Episode 1009 - Bruce McCulloch

Episode 1009 • Released April 11, 2019 • Speakers detected

00:00:00Marc:all right let's do this how are you what the fuckers what the fuck buddies what the fucksters what's happening uh this is wtf did you know what you tuned in for do you want to double check what did i do it right i was i was playing with a knob

00:00:24Marc:But I'm in a hotel room still.

00:00:26Marc:I've been away so long now.

00:00:28Marc:I'm in Dublin, Ireland right now.

00:00:31Marc:I'm sitting in Dublin in a hotel room, and there's a pastry problem.

00:00:36Marc:Yeah, I can't even.

00:00:37Marc:They're just over there.

00:00:38Marc:I'll explain to you in a minute.

00:00:40Marc:Anyways, Bruce McCullough of the Kids in the Hall is on the show today, and he is, I think there's five of them, right?

00:00:47Marc:So this will be four out of the five.

00:00:49Marc:All I'm missing is a McKinney.

00:00:51Marc:Bruce is here.

00:00:52Marc:It was great to talk to him.

00:00:54Marc:He sounds uniquely like himself.

00:00:56Marc:There is no doubt who I am talking to.

00:00:58Marc:He's been on the on the on the road with his one man show Tales of Bravery and Stupidity.

00:01:05Marc:And that's he's turning that into a book.

00:01:07Marc:And he's also, I guess, the executive producer and director of the upcoming sketch comedy show called Tall Boys.

00:01:13Marc:So on Sunday, what I did was today's Thursday.

00:01:17Marc:I haven't talked to you since Monday, but I didn't tell you about Sunday.

00:01:20Marc:So Sunday was a big day.

00:01:22Marc:It was the day before I did Birmingham, England, which was a good show.

00:01:26Marc:It was an interesting show.

00:01:28Marc:So on Sunday, I went down to the Hayward Gallery, and that's down by South Bank Center where I did the show.

00:01:34Marc:This is in London.

00:01:35Marc:I was going to go see the Diane Arbus show.

00:01:37Marc:They have a Diane Arbus exhibit of early photographs of Diane Arbus.

00:01:41Marc:Some I've seen, most of them I hadn't.

00:01:43Marc:It was sort of before she found her style in a way.

00:01:47Marc:You could see it coming, but she was still using a 35 millimeter camera before she went with the, I think it's two and a half by two and a half square, maybe Hasselblad type of stuff or something.

00:01:56Marc:one of the other bigger cameras.

00:01:59Marc:And she did a lot of those shots that you know that are hers, that are signature hers.

00:02:04Marc:But this before was more of a Ouija, Versailles, Robert Frank-ish, I think, area of photography.

00:02:11Marc:Though you could see it coming, but it was a little more, it was a little different.

00:02:16Marc:Still starting to kind of peel back the layers of people who are painfully authentic, slightly disturbing.

00:02:23Marc:But anyway, so I went to see that.

00:02:26Marc:But there was another show along with it that kind of blew my mind.

00:02:30Marc:And it was one of those moments where you realize just how isolated or insulated or just detached we are in America.

00:02:40Marc:Maybe not everybody.

00:02:41Marc:Maybe I'm just talking about me.

00:02:42Marc:Maybe I can't generalize and say it's the whole country about...

00:02:46Marc:the broader palette, the broader spectrum of other cultures, other problems, other issues that happen internationally that are similar to some of the issues we have, but different.

00:02:57Marc:And it was kind of blowing my mind.

00:02:58Marc:This Algerian, a French Algerian artist, I believe,

00:03:03Marc:His name is Cater Atia.

00:03:05Marc:There was a lot of his work, several different rooms, different things.

00:03:09Marc:There was a room full of pictures of Algerian transgender prostitutes in Paris.

00:03:14Marc:There was another room that dealt primarily with kind of documentary, short documentary footage about people talking about lost limbs, both from war and from other reasons.

00:03:25Marc:And then there was another room that was like structural sculpture that was sort of like housing projects.

00:03:32Marc:Stuff based on the grid of housing projects.

00:03:35Marc:And there was another room that had large shelves with primitive and some modern African masks with books.

00:03:44Marc:And some of these masks had disfigured faces on them.

00:03:46Marc:And then there were photographs of World War II soldiers whose faces were disfigured and then repaired.

00:03:54Marc:He's sort of obsessed with the idea of repair and what repair implies.

00:03:59Marc:It's all very deep and very complicated and provocative.

00:04:02Marc:But it was got me into that space where I bought the book and I'm reading about it.

00:04:07Marc:And it's all about post-colonialism and about the struggle of of self and what public housing and projects do to ethnic groups who are marginalized and expected to integrate.

00:04:18Marc:It was it was a lot.

00:04:20Marc:There was a lot of different rooms, a lot of different angles.

00:04:22Marc:And my brain was all blown out with the Arvis photograph.

00:04:26Marc:So I was pretty wide open.

00:04:29Marc:And then downstairs at the BFI, the British Film Institute, they were running new prints of Clockwork Orange.

00:04:35Marc:So I went and saw that.

00:04:36Marc:So needless to say, I was blasted apart in a pretty dark way.

00:04:41Marc:I don't think about post-colonialism.

00:04:45Marc:It was bad.

00:04:46Marc:But that's not a conversation that we really have in the States, or maybe it's not a conversation I have.

00:04:50Marc:It just made me realize in that moment that

00:04:54Marc:That we sort of get, even if you're open-minded, it's amazing how narrow-minded you get in terms of what is sort of moving through your brain and how you see the world.

00:05:04Marc:And this just sort of kind of supported and kind of blew out and opened up my own mind.

00:05:11Marc:weird you know floating sense of you know what do i how do i know what i know what do i know that is real what is truth you know what is happening is it over it was a dark day and then i had dinner with yorgos lanthimos who went to my show you might have remembered i interviewed him he's a director greek director lives in london and he directed the favorite and some of those kind of

00:05:35Marc:provocative and troubling movies that i enjoyed the lobster killing the sacred deer alps dog tooth yeah he turns yeah he's obviously a very bright and very smart guy with a very you know real vision a slightly dark vision so it was a full-on dark vision day but uh me and yorgos just had a nice chat about love life food

00:05:58Marc:creativity ate at a nice place yep desserts that's where it started now that i'm thinking about it i'm i'm on a roll man with the food there's pastries over there i'll explain it to you in a minute i think i'm trying to say that i'm having a pretty good time and i'm filling my brain up and i'm loading it up and i'm blowing it out and um i'm integrating it into what i'm thinking about out loud on stage and it's good it's proactive um

00:06:22Marc:I'm eating well, but I'm hating myself for it.

00:06:25Marc:But that is the wire I walk.

00:06:30Marc:That's the thin ice of me.

00:06:32Marc:I'm out there.

00:06:33Marc:I'm out there without a net, eating things that can just completely drop the bottom out of my entire sense of self.

00:06:40Marc:But, right?

00:06:41Marc:Live a little.

00:06:42Marc:So the pastries, maybe I should address that email.

00:06:45Marc:Mark, my husband and I are huge fans and it has been great to watch your fame grow bigger every year.

00:06:50Marc:I just wanted to write and ask you how you have learned to mellow out over the years.

00:06:55Marc:You are constantly mentioning that you were jealous and angry in your earlier career.

00:06:59Marc:I personally can tell this in the tone of your voice during your podcast and stand up over the years.

00:07:04Marc:Do you meditate?

00:07:05Marc:Do yoga?

00:07:06Marc:How have you found your personal inner peace?

00:07:09Marc:This is a constant battle for myself and I'm looking for some guidance.

00:07:13Marc:Big fan, May.

00:07:14Marc:May, there is nothing going on inside of me that resembles inner peace, first of all.

00:07:24Marc:Second of all, the jealousy and anger has been tempered.

00:07:28Marc:I still find it comes up in moments.

00:07:30Marc:It doesn't need to come up, but it does.

00:07:32Marc:The anger thing is there, but it's getting better.

00:07:35Marc:A couple of things have happened.

00:07:37Marc:I have found some success in my life, which kind of filled a certain void in that I worked my entire life to achieve something, and I seem to have achieved a lot of the things I wanted to achieve, and I am achieving them still.

00:07:52Marc:So that helps a lot.

00:07:54Marc:I used to do yoga.

00:07:55Marc:I don't.

00:07:56Marc:I exercise a lot except right now because I'm on the road and I've chosen to eat instead of exercise.

00:08:00Marc:I don't meditate.

00:08:01Marc:I've tried.

00:08:01Marc:I find it irritating.

00:08:04Marc:But a lot of it has to do with just knowing what's real and what isn't, which is the big question.

00:08:08Marc:What are you reacting to?

00:08:10Marc:How are you making yourself crazy?

00:08:12Marc:Is it real or is it something your brain is just doing to you?

00:08:15Marc:Usually for me, it was something my brain is doing to me.

00:08:19Marc:And that I think is probably the same for a lot of people.

00:08:22Marc:The truth is, is that if you look around and you make a little gratitude list, what is going well?

00:08:27Marc:What are you thankful for?

00:08:28Marc:Did you have a nice breakfast?

00:08:32Marc:How's your pets?

00:08:34Marc:Is your partner a nice person?

00:08:38Marc:Some of those things, you can check those off and maybe find a little balance.

00:08:41Marc:But some kind of self-acceptance, I think, is necessary.

00:08:44Marc:It's a tall order, especially if your brain is projecting garbage all the time.

00:08:48Marc:But sometimes you can turn that off.

00:08:51Marc:Those are the times that are enjoyable.

00:08:54Marc:I hope that helps.

00:08:55Marc:Thanks for writing in.

00:08:57Marc:I don't know.

00:08:59Marc:I don't know.

00:08:59Marc:There's pastries over there.

00:09:02Marc:I'm staying at this hotel.

00:09:03Marc:All right.

00:09:04Marc:I'm in Dublin.

00:09:05Marc:I'm excited to be here.

00:09:06Marc:I get here and I walk into my room and there's a tray of four fancy pastry art, pastry, little pieces of stuff, cookies, stuff with cream, stuff with arty chocolate on top, things that look too pretty to eat.

00:09:22Marc:And it's just sort of like, what the fuck?

00:09:25Marc:I can't just do this.

00:09:26Marc:There's four of them.

00:09:27Marc:And I felt bad because I want to insult the pastry chef.

00:09:30Marc:I get really weird about throwing food away when I really think about how much food gets thrown in the garbage.

00:09:36Marc:And I think, well, you can grow more stuff that grows.

00:09:38Marc:And I guess you can make more meat.

00:09:39Marc:But that's part of the problem.

00:09:41Marc:How many fish are there left?

00:09:42Marc:How can we throw all this fish away?

00:09:44Marc:It doesn't matter.

00:09:45Marc:That's sometimes where my brain goes.

00:09:47Marc:Pastries are a little different.

00:09:48Marc:But I did feel bad.

00:09:49Marc:But I was like, went downstairs.

00:09:50Marc:I'm like, you got to get those out of my room because I can't do that right now.

00:09:54Marc:I didn't go too far into it.

00:09:55Marc:I didn't spin out in front of the woman at the front desk.

00:09:58Marc:Like, I really, I don't know what you're trying to do to me.

00:10:00Marc:I mean, come on, fuck that.

00:10:02Marc:They look so good, but I can't do it because then it'll just be a spiral of darkness.

00:10:08Marc:It was a pretty little sweet spiral of darkness available to me.

00:10:13Marc:This goes back to what May just wrote.

00:10:16Marc:Try not to do those things that will throw you into a spiral of darkness.

00:10:20Marc:And then I come back to my room, and there's not one tray of pastry, little pastry cookie things, there's two.

00:10:28Marc:And they gave me a mistake one.

00:10:30Marc:There was a card to me, thanks for being at the hotel.

00:10:32Marc:And then there was a card to Mr. Jackson, and on it they squirted in chocolate, happy 10th stay.

00:10:40Marc:That's not me.

00:10:42Marc:I don't even know if this is real again.

00:10:43Marc:I'm in another hotel.

00:10:44Marc:Am I in the shining?

00:10:46Marc:Have I been here 10 times?

00:10:47Marc:Should I eat both of those trays of pastries?

00:10:50Marc:There's eight of them just sitting over there.

00:10:51Marc:And if I don't get them the fuck out of my room, I'm going to eat them all really fast and then sit there in a sugar coma and wonder why about everything.

00:11:03Marc:Not going to do it.

00:11:06Marc:Anyway, this pastry's right there.

00:11:09Marc:There's two trays of them.

00:11:11Marc:There's a round thing with some cream on it, then a square thing with several layers and a couple of pretty candies on it.

00:11:18Marc:And then there's a brownie floating on what looks like a piece of peanut brittle with some other goop on the top.

00:11:23Marc:And then there's just a little piece of chocolate.

00:11:26Marc:Now, knowing me, if I leave them there long enough, I'll be like, I'm just going to eat the little piece of chocolate.

00:11:30Marc:And then there's a bowl of chocolate.

00:11:32Marc:What the fuck is with this chocolate?

00:11:33Marc:There's a piece of chocolate on the bed.

00:11:35Marc:Maybe I'm not cut out for this nice hotel shit.

00:11:38Marc:I'm having a good time.

00:11:39Marc:Did I mention that?

00:11:40Marc:Can you hear it in my voice?

00:11:41Marc:Bruce McCullough, the fourth kid in the hall that I've talked to.

00:11:49Marc:His one-man show, Tales of Bravery and Stupidity.

00:11:52Marc:He tours with that.

00:11:53Marc:It's also becoming a book.

