Ep. 537: "Cold Breakfast"
Oh, hello.
I didn't see you there.
How are you, John?
Oh, hi.
Hi there, Merlin.
Were you in stealth mode?
no i was in a mode apparently uh where zoom something something something something oh yeah it's very it's very it's loud in here now oh zoom needed to restart my computer you see uh because of because of something and there were a lot of boxes i needed to check i had to check some boxes i had to i had to put in a password because i had to authorize really you sure you're not you might be hacked
The other day, Apple force upgraded my OS.
I'd been clicking no thanks, no thanks, no thanks for like four years.
No thanks.
And they're like, do you want me to remind you tomorrow?
And I'm like, no.
Your car turning on the check engine light is a way of forcing you to the mechanic.
I was like, nope, nope, nope.
Don't want it.
Because I know you update the OS at some point and it borks your whole computer.
It's over from that point on.
That's what always happens.
That's what always happens.
Always happens.
It borks it.
It says right in the top line of the code, bork.
Go to bork.
That's basic.
I said, it's in basic.
I said, no thanks, no thanks for four years, and then it just did it.
I didn't authorize it.
Do you consider that a nanny state problem, John?
You know, I think you explained it to me perfectly.
The people at Apple are out of touch with real Americans.
Oh, you mean the real hardworking citizens that are out there hustling every day.
That's right.
The people, those ivory tower elitists at Apple computers have not had to work.
a day in their lives.
Not a day in their lives.
They just sit there with their soft little hands, and they don't know.
They have all the memories.
Making tiny, tiny little decisions about, like, what the corner of something should look like.
That's exact.
Well, you know, and the startup sounds and all the things that regular Americans.
You think they focus too much on those trivial matters, whereas the hardworking citizens of America just want a computer that doesn't need to be restarted with boxes that need to be clicked.
See, see, you understand.
Doesn't seem like a lot to ask.
You should be able to select a mode, John.
You should be able to select a mode.
Yes.
Okay.
What mode would, what would you call the mode?
I'm going to call it old man mode because that sounds value laden.
But I think, oh, you know what?
Buzz off mode.
Traditional mode.
traditional mode can i tell you why i like it oh i like it i think it's got it's got it feels wholesome it does it feels like it's a it's a result of your values obviously you're traditional thank you you want a traditional you want a traditional mac one that's running on outdated software from like five years ago yeah well how how do we say outdated you know it's like like president trump used to say you know the two technologies are you know a wheel and a wall you know you can't beat those
I'm telling you that if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
If it ain't broke, how would you know if it's broke?
You'd know.
Well, it's more broke now that it's upgraded.
It's forked.
Forked is just another way of saying broke.
That's in the first line of the basic.
Yeah.
Go to fork.
No, how's that little slider bar working for you, Mr. Upgrade?
Yeah.
The slider bar.
The slider bar.
You got rid of that as fast as you could.
Are you talking about like the thing where you hit buttons on your laptop?
No, the little touch thing that was up at the top of your laptop for a while where you were over here, over there, over there.
It didn't work, right?
Oh, it was real frustrating for a while.
Yeah, see?
That's what upgrading does.
You make a strong case.
My Apple laptop has a Chevy 350 in it.
You can work on it yourself.
It ain't got no computers in it.
My computer ain't got no computers in it, is what I'm trying to tell you.
All you need is a Chilton book in an afternoon.
That's exactly it.
My granddad worked on it.
My great-grandfather worked on his Mac.
It was called the old Macintosh.
What?
How did they even get in this country?
You know what I mean?
No, dogs are Irish allowed.
I'm having a job over with the startup sound.
Oh, this corner's so sharp.
No, I'm telling you, I don't, I don't, I don't, you remember, oh, you remember when the first iPhones came out, how fast they were, how good they were, and then they got worser and worser and worser.
Mm-hmm.
And then they were slow and they were weird.
And then all the different things they've done that have been weird the whole time.
And now they're just listening to you constantly.
Mine's mad at me right now because I'm talking about it.
Oh, so it's not achieving generalized AI intelligence and sentience, but it can hold a grudge.
Well, I think when we talk about intelligence, isn't holding a grudge one of the first...
The first sign of intelligence is the ability to hold a grudge.
You know, like the way a bonobo can use a twig to get ants out the log.
Yeah.
The first thing that intelligence does is make you reflect back on what just happened and find a resentment in it.
So Grog the caveman wakes up one day and realizes he's bitter about his wife.
And has been.
And he didn't have a name for it because he's Grog.
Right.
But he would understand now that he has, as you say, he has intelligence.
Now he goes, whoa, what's going on here?
Ook, ook is what he says at first.
Ook, ook.
What's his wife's name?
His name is Grog.
His wife's name is probably... Ook, ook.
Stona.
Stona.
Oh, Stona.
It's a family name.
They came over here from other side of Hill.
Change name at Ellis Island.
From Estona.
I don't want no trouble.
You know, I'm a traditional guy.
You got to start using that, John.
That's good.
Traditional mode.
That is so coded.
That could end up right up there with family friendly.
As you know, you know what I mean?
Yeah, sure.
Family friendly.
It's got no swears.
A double S. Yeah.
Get your A double S off.
That's the beauty of family friendly, though, is that especially if you're kind of dumb, you can use it to mean almost anything.
You can you can throw anybody under the metaphorical bus.
As you know, Merlin, you can use words to say pretty much anything.
I think that's mostly true.
I mean, even ineffable has a definition.
Yeah, that's a Cirque du Soleil.
That's what they call away Homer.
That's a Cirque du Soleil.
Hey, that's a Cirque du Soleil.
Hey, that's a spicy meatball.
Hey!
No, I just want... Stelladoro breakfast treats.
I thought we were just naming things now.
Crumbly cookies.
I wake up in the morning.
I don't want no trouble from nobody.
Yeah.
Last thing you want is to get hassled by the man.
I just want to ride my machine.
And so I come in here, sit down, open up my machine.
I just want to ride it.
And it says, oh, you got to update.
I'm like, I don't.
I don't.
Why do you?
Hey, John, quick question.
Did Peter Fonda, he had a Harley, right?
Yeah.
Did he ever have to update his Harley?
Did he have to flash the firmware?
Did he have to go into safe mode to make his Harley work?
The only thing he had to do is put a bunch of cash in a tube in the gas tank.
That updated that Harley fast.
Did you know that Sloan did a video that parodies a famous scene from Easy Rider?
Sloan.
Sloan.
Sloan.
You know, I had a night with some Canadians.
You asked me a question about Sloan a couple weeks ago, and I honestly couldn't tell, well, not whether you were trolling me, but the extent to which and how you were trolling me.
What really interested me was that you consulted Madeline, and she told you that she thought I was trolling you.
Did I say that?
Yeah, you said Madeline thinks you're trolling me right now.
Oh, I probably did say that, and I probably did do that.
No, I mainly remember what my opinion was, and I think my opinion was very accurate.
We shouldn't talk about our text messages here, but you asked me a very good question that indicated you had at least Googled Sloan and were able to name one of their albums.
Anyways.
