Episode 1008 - Vincent D'Onofrio
Guest:Lock the gates!
Marc:Alright, let's do this.
Marc:How are you, what the fuckers?
Marc:What the fuck buddies?
Marc:What the fucksters?
Marc:What the fuck nicks?
Marc:What's happening?
Marc:It's Marc Maron.
Marc:I'm here.
Marc:This is my podcast, WTF.
Marc:How's it going?
Marc:Ooh, man.
Marc:I'm still in London, and what a few days it's been.
Marc:I haven't talked to you since, what, last Thursday?
Marc:And I recorded that on the day before, so I just got here.
Marc:I was hallucinating.
Marc:I don't think I'm still hallucinating, but...
Marc:When you're in a different country, different side of the street, different personal products, different cereals, different people.
Marc:They are different.
Marc:We're all people, but the Brits and the tone of the city and the culture is different.
Marc:It does feel like a bit of a hallucination, but it's not.
Marc:I'm here.
Marc:I'm eating things.
Marc:I'm engaging with people, with audiences.
Marc:I'll tell you about it in a second.
Marc:Oh, by the way, Vincent D'Onofrio is on the show today.
Marc:Always respected that guy.
Marc:Love him as an actor.
Marc:Seems like an intense guy.
Marc:He was an intense guy.
Marc:And it was great talking to him.
Marc:So that's coming up when I'm teasing my own show.
Marc:You'll hear that in a minute if you hang out for this.
Marc:I got tour dates.
Marc:So you may want to hang out for that.
Marc:You might want to hang out for that.
Marc:I got tour dates.
Marc:It's happening.
Marc:And holy fuck.
Marc:I don't think I even realized...
Marc:the number of dates I was going to be doing, but I'm doing them.
Marc:All right.
Marc:So I'm going to read them off to you.
Marc:Just sort of like, so you can hear if your city is mentioned, then maybe it'll inspire you to go pursue tickets.
Marc:August 9th in Portland, Oregon at Revolution Hall.
Marc:August 22nd in Dallas, Texas at the Majestic Theater.
Marc:August 23rd in Austin, Texas at the Paramount Theater.
Marc:August 24th in Houston at the Cullen Theater at Wortham Center.
Marc:September 6th in Vancouver at the Vogue again.
Marc:September 7th in Seattle at the Moore Theater, September 20th in Chicago at the Vic, September 21st in Detroit at the Masonic Temple, September 22nd in Minneapolis at the Pantages, October 10th in Philadelphia at the Miriam Theater, October 11th in Washington, D.C.
Marc:at the Kennedy Center Concert Hall.
Marc:Wow, that's that's big.
Marc:October 12th in Boston at the Schubert Theater.
Marc:And I'm going to be shooting a special there that night.
Marc:So there'll be two shows there.
Marc:October 18th in Nashville at the James K. Polk Theater.
Marc:October 19th in Atlanta at the Tabernacle.
Marc:And October 26th.
Marc:in San Francisco at the Masonic.
Marc:There will be a fan pre-sale for tickets this Wednesday, April 10th at 10 a.m.
Marc:to Thursday, April 11th at 10 p.m.
Marc:Just go to the venue websites and use the password BUSTER.
Marc:The official on-sale date for all venues.
Marc:Is this Friday, April 12th?
Marc:Except for the Kennedy Center, that's on sale April 19th.
Marc:A lot of information, but come this week, you can always go to wtfpod.com slash tour for more info on all these dates and venues, and I would assume the links to the tickets, okay?
Marc:Wow, man, that's a lot of work.
Marc:Why didn't I realize that?
Marc:Where was I when I booked these things?
Marc:I was just, I guess, on the phone, maybe cooking something, going, uh-huh, yeah, okay, sure, yeah, DC's good.
Marc:Detroit, I haven't been there in forever.
Marc:Okay, yeah, all right, sure.
Marc:Houston, okay, yeah.
Marc:Dallas, I don't know, I don't know, I don't feel like I got people in Dallas.
Marc:Okay, yeah, all right.
Marc:That's how that works.
Marc:And now looking at it all almost as if it were a poem on this page, a lot of dates.
Marc:And God knows by Boston, by October 12th, I should have a very tight relationship.
Marc:very well-grooved, very together hour and 15 minutes of material for a Netflix special.
Marc:That's for fucking sure.
Marc:Okay, how's it going?
Marc:Everybody all right?
Marc:So, since I've last talked to you, I've done a show in Salford, which is within Manchester, despite the fact that right at the beginning of the show, when I said, I'm glad to be in Manchester, or whatever version of that I said, some guy went, Salford!
Marc:And there was a bit of an argument, but apparently here...
Marc:I guess not unlike other places, there are kind of regional battles that are separated by streets, perhaps.
Marc:But it added texture to the show.
Marc:We did a lot of riffing.
Marc:I'd never been to Manchester.
Marc:I get the sense, and I know this is sort of a hackneyed piece of information, but...
Marc:I do believe that Manchester might be the birthplace of sad rain.
Marc:I think that rain was just rain and it didn't imply much previous to appearing in Manchester.
Marc:But over time, it took on an emotional tone of its own.
Marc:So I was in the birthplace of sad rain and apparently soccer or football, as they say here.
Marc:And knew nothing about it, but it seems to be woven into the culture in such a deep way that I felt like I should know something about it, but I did not do any research.
Marc:Didn't do any research on soccer or football, did not do any research on Brexit, because I found that though I was a little panicked coming into this about not knowing anything about Brexit...
Marc:It turns out that neither do the people here.
Marc:A lot of confusion.
Marc:They don't want to talk about it.
Marc:No problem.
Marc:I can talk about our country's slow drift to sort of evangelical authoritarianism and complete capitalistic chaos managed by a judiciary that will sink this entire operation.
Marc:Just my opinion.
Marc:But, you know, good shows.
Marc:I get there.
Marc:I get to places, and it seems to me that if I want to go to a museum or something, I'll do it, but I was tired.
Marc:I was jet-lagged, as you knew from the last time, so I got up.
Marc:I tried to find a place that had healthy food.
Marc:I ended up in the basement of a Buddhist society or a Buddhist center in the middle of Manchester, and it was just this old-style, strange little wooden table hippie joint that looked like it'd been there forever, and it's very interesting about...
Marc:is that the people working at the Buddha Center, which was sort of, you know, it was a paid gig.
Marc:I mean, you buy the food, but it had a sort of kind of communal health food vibe to it.
Marc:And it's just interesting, the people that gravitate towards Buddha,
Marc:maybe buddhism or the buddhist center or whatever you think that might be uh when you when you go there and you see them you're like okay all right yeah i think you you kind of need to be here don't you you need to be here look it seems to me that contemporary buddhism or whatever that is and i'm not i don't know much about it but it's one of those options where you know the wheels have really got to come off man and you know and if jesus was driving that train and
Marc:It didn't work out.
Marc:So you needed something simple.
Marc:You needed something basic.
Marc:You needed something that was pretty much not confrontive in terms of deities.
Marc:And you just took your fragile self and you found a little place and you got a little peace.
Marc:And now you're serving me some quinoa and cabbage salad.
Marc:And, you know, God bless.
Marc:I'm glad you're doing okay.
Marc:Take care of yourself.
Marc:I worry about you.
Marc:I've known you for 40 seconds.
Marc:So after that, the day of the show, I decided to go get a shave because I just walked by a barber.
Marc:They're around.
Marc:They're around in the States.
Marc:You figure everybody knows how to give a nice close shave, keep the stash, bring the soul patch back, get rid of the beard, don't need it.
Marc:But this guy seemed a little tentative.
Marc:Not a great experience, the tentative shave.
Marc:It literally felt like...
Marc:He might have even said it when I said, do you do shaves?
Marc:He's like, I can do it.
Marc:Yes, I can do this.
Marc:Yeah, yeah, yes, yes, yeah, we do shaves.
Marc:And he did it.
Marc:He was very precise, but it was not comfortable.
Marc:It was not usually you relax into the ritual.
Marc:You trust the guy.
Marc:You get nice hot cream on your face.
Marc:You get a hot towel.
Marc:There's a sort of a meditation calm to it.
Marc:It's another form of Buddhism, I guess.
Marc:Not really.
Marc:But you do surrender and you relax.
Marc:But not so much this guy.
Marc:He was doing it in small patches.
Marc:He put little dabs of cream on and he was right up on my face doing it very carefully to the point where I was very conscious of relaxing my face because I was afraid if I tighten my face, he would cut part of my face.
Marc:But I was really...
