still with the company.

00:23:05Marc:Yeah.

00:23:05Marc:That's nice.

00:23:06Marc:The same company with it.

00:23:07Marc:It's like a jump company is a company that did the shows.

00:23:10Guest:Yeah, it's really funny.

00:23:11Guest:That's crazy.

00:23:12Guest:I was shopping for a table at Jonathan Adler about a month ago.

00:23:18Guest:And this guy who worked there, McKay, if you're listening, so nice.

00:23:22Guest:And he was like, are you from Twin Falls, Idaho?

00:23:24Guest:And I was like, yeah.

00:23:26Guest:Thinking, and he goes, I was in Jump Company.

00:23:30Guest:So it's like, it's a real stepping stone.

00:23:34Guest:There were a lot of really talented kids in it.

00:23:36Guest:And a lot of them stayed in the arts.

00:23:38Yeah.

00:23:38Marc:A stepping stone to furniture sales?

00:23:41Guest:Well, to giving you confidence to get out if you want.

00:23:45Marc:And go to L.A.

00:23:45Marc:and give it a go.

00:23:46Guest:Yeah.

00:23:46Marc:I was just being a dick.

00:23:47Guest:Yeah, I know.

00:23:47Guest:You were being a dick.

00:23:50Guest:I'm like, it's so inspiring.

00:23:52Guest:God, you've got to dress me on the Idaho thing.

00:23:54Marc:No, I do.

00:23:56Marc:I think that people that come out of community theater or start that young and learn that thing, it seems like there's always a bunch of grownups that come up in it and want to keep it going that don't have big dreams but know it's good for the kids and it's good for the community.

00:24:11Guest:It was such a part of our community that we would do performances at the local college and the whole town would come out.

00:24:19Guest:And at the time, that town was about 30,000 people.

00:24:22Guest:I think it's probably doubled in size now.

00:24:24Guest:But we were big shots in that town.

00:24:27Guest:Then I moved to Virginia.

00:24:29Guest:And if you were in the theater department, you were not cool.

00:24:32Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:24:33Guest:So I went from like this really supportive community that was exciting if you were in Jump Company to going and being in the theater department in high school and everyone was like, I'm going to throw shit at your head and really tear you down.

00:24:47Marc:Yeah, nerd, beak.

00:24:49Guest:Yeah, that's the nicest way they would.

00:24:52Guest:I don't think they use words that nice.

00:24:54Marc:Not in Virginia.

00:24:55Marc:Not in Virginia.

00:24:55Marc:More evolved slang.

00:24:56Guest:It was a little more sophisticated over there.

00:24:58Marc:Yeah, there's a historical foundation of intolerance.

00:25:02Marc:In that part of the country.

00:25:05Marc:It's true.

00:25:08Marc:But the fact is that, of course, an entire city would... It's like watching kids perform plays is great.

00:25:14Marc:It's sweet.

00:25:15Guest:It's so great.

00:25:16Guest:I mean, there's definitely a Waiting for Guffman quality, too.

00:25:19Marc:Sure, of course.

00:25:20Guest:But if you remember Waiting for Guffman, they were actually really good at the end, right?

00:25:23Marc:Yeah.

00:25:24Marc:Yeah.

00:25:24Marc:But when you're a kid, like, I mean, I did Meet Me in St.

00:25:26Marc:Louis in seventh grade, and I had a mustache on, but you really think you're doing it.

00:25:32Marc:Like, you know, when you're that age, you're like, I'm doing this.

00:25:35Guest:Oh, no, we had people come up to us at the end and say, listen, we saw Grease on Broadway, and your version was better.

00:25:43Guest:And we were like, yeah.

00:25:44Guest:We thought we were as good as Broadway because we were being told.

00:25:49Guest:We didn't know Broadway.

00:25:50Marc:And you probably were being at least more earnest.

00:25:53Marc:Maybe.

00:25:54Marc:When you're a kid, there's all that weird vulnerability and you're giving it your all and there's no cynicism that has ruined it or no sense of perfectionism or expectation.

00:26:04Marc:You're just sort of like...

00:26:05Guest:I'm going to do it.

00:26:06Guest:And it was so sad because they wanted to give more kids opportunity.

00:26:10Guest:Yeah.

00:26:11Guest:So they made more pink ladies and more t-birds just so that like, yeah.

00:26:15Guest:So I was like a fake pink lady.

00:26:17Marc:So like there's like 20 of them.

00:26:18Guest:Like I made up my own name.

00:26:20Guest:Like it was just like, and then we had to change all like the dirty bits, like the dirty lyrics and stuff.

00:26:25Marc:What was your, what was your made up name?

00:26:28Guest:Um, I was, I was cherry.

00:26:31Um,

00:26:31Marc:Good one.

00:26:32Guest:I came up with cherry.

00:26:33Marc:Good one.

00:26:34Marc:So what happens?

00:26:35Marc:You moved to Virginia and now you're a genius actress.

00:26:39Marc:You've done important work, Bye Bye Birdie and Grease.

00:26:42Guest:Seven brothers, just name a few.

00:26:44Guest:It's all right.

00:26:45Marc:And you step into high school then?

00:26:47Guest:Yeah.

00:26:48Marc:Because your dad moved?

00:26:49Guest:Yeah.

00:26:50Marc:Your parents still together?

00:26:51Yeah.

00:26:51Guest:My parents were still together, but my mom was like, so help me God if you move these children.

00:26:55Guest:And we were like, we hate you.

00:26:57Guest:Don't ever take us away.

00:26:58Guest:It was really traumatic on my family.

00:27:01Marc:Bad car ride.

00:27:02Guest:Bad, bad, bad.

00:27:04Marc:Yeah.

00:27:04Guest:Bad in the VW bus.

00:27:06Marc:That's a long drive, too.

00:27:08Marc:Yeah.

00:27:10Marc:So to move at that age is the worst.

00:27:13Yeah.

00:27:14Guest:It's the worst.

00:27:15Marc:Because you're dug in.

00:27:16Guest:It was the first year of high school, and you've got all these amazing friends back in Idaho.

00:27:23Marc:And you're all going to go to high school together?

00:27:24Guest:Yeah, to a certain extent.

00:27:26Guest:We were all different ages.

00:27:28Guest:But yeah, you had this sense of putting your roots down, and you're getting crushes on boys for the first time.

00:27:37Yeah.

00:27:37Guest:And it was a very sort of wholesome place to grow up to.

00:27:44Marc:Idaho, yeah.

00:27:45Guest:We would all get together as boys and girls, and we would play Follow the Dog and Sardines.

00:27:51Guest:We would all cook together and sing songs.

00:27:55Guest:It was really quite innocent.

00:27:57Guest:So then we got to Virginia, and all the girls were carrying purses.

00:28:02Guest:I was like, moms carry purses?

00:28:03Guest:What's this?

00:28:07Guest:these chains around their neck you know with the coke tops uh like you would take off the coke tab yeah and it was supposed to be how many people you'd slept with on the oh and i was like i yeah haven't done you mean like pull tabs or yeah you would take the like well you crack the coke open that little tab on top yeah right yeah oh that's right i remember that put them on necklaces yeah and that was uh that was your how how many people you slept with supposedly

00:28:32Guest:I'm sure, supposedly.

00:28:34Guest:I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, we don't do this in Idaho.

00:28:36Guest:I don't know the purses and the sleeping with people.

00:28:39Guest:Yeah, it was outrageous.

00:28:40Guest:So I was really intimidated.

00:28:44Marc:Sheltered, you felt?

00:28:47Guest:I didn't feel sheltered.

00:28:48Guest:I thought that I could sort of sense that they were moving too fast.

00:28:53Marc:Right.

00:28:54Guest:I was kind of okay where I was at.

00:28:55Marc:Right.

00:28:56Marc:Yeah.

00:28:56Marc:These were racy gals.

00:28:59Guest:Yeah.

00:29:00Guest:They were talking about stuff that I was like, I don't... You're a kid.

00:29:03Marc:Right.

00:29:04Marc:Yeah.

00:29:05Marc:And you didn't buy it or...

00:29:06Guest:I didn't really buy it.

00:29:09Guest:You know, I sort of immediately went into that thing where I joined the theater department.

00:29:14Guest:Yeah.

00:29:14Guest:And then we're that, you know, you're not really allowed in the lunchroom.

00:29:19Guest:You're not welcome in the lunchroom.

00:29:20Marc:Really?

00:29:21Guest:Yeah.

00:29:22Marc:As theater departments?

00:29:23Guest:Yeah, they'd make fun of you and call you names and things.

00:29:26Guest:So we all sort of sat in front of the theater together.

00:29:29Guest:We were like the little goth punk theater kids that would sit and all keep to ourselves.

00:29:35Guest:So we sort of protected ourselves from...

00:29:38Marc:Right.

00:29:39Guest:The stuff that was scary.

00:29:41Marc:The horrendous hierarchy of high school.

00:29:44Guest:Yeah.

00:29:44Guest:We sort of kept to ourselves.

00:29:47Marc:It's always interesting to me that the theater department provides this haven for fragile people, for creative people, for people struggling with their sexuality.

00:29:58Marc:There was sort of an all-accepting kind of like, we're doing our thing over here.

00:30:03Marc:And there was a confidence in it.

00:30:04Guest:Absolutely.

00:30:06Guest:A very scrappy,

00:30:08Guest:well-rounded group of people, but really the people who felt like they needed a little protection and their own family at high school.

00:30:18Guest:That's where you find them, I think.

00:30:20Marc:Yeah, that aren't jocks or horrible people.

00:30:23Guest:Yeah, our teacher would even give us hall passes to get out of school assemblies and he'd go, if you go spend time working on your play in the theater, then I'll get you out of the school assembly because I know that it's torture.

00:30:38Marc:Yeah.

00:30:38Marc:He knew from generations of theater kids.

00:30:41Guest:He was like, let me at least do this for you.

00:30:43Marc:So you were gothy?

00:30:44Guest:It was gothy.

00:30:45Marc:That was your thing?

00:30:46Guest:Yeah.

00:30:47Marc:Like dyed your hair black?

00:30:49Guest:Yeah.

00:30:50Guest:Black hair.

00:30:50Guest:I went through the gamut that started out with like the sort of cherry red manic panic, you know, and then orange and purple and black.

00:30:59Marc:Who were your bands?

00:31:01Yeah.

00:31:01Guest:I mean, what you'd think.

00:31:03Guest:Concrete Blonde, Sisters of Mercy, Susie, Smith, you know.

00:31:08Marc:The ones.

00:31:09Guest:Skinny Puppy.

00:31:10Marc:Yeah.