I know more about Sloan than you've had hot breakfasts.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Because I know you like cold breakfasts.
Love a cold breakfast.
Cold breakfast in a panadabastic.
No, I was backstage last night.
Not to brag.
Not to brag.
Yeah, you are.
You are bragging.
With Sarah.
You don't even know what I'm bragging about.
Doesn't matter.
If you're backstage, you're bragging.
I was backstage with the Backstage Boys.
No.
Oh, yeah?
With Sarah McLachlan.
McLachlan.
Yeah.
And Feist.
Leslie Feist.
Both Canadian artists.
Mm-hmm.
And we talked, and all their bands are Canadian, and we talked about Canadia.
the whole time because you know canadians are they just want to talk about canadian okay so first of all i'm supposed to buy into the idea that you were backstage at a sarah mclaughlin concert okay no i'm i mean it's really more of a comment than a question what like i'm supposed to who got you into that feist because you know feist a little right no in fact when i when i was uh when i was backstage and i i saw leslie
I call her Leslie.
I call her Leslie.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I waltzed up, you know, in my signature waltz step.
And I said, Leslie.
You want to track the worms?
I said, Leslie.
I said, hey, I'm John from The Long Winters.
We opened for you like a handful of times in California.
You opened for them at the Fillmore, I want to say.
That's right.
At the Fillmore.
And she said, wow, like 20 years ago.
And I said, yep, 20 years ago.
She's a little smaller than I would have guessed.
Oh, yeah, she's little.
Yeah, she's very talented.
And she said, how's it going with the long winters?
And I said, well, Leslie, let me tell you.
Sit down, Leslie.
Getting back together after a long time.
And she said, you know, I took several years off.
And I said, I know.
And look at us now.
Here we are.
And she was like, look at us now.
And as, you know, we talked for a little while, and then as we walk away, my daughter leans over and she says, I don't think she remembered you.
Yeah.
Yeah, but she handled it in a way that was dignified for both of you.
Well, and I think she's, you know, my kid is watching her at knowing how I behave when I don't remember somebody.
Oh, I learned it from you, Dad.
Yeah, that's right.
I was like, why don't you keep your opinions to yourself?
You don't know anything.
A little shit.
Yeah.
Maybe she remembers me.
Ask me how many rock concerts I got to go to when I was a teenager.
Exactly.
0.0.
No, that's not true.
I saw Count Basie.
That's true.
You saw Count Basie at Disneyland.
And then, oh wait, I have another one.
But you didn't go see Ozzy Osbourne at the other high school.
Exactly, because there were too many devils.
And it's like Alaska and West Alaska were the two high schools.
I don't remember the name.
Anchorage and other Anchorage?
Was it a different Cardinal Anchorage?
Was it a Catholic school?
That was Anchorage High School.
I made a funny joke, John.
I said Cardinal Anchorage.
Because it was a Cardinal Point.
I liked it.
Okay.
Yeah.
I like the joke.
Well, my first problem with you is ordinal.
Go ahead.
My ears don't hear puns.
I keep forgetting that, shaboom, shaboom.
All right.
It's a weird thing.
It's like differently abled.
You rejected his damage.
Mm-hmm.
You're saying you're neurodiverse.
Oh, that's what I meant.
That's what I meant.
Yeah.
And don't hear puns, and I don't see colors.
I mean, I can perceive colors.
I just don't see them.
Oh, you don't see colors in people.
Oh, I mean, I don't see colors way up the food chain before people.
I really respect that, John.
It's traditional.
I can see it with the clothes that you wear, especially your cruise wear.
It's clear to me that you cannot see colors.
Oh, I think that's hurtful.
No, no, no, no.
It looks like you get hit with a sherbet gun in like a nice way.
sherbet gun i love those guys were they seattle circa 89 probably yeah sure well anyway so nisco nova scotia came up and then i was like oh man i'm just i've got it i've you got a file card you got a file card on that i got a i got a sloan reference i'm gonna make a sloan reference i'm gonna make a sloan reference and then we started talking about acadians did you notice i made a nova scotia reference in response to your text
Oh, you did make a Nova Scotia reference.
I thought it was a pretty good poll.
I said Eric.
Yeah, I thought maybe it was Madeline was feeding you lines by that point.
Hey, she feeds me nothing.
Well, she does.
Cold breakfast.
Cold breakfast.
Cold breakfast.
That's all you're getting.
Slop.
Go to Bork Daddy.
That's her little song she sings when you wake up in the morning.
Cold breakfast.
Slop.
I ate that song.
I'm so hungry.
Why can't I have hash browns?
Cold breakfast.
Cold breakfast.
Oh, shit.
So sorry Nova Scotia Nova Scotia came up big fishing community Yeah, yeah, and you know actually got a lot of jazz when they when they moved to Toronto, you know They got a lot of jazz from people that they were big-timing Oh, yeah, for sure.
Why'd they leave the island?
They could they could have made a fine living out there I think part of this is encompassing your question and your in your record label question We should probably say what we talked about but continue
Oh, and so then I'm sitting there, I'm talking to the band, you know, of course, because all the stars were like, hey, great to see you.
And then they moved me over to the couch with all the bass players.
See, I'm imagining you a little bit like Letterman, where you just go, these are your drums?
Nice drums.
I like them.
These are your drums?
So I'm talking to all the players, you know, the musicians.
You're talking about the side persons.
Yeah, well, you know, yeah, the band.
I mean, a lot of them.
Anybody famous in the band?
Well, they're, you know.
Canadian famous will suffice.
Sarah has a guy playing in the band.
Well, she's got her longtime guitarist, but her new time guitarist has played with a lot of people, including Beck and Sting and all these characters.
So he's like a session.
He's like a gunslinger.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But it's really her bass player and like and co vocalist who's this extraordinary musician.
And as she and I were talking, I was thinking, you know what I need to do.
Her name is Melissa.
And I was like, I absolutely need to find a way to mention Kathleen Edwards here.
Not to brag, but just to be like, hey, I know a Canadian.
I know a Canadian pretty well, and she's also a lady, and she's also a singer.
She's a very talented person.
We should say that more than once a year, but she's one of my favorite people I've met via you, and I think she's very, very talented.
Yeah, she's wonderful.
But we started talking about Acadians, and then I was like, oh, well, now we're on that jazz.
And I missed my shot at it.
And then later I was actually communicating via text message on my Apple device with Kathleen, not to brag.
No, we were backstage.
And she said, oh, Melissa, she's a really close friend of mine.
And then I realized I could have closed the circle.
I could have brought it all the way, and then we would have been like friends forever, but I didn't mention Kathleen because I thought, oh, that's unseemly.
I can't force it here.
Because not only would you have probably been invited on stage, you would have been invited on stage, and you probably would have covered The Weight, which is a song by Canadians.
There you go.
And probably I'd be on the tour bus now.
And you already know that song.
You've played that song before.
We've played it.
We played it.
We actually played it with Ryan Adams.
With Ryan Adams, not to brag.
The guy from Cut, Sing a Knife?
Yeah.
The other guy.
Brian Adams was Canadian.
Brian Adams.
Brian Adams hates it when you call him Brian Adams.