Marc:cheering him on in my mind i was like come on buddy you can do this i want you to have this experience uh he was so proud that i think that he didn't cut me and that we didn't fuck up my sideburns or my mustache that he didn't give me the full sort of aftershave lotion treatment and but he was you know i i felt like i helped him out and and that's what being a person is all about it's like here i'll risk my own face for you to have an uh you know to
Marc:to have a new experience and get better at what you're doing.
Marc:It's not the experience I wanted, but I hope it went well for you.
Marc:And I think that's sort of a theme.
Marc:I don't know.
Marc:Then the show in Manchester was great.
Marc:That Lowry Theater was beautiful, small, about 450, packed it out, but very intimate.
Marc:And the acoustics were perfect.
Marc:And I love that feeling where you have that many people, but it can still be an intimate experience.
Marc:And I think everybody had a good time.
Marc:I did do some press up there.
Marc:There's been a shit ton of press here.
Marc:I'll be honest with you, man.
Marc:I don't think I've done as much press as I did on this trip in years, if ever.
Marc:I did this show.
Marc:You never really know what you're walking into, but I did this show called Loose Ends.
Marc:And I wasn't really paying attention when they told me.
Marc:I knew it was several people.
Marc:You sit around, you talk.
Marc:I didn't think I knew the host.
Marc:And then the day of, I'm like, wait a minute.
Marc:That's the guy, Clive Anderson is hosting this, the guy from Who's Wine.
Marc:I remember that guy.
Marc:And Mavis Staples.
Marc:Mavis fucking Staples is on the show with me.
Marc:And what an honor that is.
Marc:It was me, Mavis Staples, Judy Kramer, who created the...
Marc:Mamma Mia musical, and Anita Anand, who this book she wrote sounds amazing.
Marc:I think it's called The Patient Assassin.
Marc:She's a journalist and author here, and she was great.
Marc:But I'm sitting there with Mavis Staples at a table, and she's telling stories about singing for Martin Luther King, about Bob Dylan proposing to her, and just to meet her and tell her that I saw her years ago at the bottom line when Pop Staples was still alive and John Hammond opened for them.
Marc:She's like, oh, I remember that.
Marc:And they're like,
Marc:It's just sometimes it's this business is just very exciting and very it's just a powerful moment, man.
Marc:I mean, she she's amazing.
Marc:But what it takes for me to get excited about a show just because I'm so sure it's going to be awkward.
Marc:I mean, I've played this place before.
Marc:Royal Festival Hall is a big space meant for symphonies.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And I don't always remember exactly.
Marc:I know the feeling I have when I do a space that seats over 1,800.
Marc:Like if I'm in a space that seats from 1,500 to 3,000, I tend to, it's not that I get nervous, but it's like, will the vessel hold?
Marc:Will the vessel I am occupying hold?
Marc:By the time I get to the venue, I'm like, oh my God.
Marc:Not as bad as it used to be, but once I get on stage, I do the sound check, I'm like, okay, I remember this place.
Marc:It's big.
Marc:It's a symphony space.
Marc:It is what it is.
Marc:And I know, man, I just know.
Marc:You know, I get out there.
Marc:I got my opener, this kid, Jack Barry.
Marc:He's doing all right.
Marc:I get out there and I'm like, I'm just being loose.
Marc:And I'm like, I can make this space intimate.
Marc:I can pull them in.
Marc:I can do it.
Marc:But it's weird, man.
Marc:When you work in a space, it's like there was about 1900 people in there.
Marc:And I'm on a stage that has, it's wide open because a symphony should fucking be sitting up there.
Marc:And I'm doing what I do, but it's hard to get on a roll.
Marc:I'm connecting, but it's like I don't feel it coming back as much as I'd like it to.
Marc:I know that in a bigger space, the tighter the bit, the better it's going to be because then it can just land and people know where it ends.
Marc:They know what the punchline is.
Marc:And sometimes I like to sort of noodle around a little bit.
Marc:I like to improvise, but I have to accept that.
Marc:I think I have to accept that's how I do shit.
Marc:And they're digging it, but I'm not feeling the connection as much as I like because the fucking room is so big and it wants a symphony in it.
Marc:It doesn't want just me sitting up there on a stool in the middle of where there should be a full orchestra.
Marc:The space doesn't want it.
Marc:It's fighting me.
Marc:And I feel that after every bit, after every arc, there's a moment where I'm like, look, I'm just this little guy.
Marc:I'm just sitting on the stage.
Marc:And there's that moment where it's sort of like, you know the difference between performing and just being you.
Marc:I feel that.
Marc:When I'm sitting up there in a symphony space between jokes, I'm like, the bottom could fall out here.
Marc:I could just be a guy talking to myself on stage here in front of people.
Marc:I could just feel that.
Marc:There was such a fine line between getting laughs and connecting in that way and just kind of being a guy sitting on a stage in front of 1,900 people that's wide open and should have a symphony on it going...
Marc:Hey, I don't know.
Marc:I'm just up here by myself.
Marc:You know, it's weird.
Marc:I'm up here by myself.
Marc:Like that place.
Marc:That place.
Marc:I'm just up here by myself.
Marc:I hope, I don't know.
Marc:Is there any way I can get out of here?
Marc:I have to get out of here.
Marc:Like that was just right under it.
Marc:And the show was great and people liked it, but it got to the point at the end, I'd done about an hour and 40 minutes and I was just, I just wanted to like, I set the mic aside.
Marc:The acoustics are perfect.
Marc:And I'm like, what do you guys need?
Marc:We need to connect here.
Marc:What are we doing?
Marc:And they, you know, I got applause breaks and it was all, it was fucking fine.
Marc:It was great.
Marc:But in that moment, my own struggle was I'm up here all alone.
Marc:Here's this thing.
Marc:I'm going to do this.
Marc:Here we go.
Marc:We're talking like this.
Marc:Oh, look, you all like it.
Marc:Oh God.
Marc:I'm still by myself up here.
Marc:So I sought out at the end to just really connect, and I took a couple questions.
Marc:I improvised through a few things, through a few questions.
Marc:It killed.
Marc:It was beautiful.
Marc:It was a real connection, and I closed on this weird thing.
Marc:Some weird dude in the audience goes, why do you have witch hands?
Marc:And I'm like, witch hands?
Marc:And somehow or another, I physicalized witch hands and I cast a spell of love on the entire audience.
Marc:And I threw a bad one right at him.
Marc:And it just got this huge laugh.
Marc:And I closed on what was essentially a improvisation on witch hands.
Marc:And that was like a high point like that.
Marc:You know, after almost two hours up there, I'm like, oh, thank God for witch hands.
Marc:So tonight I go to Birmingham, England.
Marc:If you haven't gotten tickets and you're hearing this, I think there's a couple left.
Marc:What else?
Marc:I want to thank the British audiences.
Marc:Just tremendous.
Marc:Great people and great time.
Marc:And I'm very grateful that they came out and experienced that.
Marc:We connected.
Marc:We engaged.
Marc:So now...
Marc:Vincent D'Onofrio, I had to remind him that we met before and he kind of remembered meeting me.
Marc:It was a fairly traumatic event.
Marc:He didn't quite remember it as specifically as I did, but it was interesting to bring it up and it was great to meet him and talk to him.
Marc:The film he directed called The Kid, starring Ethan Hawke,
Marc:Dane DeHaan and Chris Pratt is playing in select theaters.
Marc:It's a Western.
Marc:It's a sort of like a kind of sweet Western story.
Marc:He inserted a coming of age tale into the myth of Billy the Kid.
Marc:He just sort of, it was added in.
Marc:I don't know, that kid, Dane DeHaan, man.
Marc:He's something else.
Marc:Chris Pratt.
Marc:I didn't even know it was Chris Pratt.
Marc:Anyways, but you know Vincent from Full Metal Jacket, from the crime show he was on, from some other.
Marc:I mean, he's an intense dude from The Player.
Marc:Anyway, this is me back in the garage talking to Vincent D'Onofrio.
Music
Guest:so you play i mean guitar a little bit yeah i mean a little bit i'm not that great a player but i do have more guitars than i deserve yeah i do too but like we all do yeah do you buy you buy them though i buy them yeah but i but i feel like i've had i haven't bought a guitar in many many years i feel like i have the guitars that i'm gonna have yeah and that's it now
Marc:I feel that way too, but like I said, if I can get them.
Marc:I've got a bunch upstairs that I've acquired over time.
Marc:Like Jay Maskis gave me his signature Squire.
Marc:I don't play it much, but I like having it.
Marc:Yeah, I have a little Squire.
Marc:You do?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:You like it?
Guest:Yeah, it's like a... I don't know.
Guest:They always remind me of like a...
Guest:Old timey.
Guest:Yeah, old timey pop group.
Marc:Yeah, haircut rock.
Marc:But wait, do you live here?
Marc:No, in New York.