00:11:55Marc:And he's also the executive producer and director of the upcoming sketch comedy show called Tall Boys.

00:12:00Marc:This is me talking to Bruce McCullough.

00:12:06Guest:Are you trying to intimidate me with your expensive guitars?

00:12:16Marc:No, I mean, well... Yeah?

00:12:18Marc:No, no.

00:12:21Marc:The Gibson I got for free.

00:12:22Marc:Right.

00:12:23Marc:Yeah.

00:12:23Marc:So I'm not trying to intimidate you.

00:12:25Marc:People just give you guitars, right?

00:12:27Marc:Well, I work it.

00:12:28Marc:Yeah.

00:12:28Marc:I mean, I'm not a musician, so in order for me to get a free guitar from Gibson, I've got to really jump through some hoops.

00:12:33Marc:Yeah.

00:12:34Marc:I had to do some things.

00:12:35Guest:Yeah.

00:12:35Guest:See, I still get caps.

00:12:37Guest:That's where I'm at.

00:12:38Guest:Caps?

00:12:38Guest:Yeah.

00:12:39Guest:Like a toque.

00:12:41Guest:It says Project 10 or something on it.

00:12:44Guest:I'm not fucking with that.

00:12:45Marc:And a water bottle.

00:12:46Guest:Yeah.

00:12:46Marc:Yeah.

00:12:47Marc:Get a water bottle.

00:12:49Marc:So where'd you drive?

00:12:52Marc:Am I close to you?

00:12:53Marc:I mean, are we?

00:12:53Guest:I was in Laurel Canyon.

00:12:55Marc:Is that where you live?

00:12:56Guest:No, I actually live in Toronto and I stayed late.

00:13:00Guest:Oh, really?

00:13:01Guest:To come to this?

00:13:02Guest:To come see you.

00:13:03Guest:That's nice.

00:13:03Guest:Because you're an influencer.

00:13:05Guest:Am I still?

00:13:07Guest:Yeah.

00:13:07Guest:And you have many platforms, which is a funny word.

00:13:10Marc:I think I have one primary platform, and it's podcasting.

00:13:14Marc:I can't, you know, I'm about to, I'm trying to get off the platforms.

00:13:17Marc:Right.

00:13:18Marc:Are you?

00:13:19Guest:I'm just on Twitter.

00:13:20Marc:I can't take it anymore.

00:13:22Guest:Yeah, well, it's, everyone went through a thing, I think, when he was first elected, where they were all so sad, but I think people are funny again now.

00:13:30Marc:Well, it's weird because that's what happened.

00:13:32Marc:He was elected.

00:13:32Marc:We're not mentioning names.

00:13:34Marc:The monster came.

00:13:35Marc:When the monster, when the golem showed up.

00:13:40Marc:Yeah, everyone was like, it's over.

00:13:42Marc:But I kind of stuck to it.

00:13:43Marc:I stopped tweeting.

00:13:45Marc:Uh, anything funny or clever.

00:13:47Marc:Right.

00:13:48Marc:Uh, arguably ever.

00:13:49Marc:But I mean, when, when Trump took office, I was like, I'm out.

00:13:52Marc:And I just never really went back.

00:13:54Marc:Yeah.

00:13:54Marc:Because then it just seemed like this, I don't know.

00:13:57Marc:Do you ever look at Twitter and just see just a lot of needy people?

00:14:01Marc:Um, like people we know even.

00:14:03Marc:Yeah.

00:14:03Marc:All of us.

00:14:04Marc:Yeah.

00:14:04Marc:all of us needy children who had bad childhoods it's true right there we are yeah yeah just every 10 minutes like oh there he is again yeah some too many yeah and of course i have friends who this is the good life really yeah what do you mean like oh here's me in paris oh they do that a little bit of that is that instagram more uh i guess i'm not on instagram but they do it on twitter yeah oh really so you've got some of those friends who are like how you doing it's like shut up yeah

00:14:29Marc:Yeah, I'm living my best life at Trader Joe's.

00:14:35Marc:They have Trader Joe's in Toronto?

00:14:37Marc:They do not.

00:14:38Marc:Oh, I think I remembered that.

00:14:39Marc:Because once you get hooked to Trader Joe's, you go somewhere else, you're like, how do you not have it?

00:14:43Marc:Yeah, where's Trader Joe's?

00:14:44Marc:Yeah, and then you realize, like, it's not that great.

00:14:46Marc:Yeah.

00:14:46Marc:Is it?

00:14:46Guest:I don't know.

00:14:47Guest:It's like, and you're asking, it's like it's fentanyl or something.

00:14:49Guest:Hey man, where's Trader Joe's?

00:14:51Marc:You want that consistency.

00:14:52Marc:You want to be able to show up and go like, it's just like ours.

00:14:54Marc:They have the same things.

00:14:55Guest:Yeah.

00:14:56Guest:I want the $6 rosé.

00:14:58Marc:Yeah.

00:14:59Guest:So, all right.

00:15:00Guest:So you live in Toronto.

00:15:01Guest:I just, I've been in, I had been in LA for almost 20 years and I just moved back.

00:15:05Guest:Oh, this sounds like a sad story.

00:15:07Guest:Yeah.

00:15:07Guest:It's a very sad story.

00:15:08Guest:No, I'd always sort of promised myself and my family that I'd be back by the time my daughter was in high school, which was this year.

00:15:14Marc:She started high school this year?

00:15:16Marc:Yeah.

00:15:17Marc:But aren't you relieved that you have Canada?

00:15:20Guest:I am, yeah.

00:15:21Guest:And I think I feel sort of bad that I'm leaving the shit show because there's so many sad people here and it's not a great time.

00:15:30Marc:I thought you meant the show you were directing, Schitt's Creek.

00:15:32Guest:Yeah.

00:15:32Guest:I'm like, wow.

00:15:35Marc:Excellent segue.

00:15:36Marc:You're out.

00:15:36Marc:I'm out.

00:15:37Marc:Yeah, fuck that show.

00:15:40Marc:No, the shit show is true.

00:15:41Marc:But you're sad a little bit?

00:15:43Guest:Well, no, I don't want people to think I've left because of Trump.

00:15:47Marc:Right.

00:15:47Guest:It was just time of the season, as we like to say.

00:15:49Marc:No, I mean, I think if you would have left because of Trump, you're on the other side of the arc here.

00:15:54Marc:You would have got out two years ago and said, fuck this.

00:15:57Guest:But did you become a citizen here?

00:15:59Guest:How does that work?

00:15:59Guest:I have two passports in my expensive lapel of my jacket.

00:16:04Marc:What does it take?

00:16:04Marc:Because initially when he took office, I was very panicked that my people, them being the Jews, were going to be corralled up.

00:16:13Marc:No, the Jews are fine now.

00:16:14Marc:It's the darker skinned people.

00:16:15Marc:Well, that was my girlfriend's argument was like, I don't think you're first on the list.

00:16:20Marc:I know, but we're on it.

00:16:22Marc:Four down probably.

00:16:23Marc:But that's insensitive.

00:16:25Marc:But I did call an immigration lawyer in Canada.

00:16:29Marc:I did a little research and her English was choppy and she was French and I didn't quite understand.

00:16:35Marc:It seemed like a big ordeal.

00:16:37Marc:Right.

00:16:38Marc:Was it a big ordeal?

00:16:39Guest:No, you just pay a guy.

00:16:40Guest:You just got to know a guy, pay a guy.

00:16:41Marc:Really?

00:16:42Marc:To be a citizen here as a Canadian?

00:16:44Guest:Yeah, but I'd had H1s or whatever it was through my career.

00:16:48Marc:Yeah.

00:16:49Marc:Well, I remember, I guess I was at Comedy Central.

00:16:52Marc:No, I mean, it was sort of after the kids in the hall kind of already ran its course, but we ran them constantly.

00:16:58Marc:The early Comedy Central.

00:17:00Marc:Right.

00:17:00Marc:Like late 80s.

00:17:01Marc:Yeah.

00:17:02Marc:But you didn't grow up in Toronto.

00:17:03Guest:I grew up in Calgary in a little... It was backwards then.

00:17:07Guest:You would be chased by a truck.

00:17:09Guest:Yeah.

00:17:09Guest:Called a fag if you were...

00:17:10Marc:wearing bowling shoes or nurses shoes as i was is that what you were nurses shoes yeah nurses shoes and like three neckties and a piece of rope holding my pants up you know the the usual stuff mark yeah when you're 16 yeah you're 16 in the 80s yeah exactly that's exactly it's very specific yeah yeah well because i was looking through stuff about you and we're you know you're a couple years older than me but it is that weird time of there's that window of of how we all defined ourselves as individuals back then that's very specific

00:17:40Marc:Yeah.

00:17:40Marc:The sort of punk, rocky, new wavy.

00:17:43Marc:Oh, without question.

00:17:44Marc:Bowling shirts, bowling shoes, work clothes and not working.

00:17:47Guest:Yeah.

00:17:48Guest:Yeah.

00:17:49Guest:And especially me, I mean, and Calgary, like I luckily I found about six friends who were into T-Rex or whatever I was into, but that was all I cared about.

00:17:58Marc:Really?

00:17:58Marc:T-Rex was the thing?

00:18:00Guest:Well, just all of that.

00:18:01Guest:No, I know.

00:18:01Guest:It went from, you know, went from Deep Purple to, you know.

00:18:05Marc:Well, that's the thing that I started to notice about like even the music comedy records you did and some of the other stuff was that we were the generation that kind of straddled that kind of early 70s.

00:18:17Marc:rock and this other thing.

00:18:19Marc:Yeah.

00:18:19Marc:So we had it around us.

00:18:21Guest:It was so important.

00:18:22Guest:I remember when I did stand-up, I'd come out to Lust for Life.

00:18:26Guest:Right.

00:18:26Guest:And I think I was so cool.

00:18:28Guest:Right.

00:18:28Guest:Like, come on.

00:18:29Marc:Yeah.

00:18:30Marc:Yeah.

00:18:31Guest:And then I'd bomb, right?

00:18:32Guest:Because the music thought it was going to be fun.

00:18:34Marc:And then I'd bomb.

00:18:35Marc:I do not like being brought out to music even now.

00:18:38Marc:Right.

00:18:39Marc:I'm like, why would you do that?

00:18:41Marc:It's just like, Mark Maron.

00:18:43Marc:How is that not going to be let down?

00:18:45Guest:Yeah, and it's never a song that has anything to do with you.

00:18:48Marc:It's some rap song I don't even know the name of.

00:18:51Marc:But when you were a kid, though, because there was definitely a difference between rock guys and the art guys.

00:18:58Guest:Right.

00:18:58Marc:And you landed firmly in the art camp, or you were half and half.

00:19:02Guest:Well, I was all of that.

00:19:04Guest:And I was an angry young man.

00:19:06Guest:I fought a lot.

00:19:07Guest:I drank a lot.

00:19:08Marc:You were a fighter?

00:19:09Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:19:09Guest:I fought a lot.

00:19:10Guest:Really?

00:19:10Guest:I mostly would get beat up, but you'd go out and fight.

00:19:12Marc:So you'd booze it up and go beat up who?

00:19:16Guest:Or the cowboys would come get us.

00:19:18Marc:That's the thing I don't, I didn't learn that until later in life about the Calgary cowboys.

00:19:22Marc:Oh man, they would get you.

00:19:24Marc:Yeah.

00:19:24Guest:Yeah.

00:19:25Guest:And we'd go with a guy from Stelco Steel.

00:19:27Guest:He wouldn't even wash his face after a shift and he'd say, who do you want me to take?

00:19:31Guest:And we'd point, we'd point Gord into some direction and he'd take out about three guys.

00:19:36Guest:And then one little guy would come and beat the fucking shit out of me.

00:19:39Marc:So that was just it?

00:19:41Marc:You'd drink and you'd go find cowboys to fight?

00:19:43Marc:Yeah.

00:19:44Guest:Well, no, they would find you because we were fags because we weren't wearing what they were wearing.

00:19:48Marc:But I don't know if a lot of people understand that.

00:19:50Marc:Calgary has this culture because it's oil, right?

00:19:53Marc:Yeah.

00:19:54Marc:And they just sort of copy Texas.

00:19:55Marc:How does it just recreate itself?

00:19:57Guest:Well, it is sort of like that.

00:19:58Guest:It is sort of like Dallas or one of those places where it's king.

00:20:03Guest:The oil is king.

00:20:04Guest:Yeah.

00:20:05Marc:Is it still...

00:20:06Marc:uh yeah but there's a great arts community there now that was sort of started around you know that we were there and some great theater and all kinds of stuff so when you're okay so you're growing up in calgary you and your six friends and uh by six he means two two yeah but a large one named gourd yeah the missile

00:20:28Marc:And are you doing, like, how many siblings you got?

00:20:31Marc:I have an older sister.

00:20:32Guest:Is she all right?

00:20:33Guest:Yeah, she's okay.

00:20:34Guest:She's got a great spirit.

00:20:36Guest:I always say she's my younger sister, even though she's older.

00:20:38Guest:Why?

00:20:39Guest:I don't know.

00:20:39Guest:Because she talks funny and stuff.

00:20:40Guest:Like, I don't know.

00:20:42Marc:Was she the role model for many of the feminine characters that you have?

00:20:45Guest:Well, I do a Kathy as one of our characters, which is kind of my sister, who is like, bad things are always happening to her.

00:20:52Guest:Yeah.

00:20:52Guest:But she's still got a great little spirit.

00:20:54Guest:Oh, that's okay.

00:20:56Guest:Ah, I'm in jail in Galicia, Alberta.