I would, too.
Or when you say cuts like a knife.
That's not funny.
No, no, I understand.
I understand.
It's only funny because he's a dick and it's nice to... I've heard that.
The guy from old 97s is nice, right?
Oh, he's so nice.
Sometimes I confuse them in my head.
Okay, well, this is off the record.
But the Ryan guy who did that New York City I Love You song as a cashier, what was his band?
It was Whiskey Town.
They were good, too.
But you know I love old 97s, right?
You're okay with that, right?
I think old 97s are a wonderful thing to love.
I think they're American.
I really do.
And they are American.
And the singer, his name is Rhett, not to brag.
He seems nice.
He seems like, speaking of Canadians, the guy from the Weaker Thans.
The weaker than.
Which is one of my favorite bands.
John and Samson, I think his name is.
Talk about a smart Canadian.
I mean, that guy's lyric.
I'm not a lyrics guy, as you know.
No.
But now I'm just naming Canadian bands that I like.
And they're all nice.
They're all nice.
You like a lot of Canadian bands.
I'm just going to say, I think I like more and different Canadian bands than a lot of people.
Not that I dislike some Canadian bands.
I'm not like, you know...
How do you feel about the bare naked ladies?
I mean, are you?
They're fine.
They're fine.
They're fine.
I'm not like anti-Lightfoot or something.
You know, Lightfoot was in there in that Dylan circle for a little while, kind of.
Oh, sure.
Sure.
People really looked up to that first Gordon Lightfoot record.
That's how he got that nickname, Gordon Lightfoot.
Now they call him Sundown.
I think it's a shame.
You know, the tour manager, so I'm waiting there for the tour manager.
Is that anybody you knew, John?
No, but I'm waiting there by the merch table for him to come get me and take me backstage.
Not to brag.
And somebody said via text message, they were like, he'll be wearing a baseball hat that says the hip.
And I was like, a baseball hat that says the hip?
And there's a guy standing there with a baseball hat.
They know.
Canada knows.
He's got his sunglasses up on top of his hat so he can't read it.
And I walked over to him because he's standing there kind of looking around.
And I was like, are you?
And I knew his name.
And I said his name.
Are you, let's say, Gordon Lightfoot?
And he said, yeah.
And I said, well, I was supposed to know you by your hat.
But then you put your sunglasses on top of it.
And I couldn't.
And he was like, oh, ha, ha, ha.
But he didn't take the sunglasses off the hat.
He just laughed.
And then I got the reference.
I was like, oh, wait, it says the hip.
You mean.
the tragically hip.
And he was like, and he didn't even go, yeah, he was just like, uh-huh.
Like it was the most natural thing in the world, like duh, duh.
Well, I mean, just for American listeners who aren't that into music, you've mentioned several- They're Canada's biggest band.
Is that fair to say?
I mean, they were a pretty... When I try to describe Sloan to people who aren't aware of Sloan, it's difficult.
Which is most everybody you talk to, right?
Anyway, what I fall back on is that around the time of 98, 99, I would say they were at least Weezer level.
You know what I mean?
Yeah, sure.
They were in a... Not Budweiser, what am I saying?
They were in a Molson commercial with Money City Maniacs.
They don't have Budweiser there.
Yeah, Canadian ween is what I call him.
Okay.
You're so easy to wind up.
No, I'm not responding to it in any way.
I'm not even showing you how much that bothers me.
Tragically hip, though, it's fair to say they were a pretty big deal in Canada, right?
Oh, sure.
They were the Bruce Springsteen of Canada.
Oh, Jesus Christ.
Now, wait.
All the guys who wear Canadian tuxedos, all the guys in Jean Jean, amongst all those guys, that's the most Bruce of Canada?
I don't know, man.
All right.
You know what?
It's your show.
You know what?
Bruce works across all borders.
There are no borders to Bruce.
He's very talented.
You know who else is talented?
Billy Joel.
I have to confess.
Billy Joel is... Billy Joel... He's a national treasure.
You know, I'm on record being entertaining by him.
I like Billy Joel a lot.
And my kid got really into Billy Joel a few years ago and stayed really into Billy Joel.
And to cut a long story short, this is actually kind of an... This is a multi-angle intersecting story, so I'll tell it very quickly.
I've been...
somewhat acquainted with somebody who is a comedian that people know for a while not to brag and i've i didn't say his name i didn't say his name i know i know you're talking about no idea it's the other one no but this fella well he worked with the other fella and i would sometimes talk to them about they all work together in their work well that's all they're all mobbed up but anyway david wayne does a thing called middle-aged dad jam band
Ken Marino, it's a rotating group.
Sometimes Weird Al is in it.
Ken Marino is kind of the front man for it.
Billy and I went to see them live last year.
And, like, I think of myself as very acquainted with David, but I didn't realize the extent to which my relationship with him...
is... I wouldn't say this, except that I'm the one who looks like an idiot in this, so I can tell the story.
But, like, I've talked to him on the phone, and we've, you know, DM'd and stuff, and he did the nicest thing for me once.
For those of you out there who are fans of Wet Hot and of other David things, you'll know that there's a bit that David does, David and his other folks, that's really funny, which is he'll work in the sound of shattering terracotta pottery.
It's used very well in Wet Hot.
Like when Janine Garofalo throws the hand trowel and you hear...
And I wanted to use that effect.
I mentioned it in a podcast once.
I contacted David.
And this says so much about David Wayne in so many ways.
David not only went out and like found it, he found it easily because he's very organized and he sent it to me.
And he said, like, you're welcome.
So, like, I mean, like, we're acquainted.
We're not like pals.
But I didn't realize we'd never actually met.
Yeah.
Uh-huh.
Until, as previously arranged, I pop by to say hello before the show, because I want Billy to get to, I mean, Carrie Kenney is there.
Jolo Trujillo is there.
The wonderful actress who played the girl on Parks and Rec.
There's just so many great people.
I was just like, it'd be so neat if Billy got to just like...
What a fun time.
Yeah, and Billy's a huge Camarino fan, like all of us.
Anyway, I go up and I'm like, and I kind of waved to David Wayne from like outside the, you know, the area at Swedish American Club, their version of that giant room they use as a green room, you know, down the hallway.
And I waved and I was like, hey, hey.
And he goes, hi, hi, how's it going?
I'm like, hey man, how you been?
And he's like...
hi who are you oh and i went oh gosh we know each other on the internet you fucking idiot i'm merlin man who do you think billy of course wants to be nowhere near any of this but it's very important to me that because billy loves children's hospital too you know we went to pixar with uncle rob so like you know billy's kind of a little bit invested in this comedy stuff but would never admit it and david was like well you know we've never met in person right
And I was like, what are you talking about?
And then I had that moment.
Like, you remember, like, what do you call it?
A Rolodex?
Like, imagine the sound of a Rolodex flipping very quickly.
That's what's happening in my brain, is I go, oh, okay, yeah.
I guess we've never actually met, and now I'm really embarrassed, and I'm very sorry.
I see you all the time.
Oh, yeah, I figured you could see me through the TV.
And Billy's like...
very embarrassed at this point.