Marc:So I know where we met.
Marc:It was a bad night.
Marc:Was it?
Marc:For you?
Marc:You don't remember.
Guest:Where do you think you met me?
Guest:Oh, maybe we don't.
Guest:Maybe I don't remember.
Guest:I was a friend of Janine Garofalo's.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And she took me to a show.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you performed.
Marc:Okay.
Marc:But was that the show where I was attacked on stage?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:So, yeah, that's a bad night, isn't it?
Guest:Yeah, I guess.
Guest:I mean, I didn't realize the extent of it, how much control you really had of it, though.
Right.
Marc:Oh, well, it was kind of tripped out, right?
Marc:So you were there.
Marc:I remember because it became sort of dreamlike because you were just sort of there.
Marc:And I'm like, that guy's an actor.
Marc:So it was like, is this real?
Marc:Yeah, the guy lunged at me because I was poking at him.
Marc:And he jumped up and he tackled me.
Marc:And then a couple dudes got up there, Flanagan, who owned the place, and Dave Rath, the manager, they pulled him off me.
Marc:What was amazing is how quickly everyone dispersed.
Marc:In that moment.
Marc:You know who else was there?
Marc:The guitar player from Foreigner.
Marc:Oh, really?
Guest:Well, the people that were close to the stage moved out of there fairly quickly.
Guest:But we had great seats for the whole fight.
Marc:It was really more of a wrestle.
Marc:I don't think the guy was a fighter.
Marc:He just had an emotional reaction because we stood each other off.
Marc:The one thing I knew as a performer was, number one, I'm the last act, and I'm certainly not going to puss out.
Marc:I'm going to have to take the hit or whatever.
Marc:I'm in front of people.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And I took it and then it got broken up and then everyone went outside and that's when I saw you.
Marc:My shirt was ripped open a little bit and he came around and apologized.
Marc:It was a weird night.
Marc:Exciting?
Marc:Do you think it was part of the show?
Guest:Well, I didn't know the extent of it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because Janine, I haven't seen Janine for many years, but she doesn't talk for no reason.
Guest:So I didn't really quite understand the whole deal of what was going on.
Guest:And I think I was probably stoned as well, and that didn't help.
Guest:And I actually thought you were funny.
Marc:Yeah, I was funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:and that was the main thing oh good that's the memory you took away yeah well yeah it was what it was i was doing a joke i was a bouncer when i was a kid so oh really like that that wasn't like a big shocking right right it wasn't menacing right no yeah it wasn't like a crime right right it seemed like a crime it was just some drunken bullshit yeah yeah no i was doing a joke that had suicide in it and the guy got freaked out
Marc:And then like, you know, and he said something like, you know, don't do jokes about suicide.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And I was like, why did you just lose somebody?
Guest:It was like a little callous, but like, why is he interrupting my show?
Yeah.
Marc:And like, you know, maybe I had it coming, but it turned out the fucker comes around and he hadn't.
Marc:He hadn't lost anybody, but I think someone was depressed.
Marc:He was feeling, yeah.
Marc:I don't know, he popped.
Marc:He wasn't a guy trying to prove anything.
Guest:I just, like, my tone got him.
Guest:Could be and could always be the most righteous moment of his life.
Guest:I wonder.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I haven't heard from him.
Guest:I've talked about it a couple times.
Marc:I hope not.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But maybe he has good memories of it.
Marc:Like, I stood up, and then we made amends, and I don't know.
Marc:Yeah, because I remember what happened was outside, when everyone was outside, and I had walked outside, and people were trying, and then the guy pulled up.
Marc:He left, and he pulled up in a car with his friends and got back out, and there was a sort of like, hey, man.
Marc:I'm like, I'll deal with it.
Marc:Big hero with 90 people behind me.
So...
Marc:I worked it out.
Guest:Where were you a bouncer?
Guest:At every... Studio 54 when I was very young at the back door and then... How old?
Guest:How old were you?
Guest:Like 18.
Guest:You were at Studio 54?
Marc:At the back door though, not the front door with all the... Oh, the back door?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So you saw a lot of people bolting out to vomit and pass out.
Guest:Where you had to like... The people were coming in from there too and leaving there, but yeah, it wasn't like the whole scene in the front.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But this was at the heyday?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like in the 70s?
Guest:No.
Guest:No, the second time.
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:And then the Ritz on 11th Street for three and a half years.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Three and a half years?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Just because you were a big boy?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And did you get into shit?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:All the time?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You a fighter?
Guest:Well, I mean, it's not like something I look for.
Guest:Yeah, you don't start shit.
Guest:No, actually I don't.
Guest:But you'll deal with it?
Guest:I can deal with it.
Guest:I've always been able to deal with it pretty good, and I don't mind being punched.
Guest:No?
Guest:No.
Guest:That's like an important thing.
Guest:I don't know that that's on the resume for Bouncer.
Guest:I think you should know that going in.
Guest:It shouldn't be on the resume.
Marc:But you have to transcend the punch and maintain order.
Marc:Yeah, I always say this.
Guest:This is what I say.
Guest:Okay, I'm ready.
Guest:Take your time.
Guest:Like the other day, I was on Twitter, and somebody asked me, how do I handle the trolls so well, right?
Guest:And I said, because of this.
Guest:If you can be hit multiple times in the face and the body,
Guest:and not care about what it might be doing to your face or what it feels like and still maintain focus, then trolls are nothing.
Guest:Right.
Marc:That's a philosophy of life.
Marc:Get punched up until you can't see straight, and then maybe you sit down.
Guest:Yeah, and I always thought that that was one of the things.
Guest:I knew that the best fighters that I knew were that type of guy.
Guest:And why do you get trolled a lot?
Marc:Are you doing, what are you putting stuff up?
Guest:Because I'm a liberal.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Marc:And you're a vocal on Twitter.
Marc:And they come at you.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Just like that weird kind of like pile on of garbage people.
Marc:Yes.
Guest:The garbage people pile on.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But did you grow up in New York?
Guest:No.
Guest:I was born in Brooklyn, New York.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then raised partially there, but then my parents got divorced and we moved to Florida.
Guest:Well, sorry.
Guest:To a small town called Hialeah, which is outside of Miami.
Guest:Oh, okay, yeah.
Guest:So I went to most of my schooling there, but I spent every summer with my family in Brooklyn my whole life.
Guest:So it was sort of like, yeah, aunts and uncles, and I lived in my grandfather's house.
Guest:big italian family yes very very very brooklyn italian really like old school food very old school yeah some of them were like extreme racists oh yeah but most of them were very my my grandfather had a lot of integrity and his side of his family had a whole lot of integrity he was an upholsterer from like he made his way to new york from italy as an upholsterer oh wow and had a company and the whole deal
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:So like couches, chairs, whatever?
Guest:Drapes, everything.
Marc:Was he from Italy?
Marc:Yep.
Marc:Wow.
Marc:So you're like third generation kind of deal?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that was on your dad's side?
Guest:That was on my dad's side.
Guest:And my mom's side is from Monopoly, too.
Guest:Both sides of the family are from Monopoly, but my mom's...
Guest:Parents went to New York, but then immediately went to Hawaii and opened the first Italian restaurant called Rocco's in Hawaii.
Marc:In Honolulu?
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:Really?
Guest:That was smart.
Guest:Very smart.
Guest:And they lived there their whole life?
Guest:Yeah, basically my mom waitressed in his restaurant and my dad was in the Air Force stationed in Hawaii and that's how they met.
Guest:Hawaii?
Marc:So you have like a childhood past in Hawaii?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:That's good, man.
Marc:Yeah, I went to part of my elementary school there, actually.
Marc:Yeah, I think it does something to your brain to have that kind of space and that kind of quiet.
Marc:I think it programs you in a good way.
Marc:I think you have a Hawaiian sensibility deep down.
Guest:That would be nice.
Guest:My uncle used to, the scammer uncle that I have.
Guest:Which scam?
Guest:His first thing was he used to
Guest:He's an Italian kid, but he had long, brown, curly hair, so he could pass as a Hawaiian sort of, right?
Guest:Pug nose and the whole bit.
Guest:And he used to get tourists to pay him to climb palm trees and get coconuts.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He used to make a bundle.
Guest:He was like 10.
Marc:That seems like an honest dollar.
Marc:It's not quite a scam.
Marc:I mean, he's actually doing something, delivering the goods.
Marc:Okay, so do you have siblings too?
Marc:Sisters, yeah.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:A bunch?
Marc:I had three.
Marc:Now I have two.
Marc:Oh, sorry.
Marc:It's okay.
Marc:But when did you start doing the, like, did you come with the acting thing?
Marc:But did you, like, was anyone in show business?