00:31:11Marc:Yeah.

00:31:12Marc:And so it's weird how that's how you kind of designed your identity around music.

00:31:18Guest:I do.

00:31:18Guest:I remember when I lived in Idaho, hearing The Cure for the first time and seeing a video, it was off disintegration.

00:31:27Guest:And I remember hearing Joey by Concrete Blonde.

00:31:29Guest:It was the first time I'd seen music videos.

00:31:32Guest:And it blew my mind.

00:31:34Guest:I was just like, wait, there's something else out there.

00:31:41Guest:And didn't realize...

00:31:44Guest:at that time because there weren't goths and things in twin falls right so i went to virginia liking that music yeah and and thinking i was a bit odd or different or something just for like and then found all the people who were all listening to that music i was like oh they all dress a certain way too yeah there's a whole thing about it built in yeah whole lifestyle so i thought i was just coming with like some weird bands that i you know liked and then i found out there was a community

00:32:10Marc:Yeah, a community and everything's taken care of.

00:32:13Marc:Yeah.

00:32:13Marc:Here's what you need.

00:32:14Guest:And they're like, oh, wait, you don't know this band yet?

00:32:16Guest:Hold on.

00:32:17Marc:Oh, that's the best.

00:32:17Guest:Yeah, we'll take care of that.

00:32:18Marc:That's the best.

00:32:19Marc:Yeah.

00:32:20Marc:It is sort of, I guess it is sort of weird because a lot of people talk about it and I don't know if I really think about it in my life where you do see something where you're like, there is something going on out there and it's not here.

00:32:32Guest:Yeah.

00:32:33Marc:And it's like big and grown up and exciting and weird.

00:32:38Guest:Well, I also remember it was my first week in Virginia and I was waiting at the bus stop very early in the morning.

00:32:46Marc:Oh, for the school bus?

00:32:47Marc:For the school bus.

00:32:49Guest:And my neighbor, her and her brother were standing there sort of scowling and she was wearing a Cure t-shirt and I went, oh, do you like the Cure?

00:32:58Guest:She was like, yeah, I'm going to go see him in concert.

00:33:00Guest:And I was like,

00:33:02Guest:like watch them play their instruments?

00:33:08Guest:Like I didn't know that you could go and see a band that you liked.

00:33:12Marc:How old were you, 14?

00:33:14Guest:I was 13, yeah.

00:33:15Guest:I mean, bands didn't come to Twin Falls either.

00:33:18Guest:So I didn't even know that that was a thing.

00:33:20Guest:I was like, you're gonna go and they're gonna be in front of you playing their instruments.

00:33:24Guest:She looked at me like I was crazy.

00:33:28Marc:Did you go?

00:33:30Guest:I have seen The Cure probably five times now, but not that time.

00:33:33Guest:Yeah.

00:33:34Guest:But I started to go to shows all the time in D.C.

00:33:36Marc:Yeah.

00:33:37Marc:Yeah.

00:33:37Marc:All ages clubs?

00:33:38Marc:Or did you sneak in?

00:33:39Guest:I didn't really do that.

00:33:40Guest:I mean, we had these things called Jam for Man.

00:33:42Guest:Yeah.

00:33:42Guest:Where local bands would play and you'd bring like a can of soup or something.

00:33:46Guest:Right.

00:33:47Guest:And then you would get in.

00:33:48Guest:And that was more sort of local bands...

00:33:51Guest:But there was like a big scene of like Fagazi and all that stuff.

00:33:55Marc:Oh yeah, no, DC was big, yeah.

00:33:56Guest:For the punk rock.

00:33:57Guest:And then there was the 930 club.

00:33:58Guest:Yeah.

00:33:58Guest:So like L7 would come in.

00:34:00Guest:L7.

00:34:00Guest:You would go see like Built to Spill.

00:34:02Guest:Yeah.

00:34:02Guest:You know, you would go see all that.

00:34:04Guest:And then there would be big shows too, but that was a big thing.

00:34:07Marc:Those were big, though.

00:34:08Marc:That was your time.

00:34:09Marc:Those were the alt bands that were happening.

00:34:11Guest:Yeah, it was fun.

00:34:12Marc:L7's getting back together.

00:34:13Guest:Are they?

00:34:14Marc:Yes.

00:34:15Guest:That's pretty cool.

00:34:15Marc:Yeah, I talked to Joan Jett, and I think she's helping them do a record, but I think they're coming back if they haven't already.

00:34:23Guest:I still have my L7 t-shirt from that concert.

00:34:26Marc:You do?

00:34:26Guest:Yeah.

00:34:26Marc:Do you wear it?

00:34:27Guest:Smell the magic tour.

00:34:29Guest:Yeah.

00:34:30Guest:I don't know that I wear it very often.

00:34:31Guest:It's slightly offensive.

00:34:34Guest:You can't wear it out without being questioned.

00:34:37Marc:Right.

00:34:37Guest:It's a bold move.

00:34:38Marc:Okay.

00:34:39Marc:I got it.

00:34:39Guest:It's a bold move.

00:34:40Guest:Not when you're a teenager so much?

00:34:40Guest:It's more like a workout t-shirt.

00:34:42Marc:Oh, there you go.

00:34:43Marc:Yeah.

00:34:43Yeah.

00:34:43Marc:So you're doing more theater in high school and you're learning things.

00:34:47Marc:Do you have a drama teacher?

00:34:48Marc:When do you start like taking acting somewhat seriously?

00:34:51Marc:Yeah.

00:34:51Marc:And also when did you learn how to play the accordion?

00:34:54Guest:Ah.

00:34:54Guest:Well, I. Two separate questions.

00:34:57Guest:Yeah.

00:34:58Guest:Difficult.

00:34:58Guest:So high school was the first time I could choose drama as like an elective.

00:35:01Guest:Yeah.

00:35:01Guest:So it was the first time I could have a class instead of it just being community theater.

00:35:05Guest:Right.

00:35:05Guest:So I was super, super excited.

00:35:08Guest:And I was a freshman and they had auditions for their first play of the season, which was Blythe Spirit, I believe.

00:35:16Marc:Yeah.

00:35:17Guest:Oh, it could have been All My Sons.

00:35:18Guest:I think it was All My Sons.

00:35:19Marc:Arthur Miller?

00:35:20Guest:Yes.

00:35:21Guest:They're doing that on Broadway now.

00:35:22Guest:We were doing some really heavy stuff.

00:35:23Guest:That's heavy.

00:35:24Guest:Yeah.

00:35:24Marc:I think that Tracy Letts and Annette Bening are doing that on Broadway.

00:35:28Marc:Yeah.

00:35:28Guest:Amazing.

00:35:29Marc:They're in rehearsals now.

00:35:30Guest:Amazing.

00:35:31Guest:I saw Laurie Metcalf do it in London, and she was so extraordinary.

00:35:36Marc:She's amazing.

00:35:37Guest:She's always doing some play, and if you get an opportunity, I've probably seen her in 10 different things.

00:35:42Guest:She's phenomenal.

00:35:44Marc:I've seen her sitting right across from me and it was a lot.

00:35:47Guest:Yeah.

00:35:47Marc:Yeah.

00:35:47Marc:I mean, you're just sort of like, wow.

00:35:48Guest:She's just so incredibly talented.

00:35:51Guest:Yeah.

00:35:51Marc:It's like, it's kind of something.

00:35:53Guest:Yeah.

00:35:53Marc:But what is All of My, is it called All of My Sons?

00:35:56Guest:All My Sons.

00:35:57Guest:It's like, it's a really dark family post-war story.

00:36:01Guest:Situation.

00:36:02Guest:We should not have been tackling this stuff in high school.

00:36:05Guest:My teacher... Then we did Agnes of God.

00:36:07Guest:I mean, it was really too much for the kids.

00:36:09Guest:But I got one of the starring roles, and I was a freshman, and some of the seniors were a little peeved.

00:36:14Marc:Oh, yeah?

00:36:15Guest:Because they're like, this is... Yeah.

00:36:17Marc:So... She's way too young.

00:36:19Guest:Yeah.

00:36:19Marc:Yeah, to be doing this.

00:36:20Guest:We're more mature.

00:36:21Guest:So I started getting leads in the plays in high school, and it was super fun for me.

00:36:25Guest:So I really...

00:36:26Guest:And then I decided to continue doing community theater.

00:36:30Guest:So I would do theater.

00:36:31Guest:In Virginia.

00:36:32Guest:Yeah.

00:36:32Guest:So I would do high school theater.

00:36:34Guest:And then I would go out to the local towns and I did some more musicals.

00:36:38Marc:So you knew it was your thing.

00:36:40Guest:I knew it was my thing.

00:36:41Marc:Yeah.

00:36:42Guest:I was also a dancer, though, at the same time.

00:36:43Guest:So I would study ballet every day.

00:36:45Marc:Oh, really?

00:36:45Guest:Yeah.

00:36:46Marc:Ballet, ballet?

00:36:47Guest:Mm-hmm.

00:36:47Guest:Ballet, ballet.

00:36:47Marc:Like up on your toes, ballet?

00:36:48Guest:Yeah.

00:36:49Guest:In the toe shoes, ballet.

00:36:50Marc:Man, that looks... I think that all helps.

00:36:53Marc:I mean, did you think you were going to be a ballerina?

00:36:55No.

00:36:55Guest:I wanted to for many, many years, and I studied as if I was going to be.

00:36:59Guest:And then, you know, a dancer's career starts when they're like 14 or 15.

00:37:04Guest:Right.

00:37:05Guest:So if you're not that good... Yeah, if you're not a prodigy.

00:37:08Guest:...then you need to check yourself because you're like, this hurts a lot.

00:37:11Guest:Yeah.

00:37:12Guest:And you really... Dancers really beat themselves up.

00:37:15Guest:There's... It can be mentally...

00:37:19Marc:And physically, right?

00:37:20Guest:Yeah.

00:37:21Guest:Exhausting and a little bit masochistic.

00:37:24Marc:Yeah, I saw Black Swan.

00:37:25Marc:I know what's up.

00:37:26Guest:Yeah, you know.

00:37:27Guest:You know.

00:37:27Guest:You saw Chorus Line.

00:37:28Marc:We all beat ourselves up, though.

00:37:30Marc:No matter what.

00:37:30Marc:If you pick a creative field.

00:37:32Guest:But I think that it is such an underappreciated art.

00:37:36Marc:And also demanding.

00:37:37Guest:I think it's probably one of the hardest arts and the least appreciated.