00:21:00Marc:You know.

00:21:02Marc:Did you guys talk about, like, have serious discussions about who played the best woman?

00:21:08Guest:No, we left that for other people.

00:21:11Marc:And where does it land, usually?

00:21:12Guest:Well, I think it's Dave.

00:21:13Guest:I have a pretty good set of legs.

00:21:15Guest:Yeah.

00:21:16Guest:Scott is a, can't believe that he's considered the worst-looking woman.

00:21:21Guest:Very handsome man, though, of course.

00:21:23Guest:But, yeah.

00:21:24Guest:Yeah.

00:21:24Guest:And Mark had a very specific woman.

00:21:26Marc:He did, yeah.

00:21:27Marc:So when you're growing up there in Calgary with the Cowboys and two friends and Big Gord, what changes?

00:21:38Marc:Were you heading down a bad path?

00:21:40Marc:Did you feel like you were going to be lost if you didn't find the funny?

00:21:45Guest:Yeah, I didn't know what I was going to do.

00:21:47Guest:And I was kind of a loser.

00:21:49Guest:And on my 18th birthday, I had a thing called Tequila Fest at my house.

00:21:53Guest:You and the two guys?

00:21:54Guest:Well, actually, we invited over some more friends.

00:21:56Guest:And my mom came in and had a heart attack when she saw the house.

00:22:00Guest:And from there on, for about a year, I'd just do like any job because I had no money.

00:22:04Guest:And I'd be like, you know.

00:22:05Guest:She freaked out?

00:22:06Guest:Framing houses.

00:22:07Guest:Yeah, she had a heart attack.

00:22:08Guest:She had a real heart attack?

00:22:09Guest:A literal heart attack.

00:22:10Guest:No.

00:22:11Guest:Yeah, on my 18th birthday.

00:22:12Guest:and uh so happy birthday what happened she's still alive believe it or not she's had a few more you know she's 80 she's 80 now she just keeps having them you know you know i think her heart's a lump of butter yeah but she's 80 so she's 80 so i every time i talk to her i say mom i can't fucking believe you're still alive what did she say yeah me neither what about your old man uh long dead oh yeah yeah

00:22:36Guest:yeah how'd he die als oh that's bad it's a bad one that takes time for a guy who likes to talk and then he couldn't talk at the end it's very sad he had his clipboard he'd write out a joke mark it would drive me crazy he'd write out a joke it would take five minutes it's like dad you don't need to write out a joke that takes five minutes yeah it's called timing yeah he'd say that to him yeah poor guy he's just like enough yeah you knew the joke but really but how oh god how old were you when that happened

00:23:00Guest:that was about 15 years ago oh yeah and it took a long time yeah it oh not so long yeah a long time yeah but you were like able to communicate by writing on he would write things he would write AOS means you still have your brain but your body fails you yeah and it either it either affects it affects your voice or something else there's two there's two forms of it and his is the voice and he loved to talk right yeah he'd wake up in the

00:23:25Guest:I'm lonely.

00:23:26Guest:Let's talk.

00:23:26Guest:What are we talking about?

00:23:27Guest:Want to talk about the Prussian empire?

00:23:28Guest:Like anything was of interest to him.

00:23:30Guest:But it would start with, I'm lonely.

00:23:31Guest:Yeah, I'm lonely.

00:23:32Guest:It's like six in the morning.

00:23:35Guest:You just smell the cigarettes coming from downstairs.

00:23:37Marc:So that happened your whole life?

00:23:39Guest:Yeah, my whole life.

00:23:39Guest:Where was your mom?

00:23:40Guest:Well, they broke up when I was young.

00:23:42Guest:And then I had a stepmom who died of the drink.

00:23:45Guest:And my dad was a very serious boozer.

00:23:47Marc:Really?

00:23:47Marc:Really good at it.

00:23:48Marc:Yeah?

00:23:48Guest:Yeah.

00:23:49Guest:But then went to AA for many years, last year.

00:23:51Marc:So he died sober?

00:23:52Marc:Yep.

00:23:52Marc:Wow.

00:23:53Marc:Yeah.

00:23:54Marc:Now, when you were in high school, did that transfer to you?

00:23:58Marc:Are you a...

00:23:59Marc:I drank, but Daddy drank rye, so I wasn't going to drink rye.

00:24:02Marc:Rye?

00:24:02Marc:Who even calls it rye?

00:24:04Marc:Was he from the 1800s?

00:24:05Marc:Rye and ginger.

00:24:07Marc:That was Daddy's drink.

00:24:08Marc:Yeah?

00:24:09Marc:Rye and ginger.

00:24:09Marc:Now, rye is just whiskey, right?

00:24:11Marc:It's a type of whiskey.

00:24:12Marc:What's a brand of rye?

00:24:14Guest:Well, Hudson's Bay.

00:24:15Guest:Because my mom had worked at Hudson's Bay, so she drank the rye.

00:24:19Guest:And in a plastic cup.

00:24:21Marc:What's Hudson's Bay?

00:24:22Guest:It's Hudson's Bay, the company?

00:24:23Guest:Yeah.

00:24:24Guest:That took all the land from the First Nations people and took all their-

00:24:27Marc:A Canadian thing?

00:24:28Guest:Yeah.

00:24:29Marc:Oh, I'm sorry.

00:24:29Marc:Well, you don't look so surprised.

00:24:31Marc:I'm a little out.

00:24:32Marc:He doesn't care about the First Nations people, guys.

00:24:34Marc:You heard it here.

00:24:38Guest:In Hudson's Bay, what kind of company was it?

00:24:40Guest:What did they make?

00:24:41Guest:Well, they make everything.

00:24:42Guest:It's a department store, but they famously took all the pelts from the First Nations people.

00:24:48Guest:Oh, I get it.

00:24:48Guest:And gave them blankets.

00:24:49Marc:Oh, that's where it started.

00:24:51Marc:Yeah.

00:24:51Marc:Oh.

00:24:51Guest:My dad famously got up at one of their functions.

00:24:54Guest:My mom worked there.

00:24:55Guest:Yeah.

00:24:55Guest:And gave a toast to Hudson's Bay, who had been fucking the First Nations people, fucking them over.

00:25:02Guest:And everyone went, what is he doing?

00:25:05Guest:But that's the kind of thing they do.

00:25:07Guest:It was a protest message?

00:25:08Guest:Yes, of course.

00:25:09Guest:Yeah.

00:25:09Guest:It was a hipster, right?

00:25:12Marc:Well, no, but that's where you got your sense of humor.

00:25:13Marc:You're liking a couple of drinks.

00:25:15Marc:He's just going to stick it to the man.

00:25:16Marc:Yeah, of course.

00:25:17Yeah.

00:25:17Guest:Yeah, and at his wife's function.

00:25:20Guest:We never stopped hearing about that one.

00:25:22Marc:And that was the end of them?

00:25:24Guest:No, they just kept going.

00:25:25Marc:Yeah?

00:25:25Marc:Yeah.

00:25:26Marc:Oh, that was the stepmom?

00:25:27Guest:Yeah.

00:25:28Marc:Those are the years of rye.

00:25:29Guest:Was that the stepmom?

00:25:31Guest:Yeah, that was the stepmom.

00:25:31Marc:Oh, so they were both drinking the rye.

00:25:33Guest:Yeah.

00:25:34Marc:Oh, my God.

00:25:34Marc:Did you live with them?

00:25:35Guest:For a while, and then I left.

00:25:37Guest:Yeah, it was pretty grim.

00:25:38Marc:Yeah?

00:25:38Guest:And they had a dog that would just, binky, that would just attack you if you left the house.

00:25:42Guest:It was fucking crazy.

00:25:43Marc:Don't leave.

00:25:44Guest:Don't anything with these people.

00:25:44Guest:You'd have to throw a ball, and then, like, you'd go for it, and then you'd run out before you caught your pant leg.

00:25:49Marc:So that sounds pretty chaotic.

00:25:50Guest:It was very chaotic, yeah.

00:25:51Marc:And your mom didn't remarry?

00:25:53Guest:She had a bunch of suitors, lovers, things like that.

00:25:57Guest:In and out of the house?

00:25:59Marc:Yeah.

00:25:59Marc:This is your new dad?

00:26:00Marc:Oh, no, maybe not.

00:26:01Guest:No, no dad.

00:26:02Guest:Just some guy.

00:26:02Guest:This guy's named like Villy and stuff like that.

00:26:05Guest:Villy.

00:26:05Guest:Where did you pick up a guy named Villy?

00:26:07Guest:I've never even heard that one.

00:26:11Marc:But you seem to... So, I mean, I guess this is what built you.

00:26:15Marc:This is the shame that built you.

00:26:18Guest:Yeah.

00:26:19Guest:And it's so funny when I see, like, I'm working with a young comedy troupe now, and they've had sort of nice lives.

00:26:25Guest:And it's like, how do you do it?

00:26:26Guest:How are you funny?

00:26:27Guest:Like, you know, for us, obviously, kids in the hall, it's all dysfunction.

00:26:31Marc:Well, I don't, like, I find myself asking that, too.

00:26:34Marc:Like, is it, like, there was a point where I think we all sort of celebrated the fact that we had gone through some shit.

00:26:41Marc:Yeah.

00:26:42Marc:And it was cultural, and it was, you know, the time was right for it.

00:26:45Marc:I mean, there was, like, new things happening or whatever, but it seemed like I sort of, I think I look back at my life, and I'm like, yeah, I've had many lives, and, you know, we went through some shit, and it sort of defined me.

00:26:55Marc:Yeah.

00:26:55Marc:And when I see these younger people, they're sort of well-adjusted.

00:26:58Marc:They seem to function.

00:26:59Marc:They have a plan.

00:27:03Marc:Right.

00:27:03Marc:That kind of stuff.

00:27:04Marc:Yep.

00:27:04Marc:And they're good.

00:27:05Marc:And I'm like, maybe we didn't need it.

00:27:07Marc:I mean, maybe romanticizing that stuff was just bullshit.

00:27:10Guest:No, it is bullshit.

00:27:11Guest:And I think it's like there's so much kindness in a lot of young people.

00:27:15Marc:I don't know what to do with that.

00:27:17Marc:I don't believe it at first.

00:27:18Marc:Right.

00:27:19Guest:Well, I don't believe it at first, but it's actually real.

00:27:21Marc:I know.

00:27:21Marc:You know, there's real sincere kind of like they're well adjusted.

00:27:25Guest:Yeah.

00:27:25Guest:And we're old white fuckers.

00:27:26Guest:We have to realize the world has actually changed.

00:27:28Marc:No, that's I mean, I think that's true.

00:27:29Marc:Yeah, it has changed.

00:27:31Marc:But does that diminish us entirely?

00:27:32Marc:Or can we still somehow like secretly be proud of our fuck upness?

00:27:36Guest:Oh, without question.

00:27:37Guest:I mean, we've been grandfathered in, right?

00:27:40Guest:I think now anybody who's my age, I won't say our age because I'm a little bit older than you.

00:27:45Marc:57, I'm 55.

00:27:46Guest:Yeah.

00:27:49Guest:We're like the blues now.

00:27:50Guest:We're just still out there, man.

00:27:51Guest:That's how I feel, right?

00:27:53Guest:I'm B.B.

00:27:54Guest:King on a Tuesday night.

00:27:56Guest:I remember I saw Mavis Staples a few years ago, one of the greatest singers in the world.

00:28:01Guest:Yeah, absolutely.

00:28:02Guest:And then she...

00:28:03Marc:gave one of the greatest shows and then she said yeah and there's cds for sale out front it's like yeah you're 75 and you're still doing it go mavis go yeah i i there there's the go mavis go part of that but you know as somebody who who sees it there's two ways to look at that like why does she have to do that still right you know but it's what she does i always wonder that about certain people it's like do you need to do this

00:28:23Marc:It's like Bob Dylan is probably out there singing at a state fair right now.

00:28:27Marc:And there's part of me that's sort of like, well, he can't need to do it.

00:28:30Guest:Well, I know.

00:28:30Guest:It's like my friend Jeff Garland, who, you know, doing stand-up.

00:28:34Marc:Dropping those names.

00:28:35Guest:Yeah, here you go.

00:28:36Guest:Hey, Jeffy.

00:28:38Guest:Walks in, he's doing stand-up at 11 at night.

00:28:39Guest:You got two shows on the air.

00:28:40Guest:What do you need to do stand-up at 11 at night for?

00:28:43Marc:Not only does he need to do it, but he's very proud of the fact that he doesn't write any stand-up and never prepares to do stand-up and then gets up there and kind of like rambles through something.

00:28:52Yeah.

00:28:53Marc:Yeah, it's the ramble act.

00:28:56Marc:I don't prepare for any of it.

00:28:57Marc:He's very proud of that.

00:28:59Marc:And there are nights where I watch him and I'm like, maybe you should, you know.

00:29:02Guest:You can write something down.

00:29:05Marc:He's going to get mad at me for saying that.

00:29:07Guest:Repetition is beautiful.

00:29:08Marc:So, okay, so there you are.

00:29:10Marc:You can't go home.

00:29:12Marc:No, you can never go home.

00:29:13Marc:You're growing up and there's just, there's Rye.

00:29:17Marc:Yeah.

00:29:18Marc:Rye and Ginger in one house and Billy's in the other house.

00:29:22Marc:Maybe a new guy.

00:29:23Marc:Yeah.

00:29:25Marc:So your mom worked at Hudson Bay.

00:29:26Guest:What'd the dad do?

00:29:27Guest:He was a salesman.

00:29:28Guest:He was a traveling salesman.