Marc:I mean, how did you get him introduced to it?
Guest:Well, my dad was, my dad used to do theater, like community theater.
Guest:He was an actor?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And a director.
Guest:And, you know, he always belonged to a community theater.
Guest:In Florida?
Guest:In Florida.
Yeah.
Marc:Like a little place like old people would come and watch the show.
Guest:Exactly.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And did they do like a children's show on the weekend?
Guest:Sometimes.
Guest:Well, no, they didn't do children's shows.
Guest:They would do like melodramas.
Guest:Oh, like just dirty work at the crossroads and stuff like that.
Guest:Bizarre little plays that were actually called melodramas.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So it was primarily for the older people.
Marc:It was a subscription thing.
Guest:And then they would do, like, to be really artsy, they would do, like, you know, View from the Bridge or, you know, like Arthur Miller, you know, all that.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:And people would walk out like, I didn't understand it.
Guest:Yeah, exactly, yeah.
Guest:And they would do...
Guest:The Rainmaker, you know, plays like that.
Guest:Yeah, and were you involved?
Guest:My dad always played the Rainmaker.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Guest:Was he good?
Guest:The Burke Lancaster part, yeah.
Guest:Was he good?
Guest:He was good, yeah, he was okay.
Guest:I mean, I don't really remember the details, but my parents were divorced, so there was a lot of women that he could pull a lot of women playing on the Rainmaker.
Guest:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So was that his drive?
Guest:It was disturbing for me, but he had a great time.
Guest:Are either of them around still?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Folks?
Guest:They're both around.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, that's good.
Guest:My dad's not the best of mental.
Guest:Oh, really?
Marc:The mental thing's not great?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:What, is it like Alzheimer's or something?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:It would be so much easier for all of us if he was.
Guest:Bipolar-ish?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Do you feel like you got it?
Guest:Yeah, sure.
Marc:Oh, really?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Oh, man.
Marc:I don't think I have a lot of anxiety and dread, but I don't have the up and down thing.
Marc:You got the up and down thing?
Yeah.
Guest:um i have more of like the the but but the the thing about these days is you can get it under control but the spiral thing was big when i was young oh really spiraled down into the darkness yeah out of nowhere yeah wake up at the bottom of the hole yeah and then come out the other end like you know a newborn bunny yeah you know excited and then heroic until the spiral starts again yeah
Guest:The waves, peaks and valleys.
Guest:Yeah, but these days in my later adulthood, it's under control.
Guest:It's totally under control.
Marc:Relieved?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Were you one of those people that found, was it hard to give it up?
Marc:To give up the spirals?
Guest:Well, the minute that I was truly convinced that it wasn't going to affect my art, so to speak, I was totally into it.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:What did it take to convince you?
Guest:The actual going through, taking medication, going through the whole psychology thing and getting a shrink and figuring out what, you know, it takes you a long time to figure out exactly what a shrink is and how they can help you and...
Guest:Because there's so many different types.
Marc:I used to do a bit about going to a shrink when you're older.
Marc:You should basically just walk in and go, look, I know there's a lot of things we're not going to unfuck.
Marc:Right.
Marc:But I got some problems I think we can work on.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:My thing was, look, I'm really good at manipulating and good luck.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I'm going to work around you.
Guest:I'm going to dance.
Guest:I will figure out how to make you happy and get me more miserable by the time this is over.
Marc:And they're like, great.
Guest:Yeah, I'll take it.
Marc:But you found a good one?
Guest:Yeah, for many years.
Marc:Oh, good.
Marc:And then you just started...
Marc:Doing that and then doing the work and you realize the craft was in place.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:I actually realized that my motivation goes up so much more than it used to be.
Guest:And I'm so much more detailed in my work now than I used to be.
Guest:And I'm not clouded over.
Guest:I'm not in the business for chasing women or all the wrong reasons.
Guest:Right.
Guest:I'm in it because I'm actually an artist and I have friends that are artists and they're legit and I can learn from them and be inspired by them and have loyal relationships that last for 20, 30 years.
Guest:And so now that I'm almost 60, it's like I have 30 years of real art and real friends and real work.
Marc:Yeah, that's great.
Marc:All you're giving up is that weird kind of like, just for the moment, fucking let's do it.
Marc:Let's live on the edge.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:and then crying to some woman for months in some country that you don't belong in.
Marc:When I was at my worst, international travel frightened me.
Guest:No, I was up for every country.
Marc:Oh, that's great.
Marc:Just for no reason?
Marc:Oh, man.
Marc:Back when I was paranoid and anxiety-ridden, I'd get to places and be like, where am I?
Marc:They don't have the right cereals.
Marc:And it fucked me up.
Marc:But when did you... So when did you start doing it?
Marc:Like with your dad or... Traveling?
Guest:No, the acting.
Guest:No, so what happened then was is that I just... I started running lights and building sets and running sound and then... At the community theater?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Oh, so you got a handle on that shit.
Guest:And then...
Guest:There was a big flux of Cuban entertainers and artists that came into the Miami area.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You know, from Cuba.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:And a family, a couple, opened a magic shop.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Near my house.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And they were like real magicians.
Guest:Like they were a group.
Guest:Slide-a-hand kind of stuff?
Guest:Well, just everything.
Guest:They were like big show magicians.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:And I started visiting this magic shop.
Guest:I didn't have any money or anything.
Guest:How old were you?
Guest:like nine or 10?
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, like that.
Guest:Very exciting.
Guest:Yeah, very exciting.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And, you know, little did I know that later on in life it's not sexy and, you know, and you're going to have to stop doing it.
Guest:Magic?
Guest:Yeah, magic is not sexy.
Guest:Come on, man.
Marc:Dave Cross does some joke.
Marc:I don't even know how he sets it up about a magician, but I know the punchline is, yeah, that is my card.
Marc:Can I go now?
Yeah.
Guest:It's so true though.
Marc:You don't even need the setup.
Guest:No, it's funny.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But so the point is this, is that they brought me out of my shell.
Guest:He taught me magic.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He taught me, he gave me pamphlets for free so I could build my own tricks rather than buy them from him because they're just metal welded together.
Guest:Right, yeah.
Guest:I had a neighbor that was a metal worker who built another.
Guest:Oh, like rings and stuff?
Guest:Rings and cans and things, you know, and scarves and things like that.
Guest:You can have to buy it.
Guest:You can make all that shit.
Guest:Fabric, you know, felt.
Guest:Felt is like the cheapest material in the world.
Guest:Everything's made of felt in magic.
Guest:It's a nickel.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:So...
Guest:Then I started doing magic and I got really comfortable on stage.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:And I could walk out on stage and just do anything.
Guest:I didn't even think about it.
Guest:And then one day, you know, I got interested in girls and I thought, you know, this is not sexy.
Guest:And this ain't going to work out.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then so I thought, what can I do?
Guest:I don't want to be a thug.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Was that an option?
Guest:That was an option, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Hanging around with the wrong guys?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And so I didn't want to do that because it didn't look... I would always... At a very young age, I always would look at myself way beyond that age.
Guest:Like, what am I going to be like when I'm like... 20.
Guest:Old was like 30.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And it never looked good.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like for some reason, it never looked good.
Guest:And I thought maybe I should be an actor because...
Guest:I can actually see guys that are that age and they look like they're okay.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They're acting.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They're acting.
Guest:And so, and so if I'm one of the places that you act is on stage and if I'm comfortable on stage, maybe I should try to do it.
Guest:So then without anybody, I didn't do it in high school.
Guest:I didn't do it.
Guest:I wasn't even like, I never talked about it or anything.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then I moved back to New York and went to the American Stanislavski theater company.
Guest:You moved it back to Brooklyn.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I moved to Brooklyn for a little while.
Guest:With the family?
Guest:With the very religious and not- The Catholic racist?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:And then got out of there as quickly as I could.
Guest:But I was studying the whole time with this company called the American Stanislavski Theater.
Marc:Where'd you end up with your first place in the city?
Guest:Down on Fulton Street.
Guest:Oh yeah?
Guest:My sister, my best friend Steve Marshall and I, we got a one bedroom and then I built partitions to separate all the rooms and we lived in there.
Marc:So the American Stanislavski Institute, that's not the actor's studio.
Marc:No.
Marc:It's not like, what is it like?
Marc:Is the method pre-actor's studio?
Guest:You're very close, actually.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Very close.
Guest:The first 10 years of Stanislavski is the method acting.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then his actors, to make, I'm being very short story here.
Guest:Sure, it's all right.
Guest:Yeah, because it's not very interesting.
Guest:No, it is.
Guest:Stanislavski felt that his actors were becoming too indulgent, self-indulgent, and he changed the system.