And comedian David Wayne dashed down the hallway a little bit to track Billy down and say hi.
And I felt so bad.
Because he said, I really want to just bring my kid in to say hi.
But that was all really embarrassing.
The reason I'm telling you this anecdote is it reflects poorly on me, but also that they have put out these videos on YouTube for a while now.
And it's like I say, it's a rotating group.
It's really fun.
But it's pretty fun, like shambling cover band in a garage.
Their latest series of videos are much higher production values and much more like thoughtfully, professionally performed and recorded.
And I don't like to send you too many YouTube videos, but the first one I saw from this new round of these was a cover of scenes from an Italian restaurant.
I think it's on 52nd Street, maybe The Stranger.
It's by Ryan Adams.
Yep, because it's like a 69.
I happen to love a bottle of wine, a bottle of red.
It's a really good song.
It's almost like a little rock opera.
And it's so interesting for the time.
They covered that.
And they killed it.
And Ken Marino, I don't like saying things like this because it sounds weird, but he sounds so much like Billy Joel.
It's really, really good.
And I listened to that song.
I watched that video probably four times.
And then I went and I found some live.
There's some pretty good, I think it's one on Old Grey Whistle Test where he does Italian Restaurant Live in the 70s.
And
I think that guy's great, and I'm going to tell you something else.
I really admire Billy Joel.
I think the way he handles his MSG thing is very cool.
I think the way he takes a helicopter from Long Island, makes $3 million, and flies home is kind of cool, and I respect it.
It's nice.
I never have a place to say these things, but I think Billy Joel's kind of cool.
He looks a little bit like a mole man now, but we all do.
You know, I have to confess.
I have to admit it.
I have to admit it.
I've been... Do you want to give any prelude on this, John?
Because we could leave it with something as simple as you and I, and I guess you and Colton to some extent, but you and I, for the purposes of this show, have disagreed on a make-believe...
decision we've made which is like you can either like phil collins or you can like billy joel is that a fair way to put it didn't we some years ago establish that you really like phil collins and i really like billy joel and never the twain shall meet i mean really like phil collins that's pushing well i super like both you're not a fan
Right.
I used to go to sleep every night listening to the side B of Foxtrot.
So, like, my bona fides are there.
Like, I've been with the film man for a long time.
The first cassette I ever bought, the first, it was a Columbia cassette, the first one I ever bought with my own money was Glass Houses.
So like I'm just saying like I am a fan.
You were very strongly anti-Joel at one point.
I just feel like if I was sitting here in my living room and somebody walked in presumably in a tux like white tie and tails wearing a top hat and they said, hey, I'm going to play one song.
Either a random song from the collected works of Phil Collins or a random song from the collected work of Billy Joel.
Just to be clear, this is from their entire catalog.
So this could be post-82 Collins.
This could be post-83 or post-84 Billy Joel.
That's right.
Or it could be a Genesis song.
Oh, well.
It could be a Genesis, you know.
All you get to do is hear one song, and this guy's kind of, he's tapping now, and he's twirling a cane.
You got to hear one song by one of these artists.
I think he looks like the guy, I'm thinking he looks like the guy in the Blondie video, Rapture.
I'm imagining an African-American man in a white, you know, tuxedo with a top hat and glasses, and maybe he smiles like that guy in the Sprite ad.
You're seeing your glasses up on top of the top hat.
No, I was thinking about the bartender in The Shining.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Your money's no good here, sir.
Yeah, that guy.
And I would pick Phil Collins any day over Billy Joel in that situation.
Even knowing that that might be something from Nursery Crime.
It could be Susudio, and I would have made the wrong mistake.
I would have made a terrible mistake if it was Susudio.
Yeah, but the thing is, it's like blackjack.
In blackjack, you don't get to pick your hand, but you get to learn basic strategy and know that if the house is showing 10 and you've got 16, you've got to hit.
Like in that case, you just hit.
And unfortunately, you just, you know, you just got 24.
Yeah, you just got 24.
You know what?
I just went to see the movie The Fall Guy starring the gods.
Yeah.
And not just the gods.
The goat man.
Yeah.
Big fan.
I'm going to go see the gods no matter what he does.
Oh, really?
I love it.
He's like a god in our house.
We love that guy.
Oh, is that right?
Well, I don't know a lot of his early work, but I even like stuff that people don't like of his.
Like, what are the things that people don't like?
Well, I mean, you know, I mean, we're talking about here about Ryan Gosling.
Is that correct?
Yeah.
That's the guy from Drive, right?
What is that?
Oh, but it's the guy from, he's like in The Nice Guys with Russell Crowe, right?
One of the great movies.
Oh, I see what you're saying.
Movies like that.
Like The Nice Guys with Russell Crowe.
I used to confuse them with Ryan Reynolds, and I still kind of do sometimes.
I think I might, too.
John, you should absolutely see the movie Drive.
That's just not even a thing we should talk about.
When I was going out with Millennium Girlfriend.
Yes.
Did I stop you on your Billy Joel story?
I feel like I did.
I didn't mean to stop you on your tracks.
I just wanted to add some context.
No, no, no, no.
It's quite all right.
He's from Long Island, which is also where Syracuse is from.
I was watching the new Gauze movie, and that's called The Fall Guy.
Emily Blunt's in that?
See, that's what I was going to say.
Emily Blunt is in it.
And it's like a television show that's been made into a movie.
Yeah, they made it into a movie based on the Steve Austin TV show.
And they actually have Steve Austin.
It shows up to spoil it.
He's alive?
He is, and it's not a very good cameo, but he's there.
He's got to be a fucking mummy.
No, he looks amazing.
He's had like 700 plastic surgeries.
But anyway, there's a lot of explosions and so forth.
So at one point, a Billy Joel song figures prominently in the film.
Oh, no, no, no.
I'm sorry.
It's a Phil Collins song.
Figures prominently in the film.
And it's one of the Phil Collins songs that if you had said, if the man in the tuxedo had said, and you are the winning...
number and here is the phil collins song that you get i would have gone oh bummer like i chose land the confusion
No, no, I'd be psyched by that.
That's what the world is today.
A little end of confusion.
A little end of confusion.
No, no, no.
Is that a running bit now?
Can that be a running bit?
Okay, so is it solo?
Is it Genesis?
No, it's Against All Lots.
Oh, come on.
Oh, and I bet it's for a slow motion action scene.
It is.
Of course it is.
It is a slow motion action scene.
I like that song at the time.
I like that quite a lot.
And at the end, and the thing is, Emily Blunt and the guys, I think, well, I think, no, I think she's singing it.
And she has a great voice.
And I'm like, wait a minute.
I like the song Against All Odds.
It's a good song.
I remember it came out.
I'm not against it.
Yeah, it came out.
Like, in my head, I'm confusing it a little bit with, everybody needs a little time away.
That's a Chicago song.
Because they were both, like, the hit from, like, a summer movie.
Wasn't it?
Oh, that was from Against All Odds was the movie.
Yeah.
Was that Chicago or was that Peter Cetera's soul?
I think it was hard for me to say.
I'm sorry.