00:37:41Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:37:42Guest:um but i think knowing it's good you know i absolutely i mean movement for like being in touch with your body movement discipline yeah being able to take criticism yeah uh you know wanting to do the work in order to get better all those things yeah uh help in the arts or probably with everything really so what happens when you graduate or what do you do you just start acting or what happens

00:38:06Guest:I did my senior year of high school at the community college because I did not enjoy high school.

00:38:12Marc:Why?

00:38:13Marc:There wasn't enough protection in the theater department?

00:38:17Guest:No.

00:38:18Guest:It really had me depressed with how people treat each other and the way that people were allowed to get away with things being hurtful and physically hurtful to people.

00:38:34Guest:You?

00:38:34Yeah.

00:38:34Guest:I didn't get in fights, but there were fights daily in my school where it was sort of Lord of the Flies.

00:38:42Guest:I mean, kids would just, some poor kid would be getting the crap beat out of them and everyone would be like, fight, fight, fight, fight.

00:38:48Guest:And it just horrified me.

00:38:50Guest:Yeah.

00:38:51Guest:And I was too sensitive for it.

00:38:53Guest:It wasn't good for me.

00:38:55Guest:So I, unbeknownst to my parents, I and my best friend went to the community college and met with counselors and said, what kind of credits do we need to graduate from high school and also get college credits at the same time?

00:39:06Guest:So I did my senior year doing that.

00:39:08Marc:Did you get like bullied?

00:39:10Guest:Oh, absolutely I got bullied.

00:39:12Guest:Horribly.

00:39:13Marc:By girls?

00:39:14Guest:Both.

00:39:15Marc:Really?

00:39:16Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:39:16Marc:For what?

00:39:17Guest:For the way I dressed, for being in theater, for the kind of friends that I had.

00:39:21Guest:Yeah.

00:39:22Guest:I had to move my locker from a certain area because people would spit food at me and call me names.

00:39:28Guest:What the fuck?

00:39:28Guest:So I knew if my locker was closer to a certain area that I wouldn't get bothered.

00:39:33Marc:Shitty kids.

00:39:34Guest:Shitty kids.

00:39:35Mm-hmm.

00:39:35Guest:Yeah.

00:39:36Guest:Ironically, that high school is now a school for the arts, which makes me a little bit irritated and also so happy for them.

00:39:43Guest:But like, I'm like, really?

00:39:45Marc:You got to go back and give a talk.

00:39:46Marc:When I was here at Show of Your Walker, I had to move.

00:39:50Marc:from this spot.

00:39:52Guest:Yeah, you appreciate that locker.

00:39:54Marc:Yeah, because there's one asshole.

00:39:56Guest:Yeah, exactly.

00:39:57Marc:So community college.

00:39:59Guest:So went to community college, continued doing community theater, and I was working at a hair salon.

00:40:04Marc:Cutting hair?

00:40:06Guest:As a shampoo girl.

00:40:07Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:40:08Guest:And a receptionist.

00:40:09Marc:Okay.

00:40:10Guest:And my mother decided to enter me into a modeling contest.

00:40:14Guest:She had seen a contest to be in 17 Magazine.

00:40:17Marc:Without asking you?

00:40:19Yeah.

00:40:19Guest:I think what she said was, look, tore out this page and said, I think we should do this.

00:40:25Guest:Yeah.

00:40:26Guest:But I didn't have any.

00:40:27Guest:You had to send in photographs and I didn't have any.

00:40:28Guest:How old were you?

00:40:30Guest:I would be 17.

00:40:31Guest:Uh-huh.

00:40:32Guest:And a good friend of mine who worked at like the local record and tape exchange, it was like very high fidelity and I would hang out there after school.

00:40:40Marc:Sure.

00:40:40Marc:Hear the new stuff.

00:40:41Guest:Hear the new stuff.

00:40:42Guest:We play records and judge people.

00:40:44Guest:And he was like, oh, this one guy comes in here all the time.

00:40:48Guest:He's a photographer.

00:40:48Guest:I've got his number.

00:40:50Guest:Maybe he could take some pictures of you for the contest.

00:40:54Guest:So I called this guy and I said, hi, my name's me.

00:40:55Guest:He's like, how'd you get my number and what?

00:40:57Guest:Yeah.

00:40:58Guest:How old are you and what's wrong?

00:41:00Marc:I don't want any trouble.

00:41:01Guest:Yeah.

00:41:01Guest:He was like, so he decided to meet me at a bagel shop.

00:41:04Marc:Yeah.

00:41:04Yeah.

00:41:04Marc:We got to meet in public.

00:41:05Guest:And he was like, bring whatever photos you have of yourself.

00:41:09Marc:Yeah.

00:41:09Guest:And I brought a prom picture.

00:41:10Guest:And he goes, oh, you really have no photos.

00:41:14Guest:I thought you would have something.

00:41:16Guest:A little portfolio.

00:41:16Guest:And I was like, no, I really don't.

00:41:18Marc:A prom picture.

00:41:19Guest:Yeah.

00:41:20Marc:What kind of tux was the guy wearing?

00:41:23Marc:Like a baby blue ruffles?

00:41:25Guest:No.

00:41:26Guest:No, he was goth.

00:41:27Guest:He had a purple mohawk and like a-

00:41:30Guest:He had tails on and like knee-high docks and like a nose ring from his ear.

00:41:36Marc:That was the first boyfriend?

00:41:37Guest:Yeah, I actually saw him last week.

00:41:39Guest:He was also visiting.

00:41:40Marc:No.

00:41:41Guest:Yeah, that was really fun.

00:41:42Guest:I hadn't seen him in 13 years.

00:41:43Guest:We had drinks and dinner last week.

00:41:45Marc:And that was like your love?

00:41:46Guest:Yeah, it was like my first love.

00:41:47Marc:And how'd he turn out?

00:41:50Guest:He's great.

00:41:51Marc:That's good.

00:41:52Guest:Yeah.

00:41:52Marc:Does he look normal now?

00:41:53Marc:Does he still have the nose ring?

00:41:55Guest:I think everyone at work thinks he's normal.

00:41:57Guest:He's got a beard and wear suits, but then he's got all these piercings and tattoos underneath.

00:42:02Guest:Still?

00:42:03Marc:Yeah.

00:42:03Marc:He keeps them active?

00:42:04Guest:I think he's got more tattoos now.

00:42:06Guest:He's got more tattoos now.

00:42:07Marc:Yeah, people seem to collect them.

00:42:08Marc:Once they start, it doesn't stop until they run out.

00:42:11Guest:Back in the day, he just had those Celtic bands and a Sisters of Mercy star.

00:42:17Marc:And now he's got full sleeves.

00:42:18Guest:Yeah, he's got full sleeves.

00:42:20Marc:Well, that's nice.

00:42:21Marc:Isn't it nice seeing him?

00:42:22Guest:It was so nice seeing him.

00:42:23Guest:It was really, really nice.

00:42:25Marc:It can be kind of trippy to see people.

00:42:26Marc:But you've seen him since high school then, though.

00:42:28Guest:I'd seen him once, several times since high school.

00:42:30Guest:I hadn't seen him in 13 years.

00:42:31Guest:But we're still friends.

00:42:33Guest:So we text and we talk on the phone.

00:42:35Guest:Oh, that's nice.

00:42:35Guest:Yeah.

00:42:36Marc:Sometimes I don't see people for like 15 years.

00:42:38Marc:And then you see him, you're like, oh, my God.

00:42:40Marc:If that's happening to you, it must be happening to me.

00:42:42Marc:The aging process.

00:42:44Guest:I mean, I was a little bit nervous for him to see me.

00:42:46Guest:Because, I mean, he could see me on shows and stuff.

00:42:48Guest:But he doesn't really watch my shows.

00:42:51Marc:Right.

00:42:51Guest:But still just seeing someone in person is a whole different.

00:42:56Marc:Especially someone you were in love with.

00:42:58Guest:Yeah.

00:42:59Marc:It's heavy.

00:42:59Guest:And I found myself sort of like dressing a little bit goth to go meet him.

00:43:03Guest:And then I was like, why am I trying to look like I, and then I like started over and then I just went for a whole different look.

00:43:09Guest:Did you really?

00:43:09Guest:But I found myself like in a black dress and like a red lip.

00:43:12Guest:Really?

00:43:13Guest:I was like, wait a minute.

00:43:14Guest:I'm going to soften it up.

00:43:15Guest:I'm going to go more like gypsy.

00:43:17Guest:I'm going to be like a gypsy, Christina.

00:43:18Guest:This is just recently?

00:43:20Guest:Yeah, last week.

00:43:21Guest:You were gothing out.

00:43:22Guest:I was gothing out, which is, by the way, fairly normal for me.

00:43:26Marc:That's so funny, though, that you kind of lock into those old patterns.

00:43:30Guest:Yeah, I was like, how would he like to see me?

00:43:32Guest:Probably the exact same way.

00:43:34Guest:yeah it's wild yeah so all right so you get the pics the guy takes pictures so he took a bunch of test photos of me i sent them into this competition and in the meantime he introduced me to this husband and wife team who started hiring me as a local model yeah so i did a lot of like elegant bride and um these early things and then um and then i didn't win the contest right

00:43:59Guest:But I got all these nice photos and started to pursue my career.

00:44:05Marc:Modeling.

00:44:06Guest:Modeling.

00:44:07Guest:So probably did about a year of local modeling and then decided I had enough pictures in a portfolio to go to New York City.

00:44:14Guest:And I went around and met all the agencies and then I moved to New York.

00:44:18Marc:What agencies did you sign with?

00:44:20Guest:The first agency I signed with was Pauline's.

00:44:22Guest:Yeah.

00:44:22Guest:They don't exist anymore.

00:44:24Marc:Yeah.

00:44:24Guest:And then I went to Ford.

00:44:26Guest:Yeah.

00:44:26Guest:And then I was with IMG.

00:44:28Marc:So this was your thing, the modeling thing.

00:44:31Guest:That was my thing because I thought, first of all, I didn't know that I could be an actor as a profession.

00:44:37Guest:Right.

00:44:37Guest:I just thought I'll always do community theater in the evening.

00:44:39Guest:I'll get a job and then at night I'll do community theater.

00:44:42Guest:Yeah.

00:44:43Yeah.

00:44:43Guest:And I had pre-auditioned and been accepted to Virginia Commonwealth and their theater department to go to that college.

00:44:51Guest:But I had such a horrible time in high school that I was like, the idea of continuing education and being still around groups of people, I was like, this is not for me.

00:45:01Guest:And when I got this opportunity to move to New York, I just thought...

00:45:04Guest:I don't know really what I want to do, but I know this is closer.

00:45:09Guest:Yeah.

00:45:10Guest:This is closer to what I want to do.

00:45:11Guest:Right, right.