Guest:He changed the technique, and from then on it was called the Stanislavski system of acting, which is a whole different deal then.
Marc:Really?
Guest:But the method is the first 10 years of Stanislavski.
Marc:I never knew this, and I've talked to a lot of you guys, you actor fellas.
Marc:Yeah, that's the truth.
Marc:Because usually you get the Meisner people, you got the Actors Studio.
Guest:Which is all good.
Guest:All that stuff is good.
Marc:But I didn't realize that Stanislavski realized these self-centered monsters.
Marc:I have to reel them in.
Guest:They were monsters, yeah.
Guest:The monsters that he thought they were are, to me, the best actors out there.
Marc:Like who?
Guest:Like Monty Clift.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Who else?
Guest:And many, many, many other actors from Actors Studio.
Guest:From that generation?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah, right?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:They were so ahead of their time.
Marc:So when you get to the Stanislavski Institute?
Guest:The American Stanislavski Theater Company.
Guest:So you're like 18, 19?
Guest:Yeah, I'm 19 and I'm doing plays with them.
Guest:I'm doing classics with Sonia Moore who ran the school who was actually a student.
Guest:She was 90 years old when she was teaching.
Guest:She was actually a student of Stanislavski's and wrote all the books about Stanislavski.
Marc:I don't know, when did Stanislavski die?
Marc:I mean, what was his life?
Marc:Oh, I don't know, a year.
Marc:But like it was before movies or what?
Guest:No, no.
Guest:Oh yeah, he was around that long?
Guest:Yeah, you can still go visit his study and stuff in Russia.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you teach at that same place now?
Guest:No.
Guest:So I then, after that, I did a tour with them and I acted and learned the Stanislavski system of acting.
Guest:I still, because of all my reading, wanted to learn method acting.
Guest:And so finally, a teacher from Actor's Studio took me under her wing and taught me for six years how to be a method actor.
Guest:Her name is Sharon Chatton.
Guest:And she was of the Actor's Studio.
Guest:I'm a lifetime member now of the Actor's Studio.
Guest:And I also teach at the Strasburg Institute in New York, where we teach NYU students and...
Marc:Which one?
Marc:What do you teach?
Marc:Which method?
Marc:I teach the method.
Marc:You teach the method, not the Stanislawski system.
Guest:Yeah, but I do talk, because I use it in my own work.
Guest:I use both.
Guest:Consciously?
Guest:Consciously use everything in my own work, yeah.
Marc:But it's not like one of those things, because I talk to actors, I try to isolate things, I try to basically get myself an acting education.
Marc:because I'm doing a little acting now.
Marc:And I've talked to people about it, and a lot of times it's a little vague in terms of like, well, you take some of this, you take some of that, and you mash it together.
Marc:But the way you're talking, there are tools you apply every time.
Guest:There are tools that I apply every time.
Guest:Consciously?
Guest:Consciously.
Guest:Huh.
Guest:And they would be very helpful for you.
Guest:What are they?
Guest:Especially for you.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:Are you going to tell me?
Guest:Well, I'm not going to make the podcast about that.
Guest:No, I'm not going to make it about that.
Guest:A couple pointers.
Guest:Yes, I can tell you.
Guest:And then we're going to talk.
Guest:That you speak not from your head but from your stomach and your heart only.
Guest:You never speak from your head.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:So anything that's going on in your nervous system.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Right now, this second.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Whatever you're feeling.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Try and speak words only through that.
Guest:And however it comes out.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Let the words just fall out of your mouth and however it comes out.
Guest:I feel like I'd be crying a lot.
Guest:But you'll cry until you don't cry anymore, and then you'll be fine.
Marc:We're talking 55 years.
Marc:Dude, that's okay.
Guest:I taught last night until 1 o'clock in the morning.
Guest:In New York?
Guest:Here.
Guest:Oh.
Guest:My teacher, my mentor, Sharon Chatten, who I was telling you about, she now teaches here.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:And so when I'm in town, I take over.
Guest:I've taught three classes since I've been here for the last week.
Guest:And were they four-hour jam sessions?
Guest:One is the Saturday, one is three hours, and the rest just go on until everybody dies.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Everyone dies from crying and feeling?
Guest:Yeah, from being pain, yeah, from being self-indulgent.
Marc:But when you apply it to, like, a role...
Marc:Here's my big question, honestly speaking, just from being on the job.
Marc:When you're in character, do you have consciousness of yourself?
Marc:Of course.
Marc:Okay.
Guest:I don't drink like ... I'm not Daniel Day-Lewis.
Guest:Everybody has their thing that they do.
Guest:I'm not sure what he does.
Guest:I only met him once very briefly.
Guest:I'm not sure what he does, if that's method acting or whatever, but whatever he does, it works and it's great.
Guest:It seems like a lot of work.
Guest:It seems like a lot of work.
Guest:Did you meet him as somebody?
Guest:Did you meet Lincoln?
Guest:No, no, no.
Guest:The shoe repair guy?
Guest:I think I met him because we came up at exactly the same time.
Guest:But there are other actors out there too that...
Guest:There are British actors that do a version of, I would say, is the Stanislavski system and the method combined.
Guest:Now the system is different how?
Guest:Just out of curiosity.
Guest:The system is more physical and requires a lot of inner monologue.
Guest:Stuff that's actually written out.
Guest:That you're saying under dialogue or while somebody else is speaking.
Guest:Like those... So that you're thinking all the time when the camera's rolling.
Marc:About what you're acting.
Yeah.
Marc:Like the feelings or the motivations behind it.
Guest:And triggers and things that don't necessarily have anything to do with the story.
Guest:Interesting.
Guest:But help tell the story because it's the right emotion.
Marc:Right.
Marc:And do you find that you, is it possible to be completely detached from the performance and still do a good performance?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:I guess that's the craft.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, you got to show up for work no matter what.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, the thing about trying to explain how you work on a set is I only know my version of it.
Guest:You would have to ask somebody who's worked with me what it looks like to them.
Guest:I have no idea.
Guest:To me, it just looks like a struggle to do the part.
Guest:Right.
Guest:And that struggle becomes my performance.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That's all it is.
Marc:Right.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So when you're doing plays in New York, are you doing the small ones, everything you can kind of deal?
Marc:What, back then?
Guest:Yeah, everything I can, yeah.
Guest:And that's how you sort of- I ended up on Broadway.
Guest:In what?
Guest:In a play called Open Admissions, which ran for a few months and then closed.
Guest:And that was my first real paying job where I actually had to show up and get a check and everything, yeah.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Who was in it with you?
Guest:A guy named Calvin Levels.
Guest:It was about street kids going to college.
Guest:Didn't run very long.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But it was a good experience because I didn't have an agent at the time.
Guest:And what happened was is there's that...
Guest:Back in the day, there was this paper called Backstage.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so that's where you got your auditions from.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:And so I saw it.
Guest:And so I put on a whole facade that because I was from Brooklyn, I wasn't born in Brooklyn, but I went into the audition with a Brooklyn accent and lied my way through the whole thing and I got the part.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And they cast me because they thought I was exactly like the part.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And you still have a little Brooklyn accent.
Guest:A little bit, yeah.
Marc:It comes out, right?
Marc:A little bit, yeah.
Marc:So you got the part because they believed you.
Guest:They totally, totally believed me.
Guest:And you knew you were just like applying your craft.
Guest:Yes.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it was the first experience that I got paid for actually doing something that I felt like I was in control of, that I invented, and it was helping tell a story correctly.
Guest:And that ultimately is the job, right?
Marc:Yeah, that's ultimately the job.
Marc:About the story.
Guest:To service the story.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I got to realize that.
Marc:That's what most people say.
Marc:It's not just about you.
Guest:No.
Guest:Well, I mean, I can imagine it's a difficult thing because of your stand-up that if that's where your root of entertainment comes from.
Marc:Well, that's about self-consciousness, but a lot of times I'm sort of scene for scene.
Marc:Sometimes it's hard for me to even assess the whole arc of a piece, you know what I mean?
Marc:Sure.
Marc:Like you're kind of working like, well, what am I doing in this scene?
Marc:So then to sort of like really integrate the full arc of the show or the movie or the play or whatever,
Marc:I don't really know how to manage that, knowing the end and what I'm moving towards.
Guest:Well, you probably don't read it enough, for one.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I can imagine that you don't read it.
Guest:The whole thing.
Guest:The script.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You got to read the whole thing enough and not just your part.
Guest:Correct.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I had a feeling that you were going to be like that, and I think I'm right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so you have to read it over and over and over again until you realize it.
Guest:You realize the whole composition of the story.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And it's something that you actually have to sit down and think about.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And not pretend like you know it or not have all these wonderful ideas and choices.