00:29:30Guest:For real?

00:29:30Guest:Yeah, when that existed.

00:29:32Guest:And then he sold furniture.

00:29:33Marc:So he had a couple of trunks of stuff that he'd throw in the trunk and-

00:29:36Guest:Yeah, he actually had sample cases, like old school.

00:29:39Guest:That's why I... Anything?

00:29:40Guest:He was just a... He sold like greeting cards and different kinds of animal products like to help clean things and stuff.

00:29:51Guest:It was pretty... National chem search he worked for.

00:29:53Guest:It was pretty sad stuff.

00:29:54Guest:But because he was a boozer, he would go on the road, work two days and then get lost for three, you know?

00:30:00Guest:And that's what I think all those guys, all these traveling salesmen were boozers.

00:30:04Marc:Well, yeah, it's like, well, it's also like comics, you know.

00:30:07Marc:How do you not drink?

00:30:08Marc:Well, but stand-up comics, you go out, you do your, you know, in a different town from Wednesday to Sunday.

00:30:13Marc:And a lot of those guys, like, I don't know about traveling salesmen, were definitely, you know, running from tax payments, alimony payments, families, children, like it was their own space.

00:30:22Marc:So you just kind of hole up in a hotel room and...

00:30:25Marc:Yeah.

00:30:25Guest:Go at it.

00:30:26Guest:But also you have 23 hours in a day.

00:30:27Guest:I know.

00:30:28Guest:So what else are you going to do?

00:30:29Marc:That's right.

00:30:30Marc:You might as well drink for four and then sleep for 12.

00:30:33Guest:And then watch the first 48 on A&E because it's the only thing on.

00:30:38Marc:So really he'd go on Benders.

00:30:40Marc:Yeah.

00:30:41Marc:Oh man.

00:30:41Marc:Yeah.

00:30:42Marc:But you got along with him the whole time?

00:30:43Guest:Well, he was a violent man.

00:30:45Guest:He was fun, though.

00:30:46Guest:He was all things.

00:30:49Guest:It could be like he'd slap you for doing something wrong, or he'd say, hey, let's order Chinese food.

00:30:53Guest:It could be anything.

00:30:56Marc:Those are the two options?

00:30:58Guest:Yeah, pretty much.

00:30:59Guest:Chinese food or a slap.

00:31:00Marc:Those are the two tones.

00:31:01Marc:Yeah.

00:31:01Marc:You get popped or like, yeah, come on.

00:31:04Guest:What are we going to do tonight?

00:31:05Guest:Let's talk about jazz.

00:31:07Marc:So did he beat you up a lot?

00:31:09Marc:uh i don't know if he would say beat me up he would slap me right or he would slap my sister you know it was a very very chaotic but but did so in in like could in light of that i find that people who have that kind of upbringing where you just never know what you're walking into or what's going to happen you know you go two directions you either become that or you become these sort of like controlled kind of like uh you know like oh let's just try to make it as safe as possible for everybody yeah i don't

00:31:35Guest:know if i'm that i'm not i'm i i oddly i don't know i don't feel like i wear that no i don't feel that way but you seem like uh you seem like um like uh you seem stable yeah you know maybe a little dark but stable yeah and i feel i feel with with age i've gotten more stable and more i think i was you know like kind of a young prick yeah but i feel now that i'm i've evolved into someone i'm fairly proud of

00:32:02Marc:Right.

00:32:03Marc:Isn't it weird how you soften and there's nothing you can do about it?

00:32:06Marc:And then every once in a while the old prick comes out and you're like, I better put a stop to that.

00:32:09Guest:Yeah, I can't yell.

00:32:11Guest:People can't yell anymore.

00:32:12Guest:You can't yell at people anymore.

00:32:14Guest:You can't throw a coffee mug at an assistant anymore.

00:32:18Marc:Man, things have changed.

00:32:19Guest:Yeah.

00:32:21Guest:I can't even throw hot coffee anymore.

00:32:23Guest:It's a world coming.

00:32:23Guest:You were a yeller?

00:32:25Guest:Yeah.

00:32:27Guest:Mostly about the show or my comedy because everything I was doing was so important and everyone had to understand that.

00:32:32Guest:You know, just get out of my way.

00:32:34Guest:Get out of the little man's way.

00:32:36Guest:He will eat your throat.

00:32:38Marc:The genius is in the room.

00:32:39Guest:Yeah.

00:32:40Guest:And I remember we do the tapings and Kevin and Dave would celebrate because they were so happy after a scene.

00:32:46Guest:And I would go up, run upstairs and look at the feed and make sure we didn't eat pickups.

00:32:50Marc:So there, that's the control thing.

00:32:52Guest:Yeah, right.

00:32:53Marc:Right?

00:32:53Marc:Yeah.

00:32:54Marc:The angry controlly guy.

00:32:55Marc:Yeah, I guess.

00:32:56Marc:All right, so where do you first start engaging with the stage?

00:33:01Guest:I went to Loose Moose Theater.

00:33:03Guest:In Calgary?

00:33:04Guest:Yeah, in Calgary, and I'd been kind of a punk.

00:33:08Guest:How punky?

00:33:09Guest:Were you in a band at that point?

00:33:10Guest:No, all my friends were in bands.

00:33:11Guest:I was never in a band.

00:33:13Guest:Like hardcore?

00:33:13Guest:kind of stuff or the husker do and all that would come and play the calgarian all the time or people like that um but then i found comedy and i and it was like i found my religion really went to see improv comedy i was you know it was almost sexually attracted do you remember to it you were sexually almost like almost he said yeah yeah but you like who do you remember who it was who like that you saw that was like no there's no well no it yeah uh

00:33:40Guest:The Titino brothers.

00:33:41Marc:Oh, great.

00:33:42Marc:Yeah.

00:33:42Marc:They were fantastic.

00:33:43Guest:They were like rock stars.

00:33:44Guest:Really?

00:33:45Guest:And then you'd see them in a restaurant after.

00:33:46Guest:It's like, wow, they eat in the same restaurants as us.

00:33:48Guest:Really?

00:33:48Guest:That's their name?

00:33:49Guest:It was, yeah.

00:33:50Guest:Frank and Tony Titino.

00:33:51Guest:They were improv guys?

00:33:52Marc:Yeah.

00:33:52Guest:And they're still doing it.

00:33:53Guest:Really?

00:33:53Guest:Yeah.

00:33:53Guest:And it was amazing.

00:33:55Guest:They were like, I couldn't believe how cool that whole thing was.

00:33:59Marc:What was the structure?

00:34:00Marc:How did it go?

00:34:03Marc:What year are we talking, like 82, 83?

00:34:05Guest:Yeah, 83.

00:34:06Guest:And it's theater sports.

00:34:08Guest:It's competitive.

00:34:09Guest:And you get thrown off the stage and all that stuff.

00:34:11Guest:So it was competitive.

00:34:13Guest:And I thought it was beautiful.

00:34:16Marc:It is kind of amazing.

00:34:17Marc:It is amazing, yeah.

00:34:18Marc:And then when you see them do the same thing, the third show, you're like, oh, well.

00:34:21Guest:Well, I think it's a really great art form for a little bit when you're starting your world, right?

00:34:25Marc:Well, I think that's true.

00:34:28Marc:And I think that's one of the things I always envied about you fellas.

00:34:31Marc:And I imagine, you know, you find Kindred Spirit and the people you're working with now.

00:34:35Marc:What's the new show called?

00:34:36Marc:Tall Boys?

00:34:36Marc:Is that the name of the sketch comedy?

00:34:38Marc:Yeah, that's the thing I'm doing for CBC right now.

00:34:40Marc:And that's a younger crew?

00:34:41Marc:It is a younger crew, and they're excellent.

00:34:44Marc:And you're the executive producer?

00:34:46Marc:And director, yeah.

00:34:46Marc:And they come to you like a father figure and say, like, we can't resolve this sketch.

00:34:51Marc:Can you help us?

00:34:52Marc:And you say, make that voice funnier.

00:34:54Guest:Yeah, or just get a better ending.

00:34:57Guest:Like, get what we call an idea for an idea.

00:34:59Guest:Just make it funnier.

00:35:01Guest:Yeah.

00:35:03Marc:But what I was saying was that there's...

00:35:07Marc:There's something about improv where you're going into it, if that's your thing, you're going to be working with other people.

00:35:13Marc:And there's at least that.

00:35:14Marc:There has to be some basic respect for other folks and working in an ensemble.

00:35:18Marc:Whereas when you're a stand-up, you're like, I don't need anybody.

00:35:22Marc:I'm going out there alone.

00:35:23Guest:They're different.

00:35:24Guest:They're different.

00:35:24Guest:They really are.

00:35:26Guest:I mean, now we're all as kind, but I don't think when you're young, you're as kind as improvisers are.

00:35:30Marc:No, because you just build your own little wall and you got your own little world and you condescend to everybody in a way.

00:35:38Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:35:39Guest:And it's like, look out.

00:35:40Guest:Oh, old man, watch what I'm going to do.

00:35:42Guest:You know?

00:35:43Marc:Yeah.

00:35:44Marc:I can bomb.

00:35:46Marc:Oh, bombing, yeah.

00:35:47Marc:So once you saw those guys, you got involved with improv sports?

00:35:50Guest:Yeah, right away.

00:35:51Guest:And then stopped dressing creatively because I didn't need to anymore.

00:35:56Marc:Really?

00:35:56Marc:You found that transition?

00:35:58Marc:Like, I don't need these ballroom shoes.

00:35:59Guest:I didn't even notice I was doing it.

00:36:00Guest:And then I just started wearing army pants around for two years.

00:36:03Marc:Because you'd found another way to define yourself that was more honest.

00:36:06Marc:You didn't have to pretend.

00:36:08Guest:Yeah, it was.

00:36:08Guest:And I met Mark and all that.

00:36:10Guest:And I was like, oh, my God.

00:36:11Marc:You met Mark in Calgary?

00:36:12Yeah.

00:36:12Guest:Was he from there?

00:36:14Guest:No, he was there, I think, at the university, and he worked for Dial-A-Bottle.

00:36:18Marc:Dial-A-Bottle?

00:36:18Guest:What is that?

00:36:20Guest:You phone, you take booze to boozers.

00:36:23Guest:Dial-A-Bottle.

00:36:23Guest:Come on, Mark.

00:36:24Guest:That's a real thing?

00:36:25Guest:Don't act like you don't know what Dial-A-Bottle is.

00:36:27Guest:Come on, Mark.

00:36:28Marc:You Canadians are ahead of us in so many ways.

00:36:30Marc:Yeah, Dial-A-Bottle.

00:36:31Marc:But it was that honest?

00:36:32Marc:That was shameless?

00:36:33Marc:We don't want you to drive.

00:36:34Marc:You're probably well into it.

00:36:36Marc:Yeah, and you might only be 17.

00:36:38Marc:We'll bring you one.

00:36:38Marc:Yeah.

00:36:40Marc:Yeah, he's the only, I guess after you, he's the only one that I haven't talked to on the mic, that Mark.

00:36:45Guest:Oh, usually I'm the last.

00:36:47Guest:Really?

00:36:47Guest:People always collect kids in the hall like Pokemans.

00:36:49Guest:It's like, you're the last one I've met.

00:36:51Marc:Oh, no.

00:36:52Guest:Everyone says, I know Dave.

00:36:53Guest:I went out with Dave.

00:36:54Guest:Well, everyone knows Dave.

00:36:55Marc:Yeah.

00:36:55Marc:You used to see him around a lot.

00:36:56Marc:Yeah, and then here's me.

00:36:57Marc:I'm just like, you can't find me.

00:36:58Marc:And Kevin, there was the Kevin McDonald debacle.

00:37:00Marc:Did you hear about that?

00:37:01Marc:Which one?

00:37:02Marc:Where I had the wrong Kevin McDonald.

00:37:03Marc:Oh, you didn't.

00:37:04Guest:Who was the wrong?

00:37:05Guest:Oh, the film director.

00:37:06Marc:The film director.

00:37:07Marc:Well, I was expecting, it was a horrendous day.

00:37:09Marc:In the way that I was expecting Kevin, your Kevin, to show up, and then this guy shows up who I didn't know at all.

00:37:15Marc:I didn't know what the fuck to happen.

00:37:16Marc:Nothing.

00:37:16Marc:And I scramble out to the garage to do a quick bit of research.

00:37:19Marc:That's hilarious.

00:37:20Marc:And you did that when I arrived.

00:37:22Marc:Yeah, I did, because I thought the other Bruce McCullough was coming, the guy who works at the Lowe's Hardware.

00:37:26Marc:Yeah.

00:37:27Guest:Hey, do you know that Scott Thompson and Carrot Top are the same?

00:37:29Guest:I do know that they have the same name.

00:37:31Marc:And there was a period there where I'd occasionally get texts from both of them.

00:37:35Marc:Right.

00:37:35Marc:Because I knew Carrot Top because I interviewed him.

00:37:38Marc:And he would always send these really horrendous pornographic pictures like once a year.

00:37:44Marc:And I'd be like, why is Scott Thompson kids in the hall sending me this?

00:37:48Marc:It wouldn't be unusual for him to, but I didn't expect him to.

00:37:50Guest:Yeah.

00:37:51Marc:And it wasn't him.

00:37:52Marc:Yeah.

00:37:52Marc:It was Scott Thompson.

00:37:53Marc:Was that the bane of anyone's existence that they had the same name?

00:37:56Marc:No, no.

00:37:57Marc:Not at all.

00:37:57Marc:I thought it was funny.