00:45:12Guest:And it's getting me in a place that's not here.

00:45:15Marc:Yeah, New York.

00:45:16Guest:Yeah.

00:45:17Marc:Well, I mean, my first wife was a model who quit.

00:45:20Marc:And we talk about ballerinas, but modeling's...

00:45:25Marc:I mean, she had to quit because of the expectations on you to maintain whatever look it is, but it just seems like it's almost inescapable.

00:45:40Guest:Yeah, I mean...

00:45:42Marc:Eating disorders primarily.

00:45:43Guest:Right.

00:45:45Guest:I did not go through that.

00:45:47Marc:Yeah.

00:45:47Guest:I think I suffered a little bit of that when I was a dancer.

00:45:50Guest:Yeah.

00:45:52Guest:You know, some of these girls are just so damn young.

00:45:55Guest:Yeah.

00:45:55Guest:Their bodies are like that.

00:45:56Guest:Right.

00:45:56Guest:Because they're, like, not developed yet.

00:45:58Guest:Like, I was just skinny.

00:46:00Guest:Yeah.

00:46:00Guest:The girls I knew didn't work out.

00:46:02Guest:Yeah.

00:46:03Guest:Smoked.

00:46:04Guest:Smoked like crazy, drank beer, and, like, ate pizza.

00:46:08Guest:And then it's going to catch up with you.

00:46:10Marc:How often do they eat pizza, really?

00:46:11Guest:I mean, it's all we could afford.

00:46:13Guest:We weren't eating at nice restaurants.

00:46:16Marc:So you were eating nothing or pizza.

00:46:18Guest:I was eating a lot of sorbet.

00:46:19Guest:Yeah.

00:46:20Guest:I remember eating a lot of sorbet.

00:46:21Guest:Yeah.

00:46:23Guest:Just because it's what you could afford.

00:46:25Guest:Sure.

00:46:25Guest:So it didn't fuck you up too much.

00:46:27Guest:But then these girls, you know, I happened to be lucky.

00:46:31Guest:I sort of slowly transitioned into that I started doing a lot of commercials.

00:46:35Guest:Yeah.

00:46:35Guest:And then the commercials led into the acting and this and that.

00:46:39Guest:So I kind of...

00:46:40Guest:slowly phased out where had i stayed in modeling i would have gone come up to all of those things like my body's changing right things are not the way they used to be i'm getting older that you know whatever it is yeah when you're 18 you don't have to worry about too much so you obviously you kind of your timing worked out my timing kind of worked out yeah yeah so you didn't did you do like runway shit and that kind of stuff i did a little bit i was always a little short i'm five eight and

00:47:06Marc:So you never did that?

00:47:07Marc:You go to Milan and all that stuff?

00:47:09Guest:I did shows in London and I did a handful of shows in New York.

00:47:14Marc:Yeah.

00:47:15Guest:But I never did Italy or Paris.

00:47:18Marc:Yeah.

00:47:18Marc:And you liked it?

00:47:19Guest:I loved it because I was traveling for the first time.

00:47:24Guest:I was going out of the country.

00:47:25Guest:My first time out of the country was Japan.

00:47:27Guest:Blew my mind.

00:47:28Guest:Loved it.

00:47:28Marc:To work?

00:47:29Marc:To do a shoot?

00:47:31Guest:I would spend, a lot of models go there because you make a lot of money very quickly.

00:47:35Guest:So I would spend a month and a half there each time.

00:47:37Guest:So I went there three different times.

00:47:38Marc:Just to hang out?

00:47:39Guest:You just work like crazy.

00:47:40Marc:You work six, seven jobs in one catalog.

00:47:44Guest:You get an agency in Japan.

00:47:45Guest:You go and live with other models and you just work, work, work, work, work, work.

00:47:49Marc:And you get to hang out in Japan.

00:47:50Guest:You get to hang out in Japan.

00:47:51Guest:You make a bunch of money and take it home and hopefully it sustains you while you're trying to get work in the other city that you're in.

00:47:56Marc:Eat real sushi.

00:47:58Guest:Eat Real Sushi, which is a real treat when you're there.

00:48:01Marc:I've never been there.

00:48:02Marc:It's awesome.

00:48:04Marc:Do you go back now even?

00:48:05Guest:I haven't been back for 20 years.

00:48:06Guest:Since then?

00:48:07Guest:Yeah.

00:48:08Marc:That's interesting.

00:48:09Guest:I would love to go back.

00:48:10Marc:You can.

00:48:11Guest:I know I can.

00:48:12Guest:I have so many places to go and I never have a break.

00:48:15Marc:I know.

00:48:16Marc:You work too much.

00:48:16Guest:But I really, there's so many places I want to go.

00:48:19Marc:So you start doing commercials.

00:48:20Marc:I start doing commercials.

00:48:20Marc:And you get an agent?

00:48:21Marc:Is that what happens?

00:48:22Yeah.

00:48:22Guest:Yeah.

00:48:23Guest:So I started working as a model in New York.

00:48:26Guest:Yeah.

00:48:27Guest:So then I moved to London.

00:48:29Guest:Yeah.

00:48:30Guest:Which I fell really in love with.

00:48:32Guest:Yeah.

00:48:32Guest:And so I actually like planted, like I actually moved there, moved there.

00:48:37Guest:Yeah.

00:48:37Marc:You lived there for how long?

00:48:38Guest:I lived there for just over a year.

00:48:40Guest:Yeah.

00:48:40Marc:Did you go see theater there?

00:48:41Guest:Saw some theater there.

00:48:43Guest:And lived with two of my best friends who were teachers.

00:48:49Guest:Yeah.

00:48:50Guest:And modeled there and loved it, but just started running out of money.

00:48:54Guest:Right.

00:48:54Guest:And I was like, okay, I'm not, I gotta do something.

00:48:57Marc:Work's drying up.

00:48:58Guest:Yeah, I was like, you know, a couple pounds left in my pocket.

00:49:02Guest:My mom was like, I'm thinking about moving to L.A.

00:49:05Guest:My brother had moved to L.A.

00:49:06Marc:Yeah.

00:49:07Marc:And your folks were split by then.

00:49:08Guest:They were split.

00:49:09Marc:One camping trip too many.

00:49:10Guest:She was like, I only live in Virginia because of your dad and I hate it here.

00:49:12Guest:Yeah.

00:49:12Guest:So I want to go somewhere sunshiny.

00:49:14Guest:Yeah.

00:49:14Guest:She's like, do you want to come?

00:49:15Guest:And I said, I think you need a car or something.

00:49:18Guest:Like, I don't have that.

00:49:21Guest:She's like, you can have the old Buick and I'll get a new car there.

00:49:25Guest:Yeah.

00:49:25Yeah.

00:49:25Guest:So we moved out together and I got a modeling agency in the meantime.

00:49:32Guest:because I didn't know what I was going to do yet.

00:49:34Guest:And I called some friends that I knew in the music business because I was so interested in music.

00:49:38Guest:I was like, maybe you could get me an internship.

00:49:39Guest:And they were like, it's a rough go in the music industry.

00:49:44Guest:It's hard.

00:49:46Guest:And they sort of steered me away from it.

00:49:50Guest:And I got this agency, and all of a sudden I started working more as a model in L.A.

00:49:54Guest:than I'd worked anywhere else, oddly, because L.A.

00:49:57Guest:is not really considered a fashion city.

00:50:00Guest:But it was because I was doing commercials.

00:50:01Marc:Right.

00:50:02Marc:For stuff.

00:50:03Guest:For stuff.

00:50:04Guest:Carl's Jr., Dr. Pepper.

00:50:06Marc:Oh, okay.

00:50:06Guest:You know?

00:50:07Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:50:08Guest:I can't remember.

00:50:08Guest:Doing music videos.

00:50:09Guest:Yeah.

00:50:10Guest:Did an Everclear video.

00:50:11Guest:Yeah.

00:50:13Guest:And so I started learning things like how to hit your mark on camera.

00:50:18Marc:Well, how was the culture shock from... I guess it's not that much, but L.A.

00:50:21Marc:sort of...

00:50:22Marc:You know, a bit of a clusterfuck in terms of show business and in terms of like, I imagine once you did a music video, you got a kind of a little glimmer or a glimpse into, you know, what movies and everything's going to be like.

00:50:37Guest:I mean, not kind of.

00:50:40Guest:It still felt like I was, I didn't call myself an actress yet.

00:50:44Guest:I still called myself a model.

00:50:45Guest:Yeah.

00:50:46Guest:So when I was getting those gigs, I felt like I was getting the best modeling gigs.

00:50:50Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:50:52Guest:And there was this sense of like, oh, everyone here is an actor.

00:50:57Marc:Right.

00:50:59Marc:Everyone's trying to do the thing.

00:51:01Guest:Yeah.

00:51:01Guest:You would drive down a street and there'd be all these people with scripts on the street looking concerned and you realize, oh, they're in an acting class.

00:51:10Marc:They're running their lines.

00:51:11Guest:Yeah.

00:51:12Guest:And I was like, ew, this is gross.

00:51:15Guest:Like, it kind of turned me off.

00:51:18Marc:Right.

00:51:18Guest:Because it's all anyone talked about and everyone was doing it.

00:51:22Guest:It felt less special than anywhere I'd been.

00:51:24Marc:Yeah, sure.

00:51:25Marc:It's just the, it's the business of the city.

00:51:28Guest:Yeah.

00:51:28Marc:Yeah.

00:51:30Guest:And...

00:51:31Guest:Then I started doing all these commercials, and that was going really well, and I was having fun.

00:51:36Guest:And then my brother was working next door to a manager.

00:51:40Guest:Yeah.

00:51:41Guest:And he was like, you should represent my sister.

00:51:43Guest:I saw her in Agnes of God.

00:51:44Guest:She's really good.

00:51:48Guest:And this manager was like, yeah, yeah, everyone's got a sister.

00:51:50Guest:That's good.

00:51:51Guest:And he was like, no, I think my sister's really good.

00:51:54Guest:And he loved my brother, so he took a meeting with me.

00:51:57Marc:Right.

00:51:58Guest:And he was like, at the end of the meeting, I brought him the commercials I had been in.

00:52:02Guest:And he goes, I'd like to represent you.

00:52:03Guest:And I said, I don't know what that means.

00:52:06Guest:I don't know what your job is.

00:52:09Guest:And he said, well, I'll help you get auditions.

00:52:11Guest:I'll help you get an agent.

00:52:13Guest:And it turns out at the time, he had such a small group of people.

00:52:16Guest:And he was in this weird little office.

00:52:18Guest:But he represented Jon Hamm and Paul Rudd and four other people and me.