Guest:Let those, have them come in and take over your attention.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then just rely on that and hope you get through it.
Guest:Right.
Guest:That's not.
Guest:That's only half of it.
Guest:That's only, maybe even less.
Guest:Not to say that you can't get away with a great scene that way, because you can.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:But it would help, I think, so you integrate the story somehow.
Guest:Sure.
Guest:To think about it as an arc is a kind of good way to explain it, except that it's not really the way you should think about it.
Guest:You should think about it as...
Guest:Like a painting, like the composition of a painting.
Guest:You need to know the composition of the story, the structure of the story.
Guest:And you need to know where you help tell the story.
Marc:Interesting.
Marc:And how you do.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Not just like, I'm the cranky guy.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:That's called servicing the story.
Guest:Okay.
Guest:That's what our job is.
Guest:And that also keeps you grounded and real.
Guest:Right.
Guest:Because you know-
Guest:There's a context.
Guest:Because it's not... Right, right.
Guest:It's not open-ended.
Guest:Yeah, you know, this is a thing.
Guest:Yeah, there's no hook that's going to come in and grab you out and take you away, and then it's over.
Guest:So how long do you kick around before you get the movie parts?
Guest:Six years, six or so years.
Guest:It all happened while I was still studying and bouncing in clubs, and then a friend of mine walked by
Guest:Where was I then?
Guest:In your 20s?
Guest:Yeah, I was 22 or 23, and I was working at the front door of the Hard Rock Cafe in New York.
Guest:And my buddy Matthew Modine, who I knew from auditions in school,
Marc:How's he doing?
Guest:He's awesome.
Guest:Good.
Guest:Yeah, he's a great guy.
Guest:And him and his wife were passing by, and they saw me at the front door, and we talked, and he said, I'm off doing this thing with Stanley Kubrick.
Guest:And I'm like, wow.
Guest:He said, you know, there's another part that they haven't cast yet.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I don't know what it is, because he doesn't let us see it, but you should go up for it.
Guest:he gave me the address to send a tape to.
Guest:So my friend and I, Steve, we went to, I was doing a play at the time, and we went to a stoop on 10th Avenue and 24th Street, and we rented one of these cameras, you know, the cameras were like huge back then, and had a deck.
Guest:Yeah, oh right, the video cameras.
Guest:Yeah, huge.
Guest:And I mean, like, you know, the side bigger than your computer.
Guest:Right, yeah.
Guest:And so we rented all that, and I put on beta like three or four takes.
Guest:I just did three, four monologues in a row.
Guest:And the tape was huge.
Guest:What were the monologues?
Guest:From the play that I was doing, yeah.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Oh, okay.
Guest:And then I sent it to Stanley Kubrick.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:I got the part.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Just on that one tape?
Guest:He called me and he said, okay, I'm going to send you some words and I want you to put it on tape.
Guest:I'm like, well, it costs a lot of money to rent these cameras and stuff like that.
Guest:I'll send you some money too.
Guest:So they, you know, much like you and the guitars.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Thanks, family.
Guest:Maybe you could buy me the camera.
Guest:It'd be a lot easier if you just bought me the camera.
Guest:Because usually this isn't working out.
Guest:Yeah, exactly.
Guest:I'm getting good at this.
Guest:And so I sent him, he just sent me words without punctuation or anything and just said, do it, just show it, do it, do it.
Guest:And I did it.
Guest:And he said, okay, we're going to bring you out.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:So the words were just, what, were they pieces of the monologue?
Guest:They were pieces and fragments of things that sort of ended up in the movie and then most didn't.
Marc:And how much of the character did you put in place?
Marc:You had no conception of what you were even auditioning for.
Marc:So what were you putting out there?
Guest:I sussed out that he was a weak-minded individual.
Guest:Mm-hmm.
Guest:And he told me with no detail and in a kind of roundabout way.
Guest:It was like a puzzle I had to put together with what he was saying to me.
Guest:But he said that the guy is weak-minded.
Guest:He has to be overweight.
Guest:You're going to have to put on weight.
Guest:And he's struggling because it's an environment that he really shouldn't be in.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Just hearing that.
Guest:The Marine Corps, right?
Guest:It's horrible.
Marc:The role was so painful.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:The snapping of poor Leonard.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so by the time I sent him, was ready to do the second take and he had sent me the information and stuff, knowing that he was giving me that information,
Guest:I put on probably like five or six pounds.
Guest:And I did it without my shirt on so I could show him that I gained a little weight.
Guest:And did another one on the same stoop, same thing.
Guest:And then that's when he hired me.
Guest:And then I went out there and he said, before you come out here, you know that you have to gain a bunch of weight.
Guest:You have to probably gain like 20 or 30 pounds.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:And I'm like, okay.
Guest:And De Niro had already done it for Raging Bull.
Guest:Raging Bull, yeah.
Guest:And so I said, well, I can do that.
Guest:De Niro can do it.
Guest:I can do it.
Guest:Yeah, for sure.
Guest:And so I went out there and I gained the pounds, but then I just looked like I could kick everybody's ass.
Guest:And I also had to learn how to march and do monkey patrol with the rifles and all that.
Guest:So the weight went up to 70 something pounds.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Before I looked like weak.
Guest:Yeah, and was that fun or horrible?
Marc:No, it was not fun.
Marc:To eat all that?
Marc:Just terrible?
Guest:It was not fun.
Marc:It's much more fun now than it was back then.
Marc:But what did you have to do, like two months to put on fucking 50 pounds?
Guest:I had several months.
Guest:I had about six months.
Marc:Just eating pasta and shit?
Guest:and carbs and you know half a loaf of bread for breakfast oh and you're just feeling it fill out yeah and then you know you're not you're you know your romantic life goes to shit like everything goes to shit people look at you differently you don't get you know it serves the character people think you're stupid yeah you know it's really unbelievable what the judgment people have of fat people yeah and working with kubrick was it like was it amazing it was amazing
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Being out there with all that stuff.
Marc:Cause that movie, like even like when, okay.
Marc:When you talk about story, like, you know, what was the story?
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:No, I know.
Marc:You know what I mean?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, with that role, I have to assume you're like, well, this guy's story is what I got to focus on.
Guest:Right.
Guest:There's like two sections and that's that.
Guest:It's this guy's story.
Guest:And Matthew, Joker, Matthew's character is the point of view of that guy's story.
Guest:And so, yeah, it was about...
Guest:Yeah, him transcending into, the Marine Corps training backfired and just instead of making a lean green fighting machine, they just made a fighting machine.
Guest:Yeah, a monster.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And was it easier, like it must have been good to have your friend there, like to work with him.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Because that was your first big movie, right?
Marc:My first movie.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And you were shooting it out overseas?
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:I was there for 13 months.
Marc:in 13 months.
Marc:And what are your recollections of Kubrick?
Marc:What impressed you?
Marc:What do you take away as a director now that you're directing?
Marc:I mean, what did you see him do?
Guest:It's like you can't... Once you've worked with him, it's difficult to move a camera
Guest:unless it's helping tell the story.
Guest:Again, yeah.
Guest:Like, it's not just the moving... You don't move the camera for the sake of moving it.
Guest:It's hard.
Guest:It's almost like it's embarrassing.
Guest:He, like, makes you feel that way.
Guest:Like...
Guest:He puts this feeling of cinema and acting in cinema, this feeling of it in you where, look, don't be pathetic.
Guest:Don't be a dick.
Guest:Just do it right.
Guest:It's all you have to do.
Guest:Don't showboat.
Guest:Just fucking do it.
Guest:It's like, yeah, he makes you feel bad about even having the notion of showboating a little bit.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:And he knows when you're doing it.
Guest:So anytime I would see the scene, and I would think, oh, wouldn't it be cool if we... And I was like, I don't want to do that.
Guest:It's kind of stupid.
Guest:It's pretentious.
Guest:Right.
Guest:So the camera only moves to help tell the story.
Guest:That's what I remember mostly, and it's kind of...
Guest:built in me I didn't even know this until recently that it was I know that my acting is very much my film acting is very much because of the way that he directed me yeah and but and he did he help you construct the character did he like no he wants you doesn't talk about story doesn't talk about character doesn't talk about anything just tells you to stand over there
Guest:No, he just says, what are you going to do?
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then you do it.
Guest:And then you do it again.
Guest:And he said, you guys have to do it faster than that or better than that.
Guest:And it's like, can you think of anything more interesting than that to do?
Guest:He'll say things like that.
Guest:And so Matthew and I would go away and we'd come back with a scene and he'd go, okay, I'm going to put a camera here, put a camera here.
Guest:Instead of going over there, walk over there because that's where the light's going to come from and we'll shoot.