00:37:58Marc:So Mark McKinney and you are hanging out.

00:38:00Marc:Yep.

00:38:01Marc:Here's the weird thing about Ollie is.

00:38:02Marc:Yeah.

00:38:04Marc:You all got this perverse darkness somewhere working.

00:38:07Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:38:09Marc:Even the nice ones like Dave, yeah.

00:38:12Guest:Is he the nice one or is Kevin really the nice one?

00:38:14Guest:Oh, Kevin's nice, but we always say he's the worst in some way.

00:38:18Guest:He says, well, when you're out of my sight, I'll forget you immediately.

00:38:22Guest:He's like, oh, I'm the worst.

00:38:23Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:38:24Marc:So he's sort of right, I guess.

00:38:26Guest:But they're the nice ones.

00:38:28Guest:Him and Dave were the kind ones.

00:38:30Marc:Yeah.

00:38:30Guest:And Dave is a very kind man as well.

00:38:32Marc:Yeah.

00:38:32Marc:Mark seems a little menacing.

00:38:34Guest:No, he's kind.

00:38:35Guest:We've all become kind.

00:38:36Marc:We're Canadian, so it's built in a little bit.

00:38:39Guest:But Mark can drive you crazy.

00:38:40Guest:He'll change.

00:38:41Guest:If you were interviewing him, he would change the time seven times, and then it would change back to the original time.

00:38:47Guest:What do you mean time?

00:38:48Guest:Just activity.

00:38:48Guest:Like, I need more information.

00:38:51Guest:Right.

00:38:51Guest:You know, I just need just a guy who needs more information.

00:38:54Guest:He dodges.

00:38:55Guest:And I think I grew up in a way in reaction to him.

00:38:58Guest:So it's like, no, we're going.

00:38:59Guest:We're going to Toronto.

00:38:59Guest:We're going to New York.

00:39:00Guest:We're going to.

00:39:01Guest:And he was like, can we think about it a couple more years?

00:39:05Guest:So I knew his brother, Nick.

00:39:08Marc:Yeah.

00:39:08Marc:How's that guy doing?

00:39:09Guest:He's pretty good.

00:39:10Guest:He was going to.

00:39:10Guest:Hey, he was going to do a documentary on the kids in the hall.

00:39:12Guest:Hey, Nick, where's our documentary?

00:39:13Marc:Well, Paul Myers just wrote a book on you, right?

00:39:15Marc:Yeah, he did.

00:39:16Marc:And did you like the book?

00:39:18Marc:I did not read it because that's the way I am, right?

00:39:21Guest:That's how I'm weird that way.

00:39:22Marc:Did he talk to you?

00:39:23Guest:Oh, yeah.

00:39:23Guest:And very thorough, very good guy.

00:39:25Guest:He's a friend of ours.

00:39:26Marc:Yeah, no, no.

00:39:27Guest:Yeah, he's a good guy.

00:39:27Guest:And he's a very good guy.

00:39:28Guest:People seem to quite like the book and they like it for the things you've probably been talking to me about, which is that it has some relationship to like our weird path, like how we were formed, which I'm always interested in.

00:39:39Marc:Well, you're in good company.

00:39:40Marc:I mean, he's written a couple of books, but it's like you and Todd Rundgren.

00:39:42Guest:Yeah.

00:39:43Marc:Yeah.

00:39:43Marc:And I barely understand Todd Rundgren.

00:39:46Marc:No, I, yeah.

00:39:46Marc:Him and Zappa, they're just in, and Hawkwind, they're all in just this weird world.

00:39:50Marc:They are, man.

00:39:51Marc:Hawkwind, I didn't come to Hawkwind.

00:39:54Marc:I didn't even know Hawkwind existed until like eight years ago.

00:39:57Marc:Wow.

00:39:57Guest:Where were you?

00:39:58Guest:And you should have called me up.

00:40:00Guest:I would have told you.

00:40:01Guest:Yeah, Hawkwind exists.

00:40:02Guest:Okay, how'd you get this number?

00:40:03Guest:There's 90 records.

00:40:05Guest:Yeah.

00:40:05Marc:Here's the one you should start with.

00:40:07Marc:Yeah, start with the 13th.

00:40:08Marc:Yeah, here's the two with Lemmy on them.

00:40:11Marc:Go there and see how it spreads out.

00:40:13Marc:But they're one of those bands where it's like, they're still going and there's like, what, one member left and that kind of thing?

00:40:18Marc:Yeah, I think he's the original roadie.

00:40:21Marc:The only original member is the name on the bass drum.

00:40:28Marc:Right.

00:40:29Marc:So you and Mark, so you're there in Calgary.

00:40:33Marc:Yep.

00:40:34Marc:But was he sort of punky too, or was he an oddball then?

00:40:37Guest:He was more an oddball, I think.

00:40:39Guest:Tall.

00:40:40Guest:I didn't really know what he was into, like weird sweaters.

00:40:43Guest:He was like a theater guy, right?

00:40:45Guest:And we were always like, oh, Mark's taking acting classes.

00:40:48Marc:He's not going to be funny anymore.

00:40:50Marc:But he just got funnier.

00:40:51Marc:He did.

00:40:51Marc:Yeah.

00:40:52Marc:He's like, he works primarily as an actor.

00:40:54Marc:Yeah.

00:40:55Marc:That's like what he does.

00:40:55Marc:He's on Superstore now, yeah.

00:40:56Marc:Yeah.

00:40:57Marc:Yeah.

00:40:58Marc:So what do you guys do?

00:40:59Marc:Do you do a team thing?

00:41:00Marc:How does it start?

00:41:01Guest:We start, and there was other people involved.

00:41:03Guest:We started doing a thing called late night comedy, which was after- In Calgary.

00:41:06Guest:After theater sports, we'd write a few things.

00:41:08Guest:you know naked for jesus or whatever and like just naked for jesus yeah that was just one of my scenes but we would we would just do them uh in the for the audience after theater sports and then people started coming just for our show and we were we were it was it was odd that it happened to us we were successful very quickly which the two of you well there was a few other guys it's called late night comedy so there's about five of us what happened

00:41:30Marc:of those guys um they're around norm hiscock who worked on all kinds you know he works on um brooklyn 99 a bunch of shows and uh there's a few other people and you guys are like 18 19 years old yeah 1920 yep and uh and like it's so hiscock is here yep and the other guys you don't know

00:41:50Guest:No, they're around.

00:41:51Guest:Frank Van Keekin's working in Canada and Gary Campbell works in Canada.

00:41:55Marc:It's weird, Canada.

00:41:56Marc:Like if you just hang out and you stay relatively funny, you get a job for a while.

00:42:02Guest:Yeah, for a while.

00:42:02Guest:I was in CBC.

00:42:03Guest:I said, well, I'm back.

00:42:04Guest:What are you going to do with me?

00:42:06Guest:You got to do something.

00:42:07Guest:There's a kid in the hall.

00:42:08Guest:I'm a legend.

00:42:10Marc:So when do you hit the wall in Calgary where you realize it's not going to happen here?

00:42:16Guest:Well, it did happen there.

00:42:18Guest:We were selling out.

00:42:19Guest:And I said, oh, it's time to go to Toronto.

00:42:21Guest:Yeah.

00:42:21Marc:Toronto was the goal.

00:42:23Guest:Yeah.

00:42:23Guest:Well, I wanted to go there because The Damned played there as well.

00:42:25Guest:But it was like, no, we have to go to Toronto.

00:42:28Marc:But never, like it's funny because that's a reality.

00:42:30Marc:And when you're Canadian, you don't think like we got to go to Hollywood.

00:42:33Marc:You got to go to Toronto.

00:42:34Marc:No, never even crossed my mind.

00:42:36Marc:Right.

00:42:36Marc:Yeah.

00:42:37Guest:No, you just got to go to Toronto because it was the coolest city.

00:42:39Guest:My older friends were out there already.

00:42:42Marc:So you and Mark, I picture you load up a car.

00:42:45Guest:I actually went out first and he told me to find him an apartment with a fireplace that cost $200 a month.

00:42:52Guest:That's how Mark McKinney can drive you crazy.

00:42:55Guest:Did you do it?

00:42:56Guest:No, I couldn't find him one.

00:42:57Guest:Yeah, I got a friend coming.

00:42:59Guest:He needs an apartment with a fireplace for $200 a month.

00:43:02Guest:What is this, Europe?

00:43:06Marc:All right, so you go alone and you scope out the scene?

00:43:09Guest:Yeah, and we started, you know, there was Second City and there was Yuck Yucks then, and we just started doing our own thing.

00:43:15Guest:And we were very unsuccessful for very long.

00:43:18Guest:You and Mark.

00:43:18Guest:Yeah, and other people.

00:43:20Guest:And then that's when we met Kevin and Dave there.

00:43:21Marc:Yeah.

00:43:22Guest:And we started doing shows with them.

00:43:23Marc:Yeah, I think I picked up some of the history of the kids from whoever I talked to, probably Scott and Dave.

00:43:30Marc:Right.

00:43:31Marc:But not you and Mark's history.

00:43:32Marc:That's interesting.

00:43:33Marc:Yeah.

00:43:33Marc:So when Mark shows up, you're already in with the guys?

00:43:36Yeah.

00:43:36Guest:Yeah.

00:43:37Guest:Yeah.

00:43:37Guest:And Mark, you know, Mark and I work together all the time.

00:43:40Guest:Like we love to be together on stage, you know, so it formed from way back.

00:43:44Marc:Yeah.

00:43:45Marc:And in like, so when it finally took shape, where would you, were you guys working?

00:43:50Marc:Where was the theater?

00:43:51Guest:Where was the one that, that, you know, we're in the, we went to the Rivoli, which was like an alternative rock club.

00:43:56Marc:Yeah.

00:43:56Guest:It was in Queen Street West.

00:43:57Guest:It was the cool, cool place.

00:43:58Marc:Yeah.

00:43:59Guest:And we didn't do well for a very long period of time.

00:44:01Guest:And then the kids.

00:44:02Guest:Yeah.

00:44:02Guest:And then eventually we were there originally like 12 of you.

00:44:05Guest:No, there was like five other guys and they sort of went and got jobs and they weren't into it anymore.

00:44:11Marc:Didn't stay in entertainment?

00:44:12Guest:Yeah.

00:44:13Guest:No, they did.

00:44:13Guest:They just did other things.

00:44:14Guest:They were just like, enough of us.

00:44:15Marc:Right.

00:44:16Marc:Yeah.

00:44:17Marc:And then you took off?

00:44:19Marc:We ultimately just took off.

00:44:20Guest:But I mean, everyone's history is like, oh, and then Lorne Michaels found them.

00:44:26Guest:It took forever.

00:44:27Guest:It felt like it took forever.

00:44:28Guest:Yeah.

00:44:28Guest:You know, as a young man, it takes, you know, your time is so important.

00:44:32Guest:It's been six months.

00:44:33Guest:You know, now it's like six months.

00:44:35Guest:Oh, I don't know.

00:44:35Guest:I did a pilot.

00:44:36Guest:Oh, it's not going.

00:44:37Guest:OK, I'll see you again next year.

00:44:38Guest:I got my money for a year.

00:44:40Marc:That's right.

00:44:41Marc:It's weird that you still think that way when you are in this business.

00:44:44Marc:It's sort of like, how long is this money going to last?

00:44:47Marc:Yeah, I know.

00:44:48Marc:And there's never a point where you're like, I'm good.

00:44:50Marc:Yeah, I'm good.

00:44:51Guest:I can coast now for a while.

00:44:52Marc:I'm done.

00:44:53Marc:Yeah, yeah.

00:44:54Marc:So, okay, so eventually, we don't have to fast forward, but you did, Lauren Michaels did find you, you produced a show, and then it didn't, did it become a hit here immediately?

00:45:05Marc:Um, no, I think it just, you know, Comedy Central was just starting then.

00:45:10Guest:Right.

00:45:10Guest:And, well, we were on HBO initially, but I think repetition helped us, I think.

00:45:15Guest:They just played it all the time, all the time.

00:45:17Marc:Right, when I was there, like, what year are we talking?

00:45:19Marc:Because I hosted short attention span theater in 92.

00:45:22Marc:Right.

00:45:22Marc:And they were all done by then, because I know that Nick McKinney had his sketch show on.

00:45:26Marc:Right.

00:45:27Marc:What was that, Lot 57?

00:45:28Marc:What was his called?

00:45:29Marc:Vacant Lot?

00:45:30Marc:Yeah, Vacant Lot, yeah.

00:45:31Marc:Yeah.

00:45:31Marc:So that was in production, I think, when I was there.

00:45:33Marc:So you guys were kind of the old men already.

00:45:35Marc:Yeah, we were done.

00:45:36Marc:You were done already.

00:45:37Marc:We were out of there, yeah.

00:45:38Marc:So who were you dealing with over there initially?

00:45:39Marc:So Lauren did it for HBO, and you did how many on HBO?

00:45:43Guest:Well, we did, I think, two seasons.

00:45:45Guest:I mean, we did five seasons in total.

00:45:47Guest:In both places.

00:45:47Guest:Yeah, but it took forever, you know, because we wrote most of the stuff.

00:45:50Guest:So our seasons would be like 14, 15 months long.

00:45:53Marc:Yeah.

00:45:53Guest:Yeah, but we were burnt out.

00:45:54Guest:Mark was the only guy who wanted to go on.

00:45:56Guest:Really?

00:45:56Guest:Yeah.

00:45:57Guest:And he went, that's why he went to Saturday Night Live.

00:45:59Marc:It's like, oh, I still like sketch comedy, you know?