I'm pretty sure that's Chicago featuring Peter Cetera.
Terry Kath had been dead for years at that point, rest his soul.
You know, but anyway, what I was going to say, Millennium Girlfriend really loved the gods because I think all Millenniums do.
I think he's a Millennium superstar.
And so I...
turned into a gauze fan at the time because i was like oh i see i mean he's he's like unconventionally handsome you know he's not if you looked at him across he is no george clooney very actually funny as a person yeah he just seems cute and charming and just like somebody you want around he does yeah if he came around he was like hey can i do your yard
Most of the time when somebody comes to the door and leaves a business card or knocks on the door and says, hey, can I do your yard?
So you look through the hole, and you're not immediately put off by thinking it's a bugbear or something.
You see, oh, it's somebody.
He looks a little bit like the actor Ryan Gosling.
You open the door, and then he says, hey, I'm about here with my equipment.
I bet he says, I just did the lawn next door.
That's what he says every time.
That's what we were doing in Florida.
Because if you get three lawns in a row,
Oh, sure.
You're making money.
You're not spending gas and you're doing, I mean, you're spending lawnmower gas, but yeah, I do all your neighbors and I just thought I'll give you a half price deal because I'm, you know, because it's easier for me to do your lawn for half price than to go home.
What would you say if you offered?
Have you talked about price at this point?
no that because he's got a piece of paper that's got the prices on it he hasn't showed it to me yet but he's kind of laminated yes absolutely laminated and it has a three-hole punch like goes into a binder okay and he and i would look at him and i'd go cause
You know, normally I would shoo you along, but in this case, I'd like to see you do my yard.
A lot of people would be very, I think very, a lot of men in particular in America would react very strongly.
You don't offer to cut another man's lawn.
In your case, you're a fan of the gauze, millennium girlfriend notwithstanding, and you said, go ahead, you know, trim my hedge.
Well, and the thing is, I would have to then come out and stage direct because I'm like, A, don't have a lawn.
I took all the grass out.
He's never done it before.
Not environmental.
You know, grass is bad for the environment.
And then I would say, here, so this is what I want done over here.
This is what I want done over here.
And he's going to have that laminated sheet down tapping.
He's probably got a dry erase marker on a different laminated sheet where he's able to like, maybe he does like a map or something in a way that impresses you.
Well, yeah, it could be, but I'm going to, I'm going to, what I'm waiting for him to do is say, say a few magic words, right?
I'm going to wait for him to say like, oh, I only have electric tools or here's, you know, what if I do this instead of that?
And then I'll be like, guys, you're in.
And then he's going to say, normally I would charge 500 bucks, but for you today, 250.
Wow.
And I'm going to say 250.
50 gauze come on we know that's where you start half price is 125 yeah and then he's gonna call you got me so what it costs to get your lawn mowed now i don't know i've never i've never when i was a kid it was 20 bucks yeah me too five bucks but that's when i was a kid one dollar five cents do you happen to know do you happen to know what country ryan gosling's from
canada yeah no really is he canadian i'm sorry yeah he is oh but that's in a way that makes him even better canadians are you know ken jennings is against canadian
I'm not surprised.
I'm always for Canadians.
I'm for them.
Oh, I love Canadians.
You know what?
My daughter came home the other day and she was like, you know what word I'm sick of?
And I said, what?
She said, valid.
I'm sick of valid.
Valid has become a, I was about to say problematic, but I'm not going to say that.
I hate that word too.
It's become a weaponized word.
Well, and she said, every single conversation, somebody says valid now, and I just don't want... It's just like, it's a meaningless word.
And I was like, I didn't even know this was happening.
Isn't that interesting?
Valid has become a thing that Gen Z is like... Did you get a sense of, like, is it like a valid opinion?
Like, do you have a sense of where it comes from?
My sense is that they... This generation has been lectured to more than any generation prior.
And they are just... She's just like, I don't know.
Everybody's like, is that valid?
Emma...
is that valid?
Am I valid?
You are valid.
This is valid.
And it feels a little bit like maybe adults are saying it to them and they don't believe adults when they say it.
Adults are saying that's valid.
And then the adult just goes on.
I'm not going to take my clues about credulity from adults.
Thank you.
Exactly.
And I think seventh graders are just at that age where they're like, you know what I'm tired of?
I'm tired of adults that are fake friendly.
I'm tired of adults that are telling me I'm valid.
I'm tired.
Such a huge step.
and so i was like you know what yes i agree except in when it comes to canadians i feel like they're so valid and i feel like i just want to validate them as canadians and she was like you know what in can when we're talking about canadians i'll give it a pass i was like you know what yes
And I try and say that to Ken, and he's like, not hearing it.
Not hearing it.
Do you have a sense?
I mean, obviously, somebody like Ken, I'm very fond.
I don't know.
Well, Ken's like a David Wayne friend for me.
I don't think I've met Ken.
If you walked up to Ken and was like, Ken, hey!
Well, I mean, have you seen pictures of me holding my lizard or anything?
Will you show us pictures of me so he knows who I am?
You're pretty internet famous.
I'll be like, the guy that talks into his shoe, come on.
Oh, jeez, man.
Can I be like, oh, that guy?
You're killing me.
Web 2.0 guy?
Oh, my God.
Actually, you know what?
I take it back.
Could it be anybody, literally anybody but you, that explains to him who I am, please?
Oh.
What is a fair weather friend, Ken?
Yeah, yeah, 41 folders.
You haven't seen it?
Yeah, 37 folders.
It's an incredible show.
Oh, my God.
All the great folders.
Ken, okay, but here's the thing now.
What's the origin story here?
Was it something, is it like a Batman situation?
Did Canadians, God forbid, kill his parents with pearls on the ground, like outside Zorro or whatever?
And here's what it is.
The Seattle Mariners,
are a Major League Baseball team.
Did they used to be the Expos?
The Mariners?
No.
Oh, sorry.
But when Toronto, the only remaining Canadian baseball team, now that the Montreals are defunct, got absorbed into the Borg.
So Toronto Blue Jays are now Canada's baseball team.
And of course, Canadians love baseball just as any good Americans do.
And so when the Blue Jays come and play the Mariners, there is a massive wave.
You guys are pretty close to Canada.
We're close enough that they can come down.
There might be a little bit of, forgive my saying, just a little bit as an outsider, a little bit of narcissism with small differences.
Or just the way that in that book, Freud talks about why the identical people in the next tribe are despised by you because you're so much like them.
There's not much separating you guys from Canada.
It often happens where you'll be watching a movie that's set in Seattle, and if you are from Seattle, you're like, that's Canada.
That is Canada.
You're filming that in Canada.
It's not Seattle at all, but it looks enough like Seattle.
Everything's Vancouver and Atlanta because of tax breaks.
That's what's so smart about The Walking Dead.
We're on season four of The Walking Dead, and I said to my kid, well into this, once we'd already established all this, they're like, you know what's brilliant about this?
This is around the time that Atlanta, or rather Georgia, started offering...
I don't know if it's just tax breaks, but it was a cheap place to shoot.
And how great is it that the show they're shooting takes place outside Atlanta?