00:52:25Marc:Guys you ended up working with.

00:52:26Guest:Yeah.

00:52:27Marc:That's wild.

00:52:28Guest:Really weird.

00:52:28Guest:And we all like, when we see each other, we're like, remember when we would run into each other in that weird office?

00:52:33Marc:Who was the guy?

00:52:34Guest:Ross Brown.

00:52:36Marc:Uh-huh.

00:52:36Guest:And he was great.

00:52:37Marc:Yeah.

00:52:38Guest:And I was with him for years.

00:52:39Marc:Had a good eye.

00:52:39Guest:He had a good eye.

00:52:41Marc:Yeah.

00:52:41Guest:Yeah.

00:52:42Marc:That's so wild that you and Ham are being managed by this little rinky-dink operation.

00:52:47Guest:Yeah, and we were at the table read of the very first episode of Mad Men, and John was like, I don't know if you remember, but we were both... I was like, oh my God, yeah, I remember meeting you.

00:52:58Guest:Yeah, it was really weird.

00:53:00Marc:Okay, so now you're managed, and he got you an agent?

00:53:04Guest:I mean, I went around and auditioned for agencies.

00:53:07Guest:Like, actually, a lot of people don't do this.

00:53:09Guest:I don't know how they get around it.

00:53:10Guest:Yeah.

00:53:10Guest:But I had to go in and, like, do a scene.

00:53:13Guest:Right.

00:53:13Guest:You know, so there was a very sweet, kind actor who was also with the same manager.

00:53:19Guest:Yeah.

00:53:19Guest:Who would go and audition.

00:53:20Guest:I would do, like, Meg Ryan scenes.

00:53:22Guest:Oh, right.

00:53:22Guest:You know, I was like, I'm a Meg Ryan type.

00:53:24Guest:Yeah, right.

00:53:25Yeah.

00:53:25Guest:You know, so I would go in and do do a scene.

00:53:30Guest:And then and then I got my first agent.

00:53:32Marc:And who was that?

00:53:33Guest:It was Don Buchwald.

00:53:35Marc:Oh, yeah.

00:53:35Marc:Yeah.

00:53:36Marc:I think they're still around.

00:53:37Guest:I think so.

00:53:38Marc:The Buchwald agency.

00:53:39Marc:I remember that.

00:53:40Guest:Yeah.

00:53:41Marc:Yeah.

00:53:41Marc:A lot of people were with them.

00:53:42Marc:That was sort of a big, not huge agency.

00:53:45Guest:So I was with them for about six months and I got an audition for Beggars and Choosers, which was on Showtime.

00:53:55Guest:And I got it and that was my first series.

00:53:57Marc:Really?

00:53:58Marc:And how many episodes did you do?

00:54:01Guest:It was one full season.

00:54:05Guest:I think we did maybe 16 episodes.

00:54:07Guest:I came in in season two.

00:54:08Marc:And did you do other parts?

00:54:09Marc:That was your first gig?

00:54:11Marc:Your first job?

00:54:13Guest:Before that, I did an episode of MTV Undressed.

00:54:18Marc:Yeah.

00:54:19Marc:I don't even remember that.

00:54:20Guest:No one remembers it.

00:54:21Guest:But...

00:54:22Guest:Anyone who was starting out got a job on that because they needed thousands of actors because it was one of these like meandering stories where this story happens and then that character meets and that starts the next episode.

00:54:34Guest:So I did an episode or a couple episodes of that.

00:54:37Guest:And then I did an episode of Angel where I played an Irish barmaid in the 1700s or something.

00:54:43Marc:Oh, well, that's dress up.

00:54:44Guest:That was dress up.

00:54:45Marc:Yeah.

00:54:45Guest:And I got to do a little Irish accent for like my one line or something.

00:54:49Guest:And then I got this series.

00:54:51Guest:So then I moved to Vancouver and started doing this show.

00:54:53Marc:Did 19 episodes.

00:54:55Guest:Did I do 19?

00:54:56Marc:Yeah.

00:54:56Guest:Oh, more than I thought.

00:54:57Marc:I just checked.

00:54:58Guest:Yeah.

00:54:58Guest:More than I thought.

00:54:59Marc:Vancouver's nice.

00:55:01Guest:Vancouver's very nice.

00:55:02Guest:It was not a great experience for me.

00:55:04Marc:Why?

00:55:05Guest:Uh...

00:55:07Guest:I'm not going to lie.

00:55:09Guest:I don't think that people should be protected when they act bad.

00:55:12Guest:Our lead actress was nasty, nasty mean.

00:55:15Guest:Yeah.

00:55:16Guest:She was just mean to everyone.

00:55:17Guest:And I came in in season two and there had sort of this precedent had already been set and the clicks had been set and people were scared of her and stayed away.

00:55:27Guest:And I was kind of the new kid who didn't know anyone.

00:55:31Guest:Carol Kane was on that show.

00:55:33Guest:She's sweet.

00:55:34Guest:And she is so sweet.

00:55:35Guest:And she came up to me one day and she was like, hi.

00:55:37Guest:Honey, you go stand right next to them.

00:55:39Guest:You're just as important as everybody else.

00:55:41Guest:And I looked at her and I was like, Carol Kane's saying this to me.

00:55:44Guest:I'm going to go.

00:55:45Guest:And she gave me some pep talks.

00:55:47Marc:Yeah, she's great.

00:55:49Guest:She's great.

00:55:50Guest:So I felt a little bit trapped in Vancouver.

00:55:52Marc:Yeah.

00:55:53Guest:But I made a couple nice friends.

00:55:55Marc:But then you just started working, it looks like.

00:55:58Marc:Like episode arcs, things.

00:56:00Yeah.

00:56:01Guest:I did Firefly.

00:56:02Guest:Movies.

00:56:04Guest:No, I did mostly television.

00:56:06Guest:I started to get film roles through Mad Men.

00:56:11Marc:So that was the big break, really, in a way.

00:56:13Guest:That was the big break.

00:56:14Guest:I mean, to me, you know, just going to work as an actor, my dad would keep being like, oh, you're almost there.

00:56:21Guest:I'm like, I'm on a national television.

00:56:25Guest:I'm an actor.

00:56:25Guest:What do you mean I'm almost there?

00:56:27Guest:This is the dream.

00:56:28Marc:And then there's a, we don't get that station.

00:56:30Guest:Yeah, yeah.

00:56:31Guest:And then, so then when you get Mad Men and then all of a sudden there's like a lot of attention, then you're like, oh, this is like the cherry on top of the career.

00:56:40Marc:Right, because now you can bring your daughter up and people are like, oh, I know her.

00:56:44Guest:All of a sudden your daughter's in like crossword puzzles and stuff.

00:56:47Guest:I know, the crossword puzzles.

00:56:47Marc:The coolest.

00:56:48Marc:That blows people away.

00:56:49Marc:Do you know you're a clue?

00:56:50Guest:Yeah, exactly.

00:56:51Guest:A Jeopardy clue.

00:56:53Marc:Yeah, I got that.

00:56:54Marc:I got one of those.

00:56:55Marc:I got a couple of New York Times crosswords and one Jeopardy clue.

00:56:58Guest:That will impress the parents.

00:56:59Marc:Sure.

00:56:59Guest:Yeah.

00:57:00Marc:But how did that come about?

00:57:02Marc:I'm sure you've told the story a million times, but I mean, like, how did you get that part?

00:57:06Guest:I mean, it was pilot season.

00:57:08Guest:So you go on a thousand auditions and a lot of people were talking about that one because it was really different.

00:57:17Marc:The casting.

00:57:18Marc:Talking about it.

00:57:19Guest:Talking about the script, like actors who are going out to audition, like, oh, did you read that one?

00:57:22Guest:Because that was like different.

00:57:24Guest:Yeah.

00:57:26Yeah.

00:57:26Guest:And I remember very distinctly, it was that casting studio out west that's like that little brick building on a cul-de-sac.

00:57:36Guest:I can't remember the name of it.

00:57:38Guest:And I went in there dressed like what I thought was sort of 60s-like, and I auditioned for the Joan role.

00:57:47Guest:And I remember it being nerve-wracking.

00:57:51Guest:Yeah.

00:57:52Guest:And then maybe a week and a half later, they said, they'd like you to come back and audition for the mid-roll.

00:57:59Guest:And the mid-roll was the artist who did greeting cards that has an affair with Don Draper.

00:58:04Guest:Right.

00:58:05Guest:Played by Rosemary DeWitt, who's amazing.

00:58:08Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:58:10Guest:So I went back and auditioned for that role and then a couple weeks later they said, why don't you come back and audition for Joan again?

00:58:17Guest:Yeah.

00:58:18Guest:I was like, I'm not bringing anything to this role.

00:58:20Guest:I was going over the lines with my best friend and I started crying because that's what pilot season will do to you.

00:58:25Guest:Sure.

00:58:25Guest:It will beat you down.

00:58:26Guest:Yeah.

00:58:28Guest:And I was like, I'm not doing anything.

00:58:29Guest:I'm just saying words.

00:58:31Guest:She was like, I think this is yours.

00:58:32Guest:I think you're going to get this one.

00:58:34Guest:And I went back and auditioned for Joan again.

00:58:37Guest:And then it was, it seems like maybe a month went by and I didn't hear a word.

00:58:42Guest:So I just thought it was another thing that I auditioned for that went away.

00:58:45Marc:What were the agents saying?

00:58:47Guest:They weren't saying anything because when you go, pilot season can sometimes be three to six auditions a day.

00:58:54Guest:So at the end of the day, they're like, yeah, they're going a different direction.

00:58:57Guest:Oh, they chose that.

00:58:59Guest:And if...

00:59:00Guest:Some of them just pass by and you never even ask about them.

00:59:02Guest:Because you're just like, if I didn't hear, then they didn't like me.

00:59:04Marc:Right, right.

00:59:06Marc:Did you want the role?

00:59:08Marc:Did you like the role?

00:59:09Marc:Did you know that the role was some sort of portal into something amazing or no?

00:59:14Guest:I didn't know.

00:59:14Guest:I thought it was... I didn't even get to read the whole script.

00:59:18Guest:I read scenes.

00:59:19Guest:Right.

00:59:20Guest:So I liked that it was... I could tell it was different and I could tell it was smart.

00:59:24Right.

00:59:24Guest:Yeah.

00:59:26Guest:But I didn't know what this character was, if anything.

00:59:29Guest:She was a guest star when I auditioned for it.

00:59:32Guest:Oh, really?

00:59:33Guest:Okay.

00:59:34Guest:So I thought the mid-roll was more exciting.