00:46:01Marc:But that was after the movie debacle?

00:46:04Guest:Yeah, kind of at the, sort of at the same time, yeah.

00:46:06Marc:So like, what happened with that?

00:46:09Marc:With Brain Candy?

00:46:10Marc:Yeah.

00:46:11Marc:Well, I don't- Because you guys have always been a cult following and there's like definitely kids in the hall fanatics and people who love you forever.

00:46:17Marc:I imagine now, like you have, you know, boys and girls who are in their 50s.

00:46:22Marc:Right.

00:46:22Marc:You know, who are still kind of dressing like they're in their 30s.

00:46:26Marc:Coming up to you going, hi.

00:46:28Marc:Yeah.

00:46:29Marc:Yeah.

00:46:29Marc:Goth girls with daddy issues.

00:46:30Marc:Yeah.

00:46:31Marc:But now they're 50.

00:46:32Marc:Yeah.

00:46:33Marc:Yeah.

00:46:34Guest:But daddy issues don't go away, Mark.

00:46:35Guest:Don't you know that?

00:46:36Marc:I know.

00:46:36Marc:They just turn into other things.

00:46:37Marc:Yeah.

00:46:38Marc:Usually it's, you know, food or drinking.

00:46:41Marc:Right.

00:46:41Marc:Or collecting weird dolls.

00:46:42Marc:Yeah, yeah, like cats.

00:46:44Marc:But the movie, in retrospect, what happened with it?

00:46:51Marc:Because I know there was the Cancer Boy debacle.

00:46:53Guest:Yeah, where I played Cancer Boy and I had to talk the guy who had financed the movie, which wasn't Paramount, it was somebody else, into keeping Cancer Boy.

00:47:02Guest:And I talked to him for about two hours.

00:47:05Guest:Yeah.

00:47:05Guest:And then I started to cry and I said, this is important to me because my mom died of cancer.

00:47:11Guest:Is that true?

00:47:11Guest:No.

00:47:12Marc:Because we just talked about it.

00:47:13Marc:He's still alive.

00:47:14Guest:Yeah, because my job was to get Cancer Boy in the movie.

00:47:17Guest:So I did whatever it took.

00:47:18Marc:Because it was just a fight to be fought or you believed in it so much?

00:47:23Guest:I feel like I was sent by the troop to do it and I was the guy.

00:47:25Guest:I'm the pugetist.

00:47:26Marc:So everyone was on board.

00:47:27Marc:Yeah, everyone was on board.

00:47:28Marc:We can't lose Cancer Boy.

00:47:29Guest:Yeah, but it was.

00:47:30Guest:And then Lauren said, well, you just lost the war because they're pulling all the ad money.

00:47:36Marc:Lauren produced the movie?

00:47:37Marc:Yeah.

00:47:38Marc:So now what, like, let's talk about that.

00:47:40Marc:Cause I've had those kinds of things where you're like, I'm doing something.

00:47:44Marc:You knew the thing worked.

00:47:45Marc:Had you done it live?

00:47:47Guest:Uh, we didn't know it worked.

00:47:48Guest:I know we hadn't done it.

00:47:49Guest:We had done it in the show and it was called, they wouldn't call him, let us call him cancer boy on CBC.

00:47:54Guest:We had to call him dying kid, which is actually worse.

00:47:56Guest:It's cancer.

00:47:57Guest:You can come back.

00:47:58Marc:You might bounce back.

00:47:59Marc:Not dying kid.

00:48:00Marc:Yeah.

00:48:01Guest:Not dying kid.

00:48:02Guest:Yeah.

00:48:02Guest:So we, but we just, we were fighting for our thing, you know?

00:48:05Marc:It's so funny, isn't it?

00:48:07Marc:When you look back on it, out of all the things you have, out of all the characters you all did, you're going to put it all on the line for Cancer Boy.

00:48:14Marc:And it was important.

00:48:15Guest:It was really important because I'm a punk.

00:48:17Guest:And I took so much from the troupe in a certain way.

00:48:21Guest:I wouldn't let anybody dress me.

00:48:23Guest:So we weren't on the cover of GQ because I wouldn't wear a suit that wasn't one that I brought from a thrift shop.

00:48:30Guest:I understand that.

00:48:31Guest:And it was like I had to be that way.

00:48:33Guest:And it was like, wow, you weren't a lot of fun.

00:48:35Guest:I had very strict punk rules.

00:48:38Guest:Yeah.

00:48:39Guest:Authentic.

00:48:40Guest:Yeah.

00:48:41Guest:And if I really knew myself, I could have probably just worn a suit and been on GQ to let the other guys want to do it.

00:48:47Marc:Did they all get dressed?

00:48:48Marc:Did they all let them get dressed?

00:48:50Guest:No.

00:48:50Guest:It was...

00:48:50Guest:you know you can't do it if you're all not doing it oh really yeah bruce isn't wearing a suit so we can't we all got to wear our own clothes or we're not gonna no there's no gq cover thanks bruce fuck another one but you stood together yeah we did yeah i think not always like what's oh my god he goes on and on what are they going on about him and mark what are they going on about yeah so many opinions you put it up with it yeah and that's what kind of eventually broke you

00:49:17Guest:i don't know if it broke us i think you know we love each other we're kind to each other i think we just you just get worn out like bands get worn out sure but okay so the cancer boy thing so you go to the mats for that thing yeah and they keep it in the movie and you did that with the with the producer of the film and then paramount was like no we're well whoever yeah yeah we're not doing so uh and then lauren says yeah yeah yeah we sort of lost the war we won the battle you know but was he behind cancer boy

00:49:44Guest:I think he was wonderful, actually, in letting us do what we were going to do.

00:49:50Guest:I don't think he would go, pull Cancer Boy from the fucking film.

00:49:54Guest:It's so obvious.

00:49:55Guest:I think he probably wanted to say that, but he really was wonderful in letting us have our own way.

00:50:02Guest:He trusted us somehow.

00:50:03Guest:It was our career to F up.

00:50:05Marc:Do you have any regrets about Cancer Boy?

00:50:07Marc:Not really.

00:50:09Guest:Yeah.

00:50:11Guest:I'd want both things.

00:50:11Guest:I wish.

00:50:12Guest:And I honestly don't think the film would have been much more successful, even if we had more ad money.

00:50:16Guest:It's such a weird little piece.

00:50:17Guest:Yeah.

00:50:18Guest:You know, and it was more fraught with what we were going through.

00:50:20Guest:So it was a very kind of a sad movie in some ways.

00:50:22Guest:Yeah.

00:50:23Guest:You know, and I think that's what it felt like.

00:50:25Guest:It wasn't.

00:50:25Marc:You couldn't hide the sadness.

00:50:27Marc:No, I think there's too much.

00:50:28Marc:You were able to, for your entire career, it's kind of like, what's the word that I want?

00:50:34Marc:Alchemically take darkness and make it into flowers.

00:50:37Marc:And now the darkness was pervasive.

00:50:39Guest:No, it was weeds now.

00:50:41Guest:I remember saying to Kevin, even if this film makes $200 million, it won't be worth it.

00:50:45Guest:We had a call sheet that said, all calls add seven hours.

00:50:50Guest:It's like, I've never seen a call sheet like that.

00:50:52Marc:Really?

00:50:53Guest:Because it was just crazy.

00:50:54Marc:Really?

00:50:55Marc:You couldn't land on something?

00:50:56Guest:Well, no, no.

00:50:57Guest:We were just in so many characters, and they were scrubbing your face in the middle of the night, and you had to go from Alice to Grevo, and you're just exhausted.

00:51:04Guest:You're exhausted.

00:51:06Marc:Okay, so after that, you all kind of were like... There was no...

00:51:11Guest:volatility that I mean there was no bad blood no I think we were tired of each other and then when we finally came back at tooth out in 2000 we did some live shows yeah it was like oh I guess we'll do them yeah you know and it was sort of begrudging yeah and then was like wow people you know and we sold well and fast yeah you know and we're happy to see again and it was it's actually more interesting because like now we don't sell like that and it's like we got to try to sell tickets Milwaukee soft and

00:51:38Guest:You know, it's better, it brings you closer, right?

00:51:43Marc:You mean now?

00:51:44Marc:Yeah.

00:51:44Marc:When was the last time you did it?

00:51:46Marc:I think three years ago?

00:51:47Marc:Uh-huh.

00:51:48Marc:Yeah.

00:51:48Marc:But it was sort of a big deal still, wasn't it?

00:51:50Guest:Yeah.

00:51:51Guest:We still fill a hall, but, you know, they're not like, before it was like, oh my, how many shows can we add?

00:51:56Guest:We're doing five in Vancouver?

00:51:57Marc:Well, that's the thing about the blues guy thing.

00:52:00Marc:Yeah.

00:52:00Marc:Is that, like, you know, if the people that were your fans from when they were kids, they're all in their 40s now, probably, at least.

00:52:07Marc:Yeah.

00:52:07Marc:Right.

00:52:07Marc:So they're like, I can't get out to see the guys.

00:52:10Marc:I got a life.

00:52:10Marc:Yeah.

00:52:11Marc:I can't get a sitter.

00:52:13Marc:Can't, you know, I can't get off my couch, whatever the fuck it is.

00:52:16Marc:It's different when they're grownups.

00:52:18Guest:Yeah.

00:52:19Guest:And sometimes they come, sometimes they don't.

00:52:20Guest:I remember I loved Lou Reed.

00:52:22Guest:Sometimes I go see him.

00:52:23Guest:Sometimes I wouldn't, you know?

00:52:24Marc:Yeah.

00:52:25Marc:Did you see Lou a few times?

00:52:26Guest:Yeah, a few times.

00:52:26Guest:And Iggy, I loved the... Oh, man.

00:52:29Marc:I saw Iggy once in Florida just on a fluke.

00:52:31Marc:I think he had just moved down there and I was visiting my mother and he was playing some club that only had seated 200 people.

00:52:36Marc:And they announced it.

00:52:38Marc:I don't even know how we heard about it.

00:52:39Guest:I'm like, we got to fucking go.

00:52:40Guest:It was great.

00:52:42Guest:Well, I remember in Calgary, I saw him and his band laughed on him.

00:52:46Guest:And in the end, so he just did like an encore.

00:52:49Guest:The drummer came back and he was just like...

00:52:51Marc:playing drums and doing an encore it was like crazy but it was it was so wild was he climbing the walls and he was doing all that stuff yeah he's something else yeah i talked to him uh in the old garage right yeah he like he we came out on uh he came out on the deck and we were about to go in the garage and he was like oh i just need to and he's stretching right the shirt comes off right and he's right sat with him across from him with the shirt why the shirt did you ask him why the shirt off

00:53:17Marc:Do you really need to ask him?

00:53:18Marc:Oh, because it's sexy?

00:53:20Marc:I don't know.

00:53:20Marc:It's just Iggy.

00:53:22Marc:I think it might have had something to do.

00:53:24Marc:It's weird because he's got to occupy Iggy Pop and Jim Osterberg.

00:53:30Marc:Jim Osterberg, Henry Rollins, he makes a distinction.

00:53:34Marc:You're either talking to Iggy or you're talking to Jim.

00:53:36Marc:and I think that maybe he wanted to start as Iggy but I got Jim eventually which was good because Jim's a very smart man and a survivor he meant so much to me as a young man oh you never listened to him talk?

00:53:50Marc:no I don't think I have really he's very intelligent and his memory is like a steel drum dude you make these assumptions about certain people that you respect certainly musicians when Keith Richards wrote that book I was like what the fuck

00:54:03Guest:Oh, no, I couldn't believe it.

00:54:05Guest:And also, well, I'm a bit obsessed with The Stones as well.

00:54:08Guest:And I've read lots of books about Baker's Banquet or whatever.

00:54:11Guest:It's like he's fastidious.

00:54:13Guest:We all think he's always just out there blasted playing his guitar.

00:54:15Guest:No, he works so hard on this stuff.

00:54:17Marc:And he's like very intellectual.

00:54:20Marc:And, you know, it was like it was opened up.

00:54:22Marc:It was like such a lesson in misjudgment.

00:54:24Marc:I know.

00:54:25Marc:Without question.

00:54:26Marc:I felt so.

00:54:26Marc:But then when you really think back on it or even think about it as a grown up, it's like, of course, he's fucking smart.

00:54:32Marc:How the hell can you stay as the stones for as long as they have?

00:54:36Marc:Right.

00:54:37Marc:Keep generating, keep getting your shit together.

00:54:39Marc:Like, you know, there's no number of people that can just wheel those guys out.

00:54:42Marc:They're not that kind of band.

00:54:43Marc:They got to be sharp as fuck.

00:54:45Guest:And they have to come together in a way too, which is I really respect about him.

00:54:48Guest:When they tour and stuff, it's like, he's not going out to like be the Beach Boys and like who's playing the hits.

00:54:53Guest:They have to come together as a unit.

00:54:55Marc:Oh yeah, and if you go see him, especially at the beginning of a tour, which I did last time, I've only seen him like twice in my life, but I went to see the last tour, like the first show, and it took him a couple songs.

00:55:05Marc:Right.

00:55:06Marc:To, you know, sort of like, oh, are they gonna line up?

00:55:09Marc:And they do, they did.

00:55:11Marc:They're really playing.

00:55:12Guest:Yeah, it's pretty wonderful.

00:55:13Guest:so how did we get here oh i remember uh touring like you know as we get older i like this yeah i compared myself to the rolling stones no i had not kids in the hall were the pixies we've always say that i just listened to do a little the other day right all the way through yeah what a great band what a great band did you know them i didn't i wish i'd met them i'm sure dave has yeah he's met everybody oh yeah well he's out in the world yeah he's out in the world i'm not yeah having a few cocktails

00:55:38Marc:Not anymore.