That's a good match.
But, you know, everything being in Vancouver starts to get a little frustrating.
There's not that many mountains outside Manhattan, you know?
atlanta converted an entire factory neighborhood into a like a hollywood they just they turned this old i don't know what it was a garment factory or a shoe factory or i don't know a cotton gin or whatever it was a big area what are we gonna do what are we gonna do with this cotton gin burn let's make it into a place to make the avengers
It has really big buildings and they just turned it into sound stages right next to a neighborhood.
Like you're driving through the neighborhood.
I was down there with Chuck from Stuff You Should Know, not to brag.
Not to brag.
He's driving me through his normal middle class neighbor and he's like, look over there.
And I look down the street and there's Hollywood.
I was like, what's all that?
Because, you know, when you're a regular universal set kind of feeling like, yeah, well, you know, you get you get that thing when you're in show business like me, where you can look at a thing and recognize a soundstage.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
I mean, it would be like somebody who was a veteran knowing what a rifle looks like.
There it is.
That's exactly right.
Like some veteran could look down a street and go, it's a military base or that's a rifle.
No, it's not.
That's a neighborhood.
That's where they can handcuff Merle to the roof.
This is my gun.
I never get them mixed up.
This is for gun.
I never get a cotton gin and a Hollywood mixed up, because you can tell the difference, even if one used to be the other.
That's the kind of acuity that you have as a show business person.
Not to brag.
But so this is the thing.
So Ken is a baseball fan.
He goes to the baseball games.
And whenever the Blue Jays come, there's this.
And, you know, they come for a series, right?
You know about baseballs.
They come play multiple games.
Yeah.
When I was a kid anyway, it would be like usually three games.
Three games.
Yeah, three games.
That's right.
Because you were rooting for the Reds because you're a Pete Rose fan.
Yeah, I was an everybody fan.
Big Red Machine fan, yeah.
Yeah, big red machine.
So anyway, the Blue Jays fans come down from Vancouver.
Now, Vancouver and Toronto, I'm sure they have an inter-Canadian rivalry with each other because of the narcissism of small differences.
Although, the difference between Vancouverites and Toronans is probably greater than Vancouverites and Seattleites.
But they come down here and according to the Seattle baseball fans, the Blue Jays fans are obnoxious.
And I think, well, they're Canadians.
They're polite.
They're gentle.
Right.
And apparently not Canadian sports fans.
They're not because they come down and they just hoot and holler.
It's not like Philadelphia level.
i don't think they throw batteries right but they are but you know mariners fans are are i think an elevated group of intellectual people who come to the game they score the game they smoke pipes you know it's like we're we're all this sort of george will baseball culture here
Oh, I see.
Or like a George Plimpton sort of baseball.
Yeah, we all go to celebrate, you know.
And the Blue Jays fans come down and they're all cranking Rush out of their vintage Winnebago's.
And they're just like, ah, they're just apparently.
I mean, I love all people, right?
And I don't see color.
But like, it would be funny if they did that, but it was like...
I don't know, Caress of Steel or something.
Or like, you know what I mean?
Or like, you know, like Temple of Syrinx.
Just blasting with the high mint.
We are the priest!
Yeah, exactly.
Let me ask you this.
The guy from The Shining in a tuxedo, except he's wearing sunglasses on his top hat.
Who's also the guy, who's also Mr. Tyrell in Blade Runner.
And he's, oh, that's right.
But he says to you, you get to pick one song from either the collected works of Billy Joel or the collected works of Rush.
What do you do?
Billy Joel.
Now, I would like the opportunity to... I mean, I don't need to explain it, but I'm looking at that in terms of hedonic... You're looking over a four-leaf clover.
Hedonic floors and hedonic ceilings.
Hedonic floors.
Yeah, this is something I've been working on.
Hedonic ceilings.
Okay.
Okay.
Like, like, I mean, you know, you've heard others and it's an analogy I use a lot and I think it probably annoys people, but as usual, I don't care.
But like we, when you describe an ex like an experience or a food you, you would describe like, here's a great example is like, I like wine, but.
But, like, I only have so much bioavailable joy for wine.
So, like, there's a $20 bottle of wine.
There's a $200 bottle of wine.
There's a $200,000 bottle of wine.
My hedonic ceiling for wine becomes... By Buckchuck.
Something like that.
Yeah.
I still have one of those boxes here, Charles Shaw.
But no, but you know what I'm saying?
Like, whereas I've argued with Syracuse about this, but I consider meatballs to be a high floor food.
Okay, what does that mean, high floor?
Because I consider meatballs a lot.
So what is high floor?
Okay, so ceiling and floor.
Like the ceiling is as good as something can get.
And the floor is as bad as it can get.
So a high floor means that even the worst meatball is still pretty good?
Compared to other foods, yes.
I got it.
Okay.
Okay.
So like, I know there's a lot of ways to look at this, but I've been calling it hedonic floors and ceilings just because I think about things.
What does hedonic mean?
Oh, hedonic.
Like hedonism?
Remember that phrase, the original title for Annie Hall was going to be anhedonia, the inability to experience joy?
Oh, sure.
Okay.
And you've probably heard that phrase hedonic treadmill, like where we're constantly trying to make ourselves happy.
I haven't, but yeah, I like it.
But anyway, it's just a dumb way of saying like, let's just leave it at floors and ceilings.
I feel like the, I mean, it's just, how can I put this?
I'll put this a very simple way.
My chances are better with Billy Joel.
My chances are better.
Just because I like Rush, I'm not always in the mood for Rush.
And obviously the whole point of the question is, well, no, you're not going to restrict it.
You can't say 79 to 82 Rush.
Oh, here you go, John.
79 to 82 Rush v.
79 to 82.
Joel, what do you pick?
Rush every time.
It could be subdivisions.
Is that all right?
The entire career of Rush, I would pick over 79 to 82 Billy Joel.
I would listen to the worst Rush, which is pretty bad.
Well, there was that, I don't know if it was Crested Steel, but there was the one where like, yeah, I mean, there was the one, I think it's the one with the trees.
Which one is that?
But like where Getty was getting like...
I love Rush.
I have seen them live.
I adore Rush.
But there was a period that a lot of people who aren't super fans aren't aware of where he did get very screechy.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's a little screech.
But then, I mean, Permanent Waves is one of my all-time favorite albums.
Yeah, it's very good.
I have my own playlist of Permanent Waves where I perfected the order of the songs.
Oh, you moved them around.
Swapped it around a little bit.
I got all the pop stuff on side one, and then the slightly more proggy stuff on side two.
I'm not against the natural science.
You understand.
Oh, my God.
Do you like Rush?
Yes, of course I do.
God, I fucking love Rush.
I still do.
This is the thing.
I used to get into this, you know, back when I would do that cruise, that eponymous cruise.
Yes.
That I did for a decade.
It's a terrible name for a cruise.
Well, it features REM.
Yeah, no, no.
It's Ted Cruz's grandfather.
You know, listen.
He killed JFK.
He killed Joseph Kennedy.
Mr. Cruz was my grandfather.
Wait a minute.
God damn it.
Shit.
All right, you win that.