00:59:37Guest:Right.

00:59:38Guest:Because it was sexy.

00:59:39Guest:Yeah.

00:59:41Guest:So I said, I'll do any role in this thing if it's a series regular.

00:59:47Guest:Sure.

00:59:47Guest:And they said, well...

00:59:50Guest:it will become a series regular if we get like a season two or something like that, you know?

00:59:57Guest:So like a month later they called and said, you've got the part, which is weird because normally you would have to go through more steps like a network test and a studio test.

01:00:05Guest:But because AMC didn't have any other shows, they didn't have a system set up.

01:00:11Guest:Right.

01:00:12Guest:So they just were like, you're on tape.

01:00:14Guest:We saw it.

01:00:15Guest:You're great.

01:00:15Guest:That's right.

01:00:16Marc:AMC was Mad Men's on AMC.

01:00:18Guest:Yeah.

01:00:18Guest:We were there for a show ever.

01:00:19Marc:Yeah.

01:00:20Yeah.

01:00:21Guest:So I was up for another pilot, and my agents really wanted me to do that because it was the more prestigious.

01:00:30Guest:It was on a real network.

01:00:33Guest:Yeah.

01:00:33Guest:And it just seemed more of a sure bet.

01:00:35Guest:And I really put my foot down.

01:00:36Guest:I was like, I really...

01:00:38Guest:I want this, and my agents were like, we think you should go for the other one, and my manager really stood by me and said, I think this project, there's something really interesting.

01:00:46Marc:Not the old manager, the new manager.

01:00:48Marc:The new manager.

01:00:49Guest:And I said, I've done the projects that seem like sure bets, and they didn't get picked up either.

01:00:55Guest:I'm sorry, John Wells, Sally Field, I thought I was on the new West Wing.

01:00:59Guest:Canceled in six.

01:01:01Guest:So I was like, let's go for the cool one.

01:01:04Marc:Right.

01:01:05Marc:And you did that and your agents, did you fight with your agents?

01:01:07Guest:They let me go.

01:01:11Guest:They let me go.

01:01:12Guest:They were like, basically my agent went on pregnancy leave and then no one wanted to take over being my agent.

01:01:20Marc:You were working so much.

01:01:21Marc:How was that fucking possible?

01:01:22Guest:I was like...

01:01:23Guest:I have a series every year.

01:01:26Guest:What does it take?

01:01:28Guest:I guess it cost them a lot of money to send messengers and scripts to my house.

01:01:32Guest:They didn't see me going anywhere, I guess.

01:01:35Marc:So that was shitty and snotty.

01:01:37Guest:It was embarrassing.

01:01:38Guest:I was really embarrassed.

01:01:40Marc:Because your manager was like, this is what you're doing.

01:01:42Marc:The agent's like, well, fuck you.

01:01:44Guest:Kind of, yeah.

01:01:46Marc:And then you've got to, of no fault of your own, you've got to be like, you were dropped from your agency.

01:01:50Marc:Yeah.

01:01:51Marc:But then you have a sweet smell of revenge there.

01:01:55Guest:Yeah.

01:01:56Guest:I mean, I didn't...

01:01:57Guest:I had people, Matt was like, do you want me to write a, Matt Weiner, the creator of it, and he was like, you want me to write him a letter?

01:02:03Guest:And I said, the great thing about this show is no letter needs to be written.

01:02:08Guest:It's, we all know someone fucked up here.

01:02:12Marc:Yeah, it's good.

01:02:12Guest:And it wasn't me.

01:02:14Guest:Yeah.

01:02:15Marc:It's going to take care of itself.

01:02:16Guest:Yeah, I don't need to write any letters.

01:02:18Marc:But going into this role, you know, given that, you know, once you got the part, you'd only read the sides.

01:02:23Marc:And then, you know, once these scripts started coming and you realize that this was sort of a, you know, in terms of a female character, a kind of pivotal and unique character to be a woman who's going to eventually kind of

01:02:39Marc:fight it out and be judged by this you know these well-suited you know uh sexist predatory men yeah of an era but you know you were going to be the woman that sort of transcends in her whole you and elizabeth moss i believe if i remember properly took different journeys to exactly you know being you know realized yeah as powerful women

01:03:01Guest:But I didn't know.

01:03:03Guest:I mean, that is something that developed for the character.

01:03:06Guest:I mean, it wasn't something that we knew in season one.

01:03:10Guest:In season one, Matt Weiner said, you're going to have an affair with Roger Sterling.

01:03:14Guest:And I was like, yes, I love that actor.

01:03:16Guest:He's so good.

01:03:17Guest:I've always loved that actor.

01:03:19Guest:I can't believe I get to have scenes with him.

01:03:21Guest:So I was psyched about that.

01:03:23Guest:And that's the thing, like in season one, I'm kind of just this sassy bitch.

01:03:27Guest:Right.

01:03:28Guest:Like I come around and I like give people the once over and I tell them my opinion and make people feel bad.

01:03:37Guest:And she's kind of this eavesdropper, know-it-all busy bee.

01:03:42Guest:Yeah.

01:03:43Guest:Which was really fun.

01:03:44Guest:Yeah.

01:03:44Guest:But also like hard to wrap your head around.

01:03:48Guest:Yeah.

01:03:49Guest:Who and why she's this way.

01:03:51Marc:Right.

01:03:52Yeah.

01:03:52Guest:And then as the years developed.

01:03:54Marc:They must have been writing for you after season one, seeing what you could do.

01:04:00Marc:And that must have given them inspiration to take the character places that you could take it.

01:04:04Guest:I think so.

01:04:05Guest:And Matt always said he couldn't see Peggy without Joan.

01:04:10Guest:He couldn't see Joan without Peggy because there were such different women.

01:04:13Guest:Yeah.

01:04:14Guest:And it created such an interesting dynamic within that office space to see two women going about something so differently.

01:04:20Guest:Yeah.

01:04:20Guest:And...

01:04:21Guest:almost being friends but bumping heads and just fundamentally different ideas of how to get ahead.

01:04:31Guest:Yeah.

01:04:33Guest:So he loved showing their storylines through each other.

01:04:36Guest:And then I think as he got to know me, I think Joan softened up a little bit and she became a mother and a lover and a wife and you saw much more of her home life.

01:04:48Marc:Yeah.

01:04:49Guest:Yeah.

01:04:49Marc:But it must have been like at least, you know, throughout the run of Mad Men, the character kept evolving.

01:04:56Marc:Yeah.

01:04:56Marc:And it becomes like I imagine a joy to to sort of be involved because, you know, it's not one of those shows that sort of levels off and creates a one dimensional character that you just refill every week.

01:05:09Guest:No, it was like you would learn something new about her each week.

01:05:13Guest:And I mean, as you know, doing a show now for each season, you get more history with the other characters.

01:05:20Guest:And so every scene becomes richer and deeper because you're not playing that scene.

01:05:25Guest:You're playing six seasons.

01:05:27Marc:Right.

01:05:27Marc:Yeah.

01:05:28Guest:Emotions with someone.

01:05:29Guest:Every scene with Roger Sterling was so loaded.

01:05:33Guest:Yeah.

01:05:34Guest:More and more and more.

01:05:35Guest:So it just became like a joy.

01:05:38Guest:Yeah.

01:05:38Marc:And the thing just, you know, it kind of changed the culture, Mad Men, the culture of television and just the culture in general.

01:05:46Guest:Yeah.

01:05:46Marc:You know, and it's funny because I don't, I'm trying to see if I've watched, you know, you did a lot of work since then.

01:05:55Marc:Well, another period, that's fun.

01:05:57Yeah.

01:05:57Marc:I know those ladies.

01:05:59Marc:Yeah, they're great.

01:06:02Marc:But I imagine that the baggage that comes from being a cultural phenomenon has got to be a little exhausting.

01:06:09Guest:I mean, there is no baggage.

01:06:13Guest:I mean, it's just...

01:06:14Guest:I guess the best thing that ever happened to my career.

01:06:18Marc:Right, right, right.

01:06:19Guest:I mean, it opened up so many doors.

01:06:22Guest:Like I said, that's when I started doing films, getting offered.

01:06:26Guest:You know, I used to walk in a room to audition and they'd be eating a turkey sandwich and shuffling through a million hedgehogs, trying to find the one that's you while you're doing your scene.

01:06:33Guest:Yeah.

01:06:34Guest:Taking phone calls.

01:06:35Guest:Yeah.

01:06:36Guest:Now you walk in and you walk in and there's a little bit of respect there already because they liked your show.

01:06:41Guest:Right.

01:06:42Guest:They are going to give you a moment.

01:06:44Marc:Yeah.

01:06:44Guest:To do your thing.

01:06:45Guest:Sure.

01:06:46Guest:Right.

01:06:46Guest:And like not have a taco.

01:06:48Marc:Yeah.

01:06:48Marc:You know.

01:06:49Marc:Or fucking sit on their phone.

01:06:51Guest:Yeah.

01:06:52Guest:You know, whatever it is.

01:06:53Guest:You get that five minutes is actually yours.

01:06:56Guest:Yeah.

01:06:56Marc:Yeah, you're a made person.

01:06:58Guest:Yeah.

01:06:59Guest:Yeah, yeah.

01:07:01Guest:And before I got Mad Men, I was getting a lot more sort of the quirky sidekick friend or the nervous girl.

01:07:09Guest:And no one had ever thought that I could do something with a lot of strength.

01:07:15Guest:Yeah.

01:07:15Guest:And that character was filled with strength.

01:07:18Guest:Yeah.

01:07:18Guest:And it changed the type of roles that I've been offered.

01:07:23Guest:Yeah.

01:07:24Guest:The nice thing is a lot of people in our industry watched that show.

01:07:27Marc:Oh, yeah, exactly.

01:07:28Guest:So it helped, yeah.

01:07:28Marc:But out in the world, are you that person to people?

01:07:33Marc:Because it took me a long time to not see Jon Hamm as Don Draper.

01:07:39Guest:Yeah.

01:07:40Marc:I mean, I didn't think he would ever be able to kind of shift gears out of that.

01:07:44Guest:Right.

01:07:45Guest:I mean, for a long time...

01:07:48Guest:I think because I look so different than I did on the show.

01:07:51Guest:I mean, I always had the updo and the very, very proper tailoring and stuff.

01:07:54Guest:So when people see us out and our hair is down and we're in jeans and stuff, people are like, oh, my God, you're so young.

01:08:00Guest:I had no idea.

01:08:02Guest:And because it was so specific in 60s, the second you take us out of the 60s,

01:08:07Guest:It takes a second, but then you can just get back to normal and be like, oh, she can play a woman who lives now.