Guest:Wow.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Now, do you still find this many years later that that's what people know you from?
Guest:Yeah, a lot of people know me from that, yeah.
Marc:And then the other people from the- Especially Marines.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Do they love that movie?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because I think they show it.
Guest:In the Marine Corps.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:As what?
Guest:As an example?
Guest:As like a bell, warning bell.
Guest:I think.
Guest:No, it's the one thing that lifers, military lifers and law enforcement lifers, it's a movie that's very big with them.
Marc:Because they see it as something that, you know, as a cautionary tale, but also an example of the discipline necessary to do the job.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:Because they always say to me that it's the most life, like real version of Paris Island that they've ever seen.
Marc:Oh, yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And that guy just passed away, right?
Marc:Lee, yeah.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:He was something.
Marc:He was a trip.
Marc:So that starts the whole role for you, like the role of work.
Marc:I haven't stopped working since.
Marc:I know.
Marc:It's crazy when I look at how many movies you've done.
Marc:How do you decide what to do?
Guest:I just do it.
Guest:You do?
Guest:Well, I mean, it's like if it's something that I haven't done before, I'll do it.
Marc:But there was some like, do you find like Mystic Pizza, that broke?
Marc:Who was in that?
Marc:Was that Julie Roberts?
Marc:Julie Roberts, Lily Taylor.
Marc:It was a big movie for that generation, for your generation of people, and you were part of that cast.
Marc:Now, at that time, in the sense of your career, did you have a thing you wanted?
Marc:Did you want to be a movie star?
Marc:Did you want to have the track?
Guest:Well, I knew that they were making a lot of those Brat Pack films, and they were cool, I guess, but that's not what I wanted to do at the time.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And I think about that often, actually.
Guest:I think that I might have missed out on having some fun.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Because you were serious?
Guest:Because I was too serious.
Marc:Do you look at that through the lens of maybe your mental issues at this point?
Guest:It could have been.
Guest:I think it was this kind of feeling of I have to be this other kind of person.
Guest:I can't be that kind of person.
Guest:The romanticization of the troubled artist?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Uh-huh.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so that Mystic Pizza was like a big decision for me because I thought, okay, if I'm going to do this, I'm going to have to figure out a way to incorporate the way I approach
Guest:a character and how would I think of acting into this little romantic comedy, which I just heard, literally, I just heard the phrase rom-com.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You just heard it?
Guest:I'd never heard of that before.
Guest:One of the students, one of the people in class said it last night, and I said, what's a rom-com?
Guest:And they actually told me.
Guest:I have no idea what a rom-com was.
Marc:Just an abbreviation.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But I'm not big on rom-coms.
Marc:No, I get it.
Marc:But I think it's also apparent that because your presence and your talent is so specifically yours and you bring a lot of emotional and psychological life to even the most mundane parts, I imagine at some level that might have been a hindrance.
Marc:yeah that like you know that you were sort of like well you're going to do independent movies because you that's how you're that's that's what you're cut from that you know you're hired to be like you know that guy yeah yourself they they're not gonna you know you're not the light-hearted goofball no and it's not gonna happen no i and and you know we um we try you know we tried um
Guest:I tried and had really good time.
Guest:Like which movie?
Guest:Like Harold Ramis brought me in to do Stuart Smalley.
Guest:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:The Franken's movie?
Guest:Yeah, Franken's film.
Guest:Yeah, I played his brother in that.
Guest:Oh, right.
Guest:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Guest:And the two of them taught me some stuff.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Harold was like an amazing guy.
Yeah.
Guest:I forgot you were in it.
Guest:Yes, exactly.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And so that was like way, way far from anything I'd ever done.
Guest:Like way, way far.
Guest:And I think Harold just enjoyed the fact that I was like a Martian on his set.
Guest:But I listened to everything they told me.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Well, I mean, you've played killers.
Guest:You've played cops.
Marc:You've played, you know, I mean, what do you think it is like when you when you have to do something lighthearted or something simple or something that, you know, the story is really about just being funny.
Marc:I mean, it must feel incredibly limiting on some level.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:It doesn't feel limiting.
Guest:It feels foreign.
Guest:Oh, yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:But not limiting.
Guest:I mean, I understand the idea of... I riff myself.
Guest:I just don't riff in funny ways.
Guest:I riff in other ways.
Guest:I like the idea of...
Guest:of experiments, and I like the idea of being spontaneous.
Guest:I like the idea of timing and how to make things land.
Guest:I like all that.
Guest:All that stuff really interests me a lot, actually.
Marc:Yeah, well, I mean, the two records that I listened to, I had one on vinyl.
Marc:I went looking for it the other day because I have a lot of vinyl, and I had gotten it at some point, but I couldn't find it yesterday.
Marc:The spoken word records, the Swim Bonehead.
Marc:Swim Bonehead vault stuff, yeah.
Marc:Yeah, yeah.
Marc:Is that what you mean by riffing, is sort of moving through words and movement?
Guest:Subconsciously.
Marc:And with some music?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Kind of the beatnik tradition?
Guest:Yeah, well, the words come first.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then the music is composed by Dana Lynn afterwards.
Guest:Yeah, she seems like sort of a genius.
Guest:She is a genius, yeah.
Guest:Yeah, it's kind of amazing, the musical geniuses.
Guest:Yeah, she's unbelievable.
Guest:I mean, Dane is a, you know, she plays, name the instrument.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And she's a composer.
Guest:You know, she's like the real deal.
Marc:Is she like a savant music?
Marc:Kind of like she just can play anything and just has a... Pretty much.
Guest:She writes and composes music...
Guest:in such an enormous amount of it, especially because I'm delivering her stuff constantly because I write these things under a stream of consciousness.
Guest:I just wrote one about a frog the other day, and it's like she's already written, composed something.
Guest:You just send them over?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:What do you think?
Guest:I don't even say, what do you think?
Guest:She just sends something back to me because she says, I'm pissing myself laughing.
Guest:It's probably fun for her.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:But it does seem like with The Player, which is another of my... I love that movie.
Marc:I got to work with Altman.
Marc:But also the Abbie Hoffman movie, which you did with Janine.
Marc:I mean, these characters are sort of like raging characters.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And do you find that... How is your anger situation?
Guest:My anger situation in the last 10 years is really, really... I don't think I'm angry anymore.
Marc:It goes away, right?
Marc:It's something about age, too.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I don't think I'm angry anymore.
Marc:It becomes like this weird phantom limb.
Marc:You still have the trigger reactions.
Guest:God damn it!
Guest:And you're like, no, I don't need to... I actually embarrass myself of how sweet I actually am right now.
Guest:Oh, really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I actually find it embarrassing sometimes.
Guest:Really?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I find it like, oh, fuck, I sound like such a sweetie pie guy.
Guest:But I actually am like, it's my first thought these days is to be sweet rather than to be provocative.
Marc:Well, that's funny because you're disappointing your former self, which still resides inside of you.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And the struggle is just shut up.
Marc:Just shut up.
Marc:I'm being nice now.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then it happens naturally eventually.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Or the old side of me is still there and speaks up every once in a while like, why are you acting like such a dick?
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:You're such a dick.
Guest:This is not you.
Guest:When you're being nice?
Guest:Yeah, when I'm being nice.
Guest:This is not you.
Guest:Why would you say that?
Guest:That's not you.
Guest:Come on.
Guest:Being civilized.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Being nice.
Guest:Since when?
Guest:You have to do it on purpose.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Exactly.
Guest:You were out to kill us.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:No, I think I was at my worst when I was doing Law and Order.
Guest:Really?
Guest:In terms of that was the end of the anger?
Guest:Those were the death throes of- The anger ended by that.
Guest:I think that there was people on that show, not actors, but people who ran that show that taught me the extent, the end of my anger.
Guest:I took it all the way.
Guest:At them?
Guest:At them, yeah.
Guest:Oh, so you were a problem.
Marc:Well, according to them.
Marc:How did that manifest itself?
Marc:What were the issues?
Guest:We were exhausted.
Guest:We were exhausted.
Guest:And I had this- Okay, you churned those out.
Guest:I mean, you did like 150 of the fucking things.
Guest:Yeah, and we worked 18 hours a day.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Every day with Saturday off.
Guest:Sorry, with Sunday off.
Guest:Friday you work until the morning.
Guest:And you're shooting for three months, four months?
Guest:10 months.
Guest:It's 22 episodes a year.
Guest:And it's formulaic to a degree.
Guest:To completely a degree, like the degree of formulaic.
Guest:Like the number one degree.
Guest:So you're like in hell.
Guest:You're like in hell, yeah.
Guest:No, not the whole time.