Listen, so.
Listen.
Back on that cruise back when I did that and was part of that culture, that was a whole culture.
You understand of people, people, my friends that were part of this culture.
And I was, I did not know going into this, these relationships.
I did not know that there were people in rock who didn't have a rush period.
And it's one of those things where you weren't always 50-something years old.
There was a point when you were 30-something or 40-something years old.
And in my case, for me, that's in some ways also Steely Dan, where it's like, how did you not like this band at some point?
Yeah.
Didn't you just get happy when you'd hear, like, Peg or Hey 19 on the radio?
Of course I still do.
You hate all Steely Dan?
You hate all Rush?
Like, how do you like rock music?
But it's true.
Everybody's got those.
I mean, it's okay if you don't like Jefferson Airplane or Jefferson Starship.
I understand, but there are some where you're like, I don't understand how you got in, how you could like Judas Priest and not like Rush.
Yeah.
Well, so here's the thing.
Not because they're the same, but just because at that time, like, oh my God, that was some of the most exciting.
But when British Steel is a very exciting album for the time.
This is what I'm saying.
These are people my own age who...
In their respective proto Ivy League, East Coast, small town cultures.
No offense.
Who grew up in Connecticut.
You're talking about Connecticut.
I'm talking about Connecticut and, you know, suburban Boston and all these other places where, you know, where people wore preppy clothes, not because they were referencing these places, but because they were in these places.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I was meeting all these people, people that we could name, not to brag.
Not to brag.
Who said, that's Hesher music.
All of it.
All of it.
And that includes Led Zeppelin, Boston.
It includes any music made that is not on the acoustic guitar.
Right?
I mean, especially AOR.
But album-oriented rock, for me, it would be like 98 rock.
I don't know what your version of that was.
But the kind of stuff that you hear, certainly something like Scorps or Asia.
102.5.
107.7 The Bone is our local station.
There's a classic.
107.7 is the FMK Whale.
FMK Whale.
107.7 The Bone.
You're on the bone with the bone classics from the Boneyard.
I love that.
They have, like, an hour of Led Zeppelin.
They used to have an hour of Led Zeppelin every night.
No, but you know what I mean, though?
I take that as a chunking, or even better, a binning, where you're like, nope, not for me.
I can understand.
I don't like it, but I can understand how some would say, I hate New Wave.
You know, fuck Missing Persons.
And you'd be like, really?
I mean, like, really?
Because, like, do you know how good that band was?
And do you know that's, like, a lot?
That's basically Frank Zappa's band.
Oh, my God.
Do you know, like, how fucking good Terry Bozio is?
I told you that I met Terry Bozio.
He was a drummer, right?
No, oh Terry's the singer day wait.
Dale's the singer Terry's the the Dale Bozzio is the singer Terry is the husband who's the drummer.
That's right I met Dale Bozzio and at the time I knew her name.
Yeah They were great, but they played on they played on like Joe's garage and shit.
Yeah.
Yeah, although Catholic girls not Dale though
no no no later yeah oh my god i just got an email from xoxo yeah they're back i don't think i'm invited i think you've got it you've got to like i think it's like another like you have to be cold it's like the hunger games in reverse well i know but you know i like gave a keynote speech there i i i like gave speeches three years in a row at xo wow i was like i was like a not to brag but i mean i was like a an honored guest there but i don't think did you get a sash john
Did I get a sash?
I got like a little, I got badges and pins because they were all about pins.
And I had one that lit up.
Like at Disneyland.
A pin that lit up from inside that said XOXO.
Like your heart.
Like your heart, like your robot heart.
I have a good photo of Scott and Adam and me at XOXO.
Yeah, those were the days.
Yeah, we did a very funny performance there.
Okay, so you got that, Ceilings and Floors.
We get to return to... Oh, your thing is, how do you not like Rush?
I was getting to know these guys.
We were like, we're all musicians here.
We're all just having a good old time.
And they were like, no.
we are not all musicians here because you are a metalhead hesher stoner and we are not because we continued to listen to seals and crofts into the 80s well i can think i think that that okay okay for the eponymous one yeah i see that record for for for for and all i know is the one cruise i was on which was plenty but like but like you're saying like ted leo
Was he just listening to Scott?
No, no, no, no, no.
Ted Leo's fucking... You're talking about Paul and Storm.
And Jonathan himself.
That's what I'm saying.
Eponymy.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Eponymy.
Eponymy Colton.
He scoffed at any music, any guitar music.
Sorry, augmented chord.
I didn't mean to harsh your mellow.
That even had distortion at all.
It was just like, no, if it's not like really smooth and really smooth.
And I was like, oh, that explains so much.
It explains, first of all, why your songs are all about dinosaurs.
And second of all, why it's just so fucking smooth around here.
Diamond girl.
Just a little bit of like, where's the drum solo?
There's not a drum solo in this whole set.
Come on.
One drum solo.
Is that too much to ask?
Yeah.
Just let the, let the guy run a little bit.
Yeah.
Or like one guitar solo.
We're both guys solo.
Both guys solo.
Exactly.
And do a little, and then they go into a harmony.
KK and Glenn Danzig.
Yeah.
Clantanzig, who was in Minor Threat, if I remember correctly.
And then they go... You laugh, but I was very, very intimately listening to some ACDC last week.
Because there's a lot of ACDC later in their career that's a little bit like... Well, like the Ramones, I think I dropped off around 83, 84.
I saw them live with Yngwie in 85 or 86, but the ones I liked were...
Usual ones, you know Scott ones.
Well, yeah, but like I can't even off off the dome but like dirty deeds TNT if you want blood power age or whatever it's called and Yeah, and I'm back and then and then back in black.
Yeah Yeah, yeah, but like no I was just I was I was watching I put this on the internet but like the
these live live version of like oh what's it's there's a whole lot of rosy and what's the other one that's like a whole lot of rosy uh it's another one about a big girl you know we actually they were so fucking tight john do you have any people are oh you see dc their songs are simple and they're sloppy fuck off they were so fucking tight
That's very tough attitude you're taking against people.
You know, it's just like the binning, you know, when people bin and like, and are like, oh yeah, that's all over here in this pile or like, oh, that's, you know, and again, because that's what dumb guys listened to in middle school.
Right.
Right.
Right.
Right.
And it's like, well, no, I mean like they were actually nobody, very few people in this business that we call show hit the guitar strings harder than Malcolm and Angus.
they're not it's not that they're just playing louder if you're a guitar player you know about a phenomenon where if you like pete towns and down on your strings too hard they they sound like they go out of tune for a second you know i'm saying when you do like you windmill down hard on your e and your a for a power chord and it goes like it drops a little the every time they hit they're hitting so hard and they're just so goddamn talented and bon scott had very tight pants i give him that
Wouldn't you say, though, that the people that don't like ACDC are valid?
I think everyone is valid, John.
Thank you.
But, you know, it's... That's what gives that word its meaning and power.
That it applies to everything.
But didn't you guys cover... Wait, I can do this.
Because in my band... So my first band in Tallahassee was an informal band.
Can I tell a story real quick?
Boy...
Can you?