00:55:39Marc:It's done?

00:55:40Marc:Yeah.

00:55:40Marc:How long?

00:55:41Marc:A few years.

00:55:42Marc:Wow.

00:55:42Marc:Yeah.

00:55:42Marc:Good for him.

00:55:43Marc:Yeah.

00:55:43Marc:He's looking great.

00:55:44Marc:He's doing great.

00:55:44Marc:Does he feel better?

00:55:45Marc:He must feel better.

00:55:46Guest:Probably and worse.

00:55:47Marc:Yeah.

00:55:48Marc:I haven't seen him in a while.

00:55:49Marc:I should check in with him.

00:55:51Guest:Get Dave in here.

00:55:52Marc:But you were friends with Gord Downey too, right?

00:55:54Guest:Very good friends, yeah.

00:55:55Marc:Did I say his last name right?

00:55:56Marc:Downey.

00:55:56Marc:Downey, yeah.

00:55:58Marc:Well, sorry for your loss.

00:55:59Marc:Well, thank you.

00:55:59Marc:And I'm sad that like, because there was a little bit of momentum trying to get me to talk to him, but I just, I didn't know the work that much and I would have felt like I would have done a disservice.

00:56:08Guest:He was such an amazing guy.

00:56:11Guest:And I don't know if you know, he did so much work with the First Nations people at the end of his life.

00:56:17Guest:But when I saw their last tour, it was the greatest thing I'd ever seen in my life.

00:56:21Marc:I wish I grew up with it.

00:56:22Marc:I wish I knew the music better.

00:56:23Guest:I actually, in a one-man show I'm doing now, I actually do something which I don't normally do.

00:56:27Guest:I share because we're very good friends.

00:56:29Guest:I share a bunch of our late night emails that we send back and forth that are both very savage, very funny.

00:56:35Guest:You know, when they go on tour, I say, oh, this is clearly a ploy to make money.

00:56:39Guest:But I misspelled it.

00:56:41Guest:Yeah, it was plow to make money.

00:56:42Guest:Great.

00:56:43Guest:He's got fucking brain cancer.

00:56:44Guest:He's got to figure out my non sequitur.

00:56:46Guest:So it's really wonderful for the audience that they, you know.

00:56:50Guest:When did they start?

00:56:50Guest:They started about when we did.

00:56:54Guest:So they were, you know, we're very parallel to them in many ways.

00:56:57Guest:And they were gigantic, you know.

00:56:59Marc:Yeah.

00:56:59Guest:Gigantic.

00:57:00Guest:And I was actually at Atlantic Records at the same time as them.

00:57:03Guest:They, by mistake, sent me their contract.

00:57:05Marc:Oh, is that true?

00:57:06Guest:Yeah, but I didn't look at it.

00:57:07Marc:It's like the Kevin MacDonald problem that I had.

00:57:09Marc:Yeah.

00:57:09Marc:You just got there.

00:57:10Marc:Why?

00:57:10Marc:Just because it was on the Canadian set?

00:57:12Marc:Yeah, I guess it was.

00:57:13Marc:Yeah.

00:57:14Marc:But how...

00:57:16Marc:Because I guess I didn't really, it turns out when I really sit down and think about it, I'm a lot more out of touch than I think I am.

00:57:25Marc:But they were definitely probably bigger in Canada, right?

00:57:28Guest:Oh, without question.

00:57:29Guest:They play Maple Leaf Gardens three nights.

00:57:30Guest:How big is that place?

00:57:32Guest:18,000.

00:57:33Guest:Jeez.

00:57:33Guest:Yeah, they play any place.

00:57:35Marc:Oh, man, it's so sad.

00:57:36Guest:How old was he?

00:57:37Guest:He was 56, maybe.

00:57:40Guest:Oh, my God.

00:57:42Guest:Yeah, and such a good guy.

00:57:43Marc:Well, that's interesting in the show, because I've noticed that a bit lately with people of our generation, the bluesmen, like Adam Sandler, and even I watched Springsteen's One Man Show, he's a little older, but they're definitely taking time to do tributes in a way.

00:58:00Marc:Sandler talked about Farley, and Springsteen talked about Clarence Clemens, but it's definitely a piece of the show where you kind of honor a lost friend.

00:58:10Marc:What is the new One Man Show?

00:58:11Guest:Uh, it's just called tales of bravery and stupidity.

00:58:13Guest:It's just the weird shit I've done in my life, which is probably sometimes to get material.

00:58:19Guest:Like I, you know, do you consciously do that?

00:58:21Guest:No.

00:58:21Guest:Well, I, you know, it's like my wife says, Oh, let's go to Pismo beach for the weekend.

00:58:24Guest:And there's the sea Vista looks really crappy.

00:58:26Guest:And I think, yeah, maybe we'll go there.

00:58:27Guest:It could be a story.

00:58:29Guest:Yeah.

00:58:29Marc:Yeah.

00:58:29Guest:And of course you find a dirty diaper in the sea Vista.

00:58:32Guest:Yeah.

00:58:32Guest:You know, so it's like, so it's just, you know, I love gold.

00:58:35Guest:I love, yeah.

00:58:36Guest:I love storytelling, you know, as much as more than standup where you kill them.

00:58:39Guest:Yeah.

00:58:40Guest:And so it's that stuff.

00:58:41Marc:Yeah.

00:58:42Marc:I mean, there used to that was one of those weird lines that, you know, I had to cross at some point where, you know, when I was a younger man where before I ended up desperately doing one person shows at one point in my career where it's sort of like, that's a cop out.

00:58:55Marc:Right.

00:58:56Marc:Just can't, you know, got the goods.

00:58:57Marc:Yeah.

00:58:58Marc:You just got to, you know, lengthen it out and you don't have to worry about laughs.

00:59:01Marc:Right.

00:59:02Marc:Right.

00:59:02Marc:But you did stand-up and you say that we met on a stand-up show.

00:59:07Guest:Yeah, I think at the Poor Alex.

00:59:09Guest:No, at, sorry, Steve Allen.

00:59:11Marc:Oh, okay, okay.

00:59:12Guest:You did stand-up there.

00:59:13Guest:Yeah.

00:59:14Guest:You did 12 M's of C, minutes of comedy.

00:59:17Marc:Yeah.

00:59:19Marc:And you didn't like stand-up?

00:59:21Guest:I like stand-up and I still do it.

00:59:23Marc:You do?

00:59:23Guest:I'm going to do it next week at Kevin's show, Toronto.

00:59:27Guest:Kevin MacDonald?

00:59:28Guest:Yeah.

00:59:28Guest:I like stand-up, but it's sometimes nice to be in a theater.

00:59:32Guest:You know?

00:59:33Guest:And people there just to see you.

00:59:36Guest:I remember I did... Without the pressure.

00:59:37Guest:I did the improv with Janine a few years ago.

00:59:39Guest:And I thought, I've worked my whole life to go to have people come see me who know me.

00:59:45Guest:And here I am at the improv and there's a 50-year-old woman celebrating her birthday, drunk at the table.

00:59:50Guest:It's like, eh, maybe not.

00:59:51Marc:Yeah.

00:59:52Marc:Well, that's like that's the other thing that's weird about like about doing it now that I finally after two decades can have enough fans to sell a theater out.

01:00:01Marc:Right.

01:00:02Marc:I still feel like it's part of my job as a comic to go into a place where at least a third of the room doesn't fucking know me and do the job.

01:00:10Guest:Yeah, I think it's noble.

01:00:11Guest:I actually do.

01:00:12Guest:I think it's cool.

01:00:13Marc:You know, win them over.

01:00:14Guest:Yeah.

01:00:15Marc:But then like midway into that set, you're like, I don't really care about these people.

01:00:18Marc:What, and I have to do a show after this?

01:00:20Marc:No, I don't mind that.

01:00:21Marc:But it's just sort of like, even though there's the people that don't know me, some of them I can feel like they still don't care.

01:00:27Marc:And it's sort of like, all right, fine.

01:00:29Marc:I don't care if you don't care.

01:00:30Marc:And you know, the next guy will be fun for you, hopefully.

01:00:34Marc:It'll be your cup of tea.

01:00:35Guest:Yeah, I remember I did stand-up not too long ago.

01:00:37Guest:And then I thought I was pretty funny.

01:00:38Guest:And then Tom Papa went on.

01:00:40Guest:It's like, I'm funny.

01:00:42Guest:But then there's Tom Papa.

01:00:44Guest:It's a whole other thing.

01:00:45Guest:He's tight, man.

01:00:46Guest:Oh, and it's just chemically so different.

01:00:48Guest:The whole audience comes.

01:00:50Guest:He's raising his arms.

01:00:51Guest:Like they just go crazy.

01:00:53Marc:He's got tight craft, that Papa.

01:00:54Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:00:55Marc:Yeah, he's on top of it.

01:00:56Marc:Yeah.

01:00:56Marc:Not a missing beat.

01:00:57Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

01:00:59Marc:Everything is honed.

01:01:00Marc:Each beat, each word.

01:01:02Marc:Yeah, he's a great comic.

01:01:04Marc:So, the one-man show.

01:01:05Marc:Now, are you doing it just in Canada?

01:01:08Guest:I'm doing it in Canada now.

01:01:09Guest:I'll do some dates in the States.

01:01:10Marc:Are you doing like a run?

01:01:11Marc:You got a theater?

01:01:12Marc:Touring around.

01:01:14Marc:Oh, you're not just at one place for a month?

01:01:17Marc:No, that's too hard.

01:01:18Marc:Yeah.

01:01:19Marc:To do to do a month somewhere.

01:01:21Marc:OK, so now after the kids, like, let's talk about this this this L.A.

01:01:26Marc:period.

01:01:26Marc:Right.

01:01:27Marc:Because I always knew, you know, that the other guys were more visible, but you were working a lot behind the camera and you became that guy.

01:01:36Guest:Yeah, you know, I directed a few films.

01:01:38Guest:And I think the last part of my career, I kind of got caught in a success trap, which was I probably did 15 pilots for like NBC.

01:01:48Marc:You were doing the development thing.

01:01:49Guest:Doing the thing.

01:01:49Guest:And it's like, oh, great, I sold it in the room.

01:01:51Guest:And then I sold another one the next day.

01:01:53Guest:And it's like, and then you realize, oh, they're just, they don't make most of them.

01:01:58Guest:yeah and then so i'd get paid out and people go where have you been oh i've been working yeah i did one day on arrested development you know and it's like well that's what people think what regular people they're like he must not be doing well i've seen he shows up every five years as a bit player yeah yeah and well i never like i never did any tried to i never saw any acting or any of that stuff so it was all you didn't no i just and i've always thought of myself as a writer anyway

01:02:20Guest:So, you know, look, there's four very talented guys in the kids in the hall.

01:02:24Guest:And then there's a guy with a jumbo head who won't stand still.

01:02:28Guest:And that's me.

01:02:29Marc:But you're very memorable.

01:02:30Marc:All your characters are memorable.

01:02:31Marc:Like when you were coming over, like I was like, I know that guy because I remember, you know, like you were definitely an actor and a comedic performer.

01:02:39Guest:Well, I'm good in the kids in the hall.

01:02:41Guest:You know, I don't know if I'm always good and I would always be good in something else.

01:02:45Marc:Yeah.

01:02:46Marc:So that was something you just admitted to yourself or that you think about yourself?

01:02:49Guest:Well, I didn't seek it out.

01:02:50Guest:It's so interesting.

01:02:51Guest:I could go into a room and sell a show to 10 NBC executives.

01:02:55Guest:Yeah.

01:02:56Guest:But I can't audition.

01:02:57Guest:Yeah.

01:02:57Guest:I did one when I came here, and Bobcat Goldthwait was there.

01:03:00Guest:I don't want to be in another waiting room with Bobcat Goldthwait.

01:03:04Guest:Neither of us are going to get it.

01:03:05Marc:That's the same thing that stopped you from letting them dress you for the GQ cover.

01:03:10Marc:I guess, yeah.

01:03:11Marc:They're sort of like, how do I hold on to my strange ego-based integrity?

01:03:16Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:03:16Marc:Yeah.

01:03:17Marc:Why do I like it?

01:03:18Marc:Because we're all so fragile that that sort of weird resistance.

01:03:21Marc:So I'm going to wear my own clothes.

01:03:22Marc:It's like I need to go sit there and have my identity destroyed in a room full of people that are kind of like me waiting to do the one that I didn't even create.

01:03:31Guest:Yeah.

01:03:32Guest:Yeah, exactly.

01:03:32Guest:These words don't make any sense to me.

01:03:34Marc:Right.

01:03:34Marc:Yeah.

01:03:35Marc:It's humiliating.

01:03:36Guest:Yeah.

01:03:36Guest:Someone can say these words or someone else can say these words.

01:03:38Guest:That's what I always think.

01:03:39Guest:I don't know.

01:03:40Guest:I could or someone else could.

01:03:41Guest:Yeah, yeah.

01:03:42Guest:Probably better than me.

01:03:42Guest:You have the other guy to do it.

01:03:43Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:03:44Marc:I don't need to go.

01:03:45Marc:But you did find your way into directing and that was just a natural evolution.

01:03:48Marc:Because it seems like that's one of those things if you do a good job and you're nice to people that you keep getting work.

01:03:53Guest:Yeah.

01:03:54Guest:I did it.