Guest:The whole time, the first few years is you get to develop this character that nobody's ever seen before.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And that's fun.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then all this other shit happens, and they start writing to the stuff that you've invented, and suddenly it's not that interesting anymore because they're writing to it, and the writing doesn't feel as good as inventing it.
Guest:Right, right, right.
Guest:But then the fifth year kicks in, and then the sixth year.
Guest:And you can't get out.
Guest:Oh, my God.
Guest:So you're happy to be out?
Marc:And it's your own fault for being there.
Guest:Yeah.
Marc:Yeah, but I mean, a job's a job.
Guest:A job is a job, yeah.
Marc:Health and coverage, you got kids, what are you going to do?
Marc:Yeah, exactly.
Marc:You know, you're a grown-up now.
Marc:So that, because working with Kubrick and working with Altman are big deals, I would imagine.
Marc:And Ramis.
Marc:I mean, I'm not going to belittle anybody, but obviously as a film head that, you know, for me, like the player, a lot of people think is different than his other movies.
Marc:I love that movie.
Marc:Yeah, me too.
Marc:And how did he work?
Marc:You know, what did you learn from him?
Guest:He was totally open.
Guest:He loved actors.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:He loved actors coming up with ideas.
Guest:He was a very honest director.
Guest:Like if you came up with something, like the whole thing about my character dying in the water.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like drowning in like this much water.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:Like that was something that I came up with.
Guest:And on the night, we were all worried whether it was going to work a lot, including myself.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And then once we saw that it worked, he's like, that will never be your idea again.
Yeah.
Guest:It just became his?
Guest:It just became his idea.
Guest:And I loved that.
Guest:I was like, you got it, dude.
Guest:Whatever you say.
Guest:You know, Altman was totally open.
Guest:He'd walk around with half a joint in his pocket.
Guest:Most of the scenes were shot on a baby jib, which is like a small little weighted crane with the camera on one side and weights on the other.
Guest:And they would put it on the track.
Guest:You'd have like five guys, because back then it was cable.
Guest:It was everywhere.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:You had five guys reeling up cable, and the actors could go anywhere they want.
Guest:They could walk over the track, do anything.
Guest:And all you see is these guys with cable running back and forth, keeping the cable out of the shot.
Guest:And you just did it.
Marc:So there's a naturalism to it.
Marc:Yeah, totally.
Marc:Because that seemed like a pretty tightly scripted movie for some of his more lyrical things compared to it.
Marc:But he still employed all that stuff.
Marc:Totally, yeah.
Marc:And he did give Fred Ward that amazing tracking shot at the beginning.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:It took 10 minutes.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:So I watched the whole movie.
Marc:Now, The Kid, is this the first feature you directed?
Guest:The first real feature.
Guest:I've done a couple of experiences.
Guest:I shot a film in my backyard in upstate New York, a musical horror.
Guest:Yeah?
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:And we shot it in like five days.
Guest:And everybody sings and everybody dies.
Guest:Yeah?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:Does it have a cult following?
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:I guess so, yeah.
Marc:It's pretty weird.
Marc:The music is awesome.
Marc:But I guess my question is, outside of the fact that you were just in The Magnificent Seven, what is it about the Western that made you want to make a Western?
Guest:Just because they're cool movies.
Guest:I've always liked the good ones and always thought that I wanted to make one.
Guest:And I wrote one a long time ago that got kind of caught up in lawyer stuff and is now just not able to be made.
Guest:And then I started to think about coming-of-age stories.
Guest:And then one night, I just thought of a great idea to put a kid, a fictional character, in between the factual character.
Guest:In the story of Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid.
Marc:Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid.
Marc:So that story tracks historically?
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And so you took that story, you know, the sort of mythologizing Billy Kid, the reality ability kid, this weird relationship between Pat Garrett and Billy the Kid, Pat Garrett played by Ethan Hawke.
Marc:And you thought like, well, I'm going to stick a kid in there somehow.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:To have a rites of passage movie.
Marc:Exactly.
Marc:And learn from two different men.
Marc:Yeah.
Guest:Huh.
Guest:And you came up with the story?
Guest:Yes.
Guest:And you... And I found a writer that I thought that was the right guy to write it, this guy Andrew Lanham, and him and I get along fantastically.
Guest:And so he came... I was shooting The Judge at the time with Downies, and he came to Boston and stayed in the hotel that I was in, and he would write, and then he would deliver pages, and then we'd go in the room, and we'd write out structure and write out the whole thing.
Guest:Oh, wow.
Guest:Yeah.
Guest:I mean, Andrew wrote the screenplay, but the story is mine.
Guest:I couldn't have done as good a job as Andrew did.
Marc:But was that the first time you were involved in that process?
Marc:Yeah, in writing outside of you?
Guest:No, I had done it with friends for the thing I did in my backyard upstate.
Guest:But I knew what it was like to bounce stuff off of people and write.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:And what were the challenges like?
Marc:So like this is like you got a little money here.
Marc:This isn't a backyard event.
Marc:You know, you got a crew.
Guest:Yeah, you have 20 days to shoot a full out Western with stagecoaches and gunfights.
Guest:20 days.
Guest:And major dramatic scenes.
Guest:Well, you got some power actors in there.
Guest:Yeah, you would think that it would be fall out of bed and just do it.
Guest:No, no, I knew it.
Marc:But you got some beautiful performances out of people.
Guest:Yeah, man, because they're great.
Guest:They're great actors.
Marc:And you and Ethan are friends for years.
Marc:You've done other work together.
Marc:Yes.
Marc:And that kid, he seems to be some sort of wizard or natural.
Marc:He's a natural, yeah.
Marc:Dane DeHaan.
Guest:Yeah, yeah.
Guest:Dane is amazing, yeah.
Marc:When you're working with a guy like that, do you relate?
Guest:Totally.
Guest:He knows.
Guest:We both know what we're doing.
Guest:We're peers and there's no secrets.
Guest:As far as I'm concerned, I just respect the hell out of him.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:It's like I can see moment to moment his performance.
Guest:I can see when it's coming, when it's not.
Guest:I can see the whole thing, and I just respect the hell out of it.
Guest:And I can walk up to him in the middle of a take or say something to him in the middle of a take or after a take, say, just whisper a couple of things in his ear, and then he'll bring this whole other thing.
Guest:These guys are amazing what they do.
Marc:I didn't even know it was Chris Pratt.
Guest:For like half the movie.
Guest:Chris was doing another show at the time and he came in for five days.
Marc:Yeah, but he went to that sort of eternal dark place of completely morally corrupt characters.
Marc:There's some people that can tap into that.
Marc:And he did it, and I was sort of like, whoa, good job.
Marc:Good job, yeah.
Guest:And Ethan's very controlled, but solid.
Guest:But Ethan had to play Pat Garrett.
Guest:He had to do it.
Guest:I kind of used our friendship, because there was nobody in my mind.
Guest:He knew that I've always wanted him to play Pat Garrett, because I actually think he is like...
Marc:um the spirit of chris christopherson like i you know i really think that it's like ethan has that kind of quality in real life yeah i've talked to him yeah he told me like as an actor he told me one of the greatest things because i watch him differently now because he said when he was um and he's also like a very intellectually curious guy he likes to engage and do stuff art totally yeah but he said that when he was when he got the role in training day
Marc:He knew that his obstacle was going to be not to be eaten alive by Denzel.
Marc:So he watched Denzel movies like football players watch training films of the other team so he could figure out a way to hold his own with that guy.
Marc:So now when I watch him in scenes, I'm wondering, not that he's going to overact, but how he's going to step up.
Marc:Even in the shootout in your movie, I knew there was a moment there where it looked like, well, Chris Pratt's going to eat his lunch.
Marc:And then he just fills up somehow.
Guest:Oh, my God, yes.
Guest:You know what I mean?
Guest:And if you give him...
Guest:um one piece just one piece of good dialogue yeah he will he it will spawn pages and pages of dialogue yeah like you just he appreciates words so much yeah that you just have to give him if you can put together somehow two sentences yeah of really good words yeah he's inspired for weeks that's great well i mean i think you did a beautiful job thanks and yeah i gotta run you out of here because you got to do a phoner
Marc:Oh, okay.
Marc:But you feel good?
Marc:I feel good.
Marc:It's great talking to you.
Marc:It was great to finally talk to you.
Marc:All right, man.
Marc:Yeah.
Marc:There you go.
Marc:That was nice.
Marc:He's intense though, right?
Marc:The Kid, his new movie, Vincent's new movie starring Ethan Hawke, Dane DeHaan, and Chris Pratt is playing in select theaters.
Marc:Also, look for all those tour dates.
Marc:A lot of tour dates added.
Marc:I gotta be coming close to you.
Marc:WTFpod.com slash tour.
Guest:boomer lives