01:08:14Guest:It's possible.

01:08:15Marc:It's so funny about the 60s.

01:08:17Marc:Everybody looked old.

01:08:19Guest:Everyone looked old.

01:08:20Marc:Yeah, older.

01:08:20Guest:If you were 30, you looked like you were a grandparent.

01:08:23Marc:Yeah, it's weird, though, because it was even that way with the people that were not all... It always blows me away that Jimi Hendrix was 27 when he died.

01:08:33Guest:Are you serious?

01:08:33Marc:I think so, yeah, and Janis Joplin.

01:08:35Marc:Well, they were living hard.

01:08:37Marc:They were living hard, but they never seemed like they were in their 20s, even though they were hippies or whatever.

01:08:44Marc:But the people in Mad Men, you just assume they're just full-grown adults, but it's just the way it looked.

01:08:52Guest:I know.

01:08:53Guest:I mean, that's what everyone would be like.

01:08:55Guest:You look exactly like my mom or exactly like my grandmother, exactly like my aunt.

01:08:58Guest:And you pull up those old photos.

01:08:59Guest:Yeah.

01:09:00Guest:And it's like.

01:09:01Marc:And then you realize those people are 25.

01:09:03Marc:Exactly.

01:09:03Marc:They're not 35 or 40.

01:09:05Guest:People thought we were much, much older on the show.

01:09:08Marc:That's wild.

01:09:08Guest:Yeah.

01:09:09Guest:I mean, I was 30 when I started the show.

01:09:11Marc:Yeah.

01:09:12Marc:And so, and then this new show, like, I mean, you did other stuff, but this is the next big thing, right?

01:09:19Marc:Good Girls, really.

01:09:20Marc:The movies, though, you did good movies.

01:09:21Marc:Drive was a good movie.

01:09:22Guest:Thank you.

01:09:23Marc:Did you like doing that?

01:09:24Marc:I loved it.

01:09:25Guest:Yeah.

01:09:26Guest:I've got a chance to do a lot of great films in the time and in the break.

01:09:31Marc:Which one did you like the most?

01:09:34Guest:I mean.

01:09:34Marc:Like when you say that.

01:09:36Marc:Because Drive was like, that was an interesting movie.

01:09:39Guest:I mean, Drive, it's an interesting question.

01:09:42Guest:Which ones did you love doing the most?

01:09:44Guest:Which ones came out the best?

01:09:45Guest:Which ones are you most proud of?

01:09:48Guest:I'm so proud of Drive, and it's amazing.

01:09:50Guest:I wasn't there a ton.

01:09:51Guest:I have a small role, but it was an important thing for me.

01:09:56Guest:I just finished doing a movie last year called American Woman that'll be out in a couple,

01:10:01Guest:month and a half or so.

01:10:03Guest:That was just one of those things where it was like such a labor of love.

01:10:08Guest:It was just the most amazing experience.

01:10:12Marc:What's that about?

01:10:13Guest:It's about a family.

01:10:15Guest:Sienna Miller and I play sisters and her daughter is abducted and it's about this family sort of

01:10:21Guest:Breaking down and then bringing themselves back together and bonding and how you get through trauma.

01:10:27Marc:Oh, Pat Healy's in it.

01:10:30Guest:Love Pat Healy.

01:10:31Guest:And then I did Romanos with Matt Weiner over in Prague.

01:10:34Marc:When is that going to be on?

01:10:35Guest:It's already been on.

01:10:36Guest:It's done.

01:10:37Marc:Oh, it has?

01:10:38Guest:Yeah.

01:10:38Marc:Damn it.

01:10:39Guest:That's the thing.

01:10:40Guest:You can stream it.

01:10:41Marc:The hair person from Globe was on that, Teresa.

01:10:44Guest:I know, Teresa, and you know Lana.

01:10:45Marc:And Lana, yeah.

01:10:46Guest:Two of my best friends.

01:10:47Marc:They're your best friends?

01:10:47Guest:I mean, I worked with them.

01:10:49Guest:They're like family.

01:10:50Marc:Yeah.

01:10:52Guest:I was texting Lana yesterday.

01:10:53Marc:Oh, yeah?

01:10:53Marc:So you were coming on here?

01:10:55Guest:I didn't.

01:10:56Guest:I forgot about the connection, oddly.

01:10:58Guest:We were just talking about, like, stupid shit.

01:10:59Marc:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:11:00Marc:Teresa made me look like I was from the 80s.

01:11:03Guest:She's so good.

01:11:05Marc:Yeah, I love them.

01:11:05Marc:They're great.

01:11:06Guest:The way that she has done everyone's hair on that, I was like... It's crazy.

01:11:10Guest:It made me get a perm, first of all.

01:11:13Guest:Yeah.

01:11:13Guest:Fried my hair.

01:11:14Marc:Yeah.

01:11:15Guest:It's taken me a year and a half to try and get the stupid perm off because I was so inspired by what she did to everyone's hair that...

01:11:21Marc:Really?

01:11:22Marc:Darn it.

01:11:22Marc:I know.

01:11:23Marc:It's crazy.

01:11:23Marc:You went out and got a perm?

01:11:24Guest:I got a perm.

01:11:26Guest:I had these people that I somehow put blind trust in.

01:11:30Guest:They were like, oh, yeah, perms are different these days.

01:11:32Guest:I was like, but I have chemically treated hair.

01:11:34Guest:Are you sure?

01:11:35Guest:They were like, no problem.

01:11:37Guest:It was worse than your worst case scenario.

01:11:40Guest:They started crying.

01:11:41Guest:I had a chemical burn.

01:11:43Guest:It was breaking off.

01:11:44Guest:It was a nightmare.

01:11:46Marc:Oh, God.

01:11:47Guest:All because Alison Brie looked so good.

01:11:49Marc:That was a cute perm, right?

01:11:50Guest:So cute on her.

01:11:51Guest:Yeah.

01:11:51Guest:Best look ever.

01:11:52Marc:It's crazy with those girls.

01:11:54Marc:I'd come in at like seven and they'd been there since five just to get the fucking hair right.

01:11:59Guest:Yeah, I'm sure.

01:11:59Marc:And there's so many of them.

01:12:01Marc:I know.

01:12:01Marc:It was crazy.

01:12:02Guest:I also just worked with Mariana Palka.

01:12:04Guest:She directed me in a film.

01:12:06Marc:Recently?

01:12:07Guest:This past year.

01:12:08Marc:Oh, that's great.

01:12:08Marc:When's that coming out?

01:12:09Guest:It's out.

01:12:10Marc:Oh, boy.

01:12:11Marc:Which one's that called?

01:12:12Guest:It's called Egg.

01:12:13Marc:Yeah, how was that?

01:12:13Guest:It came out like two months ago.

01:12:15Guest:I can't keep up.

01:12:16Guest:No, there's a lot of stuff out there.

01:12:17Marc:There really is.

01:12:18Guest:There's a lot of content.

01:12:19Marc:But I watched a few good girls.

01:12:20Guest:Oh, good.

01:12:21Marc:Yeah.

01:12:22Guest:Excellent.

01:12:22Marc:Because I wanted to at least know what you were up to.

01:12:25Guest:Yeah.

01:12:26Marc:Now, with this role, did they have you in mind or did you go in for it?

01:12:32Guest:The truth is they shot the pilot with another actress.

01:12:35Guest:Really?

01:12:35Guest:And they were recasting the role and then they came to me and I got the very, very rare opportunity to see the show before I did it.

01:12:49Guest:Normally you read a script and you hope for the best, but I actually got to see a finished product.

01:12:54Marc:And they didn't air that pilot or they did?

01:12:55Guest:They did not.

01:12:56Marc:Right.

01:12:56Guest:No.

01:12:57Marc:So you are the person.

01:12:58Guest:So I'm the person as far as anyone's seen.

01:13:03Guest:This happens all the time in Hollywood.

01:13:06Guest:It is nothing against her or anyone who's been replaced.

01:13:09Guest:I have been replaced.

01:13:10Guest:I saw Julianne Moore on camera last night saying she was replaced.

01:13:15Marc:Please forgive me.

01:13:15Marc:Yeah.

01:13:16Marc:Yeah, that's kind of wild.

01:13:17Guest:I was like, Beth and Julianne Moore.

01:13:19Guest:It made me feel better.

01:13:21Guest:Yeah.

01:13:21Guest:Because it does happen to all of us at some point.

01:13:23Marc:Yeah.

01:13:24Marc:And then, yeah, right.

01:13:24Marc:And that other actress is going to have her version and her story.

01:13:27Guest:Yeah, exactly.

01:13:27Guest:And she'll have some amazing thing.

01:13:29Guest:Yeah.

01:13:29Guest:Exactly.

01:13:30Marc:Yeah.

01:13:30Marc:Usually it works out.

01:13:31Guest:It does.

01:13:32Guest:Yeah.

01:13:33Marc:Not always.

01:13:34Guest:So I got to see it.

01:13:36Marc:Yeah.

01:13:37Guest:I had read the script and I thought it was great, but I was like, I don't, it's on NBC.

01:13:42Guest:I don't know if I trust that they're going to go with this dark, weird tone.

01:13:45Marc:I was curious about that.

01:13:47Guest:Yeah.

01:13:47Guest:I was scared.

01:13:48Guest:And then I saw it and I was like, oh, they went for it.

01:13:51Mm-hmm.

01:13:51Guest:They went for it.

01:13:54Guest:And I thought, if they can keep doing this, then I'm interested.

01:14:00Guest:And it probably took me a month of talking to Jenna Banz, our creator, talking to people at NBC and being like, you have to promise me that you're not going to get scared and back down saying we offended someone or this got to.

01:14:14Guest:I said, this has got to be the tone of the show.

01:14:18Guest:And they kept promising, and they've been true to their word.

01:14:22Marc:And you like playing this character?

01:14:23Marc:It's complicated to create these strong female characters.

01:14:31Marc:It's that zone where I think it probably started... Breaking Bad has this idea that these characters are decent folks that have become...

01:14:42Marc:Morally compromised out of necessity or out of and then, you know, they kind of live in that zone.

01:14:49Marc:They navigate, you know, being kind of bad people, but but you empathize for.

01:14:55Guest:Right.

01:14:56Marc:Yeah.

01:14:56Marc:It's tricky.

01:14:57Guest:Whereas in Breaking Bad, I think they went a little more full throttle.

01:15:01Marc:Right.

01:15:02Marc:That's what I mean.

01:15:02Marc:Like, we're Breaking Bad.

01:15:03Marc:Like, you definitely were empathizing for a guy who killed people.