01:03:55Guest:I started doing it during the kids in the hall because I did see past the kids in the hall and I thought, I need a job after this.

01:03:59Guest:I'm not going to be getting another series.

01:04:02Guest:I don't want to do another series.

01:04:03Guest:Right.

01:04:03Guest:And I was always been the guy who was obsessed with the music and the extras and the thing and the thing.

01:04:08Guest:So it was sort of natural.

01:04:09Guest:And I was out of it for a while.

01:04:11Guest:And then now I sort of, you know, I did a show called Young Drunk Punk where I...

01:04:15Marc:Canadian show?

01:04:16Guest:Yeah.

01:04:17Guest:I had actually done a pilot with Bill Burr and Kevin Hart just before Kevin broke at Comedy Central.

01:04:24Guest:And I kind of had wished I had directed it just because it was the communication.

01:04:29Guest:You wrote it?

01:04:30Guest:I wrote it with them.

01:04:30Guest:Yeah.

01:04:32Marc:You're one of those guys, like, we're going to set you up with a writer.

01:04:34Guest:You know Bruce?

01:04:35Guest:Yeah, he's that stuff.

01:04:37Guest:We need an adult in the room.

01:04:40Guest:So when I did Young Drunk Punk, I wanted to direct it.

01:04:43Guest:So I directed it, and then I started doing a little bit more.

01:04:46Guest:It's like, oh, I actually really like directing.

01:04:49Guest:Because I had done Superstar and a couple of, and then I did the Tom Green movie that gave my career a heart attack.

01:04:55Guest:Did it?

01:04:56Guest:Yeah.

01:04:57Guest:Stealing Harvard, which again made $32 million in cost, whatever.

01:05:02Guest:And so I went through that Hollywood thing, which I didn't know that I was in film jail and my agent wouldn't tell me that I wasn't going to get another job.

01:05:11Guest:And so for a long time- Because it tanked?

01:05:13Guest:Yeah.

01:05:14Guest:And now I want to be a film director.

01:05:17Guest:They can't throw me out.

01:05:18Guest:And then I was beating my head against the wall and then I sort of moved into writing pilots and doing TV.

01:05:24Marc:But you directed, you worked on Schitt's Creek?

01:05:27Marc:Schitt's Creek.

01:05:28Marc:Trailer Park Boys.

01:05:29Guest:Yeah, Trailer Park Boys.

01:05:30Guest:Amazing.

01:05:31Marc:Yeah.

01:05:32Guest:And then I'm going to direct all this series I'm doing now.

01:05:35Marc:And what was the last series you did up in Canada?

01:05:38Marc:Was it Young Drunk Punk?

01:05:39Guest:Yeah, and I did another thing called This Blows, which is about a girl who she gets hit by a car and then now she can blow things up when she gets angry.

01:05:46Guest:Sort of a sci-fi thing.

01:05:48Guest:How'd that go over?

01:05:49Guest:It was good.

01:05:49Guest:It was a digital thing, but it was really wonderful.

01:05:51Guest:Yeah.

01:05:52Guest:My friend's kids were in it.

01:05:54Guest:So that was.

01:05:55Marc:So you keep working.

01:05:56Guest:Oh, I work a lot.

01:05:56Marc:Yeah.

01:05:57Marc:Was there a period here where you were just sort of like, what's going to happen now?

01:06:00Guest:Kind of.

01:06:00Guest:Well, but also when you sell a pilot, you make your money for the year.

01:06:03Guest:Right.

01:06:03Guest:And then it's like, oh, in January 9th, the year's over.

01:06:07Guest:Okay, I guess I'm.

01:06:08Guest:Go out again.

01:06:09Guest:Yeah, I'll go out in August again.

01:06:12Marc:Yeah.

01:06:12Marc:So what did you do with that time?

01:06:14Marc:Just family time?

01:06:15Guest:Just family.

01:06:16Marc:Yeah.

01:06:16Yeah.

01:06:17Marc:walk run whatever you know do stuff but i'm always writing or doing something you and your wife been together since for 20 years oh yeah and the kids are now one start in high school yeah 12 and 14. wow yeah so you just like kind of dug in and just dug in yeah created a family because i came from a shitty one yeah and you're doing it better i i feel i am yeah and i couldn't no one could do it worse

01:06:40Marc:And what about the music career?

01:06:43Marc:Again, I was like, oh, I'm not going to go tour with my record.

01:06:45Marc:That was a funny record.

01:06:46Marc:Yeah, I did a couple, actually.

01:06:48Marc:I couldn't find the second one, the Drunk Baby Project.

01:06:51Marc:I should have brought it over for you.

01:06:52Marc:Yeah, I would have liked it on vinyl.

01:06:55Marc:But the other one was funny.

01:06:57Guest:People liked it.

01:06:58Guest:People really liked it.

01:06:58Guest:I was happy with it.

01:07:00Guest:What was that one called?

01:07:01Guest:Shame-Based Man.

01:07:02Guest:Who did the cover art on that?

01:07:03Guest:His name is Marshall Erisman.

01:07:05Guest:That's quite a, it's like disturbing and good.

01:07:07Guest:Yeah, he's an Esquire cartoonist or illustrator.

01:07:11Guest:And I had bought a couple of his pieces that I'd seen in the magazine.

01:07:14Guest:And it's like, I want him to do it.

01:07:16Guest:And he did it?

01:07:17Guest:Yeah.

01:07:17Marc:Isn't that exciting?

01:07:18Guest:And I went to a studio in New York and I loved it.

01:07:21Marc:Yeah.

01:07:21Guest:That's the best thing.

01:07:22Marc:Painting.

01:07:23Marc:Yeah, it's always good to enjoy the art of somebody that is working in a medium that has nothing to do with you and you can't do it.

01:07:30Marc:Oh, no.

01:07:31Marc:Well, that's why I love music.

01:07:32Guest:But it's like, yeah, it's amazing.

01:07:35Guest:And that's the best thing.

01:07:36Guest:Marshall Erisman did my cover.

01:07:38Marc:Yeah.

01:07:38Marc:But that was a comedy record, really, right?

01:07:42Guest:Yeah, and it was kind of.

01:07:44Guest:Kind of spoken word.

01:07:46Guest:Yeah, a little bit of that stuff.

01:07:47Guest:I don't smell many.

01:07:49Guest:Spoken word, I don't smell many.

01:07:52Guest:That was my Kevin MacDonald.

01:07:54Marc:So that was good.

01:07:57Marc:So how long have you been in Toronto now?

01:07:59Marc:Uh, just four months.

01:08:01Marc:And does it feel like I'm home?

01:08:02Marc:Thank God.

01:08:03Guest:No, it's complicated.

01:08:04Guest:There's, there's no right decision.

01:08:05Guest:You know, it's like, I like that city though.

01:08:07Guest:Yeah.

01:08:08Guest:It's a great city, but it's, you know, and I'm Canadian.

01:08:10Guest:Yeah.

01:08:10Guest:You know, so it's, we had to, I had to get my kids back there.

01:08:13Guest:Yeah.

01:08:13Guest:I didn't want them to be soft in the Hollywood Hills.

01:08:15Marc:Yeah.

01:08:16Marc:And, and are any of the other kids up there just Kevin or?

01:08:18Guest:Scott's back and forth.

01:08:21Guest:Mark's there sometimes, but he's always doing Superstore here.

01:08:25Marc:Yeah.

01:08:27Guest:And Dave's here?

01:08:28Guest:Dave's here, yeah.

01:08:29Marc:Yeah.

01:08:30Guest:And you guys talk?

01:08:31Guest:Oh, yeah.

01:08:32Guest:We'll be doing something soon.

01:08:33Guest:We keep talking about it.

01:08:35Marc:But the last tour a few years ago, it was good enough to do it again.

01:08:39Guest:Yeah.

01:08:40Guest:I mean, we've been talking about doing a sketch show for a long time now, and I think we'll end up doing it.

01:08:45Marc:Really?

01:08:46Marc:Yeah.

01:08:46Marc:With all you guys in it?

01:08:47Marc:Yeah.

01:08:48Yeah.

01:08:48Guest:All the original members, people always ask us when we do a show, are they all the original members?

01:08:52Guest:Who's it going to be?

01:08:53Marc:It's not like- Harlan Williams as Bruce McCullough.

01:08:56Marc:Bill Wyman doesn't want to travel anymore.

01:08:59Marc:Harlan Williams, Bruce McCullough.

01:09:01Marc:But how would you do it in this-

01:09:04Marc:It's weird because I started thinking about it, and we were talking about it earlier, this aging thing.

01:09:10Marc:I don't feel bad, but you know you can... I was fortunate in that whatever relevance I accumulated, which was not nearly as big as you guys, happened when I was in my mid-40s, which was great.

01:09:22Marc:Thank God I pulled it off.

01:09:24Marc:But even now, after 10 years of my marginal relevance, I'm starting to think, is it done?

01:09:32Marc:Am I...

01:09:33Marc:Where does it go?

01:09:34Marc:When do you know it's time to stop if you can?

01:09:37Marc:Well, you have to keep going.

01:09:38Marc:Yeah.

01:09:38Marc:You just do.

01:09:39Marc:This is what we learned.

01:09:39Marc:Yeah.

01:09:40Marc:Now, in thinking about approaching another Kids in the Hall project, you would call it the Kids in the Hall again?

01:09:46Guest:Yeah.

01:09:47Marc:Yeah.

01:09:47Guest:We should call it Hee Haw, too.

01:09:49Guest:Is that what you're suggesting, Mark?

01:09:50Marc:Well, I'm just saying.

01:09:51Marc:No.

01:09:52Marc:It's the original guys, but they're doing a new thing.

01:09:55Guest:Well, we'd be doing sketches, so a sketch is a sketch, right?

01:09:58Guest:A song is a song.

01:09:59Marc:Do you think you'd approach it differently and be more age-appropriate?

01:10:02Guest:Well, we'd have to be.

01:10:04Guest:I mean, we have to play, you know, we don't play debutantes anymore.

01:10:08Guest:You know, we play old billowy ladies.

01:10:12Guest:Yeah, yeah.

01:10:13Guest:I know when we did Death Comes to Town, our miniseries that we had done, it's like I remember looking at the footage going, oh, we really are older.

01:10:21Guest:We really are really, really older, right?

01:10:24Marc:Yeah, I have that moment in the mirror some days.

01:10:25Marc:Some days, you know, because you see yourself all the time and you're like, there I am.

01:10:29Marc:And then one day you're like, oh, it's happening.

01:10:30Guest:Yeah.

01:10:31Guest:I remember once I'd written all night and I looked at my face and I said, oh, there's my 50-year-old face.

01:10:36Guest:Yeah.

01:10:37Guest:Right.

01:10:37Guest:Yeah.

01:10:37Guest:And I was in my early 40s, I think.

01:10:39Marc:Yeah.

01:10:40Marc:Yeah.

01:10:40Marc:There's my 50-year-old face.

01:10:41Marc:That's how it's going to be.

01:10:42Guest:Yeah.

01:10:42Guest:Well, I thought this went well, do you?

01:10:44Guest:I thought it was wonderful.

01:10:46Guest:And I didn't want to tell you what a fan I am of this podcast because you would have not interviewed me.

01:10:50Guest:That's not true.

01:10:53Marc:The only thing that happens sometimes when people are fans is that they produce the show in their head.

01:10:57Marc:They're like, oh, this is where you can ask me about my dad.

01:11:00Marc:Okay, so this is the part where you go, who are your guys?

01:11:03Marc:I didn't have to do that with you.

01:11:06Marc:Who are your guys, though?

01:11:07Marc:What do you mean?

01:11:07Marc:I mean, you know, like the people that inspired you the most outside of the brothers.

01:11:12Guest:I don't know.

01:11:14Marc:We talked about it musically.

01:11:16Guest:Yeah, it's just more musically.

01:11:18Marc:Yeah, yeah.

01:11:19Marc:In Iggy, The Damned.

01:11:21Marc:Yeah, all those people.

01:11:21Marc:Tragically hip.

01:11:22Marc:Yep.

01:11:23Marc:But who was the one that blew your mind the first time?

01:11:25Marc:Was it T-Rex?

01:11:27Guest:Well, I still remember when they put on God Saves the Queen.

01:11:31Guest:I still remember that feeling at the back of my neck like ecstasy was coming for me.

01:11:38Guest:I'll never forget that.

01:11:39Guest:Yeah.

01:11:39Guest:How that felt.

01:11:40Marc:That was it.

01:11:40Guest:What the fuck is this?

01:11:42Marc:Yeah.

01:11:42Marc:I want to crawl inside it.

01:11:44Marc:Yeah.

01:11:45Marc:And you stayed there.

01:11:46Marc:Yeah.

01:11:46Marc:And now we're old and we made it through.

01:11:48Marc:Yeah.

01:11:48Marc:Nice talking to you.

01:11:49Marc:Yeah.

01:11:49Marc:Nice talking to you, sir.

01:11:55Marc:I like those Canadians.

01:11:57Marc:That was a nice chat.

01:11:59Marc:He's a nice guy, and he's funny in a very specific, unique way.

01:12:04Marc:Bruce McCullough, Tales of Bravery and Stupidity is his one-person show.

01:12:07Marc:Soon to be a book, and Watch Out for Tall Boys, which is a sketch comedy show that he produced and directed.

01:12:14Marc:There's pastries right there.

01:12:16Marc:Right, like, eight of them.

01:12:19Marc:But two of them are just chocolates.

01:12:21Marc:They're just little chocolates.

01:12:25Marc:Yeah, maybe I'll... Boomer lives!

01:12:28Marc:Boomer lives!