My first, so I, I've been in bands in college and then I moved to Tallahassee for a job and had a great music scene.
And I was really famously were in bands in college.
I know a guy out here that was in like some, uh, I don't think he was in a band with you.
He was a super fan of your bands.
Wait, so he wants a new college.
That's how, that's how I'm going to introduce you to Ken Jennings.
I'm going to be like, you know, he's the guy that was part of the big, he was part of the Tallahassee scene.
He was like, uh,
He was like a big player there.
Not to brag, yeah.
Yeah, not to play.
You wore a gorilla suit, this guy tells me.
Oh, that's out here.
Every Sunday night after band practice, I'd call out bingo numbers in a suit.
And then at the end, I'd do a rap.
I'd do a rap from suggestions from the audience.
That's what this, it's a dad here in Seattle who's a dad of a girl that goes to school with my kid.
Really?
Who loves to- Would you find out so I can say hello?
Sidle up to me and say like, oh my God, I used to love Merlin.
Huge star.
If I know and forgot, forgive me, but I'd love to find out.
Okay, so all I'm saying is this.
So, like, Tallahassee, blah, blah, doesn't matter, it's quick.
And, like, I started sort of, like, gently, like, showing up at, like, you know, open mics, coffeehouse-type things, and in the fullness of time started playing, like, shows for people, some of which, because of Tallahassee.
The same thing that led Bacon Ray to open for the Mekons and Ween, for example, would... Ween?
Would find...
Oh, no, you don't.
You're talking about the new... The Sloan of America?
The new Hope Sloan.
One time I opened for Corey Clever from In Living Color.
Really?
Yeah.
In Living Color?
But I was... But the first thing where I played with other people is I had these two pals I got to know.
They owned a local club called The Cow House, which is where a lot of bands have played over the years.
And Todd and Alan...
But they were best known for being the rhythm section from a death metal band called DVC or Darth Vader's Church, who had, like, toured in Germany.
But they were, like, you know, double bass, like, full-on Cookie Monster singing band, but funny.
Yeah.
Because they're called Darth Vader's church.
But they had the gothic letters and everything.
They were fucking great.
Anyway, I played with those two guys.
Me playing literally an acoustic guitar with a rhythm section from a death metal band.
A professional death metal band.
And we would play mostly my pop songs.
But it was so fun.
And I could leave my... We could just practice there because they owned the club.
And it was just great.
But anyway, we... Somewhere there's videotape from an FSU band.
like, you know, student thing of us playing Spirit of... We used to cover Spirit of Radio.
Did you really?
Yeah.
I mean, especially we ended one of our songs with the... You know, that kind of thing.
But, like, it was never a question.
I mean...
Everybody who liked that kind of music liked Rush.
And usually people, if somebody doesn't like Rush, they usually have a reason.
They're like, no, actually, I'm really into Gentle Giant.
You're like, oh, okay, now I understand that's a different kind of thing that you were into or whatever, right?
Or like, I was into Hawkwind.
And you're like, oh, I understand.
Love Hawkwind, but I hate...
Motorhead, whatever.
But you know what I mean?
It's just weird.
But then you can interrogate that with somebody unless they've been binning.
And the binners like to just throw things in a bin and go, put them in there with the missing persons.
It drives me crazy.
No.
Yeah.
No.
And you guys, the point is, I think you guys, was it a soundcheck thing?
Didn't you guys?
It wasn't Spirit of Radio.
It was the other one.
Well, the thing is, my band, Eric Horson.
Because Eric's super into Rush, right?
Yeah.
And his roommate, Darius Minwala, really into Rush.
Really, really into Rush.
He used to be the drummer of the Posies, and at the time, he had the Posies logo written in the Rush font.
Ugh.
and uh it was pretty great not i would kill for that on a shirt yeah but but but but but they used to jump into tom sawyer during sound checks and if i was sitting tuning my guitar or doing something that was taking too long or if they were tired of my banter they would start doing the bass and drums and i never took the time
Well, they didn't get all that way.
But, you know, I never took the time to learn the guitar parts because, A, I thought, oh, that's too complicated.
And B, I was like, it never occurred to me to do anything back then.
It's hard for the drummer, I think.
Not just to say that Neil Part was a great drummer, but like that.
I mean, you can fake it.
It's mostly an E and you can glide around.
But the drum parts on that shit's hard.
Well, but the guitar parts, I mean, that's all.
Oh, you're talking about like the pull-offs, the pull-offs on Spirit of Radio.
All that stuff and just different like.
Your fingers couldn't even do that then.
Couldn't even do it.
That kind of thing.
On the eponymous cruise, they developed over time a new trick, which was all the rock musicians that died during the course of that year, they would cover those musicians on the final show.
They do like a 10-song set of, you know, when Bowie died, we did Bowie songs.
When Prince died, we did Prince songs.
Well, it was the same year.
Yeah.
But then Neil Peart died.
And I said, well, we have to do a Rush song.
And nobody liked Rush except for the hired gun guy.
See, what about Jim?
Did Jim like him?
jimboja jim is a very good musician and he would are you gonna break my heart i don't he's not he doesn't hate them see i i see ted i see ted knowing these songs knowing that he walked in to the offices at the onion and they were able to cobble together the most incredible cover of everybody wants to rule the world like in a few minutes i think ted's got an ear for that stuff and probably loved it
Ted Leo and Jim Bossier are both professional musicians, and they know music across the entire spectrum.
They both wear clothes that fit, too.
And they do not, either one of them, I don't think, hate any music.
Yeah.
If you get what I'm saying.
I know that's a very important distinction.
Yeah, they don't bin.
It's like, is this music?
Yes.
Can I learn to play it?
Yes.
Do I like to listen to it?
Probably.
You know, they like it all because they're musicians.
They're fans, right?
Why don't you go fucking around and name some more names?
You got Eponymy at the top.
He's running that whole joint.
He's practically the Catholic goddamn craft.
well and then you go why can't this be more like dan fogleberg even his even his uh his his drummer the drummer in his band who is tasked with playing this rush song by me who's like neil part died and this is the rule did he play with brushes he says i hate rush i hate playing this music how can you be a rock drummer who hates rush that's so weird
i know it's like i hate the police what yeah he he he a did not take the time to learn the song and be you know like really clammed it up but there was one other guy in the band who really loved rush and he played the bass okay and the two of us uh rocked it out and then uh and then mary kobayashi came out and played the guitar solo on the violin
And that feels very eponymous.
And I was playing, I was playing, I was playing, the only guitar I had was a Telecaster.
So already it's just like, what am I doing up here?
That's what I was playing.
This is an embarrassment, you know, an embarrassment to me and to every solo Merle Haggard.
You can drive a truck under that action.
But so I put it, you know, I said, Mary, can you play this?
And she came out and played it great on the violin, played the song.
That's awesome.
But, you know, there's a lot of stuff you have to learn and all this.
John, there's so much baggage with these things, and we don't revisit them.
My mind is not for rent, you know?
I would never put you down as arrogant.
I would just say, you know, not to brag is John's catchphrase.
That's right.
It is.
And I think it's valid not to brag.