01:15:07Guest:Right.

01:15:08Guest:And on ours, you know, it gets compared to it because, obviously, it's people living normal lives in the Midwest who stumble into this thing that's so out of their depth.

01:15:20Marc:Yeah, and they try to navigate it.

01:15:22Guest:And they try to navigate it.

01:15:23Guest:But they're...

01:15:26Guest:constantly backtracking and wanting to be good people and drawing lines in places like that.

01:15:34Guest:That's where we, we can't go further than that.

01:15:35Guest:That's where I draw the line.

01:15:36Guest:That's when you're a bad person.

01:15:38Guest:This is when you're a good person.

01:15:40Guest:Yeah.

01:15:40Guest:And how you justify doing those bad things little by little.

01:15:43Marc:Like you don't shoot the guy.

01:15:44Guest:You don't shoot the guy.

01:15:45Guest:We're not killers, you know?

01:15:46Marc:Not yet.

01:15:47Guest:And so we're still like doing bake sales and we're still, you know, picking them up at the pool, but trying to navigate this thing.

01:15:54Marc:And your husband had to take a bullet.

01:15:55Guest:Husband had to take a bullet.

01:15:58Guest:Yeah.

01:15:58Guest:Matt Lillard, who's great.

01:16:00Marc:I haven't seen him, I think, since Descendants.

01:16:03Guest:Who's great on that.

01:16:04Marc:He plays similar character in a way.

01:16:06Guest:Yeah.

01:16:07Guest:Yeah.

01:16:07Guest:Kind of a douche.

01:16:08Guest:A douche.

01:16:09Guest:But he couldn't be nicer.

01:16:10Guest:He's the best guy ever.

01:16:12Guest:Yeah.

01:16:13Guest:I'm so lucky to get to play his wife.

01:16:15Guest:But...

01:16:16Guest:And he jokes, he's like, God, why do I have to be such a dick all the time?

01:16:24Guest:But he does it really well.

01:16:26Guest:And his role is really hard, too, because you're teetering on this guy who's cheated on his wife and depleted their financials and been reckless.

01:16:34Guest:And yet there's something the way that Matt does it that's sort of lovable and likable.

01:16:39Guest:And you can see why they were together and you can see that he's a good dad.

01:16:43Yeah.

01:16:43Guest:Right.

01:16:44Guest:You can see there's history there.

01:16:45Guest:So it's a bit of a complicated relationship.

01:16:48Marc:And are people watching it?

01:16:50Guest:I think so.

01:16:50Marc:It's on network.

01:16:52Marc:You should know.

01:16:53Guest:First of all, I don't know what those numbers mean.

01:16:56Marc:I'm really bad at it.

01:16:58Guest:One, yes.

01:17:00Guest:But yes, they watched it on NBC.

01:17:02Guest:But then they really started watching it on Netflix.

01:17:04Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:17:05Guest:A lot of people think we're a Netflix show.

01:17:07Guest:We are an NBC show.

01:17:09Guest:It's kind of two different audiences, which is great.

01:17:12Guest:And then we're on Hulu.

01:17:14Guest:So we're getting ourselves out there in a bunch of different ways.

01:17:17Guest:But a lot of people were like, oh, my God, I just binge watched your show.

01:17:20Guest:Are you going to get a season two?

01:17:21Guest:And I'm like, yeah, it's actually on tonight.

01:17:23Guest:But you have to watch it on NBC.

01:17:25Marc:You've got to watch it like a normal TV show.

01:17:27Guest:Yeah.

01:17:27Guest:I like having to wait a week.

01:17:28Guest:Me too.

01:17:29Guest:I like that.

01:17:30Marc:Yeah, it's better than watching all of them at once and having to wait a year.

01:17:32Guest:You also completely forget.

01:17:35Marc:Right.

01:17:35Guest:I'll watch an entire series and I'm like, that was amazing.

01:17:39Guest:Oh, my God.

01:17:39Guest:And then they're like, remember when?

01:17:41Guest:And I'm like, no, I watched it in three days.

01:17:43Marc:Yeah.

01:17:44Guest:I consumed too much at one time.

01:17:45Marc:It's crazy because you literally got to wait a year.

01:17:47Marc:That was the benefit of a weekly thing is you looked forward to it.

01:17:50Marc:Like when The Sopranos first aired, it was like you built your life around Sunday.

01:17:54Guest:Oh, my God.

01:17:55Guest:Of course.

01:17:55Guest:And Mad Men, people would talk about what happened all week long.

01:17:59Marc:I think it was Better World.

01:18:00Guest:I think so.

01:18:02Guest:I think so.

01:18:02Marc:But everybody's doing such great.

01:18:03Marc:You know, Reddit, that's like a completely different thing for her.

01:18:06Marc:I've never seen her like that.

01:18:07Marc:She's awesome.

01:18:09Guest:Yeah.

01:18:09Guest:She's so awesome in it.

01:18:10Guest:And May is amazing.

01:18:11Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:18:12Marc:You guys are.

01:18:13Marc:They're the coolest.

01:18:14Marc:You're great.

01:18:14Marc:And you're going to ride that line this whole season.

01:18:18Guest:Yeah.

01:18:18Guest:I mean, it gets darker in season two.

01:18:20Guest:Yeah.

01:18:21Guest:The characters are quirky and they're in ridiculous situations.

01:18:25Guest:So it is really funny.

01:18:26Guest:The show is really, really funny.

01:18:28Guest:But at its core, it's a drama and it's quite emotional.

01:18:32Marc:But they are sensitive to the comedy of it?

01:18:36Marc:I mean, you said it's funny.

01:18:38Marc:Like, are they right?

01:18:38Marc:Do they know it's funny?

01:18:40Yeah.

01:18:40Guest:Yeah, I mean, I think the whole time we've been trying to ride this line of comedy drama.

01:18:46Guest:In fact, as you know, like when it comes to award seasons and stuff and they want to put you up for a category, we didn't know what we would call ourselves because we really feel like... I guess that's a way of... Yeah, I can see that.

01:19:00Marc:I only watched a few, but I guess, yeah, I can see that it does play for comedy.

01:19:04Marc:And I guess that's sort of a way...

01:19:06Marc:To temper the darkness of it, you know, because Ozarks does not have any funny in it.

01:19:11Guest:No, that's dark.

01:19:13Marc:You know, but it's sort of a similar setup where you have like someone who's just trying to get their asses out of something, but then ends up, you know.

01:19:19Guest:Yeah, there's definitely...

01:19:22Guest:intentional humor in this yeah sure and we write the humor but we try not to play the humor right but it's so confusing these days it's sort of like if you're a half hour show then you're just automatically considered a comedy yeah but was nurse Jackie a comedy yeah yeah I don't know it's like a drama to me right right yeah all of this stuff is BS but I like watching shows that I get both I think it's interesting I thought Mad Men was hilarious yeah did you yeah I thought it was really funny it was dark and funny and weird I'm trying to think if I thought it was funny

01:19:52Guest:I mean, just think of all the like Roger Sterling lines.

01:19:55Guest:Oh, he's funny.

01:19:56Guest:Snarky and witty guy.

01:19:58Guest:Things happening to Pete Campbell.

01:20:00Guest:And there was some weird, funny stuff.

01:20:01Marc:There was.

01:20:02Marc:Yeah.

01:20:03Marc:Well, congratulations on it.

01:20:04Guest:Thank you.

01:20:05Marc:It was nice talking to you.

01:20:06Guest:Very nice.

01:20:07Marc:Do you think we covered it?

01:20:08Marc:Oh, wait.

01:20:08Marc:Accordion.

01:20:10Guest:Oh, my God.

01:20:11Guest:There's not a lot to tell.

01:20:12Marc:But you can play it.

01:20:13Guest:I can't anymore.

01:20:15Guest:This is the sad truth.

01:20:16Guest:My ex knew that I always loved the accordion.

01:20:21Guest:I thought it was a beautiful instrument.

01:20:23Guest:One year he gave it to me for Christmas.

01:20:25Guest:And so I started learning as an adult.

01:20:28Guest:It's not something I grew up with.

01:20:29Marc:You weren't some sort of polka master when you were a kid?

01:20:32Guest:No.

01:20:32Guest:So I would go to Silver Lake Conservatory of Music.

01:20:35Guest:Fleece Place?

01:20:35Guest:Yeah, Fleece Place.

01:20:36Guest:They sort of tout themselves as saying, we teach every instrument.

01:20:40Guest:So I found an accordion teacher there and studied a little bit with him.

01:20:45Guest:And then on Mad Men...

01:20:47Guest:Matt called me one day and he was like, do you speak French and do you play the piano?

01:20:51Guest:And I said, I'll learn French if you want me to.

01:20:54Guest:And I don't really play the piano, but I do play a little accordion, which was perfect because we hadn't established a piano in Joan's apartment.

01:21:03Guest:Yeah.

01:21:04Guest:It's a very small apartment.

01:21:05Guest:Right.

01:21:05Guest:So to strap on an accordion solved a million problems.

01:21:09Guest:Interesting.

01:21:09Guest:So then they got me another accordion teacher and had her come up and teach me each week.

01:21:14Guest:So when I play on Mad Men, I am like anyone who actually plays the accordion is like, oh, she is not very good.

01:21:19Guest:Yeah.

01:21:20Guest:But enough to like do it.

01:21:21Guest:Right.

01:21:21Guest:I was a beginner and I really enjoyed it.

01:21:24Guest:And then.

01:21:25Guest:I went on location for different films and this and that and set it aside.

01:21:28Guest:And it's in my office, winking at me every day.

01:21:31Guest:And I want to play it, but I'd be starting over.

01:21:33Guest:I would be starting over.

01:21:34Guest:But I won't get rid of it because I do have every intention of starting again.

01:21:39Marc:Okay.

01:21:39Marc:Well, maybe someday.

01:21:41Marc:Maybe someday.

01:21:42Marc:All right.

01:21:42Marc:Good talking to you.

01:21:48Marc:That's it.

01:21:49Marc:Christina Hendricks.

01:21:51Marc:Nice chatting with her.

01:21:53Marc:Good Girls is on.

01:21:54Marc:The new episodes are on Sunday nights at 10, 9 central.

01:21:58Marc:Okay.

01:22:00Marc:All right.

01:22:00Marc:I haven't played guitar in weeks.

01:22:02Marc:For all the tour dates, which there are many now, go to wtfpod.com slash tour.

01:22:08Marc:Haven't picked up a guitar in two weeks.

01:22:10Marc:Let's pick it up now.

01:22:12Marc:And let's put some fucking echo on it.

01:22:17Yeah.

01:22:43Guest:Boomer lives.